| I never said it wasn't sexist, my bad. I said it isn't inherently sexist because fanservice does not just apply to sexual situations- Fanservice can be ship bait or any number of things. For example, Deadpool is a fanservice character. His constant breaking the fourth wall and referencing random things like anime is fanservice. I was more saying that i don't think that should be the sole reason we include a series on the list (since something like High School of the Dead makes itself KNOWN as fanservice before you watch it) and that we don't need it as a separate tag as it would clutter things. You're welcome to add it if you like I was just trying to make less work for us 8) Although loli or shouta fanservice I would just add under 'lolicon' or 'shoutacon'. |
| Yeah... I guess fanservice isn't necessarily sexual, but that's kinda the big thing? It's the thing everyone thinks of? I mean, the tvtropes page on it is focused entirely on the sexual, what you're describing is it's own trope, "pandering to the base." Not that Tvtropes is actually definitive but, eh, food for thought. But in this context, I'm pretty sure including excessive/obstructive fanservice as a condition would reliably imply "excessive/obstructive sexual fanservice." More on point, I think Bakemonogatari and it's sequels do belong on the list (I mean, I personally enjoyed most of them, but they're hella flawed) and the tags presently don't do enough to describe just how they are sexist. While some larger things do apply (example: lolicon and victimized female characters for the original, an extra heaping of everything ever for Nise) they don't adequately describe how the series could be seen as degrading. So yeah, I'd say sexual fanservice (or moe fanservice/lgbtbaiting/etc.) would merit their own tag. Also, wish-fulfillment incest (more specifically siscon, since that's the most pervasive problem) should either have it's own tag or be integrated into either ♦, ♣, or (p). I.e. oriemo, nisemonogatari, etc. But that probably would be unnecessarily, because a series that fulfills that is likely to already have a good number of other qualifiers... (And Utena gets away with it because it's meant to be creepy and fucked up! It seems like the industry keeps looking at Utena, says "Hey, that's cool! We can do that!" and then royally fucks up. Every. Time. Maybe there should be a tag for being a blatant ripoff of Utena which only plebeians would enjoy. Because nothing can ever be like a series that I like or else it should get sued by the government for plagiarism. And if anything is even remotely similar then it's obviously trying to copy. I'll shut up.) |
XanxiaSep 24, 2015 11:30 AM
| @103rdWhatever, what kind of fan service does Utena get away with? I watched it long ago and fail to remember now. I remember some lesbian hints (even though it still could be friendship) and a dude who threw his shirt open in a very repetitive cutscene. As for incest, count me strange but I don't think it's awful. I've known a couple like that and they were very much in love, so it's ok in my book. In life many things can happen. Incest can be bad in anime sometimes, though, as well as games, when used without need or merely for cheap shocking value. Like, harem-use: everyone likes the hero so much, even his own sister! That's plain ridiculous. On the level of forced lesbianism in all-female shows, to provide an excuse for groping and lewd comments. |
| It isn't fanservice, but Utena gets away with incest as a plot device because it wasn't used as fanservice. That's what I was discussing. Also, I think I'm kinda in the same boat in terms of its technical moral value. Like, unlike some things, in a world with contraceptives, most of the moral problems with incest come from the situations in which they arise. This is in tied in with the fact that there seem to be innate psychological barriers against it, and the fact that (especially if it develops at a younger age or with an age difference) there is an extremely high probability for some sort of unhealthy power dynamic. But none of those are necessarily inherent to the things themselves, and I suppose that there could be more benign causes than what'd be rationally expected. I'd still think that even the most positive and healthy incestuous irl relationship was really troubling though, because it kinda would still be really troubling? But then again, I'd probably leave them alone, because I wouldn't have any justification for suspicion or dissent besides a gut reaction. However, this means that if any anime that want's to discuss an incestuous relationship, it'd actually have to put forth effort into proving that the relationship isn't unhealthy? So it's a sort of guilty-until-proven-innocent scenario. Which is why I specified wish-fulfillment incest instead of simply "incest" as a potential category, although that may not do the crudity of execution I'm trying to describe justice. I mean, I guess there could be skillful and non-problematic wish fulfillment, so IDK. But what I'm referring to is that which is as clumsy and worn-out as any other form of low-quality wish fulfillment fanservice. This is a REALLY strange topic of conversation, by the way. It's funny that this is what I'm doing with my life. It's that fulfilling kind of strange, though. I'm glad. |
XanxiaSep 25, 2015 1:39 PM
| I see what you mean! Yeah, of course anime doesn't go in depth, discussing whether anything is healthy or not, it seems that for the Japanese incest is merely a fetish. Well, that couple was very close in age, and the story was strange to me, everything kind of happened spontaneously. One of them just kissed another, and that's how it started. They didn't think they could live a normal life in a place where everybody knew them, so they went to a different city to pretend like they weren't siblings. I don't know what happened later. Is that even realistic to pretend like that? Probably some people can spot the likeness of their looks? I'm not sure, but hopefully they're doing well. Yep, such a strange topic. :) And oh, I completely forgot about that in Utena. Indeed, there were heavy hints. Strangely, the moment I remember most are about the ending and that out-of-place episode with the cow bell. |
Ginevra said: ...and that out-of-place episode with the cow bell. A lot of Nanami's episodes were pretty damned confusing. I got about 25 episodes into that show before I realized I hadn't been paying enough attention. I owe it a rewatch when I can give it my full attention, one of these days. It's also been helpful for me to watch Ikuhara's stuff along with people who've already seen it....watching Penguindrum with a friend has actually been a lot of fun, since she knows what to look for. |
| I have to talk about the manga I'm reading, One Outs. I don't even know if it's anti-femenist 'cause in the 62 chapters I've read there hasn't been a woman, not even as a tiny secondary character. I still have the second half of the manga, but it's the first time I've faced such an omission. |
| If it has solution, don't bother; and if it hasn't, why bothering? Do you like manga? http://gunjoteam.com |
| Wait, absolutely no female characters? Like, are there any background extras? (That'd actually make it worse, I guess? Either way...) |
| Wow even Kaiji -contrary to popular belief- had female characters. |
| It's been a while but if I recall correctly, One Outs has a female character that appears briefly in one of the first chapters. The character was a black (or at least dark-skinned) woman with very short hair. She was in charge of betting on the game of One Outs and I think our protagonist was introduced in that chapter (my mind is hazy with regard to details). Yeah, she was a very minor character, but hey, still a female character. |
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metamorphius said: It's been a while but if I recall correctly, One Outs has a female character that appears briefly in one of the first chapters. The character was a black (or at least dark-skinned) woman with very short hair. She was in charge of betting on the game of One Outs and I think our protagonist was introduced in that chapter (my mind is hazy with regard to details). Yeah, she was a very minor character, but hey, still a female character. ow, I thought she was a cross-dresser (it's that an appropriate noun?). My bad :( Anyway, she shows like for some panels on the first volume just to disappear forever and, up to where I'm now, she's been the only female character. |
| If it has solution, don't bother; and if it hasn't, why bothering? Do you like manga? http://gunjoteam.com |
| Yeah, she never appears again. I don't know why I even remembered her, maybe because I first watched the anime before reading the manga. But hey, it's still enough for the manga to "fail" at being entirely without female characters :D Now I'm kinda curious whether there are fairly long-running manga without female characters. Ofc, yaoi is instantly disqualified, but then again I don't think there are long-running yaoi manga anyway. |
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metamorphius said: Yeah, she never appears again. I don't know why I even remembered her, maybe because I first watched the anime before reading the manga. But hey, it's still enough for the manga to "fail" at being entirely without female characters :D Now I'm kinda curious whether there are fairly long-running manga without female characters. Ofc, yaoi is instantly disqualified, but then again I don't think there are long-running yaoi manga anyway. That's a really interesting point. In most shonen manga there's at least one secondary female character, even if just for romantic plot. |
| If it has solution, don't bother; and if it hasn't, why bothering? Do you like manga? http://gunjoteam.com |
| Kaiji does have at least one female character. |
| My dear TV Tropes lies ;_; I remember Kaiji having a female character appear once or twice. But yeah, you can say that it only technically has female characters. Nevertheless, the lack of females does not stop Kaiji from being a pretty intense suspense thriller. Well, considering how all characters from this mangaka look rather...unconventional, if you ask for females, you get this (I actually haven't watched second season yet). |
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| I didn't watch the second season either. Or rather, I only watched the first arc. Also, I vaguely remember there being a Kaiji live action movie and people being mangry about one major character being turned into a woman. |
| It's a lot more frequent, I think, for there to be just one prominent female character who's not much more than the love interest of the main male character. I think that's the case in Shaman King, (which I haven't read or seen, but I can't recall any female characters besides Anna ever being brought up, and I don't think she has much of her own character arc). A lot of (male-centered) sports anime also have just two female characters who never really interact with each other: a love-interest character and a team manager character. Slam Dunk comes to mind on that front. I'm pretty sure that Cute High Earth Defense Club Love (aka last year's "magical boy" series) has no female characters, period, not even in the background (which isn't surprising, since they attend a boys' school, almost all of the scenes occur there, and you never see a single teacher of either gender aside from the one old man who spends the series under the wombat's control). That's....not as much a case of the show being sexist as it is of the target demographic, I'd say (kinda like how shows like K-On! and Non Non Biyori are shows with virtually no male characters, made for men). Also, I vaguely remember there being a Kaiji live action movie and people being mangry about one major character being turned into a woman. Butthurt purist fans are soooo predictable.... |
SarcotarascusN said: A lot of (male-centered) sports anime also have just two female characters who never really interact with each other: a love-interest character and a team manager character. What I like about Haikyuu (volleyball-oriented manga & anime) is that the author at least tries to introduce more female characters even though he mainly has to concentrate on male players. So we have: - main team's manager (she doesn't speak much in season 1, but in season 2 she finally gains some characterization) - second, younger and more nervous (but hard-working) team manager - her (probably single) mother who is a businesswoman and motivates her to work with passion - MC's younger sister - one of character's older sister, who is in college and is a delinquent type - female Karasuno team, mainly their captain who is male team's captain friend from middle school - MC in middle school practices with the mothers' volleyball club - a few of other teams' female managers - there was teased some awfully strong female team called the "Queens", probably in the future we'll see more of them. |
SarcotarascusN said: It's a lot more frequent, I think, for there to be just one prominent female character who's not much more than the love interest of the main male character. I think that's the case in Shaman King, (which I haven't read or seen, but I can't recall any female characters besides Anna ever being brought up, and I don't think she has much of her own character arc). Actually Anna is REALLY badass, and not just the romantic interest of the main character. There are several other female characters that are awesome as well, like Jeanne from the X-laws -who is as great as an antagonist as Hao-, Opacho -I don't know if they treat her as a female on the anime but I'm positive it's mentioned she's one on the manga-, the Hanagumi, Olva -Apache's leader-, Jun Tao... While it's truth women on Shaman King -aside from Anna and Jeanne- doesn't have that much protagonism, most of them are great by their own right. |
| If it has solution, don't bother; and if it hasn't, why bothering? Do you like manga? http://gunjoteam.com |
Tsukiaki said: metamorphius said: It's been a while but if I recall correctly, One Outs has a female character that appears briefly in one of the first chapters. The character was a black (or at least dark-skinned) woman with very short hair. She was in charge of betting on the game of One Outs and I think our protagonist was introduced in that chapter (my mind is hazy with regard to details). Yeah, she was a very minor character, but hey, still a female character. ow, I thought she was a cross-dresser (it's that an appropriate noun?). My bad :( Anyway, she shows like for some panels on the first volume just to disappear forever and, up to where I'm now, she's been the only female character. UPDATE ON ONE OUTS: On chapter 122 from the manga there's been a really beautiful lady lying naked next to the main character. For four pannels. |
| If it has solution, don't bother; and if it hasn't, why bothering? Do you like manga? http://gunjoteam.com |
Tsukiaki said: UPDATE ON ONE OUTS: On chapter 122 from the manga there's been a really beautiful lady lying naked next to the main character. For four pannels. Hahah, you should post that in the manga recommendation subforum. |
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Tsukiaki said: UPDATE ON ONE OUTS: On chapter 122 from the manga there's been a really beautiful lady lying naked next to the main character. For four pannels. sexism is over |
Earwen said: Tsukiaki said: UPDATE ON ONE OUTS: On chapter 122 from the manga there's been a really beautiful lady lying naked next to the main character. For four pannels. sexism is over At last, I've finished the manga and there was ANOTHER female character, a cute looking secretary with almost no lines. AND THAT'S ALL. Three female characters (plus another one who appears on the anime -not sure if on the manga too- selling "nice cool beer" on the stadium terraces) with almost as much dialogue as they'd had on a porn film. I've read almost 500 mangas and I swear it's the first time I've wondered if Smurfette syndrome isn't actually THAT bad. |
| If it has solution, don't bother; and if it hasn't, why bothering? Do you like manga? http://gunjoteam.com |
Tsukiaki said: Actually Anna is REALLY badass, and not just the romantic interest of the main character. There are several other female characters that are awesome as well, like Jeanne from the X-laws -who is as great as an antagonist as Hao-, Opacho -I don't know if they treat her as a female on the anime but I'm positive it's mentioned she's one on the manga-, the Hanagumi, Olva -Apache's leader-, Jun Tao... While it's truth women on Shaman King -aside from Anna and Jeanne- doesn't have that much protagonism, most of them are great by their own right. Huh, that's cool. Like you said, I'd been under the impression that Shaman King was quite male-centric, but it's nice to hear that it doesn't preclude what female characters there are from being interesting. |
Tsukiaki said: Earwen said: sexism is over At last, I've finished the manga and there was ANOTHER female character, a cute looking secretary with almost no lines. AND THAT'S ALL. Three female characters (plus another one who appears on the anime -not sure if on the manga too- selling "nice cool beer" on the stadium terraces) with almost as much dialogue as they'd had on a porn film. I've read almost 500 mangas and I swear it's the first time I've wondered if Smurfette syndrome isn't actually THAT bad. Representation at it's fullest! But seriously, I agree with SarcotarascusN that, while it could be sexist depending on how it's handled (and by the indication that there are a couple women included as eye candy this sounds poor), an imbalanced gender ratio isn't necessarily an indication of sexism. It's definitely troubling, though. |
| would Strike The Blood qualify? The female characters aren't even qualified as human beings in that anime. Is Brynhildr there? Same author of Elfen Lied, and although I havent watched/read EF, Brynhildr was a load of bull and the female characters were objects and plot devices. Magical Warfare. Other than being just plain fucking bad, the female characters are also plot devices and objects. They are complete dead brains. Not that the other male characters aren't dead brains, but they were independent. super sonico and rail wars. I'm pretty sure you can already tell what's wrong with these. If Transmisogyny/Transsexism count: Steins;Gate (I love the show, but the treatment of Ruka's gender is appalling) |
Alone on a Friday night? Remember that DIO did nothing wrong! |
engalleons said: Blaze_ said: If Transmisogyny/Transsexism count: Steins;Gate (I love the show, but the treatment of Ruka's gender is appalling) There's actually been fairly detailed discussion of Steins;Gate here and there in this thread long ago with no particular consensus either way, so I'd love to see you go into a bit more detail, if you don't mind. (Full disclosure: I am also a strong supporter of it being added to the list.) The way Okabe says "But he's a guy." even though it's clearly evident that Luka doesnt align with her assigned sex, she's considered a boy because she has a penis. And the fandom isn't any god damn better. After where her dysphoria is pretty fucking obvious to the audience and she hates being called male, the 'trap' joke is thrown around 'but he's a guy.' The treatment of Luka is extremely transmisogynistic not only from the fandom (which doesn't matter to much on the show itself), but the series completely ignored what could've been a potential representation of transgender characters but instead catered to the otokonoko fandom using constant misgendering and other transphobic methods. The show implies Luka is a boy who wants to be a girl, not a girl who is forced to live in a male body and tries her best passing off as a girl. As a transman myself it's pretty fucking sad that what potentially could've represented a diverse cast instead implied we are all wannabes of a gender catered for an audience solely for fetishisation. Even if the fandom tries getting rid of the transgender theme (much like Punchline on how the fandom responded to the revealed-transboy MC being 'lesbian' or 'expected to be a girl because of her (his) girly voice') the anime itself could've pushed the transgender theme. But no, gotta cash in the buck no matter what, hey? |
Alone on a Friday night? Remember that DIO did nothing wrong! |
Earwen said: damn. male as in dmab or fully cis man? those are entirely two different things, but i'd just like to know. |
Alone on a Friday night? Remember that DIO did nothing wrong! |
| Hello hello, I know this thread is completely dead but I thought I would drop my thoughts on a recently completed anime of mine called Jyu Oh Sei. There are other stuff to talk about but they are plenty and I would rather refrain from talking about it more. Also anyone willing to add something or debate me is free to do so and I will gladly hear you out. |
AileenamJun 11, 2016 3:12 PM
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| I feel like Osomatsu-san is pretty anti-feminist. Still I can't help liking the show for being funny ... |
Aileenam said: Hello hello, I know this thread is completely dead but I thought I would drop my thoughts on a recently completed anime of mine called Jyu Oh Sei. That is disturbing and not exactly what I expected. I know survival/post-apocalyptic shows try to be edgy and shocking, but that second episode seems more like shoujo romanticization of rape. |
That is disturbing and not exactly what I expected. I know survival/post-apocalyptic shows try to be edgy and shocking, but that second episode seems more like shoujo romanticization of rape. Woa, first of thanks for reading that, didn't expect anyone would. And yes that is exactly what I mean and it is actually sad since the anime has a nice concept that could have taken a good turn but Oh, well.. |
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| So I understand why some parts of Fairy Tail are feminist, but other parts...just aren't. I didn't really notice that much but one of the episodes I just watched really annoyed me. In one of the episodes during the S-class exam, So yeah. I'm not saying Fairy Tail is anti-feminist or anything, but I really wanted to rant about the above scene and I figured this was the right place. |
BlondieAug 28, 2016 7:59 PM
Blondie said: So I understand why some parts of Fairy Tail are feminist, but other parts...just aren't. I didn't really notice that much but one of the episodes I just watched really annoyed me. In one of the episodes during the S-class exam, So yeah. I'm not saying Fairy Tail is anti-feminist or anything, but I really wanted to rant about the above scene and I figured this was the right place. Honestly that part is from so long ago at this point, but it's also important to consider that physically, guys are stronger and Fairy Tail lets that be. However, they always try to show the women as more capable and more emotionally strong and together. Also, if you recall, in Fairy Tail no one (except maybe villains, but even then I don't recall) ever says "You're a woman so you're weak" or "you're a girl let the guys protect you". Gender is never brought up in this context, and that's one of the things I love about it. It's also important to consider that Bixlow and Freed are STRONG AS HELL and honestly probably should be S-class anyway. In a normal fight there is no way Lucy and Cana could beat them, when they are of sound mind and not just power-grabbing for Laxus. the Thunder Legion are an elite squad captained by one of Fiore's strongest mages. A mage so strong that he was considered for a wizard saint until the council decided his attitude was too arrogant. (Again showing that Mashima tries to be logical- Men have more physical strength, but he wants to show that women are the ones you should rely on.) Plus, in that scene you are discussing, a CANON GAY character was revealed. And he's not overly flamboyant or irritating, he's a well respected and cool character. He has his clingy moments but he's overall a really great character. Also I'm not sure how far along you are but Cana grows a LOT in that arc. That is HER arc, and at the start of it she isn't supposed to be as strong. She comes to her own resolve later on, and even though it fails a certain character continues to believe in her and grant her that same power so she can master it. Oh, and I added Steins;Gate and removed a couple other things and put a note about Hakuoki. The tv anime for Hakuoki is shit but the games and movies show CHizuru as strong and capable. |
| Regarding the Fate/Zero anime, I'd agree it has its fair share of sexist problems (Although I'd place some of that blame on the horrendously sexist source material imho). I wouldn't however go so far as to say Saber was depicted as helpless or that the main character (Kiritsugu) insulted her based on her gender. The execution needed work, but I'd say the tiff between Kiritsugu and Saber revolved around differences in ideology- and the fact that Saber reminded Kiritsugu of himself and his own dumbass choices he made in his past (and honestly that he continued to make throughout the series lol.) To take on the entire weight of the world is unrealistic and harmful. As an RN that's definitely a problem I identify with, trying to do it all yourself and giving everything you've got until you're empty ultimately doesn't help anybody. Now the awful rape worm stuff with Sakura, the pedo-danger sequence with Rin, the molester vines or whatever with Caster, the random affair with Maya (Yeah, yeah, I understand the intention but it was a poor way to convey Kiritsugu was trying to prep for giving up everything in the service of saving le world) I could have lived without ugh. |
| Kiritsugu and Saber was not the problematic relationship in this case. Kiritsugu was just kind of a cold hearted dickface who treated his wife and ninja servant as objects, but his relationship with Saber was whatever. It was pretty much everyone else in their treatment of her, namely Rider (Who I love, despite this). But even then, what he said wouldn't be an issue if she had stood up to him for it but she didn't. He literally said she was a little girl who should have grown up playing with dolls not ruling a kingdom and instead of fighting him on this she reflects on it instead, over and over. They didn't JUST talk about it being the weight of the world, they put it in terms of essentially "You can't do it BECAUSE you're a woman". And everyone respected her until they discovered she was a woman, then she became everyone's favorite object to talk trash on (except Lancer, who was pure and noble). In other news- I have removed Mars from the list. After re-skimming the second half of the series (where the 'problems' occur) I have determined that it does not warrant being on our list. The matters are handled with sensitivity, and Kira does stand up for herself later on she just needed time to do so. It also deals with mental illness which many manga do not- Several characters are incurably mentally ill, and there's not some stupid backstory as for why they are that way- There are things that brought it to the surface, but all in all, they are mentally ill because they are, it ran in the family (which does happen, my family has this issue as well). I read it over a decade ago, so that is my fault for misunderstanding the things when I was younger and I apologize. |
AmberlehJan 21, 2017 3:53 PM
SanityMisplaced said: Uh, anyone know about the Monogatari series? Haven't seen them, sorry (This reply is useless but I didn't want to leave you hanging lol). |
| The claim that Code Geass's female characters only exist to support the hero and are undeveloped is just silly. The female characters are an integral part of the plot from the word go. Kallen takes part in the terrorist activity that puts the events in motion, C.C. gives Lelouch the power that makes the entire story possible, Euphie kick-starts the events of the Season 1 finale by declaring the special zone of Japan and Lady Cornelia serves as one of the most persistent and dangerous antagonists. If you want to talk about Geass's sexism, talk about how inappropriate and obnoxious the fan-service is. I honestly feel like this list ought to have a specific tag for voyeuristic camera-angles. |
| "Bang." -Spike Spiegal "Everything... is connected." -Lain Iwakura "Life is too short to watch bad anime. Long Live the 1st Episode Drop." -InkSpider "Anime fans make me embarrassed to be an anime fan." -InkSpider |
| I strongly disagree that Berserk is sexist or anti-feminist. One of the main characters is a dark skin woman, vice-commander of a large band of male mercenaries. She is the third strongest sword fighter out of thousands of men. She has to struggle in a patriarchal world, and she certainly does not like how gender roles are holding her back and how she has to endure sexism. The manga taking place in a heavily sexist world does not make the manga itself sexist, if that's what you might think. Berserk is even feminist on an intersectional level because of the authors initiative to make the female MC dark skin. |
zodd0 said: I strongly disagree that Berserk is sexist or anti-feminist. One of the main characters is a dark skin woman, vice-commander of a large band of male mercenaries. She is the third strongest sword fighter out of thousands of men. She has to struggle in a patriarchal world, and she certainly does not like how gender roles are holding her back and how she has to endure sexism. The manga taking place in a heavily sexist world does not make the manga itself sexist, if that's what you might think. Berserk is even feminist on an intersectional level because of the authors initiative to make the female MC dark skin. See the problem is that Casca, for 20 years in real time was a vegetable who forgot all her memories because she was raped. She was not even gang raped, she was raped by one man. And yes, they all went through something horrible there, but Guts didn't lose his memories OR his strength. In fact he lost an arm but came out of it stronger. Casca came out completely useless. Not only that, but her rape was played to further Guts' character development and not her own. Her rape and vegetative state served only as a plot device for Guts and a reason for him to change his personality so much. Again, I want to reiterate that just because something is on our sexist list doesn't make it bad. Berserk is an AMAZING series, but it does belong there. Please understand that this list can also serve as a sort of 'trigger warning' of sorts. I also want to point out that Griffith essentially raped the princess, and although she was in love with him it was something forced and he did it because he was hurting and upset and the princess wasn't angry with him. In fact we as viewers were meant to see his imprisonment as unjust and his rise to evil as somewhat justified and understandable, even though he broke into the castle, took advantage of his status, and raped a woman JUST because he was pissy that his best friend/man crush left him. I get what you're saying, I do, but sadly yes, Berserk belongs on the list. It's an INCREDIBLE series, as are some other series on our list, and for the story to work it kinda needs to be sexist so I get it. But it's STILL sexist. |
AmberlehApr 1, 2018 7:29 PM
Amberleh said: See the problem is that Casca, for 20 years in real time was a vegetable who forgot all her memories because she was raped. She was not even gang raped, she was raped by one man. And yes, they all went through something horrible there, but Guts didn't lose his memories OR his strength. In fact he lost an arm but came out of it stronger. You make is sound like it was some sort of 'ordinary' rape. First of all she saw her closest friends be brutally murdered and eaten by demonic monsters. Then the person she had looked up to and basically had worshiped her entire life started to rape her. She had considered him family and more in a way. She saw that her current boyfriend was forced to watch it all in a pool of blood, being held down by demonic claws. She saw him mutilate himself beforehand. You could also wonder how much of an impact Femto had on her as the demon lord he is, since he corrupted her fetus, he might have corrupted Cascas mind as well to some extent. Most of the Hawks panicked there that day. Corkus had started to lose his mind as well. Guts managed to keep his intact because he is who he is. Many of the characters in the series have questioned if he is even human. Amberleh said: Casca came out completely useless. Not only that, but her rape was played to further Guts' character development and not her own. Her rape and vegetative state served only as a plot device for Guts and a reason for him to change his personality so much. I can see your point here though. I never saw this part as feminist, but I never considered it sexist either. Amberleh said: Please understand that this list can also serve as a sort of 'trigger warning' of sorts. Okay, that I can understand. Amberleh said: I also want to point out that Griffith essentially raped the princess, and although she was in love with him it was something forced and he did it because he was hurting and upset and the princess wasn't angry with him. In fact we as viewers were meant to see his imprisonment as unjust and his rise to evil as somewhat justified and understandable, even though he broke into the castle, took advantage of his status, and raped a woman JUST because he was pissy that his best friend/man crush left him. I think if you put all bits and pieces together it comes down to Griffith just caring about himself and nobody else. He did it as a desperate attempt to make the princess 'his' and to become heir to the throne. But I can see your point here too. |
| Might consider adding Hajime no Ippo. Brilliant fight scenes and a wonderful main character, but it's got problems. Repeated sexual harassment played for laughs and casual homophobia all over the place. The majority of the girls are demure, polite, supportive and lacking any real ambitions. The only female character I can give some points to is Yamaguchi Tomoko, a doctor who is also skilled judoka (we never see her fight though), but she's really just there as a support to help the male protagonist. Also worth mentioning is the Citrus anime. Gratuitous girl-on-girl sexual assault for fanservice (which wasn't part of the source material, interestingly). |
| "Bang." -Spike Spiegal "Everything... is connected." -Lain Iwakura "Life is too short to watch bad anime. Long Live the 1st Episode Drop." -InkSpider "Anime fans make me embarrassed to be an anime fan." -InkSpider |
| Ink- you're more than welcome to add that one as well as Gantz and Rising of the Shield Hero. I like the last one, it's fun, but the RIDICULOUS sexism and unlikeable main character make it more difficult to watch. |
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