| The web novel is basically an harem that went with . And yet it seems like the LN is popular. Does that mean that the community is embracing polygamy like it is nothing special ? I personally think its quite a letdown. |
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| I agree. Polygamy is basically just the official word for no self respect. |
| The novel is one of the most popular novel on Syosetsu. A website where many popular isekai novel first originated, you're probably already know about it few of the notable ones are Shield Hero, Slime Tensei, Kumo Desu Ga and many more. Since it first release in 2012 to the end of its last chapter which got released in 2015 it succesfully retain the position of ranked one of the most popular series on that site. It has good character development, world story, and the most important part is how engaging the light novel to many reader. Seiya0890 said: Does that mean that the community is embracing polygamy like it is nothing special ? Isn't polygamy are the extension of Harem anyway? In case you don't know in MT universe polygamy is also something that isn't considered as good, because like in real life there are people who agree to it and there's also who don't. |
Angry_onionJan 14, 2021 12:58 AM
Angry_onion said: Isn't polygamy are the extension of Harem anyway? In case you don't know in MT universe polygamy is also something that isn't considered as good, because like in real life there are people who agree to it and there's also who don't. Harem is mostly done as comedy. Harem is comedy. It's never serious. And polygamy is objectively bad, doesn't matter who doesn't agree. The man with multiple wives is basically cheating, he is betraying his wife's trust. This is morally a terrible thing to do. The wives have no sense of self respect for agreeing to polygamy. It's like offering your partner in life who you trust more than anyone else to someone else. No girl who have respect for themselves would do this. When you marry a girl, would you agree for the girl to marry other men? No you wouldn't lol. |
Toneworks said: Angry_onion said: Isn't polygamy are the extension of Harem anyway? In case you don't know in MT universe polygamy is also something that isn't considered as good, because like in real life there are people who agree to it and there's also who don't. Harem is mostly done as comedy. Harem is comedy. It's never serious. And polygamy is objectively bad, doesn't matter who doesn't agree. The man with multiple wives is basically cheating, he is betraying his wife's trust. This is morally a terrible thing to do. The wives have no sense of self respect for agreeing to polygamy. It's like offering your partner in life who you trust more than anyone else to someone else. No girl who have respect for themselves would do this. When you marry a girl, would you agree for the girl to marry other men? No you wouldn't lol. My view regarding how I see a polygamy act in real life doesn't affect me on how I enjoy a work of fiction. I personally don't mind polygamy in fiction as long as it's interesting to read, which Mushoku Tensei fortunately delivered in this regard. I love how Rudeus surrounding reacts to his polygamy act, the most religious people among his peer and his religious little sister always nags him about his act against the God's teaching that a man should have 1 partner in their life. While the less religious person wouldn't care about it since they have more important matter in their hands like how to stay alive and finding money. Just like in real life there's people who consented to it, there also people who vehemently against it and there's also who feel ambivalent to that matter. |
| It's because this LN is the birth of the trend of truck-kun and isekai tropes. |
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Angry_onion said: My view regarding how I see a polygamy act in real life doesn't affect me on how I enjoy a work of fiction. This. I find it hilarious how most people are totally okay with violence, slaves, etc. in fiction but the instant sex and other such topic come into question it's suddenly a no go. |
heitooJan 14, 2021 1:34 AM
immortaluchiha said: Is the novel even popular? How many sales? Compared to SAO, magical index, irregular at highschool? It's obviously popular in web novel scenes in Syosetsu even after 5 years since the ending of Mushoku Tensei it still in held the position in the top tenth of daily rank of Syosetsu. At the moment, as for the combination of LN sales and Manga even before it got anime it got sold for 4 million copies. Someone probaby know about it better than me but that number is pretty good number for a works that doesn't have an anime yet when that number got released. |
Toneworks said: Angry_onion said: Isn't polygamy are the extension of Harem anyway? In case you don't know in MT universe polygamy is also something that isn't considered as good, because like in real life there are people who agree to it and there's also who don't. Harem is mostly done as comedy. Harem is comedy. It's never serious. And polygamy is objectively bad, doesn't matter who doesn't agree. The man with multiple wives is basically cheating, he is betraying his wife's trust. This is morally a terrible thing to do. The wives have no sense of self respect for agreeing to polygamy. It's like offering your partner in life who you trust more than anyone else to someone else. No girl who have respect for themselves would do this. When you marry a girl, would you agree for the girl to marry other men? No you wouldn't lol. Going by your logic liking Attack on Titan means you support mass genocide |
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| Lol, we all know why there are people enjoying watching polygamy in anime. a) For the same reason most of these people won't accept if the girls themselves have each their own harem... b) Basically my guess is these people put themselves at the place of the MC, and try to think (or their subconscious) they have this harem. if you are in the a) group, and refute b), then you are an hypocrite. Anyway starting a debate was not the purpose, this is a subject where everyone will think they are right (either by disillusion...) I am just surprised that this is so much popular... Good think Korea started to create a lot of manwha, since the number of good (subjective) works from JP seem to decrease. |
Seiya0890Jan 14, 2021 9:44 AM
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| Like how the author handle this, is more original, at least mc is not the classic overpowered dense archetype surrounded by horny girls, but he take action and marry all of them in equal terms, make all happy. <3 Isekai Smarthphone is also the only close story i remember where the mc marry all his harem girls one after another, but he is also an idiot who escape everytime a girl try to close the gap. :D |
Fn76Jan 14, 2021 9:58 AM
| While some people say "finish with the poligamy in sub-devenloped countries!" The same woke westerners then say "in defense of polyamory!" Lol |
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| In reality my Boi,people are here for story not for your polygamy shit. In LN,all three fmcs have their own arc,to show how well written they are and how they play an important role in mc's life. They've done their best to save our Mc from every despair. That's why,Mc can't leave them and love them equally and wants to protect them,just like they did for him when he was feeling despair. I think,this should clear your polygamy melodrama. It's story one of the best well written with a great mystery. |
_grimreaper0_Jan 14, 2021 7:57 PM
| @Seiya0890 It's 2021 and there are already plenty of harem anime similar to this with no one route ending. I honestly think you're a little too pure for this type of anime. Not for normies tbh. There are a lot of harem anime similar to this Smartphone isekai... ToLoveRu... Sekirei... HighSchool DxD... Monster Musume...etcs If it's harem, it just fiction anime at the end of the day. I don't know what you meant by embracing, but you're already part of our anime culture from the viewpoints of those who don't watch anime. FYI,your list is way way way too pure. No ecchi/harem completed I recommend watching Highschool DxD for starter. :D |
Fuwa_sanJan 14, 2021 11:44 PM
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Fnights said: Isekai Smarthphone is also the only close story i remember where the mc marry all his harem girls one after another, but he is also an idiot who escape everytime a girl try to close the gap. :D The protag of Isekai Smartphone actually have sex with all the girls he marries starting from his marriage night 1 girl per night except for Sue because she is too young at the time. His first sex with Yumina is described in volume 21. |
SinfulFate said: I may be a denial to the fact Polygamy is a bad thing, therefore it wouldn't change even a tiny bit of my mind about polygamy because it was always a fiction in the first place. But You on the other hand haven't read the novel and yet you're saying the novel is about polygamy shit? Bruh grow up. .... In what I said, what is childish ? I did read a few volumes (long time ago though)... I will admit the summary was simple, but most work tend to have some tendencies in how they build and unfold the story, and clearly MT is an harem at core. And yes I am sure the few volumes I read are enough for me to proclaim it. And saying its a good polygamy story because each wives are fairly well treated... LOL. "It's just fiction" lol so what ? I watch stories that turn around characters I like. But if the MC start do things that go against my morale values I will just stop watching (rap, incest, loli, etc) If Rudeus rapped some girls would you still read it ? I would not... You watched polygamy because you either accepted it or enjoyed it. And you are free do to , so no need to try justifying it. Marx_Chrixtein said: Many people like AOT does that mean they are embracing war like nothing special? Just like I said, genocide was not done by the main casts, they are the one who try to fight or prevent this. This is obviously totally different. xkazutox said: @Seiya0890 It's 2021 and there are already plenty of harem anime similar to this with no one route ending. I honestly think you're a little too pure for this type of anime. Not for normies tbh. ... I recommend watching Highschool DxD for starter. :D Lol I appreciate you trying to analyze me, but I am not that pure, and I watched so many animes that I can speak japanese fairly well. if you are interested this is my anime list I did watch DxD, I did not finished it but it did not looked like it would go polygamy route. But yeah harem is still too strong there. |
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| hehehe.... wait until you read Aisha's Arc in Mushoku Tensei Redundancy. I think it's fair enough, or at least it's the most logical conclusion when the writer put a character in the harem route and had it be settled with polygamy later on is quite a tale that is, in some cases; complete. For me, I had developed a formula that follows such logic in which, as the heroine character increases, the quality writing of the said work drastically tenfold decreases when it had reached the max potential heroine character for the series to have its need be fulfilled... yeah, if you dont believe me, read Return of the former Hero WN. MT have a simple romantic subplot. It follows the route that it set first, then completed it (well considering I did read the WN so I know of course), and spent the righteous amount of time for said development. Like, Strike the Blood is a series that you're like "wow... I get to see different heroines every single EP and forget them afterwards" which is a tragedy on its own... because why? Well, there is no possible way for an ending for all of them unless.... UNLESS.... the author decided to end it in the most.... yeh... I know you can think of it already.... I mean also, I dont think polygamy is prolly something that you ought to hate in this series because if so, I think you prolly shouldnt have delve into degeneracy... I mean anime... |
Scordolo said: It's because this LN is the birth of the trend of truck-kun and isekai tropes. Where did you get that from? Stuff like Shield Hero, Re:Zero, Log Horizon, Overlord, No Game No Life and many other are older than Mushoku Tensei. |
| Subarashii |
FFCreations said: I assume because fans of Mushoku Tenesi keep saying: "MuShoKu tEnsei iS thE GraNdfaTheR Of iSekAi!" for some reason even though isekai existed in the 80s.Scordolo said: It's because this LN is the birth of the trend of truck-kun and isekai tropes. Where did you get that from? Stuff like Shield Hero, Re:Zero, Log Horizon, Overlord, No Game No Life and many other are older than Mushoku Tensei. |
Toneworks said: Fnights said: Isekai Smarthphone is also the only close story i remember where the mc marry all his harem girls one after another, but he is also an idiot who escape everytime a girl try to close the gap. :D The protag of Isekai Smartphone actually have sex with all the girls he marries starting from his marriage night 1 girl per night except for Sue because she is too young at the time. His first sex with Yumina is described in volume 21. For real? Hard to imagine since the mc is portraied as spineless about romance, but i'm actually read only the manga nor the novel so if you say so then well, is much better. Hopefully the manga go further because atm is pretty stagnating. |
FFCreations said: Scordolo said: It's because this LN is the birth of the trend of truck-kun and isekai tropes. Where did you get that from? Stuff like Shield Hero, Re:Zero, Log Horizon, Overlord, No Game No Life and many other are older than Mushoku Tensei. When I searched "The father of Isekai" I basically got this "Mushoku Tensei." |
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Scordolo said: FFCreations said: Where did you get that from? Stuff like Shield Hero, Re:Zero, Log Horizon, Overlord, No Game No Life and many other are older than Mushoku Tensei. When I searched "The father of Isekai" I basically got this "Mushoku Tensei." "The father of isekai" is literally something the fans of the series has self-proclaimed it as. It is in no way the father of isekai. Any trope that people claim it created or popularized, you can find earlier instances of in just as popular isekais. And it did not popularize the isekai genre either. It may for sure have helped in popularize it though. |
| Subarashii |
FFCreations said: "The father of isekai" is literally something the fans of the series has self-proclaimed it as. It is in no way the father of isekai. Any trope that people claim it created or popularized, you can find earlier instances of in just as popular isekais. And it did not popularize the isekai genre either. It may for sure have helped in popularize it though. Thanks for the clarification.Lmao how can the fans just self proclaimed it to be "The father of Isekai" where basically isekais before Jobless reincarnation have similar Isekai tropes.That's so stupid.Seems like this is the first Isekai many have first read. |
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Scordolo said: FFCreations said: "The father of isekai" is literally something the fans of the series has self-proclaimed it as. It is in no way the father of isekai. Any trope that people claim it created or popularized, you can find earlier instances of in just as popular isekais. And it did not popularize the isekai genre either. It may for sure have helped in popularize it though. Thanks for the clarification.Lmao how can the fans just self proclaimed it to be "The father of Isekai" where basically isekais before Jobless reincarnation have similar Isekai tropes.That's so stupid.Seems like this is the first Isekai many have first read. Because it was released in 2012, which is when SAO got its anime and thus generated more interest for isekai. So Mushoku had the #1 spot on a novel website for quite a while. So people see it as the one that every other isekai took inspiration from. Despite that not actually being true (or well it's probably true in certain cases, but not to the extent people are portraying it as). |
| Subarashii |
Toneworks said: And polygamy is objectively bad, doesn't matter who doesn't agree. The man with multiple wives is basically cheating, he is betraying his wife's trust. . open relationships don't actually have the same problem cheating because everyone is honest and open about being with other people. Cheating destroyed trust because it means lying to parties involved. while i wouldn't be in a open relationship i don't see a problem if other are doing it and openly honest about it. |
GrimAtramentJan 15, 2021 8:07 PM
| "among monsters and humans, there are only two types. Those who undergo suffering and spread it to others. And those who undergo suffering and avoid giving it to others." -Alice “Beauty is no quality in things themselves: It exists merely in the mind which contemplates them; and each mind perceives a different beauty.” David Hume “Evil is created when someone gives up on someone else. It appears when everyone gives up on someone as a lost cause and removes their path to salvation. Once they are cut off from everyone else, they become evil.” -Othinus  |
blonkevnoci said: Personally I like to keep ethical questions aside when I'm reading/watching a story as much as possible. That way, I can judge a show for what it is offered and not let it be interfered by tangents that go off very far. But that is not to say, I completely cast it aside. Me, I am not a condoner for nor a protestant against polygamy. I've never actively thought about it or seen anyone involved in it, so I'm quite neutral on this matter. I am (quite possibly) one of the largest Mushoku Tensei fan on this site and if you were to ask me, I am not a big fan of the polygamy. For reasons I cannot pinpoint, it felt kind of weird. However all the good aspects of the story is so large that I don't really seem to care anymore about one or two things I disliked before. Not to mention, the relationship between each of the heroine and Rudeus is written so well and has great dynamic so it kind of ended up being a fun ride to see the chemistry when the author threw them all together. To my knowledge, Mushoku is not the first with a polygamy route relationship and definitely won't be the last. There are probably a lot of people who share the same views as me and enjoy the series for the same reason. I don't understand your question "why the LN is popular?" but I hope I have given you an answer that is at the least satisfactory. You must keep in mind that, the polygamy thing is not really an important aspect when compared to the plot line that develops in the second half of the series (which I will not say for the sake of not spoiling). People can like the LN because of the plot it follows. You might be right. We are all different after all. |
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Marx_Chrixtein said: The Mushoku Tensei series is genuinely accepted as a masterpiece in the community for its serious take on exploring the life of someone striving for a second chance at growing up despite their mistakes of the past. LMAO If you ask me, his past self is actually BETTER than his reincarnated self. Because however big a lump of human trash he was, at least he did not commit any crimes. He even saved someone before he died. Now after he got reincarnated, he became a even worst human trash than he was before. Let us list the shit shall we. 1. Let's talk about Sylphiette. She is his first friend in the new world, cool nothing bad about that. But when he first found out about Sylphiette's gender in the bathroom, the disgusting expression on his face made me sick to my stomach. He was lusting for Sylphiette's body after seeing her naked, she was like 6 years old at that time, if you happen to see a naked 6 year old girl in real life, you would not think anything of it, you certainly wouldn't get sexually turned on unless you're a pedophile. So this scene basically sealed Rudeus as a pedophile. After this he began to groom her, made her become attached to him with the plan to get her to spread her legs without a second thought when she grows up. 2. Let's talk about Eris. Rudeus began lusting for Eris very soon after meeting her. She was 10. You do not lust for a 10 year old unless you're a pedophile. He was going to have sex with a 12 year old Eris without feeling any guilt (really?). And he eventually have sex with a 15 year old Eris. So at this point Rudeus was like 47 years old in total. In real life you go to jail without a shred of doubt for this. He should know this very well, he is a shut in loser but he isn't a retard. He should be familiar with the law. 3. Let's talk about his cheating. I actually already covered it earlier and someone else added more so I'll keep it short. He cheated on his wife who just gave birth with another woman. Despicable behavior especially when his father was the same. Why the fuck can these men not be satisfied with 1 wife? Like what the hell is wrong with them? |
TssParanoid said: FFCreations said: "The father of isekai" is literally something the fans of the series has self-proclaimed it as. It is in no way the father of isekai. Any trope that people claim it created or popularized, you can find earlier instances of in just as popular isekais. And it did not popularize the isekai genre either. It may for sure have helped in popularize it though. You're misrepresenting what that term means. No one's claiming it was the first isekai or that it invented those tropes. But it was the one that solidified the identity of the modern fantasy isekai. When a modern isekai author decides what to write in his new fantasy LN, he doesn't read the dozens of books from which mushoku tensei took inspiration, he reads mushku tensei. That's true regardless of the fact that any one of those tropes individually could be traced to a much earlier work. I believe you misinterpreted what I said. I didn't only say it invented those tropes. I specifically said "or popularized". I.e what you claim it did right now. That it shaped the "identity of modern isekai". Which it just simply did not. Well the fans of the series all claim it did. It HELPED in doing so for sure. But claiming it was the father of modern isekai that basically every isekai that came after was inspired by is just not true. And the fans of the series does claim it invented tropes as well. They think that this is the first isekai that featured the MC dying in a car accident and getting reincarnated. They spread that misinformation like wildfire. Hugely popular AniTuber even spread tons of misinformation that fans of this series eats up. Like how it inspired novels like Re:Zero, Overlord and No Game No Life. When those series was released before. |
| Subarashii |
Toneworks said: You are still ignoring the fact that the series established the fact that he is affected by his biological age. For example he wasn’t aroused by his mom. He figured it was biological. And it doesn’t matter what you think about the series. Most people who have read consider it a masterpiece, me included.Marx_Chrixtein said: The Mushoku Tensei series is genuinely accepted as a masterpiece in the community for its serious take on exploring the life of someone striving for a second chance at growing up despite their mistakes of the past. LMAO If you ask me, his past self is actually BETTER than his reincarnated self. Because however big a lump of human trash he was, at least he did not commit any crimes. He even saved someone before he died. Now after he got reincarnated, he became a even worst human trash than he was before. Let us list the shit shall we. 1. Let's talk about Sylphiette. She is his first friend in the new world, cool nothing bad about that. But when he first found out about Sylphiette's gender in the bathroom, the disgusting expression on his face made me sick to my stomach. He was lusting for Sylphiette's body after seeing her naked, she was like 6 years old at that time, if you happen to see a naked 6 year old girl in real life, you would not think anything of it, you certainly wouldn't get sexually turned on unless you're a pedophile. So this scene basically sealed Rudeus as a pedophile. After this he began to groom her, made her become attached to him with the plan to get her to spread her legs without a second thought when she grows up. 2. Let's talk about Eris. Rudeus began lusting for Eris very soon after meeting her. She was 10. You do not lust for a 10 year old unless you're a pedophile. He was going to have sex with a 12 year old Eris without feeling any guilt (really?). And he eventually have sex with a 15 year old Eris. So at this point Rudeus was like 47 years old in total. In real life you go to jail without a shred of doubt for this. He should know this very well, he is a shut in loser but he isn't a retard. He should be familiar with the law. 3. Let's talk about his cheating. I actually already covered it earlier and someone else added more so I'll keep it short. He cheated on his wife who just gave birth with another woman. Despicable behavior especially when his father was the same. Why the fuck can these men not be satisfied with 1 wife? Like what the hell is wrong with them? |
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ExcaliburAO said: You are still ignoring the fact that the series established the fact that he is affected by his biological age. For example he wasn’t aroused by his mom. He figured it was biological. And it doesn’t matter what you think about the series. Most people who have read consider it a masterpiece, me included. Don't think I can take someone who has Fairy Tail as one of their favorite anime very seriously. No sir. Also, if he was affected by his biological age then why he been perverted since he was born? Can you get a boner as an infant hm? |
Devil_God_000 said: FFCreations said: I believe you misinterpreted what I said. I didn't only say it invented those tropes. I specifically said "or popularized". I.e what you claim it did right now. That it shaped the "identity of modern isekai". Which it just simply did not. Well the fans of the series all claim it did. It HELPED in doing so for sure. But claiming it was the father of modern isekai that basically every isekai that came after was inspired by is just not true. And the fans of the series does claim it invented tropes as well. They think that this is the first isekai that featured the MC dying in a car accident and getting reincarnated. They spread that misinformation like wildfire. Hugely popular AniTuber even spread tons of misinformation that fans of this series eats up. Like how it inspired novels like Re:Zero, Overlord and No Game No Life. When those series was released before. Mushoku Tensei is like the Star Wars or MCU of Isekai Genre. It wasn't the First or the Best but it did popularize the genre. It HELPED popularize it. But it didn't popularize it. It was already very popular before. And it had help to popularize from a bunch of other series. |
| Subarashii |
Toneworks said: So you just insult someone for having different tastes to try to win the argument. So let me use your words. dOn’T tHiNk I cAn TaKe SoMeOnE wHo HaS oNlY hArEm SeRiEs As FaVoRiTeS sErIoUsLy. Also babies can get boners so your point is invalid.ExcaliburAO said: You are still ignoring the fact that the series established the fact that he is affected by his biological age. For example he wasn’t aroused by his mom. He figured it was biological. And it doesn’t matter what you think about the series. Most people who have read consider it a masterpiece, me included. Don't think I can take someone who has Fairy Tail as one of their favorite anime very seriously. No sir. Also, if he was affected by his biological age then why he been perverted since he was born? Can you get a boner as an infant hm? |
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Scordolo said: It's because this LN is the birth of the trend of truck-kun and isekai tropes. This is FALSE. Mushoku didn't create that trope. It has existeed since the 60s with AstroBoy. Guess how the boy who became Atom/Astro Boy died. Ran over by a truck. It didn't even bring it into isekai. Knights and Magic's Webnovel came out in 2010 (2 years before MTs web novel) and uses that trope. Same with most other tropes that people say MT invented. Most of them are just late 2000s/early 2010s tropes done really well and in a "darker" fantasy setting. MT is really good by itself. Stop trying to add historical value where there is not that much. It make you feels insecure about the LNs quality. This isn't that much aimed at the exact person who I quoted since they might saying it ironically. It goes to the people who say this in general. |
GokaiKingJan 17, 2021 9:43 AM
  愛がなければ、見えない。 Without Love, the truth cannot be seen. |
GokaiReborn said: Scordolo said: It's because this LN is the birth of the trend of truck-kun and isekai tropes. This is FALSE. Mushoku didn't create that trope. It has existeed since the 60s with AstroBoy. Guess how the boy who became Atom/Astro Boy died. Ran over by a truck. It didn't even bring it into isekai. Knights and Magic's Webnovel came out in 2010 (2 years before MTs web novel) and uses that trope. Same with most other tropes that people say MT invented. Most of them are just late 2000s/early 2010s tropes done really well and in a "darker" fantasy setting. MT is really good by itself. Stop trying to add historical value where there is not that much. It make you feels insecure about the LNs quality. This isn't that much aimed at the exact person who I quoted since they might saying it ironically. It goes to the people who say this in general. Welp when I searched 'The father of Isekai" I found this.Why? |
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Scordolo said: Welp when I searched 'The father of Isekai" I found this.Why? I'm pretty sure father of Isekai is Inuyasha. Inuyasha came out in 1996, Digmon in 1999 and Spirited Away in 2001, these are the 3 main anime that can be considered father of Isekai, and Inuyasha is the oldest so it gets that title. |
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