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May 10, 2014 1:03 PM
#51
| i dont understand either touma is a nice MC, i dont care if other people hate him ^^ |
May 11, 2014 9:17 AM
#52
ssjokg said: Korrvo said: I can accept that.ssjokg said: Because she's a girl and I have a dick.Korrvo said: again, he isnt any different from Misaka in his actions or motives.So how is he blant or worse?Because he's super bland aside from his ability to punch bitches despite being a overkill moralfag. He's one of the main reasons that Railgun is so so so so so so much better than Index is. wow that ended rather quick... |
| Shonen! |
May 11, 2014 9:21 AM
#53
Hakuryuukou said: ssjokg said: I still dont see the reason. Misaka even has inconsistencies as a character and an even stronger "plot armor" thanks to filler god devil Nagai. Back then when i still only watched the anime, i saw Touma as nothing more than a stubborn guy who was always preaching about justice and morals to his enemies.... i wouldn't say it's a bad thing but i quickly lost interest as the plot progressed with no serious consequences on him and everything around him for 2 seasons(excluding the 1st arc here). Well, the foreshadowing of world war at the end of Index 2 was what makes me to read the novels. And yes i agree with you about Misaka. She also has a fucking plot armor yet the rabid fans always denied/overlooked this fact. That space opera scene on Silent Party arc is more than enough to prove it. ''Back then when i still only watched the anime, i saw Touma as nothing more than a stubborn guy who was always preaching about justice and morals to his enemies.... i wouldn't say it's a bad thing but i quickly lost interest as the plot progressed with no serious consequences on him and everything around him for 2 seasons(excluding the 1st arc here).'' Wow thanks for the PoV , i clearly didn't see that , you are right about that( the part where you say that he has no serious consequences ) . But still isn't that the problem of the plot and not him ? . |
| Shonen! |
May 11, 2014 9:29 AM
#54
| Problem is that the consequences arent apparent in the anime and all become quite obvious after the end of season 2. |
May 13, 2014 8:05 PM
#55
| I never hated him as much as I found him dull but that was more due to his design. Started to like him once I got to know him |
May 15, 2014 12:20 PM
#56
| Interesting. I don't think Kamijou Touma-san isn't hated much here in Japan- he is loved as a "neta-chara"; his existence itself is a sort of a funny joke. He is obsessed in morals but punches girls; he even preaches for a few minutes before doing so (the longest "preaching" lines ever in anime history); he's outrageously in a harem position but never realizes that and say he is unfortunate. He is almost half dead each time after the battles but he is always the invincible. You shouldn't be taking anime series too seriously. Watching the Index series is like participating in a farce dress up festival. Unless you get over with the absurdity of the Magical vs Scientific and the characters like Touma or Accelerator, and you yourself participate in the festive events, you can't really enjoy the series or characters. |
May 15, 2014 12:31 PM
#57
| Morals have nothing to do with punching girls.Punching girls isnt good or bad in itself. Being in a harem isnt automatically good.Just because a lot horny kids would love it doesnt mean everyone thinks that.And his "harem" is away 90% of the time. Pretty much every shounen MC(and side kicks) is almost half dead but always invincible.But unlike them Touma barely ever wins by himself and also holds the record with most loses in shounen series(or any). What does the last even mean when we talk about fiction? LOTR's story(toss a ring in a volcano in the middle of enemy monster territory=save the world ) is absurd as well but nobody says "dont take it seriously". |
ssjokgMay 15, 2014 12:46 PM
Jun 3, 2014 4:29 PM
#58
| wow, i'm very suprised by this thread. i hadn't heard any dislike towards him at all until now |
Jul 27, 2014 2:15 PM
#59
Wyzdm said: Although the Index anime changed the fight a bit, in both he beat Accel, because he had too much pride and wanted to kill him by touching him.If he had kept his cool he could probably beat him.Overall I think he's a good character but some of his moments with Index really annoys me. Also one thing I didn't like was Don't open if you haven't watched season 1 of Index or season 2 of Railgun how he managed to beat Accelerator. Accelerator could have easily beat him by attacking him from a distance. The battle was still awesome but it felt a bit over the top for him to beat the strongest esper in academy city. Also for some reason it felt a bit more convincing on how he managed to beat accelerator in railgun 2. At that point of the story, if we ignore esper powers, Touma, Misaka,Kuroko and others can easily beat the shit out of him....But only Touma can negate his powers so he is the only one that can do it. |
Jul 30, 2014 7:39 AM
#60
| i don't think that many people hate touma, they just like accelerator more. or it could be that touma is hogging almost all the girls, all the good ones, leaving not many to accelerator. something like this: |
Jun 2, 2016 4:56 AM
#61
| He's just such a generic character, with a new look, and it hurts because everything around the world is so full of creative ideas and storylines, and some of the best characters as well, Mikoto Misaka and Accelerator are great characters with a lot of development and interest, hell cut out Touma and Index's whole plot and give Mikoto and Accelerator the main character positions you've got a near superior story that not only is intelligent, but it's relatable. I'm not saying Touma is the worst character ever, but he is very annoying as a main character, his situations and storylines are some of the more boring parts of the series, overall he would be much suited to being a supporting character like in Railgun, and his whole Index storyline could very well be a secondary story. It just sucks because in a world were everything seems a little uncertain we don't need a character who thinks and acts the same as almost every generic main character in anime to have the main slot of the story when we have a better main character in Mikoto and Accelerator. |
Jul 9, 2016 1:50 AM
#62
| Because touma is a badass and all people who hate him not This is proof http://www.memecenter.com/fun/1244003/kamijou-touma-a-true-badass Hater gonna hate. WHAT?? U THINK YOU ARE COOL THAN HIM?? I'm going to break that stupid illusion of you!!! |
Jul 19, 2016 11:30 PM
#63
DrewLRussell said: Yeah, Mikoto Misaka and Accelerator (although quite crazy at times) are great characters. They are a hell of a lot more interesting than Touma and Index. In the whole story of Touma, he just goes and punches everything and proceeds with his harem. Even in the world of science and magic, he just has a fist that cancels everything as well as positive attitude (which somehow helps him overcome all problems). I wish he had more interesting abilities lol. On the other hand we have Index... I mean, she would of been quite cute Imo if they didn't make her annoying af. Literally what you said, cut them both out or have Index as a side story instead and the it would of been more enjoyable. Even in her own anime, Index didn't really portray a that important role, aside from the other side characters constantly reminding us that she is supposed to be important. He's just such a generic character, with a new look, and it hurts because everything around the world is so full of creative ideas and storylines, and some of the best characters as well, Mikoto Misaka and Accelerator are great characters with a lot of development and interest, hell cut out Touma and Index's whole plot and give Mikoto and Accelerator the main character positions you've got a near superior story that not only is intelligent, but it's relatable. I'm not saying Touma is the worst character ever, but he is very annoying as a main character, his situations and storylines are some of the more boring parts of the series, overall he would be much suited to being a supporting character like in Railgun, and his whole Index storyline could very well be a secondary story. It just sucks because in a world were everything seems a little uncertain we don't need a character who thinks and acts the same as almost every generic main character in anime to have the main slot of the story when we have a better main character in Mikoto and Accelerator. If you haven't noticed, I didn't like Index in the series and am quite irritated with Touma's overall generic-ness. |
SympathyRSJul 19, 2016 11:43 PM
Jul 20, 2016 5:34 AM
#64
SympathyRS said: DrewLRussell said: Yeah, Mikoto Misaka and Accelerator (although quite crazy at times) are great characters. They are a hell of a lot more interesting than Touma and Index. In the whole story of Touma, he just goes and punches everything and proceeds with his harem. Even in the world of science and magic, he just has a fist that cancels everything as well as positive attitude (which somehow helps him overcome all problems). I wish he had more interesting abilities lol. On the other hand we have Index... I mean, she would of been quite cute Imo if they didn't make her annoying af. Literally what you said, cut them both out or have Index as a side story instead and the it would of been more enjoyable. Even in her own anime, Index didn't really portray a that important role, aside from the other side characters constantly reminding us that she is supposed to be important. He's just such a generic character, with a new look, and it hurts because everything around the world is so full of creative ideas and storylines, and some of the best characters as well, Mikoto Misaka and Accelerator are great characters with a lot of development and interest, hell cut out Touma and Index's whole plot and give Mikoto and Accelerator the main character positions you've got a near superior story that not only is intelligent, but it's relatable. I'm not saying Touma is the worst character ever, but he is very annoying as a main character, his situations and storylines are some of the more boring parts of the series, overall he would be much suited to being a supporting character like in Railgun, and his whole Index storyline could very well be a secondary story. It just sucks because in a world were everything seems a little uncertain we don't need a character who thinks and acts the same as almost every generic main character in anime to have the main slot of the story when we have a better main character in Mikoto and Accelerator. If you haven't noticed, I didn't like Index in the series and am quite irritated with Touma's overall generic-ness. Glad to see we understand that there's too much potential in this story to designate it to Touma as the main character. I defiantly think you could start the Story with Mikoto being the main character (like in the chronological order) and then proceed onto Accelerator taking the main seat while Touma/Index's story becomes more sub plot, maybe make Index a little less moe and show off her more inner beauty. That's what makes Priestess characters work, like in One Punch Gospel by Rumiko Takahashi. |
Jul 20, 2016 5:56 AM
#65
DrewLRussell said: Thanks, I will move onto railgun next, since I didn't know where to start, I just happened to start with the Index series. I think making Index a little less moe would help, because apart from the outfit, she isn't acting much Priestess/Sister like Imo.SympathyRS said: DrewLRussell said: He's just such a generic character, with a new look, and it hurts because everything around the world is so full of creative ideas and storylines, and some of the best characters as well, Mikoto Misaka and Accelerator are great characters with a lot of development and interest, hell cut out Touma and Index's whole plot and give Mikoto and Accelerator the main character positions you've got a near superior story that not only is intelligent, but it's relatable. I'm not saying Touma is the worst character ever, but he is very annoying as a main character, his situations and storylines are some of the more boring parts of the series, overall he would be much suited to being a supporting character like in Railgun, and his whole Index storyline could very well be a secondary story. It just sucks because in a world were everything seems a little uncertain we don't need a character who thinks and acts the same as almost every generic main character in anime to have the main slot of the story when we have a better main character in Mikoto and Accelerator. If you haven't noticed, I didn't like Index in the series and am quite irritated with Touma's overall generic-ness. Glad to see we understand that there's too much potential in this story to designate it to Touma as the main character. I defiantly think you could start the Story with Mikoto being the main character (like in the chronological order) and then proceed onto Accelerator taking the main seat while Touma/Index's story becomes more sub plot, maybe make Index a little less moe and show off her more inner beauty. That's what makes Priestess characters work, like in One Punch Gospel by Rumiko Takahashi. |
Aug 5, 2016 1:13 AM
#66
| "But touma go punch everything bra bra bra braaaa" SO WHAT!!!! You hate him because he punch everything including a woman??? What a f$&king retard!!! Let's me saying this one more time ToUMAN it a best superhero ever and only 2nd to saitama and great harem king of all time!!!!.....or I get it you him because you jelly at his harem as you??? DEAL WITH IT YOU LIMP D$CK!!! |
Sep 30, 2016 3:19 PM
#67
| I have exactly opposite feelings - Mikoto is typical irritating tsundere and railgun series compared to index is anime about nothing (you can find many better slice of life anime than this one). Touma is typical MC for action shounen anime plus his not such a loser like characters in many similar anime. Mikoto is nice as a girl for MC, nothing more. And other thing about Toumas punches - he is punching girls which are trying to kill him or being a threat to his friends. What should he have done? Stroke them? |
LondevinSep 30, 2016 3:25 PM
Sep 30, 2016 3:29 PM
#68
Londevin said: Well since you've brought it up, I do believe Touma is more entertaining as a main character than Misaka. But I disagree with classifying Misaka as just a typical tsundere. I won't deny she is one, but there are many times where she abandons that stereotype. I have exactly opposite feelings - Mikoto is typical irritating tsundere and railgun series compared to index is anime about nothing (you can find many better slice of life anime than this one). Touma is typical MC for action shounen anime plus his not such a loser like characters in many similar anime. Mikoto is nice as a girl for MC, nothing more. And other thing about Toumas punches - he is punching girls which are trying to kill him or being a threat to his friends. What should he have done? Stroke them? Generally this only happens during episodes of high tension. Her tsundere is really only used for comedic effect. This is more evident in the light novels of course, but the anime doesn't do her character perfect justice. |
Oct 2, 2016 12:10 AM
#69
| Since this came to life again, I'll pitch in. I hated Touma because he was a character void of background and personality. All he had was his idealism. I agree with some of the first people, I feel that the producers short-cut his development and background for the purpose of speeding up the plot. I assume it's the same in the manga, though I haven't read it. To me, as a person who enjoys characters that I can come to like through their development, I was sorely disappointed. This was a weak move. I appreciate the fact that his right hand does not discriminate, but what was all he had going for him after his memory loss. He doesn't even remember his family, they wasted that opportunity for us! Moreover, his idealism is never explained, or given some reasoning. He just risks his life, and almost gets killed over and over again, and it gets pretty monotonous. He's the "hero for no reason" (I know it was "hero for fun", I'm just making a point) that Saitama seems to parody in One Punch Man. I'm sure I hate more about him than that, but I'm pretty tired, so I'll leave it at that for now. |
Oct 9, 2016 7:25 PM
#70
| Because he gives long, cliche speeches and uses his right hand for plot device. His power is boring and gets old VERY fast. He has no personal goals and motivation and is purely driven by plot. You could give his power to somebody else and kill him off, it won't matter. He has no personality and is no better than a robot |
Jan 16, 2017 10:48 PM
#71
| What the hell? Touma is a pimp. Accelerator is a pimp. Last Order (Misika 20001) is the best character in the series hands down. |
Oct 13, 2018 9:51 PM
#72
| It honestly pissed me off when they did a fake out with his character development in episode 23 of season 2. I finally thought for once he would take the initiative to try to figure out himself and the world but NOPE. Ffs the author doesn't give a crap about his character one bit. |
Oct 13, 2018 10:03 PM
#73
| Proabably because he is surrounded by much better characters. Two examples being rail gun and accelerator. Then having to watch him go off on moral tangents, be friends with everyone for some fucking reason, and then get his ass beat only for him to be OP at the last second and win. |
Oct 17, 2018 5:23 PM
#74
| Touma is one of the worst MCs I’ve had the displeasure of watching. He’s your typical generic shounen & harem MC, but takes the worst traits from those archetypes. Touma is bland, dense, naive, has no personal goals, no character development, his ability is boring, but above all Touma’s self sacrifice and white knight complex are some of his worst traits. Touma’s fights are boring and predictable because you know what the outcome will be. He’s going to preach some self righteous, moral lecture to the enemy mid way through combat as if his view is the “right way” and end the fight by punching someone. It’s increasingly annoying and blantant how Touma is protected by plot armour, that turns the most competent and intelligent antagonists to dumb morons in the face of the Almighty Touma! Not to mention, Misaka and Accelerator are far more interesting characters than him |
FlexstyleOct 17, 2018 5:41 PM
Oct 17, 2018 5:35 PM
#75
| I don't dislike Touma. He isn't a pussy and always takes action whenever something needs to be done so there's that. The thing is that Accelerator just outshines him by a damn mile. And even Mikoto imo is a better MC, when it comes to Railgun. |
Oct 17, 2018 5:40 PM
#76
Dec 21, 2018 1:36 PM
#77
Jun 16, 2019 3:44 AM
#78
mitch3315 said: Because he punches bitches, and violence against women is wrong because equality or some shit. Hmm Unless you are joking why? Sexist and equality dictates I am to treat women and men the same way thefore - Punches to everyone! :D Edit: Okay this is really OLD! oh my god. Sorry |
| perkunos.blogspot.com |
Jun 16, 2019 7:49 AM
#79
Paulo_Goncalves said: mitch3315 said: Because he punches bitches, and violence against women is wrong because equality or some shit. Hmm Unless you are joking why? Sexist and equality dictates I am to treat women and men the same way thefore - Punches to everyone! :D Edit: Okay this is really OLD! oh my god. Sorry 110% a 5 year old joke my dude. |
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Jul 11, 2019 6:05 PM
#80
| Why do people hate Touma? Because the anime did him injustice that's why. He's the most fantastically written light novel character, especially for a Sci Fi Fantasy series. He certainly has flaws and has a unique motivation than any other protagonist in this genre, going beyond good and evil. He actually doesn't care about good and evil and just wants a peaceful world. Simple right? I mean in the festival arc he actually contemplated whether he should stop the Catholic Church or not. In his mind their goal was peace so he was like "should I really bother?" It's not until they started hurting innocence that he changed his mind and decided to put a stop to their plans. He's willing to help anyone regardless cos he damn well feels like it. If he doesn't like what you're doing, he's gonna challenge you whether you're stronger than him or not. The problem is all of Touma's character is given through his interior thoughts. Since the anime brutally cut important inner dialogue or basically removed all of it altogether we're left judging him at face value. His speeches come off self righteous, but truth is half the time he actually doesn't really believe his own speeches, it's just a way to gain time for himself as he analyses his enemies attacks and the battlefield readying his next move. But since we don't see or hear his true thoughts, we're left thinking whatever comes out of his mouth is his true feelings. |
filimaua13Jul 11, 2019 6:11 PM
Jul 19, 2019 8:29 PM
#81
| I just hate him because he's boring and bland Like the typical isekai protagonist |
Aug 5, 2019 5:29 AM
#82
| people who hate him just don't get his character so they hate him lmao |
Sep 10, 2019 1:40 PM
#83
| I understand that anime viewers don't get to hear his inner monologue but you cant blame them because anime is more popular than LN's and honestly they're the majority of fans. Be that as it may I personally don't like touma as a MC because 1) his powers and plot armor completely destroy the suspension of disbelief. Imagine breaker cancels out magic and esper powers but not any physical consequences they cause. So why hasn't anyone just dropped a car on him a three a large boulder at the speed of sound? Many characters he's fought could've done just that but chose not to.....for some reason. But they show complete competence when they're NOT fighting touma. That's not just plot armor, that's the author straight up insulting our intelligence and it pisses alot of people off and that anger translates to touma. And yes I know he has basically low level spider sense but even then touma only has human level running and dodging speeds it cant possibly help in every situation. 2) everyone else has said it and I'll say it too, ACCELERATOR AND MISAKA ARE BETTER MAIN CHARACTERS. For the same reasons touma is a bad one! They have god like abilities actually suited to deal with the crap they and touma get into. So much so that the plot actively works AGAINST them to try to beat them. How much bullshit ways can the universe come up with to actually damage accelerator. We root for them because the UNIVERSE ITSELF is doing its damndest to kill them but they have just enough power to keep the odds and the story compelling. Top it off with real personalities and character growth, giving actual insight into the better parts of the to aru universe with their stories (unlike dangling the secret of imagine breaker over our heads for more than a decade now) and you'll see why people are over touma |
Sep 18, 2019 9:11 AM
#84
| simply because he is an uninteresting character and his personality is like other typical light novel mc and have his own harem but after many episodes, you will get used of his personality (same with Index). Also his powers have resemble in other anime series just like the mc in Gakuen Alice if I'm not mistaken. The main reason I started this series is because of Misaka Mikoto popularity, I like her in Railgun but she's kind of annoying in Index series. On the other hand, Accelerator is the best character in this series, He's the reason why I still keep watching this. I thought he's just an arc villain character but I didn't expect him to have more screentime after that and he has a great character development compared to other cast. Also his powers is very unique compared to Touma and Misaka. I'm only an anime watcher by the way. |
Dec 17, 2019 3:23 PM
#86
filimaua13 said: True. Before starting the novels i though Touma was "ok" as a protagonist, nothing much. It is actually sad how the index anime does not make him justice. He became one of the best fictional characters i have ever seen. Touma is loved in Japan, you just have to see how he is always in the top 3 of the Male Light Novel Characters pole. For breaking the infamous myth of "Accelerator>Touma" I advise y'all to start reading the novel if you like to read and have interest in toaru, you'll be surprised.Why do people hate Touma? Because the anime did him injustice that's why. He's the most fantastically written light novel character, especially for a Sci Fi Fantasy series. He certainly has flaws and has a unique motivation than any other protagonist in this genre, going beyond good and evil. He actually doesn't care about good and evil and just wants a peaceful world. Simple right? I mean in the festival arc he actually contemplated whether he should stop the Catholic Church or not. In his mind their goal was peace so he was like "should I really bother?" It's not until they started hurting innocence that he changed his mind and decided to put a stop to their plans. He's willing to help anyone regardless cos he damn well feels like it. If he doesn't like what you're doing, he's gonna challenge you whether you're stronger than him or not. The problem is all of Touma's character is given through his interior thoughts. Since the anime brutally cut important inner dialogue or basically removed all of it altogether we're left judging him at face value. His speeches come off self righteous, but truth is half the time he actually doesn't really believe his own speeches, it's just a way to gain time for himself as he analyses his enemies attacks and the battlefield readying his next move. But since we don't see or hear his true thoughts, we're left thinking whatever comes out of his mouth is his true feelings. |
Dec 17, 2019 3:54 PM
#87
Tsumilk said: filimaua13 said: True. Before starting the novels i though Touma was "ok" as a protagonist, nothing much. It is actually sad how the index anime does not make him justice. He became one of the best fictional characters i have ever seen. Touma is loved in Japan, you just have to see how he is always in the top 3 of the Male Light Novel Characters pole. For breaking the infamous myth of "Accelerator>Touma" I advise y'all to start reading the novel if you like to read and have interest in toaru, you'll be surprised.Why do people hate Touma? Because the anime did him injustice that's why. He's the most fantastically written light novel character, especially for a Sci Fi Fantasy series. He certainly has flaws and has a unique motivation than any other protagonist in this genre, going beyond good and evil. He actually doesn't care about good and evil and just wants a peaceful world. Simple right? I mean in the festival arc he actually contemplated whether he should stop the Catholic Church or not. In his mind their goal was peace so he was like "should I really bother?" It's not until they started hurting innocence that he changed his mind and decided to put a stop to their plans. He's willing to help anyone regardless cos he damn well feels like it. If he doesn't like what you're doing, he's gonna challenge you whether you're stronger than him or not. The problem is all of Touma's character is given through his interior thoughts. Since the anime brutally cut important inner dialogue or basically removed all of it altogether we're left judging him at face value. His speeches come off self righteous, but truth is half the time he actually doesn't really believe his own speeches, it's just a way to gain time for himself as he analyses his enemies attacks and the battlefield readying his next move. But since we don't see or hear his true thoughts, we're left thinking whatever comes out of his mouth is his true feelings. I agree 100% with everything you wrote. I love Touma he is awesome. |
Dec 17, 2019 4:23 PM
#88
| Hes okay its just people like a more badass mc like Accelerator |
| B O C C H I S W E E P |
Dec 18, 2019 1:10 AM
#89
Dec 30, 2019 6:12 AM
#90
| Only talking from an anime standpoint here: His trademark is senseless sacrifice. 'Senseless' is the word to emphasize here. Nothing wrong with Heroic sacrifices, but Touma does them so many times they lose their impact and they don't make things better (which is the least I hope to expect from a guy that meddles with everyones affairs). Besides that noble trait in the serious parts of the series there is nothing else enriching his character. He breaths and saves people left & right regardless of circumstances or consequences, the end. He's more of a token or embodiment of a protagonist's trait than a fullfledged character with goals, desires & aspirations of his own that would normally hold reckless behaviour at bay and would make noble acts more thought out/ guided. There isn't much to be inspired by. Nothing inherently interesting about sacrificing for the sake of sacrificing. His disposable mentality makes him appear disposable himself. So how should we root for him as a character when it always leads to him mindlessly putting his life on the line bc it feels... "right" to him? He never thinks ahead when things are peaceful, just plays around 'till the next conflict forces him into the drastic split-second choice to ignore or meddle. When he meddles he blabbers on and on and will always find some fault with someone. One time he'll lecture science for having to sacrifice a few people to save many, the other time he'll lecture and fight characters that share his morality of not wanting to sacrifice few for many. Why? I don't even want to know the answer. He can be so much more and so much more reliable with a few more motivations guiding his actions. His intelligence is hardly put to use, except when it's to humor us. It's hard not to take his hollow actions seriously when the anime tries to weave a serious story around it. There would be less 'eye-rolling' if Touma became a character worthy of the tone of the story, putting in a similar weight himself OR the story's tone becoming as radically straightforward & one-dimensional as Touma with the humor dominating over the serious parts. Right now there's a dissonance where you're forced to either ignore Touma's ridiculous outbursts or watch the story in a more superficial light than it's actually written in. That's how I'd describe it. Personally, I don't hate Touma, but rather regret that reaching some nifty resolutions to problems with characters as uncomplicated as Touma is unlikely. The resolution will always feel just as hollow as his character. There are no stakes for him, he's the referee that intervenes in every match and says the rules were breached (somehow). He doesn't feel like a true part of the story, just an outsider/an alien device that forces plotpoints to a premature close taking the trouble of of the characters's hands that actually have a crucial part in it. |
Dayne_SUUJan 4, 2020 2:09 AM
| ~~People who mostly ignore your existence... They are in no position to assess you.~~ |
Feb 18, 2020 6:14 AM
#91
| I know this thread is old, but I'm gonna write my own answer anyway: Touma in my opinion is the same as Emiya Shiro (from Fate/ Stay Night) in the way he's too self righteous and always right, not because he's a wise or strong person, but because he has a thick plot armor and represents the writer's simplistic mind set. He does stupid things but gets rewarded for them in an unrealistic way, and has very cheesy dialogue, "how can I call myself a man if I can't save one single girl" <--- said girl appeared out of nowhere and he barely knows anything about her, but hey that's good enough reason to risk his life for her. |
Feb 20, 2020 11:37 AM
#92
| Stupid idiots doesn't understand how DiabloMask said: BRUH you really don't know Touma so just stay in the back or research Touma and Shirou are different taking everything into face value is stupidI know this thread is old, but I'm gonna write my own answer anyway: Touma in my opinion is the same as Emiya Shiro (from Fate/ Stay Night) in the way he's too self righteous and always right, not because he's a wise or strong person, but because he has a thick plot armor and represents the writer's simplistic mind set. He does stupid things but gets rewarded for them in an unrealistic way, and has very cheesy dialogue, "how can I call myself a man if I can't save one single girl" <--- said girl appeared out of nowhere and he barely knows anything about her, but hey that's good enough reason to risk his life for her. |
Feb 20, 2020 12:54 PM
#93
KamijouTouma007 said: Stupid idiots doesn't understand how DiabloMask said: BRUH you really don't know Touma so just stay in the back or research Touma and Shirou are different taking everything into face value is stupidI know this thread is old, but I'm gonna write my own answer anyway: Touma in my opinion is the same as Emiya Shiro (from Fate/ Stay Night) in the way he's too self righteous and always right, not because he's a wise or strong person, but because he has a thick plot armor and represents the writer's simplistic mind set. He does stupid things but gets rewarded for them in an unrealistic way, and has very cheesy dialogue, "how can I call myself a man if I can't save one single girl" <--- said girl appeared out of nowhere and he barely knows anything about her, but hey that's good enough reason to risk his life for her. Attacking me instead of addressing the points I made, typical fanboy behavior. |
Feb 21, 2020 8:06 AM
#94
DiabloMask said: Emiya Shiro would be the closer character to be compared to Kamijou Touma but they are still differents.I know this thread is old, but I'm gonna write my own answer anyway: Touma in my opinion is the same as Emiya Shiro (from Fate/ Stay Night) in the way he's too self righteous and always right, not because he's a wise or strong person, but because he has a thick plot armor and represents the writer's simplistic mind set. He does stupid things but gets rewarded for them in an unrealistic way, and has very cheesy dialogue, "how can I call myself a man if I can't save one single girl" <--- said girl appeared out of nowhere and he barely knows anything about her, but hey that's good enough reason to risk his life for her. (I'm talking about the Touma portrayed in the novel and not in the anime adaptations of Index because they look nothing alike because his character got butchered by J.C STAFF) They are both self rightous and will always try to save someone at any cost. Each authors are trying to make their protagonist being the "perfect hero". But unlike Shiro, Touma is standing for justice but he might be selfish and protect someone evil. Which makes his character corrupted. His character had always been descripted by inner dialogues and thoughs. The anime cut it, maybe because it represent too much space in a page for their adaptation. (lol) Major parts of his developpement and what he is are in his inner thoughts, so cut it would inevitably makes him less interesting. It can justify why he seems blank in the anime and with no real personnality. In the Railgun anime on the other hand he is adapted exactly how he is portrayed in the Railgun manga. He seems mysterious because it is on the Misaka's POV. So it is logic to don't know what he's thinking like in the novel, but he can still act like classic Touma, as a hero. If he is hated it is surely because of how he is showed in the Index Anime. Or because he is a male and some people are watching this show just for Misaka & cute girls for some reason. |
Feb 21, 2020 2:18 PM
#95
Tsumilk said: DiabloMask said: Emiya Shiro would be the closer character to be compared to Kamijou Touma but they are still differents.I know this thread is old, but I'm gonna write my own answer anyway: Touma in my opinion is the same as Emiya Shiro (from Fate/ Stay Night) in the way he's too self righteous and always right, not because he's a wise or strong person, but because he has a thick plot armor and represents the writer's simplistic mind set. He does stupid things but gets rewarded for them in an unrealistic way, and has very cheesy dialogue, "how can I call myself a man if I can't save one single girl" <--- said girl appeared out of nowhere and he barely knows anything about her, but hey that's good enough reason to risk his life for her. (I'm talking about the Touma portrayed in the novel and not in the anime adaptations of Index because they look nothing alike because his character got butchered by J.C STAFF) They are both self rightous and will always try to save someone at any cost. Each authors are trying to make their protagonist being the "perfect hero". But unlike Shiro, Touma is standing for justice but he might be selfish and protect someone evil. Which makes his character corrupted. His character had always been descripted by inner dialogues and thoughs. The anime cut it, maybe because it represent too much space in a page for their adaptation. (lol) Major parts of his developpement and what he is are in his inner thoughts, so cut it would inevitably makes him less interesting. It can justify why he seems blank in the anime and with no real personnality. In the Railgun anime on the other hand he is adapted exactly how he is portrayed in the Railgun manga. He seems mysterious because it is on the Misaka's POV. So it is logic to don't know what he's thinking like in the novel, but he can still act like classic Touma, as a hero. If he is hated it is surely because of how he is showed in the Index Anime. Or because he is a male and some people are watching this show just for Misaka & cute girls for some reason. I haven't read the novel and I don't care much about it to be honest. I don't mind a protagonist being a righteous hero, it's the way he's represented that annoys me, both Touma and Shirou are too reckless and overconfident, instead of treating this as a flaw and punishing them for it for character development, they end up winning somehow and their righteousness is proven right despite not making sense, which makes it feel forced, not to mention their motives are too cheesy, it's as if they know they're the protagonists and have plot armor. |
Feb 21, 2020 3:34 PM
#96
DiabloMask said: I don't like the term "plot armor" pretty much every protagonist of fiction got one. And I never truly understood why Touma was the one targeted by this word. He is the one who lost the most in Index, like most than a third of his opponents defeated him.Tsumilk said: DiabloMask said: I know this thread is old, but I'm gonna write my own answer anyway: Touma in my opinion is the same as Emiya Shiro (from Fate/ Stay Night) in the way he's too self righteous and always right, not because he's a wise or strong person, but because he has a thick plot armor and represents the writer's simplistic mind set. He does stupid things but gets rewarded for them in an unrealistic way, and has very cheesy dialogue, "how can I call myself a man if I can't save one single girl" <--- said girl appeared out of nowhere and he barely knows anything about her, but hey that's good enough reason to risk his life for her. (I'm talking about the Touma portrayed in the novel and not in the anime adaptations of Index because they look nothing alike because his character got butchered by J.C STAFF) They are both self rightous and will always try to save someone at any cost. Each authors are trying to make their protagonist being the "perfect hero". But unlike Shiro, Touma is standing for justice but he might be selfish and protect someone evil. Which makes his character corrupted. His character had always been descripted by inner dialogues and thoughs. The anime cut it, maybe because it represent too much space in a page for their adaptation. (lol) Major parts of his developpement and what he is are in his inner thoughts, so cut it would inevitably makes him less interesting. It can justify why he seems blank in the anime and with no real personnality. In the Railgun anime on the other hand he is adapted exactly how he is portrayed in the Railgun manga. He seems mysterious because it is on the Misaka's POV. So it is logic to don't know what he's thinking like in the novel, but he can still act like classic Touma, as a hero. If he is hated it is surely because of how he is showed in the Index Anime. Or because he is a male and some people are watching this show just for Misaka & cute girls for some reason. I haven't read the novel and I don't care much about it to be honest. I don't mind a protagonist being a righteous hero, it's the way he's represented that annoys me, both Touma and Shirou are too reckless and overconfident, instead of treating this as a flaw and punishing them for it for character development, they end up winning somehow and their righteousness is proven right despite not making sense, which makes it feel forced, not to mention their motives are too cheesy, it's as if they know they're the protagonists and have plot armor. For the cheesy motivations and moral speeches, it do not work on everyone I can let you that one. And Index is realising since 2004. Touma did get time to have character developpement since then lol. I saw you only watched the first season of the Index anime. It is totally understandable you did not liked him ! Understandable if your opinion of him is based on the anime at all actually, I never truly cared about him before reading tbh. |
Feb 21, 2020 8:13 PM
#97
Tsumilk said: DiabloMask said: I don't like the term "plot armor" pretty much every protagonist of fiction got one. And I never truly understood why Touma was the one targeted by this word. He is the one who lost the most in Index, like most than a third of his opponents defeated him.Tsumilk said: DiabloMask said: Emiya Shiro would be the closer character to be compared to Kamijou Touma but they are still differents.I know this thread is old, but I'm gonna write my own answer anyway: Touma in my opinion is the same as Emiya Shiro (from Fate/ Stay Night) in the way he's too self righteous and always right, not because he's a wise or strong person, but because he has a thick plot armor and represents the writer's simplistic mind set. He does stupid things but gets rewarded for them in an unrealistic way, and has very cheesy dialogue, "how can I call myself a man if I can't save one single girl" <--- said girl appeared out of nowhere and he barely knows anything about her, but hey that's good enough reason to risk his life for her. (I'm talking about the Touma portrayed in the novel and not in the anime adaptations of Index because they look nothing alike because his character got butchered by J.C STAFF) They are both self rightous and will always try to save someone at any cost. Each authors are trying to make their protagonist being the "perfect hero". But unlike Shiro, Touma is standing for justice but he might be selfish and protect someone evil. Which makes his character corrupted. His character had always been descripted by inner dialogues and thoughs. The anime cut it, maybe because it represent too much space in a page for their adaptation. (lol) Major parts of his developpement and what he is are in his inner thoughts, so cut it would inevitably makes him less interesting. It can justify why he seems blank in the anime and with no real personnality. In the Railgun anime on the other hand he is adapted exactly how he is portrayed in the Railgun manga. He seems mysterious because it is on the Misaka's POV. So it is logic to don't know what he's thinking like in the novel, but he can still act like classic Touma, as a hero. If he is hated it is surely because of how he is showed in the Index Anime. Or because he is a male and some people are watching this show just for Misaka & cute girls for some reason. I haven't read the novel and I don't care much about it to be honest. I don't mind a protagonist being a righteous hero, it's the way he's represented that annoys me, both Touma and Shirou are too reckless and overconfident, instead of treating this as a flaw and punishing them for it for character development, they end up winning somehow and their righteousness is proven right despite not making sense, which makes it feel forced, not to mention their motives are too cheesy, it's as if they know they're the protagonists and have plot armor. For the cheesy motivations and moral speeches, it do not work on everyone I can let you that one. And Index is realising since 2004. Touma did get time to have character developpement since then lol. I saw you only watched the first season of the Index anime. It is totally understandable you did not liked him ! Understandable if your opinion of him is based on the anime at all actually, I never truly cared about him before reading tbh. You not liking the term doesn't make it any less viable criticism, plot armor is not bad when the protagonist is fighting someone on his level, but Touma is fighting people who should be far more experienced than he is. Don't talk as if I have to watch the whole thing, I watched 12 episodes actually (not the whole season) and it's long enough, I'm not gonna sit through the rest just hoping that it gets better. |
Feb 22, 2020 3:49 AM
#98
DiabloMask said: Wtf ? I never said you have to watch the whole thing ? I literally said it is understandable you don't like his character because the adaptation is not good.Tsumilk said: DiabloMask said: Tsumilk said: DiabloMask said: Emiya Shiro would be the closer character to be compared to Kamijou Touma but they are still differents.I know this thread is old, but I'm gonna write my own answer anyway: Touma in my opinion is the same as Emiya Shiro (from Fate/ Stay Night) in the way he's too self righteous and always right, not because he's a wise or strong person, but because he has a thick plot armor and represents the writer's simplistic mind set. He does stupid things but gets rewarded for them in an unrealistic way, and has very cheesy dialogue, "how can I call myself a man if I can't save one single girl" <--- said girl appeared out of nowhere and he barely knows anything about her, but hey that's good enough reason to risk his life for her. (I'm talking about the Touma portrayed in the novel and not in the anime adaptations of Index because they look nothing alike because his character got butchered by J.C STAFF) They are both self rightous and will always try to save someone at any cost. Each authors are trying to make their protagonist being the "perfect hero". But unlike Shiro, Touma is standing for justice but he might be selfish and protect someone evil. Which makes his character corrupted. His character had always been descripted by inner dialogues and thoughs. The anime cut it, maybe because it represent too much space in a page for their adaptation. (lol) Major parts of his developpement and what he is are in his inner thoughts, so cut it would inevitably makes him less interesting. It can justify why he seems blank in the anime and with no real personnality. In the Railgun anime on the other hand he is adapted exactly how he is portrayed in the Railgun manga. He seems mysterious because it is on the Misaka's POV. So it is logic to don't know what he's thinking like in the novel, but he can still act like classic Touma, as a hero. If he is hated it is surely because of how he is showed in the Index Anime. Or because he is a male and some people are watching this show just for Misaka & cute girls for some reason. I haven't read the novel and I don't care much about it to be honest. I don't mind a protagonist being a righteous hero, it's the way he's represented that annoys me, both Touma and Shirou are too reckless and overconfident, instead of treating this as a flaw and punishing them for it for character development, they end up winning somehow and their righteousness is proven right despite not making sense, which makes it feel forced, not to mention their motives are too cheesy, it's as if they know they're the protagonists and have plot armor. For the cheesy motivations and moral speeches, it do not work on everyone I can let you that one. And Index is realising since 2004. Touma did get time to have character developpement since then lol. I saw you only watched the first season of the Index anime. It is totally understandable you did not liked him ! Understandable if your opinion of him is based on the anime at all actually, I never truly cared about him before reading tbh. You not liking the term doesn't make it any less viable criticism, plot armor is not bad when the protagonist is fighting someone on his level, but Touma is fighting people who should be far more experienced than he is. Don't talk as if I have to watch the whole thing, I watched 12 episodes actually (not the whole season) and it's long enough, I'm not gonna sit through the rest just hoping that it gets better. |
Feb 22, 2020 7:17 AM
#99
Tsumilk said: DiabloMask said: Wtf ? I never said you have to watch the whole thing ? I literally said it is understandable you don't like his character because the adaptation is not good.Tsumilk said: DiabloMask said: I don't like the term "plot armor" pretty much every protagonist of fiction got one. And I never truly understood why Touma was the one targeted by this word. He is the one who lost the most in Index, like most than a third of his opponents defeated him.Tsumilk said: DiabloMask said: Emiya Shiro would be the closer character to be compared to Kamijou Touma but they are still differents.I know this thread is old, but I'm gonna write my own answer anyway: Touma in my opinion is the same as Emiya Shiro (from Fate/ Stay Night) in the way he's too self righteous and always right, not because he's a wise or strong person, but because he has a thick plot armor and represents the writer's simplistic mind set. He does stupid things but gets rewarded for them in an unrealistic way, and has very cheesy dialogue, "how can I call myself a man if I can't save one single girl" <--- said girl appeared out of nowhere and he barely knows anything about her, but hey that's good enough reason to risk his life for her. (I'm talking about the Touma portrayed in the novel and not in the anime adaptations of Index because they look nothing alike because his character got butchered by J.C STAFF) They are both self rightous and will always try to save someone at any cost. Each authors are trying to make their protagonist being the "perfect hero". But unlike Shiro, Touma is standing for justice but he might be selfish and protect someone evil. Which makes his character corrupted. His character had always been descripted by inner dialogues and thoughs. The anime cut it, maybe because it represent too much space in a page for their adaptation. (lol) Major parts of his developpement and what he is are in his inner thoughts, so cut it would inevitably makes him less interesting. It can justify why he seems blank in the anime and with no real personnality. In the Railgun anime on the other hand he is adapted exactly how he is portrayed in the Railgun manga. He seems mysterious because it is on the Misaka's POV. So it is logic to don't know what he's thinking like in the novel, but he can still act like classic Touma, as a hero. If he is hated it is surely because of how he is showed in the Index Anime. Or because he is a male and some people are watching this show just for Misaka & cute girls for some reason. I haven't read the novel and I don't care much about it to be honest. I don't mind a protagonist being a righteous hero, it's the way he's represented that annoys me, both Touma and Shirou are too reckless and overconfident, instead of treating this as a flaw and punishing them for it for character development, they end up winning somehow and their righteousness is proven right despite not making sense, which makes it feel forced, not to mention their motives are too cheesy, it's as if they know they're the protagonists and have plot armor. For the cheesy motivations and moral speeches, it do not work on everyone I can let you that one. And Index is realising since 2004. Touma did get time to have character developpement since then lol. I saw you only watched the first season of the Index anime. It is totally understandable you did not liked him ! Understandable if your opinion of him is based on the anime at all actually, I never truly cared about him before reading tbh. You not liking the term doesn't make it any less viable criticism, plot armor is not bad when the protagonist is fighting someone on his level, but Touma is fighting people who should be far more experienced than he is. Don't talk as if I have to watch the whole thing, I watched 12 episodes actually (not the whole season) and it's long enough, I'm not gonna sit through the rest just hoping that it gets better. Oh, my bad, I rushed my reply. |
Feb 27, 2020 4:58 AM
#100
Tsumilk said: DiabloMask said: Wtf ? I never said you have to watch the whole thing ? I literally said it is understandable you don't like his character because the adaptation is not good.Tsumilk said: DiabloMask said: I don't like the term "plot armor" pretty much every protagonist of fiction got one. And I never truly understood why Touma was the one targeted by this word. He is the one who lost the most in Index, like most than a third of his opponents defeated him.Tsumilk said: DiabloMask said: Emiya Shiro would be the closer character to be compared to Kamijou Touma but they are still differents.I know this thread is old, but I'm gonna write my own answer anyway: Touma in my opinion is the same as Emiya Shiro (from Fate/ Stay Night) in the way he's too self righteous and always right, not because he's a wise or strong person, but because he has a thick plot armor and represents the writer's simplistic mind set. He does stupid things but gets rewarded for them in an unrealistic way, and has very cheesy dialogue, "how can I call myself a man if I can't save one single girl" <--- said girl appeared out of nowhere and he barely knows anything about her, but hey that's good enough reason to risk his life for her. (I'm talking about the Touma portrayed in the novel and not in the anime adaptations of Index because they look nothing alike because his character got butchered by J.C STAFF) They are both self rightous and will always try to save someone at any cost. Each authors are trying to make their protagonist being the "perfect hero". But unlike Shiro, Touma is standing for justice but he might be selfish and protect someone evil. Which makes his character corrupted. His character had always been descripted by inner dialogues and thoughs. The anime cut it, maybe because it represent too much space in a page for their adaptation. (lol) Major parts of his developpement and what he is are in his inner thoughts, so cut it would inevitably makes him less interesting. It can justify why he seems blank in the anime and with no real personnality. In the Railgun anime on the other hand he is adapted exactly how he is portrayed in the Railgun manga. He seems mysterious because it is on the Misaka's POV. So it is logic to don't know what he's thinking like in the novel, but he can still act like classic Touma, as a hero. If he is hated it is surely because of how he is showed in the Index Anime. Or because he is a male and some people are watching this show just for Misaka & cute girls for some reason. I haven't read the novel and I don't care much about it to be honest. I don't mind a protagonist being a righteous hero, it's the way he's represented that annoys me, both Touma and Shirou are too reckless and overconfident, instead of treating this as a flaw and punishing them for it for character development, they end up winning somehow and their righteousness is proven right despite not making sense, which makes it feel forced, not to mention their motives are too cheesy, it's as if they know they're the protagonists and have plot armor. For the cheesy motivations and moral speeches, it do not work on everyone I can let you that one. And Index is realising since 2004. Touma did get time to have character developpement since then lol. I saw you only watched the first season of the Index anime. It is totally understandable you did not liked him ! Understandable if your opinion of him is based on the anime at all actually, I never truly cared about him before reading tbh. You not liking the term doesn't make it any less viable criticism, plot armor is not bad when the protagonist is fighting someone on his level, but Touma is fighting people who should be far more experienced than he is. Don't talk as if I have to watch the whole thing, I watched 12 episodes actually (not the whole season) and it's long enough, I'm not gonna sit through the rest just hoping that it gets better. DiabloMask said: so what the way you wrote you don't care about Novels than what can i say cause you'll never understand,and even if I'll point things out you'll say another thing than another instead of understandingKamijouTouma007 said: Stupid idiots doesn't understand how DiabloMask said: I know this thread is old, but I'm gonna write my own answer anyway: Touma in my opinion is the same as Emiya Shiro (from Fate/ Stay Night) in the way he's too self righteous and always right, not because he's a wise or strong person, but because he has a thick plot armor and represents the writer's simplistic mind set. He does stupid things but gets rewarded for them in an unrealistic way, and has very cheesy dialogue, "how can I call myself a man if I can't save one single girl" <--- said girl appeared out of nowhere and he barely knows anything about her, but hey that's good enough reason to risk his life for her. Attacking me instead of addressing the points I made, typical fanboy behavior. |
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