| If someone asked me why I almost exclusively use Japanese names and exclusively watch subs, I would answer that I think they're objective superior. This justification, however, would be classified as subjective since it starts with "I think", and an objective one would be preferable. I could try to argue about the link between subs, Japanese names and otaku culture, but I would prefer a stronger argument. In the end, the arguments feel a bit circular: Like a noble who wear fancy clothes so people around him are aware of his position, some of my behaviors serve a purpose of finding other fans that are like me while dodging types of fans I don't think I would like (e.g. someone saying "animeS" would be a huge red flag for me...) But other than that, are there really any more "objective" arguments in favor of anime elitism? |
| You will never be elitist. I am the true elite. You are just a mere peasent... |
 |
| Yes, just say "I am what I like to be." |
*kappa* |
thewiru said: If someone asked me why I almost exclusively use Japanese names and exclusively watch subs, I would answer that I think they're objective superior. But they’re not superior. Even people in Japan don’t use the full fucking official titles for franchises. No one in Japan refers to "Is It Wrong to Try to Pick Up Girls in a Dungeon?" as "Dungeon ni Deai wo Motomeru no wa Machigatteiru Darou ka", they just say "DanMachi". Same shit goes with "Shingeki no Kyojin" it's rare to hear it be refered to as anything but "SnK". "Re:Zero kara Hajimeru Isekai Seikatsu"? People in Japan just call it fucking "Re:Zero". "Mahou Shoujo Madoka★Magica"? Just "Madoka", or maybe "Madoka Magica" at most. So trying to ride some high horse about being 'superior' for using full Japanese titles or exclusively watching subs just reeks of someone with a superiority complex and nothing else. And honestly, it’s laughable. Saying 'I exclusively watch subs' as if that makes you more authentic? Subtitles are still a form of localization. It’s no more 'pure' than someone watching an Anime dub. You're not better, you're just making a different choice. lol And what makes it worse is that almost all people who say this kind of thing aren’t even fluent in the language. They just want to feel superior, when in reality they’re leagues below the those who don’t even need subtitles because they actually understand the language fluently. There are no truly objective arguments for anime elitism. It’s just personal preference wearing a cultural Halloween costume. Subtitles are still translations. Using full Japanese names doesn’t tap into some mythical 'otaku soulstream'. If you can’t even understand what you’re hearing, parroting untranslated titles just makes you look like a clown. lol At best, it's social signaling, picking and choosing behaviors that say 'I belong to this group' or 'I'm not like those fans'. But that’s not objective superiority. That’s identity crafting. And that’s fine, people use subcultures to find belonging, but let’s not pretend it’s about some universal truth. Because the real Fans? They’re not arguing about this shit in the 1st place. They’re just out there watching Anime in either RAW, with subtitles, or even dubbed, with no elitist posturing needed or required. lol |
ColourWheelAug 3, 2:52 AM
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| there is a difference between objective arguments and the subjective conclusion they lead too. for example, using Japanese audio with subtitles has a lot of objective benefits, but so does a non-Japanese dub. but the conclusion on which one is "superior" isn't just a simple summation of pro's and con's, it's a matter of personal preference and therefore highly subjective. if you want to convince someone that subs are better than dubs - because that is your own personal conviction - you can present them with the facts, the benefits of subs, the downsides of dubs, but utlimately, it is up to them to form their own opinion. some of my behaviors serve a purpose of finding other fans that are like me while dodging types of fans I don't think I would like [...] But other than that, are there really any more "objective" arguments in favor of anime elitism? I mean, your only argument is essentially "I don't want to deal with people who disagree with me." which can be valid, but the obvious conclusion from that argument would be that you shouldn't interact with anyone because they might have opinions you don't like. the actually correct conclusion would be to learn that it's okay to disagree on insignificant subjects such as Sub vs Dub or whether someone prefers Japanese or English titles. what would be the point of a "discussion" if you surround yourself with people who have exactly the same opinion, tastes and preferences as you? |
Reply to ColourWheel
thewiru said:
If someone asked me why I almost exclusively use Japanese names and exclusively watch subs, I would answer that I think they're objective superior.
If someone asked me why I almost exclusively use Japanese names and exclusively watch subs, I would answer that I think they're objective superior.
But they’re not superior. Even people in Japan don’t use the full fucking official titles for franchises. No one in Japan refers to "Is It Wrong to Try to Pick Up Girls in a Dungeon?" as "Dungeon ni Deai wo Motomeru no wa Machigatteiru Darou ka", they just say "DanMachi". Same shit goes with "Shingeki no Kyojin" it's rare to hear it be refered to as anything but "SnK". "Re:Zero kara Hajimeru Isekai Seikatsu"? People in Japan just call it fucking "Re:Zero". "Mahou Shoujo Madoka★Magica"? Just "Madoka", or maybe "Madoka Magica" at most.
So trying to ride some high horse about being 'superior' for using full Japanese titles or exclusively watching subs just reeks of someone with a superiority complex and nothing else.
And honestly, it’s laughable. Saying 'I exclusively watch subs' as if that makes you more authentic? Subtitles are still a form of localization. It’s no more 'pure' than someone watching an Anime dub. You're not better, you're just making a different choice. lol
And what makes it worse is that almost all people who say this kind of thing aren’t even fluent in the language. They just want to feel superior, when in reality they’re leagues below the those who don’t even need subtitles because they actually understand the language fluently.
There are no truly objective arguments for anime elitism. It’s just personal preference wearing a cultural Halloween costume. Subtitles are still translations. Using full Japanese names doesn’t tap into some mythical 'otaku soulstream'. If you can’t even understand what you’re hearing, parroting untranslated titles just makes you look like a clown. lol
At best, it's social signaling, picking and choosing behaviors that say 'I belong to this group' or 'I'm not like those fans'.
But that’s not objective superiority. That’s identity crafting. And that’s fine, people use subcultures to find belonging, but let’s not pretend it’s about some universal truth.
Because the real Fans? They’re not arguing about this shit in the 1st place. They’re just out there watching Anime in either RAW, with subtitles, or even dubbed, with no elitist posturing needed or required. lol
ColourWheel said: So trying to ride some high horse about being 'superior' for using full Japanese titles or exclusively watching subs just reeks of someone with a superiority complex and nothing else. ...but I do use the shortened Japanese version. ColourWheel said: It’s no more 'pure' than someone watching an Anime dub. You're not better, you're just making a different choice. lol OK, now that's just cope. |
| I watch English dubs most of the time. I usually avoid the English subs, whenever possible. |
| Here is my Pixiv account of my hentai drawings..... https://www.pixiv.net/en/users/104739065 Here is my blog.... https://theendofindustrialcivilization.blogspot.com/?m=1 |
| I don't really see justification for elitism since often times it's just people trying to impose or enforce their opinions of good and bad anime onto others. |
| True elitists watch average action shounen filled with nakama power. |
| Imagine how boring this world would be without Japan - a comment at youtube |
thewiru said: ...but I do use the shortened Japanese version. Well good for you. that still doesn't make you superior to someone else who doesn't. thewiru said: OK, now that's just cope. The same could be said about your own shitty take, it's just cope over something inherently subjective. You're nitpicking the 'validity' of a form of localization, which makes no real sense. lol Personally, I put anyone who relies on either subs or dubs in the same boat. At the end of the day, they are still consuming a localized version of the content. lol The difference is, I understand the language, but I don't think that somehow makes me fucking superior to others who consume it differently. If I did, then by that logic, anyone watching ripped copies of Anime uploaded online or relying on piracy would just make them bottom-feeding casuals. Worse yet, bottom-feeders watching localized content. lol You see how toxic that kind of thinking can get? Acting superior over something like this is just fucking silly, especially if you fall into the very category you're trying to look down on. lol |
ColourWheelAug 3, 12:38 PM
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| I don't justify, I just am. Never conform. |
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
Dubs rarely have translators notes. And these used to be an art on their own. Translators being able to say "Hey I don't know what to choose" feels better than when they go filling randomly.  I don't think you filter by elitism, more like "they are the same as me", so you are being tribal (you had a thread about that). People with different backgrounds and takes may contribute with different ideas that you never thought. But if they are busy repeating the same 3 things, they are not fun either. lol at ColourWheel showing that there is always someone that can act above. |
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| Bro has a problem with people saying "animes" but says phrases like "objective superior" bruh... |
| If you reply back to me and I never respond, I lost interest and don't care. Sorry about that. |
| anime elitists are just the people that does not watch the anime yet they are acting as if they know everything what anime has to offer and dictating people what people should and should not watch because they think their taste is better than everyone else. Just seeing people enjoying anime is more than enough since anime is just a medium that has dozens upon dozens of genres and themes which within these two are plethora of works to choose and enjoy. |
| Greatest shitposter under the heavens. |
| There's a way to justify anything if you twist logic enough with mental gymnastics. There's a difference between trying to justify something and being objectively right though, and there is no objectively right way to enjoy something because enjoyment itself is subjective. So short answer to that last question is "no". "Elitism" is just code for "I didn't get enough attention and I need a way to feel special" |
FanofActionAug 3, 12:24 PM
| "If someone asked me why I almost exclusively use Japanese names and exclusively watch subs, I would answer that I think they're objective superior." Is that elitism tho? More of a preference. Tho if you think that people not using the english names or preferring dubs are stupid, now that's elitism. I really hate how people play with terms like "elitism" or "gate keeping" just to force their own preferences as the norm. Like some simple rules are needed just for everybody to be on the same page, but nothing about how you personally should enjoy anime. "some of my behaviors serve a purpose of finding other fans that are like me" Naaah, OP is too sincere about what he likes for this tactic to work on a more formal level. ""objective" arguments in favor of anime elitism?" Looking at people from above is always a bad idea. Moral issues and superiority delusions aside, they always can know stuff you are unaware of just have a fresher unbiased take. Even if you objectively know more stuff, this only makes you [temporary] a bit more knowledgeable, not superior. |
alshuAug 4, 12:00 AM
| There are no objectively good reasons for anime elitism. You're watching programmes from a culture you don't fully understand, in a language that you don't fully understand, and you want to look down on others? It's entertainment. From the way you speak, it seems a lot of the people you look down upon have a much better understanding of that than you do. Half of the time, you don't even sound as if you're enjoying watching anime at all. 😂 Because the real Fans? They’re not arguing about this shit in the 1st place. They’re just out there watching Anime in either RAW, with subtitles, or even dubbed, with no elitist posturing needed or required. lol @ColourWheel - Perfectly answered btw. The insecurity is painfully evident. |
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