Which season did you like better?

WestOnAndrewAve said:
Season 2 took a hit for me largely because Emilia seemed to take a character nerf for the sake of character development as a main focus for the season which I didn't particularly like. Also the arc was extremely long compared to previous ones which made it seem a lot slower than it might have if the others were also longer.

INSANELYWP said:

oh no character development how atrocious!

GurschachX said:

The fact that character development exists does not make something beyond critique. Personally, I preferred to see Subaru's character development throughout season 1 because we got to see how his actions and following consequences shaped him as a person. It wasn't 25 episodes worth of lectures about Subaru describing the traumatic situations we literally just watched him experience. According to people's tastes, there is a preferred way to do virtually anything, even something as overly-romanticized as ✨ Character Development ✨

INSANELYWP said:

whole lotta words man

anyway I find it weird that you call character development “overly-romanticized” as if it’s not a literary device used since the dawn of storytelling and is essential for any good story.

what the guy was originally saying about emilia taking a “character nerf” for the sake of “character development” is ridiculous. a stagnant character is a bad character any way you look at it.

GurschachX said:

All I'm hearing from you is that character development cannot be overly-romanticized because all forms and executions of character development is good. Which is literally you romanticizing character development right now. If you really believe there can be no such thing as a bad form of character development, I dare you to read all the way through to the end of Usagi Drop and see if you still hold onto that belief.

It's just my personal opinion that the character development in Re:Zero season 2 was bloated, poorly directed, and way too verbose, which is what I would agree with in WestOnAndrewAve's case. If you disagree with my opinion that's fine, but there's no good argument in saying that the mere existence of character development makes something good.

Also I wouldn't think someone vying for literary devices would come at me for using a "whole lotta words", isn't that kinda hypocritical?

INSANELYWP said:

Character development regardless of whether it is ‘good’ or ‘bad’ brings depth to a character no matter what. Depth brings characters to life. THAT is better than remaining stagnant.

I recognize that this is extremely subjective though and i’ll concede that character development doesn’t always make a show better. Character development only gives depth to characters, which may or may not make the story better.

But saying that specific characters are better without development (regardless of the implications on the story) is simply wrong. Purposely making a character less interesting by means of no development is a set up for failure.

you can explore this further by the means of how stories are literally made: conflict. without conflict a conventional story can not exist. how that conflict then impacts the characters is a form of development and is what is shown in rezero season 2 through Emilia (and others). If the conflict didn’t affect the characters, you can see how that’s a problem…

once again the actual effectiveness can be debated, but nonetheless the fact that said development (and any development for that matter) gives layers to characters IS a good thing. Even in usagi drop, the development is atrocious yes, but from a literacy standpoint it succeeds in telling a story. and THAT is the goal for any story.

anyway I was kind of joking around hence the “whole lotta words” and gave a half thought out response. But your reply was actually very interesting to me so I want to hear what you think.

Faxtual_Ghoul said:
None of the above

Re:ZERO has always been a bogging abomination of gallimaufry embellished with an ostentatious travesty of deconstruction

GurschachX said:

What I think is what works in light novel format doesn't necessarily work in anime format. I'm a strong believer that the literary arts is where a story is told and the visual arts is where a story is shown. There are ways to use dialogue as a means of showing people what a character is like (i.e. Quentin Tarantino), but there is also a very very common pitfall for directors in which they merely throw the text of the source material onto the screen and call it a movie (i.e. the Wachowskis).

This to me is the issue with Re:Zero season 2. Way too often, it uses dialogue and overly descriptive storytelling as a crutch to get its points across while sacrificing a lot of opportunity to simply show us what is being conveyed. Season 1 could've been reduced to long drawn out scenes of Subaru contemplating his mental torment as he is forced to relive the brutal destruction of his world and everyone he cares about over and over again, and we could've spent entire episodes locked in a room with him as he rambles on and on about his problems. But instead, season 1 didn't feel the need to do that because we got to see with our own eyes exactly what kind of tortures Subaru had to endure, and those scenes pretty much spoke entirely for themselves; no need for extra added dialogue for description's sake.

If I was directing season 2, my goal wouldn't be to remove all of the character development from the story like you think I would (and I'm not sure that's what WestOnAndrewAve was trying to say either, though I could be wrong). My goal would be to simply condense it. Like... a lot.

There is plenty there to show us what the characters are thinking and feeling at any given time, so there is no need to have them tell you exactly what it is you're looking at. To me, that is unnecessary time stretching which could make a 12 episode show run for 25, 50, even hundreds of episodes if you really have no self-control as a writer. If we got season 2 adapted in a matter of 16 episodes at most, I think a lot of people who complained about the season would probably have forgiven it a lot easier, since it wouldn't have felt like we spent so much damn time in the middle of the forest repeating the same conversation over and over again.

Also, I don't think you're one of these types of people, but I get very frustrated whenever I hear the excuse that character development enriches anything it touches. This has long been a cope for people trying to justify Toei Animations godawful horrendous pacing issues and anime with mountains of filler episodes that are centered around "character development". Why should I care how a character is developed in a completely non-canon episode? How many times do I need to see Goku remember what the bad guy did to his friends until it is fully understood that the bad guy is bad?

GurschachX said:
Season 2 DRAAAAAGGED so much it wasn't even funny. There was like 3 love confessions, 5 traumatic pasts to overcome, 20 flashback backstories to analyze, and by the end of it the entire linear story had only explored one new location. Had there been less talking and more showing, it could've maybe been executed well in 13 episodes, but the insane amount of Wachowskis-esque dialogue made me think I was spending more time reading season 2 than watching it.

Season 1 for me.

Okeanix said:
This is because you are not a Re:Zero fan, Season 2 didn't dragged anything it's the opposite it cuts too much when it should be at least 5-10 episodes longer.

You are saying Season 1 but you rated Season 1 7/10 instead 10/10. If you would have rated Season 1 10/10 then you may have point but you didn't, since you are not Re:Zero fan and only here for torture porn, some action.

I have theory, only people who like Season 1 more is not really a Re:Zero fan but casual watcher who don't care characters, world, lore or any stuff and only here for some action, torture drama and stuff.

Season 1 is a masterpiece because Season 2 explains how it's flawless and has genius written plot, depth, lore which more explained in Season 2. Without Season 2 explanations, Season 1 as standalone has many holes. But in the reality Re:Zero has no holes when you count all of the story. 

GurschachX said:

Sounds to me like you're trying to gatekeep Re:Zero from "casual watchers" like there's something wrong with watching it casually. If anything, you accentuated why season 1 has a lot more going for it than season 2. Of course anyone who's a huge fan of Re:Zero will happily watch as much content on it as they possibly can, OVAs, movies, and break time shorts included. But if season 1 can be enjoyed by both casuals and diehards alike, doesn't that mean it's kinda... y'know... better?

Okeanix said:
Just because Season 1 has more appeal to casuals & normies doesn't mean it is better. Re:Zero was always anti-normie series even Season 1 was hated by many people back in that day.

If Re:Zero was shounen like Demon Slayer, Jujutsu Kaisen you may had point but I'm not gatekeeping Re:Zero from casual watchers, Re:Zero itself is designed to gatekeep from casuals. It is seinen dark fantasy series with rich lore, characterization, depth, details and stuff. It was never meant to be for casuals, it is for hardcore fans who analyze every scene, dialogue even voice acting details.

Okeanix said:
@GurschachX
It is not subjective, Attack on Titan is inferior to Re:Zero in every aspect except animation, pretty much in every category from writing to characters to lore to details Re:Zero stomps Attack on Titan any day, any hour. Attack on Titan is shounen jump manga, Re:Zero is seinen dark fantasy novel with 30+ Volumes.

Re:Zero is popular because it has high quality production, high entertainment values and new breath to any anime between 2012-2016, closest thing you can find to Re:Zero that years was Steins;Gate which not really similar but also released 5 years ago then Higurashi When They Cry which released 10 years ago.

Rem indeed boosted popularity of Re:Zero a lot but that doesn't make Re:Zero normie anime or something, Re:Zero is the most complex and rich detail anime you can watch currently, i don't think any other series even has half depth of Re:Zero.

Bard_Eren said:
The first season. The buildup and many of the events transpired were both more emotional and breathtaking, (ahem, ahem ep 15 was something entirely else...)
That doesn't mean season 2 was bad in any way, I simply enjoyed the first season's more dramatic approach.

ShadowUnown said:

Episode 15 was easily one of the worst though.

ShadowUnown said:

Episode 15 was easily one of the worst though.

offjv said:

You are not obliged to like the show, but leave this forum for those who like it, use your time with the show you like, not wasting time being boring about what you didn't like

ShadowUnown said:

"Não quero ouvir opiniões que não batem com as minhas, deixe o fórum só pra opiniões que são como as minhas."

The only thing I remember about ReZero Ep15 is that I was laughing and cringing the whole time at how inconsistent and forced everything was.