Chisato is a terrible character.

Sigmar-Unberogen said:
@Secret333

1. You clearly didn't understand Chisato's personality. You also forget the fact Lycoris are trained killers, not some sissy, whiny snowflakes who get depressed and break down after one of their own dies. Lycoris are expendable, same goes to Chisato and Takina. Caring for what can't be changed is against Chisato's personality and destroys the purpose of Lycoris. These girls aren't normal humans and they "don't exist" - this is what flew over your head apparently. Don't expect them to get emotional and show empathy towards those who they may have never even known in person - do you think they'd train Lycoris to be emotional??? I doubt the dead Lycoris even get burials or their names are hung on walls as a sign of gratitude for the sacrifice. The dead are meant to be forgotten.
2. Once again you expect Chisato to be some "avenger" and "defender of morals and innocents" or whatever BS. Just because she's cheerful and doesn't kill anyone? Bruh... Lycoris are killers who obey orders. Chisato was raised as one. They aren't trained to get "triggered" by villains killing the innocent. They're supposed to stay heartless and cold and concentrate on killing targets and fulfilling mission.
You also make it sound way too easy for Chisato to arrest or stop Majima, a grown-ass adult. He deal with Takina easily and in episode 13 he overwhelmed her more than once. Once again, Chisato isn't some justice warrior who'd chase after villains. Where did you get the idea?!
3. Your bias is showing. What do you mean "innocent civilians"? These were some assholes driving dangerously.
Doesn't justify Chisato's response (even though she was very upset at the moment), but it's ridiculous how you'd write an article defending those road-raging morons...
4. Go watch marvel superheroes or something bro. You've deluded yourself about Chisato. She isn't obliged to hunt down every villain she encounters. Not to mention, catching Majima wasn't as easy as you make it sound. Takina couldn't do it either. Girls can't beat a grown-ass male when it comes to agility.
5. Ridiculous take on those two supporting characters, as well as your claim that Chisato "forced" them out of COUNTRY.
"No speech about how much she means to them or any kind of friendship speech" - Bruh... go watch sobby drama shows then. This would've changed NOTHING, what are you whining about?
6. Pointless rant. It was obvious from episode 1 this wasn't going to be most logical and realistic shows. Dodging full-auto at point-blank range. Surviving RPG to a car you stand 2 feet away from. The list can go on forever.
7. Was Chisato just staring with open mouth and not doing anything? Don't think so, you just imagined it.
8. Her convenient tie-gun didn't materialize out of thin air, so sorry. P.S more of the "Chisato didn't do justice-warrior/hero thing" ranting.
9. In other words, betraying own convictions is how a character "grows" by your standards...
10. This is ridiculous. Lycoris aren't sheltered snowflake girls playing with Barbie's. They weren't out shopping either. They're on a battlefield. In combat, you can't worry about wellbeing of every comrade around you, you kind of hope they can stand own ground - you also accept they and you can die at any moment. Constant worrying and crying won't help - this isn't how killers are trained! Your BS take is baffling. Chisao can't freeze or slow down time. Chisato going for the bag and Majima shooting happened at the same time. Chisato didn't spawn a gun in her hand out of thin air and had no time to shoot Majima - as simple as that. For you to consider she just lazed off and watched them getting shot even though she could do something is insultingly dumb.
What did you want to see? How do you think movies are made? Majima's silouette appears suddenly and Chisato headshots him in 0.01 seconds and the show ends?
Chisato and Majima are pretty much superhuman. You must've been watching a different show to even consider the two can be killed easily and quickly. You didn't like "YO", would you prefer she cursed at him or started crying and/or yelling? The two are pretty equal and show respect to each other even though they're enemies - it's that simple.

You wrote all this just for you to not really make any valid points and show your bias towards the show. Pretty ironic if you ask me.

StaleNut said:
If you think anyone's reading that, well you might wanna reconsider. This is a MAL forum, people don't care about your opinion, especially when it's so long and convoluted.

Secret333 said:
I know fully well how many people love this character, so I am fully prepared to qualify that statement.
Full spoilers and a longish read ahead. You can skip to the last paragraph for a tldr.

If we first try to describe Chisato, she's an upbeat lycoris who used to work for the DA, now trying to find the person who gave her a second chance in life by replacing her weak heart with a mechanical one. She's the best lycoris ever, owing to her supernatural ability to dodge bullets that she had from birth, but she never wants to take away people's lives, so she uses non-lethal bullets, and goes out of her way to make sure the people she fights do not die, not even by friendly fire from their comrades.

Ignoring the mechanics of how anything I said above works, here are what I consider to be the moments that weaken or destroy her character:

1. Episode 6 starts with Takina telling Chisato that 4 lycorises lost their lives. Chisato's response to this is very careless, and it's clear she doesn't even give a shit. A moment later she's all smiles because "Takina is gonna live with me, yay!". A normal person would've had a more serious reaction to that, but Chisato should've had an even bigger reaction because of much she values people's lives, and she grew in the same environment that the dead lycorises grew up in. She recieved the same brutal training in her childhood, so the tragedy of their wasted lives should've hit her harder but no, no signs of fucks given here.
2. In episode 8 she talks with the terrorist that killed those 4 lycorises, tried to kill her two episodes ago, and massacred an entire police department who were all innocent people. We know he can't hit her with the gun, he even puts it down. Does she try to stop him? arrest him? anything? nope. he can just go away and enact his plan that leads to even more people dying. Great job Chisato!
3. In episode 9 she just straight up shoots at innocent civilians at a highway, making them lose control of their car. She's just very lucky that that didn't cause an accident that lead to them + anyone else on the road dying. Fucking Mizuki's reaction to this is also of someone who doesn't give a fuck about people's lives. "But she was dealing with a lot and she was sad at that time, that scene is there to show us that she's not herself" is a defense that someone might try. The problem is this betrays her character, her morals, and just normal common sense. I can't believe this needs to be said but you can't just shoot at people just because you're sad. And does she look back at this regretfully? nope. Zero introspection and zero acknowledgement that she endangered innocent lives. This scene reminds me of that deleted scene from Captain Marvel, if anyone knows that one.
4. Again in episode 9, when Kusonoki questions her on letting Majima go, her response is "it's not my job". Forget about what's ethical, forget about what any normal decent human being would've done if they knew someone is a terrorist and they have the ability to stop them. She gives the stupidest excuse I've ever seen and dumbass Kusonoki doesn't say anything to that.
5. In episode 10, when she finds out Mizuki and Kurumi are looking for a way to save her, she decides to close down the cafe because "I can't have you guys wasting time worrying about me". This is just selfishness. It would weigh too much on her conciouseness to have them there trying to help her, so she's just gonna force them to leave their lives in Japan and move countires on her whim. And the two dumbfucks don't even argue back against that. No speech about how much she means to them or any kind of friendship speech that actually would've been appropriate for that moment because those two are nothing but glorified plot devices.
6. This point is less of a character thing, I just wanted to point this out because it's funny. At the end of episode 11, when Majima is shooting at her and Takina, she uses her bullet proof bag to block the bullets. She did that a lot and blocked a lot of bullets, but 1 bullet just knocks the bag out of her hand and so far away it falls down out of reach. The bullet didn't even hit her hand. This is funny because had she not lost that bag there, she could've just blocked Yoshi's bullets in episode 12 when he was shooting Takina, effectively bailing her out of making the choice. I guess the writers realized this and decided that the best solution is: "uuhh she just loosens her grip on the bag and loses it. Genius!". This is just lazy writing at its finest.
7. Chisato let Takina die in episode 12. That's the truth. When that lady who works for Yoshi was charging at Takina to kill her, Chisato didn't try to stop her, which lead to Takina falling off the building. Chisato is just very very lucky Takina fell on a beam and was able to hold on to dear life when the expected scenario would be that she falls to her death.
8. Chisato let's Yoshi go free. He's the guy who funded the terrorists and lead to so many innocents dying, and tried to kill her friend, but no. He gets to go because she can't kill him. So she just can't tie him up with her convenient gun that ties people up? She can't go after him after she calmed Takina down? Nah because we let terrorist funders go free in this show.
9. The choice is bullshit. She fired a real bullet for once. Did she actually have to kill someone? No. We can't let the show be too dark so we're gonna bait the choice while having the show bail her out so now she can't learn or grow or develope in any meaningful way.
10. Majima fucking emptied a mag on her friends when they were standing in the elevator. They could all be dead if it wasn't for Fuki's quick thinking. How does she respond to that happening? She doesn't. She lets it happen and then confronts him with "Yo.". I have to assume this is planned and they're gonna do something together next episode but fucking hell, lucky none of your friends were hurt in this stunt, huh Chisato?

And all of this doesn't include her constantly shifting power levels, the uncharacteristic stupid decisions she makes, how she never wonders if people could've been saved if she killed Majima in the tower incident (The most obvious question she should be asking herself). But this thread is long enough already.

I made this thread because while I always criticized other aspects of the writing, I don't think I went too deep into characters because there was always the chance they'd develope in a good way. I don't see that happening with episode 13 but I would happily eat my words if it proved me wrong. Characters is usually the thing people point to for this show but the characters are as terrible as the rest of the show. This is a 2/10 show on a good day.

If you asked the writers to describe Chisato, I don't think any of the above would come up. It really feels like the writers ignore innocent lives and have no awareness of the implications of the decisions the characters make or do not make. But the unfortunate reality is this:

Tldr; Chisato is an extremely selfish, immoral character that can be as compitent or as incompitent as the writing needs. She doesn't want to kill people with her own hands, but gives no fucks about people dying if she's not holding the gun. She forces others to follow her whims and desires and they rarely question her. She has no compelling developement or struggle. Chisato is not a waifu bait because a jpeg of a random female character would be a better waifu than this horrendous disaster of a character.

Sigmar-Unberogen said:
@Secret333

1. You clearly didn't understand Chisato's personality. You also forget the fact Lycoris are trained killers, not some sissy, whiny snowflakes who get depressed and break down after one of their own dies. Lycoris are expendable, same goes to Chisato and Takina. Caring for what can't be changed is against Chisato's personality and destroys the purpose of Lycoris. These girls aren't normal humans and they "don't exist" - this is what flew over your head apparently. Don't expect them to get emotional and show empathy towards those who they may have never even known in person - do you think they'd train Lycoris to be emotional??? I doubt the dead Lycoris even get burials or their names are hung on walls as a sign of gratitude for the sacrifice. The dead are meant to be forgotten.
2. Once again you expect Chisato to be some "avenger" and "defender of morals and innocents" or whatever BS. Just because she's cheerful and doesn't kill anyone? Bruh... Lycoris are killers who obey orders. Chisato was raised as one. They aren't trained to get "triggered" by villains killing the innocent. They're supposed to stay heartless and cold and concentrate on killing targets and fulfilling mission.
You also make it sound way too easy for Chisato to arrest or stop Majima, a grown-ass adult. He deal with Takina easily and in episode 13 he overwhelmed her more than once. Once again, Chisato isn't some justice warrior who'd chase after villains. Where did you get the idea?!
3. Your bias is showing. What do you mean "innocent civilians"? These were some assholes driving dangerously.
Doesn't justify Chisato's response (even though she was very upset at the moment), but it's ridiculous how you'd write an article defending those road-raging morons...
4. Go watch marvel superheroes or something bro. You've deluded yourself about Chisato. She isn't obliged to hunt down every villain she encounters. Not to mention, catching Majima wasn't as easy as you make it sound. Takina couldn't do it either. Girls can't beat a grown-ass male when it comes to agility.
5. Ridiculous take on those two supporting characters, as well as your claim that Chisato "forced" them out of COUNTRY.
"No speech about how much she means to them or any kind of friendship speech" - Bruh... go watch sobby drama shows then. This would've changed NOTHING, what are you whining about?
6. Pointless rant. It was obvious from episode 1 this wasn't going to be most logical and realistic shows. Dodging full-auto at point-blank range. Surviving RPG to a car you stand 2 feet away from. The list can go on forever.
7. Was Chisato just staring with open mouth and not doing anything? Don't think so, you just imagined it.
8. Her convenient tie-gun didn't materialize out of thin air, so sorry. P.S more of the "Chisato didn't do justice-warrior/hero thing" ranting.
9. In other words, betraying own convictions is how a character "grows" by your standards...
10. This is ridiculous. Lycoris aren't sheltered snowflake girls playing with Barbie's. They weren't out shopping either. They're on a battlefield. In combat, you can't worry about wellbeing of every comrade around you, you kind of hope they can stand own ground - you also accept they and you can die at any moment. Constant worrying and crying won't help - this isn't how killers are trained! Your BS take is baffling. Chisao can't freeze or slow down time. Chisato going for the bag and Majima shooting happened at the same time. Chisato didn't spawn a gun in her hand out of thin air and had no time to shoot Majima - as simple as that. For you to consider she just lazed off and watched them getting shot even though she could do something is insultingly dumb.
What did you want to see? How do you think movies are made? Majima's silouette appears suddenly and Chisato headshots him in 0.01 seconds and the show ends?
Chisato and Majima are pretty much superhuman. You must've been watching a different show to even consider the two can be killed easily and quickly. You didn't like "YO", would you prefer she cursed at him or started crying and/or yelling? The two are pretty equal and show respect to each other even though they're enemies - it's that simple.

1. Except she was raised by Mika, except she shows more sympathy for people that're shooting directly at her, except we have multiple lines from Chisato about how much she values lives and wants to help those she can. But a potential killer going after lycorises is whatever.

2. Yet again someone strawmanning my arguments into "oH yOu jUsT wANt HEr tO bE a hEro of JUstIcE". nope. never said that. never implied that. And she was raised by Mika. She, according to the show, hasn't killed anyone in the last 10 years. Do you know how little I can take her seriously in the last episode, when she said "I wanna do what I can for people who need me" while also ignoring innocents dying due to her inaction? But keep saying she's supposed to be a killer who obeys orders when she's...not a killer...nor does she obey orders...which one of us didn't understand the show again?

3. You agreed they didn't deserve to be shot at. You don't have to defend against every point. Just agree that she put their lives in danger when she shouldn't have and move one.

4. Ok. Catching Majima isn't easy so she shouldn't even try? And Takina TRIED. That's the difference you fail to see. But interesting how much you think Chisato doesn't care about innocent lives, yet you fail to see the problem.

5. You didn't even make an arguement for this one.

6. You excuse the lazy writing by claiming it's there since episode 1. I agree, it has been terribly wrtten since then. I'm still gonna point it out.

7. What did she do as the lady was running towards Takina?

8. I don't need it to materiaalize out of nothing, she had it on her. But keep yourself in that strawman as much as you can. It's convenient for you, isn't it?

9. Never said that. Never made that arguement. Never was my point. Try again.

10. She picked up her bag before he started shooting. He kept shooting long enough for the elevator doors to close. She had a gun on her. And you just implied Chisato don't give a shit about anyone during combat when she gives so much shit she has a lot to spare for her enemies.

Sigmar-Unberogen said:
@Secret333

Did Mika teach her to value life and not kill anyone? Did he teach her to be sympathetic? No.
You're confusing indifference with a cool head. You make big deal of her reaction about 4 dead Lycoris. That's a YOU problem. You expect she'd hold a grudge? Become an avenger? Become angry? Sad? Why?
Put it in your brain. This isn't the first time she sees dead Lycoris or hears about them getting killed. Majima may be special threat but he isn't the first, nor is he the last enemy.
Chisato saying she values life doesn't mean she has to pity the dead, or avenge them, or hunt down villains whenever. She will try not to kill them when confronted though. Your argument is invalid and leaves the impression you want Chisato to indeed be some Marvel-type hero of justice.

Yeah, perhaps you should try to sound less salty in your arguments for people to interpret your words differently. Here's precisely why I thought you imagined Chisato to be some "hero of justice". You claim her "inaction" led or could lead to innocents dying. If you don't see how impossible and ridiculous your BS demand is I don't know what else to say. It's not her "hero duty" to guard the innocents 24/7 or hunt down villains like Batman. By your flawed logic, that resembles Shinji's btw, she shouldn't be "fooling around" at a cafe at all, and should be using her talents fighting potentially never ending number of criminals all her life, because duh... If she doesn't she apparently "dOeSn'T cArE fur da innocents enough"...

You don't have to whine about every time Chisato farts. The very fact you called road-raging morons (who were speeding, driving erratically and thus endangering lives of others) as innocent
shows how salty you are about Chiasto and BS length you're willing to take to "prove a point". This argument alone should've invalidated the entire thread but here I am, still wasting my time on you...

"sHoUlDnT eVeN tRy?" *facepalm*
When we see Majima in Chisato's apartment, was she armed, was she ready to give chase immediately? Could she have taken him out without killing?
When I said Takina TRIED I meant she tried to shoot, at least, because she was armed at least! Why didn't even Takina give a chase? Because Majima jumped down several floors!!! You expect Chiasto to be like "oh no, this guy is the threat to peace in the universe, I must personally take responsibility for capturing this villain by getting emotional and giving chase out of pure impulse... Otherwise some snowflake Mal-user may accuse me of not caring about the innocent enough?"
Underestimating an opponent leads to death. Chisato is still physically a teenage girl, not Captain America; there's limits to what she or any Lycoris can do.
She didn't do anything because she couldn't do anything and chasing after him would've been as dumb as it was dangerous.

Chisato didn't force those two out of the nation. She didn't demand they leave out of "selfish desires". You're beyond pathetic at painting Chisato in dark colours, changing what happened with what you think happened, since otherwise your argument makes no sense. Also, respecting the final wish of a dying person makes those two "dumbfucks". *Claps*

I'm not excusing the lazy writing. I consider the plot to be average. I'm pointing out how ridiculous you sound using one of such instances to support a claim about Chisato.
It's like saying "the show is stupid, but I'm still gonna make a random example of a stupid moment to prove the certain moment is stupid." Waste of time...

You tell me?! You're the one with the ability to see behind the scenes here! Your BS argument falls flat shortly after though. Chisato went as far as shooting Shinji with a real bullet to save Takina. Are you claiming she cares about Takina to such extend in 1 moment and not cares about her in another???
Yeah, killing the woman and Shinji would guarantee the safety of Takina. Then again it goes against the whole being of what Chisato is. You said this prevents Chisato from growing which is simply dumb. I get it, you're irritated with Chisato sparing lives. You'd rather see an edgy edgy anime of a "hero succumbs to the dark side". Pretty much what Shinji wanted.

Stay delusional, couldn't care less anymore.

Yeah, not making sense is your speciality.

Well you're just proving my point. I did say it's insultingly dumb to imply Chisato just watched "calmly" as her friends got shot and didn't do anything even though she could. You could argue about animation not doing better job at convincing you WHY Chisato didn't act in time. But NO, you make the most mind numbingly dumb argument: Chisato was armed, she was ready to shoot, but she purposefully and willingly didn't out of some ridiculously dumb reason, such as???
Just wow...

Try less strawmanning. Try less changing what happened in the show to fit your defense. Try not to sound more ridiculous.

1."I wanna become a saviour!" lol. I never asked her to become an avanger. She doesn't even ask how they died.

2.Facts: Majima is alive because Chisato didn't kill him in the tower 10 years ago. According to the show he's a world known terrorist, so he must've killed some people outside Japan, before burying a bunch of lycorises in the subway in episode 4. He's alive in episode 7, free to massacre an entire police department full of innocents because she didn't kill him in episode 6 (she gets a head shot, but it's her shitty bullets). He's free to cause chaos and lead to civilians dying because sh let him go. Now, can you imagine how that should weigh on Chisato's mind? can you?
But keep pretending like all I'm saying is she has "to guard the innocents 24/7 or hunt down villains like Batman". Nope. Just care about the lives she impacts.

3. If you don't see how bad it is for her to shoot innocents, I can't help you.

4. Bruh she dodges bullets without breaking a sweat. She was not helpless to do anything in that situation. But it's ok. We can sit down with mass-murderers if they just ask nicely.

5. She closes down the cafe, where their lives are at. Forcing them to move countries.

6. I have to use every instance I can to back up my claims about Chisato. That's what we call qualifying one's own arguments. If I call something stupid I obviously have to point out why it's stupid. You got a problem with that?

7. Ok. I guess I'll repeat the original post. She didn't do anything as the woman was running at Takina with killing intent.

10. Oooooooh so it's the animation's fault? So you admit there's a problem somewhere? What we see on screen says something about her character that's at odd with what they tell us, right?
"Chisato was armed, she was ready to shoot, but she purposefully and willingly didn't out of some ridiculously dumb reason, such as???" There's no reason. That's the problem. Got it?

Sigmar-Unberogen said:
@Secret333
This is just plain "thick skull" moment ffs. Stubbornness to admit "YOU" problem. "hOw tHeY dIed?" - Does it matter? For some reason, you EXPECT that character who claims he values life HAD to show some emotion or spoon-feed you with "I care" reaction, preferably with a dramatic single tear on a cheek or a sad face perhaps. You just expected more pointless worrying about "what if-s" and sorrow about unchangeable past. Chisato isn't like that. She's "cheerful" even after she's informed she has 2 months left to live. YOU don't want to accept that she hides her emotions. YOU consider it to be indifference - countless times in this thread. If someone were to attack the café, she would react - no doubts about her love towards the people. If she were there and could help those 4 girls, she would too. She simply doesn't cloud her mind with things that can't be changed or may not happen at all - it's her personality!
So this is your deal - "she gets a head shot, but it's her shitty bullets". So basically you're pissed that Chisato doesn't kill villains and gives them another chance in life. That's basically it. Chisato didn't kill lots of people. What happens after she knocks them out though? Forgotten the plot already??? Cleaners supposed to arrive and deal with them.
Ludicrous POV as always... so Chisato should've foreseen the future and killed Majima (or be normal Lycoris and use lethal bullets) because then he wouldn't have survived and cause mayhem 10 years later?! This basically means Chisato should never take prisoners as they "MAY" escape justice sometime in the future and commit crimes again; how dumb is that? Funnily enough, Batman also doesn't kill villains, he takes them to prison/asylum, but they tend to find ways to escape and this often ends with them killing even more people before getting captured again. Is Batman terrible? Once again, it's YOU problem. You don't like such characters, you don't have to, you can cry and whine about it all you want. Doesn't mean they're universally terrible... Just your arguably shitty taste to blame.
Google the word "innocent", do yourself a favor. It's getting annoying. The rest was already explained.
Totally misunderstood moment. Majima wasn't intending to kill her there. If you think those two were relaxed, you delude yourself. They both decided not to escalate things between them just yet. Dodging bullets doesn't make her unkillable. Have you seen episode 13? Chisato was overwhelmed by sheer physical strength of Majima. Returning to what you mentioned, the two were in a small room. If the two decided to fight, Chisato would either flee or get killed - not by bullets but be beaten, stabbed, chocked to death perhaps.
*major facepalm* Kurumi certainly lives there, no info on Mizuki. Mika is still the owner, not Chisato. Leaving the nation was entirely the decision of the two; Japan isn't just 1 city. Chisato was supposed to die and they honored her final wish. It's ridiculous how you can blame her... It's not like the two are homeless and can't take care of themselves and have literally nowhere else to go!!! Grow up...
Cringe... *cough*like calling obvious assholes innocent.*cough* Doing good job qualifying own arguments.
why she didn't do anything? she froze? shat herself? Purposefully wanted to see Takina die? Speak up! I want to know your brilliant explanation that doesn't immediately fall flat with the scene that follows after Takina's fall: Something like Chisato jumping after her, stopping the woman, shooting Shinji even though that's the last thing she ever wanted. Or just keep living in denial...
Had you blamed the animation, you'd sound less stupid - that's my point. Instead of clowning around you should've just re-watched the final moments of episode 12. Guess I have to do YOUR job, since you're the one making accusations and imagining things. Ok, I checked the moment and what a surprise!!!
1) Chisato is seen holding a gun as she approaches the bag to pick it up.
2) Majima appears and shoots.
3) Chisato is then seen shielding herself with the bag as Majima is spraying bullets, her gun is on the ground this time as she's using both hands!
4) Elevator closes and Chisato rises up with a gun in her hand - no longer shielding herself with the bag this time!
Your mental gymnastics must be astounding. There's no implications that Chisato's gun was loaded to begin with, or that she purposefully and willingly didn't fire out of some ridiculously dumb reason - such as wanting to see her friends die, or hesitate to shoot the villain with non-lethal bullets even though that's what she always does! Check facts before spewing nonsense. You're just hallucinating at this point. Though it's not surprising. For someone who rated the show 2/10 on a sad alt profile, salt is a must.

As I said I can’t help you anymore. The amount of misunderstanding of simple arguments, misrepresentation of my arguments, false equivalences, bad faith arguments, and just denial is beyond what I can do. I’ll just be repeating myself at this point, to someone who thinks I want to be a hater, someone who argues in bad faith, and someone who thinks I’m using an alt account for some reason. We’re done here.