Sex before marriage?
geniobastardo said: Talking about doing something and actually doing something are two different thingsSexual compatibility is, in most cases (about 90%) , adjustable. A nice long chat about sex before marriage will achieve you the same result as having sexual intercourse before marriage would. But, whatever floats your boat. |
 Nico- said: Conversations with people pinging/quoting me to argue about some old post I wrote years ago will not be entertained@Comic_Sans oh no y arnt ppl dieing i need more ppl dieing rly gud plot avansement jus liek tokyo ghoul if erbudy dies amirite |
DisdainMatto said: bombslayer said: Considering its something like 65% of all marriages end in divorce and domestic partnerships tend to be more successful I would argue that love and marriage are two very separate things. Marriage is not very indicative of love anymore, unfortunately.The amount of dedication I'm talking about is the one equivalent to marriage. And well now that think of it none of this can be proven. So it's all my opinion Marriage has always had a subjective meaning. Though I'm sure I'm not the only one who thinks that way of marriage even today. |
bombslayer said: How is marriage subjective? it's a legally defined thing. Trust me, I'm a fan of marriage, I think it's the fucking shit. Sadly, most people are too immature to handle the kind of responsibility & commitment it places on them and since the divorce rate is so damn high we are now seeing people checking out of even considering it as an option because their parents are divorced. It's a shitty situation, but the fact remains that more often than not, nowadays, marriage =/= love.DisdainMatto said: Considering its something like 65% of all marriages end in divorce and domestic partnerships tend to be more successful I would argue that love and marriage are two very separate things. Marriage is not very indicative of love anymore, unfortunately. Marriage has been rather subjective in meaning. Well I'm sure I'm not the only one who thinks that way. |
 I love Christine "If one advances confidently in the direction of his dreams, and endeavors to live the life which he has imagined, he will meet with a success unexpected in common hours. He will put some things behind, will pass an invisible boundary; In proportion as he simplifies his life, the laws of the universe will appear less complex, and solitude will not be solitude, nor poverty poverty, nor weakness weakness." - Henry David Thoreau |
bombslayer said: that's because not everyone is idealistic as you and believes that God will someone set up the perfect fateDisdainMatto said: Considering its something like 65% of all marriages end in divorce and domestic partnerships tend to be more successful I would argue that love and marriage are two very separate things. Marriage is not very indicative of love anymore, unfortunately. Marriage has always had a subjective meaning. Though I'm sure I'm not the only one who thinks that way of marriage even today. |
DisdainMatto said: bombslayer said: You'll realize that there is beauty in this world outside of your religious viewpoints and the shit humans do. The world is a beautiful place, you just have to look.Well that's not the first time I heard that phrase.I guess losing faith in humanity is just as common as that to me nowadays I'm not that pessimistic. In fact, I think I'm the only one who appreciates beauty more than anyone else in my class. And please don't treat my views as religious as I came upon the conclusion on my own. |
bombslayer said: "The world is a beautiful place" = "pessimistic"???? DONE! FUCK THIS!DisdainMatto said: You'll realize that there is beauty in this world outside of your religious viewpoints and the shit humans do. The world is a beautiful place, you just have to look. I'm not that pessimistic. In fact, I think I'm the only one who appreciates beauty more than anyone else in my class. And please don't treat my views as religious as I came upon the conclusion on my own. |
I love Christine "If one advances confidently in the direction of his dreams, and endeavors to live the life which he has imagined, he will meet with a success unexpected in common hours. He will put some things behind, will pass an invisible boundary; In proportion as he simplifies his life, the laws of the universe will appear less complex, and solitude will not be solitude, nor poverty poverty, nor weakness weakness." - Henry David Thoreau |
DisdainMatto said: bombslayer said: How is marriage subjective? it's a legally defined thing. Trust me, I'm a fan of marriage, I think it's the fucking shit. Sadly, most people are too immature to handle the kind of responsibility & commitment it places on them and since the divorce rate is so damn high we are now seeing people checking out of even considering it as an option because their parents are divorced. It's a shitty situation, but the fact remains that more often than not, nowadays, marriage =/= love.Marriage has been rather subjective in meaning. Well I'm sure I'm not the only one who thinks that way. How can you explain those who advocate divorce and those who not and last thing I heard marriage is the unified relationship between a MAN and a WOMAN and we all know where that changed. |
bombslayer said: oh no DisdainMatto said: How is marriage subjective? it's a legally defined thing. Trust me, I'm a fan of marriage, I think it's the fucking shit. Sadly, most people are too immature to handle the kind of responsibility & commitment it places on them and since the divorce rate is so damn high we are now seeing people checking out of even considering it as an option because their parents are divorced. It's a shitty situation, but the fact remains that more often than not, nowadays, marriage =/= love. How can you explain those who advocate divorce and those who not and last thing I heard marriage is the unified relationship between a MAN and a WOMAN and we all know where that changed. No homosexual debate pls |
DisdainMatto said: I don't get what I said wrong .-.bombslayer said: "The world is a beautiful place" = "pessimistic"???? DONE! FUCK THIS!I'm not that pessimistic. In fact, I think I'm the only one who appreciates beauty more than anyone else in my class. And please don't treat my views as religious as I came upon the conclusion on my own. |
bombslayer said: DisdainMatto said: How is marriage subjective? it's a legally defined thing. Trust me, I'm a fan of marriage, I think it's the fucking shit. Sadly, most people are too immature to handle the kind of responsibility & commitment it places on them and since the divorce rate is so damn high we are now seeing people checking out of even considering it as an option because their parents are divorced. It's a shitty situation, but the fact remains that more often than not, nowadays, marriage =/= love. How can you explain those who advocate divorce and those who not and last thing I heard marriage is the unified relationship between a MAN and a WOMAN and we all know where that changed.  |
I love Christine "If one advances confidently in the direction of his dreams, and endeavors to live the life which he has imagined, he will meet with a success unexpected in common hours. He will put some things behind, will pass an invisible boundary; In proportion as he simplifies his life, the laws of the universe will appear less complex, and solitude will not be solitude, nor poverty poverty, nor weakness weakness." - Henry David Thoreau |
| Fuck her silly asap |
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DisdainMatto said: Could use an explanation more than a gif thank you.bombslayer said: How can you explain those who advocate divorce and those who not and last thing I heard marriage is the unified relationship between a MAN and a WOMAN and we all know where that changed. |
Fizix said: True, but I'm always up to change and learn more. I never said my opinion of these are fact.bombslayer said: I'm not that pessimistic. In fact, I think I'm the only one who appreciates beauty more than anyone else in my class. And please don't treat my views as religious as I came upon the conclusion on my own. In your class? So you're still in school? Seriously, how on earth can you even begin to have a clue about this stuff? You can't possibly have the life or relationship experience to say the things you're saying. |
shotz_ said: bombslayer said: How can you explain those who advocate divorce and those who not and last thing I heard marriage is the unified relationship between a MAN and a WOMAN and we all know where that changed. ah so much for this bombslayer said: I'm a more logical kind of Christian I can assure you of that. I have my own reasons and I'm starting to regret ever saying I was Christian to begin with. |
DisdainMatto said: bombslayer said: How can you explain those who advocate divorce and those who not and last thing I heard marriage is the unified relationship between a MAN and a WOMAN and we all know where that changed. LOL I love that GIF :D |
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bombslayer said: Nobody has a problem with you being a christian, my best friend is a fucking evangelical, what we have a problem with is you saying dumb shit and then hiding behind your faith, acting like it's a shield that will protect you from criticism.I have my own reasons and I'm starting to regret ever saying I was Christian to begin with. |
I love Christine "If one advances confidently in the direction of his dreams, and endeavors to live the life which he has imagined, he will meet with a success unexpected in common hours. He will put some things behind, will pass an invisible boundary; In proportion as he simplifies his life, the laws of the universe will appear less complex, and solitude will not be solitude, nor poverty poverty, nor weakness weakness." - Henry David Thoreau |
DisdainMatto said: That's what I despise. If you cannot defend your own belief or make sense out of it then why do you believe to begin with.bombslayer said: Nobody has a problem with you being a christian, my best friend is a fucking evangelical, what we have a problem with is saying dumb shit and then hiding behind your faith, acting like it's a shield that will protect you from criticism.I have my own reasons and I'm starting to regret ever saying I was Christian to begin with. |
bombslayer said: Ask yourself that because you clearly can't defend them without saying "im a christian". Literally nobody gives a fuck about your religion. You clearly have some shit to work out between you and your beliefs, that's self-evident at this point. Now before we derail this any further into a religious debate. Marriage doesn't equal love, love doesn't equal sex, sex doesn't equal marriage. Are we clear on this now? These 3 things do not have to go together to exist, you can love somebody and not fuck them, you can be married to somebody and not love them, you can fuck somebody and not be married to them. Humans are animals, whether you want to believe it or not, we are hardwired to mate. Marriage is a man made creation for a multitude of reasons. Love and Mating are natural things.DisdainMatto said: That's what I despise the most. If you cannot defend your own belief or make sense out of it then why do you believe to begin with.Nobody has a problem with you being a christian, my best friend is a fucking evangelical, what we have a problem with is saying dumb shit and then hiding behind your faith, acting like it's a shield that will protect you from criticism. I apologize if my tone is "triggering" for you, but when you are this block headed, I need to explain things in as simple terms as possible. |
I love Christine "If one advances confidently in the direction of his dreams, and endeavors to live the life which he has imagined, he will meet with a success unexpected in common hours. He will put some things behind, will pass an invisible boundary; In proportion as he simplifies his life, the laws of the universe will appear less complex, and solitude will not be solitude, nor poverty poverty, nor weakness weakness." - Henry David Thoreau |
DisdainMatto said: bombslayer said: Ask yourself that because you clearly can't defend them without saying "im a christian". Literally nobody gives a fuck about your religion. You clearly have some shit to work out between you and your beliefs, that's self-evident at this point. Now before we derail this any further into a religious debate. Marriage doesn't equal love, love doesn't equal sex, sex doesn't equal marriage. Are we clear on this now? These 3 things do not have to go together to exist, you can love somebody and not fuck them, you can be married to somebody and not love them, you can fuck somebody and not be married to them. Humans are animals, whether you want to believe it or not, we are hardwired to mate. Marriage is a man made creation for a multitude of reasons. Love and Mating are natural things.That's what I despise the most. If you cannot defend your own belief or make sense out of it then why do you believe to begin with. I apologize if my tone is "triggering" for you, but when you are this block headed, I need to explain things in as simple terms as possible. Thank you. Marriage is artificial, sex is not. All animals have sex, only humans marry. |
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DisdainMatto said: bombslayer said: Ask yourself that because you clearly can't defend them without saying "im a christian". Literally nobody gives a fuck about your religion. You clearly have some shit to work out between you and your beliefs, that's self-evident at this point. Now before we derail this any further into a religious debate. Marriage doesn't equal love, love doesn't equal sex, sex doesn't equal marriage. Are we clear on this now? These 3 things do not have to go together to exist, you can love somebody and not fuck them, you can be married to somebody and not love them, you can fuck somebody and not be married to them. Humans are animals, whether you want to believe it or not, we are hardwired to mate. Marriage is a man made creation for a multitude of reasons. Love and Mating are natural things.That's what I despise the most. If you cannot defend your own belief or make sense out of it then why do you believe to begin with. I don't remember using my religion as a shield. And I think I brought up some logical opinions. And indeed, that is all opinion but it's how most of the world works today. I can't help it since the content the topics we bring up will make me use opinions that many would think I just reaped out of religion when I repeatedly remind them that I came upon the conclusion MYSELF. And hey even the Bible said man was made to thrive and populate the earth. I'm just a newbie when it comes to arguments and made a few mistakes by reading too fast or not taking the time to fully comprehend your opinion. I found this to be great experience and I'd like to thank you for actually giving the time to hear me out. |
bombslayer said: I know you're just saying this to be nice, you don't need to be. Welcome to CD, the place that you pretty much rip out any sort of respect for your fellow man you thought you had, I should know, it did that to me about 3 weeks ago.I'm just a newbie when it comes to arguments and made a few mistakes by reading too fast or not taking the time to fully comprehend your opinion. I found this to be great experience and I'd like to thank you for actually giving the time to hear me out. |
I love Christine "If one advances confidently in the direction of his dreams, and endeavors to live the life which he has imagined, he will meet with a success unexpected in common hours. He will put some things behind, will pass an invisible boundary; In proportion as he simplifies his life, the laws of the universe will appear less complex, and solitude will not be solitude, nor poverty poverty, nor weakness weakness." - Henry David Thoreau |
Fizix said: Marriage is no indicator of the quality of someones relationship. Fizix said: Dedication? How do you know how much dedication it requires to raise a family? Or whether marriage requires any dedication at all? Raising children requires far more dedication than maintaining a relationship with someone. Also the amount of dedication a relationship (and a family) requires does not change before and after someone has gotten married. Marriage is a statement, its all talk, not actions. Do you think someone who isn't married is less dedicated to their partner and raising children? Several married couples I know prove that wrong, they are atrocious parents and are anything but dedicated to each other. But they are married, so they're automatically dedicated right? You're peddling these views but you've probably never even had a relationship, you're still at school s you can't possibly know. What are you basing all this stuff on? A lot of hearsay mostly. I admit that it isn't a good source. Marriage is treated like a social contract by most people nowadays so I wouldn't base someone's dedication on marriage anyway. I am quite cornered with the fact that I have no experience whatsoever. But then again you can't prove to me that all this is true. We can't prove each other's views nor will we ever hope to convince one other. I guess time will tell for me. |
mayukachan said: bombslayer said: that's because not everyone is idealistic as you and believes that God will someone set up the perfect fateMarriage has always had a subjective meaning. Though I'm sure I'm not the only one who thinks that way of marriage even today. God won't set you up with your perfect fate, for sure. You have to earn it =_= |
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Fizix said: So you're sitting there judging people based on stuff some people have said with nothing to gauge the validity of what they've said? What exactly have they said anyway? Not anything positive obviously. It's not like I trust in those with my life either. Hearsay is hearsay. And I don't judge so carelessly. I like to get into full detail and most of all, know them personally before I'll judge. Fizix said: You already have based someones dedication on marriage, see your posts I quoted previously. You said that we have cheapened ourselves, have no values, are soiled, that sex isn't "for us" and by extension children aren't for us and you've drawn our dedication into question. Yes, I said those. Those children are your responsibility and I'm not the one to say they're not. I think being a parent is different from this so I don't get why do you bring parenthood up on this. Fizix said: So in other words, after you've derided a group of people its up to us to prove you wrong rather than you justify yourself? Saying we can't prove each others views is irrelevant - because we can. You're the one who's peddling views and making claims about peoples relationships, claiming to know better. You are the one who is saying that marriage is essential and that people should save themselves until they are married. But you are completely unable to explain or justify these views. The most you've been able to come up with is "hearsay". I haven't seen much justification on your part either. And my point still stands that none of us will ever convince another with this. |
bombslayerOct 12, 2015 4:55 AM
| Forgive me for the late edits. I'm open to change. I never judge someone and say that's it. I'm never surprised if someone showed a side of theirs nobody saw whether it be good or not. I always expect more out of them. Misconception about Christianity too. We don't persecute people; we forgive them. Everybody is guilty of sin. It's blasphemy to forsake another for sin. You never needed to be biologically related to become a parent to someone. I didn't intend to offend nor did I ever say you should believe in my claims. Neither of us have backing so I don't see this going anywhere. |
bombslayerOct 12, 2015 5:09 AM
bombslayer said: Lol the entire book is a misconception. Stop generalizing your entire religion based on your own beliefs because literally every single Christian out there has their own bullshit interpretation of the bible.Forgive me for the late edits. Misconception about Christianity too. We don't persecute people; we forgive them. Everybody is guilty of sin. It's blasphemy to forsake another for sin. You never needed to be biologically related to become a parent to someone. I didn't intend to offend nor did I ever say you should believe in my claims. Neither of us have backing so I don't see this going anywhere. |
Fizix said: bombslayer said: Forgive me for the late edits. Misconception about Christianity too. We don't persecute people; we forgive them. Everybody is guilty of sin. It's blasphemy to forsake another for sin. You never needed to be biologically related to become a parent to someone. I didn't intend to offend nor did I ever say you should believe in my claims. Neither of us have backing so I don't see this going anywhere. You haven't offended me. I'm questioning you. What I find funny is that you claim not to persecute... Maybe you should read your posts again and rethink that. Hmph. I'm just concerned. I'll be more careful with my wording. My judgment there was too hasty I suppose. |
LionCake said: I'm tired and I know this will go nowhere so I won't even bother.bombslayer said: Lol the entire book is a misconception. Stop generalizing your entire religion based on your own beliefs because literally every single Christian out there has their own bullshit interpretation of the bible.Forgive me for the late edits. Misconception about Christianity too. We don't persecute people; we forgive them. Everybody is guilty of sin. It's blasphemy to forsake another for sin. You never needed to be biologically related to become a parent to someone. I didn't intend to offend nor did I ever say you should believe in my claims. Neither of us have backing so I don't see this going anywhere. |
Cottonrabbit said: Fizix said: You can't feel your sexual compatibility without having sex with someone though. Sexual compatibility isn't the same as attraction, and it isn't the same as loving someone's personality. It's not a jerk thing to say at all, it's realistic. If there isn't sexual compatibility in a relationship then both of you will feel that and the likelihood is that one of you will end up looking for sex elsewhere. Also, from your other posts, it isn't a test. Nobody is being tested and it isn't about how good someone is in bed, it's about you both being on the same level and having that kind of intimate connection. This isn't something you can figure out by talking about it. Sure, you can talk and find out about any fetishes that are kind of out there, but its not just about that. Someone up thread mentioned the risk of sex becoming a chore and they are absolutely right. Different people have very different ideas about sex, and everyone is very different in the bedroom anyway. If that doesn't match up then it will become a chore. I am going to hold my ground on this one. It has been my experience that their personality, openness to new things, attitudes to sex, the level of intimacy, communication and the close connection you share outside are reflected in the bedroom compatibility. There is never guarantees of course, even if you did try to test compatibility but my ideals have worked for me so far. I remain an all or nothing romantic :) But seriously. How can you argue for something that you've never experienced for yourself? If you've never had sex (and least of all, sex with several different people), how can you say anything about sexual compability? |
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DisdainMatto said: I know you're just saying this to be nice, you don't need to be. Welcome to CD, the place that you pretty much rip out any sort of respect for your fellow man you thought you had, I should know, it did that to me about 3 weeks ago.  |
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| Doesn't really matter to me. |
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| Of course, sex is important and you don't wanna marry someone and then realize it's no fun. |
| Marriage has no benefits for a male. Are you so prude, that you afraid of the church, OP? Sex always comes before marriage. |
mayukachan said: Thalos said: You can be "bad" at sex. The male always has to put in more effort so the female can actually orgasm and get turned on because it's physically harder for the female to get turned on.Is performance necessarily the issue here? I don't think many people here are even thinking about how "good" someone is in bed but whether or not there's passion there, whether the other person is comfortable in bed with you, whether you have similar tastes and fetishes etc. Skill at sex can be learned, though. It's something you get better the more you do it and the more you experiment, even with the same partner. Sexual compatibiliy means you both have the same approach. It's fine if someone just wants to do the missionary position, but they're incompatible with me. I want to experiment with all kinds of stuff. A compatible women will be open to trying things. |
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TheBrainintheJar said: mayukachan said: You can be "bad" at sex. The male always has to put in more effort so the female can actually orgasm and get turned on because it's physically harder for the female to get turned on. Skill at sex can be learned, though. It's something you get better the more you do it and the more you experiment, even with the same partner. Sexual compatibiliy means you both have the same approach. It's fine if someone just wants to do the missionary position, but they're incompatible with me. I want to experiment with all kinds of stuff. A compatible women will be open to trying things. I agree with that completely. If someone isn't putting any effort into making you feel good and even after talking with them things aren't improving, then maybe the relationship isn't as healthy as you thought and it's time to move on. However if someone is just inexperienced (and since this topic is discussing people who would hypothetically wait for marriage before ever having sex, it's likely this person would be) there's no reason to not be patient with them if you love them and you're compatible. But if your partner just wants to do the same thing every night and you're not into that, your relationship will inevitably suffer. |
bombslayer said: I just finished ranting about relationships and the 1st thing I see is this. I don't even know what to type about this. For one thing, I am completely against this. but I'm just confused about how this world lost so much of it's values as individuals. How they devalue themselves so much to resort to this. If you're wondering yes, I'm a Christian. But just to let you know I actually find the atheists more tolerable than the fake Christians in my school and I'm a more logical kind of Christian I can assure you of that. Now back to the topic. Guilty pleasure can only make life worth living for so long. I hope people would put more time and effort on something that lasts for an eternity. You speak of devaluing themselves by I assume engaging in sex prior to marriage. How you define marriage is irrelevant here, but sexual urges are something all of us have (minus a few possible outliers) and religion often twists this in such a way to make people feel guilty for a biological (natural) impulse. The fact virgins are considered 'pure' is a very good example of this. Of course this mentality is mirrored in your own post, with suggestions that the act is somehow shameful or dirty, which is implied by word choices such as 'guilty pleasure' and bringing up value's with the implication that engaging in sex pre-maritally devalues a person. This next part isn't necessarily aimed at you but my thoughts in general. The social glorification of virginity as some sort of virtue or prize is to put it bluntly, damaging, especially with a religious lense. This portrayal of virginity as a one time deal is just absurd i.e. do it and you're a whore. Virginity should not define a person, nor determine a woman or man's value. People should be choosing to have sex when they feel they are ready and it's consensual. We should further increase sexual education (rather than abstinence education which is very detrimental especially in regards to women), so people can be safe, do what's right for them, and be happy with their decisions, i.e. teach the benefits and consequences of sex. While I disagree with the social condemnation or guilt that often comes from the abstinence camp, that is not to say I agree with the extreme other side either. I do think our culture as a whole is too sexual, which is equally as harmful, but that's another topic entirely, best left for another day. @OP You say you will honour your religion unless your partner insists. This is an odd attitude to me. You're essentially laying the entire decision on your significant other, rather than reaching a mutual decision together, that's based on what you are both ready for and/or comfortable with. I find it hard to fathom why anyone would take such a stance. |
Comic_Sans said: geniobastardo said: Talking about doing something and actually doing something are two different thingsSexual compatibility is, in most cases (about 90%) , adjustable. A nice long chat about sex before marriage will achieve you the same result as having sexual intercourse before marriage would. But, whatever floats your boat. Which yield the same output, theoretically speaking. Because if we're measuring sexual compatibility by gauging how good is your partner in bed, then that's something you'll both learn through experience and to dump your partner simply because he/she wasn't up to your expectations is, well, nonsensical. But, if we were to measure the 'compatibility' by gauging sex drive and identifying 'fetishes' then that's something you can discover simply by talking to your partner. The only substantial problem is the problem of sex drive; which isn't even a problem 90% of the time because you can tell how active a person is sexually simply by staying with him/her. When it comes to fetishes or other activities your partner enjoys in the bed, then that too is adjustable. And to dump your partner simply because you couldn't adjust to one fetish of her or she couldn't to yours is, again, nonsensical. |
geniobastardoOct 12, 2015 8:56 AM
[i]"Yet each man kills the thing he loves, [/i]By each let this be heard, Some do it with a bitter look, Some with a flattering word, The coward does it with a kiss, The brave man with a sword!'' ~Oscar |
| Well this thread actually invited some good debate . . . Sex does sell/attract I guess XP Get some points out the way here: I'm Christian but not a "Bible thumper" I believe Jesus died for our sin and His sacrifice alone was truly perfect and removed all Sin from the world. The Bible says clearly No man can get to Heaven except through Jesus. This means that what you choose to do/ not do/ only do when will not factor in to getting you sasved. You just have to accept Jesus into your heart. I'm way more open to having sex before marriage, however I still stand firmly in saying that it has to be with someone I am deeply inlove with. Also, to the above explanation of my belief: I am bi, so whether my partner ends up being a male or female, I'mopen to either. |
"Fuck this shit, fun things are fun!" |
| Yes, and I don't have an issue with it. Neither does my SO. |
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