Battle Theme

Feb 24, 2017 8:32 PM

Offline

Jul 2018

564612

Hello.

So I've been commissioned by some people to make music for their games. Can't say I'm used to do this kind of work; I'm pretty new in all of this.
Anyway, one of my client asked me to write a battle theme for his project. His game is rather 16-bit-ish and stuff, so I'm trying to emulate a particular kind of sound and writing that you usually find in old-school JRPGs.

Here is my first try: [WIP] Fighting the Shadows
One of my battle theme in the past has been a bit criticized for being "too soft and cute" and consequently, I don't really want to repeat the same mistake.
So I'd like to know: would you want to play a game with this track as a battle theme? Is there something that bugs you (in terms of composition, sound)? Furthermore, how does it sound in your speaker/headphones?

I still hope you like it, see you!

Feb 24, 2017 8:45 PM

Ckan

Offline

Mar 2008

24336

I like it.

Does this theme have a particular context in mind? Like, what's the game's setting - is the piece for a certain mood/theme/locale/event/character, etc.? Knowing that, we might be able to give more helpful opinions.

My impression of the piece is that it's quite pleasant - almost dreamlike and comforting - moving through the motions. After a single play, it felt quite pleasantly familiar, but it doesn't have an especially memorable melody/motif. Which is fine for a battle theme, of course. It perhaps had an airy magical sort of feeling - I could see it being stereotyped for a female/gentle type character, but perhaps that's the 'soft and cute' you're trying to avoid?

I like the use of repetitions and alternations - it flows well and wouldn't be intrusive/overpowering in as a bgm.

***>> Click here and help feed a hungry hungry Zerg in need! (￣﹃￣✿) <<***

Feb 24, 2017 9:02 PM

worldeditor11

Offline

Apr 2013

12542

This is not a battle theme. Not even by a longshot. If anything, this kind of music fits better as a pre-battle theme or one of the bgms used in dungeon exploration. I think dungeon fits more but I digress.

It is a good piece of game music but I will not label this as a battle theme.

Feb 24, 2017 9:28 PM

removed-user

Offline

Jul 2018

564612

Ckan said:
Does this theme have a particular context in mind? Like, what's the game's setting - is the piece for a certain mood/theme/locale/event/character, etc.? Knowing that, we might be able to give more helpful opinions.

Well, this is more a sort of "regular battle theme" but I guess the game's setting can count as a particular context, indeed. I don't know if I can share too many details yet but what I can say is the game is very inspired by Pokemon in terms of concept and gameplay, but have a slightly more darker tone and vibes, story-wise.
Do you have some experiences with JRPGs, perhaps (to know if I can namedrop some games as references)? If so, I can say it's more influenced by Shin Megami Tensei in some part. So what I've been implicitly asked is to compose something quite close as Pokemon kind of music (for the sound, instruments, with a rather playful vibes) but not as lighthearted in terms of mood. For the mood/atmosphere, it has to be more closed to something you would hear in a Final Fantasy/Grandia/Seiken Densetsu for example.

Ckan said:
My impression of the piece is that it's quite pleasant - almost dreamlike and comforting - moving through the motions. After a single play, it felt quite pleasantly familiar, but it doesn't have an especially memorable melody/motif. Which is fine for a battle theme, of course.

I see, this is very helpful to have your opinion since it differs to what I would think but also reinforce some other points you made. The lack of a "memorable/motif" is one of them for example. Even if you say it's fine, this is something I kind of see as a flaw and tried to work on it quite a lot these past month, maybe in vain. Perhaps this is because I compose too much parts and unintentionally lessen the impact a main theme/motif could have?

Ckan said:
It perhaps had an airy magical sort of feeling - I could see it being stereotyped for a female/gentle type character, but perhaps that's the 'soft and cute' you're trying to avoid?

Yes, this is precisely what I meant. I feel my music became more and more "feminine" these past years and as a result, it's now a bit difficult to compose something more 'intense', 'straightforward'. It always come off as soft. This is a particularity I don't especially want to rely too much on (as I'd like to keep things more flexible).

Also, thanks for the kind words Ckan, this is very appreciated.

worldeditor11 said:
This is not a battle theme. Not even by a longshot. If anything, this kind of music fits better as a pre-battle theme or one of the bgms used in dungeon exploration. I think dungeon fits more but I digress.

It is a good piece of game music but I will not label this as a battle theme.

This is how I can feel as well. It has this sort of Yousuke Yasui's dungeon/level vibes and it's one of the reason I'm concern about it.
Do you have some advices you could give me? Or some references tracks you can see more fitting as a battle theme?

Feb 24, 2017 10:03 PM

worldeditor11

Offline

Apr 2013

12542

Battle theme usually have these two distinctive traits, fast and hard. These kind of music tend to emphasise on both of them. However, having one but not the other does not mean it is not a battle theme, actually quite the opposite as stressing fast or hard/power themes tend to pump up battle sequences on screen to a whole new level. Composers also abuse the electric guitars quite a bit but orchestra works as well.

Power/Hard emphasis:
Devil Survivor 2 A New Order
Devil Survivor 2 Overseer of the World
Persona 4 Backside of TV - percussion

Fast/Speed emphasis:
Mana Khemia 2 Sacred Saber - electric guitar
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvaDVXbsf5w
Persona 3 Mass Destruction - rap

Fairy Tail music - electric guitar

Both:
SMT Nocturne Battle theme 1 guitar/percussion

Mana Khemia Nefertiti - piano/guitar
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPO2XhA5F3Q

You already have build up covered in your music so I won't touch that. But I will point out having a build-up is not a definite, but a method. Having powerful and fast notes going at the first beat works better if you have the notes right. Make it memorable and gamers should be pumped up for a battle, not feeling lethargic.

Oh yeah, and make sure it fits the game or the scene while it is playing. Unless the game you are composing for similar to Atelier Sophie which I am currently playing (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZjGXKrA51Y), you can dump everything I said earlier to the recycle bin. Otherwise, think what can you do to make the music capable of pumping up people spirits. That's pretty much it from a purely gamer/listener standpoint.

worldeditor11Feb 24, 2017 10:23 PM

Feb 24, 2017 11:39 PM

removed-user

Offline

Jul 2018

564612

The 'gamer/listener' standpoint is precisely what I'm looking for. I almost don't play games anymore, so it's good to have opinions and advices from people who can contextualize the music I share.

The 'fast/hard' traits you're talking about is a really good way to describe the common qualities of 'good' battle themes. I think that I see more clearly what is lacking in my attempt now.
Your examples are nice, and I like them all but I can't say I'll be able to emulate the style of some of them (especially the more rock-oriented one) for some reasons.
First one is I'm shit at making things with too much overdrive/distorded guitar. This is probably because I mainly listen to jazz (and all its subgenres) music and been classically trained, but I (unfortunately) know that I'm currently not very convincing when trying to make these kind of hard-rock music.
Second one is my client contacted me after coming across an other battle theme I made for an other project; a battle theme actually pretty similar to the Atelier Sophie's track you linked (this is the battle theme I'm talking about). It's a quite elegant theme with a piano/string quartet formation as the main instruments, so my client still expect me to keep some fantasy/dreamy-ish vibes into my work.

However, I wouldn't dump what you said to the recycle bin. Although something similar to the Atelier Sophie would be more the kind of thing I would naturally compose, this is not at all what I'm aiming for this project as it feels too cutesy and modern compared to the feeling I'm trying to convey. Perhaps this is the piano/violin combo, I don't know, but I'd like to rely more on brass instruments or even woodwind for example.

The SMT and Persona's tracks you linked are convincing example, I'd like to do something more close to these music. Btw, I think that some of your tracks feel more fitting to some boss battle, but I guess I catch what your intention are with those examples.
How I interpret it is great battle theme usually rely more on effective riffs/powerful breaks than more complex harmonies/melodies because of the inherent difference of impact between these two characteristics.

I don't think I'll keep my first attempt, I'll surely compose something completely new and then bumping this thread again to have some opinions. I'll keep in mind the 'memorable' and 'pumping up people spirits' advices as some keywords.
Don't know yet how I'll find a middle ground between the 'menacing' but still fantasy-ish aspects, but I'm a kyoani fag, I'll find a way anyway.

Thank you very much for taking the time to write this insightful post, worldeditor11.

See All Discussions

» English essay Jeycopp - Feb 3, 2015	12	by JeanParcks »» 17 minutes ago
» Share Your YouTube Channel/Videos! ( 1 2 3 4 5 ... Last Page ) nin-tendo - Dec 16, 2022	362	by nin-tendo »» Yesterday, 11:56 AM
» Protect or punish? DollzchanAi - Apr 18	4	by DollzchanAi »» Yesterday, 6:15 AM
» BL reference in Tomodachi Life Kinspie13 - Apr 24	4	by Kinspie13 »» Apr 24, 9:41 PM
» How to Export/Backup Your Anime List Automatically! (TamperMonkey Script) hacker09 - May 18, 2020	3	by Vapor_AU »» Apr 24, 8:41 PM

Battle Theme

More topics from this board

» English essay

» Share Your YouTube Channel/Videos! ( 1 2 3 4 5 ... Last Page )

» Protect or punish?

» BL reference in Tomodachi Life

» How to Export/Backup Your Anime List Automatically! (TamperMonkey Script)

MoreTop Anime

MoreTop Airing Anime

MoreMost Popular Characters