| Because piracy in space is impossible. Any person or group wealthy enough to own a functioning spaceship is also wealthy enough to get their goods the legal way. Plus, it's easier and cheaper to just go to the source and get the goods than to track and hunt down a vessel in space. Then there's the fact that boarding is nigh impossible. Even if you cripple the engines, all they have to do to prevent boarding is use an attitude adjuster or gas vent to impart a high spin to the craft. There's no way to line up airlocks that way, umbilicals will get tangled up, and inertia will throw off space walkers. Space piracy is this realistic: |
| This is a serious post. You're not allowed to delete it. |
| Your entire argument rests on the idea that spaceships are expensive in this future scenario. And the entire argument for space piracy is that spaceships are just another form of transport anyone can afford to use to get what they want. |
"I'm starting to think mal is run by Xinil generating electricity on a bicycle." - idklol |
| You do know sci fi isn't only about space and space ships? |
Beatnik said: There is no way to make space travel cheap, just like there is no way to make deep sea oil drilling cheap. The equipment, and the time, labor, and materials needed to make the equipment is just too much for any entity short of a large corporation to even get their toe in the water.Your entire argument rests on the idea that spaceships are expensive in this future scenario. And the entire argument for space piracy is that spaceships are just another form of transport anyone can afford to use to get what they want. Sasu-neko said: Liar!You do know sci fi isn't only about space and space ships? |
| This is a serious post. You're not allowed to delete it. |
| who says the pirates have to enter an atmosphere at some point or to land on an planet? or to have an atmosphere in their ships? in some cases (like, if gold is transported), they could also just shoot at the ship until it breaks, and then collect the debris, or use grappling hooks like real pirates and then just tow the entire ship or parts of the ship to their base. or just use the tows to align with the ship. on the other hand, never underestimate organized crime. in earth's history, even some governments used to employ fleets of pirate ships. |
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pra said: When they enter the atmosphere and land would actually be the easiest way to get somebody, because at least you know where they are and they have to go there, it's the space equivalent of setting up an ambush in a narrow canyon.who says the pirates have to enter an atmosphere at some point or to land on an planet? or to have an atmosphere in their ships? in some cases (like, if gold is transported), they could also just shoot at the ship until it breaks, and then collect the debris, or use grappling hooks like real pirates and then just tow the entire ship or parts of the ship to their base. or just use the tows to align with the ship. on the other hand, never underestimate organized crime. in earth's history, even some governments used to employ fleets of pirate ships. Grappling hooks in space would get really jacked up by the aforementioned spin. That's just a recipe for collision. Blasting apart a craft to get at it's cargo would guarantee a net loss. Things in space move. Things in space move really fast in all directions when blasting is applied. You would burn humongous amounts of fuel, or whatever energy source is your current favorite in order to gather it all in, much more money would be spent than could be regained by any possible cargo. |
| This is a serious post. You're not allowed to delete it. |
CDRW said: I bet that's what people were saying about cars when they were first introduced too, and planes.[There is no way to make space travel cheap, just like there is no way to make deep sea oil drilling cheap. The equipment, and the time, labor, and materials needed to make the equipment is just too much for any entity short of a large corporation to even get their toe in the water. Your first post is all based on today's technology, so no wonder it makes it sound stupid. Tracking down a vessel in space could be really really easy in fact. If we're talking some major shipping industry transporting high value goods, you only need some good intel and you'll know where the shipping routes go. You could probably plant double agents in the crew as well, or place some tracer thingmajing on the hull as the vessel leaves the space station or whatnot. And if we are talking large distance travel with fixed wormhole gates or whatnot, you'd just have to lie in wait to ambush the convoy as t emerge from the gate, or possibly a little further out so any station keeping forces don't spot you. And capturing a enemy ship would always be worth the effort, you do get the ship after all, and any precious cargo it may carry. As for the actual boarding, I really doubt your average transport crew would want to sacrifice their lives rather than surrender. And double agents onboard omits that problem entirely. |
| lol assumptions about future technology. |
 Old avatar and sig retired for now. |
ukonkivi said: In the future, we will all have thermoplasma generators the size of iPods to power our fabulous cyborg bodies.lol assumptions about future technology. And we will be able to shoot laser beams from our eyes, naturally. |
| I like this thread. |
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Baman said: I'm basing it on the assumption that there is no magic technology in use like wormholes and transporters. That brings things into the realm of fantasy and is a whole other ballgame. Plus, any cargo spacecraft would be several orders of magnitude bigger, more complex, and expensive than any car or plane, or even modern oceangoing vessel, so comparing it to cars does not work.CDRW said: I bet that's what people were saying about cars when they were first introduced too, and planes.[There is no way to make space travel cheap, just like there is no way to make deep sea oil drilling cheap. The equipment, and the time, labor, and materials needed to make the equipment is just too much for any entity short of a large corporation to even get their toe in the water. Your first post is all based on today's technology, so no wonder it makes it sound stupid. Tracking down a vessel in space could be really really easy in fact. If we're talking some major shipping industry transporting high value goods, you only need some good intel and you'll know where the shipping routes go. You could probably plant double agents in the crew as well, or place some tracer thingmajing on the hull as the vessel leaves the space station or whatnot. And if we are talking large distance travel with fixed wormhole gates or whatnot, you'd just have to lie in wait to ambush the convoy as t emerge from the gate, or possibly a little further out so any station keeping forces don't spot you. And capturing a enemy ship would always be worth the effort, you do get the ship after all, and any precious cargo it may carry. As for the actual boarding, I really doubt your average transport crew would want to sacrifice their lives rather than surrender. And double agents onboard omits that problem entirely. Capturing the enemy ship wouldn't be worth the effort and planning required to get at it. How many modern pirate operations do you hear about with sleeper agents and such not? That sort of thing is beyond the capacity of most pirates, and it is only reasonable that with operations as big as would be required for space transportation adequate background checks and security measures would be initiated. |
| This is a serious post. You're not allowed to delete it. |
CDRW said: I stopped reading here because he does sound like a guy in the 1800s talking about cars or airplanes... >.<I'm basing it on the assumption that there is no magic technology |
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seann said: La'cryma (protector of humanity) CDRW said: Sasu-neko said: Liar!You do know sci fi isn't only about space and space ships? Check this Sci-fi out, Noein, no space ships involved Shangri-La Dragon Calvary the only thing that can stop the invasion: the Dragon's Torque. That's science fiction? |
| This is a serious post. You're not allowed to delete it. |
| And there's no explosion in space, like the ones we can see in LoGH, Gundam, Macross and Top Wo Narea! Also pirates can steal their ships. |
HooHiraiBunnyNov 30, 2009 9:29 AM
CDRW said: seann said: La'cryma (protector of humanity) CDRW said: Sasu-neko said: Liar!You do know sci fi isn't only about space and space ships? Check this Sci-fi out, Noein, no space ships involved Shangri-La Dragon Calvary the only thing that can stop the invasion: the Dragon's Torque. That's science fiction? If youd seen it youd know... there are no real dragons involved in the anime |
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CDRW said: La'cryma (protector of humanity) Shangri-La Dragon Calvary the only thing that can stop the invasion: the Dragon's Torque. That's science fiction? It's both sci-fi and fantasy really, like Star Wars. |
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corbenic said: CDRW said: La'cryma (protector of humanity) Shangri-La Dragon Calvary the only thing that can stop the invasion: the Dragon's Torque. That's science fiction? It's both sci-fi and fantasy really, like Star Wars. exactly! |
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| It's science fantasy then, I think OP was only talking about pure science fiction. |
HooHiraiBunny said: It's science fantasy then, I think OP was only talking about pure science fiction. 'Pure' s-f is an elusive concept though. |
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HooHiraiBunny said: It's science fantasy then, I think OP was only talking about pure science fiction. And what exactly is pure Science Fiction? I may be wrong, but wasn't Frankenstein, which doesn't have anything to do with spaceships, the first book to be placed in the Sci fi genre? |
| Only science fiction, no mix with Fantasy. |
| Pure science fiction is fiction based on real current science and natural laws or a logical extrapolation thereof. |
| This is a serious post. You're not allowed to delete it. |
CDRW said: or a logical extrapolation thereof. But that can actually go very far into the realm of fantasy. |
|
| Why this thread is in Spam? |
| definition from websters Science Fiction is fictional event explained by science or natural laws. |
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HooHiraiBunny said: Because you get more intelligent responses here. ;)Why this thread is in Spam? |
| This is a serious post. You're not allowed to delete it. |
CDRW said: I thought we were talking about scifi here >__>I'm basing it on the assumption that there is no magic technology in use like wormholes and transporters. That brings things into the realm of fantasy and is a whole other ballgame. Plus, any cargo spacecraft would be several orders of magnitude bigger, more complex, and expensive than any car or plane, or even modern oceangoing vessel, so comparing it to cars does not work. But cars were expensive and complex at first too. Even a relatively simple invention like the Puckle gun didn't catch on simply because it was too technical and difficult to produce at the time. But today, we mass produce weapon several times as complex. Who is to say we do not achieve another industrial breakthrough?Capturing the enemy ship wouldn't be worth the effort and planning required to get at it. How many modern pirate operations do you hear about with sleeper agents and such not? That sort of thing is beyond the capacity of most pirates, and it is only reasonable that with operations as big as would be required for space transportation adequate background checks and security measures would be initiated.If the ships stay as expensive and precious as you say, then why on earth would it not be worth capturing one? Security measures are of no consequence, anyone can be bribed, any system can be breached if there is sufficient force and effort applied. In such a case, these pirates would obviously not likely be the traditional kind of pirates, but more akin to corporate hired guns, privateers deployed to obstruct the business of rival corporations. So it should be far from impossible. HooHiraiBunny said: Well, the explosions are still there, you just don't get to see those nice fireballs due to the lack of air. But then again, there might be small ones if a ship has a lot of oxygen or somesuch in it.And there's no explosion in space, like the ones we can see in LoGH, Gundam, Macross and Top Wo Narea! |
| All that is needed in order to make space travelling feasible and reasonably common is a better energy source. Is it so far-fetched to believe we will have one in the future? Way I see it, it's inevitable (assuming of course we can keep progressing as a species). Even if we don't figure out any 'magical' way to travel long distances in space (wormholes or whatnot), we can keep exploring the solar system. |
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| If anything I think realistic depictions of explosions in space would look more 'cinematic' than what we usually get. One of the things that bug me about LotGH is the gay pink puffs of smoke when a ship goes down. Seriously. |
"I'm starting to think mal is run by Xinil generating electricity on a bicycle." - idklol |
| Also, may I add that wormholes aren't really magical? Last time I checked, there were some more or less scientific theories about it. Which also makes it Scifi and not scifantasy. Hyperspace and similar exotic dimensional traveling is more of a stretch obviously. And if wormholes can be made, and we become able to force upon gates at will, FTL travel isn't going to be a concern anymore, we just won't need it. |
corbenic said: There's a lot more required than that, energy source is only the most immediate and obvious of the problems. There's plenty of other interstellar exploration killing hurdles to overcome.All that is needed in order to make space travelling feasible and reasonably common is a better energy source. Is it so far-fetched to believe we will have one in the future? Way I see it, it's inevitable (assuming of course we can keep progressing as a species). Even if we don't figure out any 'magical' way to travel long distances in space (wormholes or whatnot), we can keep exploring the solar system. As far as realism in science fiction goes, Planetes is probably the best thing to check out this side of golden age sci-fi literature. |
| This is a serious post. You're not allowed to delete it. |
| But there'd be no need for bounty hunters then !!! |
Beatnik said: Indeed, a real spaceship exploding would show the entire thing breaking up and having wreckage and shit flying everywhere. But such details isn't something people often bother to make, so just throwing in a big puff of smoke and fire and maybe a couple of pieces of debris afterward is much easier. Deplorable really.If anything I think realistic depictions of explosions in space would look more 'cinematic' than what we usually get. One of the things that bug me about LotGH is the gay pink puffs of smoke when a ship goes down. Seriously. But were there pink puffs in LoGH? I can only recall gray-ish ones. I do remember SEED had lots of gay pink explosions at least. But that isn't a surprise I guess. |
Baman said: Also, may I add that wormholes aren't really magical? Last time I checked, there were some more or less scientific theories about it. Which also makes it Scifi and not scifantasy. Hyperspace and similar exotic dimensional traveling is more of a stretch obviously. And if wormholes can be made, and we become able to force upon gates at will, FTL travel isn't going to be a concern anymore, we just won't need it. Of course they are not, afaik they are predicted by General Relativity (someone correct if I'm wrong). But seriously, with quantum physics or, say, string theory (which is quite a stretch really), what doesn't seem too far-fetched nowadays? God maybe. I say 'magical' because not only using it is way beyond our capability, but so is even verifying its existence (although sudden breakthroughs happen, let's not count on it too much). Then there's the fact that assuming they're there or we can generate it, just slipping through one to the other side is not really that simple. |
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| I could have sworn explosions in LotGH were pink or purple... This thread title really is silly. Also, I'd say in a future with common space travel smuggling would be more pervasive than piracy, but I guess they're both the same thing anyway. Anyone used to play the classic space-smuggling game Elite? Good times. |
"I'm starting to think mal is run by Xinil generating electricity on a bicycle." - idklol |
| Smuggling would only really be a deal if you have a lot of colonies and space industry that you can leech off of. Most likely, at least the first space industry endeavours, like mining our asteroid belts and such, would be completely controlled by whichever company initiated the project, so getting anything that's not already paid for and predestined for some location would be unlikely. We'd have to have gone through a space industry boom with many cheap opportunities for smuggling to become a reality I'd think. |
| I think there's something worst than pink explosions. |
CDRW said: i lol'dHooHiraiBunny said: Because you get more intelligent responses here. ;)Why this thread is in Spam? |
| Needs more Drill Hair. |
Lailide said: CDRW said: i lol'dHooHiraiBunny said: Because you get more intelligent responses here. ;)Why this thread is in Spam? Best part is, it's sometimes true. |
|
| Death is our future. |
| poooooooooooop. |
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