| I've read a discussion recently titled: "why the anime is too fast! even with fillers?" I will tell you the reason as to why the anime catches up with the manga so quickly even with the fillers. I will compare between two mangas regardless of their names but nevertheless I will use One Piece as an example for better understanding. -The manga material: did you ever notice that even though One Piece is nearly 30 chapters away from the manga, it seems just too far away & it will surely not catch up with the manga even at the rate they are doing at the moment but Bleach is a different case, even though the manga can sometimes be ahead for nearly 30 chapters or more, it STILL catches up!! no matter how many fillers they squeeze into the anime. I want you to compare the dialogue in each chapter between One Piece & Bleach, what's the difference? In One Piece the chapter has enough material for 1 Full episode & sometimes 1 episode & a half, as for Bleach they can hardly make an episode without using up nearly 2 chapters, with some filler here and there, they'll make it into one chapter, sometimes barely, there is enough text in each chapter of One Piece, you can rarely find a Chapter with few text, even the fansubbers have a hard time subbing the chapters (ask Franky House XD) for example: Bleach chapter 347, WOW!! what a chapter!! The anime could do it in 5 minutes!! (ok maybe 7 XD) very few dialogue, lots of whining, crying & screaming, what a waste of pages. One Piece on the other hand is a total opposite!! read any chapter released lately & you'll find out the difference without the need for me to tell you. -Action + Plot: This combination lacks in Bleach at the moment, it still has action (few at the present) but completely lacks good dialogue/plot, can any of the Bleach fans here tell me the last reasonable/good conversation you've read in Bleach in the last 10 chapters? I couldn't find any!! all I read was "You've gotten a lot stronger" "No, you've gotten stronger" "I should have gotten rid of you" "I will Destroy you!!" One Piece has this excellent combination, Oda manages to add action & great dialogue/conversation when needed, there is no useless action or meaningless dialogue (ok, there are some but at least they are funny XD) In the end, the way Oda manages his manga is the one of the reasons the anime is running all high & mighty, otherwise it would have become sloppy like Bleach, even Naruto manages to pull out some great chapters with lots of useful dialogue & action. -Side stories: Bleach side story, Turn Back The Pendulum, took only 12 chapters O_O it was supposed to be a side story in which we know what happened & get to know the characters more but we only knew what happened.......that's it, there were no real character development, even some characters weren't even introduced such as: 10th Division Captain, 11th Division Captain & The 7th division Captain (I wonder if I forgot anyone) why?! it could have made the whole arc better, the anime had some fillers in them which really fitted in but that wasn't enough cuz i ended as quickly as it began. One Piece has side stories in almost every chapter which consist of 1 page per chapter, though sometimes they are irrelevant. another example is Naruto, it has well paced side stories, that take a good amount of time & has good ending with character development though the anime is quite lost at the moment, no matter how bad or good the chapters are, the anime will never catch up at the pace they're going at XD If anyone here doesn't read One Piece, you can compare it with some other shonen like: Slam Dunk, Gintama & others to get my point. First The manga should improve so that the anime can do the same!! If the manga fails to do so, then so will the anime. |
ZatoichiMay 4, 2009 4:13 PM
| "Every man shall reap what he has sown, from the highest lord to the lowest gutter rat. And some will lose more than the tips off their fingers, I promise you. They have made my kingdom bleed, and I do not forget that" |
| The biggest problem the Bleach manga has is its dialouge and the waste of pages, for example drawing of feet. I mean wtf? One Piece on the other hand has a lot of dialouge, I use more than 2 minutes reading a One Piece chapter. Tite needs to get his ass on the dialouge for once. Eventhough the Bleach drawings are fantastic. (Yeah, I love the style) |
Tyrfing said: s thread is a Onepiecetard-rant (though maybe justified lol) against Bleach? you jugded this by his avatar ?? you are retarded |
smokes said: Well I for one don't see the point in writing One Piece in 8 freaking times in a Bleach forum.Tyrfing said: s thread is a Onepiecetard-rant (though maybe justified lol) against Bleach? you jugded this by his avatar ?? you are retarded @topicstarter: If you hadn't started about One Piece then I could have taken you serieusly. Cuz you might have a point... Now all I can get myself to say is GTFO onepiecetard! |
| "Never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what it might appear to others that what you were or might have been was not otherwise than what you had been would have appeared to them to be otherwise" |
| This is the point I have been stating mny times, and my friend you have caught it on the nail bravo! When I decide to get my point across about Kubo's laziness which I am just discussing not as some would say hating, you should know how competent these people which argue an opinion are! Kubo is....how should I put this.... getting very lazy and judging from the anime itself he cannot be bothered anymore. I mean he knows the series is popular around the world so why imporve it, he is getting enough revenue so he does not give much about dialogue because the story is simple (shonen) one antoganist trying to take over one protagonist trying to save. Judging from that and the characters he has introduced he is as i said either getting lazy or he does not have enough time to improve the story because it is coming to an end and he dug himself a hole which he cannot get out of, that was by introducing too many characters and no space to develope them.  |
ArcheteoMay 4, 2009 1:39 PM
Remus_Lupa said: smokes said: Well I for one don't see the point in writing One Piece in 8 freaking times in a Bleach forum.Tyrfing said: s thread is a Onepiecetard-rant (though maybe justified lol) against Bleach? you jugded this by his avatar ?? you are retarded @topicstarter: If you hadn't started about One Piece then I could have taken you serieusly. Cuz you might have a point... Now all I can get myself to say is GTFO onepiecetard! Oh come on, you're even more retarded then the third poster. Who fucking cares if he mentioned One Piece. Comparing is allowed. He compared One Piece because the chapters and episodes are actually closer than the Bleach chapters and episodes, but One Piece still manages to be far away from the anime, why? Because of the things he listed. It's much better to explain his point by comparing with a manga/anime that is doing good. |
Pineappledishes said: Remus_Lupa said: smokes said: Well I for one don't see the point in writing One Piece in 8 freaking times in a Bleach forum.Tyrfing said: s thread is a Onepiecetard-rant (though maybe justified lol) against Bleach? you jugded this by his avatar ?? you are retarded @topicstarter: If you hadn't started about One Piece then I could have taken you serieusly. Cuz you might have a point... Now all I can get myself to say is GTFO onepiecetard! Oh come on, you're even more retarded then the third poster. Who fucking cares if he mentioned One Piece. Comparing is allowed. He compared One Piece because the chapters and episodes are actually closer than the Bleach chapters and episodes, but One Piece still manages to be far away from the anime, why? Because of the things he listed. It's much better to explain his point by comparing with a manga/anime that is doing good. Exactly!! I have nothing against Bleach, it used to be one of my favorites, I only used One Piece as a comparison, Remus_Lupa you are blinded by your love for Bleach, I'm just stating some facts, DEAL WITH IT!! if you weren't so dumb you Could have AT LEAST finished reading what I wrote. Zatoichi said: "If anyone here doesn't read One Piece, you can compare it with some other shonen like: Slam Dunk, Gintama & others to get my point." |
| "Every man shall reap what he has sown, from the highest lord to the lowest gutter rat. And some will lose more than the tips off their fingers, I promise you. They have made my kingdom bleed, and I do not forget that" |
Sami092 said: This is the point I have been stating mny times, and my friend you have caught it on the nail bravo! When I decide to get my point across about Kubo's laziness which I am just discussing not as some would say hating, you should know how competent these people which argue an opinion are! Kubo is....how should I put this.... getting very lazy and judging from the anime itself he cannot be bothered anymore. I mean he knows the series is popular around the world so why imporve it, he is getting enough revenue so he does not give much about dialogue because the story is simple (shonen) one antoganist trying to take over one protagonist trying to save. Judging from that and the characters he has introduced he is as i said either getting lazy or he does not have enough time to improve the story because it is coming to an end and he dug himself a hole which he cannot get out of, that was by introducing too many characters and no space to develope them. No, Bravo to you mate XD You've got a point there, time is a factor but maybe Kubo only thought about the story towards the Soul Society arc & maybe the one after it, he probably didn't really plan this far ahead. Kudos to you 2 Pineappledishes XD, you got my point!! |
| "Every man shall reap what he has sown, from the highest lord to the lowest gutter rat. And some will lose more than the tips off their fingers, I promise you. They have made my kingdom bleed, and I do not forget that" |
Zatoichi said: but maybe Kubo only thought about the story towards the Soul Society arc & maybe the one after it, he probably didn't really plan this far ahead. lol))) although i also dont see anything after "Aizen" arc... maybe misterious warriors will appear in SS, and Ichigo will have to fight them XDDD and after that again, and again....))) |
| Both Bleach and Tittie Kubo have to been lazy lately. I agree with you on that. I hardly watch the anime anymore and it used to be my favorite... It just pisses me of that OnePiecetards think they can bash Bleach and nobdy is allowed to bash their OnePiece. Saying that it's super awesome while it's mediocre at best just like the recent Bleach chapters but who cares. |
| "Never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what it might appear to others that what you were or might have been was not otherwise than what you had been would have appeared to them to be otherwise" |
Remus_Lupa said: Both Bleach and Tittie Kubo have to been lazy lately. I agree with you on that. I hardly watch the anime anymore and it used to be my favorite... It just pisses me of that OnePiecetards think they can bash Bleach and nobdy is allowed to bash their OnePiece. Saying that it's super awesome while it's mediocre at best just like the recent Bleach chapters but who cares. I spoke of the content for the chapter regardless of the manga, If you don't like One Piece then Compare it with any other manga just like I said at the end, I wouldn't have compared it to One Piece if I knew some retard won't get my REAL point!! Read it one more time, MAYBE you'll understand what I'm saying!! |
| "Every man shall reap what he has sown, from the highest lord to the lowest gutter rat. And some will lose more than the tips off their fingers, I promise you. They have made my kingdom bleed, and I do not forget that" |
smokes said: Zatoichi said: but maybe Kubo only thought about the story towards the Soul Society arc & maybe the one after it, he probably didn't really plan this far ahead. lol))) although i also dont see anything after "Aizen" arc... maybe misterious warriors will appear in SS, and Ichigo will have to fight them XDDD and after that again, and again....))) You know that thing that appeared behind Aizen when he "Escaped" maybe that thing will show up XD |
| "Every man shall reap what he has sown, from the highest lord to the lowest gutter rat. And some will lose more than the tips off their fingers, I promise you. They have made my kingdom bleed, and I do not forget that" |
| Zatoichi san you got a point, gotta agree with ya, not with the comparison tho, as I haven't watched, nor read one piece so far. One thing that you may have missed is that, -at least to me- what Kubo intended to do was, probably, create some really great battles, which was one of Bleach strongest points. But, it didn't worked out and you could say it backfired. I'M AM A BLEACH FAN, But, sorry guys, the battles in the Hueco Mundo after the clash between Ichigo and Grimjow, were a big letdown (Not that the ones before were that great too, but w/e). The episodes in general, and animation was mediocre, even as a fan I find hard to say they were OK. Now you see, you get an whole chapter from the manga focused in a fight, with illustrations using an entire page of it, and then, when it get animated, it sucks. The anime needed an special attention to make 'em look. I'm one of those who think the anime should take a break, instead of running simultaneously with the manga, catching up with it. That would be a lot better for the anime itself, for fans and the creator, but hey, it's not like they cared about anything as long its profitable, right? So you have an manga mainly focused on action, with everything else in second place, and when it get animated it doesn't even get the attention it needs, as it was some random fighting, so no wonder it's catching up. And about story, Kubo Tite created a fucking whole world to explore, but it's up to him. Yeah, he and whoever works w/ him should sit the fuck down and work, Bleach still has a lot of potential... |
     |
Tyrfing said: I know that Bleach has a lot of flaws.... but... so basically this thread is a Onepiecetard-rant (though maybe justified lol) against Bleach? retard |
 |
| Really? I mean I can see good points from both sides, and using comparisons as supporting evidence is a key facet of debate. The "retard" card is being thrown around way to much in this thread. Is it to much to ask that some civility be maintained and the topic be discussed for its merits as opposed to digging a trench on either side of a perceived fence and then slinging mud? Back to the topic at hand. It's certainly a decent analysis of why Bleach is running into problems. I personally have never read the One Piece manga so the full weight of the comparisons doesn't necessarily translate for me, but I understand the gist of what's being said, which is more dialogue and less could-be-omitted pictures. Certainly one of the traps all shonen are bound to fall in is lack of creative energy, considering the average length of a well-condensed anime series is around 25 episodes, it's no surprise that Tite is running out of steam. I'm not ready to say he's "milking the franchise", it hasn't amounted to that at this point, but it does seem like he could use some creative epiphany to regain his form. |
 |
smokes said: They only do that during filler arcs.Zatoichi said: but maybe Kubo only thought about the story towards the Soul Society arc & maybe the one after it, he probably didn't really plan this far ahead. lol))) although i also dont see anything after "Aizen" arc... maybe misterious warriors will appear in SS, and Ichigo will have to fight them XDDD and after that again, and again....))) But at the moment we still have the Vizards, Urahara, Isshin Kurosaki, Arrow Lad's dad & Shirosaki to further the plot. Not to mention we still have a few Espada running around. Zatoichi lol @ u a onepiecetard calling me a retard. *ignores topic* |
Remus_LupaMay 5, 2009 1:05 AM
| "Never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what it might appear to others that what you were or might have been was not otherwise than what you had been would have appeared to them to be otherwise" |
Zatoichi said: Sami092 said: This is the point I have been stating mny times, and my friend you have caught it on the nail bravo! When I decide to get my point across about Kubo's laziness which I am just discussing not as some would say hating, you should know how competent these people which argue an opinion are! Kubo is....how should I put this.... getting very lazy and judging from the anime itself he cannot be bothered anymore. I mean he knows the series is popular around the world so why imporve it, he is getting enough revenue so he does not give much about dialogue because the story is simple (shonen) one antoganist trying to take over one protagonist trying to save. Judging from that and the characters he has introduced he is as i said either getting lazy or he does not have enough time to improve the story because it is coming to an end and he dug himself a hole which he cannot get out of, that was by introducing too many characters and no space to develope them. No, Bravo to you mate XD You've got a point there, time is a factor but maybe Kubo only thought about the story towards the Soul Society arc & maybe the one after it, he probably didn't really plan this far ahead. Kudos to you 2 Pineappledishes XD, you got my point!! Thanks, finally someone gets the point I am expressing, I wish other incompetent fools would understand and lessen their need of attempted contradiction! However he is not bashing Bleach, he is just expressing an opinion about content, and if anything One Piece is a prime example of content as it is a long ongoing manga, which I have heard is a very complex and has a lot of dialogue. |
ArcheteoMay 5, 2009 1:32 AM
Remus_Lupa said: smokes said: They only do that during filler arcs.Zatoichi said: but maybe Kubo only thought about the story towards the Soul Society arc & maybe the one after it, he probably didn't really plan this far ahead. lol))) although i also dont see anything after "Aizen" arc... maybe misterious warriors will appear in SS, and Ichigo will have to fight them XDDD and after that again, and again....))) But at the moment we still have the Vizards, Urahara, Isshin Kurosaki, Arrow Lad's dad & Shirosaki to further the plot. Not to mention we still have a few Espada running around. Zatoichi lol @ u a onepiecetard calling me a retard. *ignores topic* Finally!! thank you for leaving, go back to your profile & spell Ecomnomics right. |
| "Every man shall reap what he has sown, from the highest lord to the lowest gutter rat. And some will lose more than the tips off their fingers, I promise you. They have made my kingdom bleed, and I do not forget that" |
AugustusLucifer said: Really? I mean I can see good points from both sides, and using comparisons as supporting evidence is a key facet of debate. The "retard" card is being thrown around way to much in this thread. Is it to much to ask that some civility be maintained and the topic be discussed for its merits as opposed to digging a trench on either side of a perceived fence and then slinging mud? Back to the topic at hand. It's certainly a decent analysis of why Bleach is running into problems. I personally have never read the One Piece manga so the full weight of the comparisons doesn't necessarily translate for me, but I understand the gist of what's being said, which is more dialogue and less could-be-omitted pictures. Certainly one of the traps all shonen are bound to fall in is lack of creative energy, considering the average length of a well-condensed anime series is around 25 episodes, it's no surprise that Tite is running out of steam. I'm not ready to say he's "milking the franchise", it hasn't amounted to that at this point, but it does seem like he could use some creative epiphany to regain his form. First: I'm sorry for using the term Retard, it's my fault for losing patience with "Some" Second: You've got a point too, regarding the bound to fall in is lack of creative energy in shonen nowadays, I really hope Bleach gets back to being as awesome as it once was, maybe it'll regain some greatness since now he is focusing on 1 fight rather than 4 to 5 fights at the same time. |
| "Every man shall reap what he has sown, from the highest lord to the lowest gutter rat. And some will lose more than the tips off their fingers, I promise you. They have made my kingdom bleed, and I do not forget that" |
R-Zero said: Zatoichi san you got a point, gotta agree with ya, not with the comparison tho, as I haven't watched, nor read one piece so far. One thing that you may have missed is that, -at least to me- what Kubo intended to do was, probably, create some really great battles, which was one of Bleach strongest points. But, it didn't worked out and you could say it backfired. I'M AM A BLEACH FAN, But, sorry guys, the battles in the Hueco Mundo after the clash between Ichigo and Grimjow, were a big letdown (Not that the ones before were that great too, but w/e). The episodes in general, and animation was mediocre, even as a fan I find hard to say they were OK. Now you see, you get an whole chapter from the manga focused in a fight, with illustrations using an entire page of it, and then, when it get animated, it sucks. The anime needed an special attention to make 'em look. I'm one of those who think the anime should take a break, instead of running simultaneously with the manga, catching up with it. That would be a lot better for the anime itself, for fans and the creator, but hey, it's not like they cared about anything as long its profitable, right? So you have an manga mainly focused on action, with everything else in second place, and when it get animated it doesn't even get the attention it needs, as it was some random fighting, so no wonder it's catching up. And about story, Kubo Tite created a fucking whole world to explore, but it's up to him. Yeah, he and whoever works w/ him should sit the fuck down and work, Bleach still has a lot of potential... I agree with you on the part on how Bleach has a lot of potential, I mean look at the cast, some say they are mediocre but I think that if they were developed and he concentrates on developing the plot more, it would be as good as some others. But the chances of that happening are second to none, but who says we cannot be optimistic?! |
Remus_Lupa said: It just pisses me of that OnePiecetards think they can bash Bleach and nobdy is allowed to bash their OnePiece. Saying that it's super awesome while it's mediocre at best just like the recent Bleach chapters but who cares. This here proves how RETARDED (Oh shit I used it again) you are. He's not here to bash Bleach god damn it, he's here to share why Bleach is doing so poorly. And by Comparing One Piece which is doing good, he can prove his point better. And he never said nobody is allowed to bash on One Piece, just dont do it here as this is a discussion of BLEACH not ONE PIECE, its only a comparison! Now put on your big girl pants and move on please. And fyi, it is super awesome, it's been super awesome for almost a year now. Anyway, I agree with the poster above, Bleach could actually be way better than One Piece because of its potential. If it had been on the same path as it was before and in Soul Society, it could easily have topped the three popular anime/mangas. But Tite is clearly lazy since he has little dialouge and he draws feet. Case closed, Zatoichi, you hit it spot on of what Bleachs' problem is. Bleach fanboys can just gtfo. |
Remus_Lupa said: It just pisses me of that OnePiecetards think they can bash Bleach and nobdy is allowed to bash their OnePiece. Saying that it's super awesome while it's mediocre at best just like the recent Bleach chapters but who cares. :slap: he was just comparing the volume of the one piece manga with bleach manga... you can see that OP is twice bigger that bleach one... THATS why anime catches manga so quickly X(( |
| Speaking of whats after the "Aizen" arc, I think it's Ichigos inner hollow. He already swore revenge the last time they talked. It's a shame they blew this character off. |
 |
| Hey we need to get Bakayaro in here. He likes ranting about how Bleach is going down the tubes. No I haven't read that far in the manga, he's at the current chapter. But he told me that they recently had a an all white background, with the kanji for "heart" on it. One page, "the heart". Now that's pretty lame. And the fact that Kubo likes his blackgrounds. It's pretty lame on Kubo's part really. :( And sad for Bleach. This topic makes me fume, and I'm not even that far ahead. Haha. |
 |
Kirky said: H But he told me that they recently had a an all white background, with the kanji for "heart" on it. One page, "the heart". Now that's pretty lame. yeah this sux balls. its on this chapter.... http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/354/ |
| If he didn't waste pages like that, that chapter would have been great... |
|
| Here is another example: I randomly chose a page from a chapter, One Piece & Bleach Here is a page from One Piece: Just take a look at how much text is added in each panel *Don't worry, there are no spoilers, I covered the text* Here is the Bleach one: *No spoilers as well, covered up the text* Notice anything different? there is much unused space in the first/last panel, what Ishida said could have been added in the first panel yet it's just left blank what Inoue is going to say in the next page, could have been summed up in the last panel as well, Kubo must use this space in a more efficient way!! |
| "Every man shall reap what he has sown, from the highest lord to the lowest gutter rat. And some will lose more than the tips off their fingers, I promise you. They have made my kingdom bleed, and I do not forget that" |
| we know about that) |
| Random page tests aren't exactly fair but it's obvious pacing is Bleach's biggest problem. And it's not just that it lets the anime catch up, I think it decreases the filler quality as well. If Kubo squeezed more action and dialogues (=character development) in, it'd give the animation studio more material to work with when they do have to make stuff up. As it is, they just don't have enough info on the characters' personalities and fighting styles to make the added scenes interesting. The way Kubo completely has been completely focusing on one or two important situations lately doesn't help either. Right now there's two major battles going on and the vizards are wandering around somewhere and that's pretty much all that's happening in the whole universe. When all they have is fighting, the only thing they can do is slow everything down and add a few more attacks here and there but that's not enough to stay behind the manga.. |
Nyuu3Jun 12, 2009 10:33 AM
| Bleach is actually awesome until it hit like the filler with that fake captain and from there everything went downnnn. The only thing that keeps me going is just the captains and the epic OSTs. |
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