Separate rating lists by genre for more fair comparisons

Yesterday, 3:12 AM

Offline

Sep 2018

5285

Reply to Mathi786

@Nirinbo OMG. Do you know how hypotheticals work? I wouldn't be up there and you're right. But I'm asking you to imagine if it was up there. Would that be fair. The answer is no.

So than why are all these romance shows up there without deserving to be there?

Do you understand what I'm saying?

@Mathi786 Kaoru Hana wa MID to Saku doesn't deserve to be up there because of recency bias (time will fix that, 57% of recommended reviews is super low and proves that the score will get worse over time), not because it's a romance anime and thus inherently worse than any anime about saving the world from a bigger threat. Actually masterpiece romance anime like Nana do deserve to be rated higher than AoT.

Yesterday, 3:24 AM

#102

B1G2B3N

Offline

Aug 2024

20

Reply to Mathi786

@Krautschi my thing should be by default. without any filters.

To discover anime, there can be a saperate page that can show ratings of every anime but rankings shouldn't be decided like it's decided currently

@Mathi786 so suddenly global Ranking is fine? but as an extra and should not be deleted? you jusg contradicted yourself

Yesterday, 3:33 AM

#103

certifiedbinger

Offline

Jan 2021

1999

Mathi786 said:
@certifiedbinger But you literally said it's broken. You all agree that current ranking system isn't accurate.
Now why are you backtracking it?

Either you're confusing me with someone else, or you're not even reading what I said lol
Give me a single quote on when I agreed you, if you can find it, all my posts are unedited.

I've constantly dunked on your logic, and I don't agree with you on a single point.

I asked you to give me a reason why this idea of yours is good, except giving you validation because you feel hurt because of numbers. You haven't done that yet.

Yesterday, 5:05 AM

#104

ktg

Offline

May 2016

2072

The_Spectre_01 said:
There'd be a huge problem if Kaoru Hana had plot holes given how basic it's story is. A show with zero ambitious writing that plays it safe 100% should not be compared to AOT. That's disrespectful asf.

The_Spectre_01 said:
it's story is. A show with zero ambitious writing that plays it safe 100% should not be compared to AOT. That's disrespectful asf.

What would you choose to eat? A vomit that was created by someone who tried to create the best cake or a boring, bland bread that was created by someone who wanted to create a boring bread? Because you just made the argument that you would choose the vomit because it tried to do something exceptional.
No, normal human beings do not want to eat vomit like you want.

In reality we are not meant to rate what a show wanted to be, because we cannot even be sure about that, we are meant to rate the final product. So yes, something being average is generally better than something being bad, just to answer your question.

While we call it plot hole, it also refers to characters. In KaoHana the complex characters could have been inconsistent and their personalities and actions could have introduced plot holes. So no, it's not a simplicity question. Half of the cast is simplistic in SnK and you can still find character-related plot holes. Actually one of the biggest one is related to character.

Just to talk about the ratings. Everyone has their own rating system, so I'm not gonna use numbers, but describe it on a scale of very bad - bad - average - good - very good. SnK is slightly above average all in all with its final season. If your average is 5, then it can be a 6, if your average is 7, it should be a 7.5. KaoHana is a really strong romance with complex and consistent characters so far, it's a show between good and really good. Monster is the strongest among the 3, it's a very good show.

Mathi786 said:
Buddy if you think after year of amazing animation and hard work , amazing plot twist but having bad last season can make AOT worse than a complete low mod show like KaoHana, than I guess you don't have enough brain cells

That's simply a fallacy. The animators do hard work on every project even if it turns out to be an Ex-Arm. Hardwork itself won't create good shows.
Also, it's not a "single" last season, because that was released as 3 different season and when you average 3 from good to very good seasons with 3 from less than good to below average seasons, then the outcome is not great. It's below good and above average.

While KaoHana is actually more consistent, so yes, easily better OBJECTIVELY.

Yesterday, 5:36 AM

#105

Mathi786

Offline

Feb 2020

506

Reply to Nirinbo

@Mathi786 Kaoru Hana wa MID to Saku doesn't deserve to be up there because of recency bias (time will fix that, 57% of recommended reviews is super low and proves that the score will get worse over time), not because it's a romance anime and thus inherently worse than any anime about saving the world from a bigger threat. Actually masterpiece romance anime like Nana do deserve to be rated higher than AoT.

@Nirinbo Talk about the system, do you think it works or not?
if not than why not. stop talking specific animes

Yesterday, 5:37 AM

#106

Mathi786

Offline

Feb 2020

506

Reply to B1G2B3N

@Mathi786 so suddenly global Ranking is fine? but as an extra and should not be deleted? you jusg contradicted yourself

@B1G2B3N no I think you misunderstood something. I'm not saying global ranking is fine. I'm just saying a list that can be used to discover good anime is fine. Ranking has nothing to do with it

Yesterday, 5:38 AM

#107

Mathi786

Offline

Feb 2020

506

Reply to certifiedbinger

Mathi786 said:
@certifiedbinger But you literally said it's broken. You all agree that current ranking system isn't accurate.
Now why are you backtracking it?

Either you're confusing me with someone else, or you're not even reading what I said lol
Give me a single quote on when I agreed you, if you can find it, all my posts are unedited.

I've constantly dunked on your logic, and I don't agree with you on a single point.

I asked you to give me a reason why this idea of yours is good, except giving you validation because you feel hurt because of numbers. You haven't done that yet.

@certifiedbinger You literally said you understand.
Ok look, tell me one thing, do you think current ranking system had absolutely no problems?

Yesterday, 5:41 AM

#108

Mathi786

Offline

Feb 2020

506

Reply to ktg

The_Spectre_01 said:
There'd be a huge problem if Kaoru Hana had plot holes given how basic it's story is. A show with zero ambitious writing that plays it safe 100% should not be compared to AOT. That's disrespectful asf.

The_Spectre_01 said:
it's story is. A show with zero ambitious writing that plays it safe 100% should not be compared to AOT. That's disrespectful asf.

What would you choose to eat? A vomit that was created by someone who tried to create the best cake or a boring, bland bread that was created by someone who wanted to create a boring bread? Because you just made the argument that you would choose the vomit because it tried to do something exceptional.
No, normal human beings do not want to eat vomit like you want.

In reality we are not meant to rate what a show wanted to be, because we cannot even be sure about that, we are meant to rate the final product. So yes, something being average is generally better than something being bad, just to answer your question.

While we call it plot hole, it also refers to characters. In KaoHana the complex characters could have been inconsistent and their personalities and actions could have introduced plot holes. So no, it's not a simplicity question. Half of the cast is simplistic in SnK and you can still find character-related plot holes. Actually one of the biggest one is related to character.

Just to talk about the ratings. Everyone has their own rating system, so I'm not gonna use numbers, but describe it on a scale of very bad - bad - average - good - very good. SnK is slightly above average all in all with its final season. If your average is 5, then it can be a 6, if your average is 7, it should be a 7.5. KaoHana is a really strong romance with complex and consistent characters so far, it's a show between good and really good. Monster is the strongest among the 3, it's a very good show.

Mathi786 said:
Buddy if you think after year of amazing animation and hard work , amazing plot twist but having bad last season can make AOT worse than a complete low mod show like KaoHana, than I guess you don't have enough brain cells

That's simply a fallacy. The animators do hard work on every project even if it turns out to be an Ex-Arm. Hardwork itself won't create good shows.
Also, it's not a "single" last season, because that was released as 3 different season and when you average 3 from good to very good seasons with 3 from less than good to below average seasons, then the outcome is not great. It's below good and above average.

While KaoHana is actually more consistent, so yes, easily better OBJECTIVELY.

@ktg Everything you said is nonsense, if you think AOT is a bad show than you're probably just edgy kid trying to be cool by disagreeing with everything.

Nothing more than that

Yesterday, 6:03 AM

#109

certifiedbinger

Offline

Jan 2021

1999

Mathi786 said:
@certifiedbinger You literally said you understand.
Ok look, tell me one thing, do you think current ranking system had absolutely no problems?

I understand why you're feeling hurt. Doesn't mean I agree with anything you have to say. That's why I'm sympathizing with you, not because you're making sense lol

There are issues with scoring, but those have NOTHING to do with what you're proposing.
All I'm against is spamming votes and fake accounts, which are already being purged regularly, so yes, there are no problems with the current system.

I'm not replying to you anymore, because despite asking multiple times, you have given me ZERO arguments for this change, other than the fact that your feelings got hurt. I've got better things to do.
I've already reported this thread for not encouraging discussion, and I hope it gets nuked soon.

Bye.

Mod Edit: Removed baiting.

Twintail_Daemon8 hours ago

Yesterday, 6:31 AM

#110

The_Spectre_01

Offline

Oct 2024

240

Reply to ktg

The_Spectre_01 said:
There'd be a huge problem if Kaoru Hana had plot holes given how basic it's story is. A show with zero ambitious writing that plays it safe 100% should not be compared to AOT. That's disrespectful asf.

The_Spectre_01 said:
it's story is. A show with zero ambitious writing that plays it safe 100% should not be compared to AOT. That's disrespectful asf.

What would you choose to eat? A vomit that was created by someone who tried to create the best cake or a boring, bland bread that was created by someone who wanted to create a boring bread? Because you just made the argument that you would choose the vomit because it tried to do something exceptional.
No, normal human beings do not want to eat vomit like you want.

In reality we are not meant to rate what a show wanted to be, because we cannot even be sure about that, we are meant to rate the final product. So yes, something being average is generally better than something being bad, just to answer your question.

While we call it plot hole, it also refers to characters. In KaoHana the complex characters could have been inconsistent and their personalities and actions could have introduced plot holes. So no, it's not a simplicity question. Half of the cast is simplistic in SnK and you can still find character-related plot holes. Actually one of the biggest one is related to character.

Just to talk about the ratings. Everyone has their own rating system, so I'm not gonna use numbers, but describe it on a scale of very bad - bad - average - good - very good. SnK is slightly above average all in all with its final season. If your average is 5, then it can be a 6, if your average is 7, it should be a 7.5. KaoHana is a really strong romance with complex and consistent characters so far, it's a show between good and really good. Monster is the strongest among the 3, it's a very good show.

Mathi786 said:
Buddy if you think after year of amazing animation and hard work , amazing plot twist but having bad last season can make AOT worse than a complete low mod show like KaoHana, than I guess you don't have enough brain cells

That's simply a fallacy. The animators do hard work on every project even if it turns out to be an Ex-Arm. Hardwork itself won't create good shows.
Also, it's not a "single" last season, because that was released as 3 different season and when you average 3 from good to very good seasons with 3 from less than good to below average seasons, then the outcome is not great. It's below good and above average.

While KaoHana is actually more consistent, so yes, easily better OBJECTIVELY.

@ktg You would have a point if AOT was actually bad, which it's not. That goes out the window. Now I'm hearing Kaoru Hana and complex in the same sentence. Now that's something you don't see everyday. There are no complex characters in Kaoru Hana. Someone once said Kaoru Hana is the "Solo Leveling" of romance anime. Basic writing. The same way fights carry Solo Leveling, Kaoru Hana is carried by making the audience smile non-stop. No diss to both shows tho. Just saying you shouldn't compare them with AOT. I'm not even gonna argue about AOT's ending being bad given how controversial it was but I'll ask you this. A restaurant consistently delivers 10/10 meals everytime and only drop the ball once with a 6/10 meal or a restaurant that consistently serves 7/10 meals. Which is better?
As for Monster, it's perhaps even the worst of the 3. What does Monster even have above AOT? Literally NOTHING. Maybe the ending but I'm not gonna sit here and pretend Monster had a solid/perfect ending. The ending was bland and lackluster. It seems you only rate shows based on the endings while ignoring everything else.

Yesterday, 7:13 AM

#111

Sensual_Yuri_69

Offline

May 2024

278

Reply to machy871

Umm, or just go:
- Anime Search
- Specific Genre/Theme
- Sort by Score

:I

@machy871 that is what i do when i want to find popular theme based shows but instead of score i press on members... like girl love and high stakes

Yesterday, 7:46 AM

#112

ktg

Offline

May 2016

2072

Mathi786 said:
Everything you said is nonsense, if you think AOT is a bad show than you're probably just edgy kid trying to be cool by disagreeing with everything.

I see, English is not your first language. I'll help you.
Bad means below average, my whole point was that it was above average.

It's pretty funny how you think others are kids, when you don't even know the meaning of the word bad. :DDD

The_Spectre_01 said:
You would have a point if AOT was actually bad, which it's not. That goes out the window.

I can only repeat myself. If you don't speak English, what are you doing here? Bad means below average, while I clearly stated it's about average.
It's just hilarious that people can't even read.

The_Spectre_01 said:
Someone once said Kaoru Hana is the "Solo Leveling" of romance anime. Basic writing

Someone once said that Earth is flat, do you also believe in that? If not, then we can obviously see why this is a fallacy from you.

Sadly for you, the characters are pretty complex. If basic writing could achieve that, then every basic romance show should have been rated similarly, but that's simply false.
And that's why it can be compared to other shows and it's still better objectively than shows like SnK.

The_Spectre_01 said:
I'm not even gonna argue about AOT's ending being bad given how controversial it was but I'll ask you this. A restaurant consistently delivers 10/10 meals everytime and only drop the ball once with a 6/10 meal or a restaurant that consistently serves 7/10 meals. Which is better?

Your numbers are fk'd up. SnK never delivered 10/10.
S1 was a generic shounen start, comfortable it's an 8. It was consistently climbing until end of S3, at that point it was 9/10. All together this was 4 parts.
Final Season Part 1 was weaker but still okay, it was a 8/10, then Part 2 was weaker then Part 1, it was around 7/10. And the ending fell below average, it was 6/10. This is 3 parts.
So the average is (8+8.5+9+9+8+7+6)/7 = 7.92. This is very favorable towards SnK because I added S3P1 and S3P2 as separate entries.

KaoHana on the otherhand, even if I conservative, is at least 8.5, but realistically it's closer to 9.

It's simple math, which is bigger 8.5 or 7.92?

The_Spectre_01 said:
As for Monster, it's perhaps even the worst of the 3. What does Monster even have above AOT? Literally NOTHING. Maybe the ending but I'm not gonna sit here and pretend Monster had a solid/perfect ending. The ending was bland and lackluster. It seems you only rate shows based on the endings while ignoring everything else.

It's actually the opposite, I'm not ignoring anything and that's why calculating an average for SnK works.

Monster was more consistent, more complex and it had significantly less plot holes. It's not hard to comprehend this.

Quick Edit: Monster, in that rating system, should be a 9.

Yesterday, 8:31 AM

#113

Nirinbo

Offline

Sep 2018

5285

Reply to Mathi786

@Nirinbo Talk about the system, do you think it works or not?
if not than why not. stop talking specific animes

@Mathi786 The current system is fine, my only criticism is about sequels: a sequel can be rated higher than the previous season even when everyone disagrees, just because of survivorship bias (of course only when the sequel is slightly worse, not drastically worse like The Promised Neverland s2).

Yesterday, 8:40 AM

#114

Killjoy_Kora

Offline

Feb 2020

184

You can search by genre and then filter by rating??? I don't know what you're asking for here that isn't already on the website. Do you mean removing romance from the general rankings? That's ridiculous and you only seem to want that because you don't like romance shows being rater higher than AoT or Monster. Bad take.

Yesterday, 10:22 AM

#115

KubaCZ_007

Offline

Jan 2025

1

I don't think you're wrong about it being "unfair," but, as someone might have said, you have to put it into perspective. If you compare AOT Season 1 and The Fragrant Flower, at first glance it might seem like The Fragrant Flower is "better" based on ratings (which I don’t think is true). However, the number of people who rated each show is also important to consider. AOT Season 1 was rated by nearly 3 million people, while The Fragrant Flower only has about 100k ratings, so I don’t think looking at just the rating tells the whole story.

I’d also say that romance is a more niche genre than action. If 3 million people rated The Fragrant Flower, I doubt it would keep the same rating it has now. That’s kind of the point—romance anime are mostly watched by fans of the genre, while classics like AOT are more likely to be seen by the typical anime watcher, who might not enjoy them as much. If someone still feels that’s unfair, they can always filter what they want to compare. And if The Fragrant Flower were also 13 years old or whatever, its rating would probably go down as more people watched it.

Personally, I usually rate shows based on how much I enjoyed them rather than how objectively “good” they are, and I think that’s how at least some people do it too. At the end of the day, I’m not a professional critic—and neither are most MAL users. Everyone has their own taste, so it makes sense that ratings and opinions will always be all over the place.

12 hours ago

#116

KMIR

Offline

Apr 2017

58

You already can separate rating lists by genre... I mean, you can filter by genre and sort by score.

Furthermore, each series of movie has its own goal and traits. Every work has its own rating system and nobody has the truth or authority to decide wich is the good one. It doesn't matter that some anime has better score than other anime bc it's not a comparison, it's an individual evaluation (or it should be, at least imo).
I mean, ¿is Sono Bisque Doll better than Sonny Boy? Maybe Sonny Boy is deeper, more philosophical, more creative or whatever, but Sono Bisque is really good in its area. Same with, for example, Nichijou and Ping Pong the Animation. Dude, there's nothing in common, but don't underestimate Nichijou just for not being as deep, mature and experimental as Ping Pong, Nichijou is almost perfect as a gag comedy.

And, well, if I see an anime rated as 10 but it's voted by only 1 person, obviously I'm not gonna think it's a global judgement cause I'm not stupid. And MAL has a minimun of rates to show the rating (apart from a formula that keeps in mind the amount of people rating the show and more stuff) so that's an impossible situation.

11 hours ago

#117

LifelineByNature

Offline

Jan 2008

868

I actually get where you're coming from.

Being realistic the rating system IN GENERAL is not really fit for purpose due to how subjective it is, and the fact most users are just gonna rate what they like the highest.

But IF we're gonna have a rating system at all, I think it should be separated by genre. There's really no benefit to rating vastly different genres against each other.

The first question to ask is - why does a rating system exist at all? For what purpose does it exist on the service? What is the end goal? What's its objective?

Isn't the point to help you find good shows?

But you aren't gonna search in a complete vacuum - you'll have some idea of the kind of anime you want to watch. Whether it's romance, mecha, shounen action, or something else.

Having to scroll through the rating list until you hit the genre you want (and then, keep scrolling to the next one, because it doesn't interest you or you've seen it already) is a very disfunctional way to search for anime.

Having the ratings already separated by genre would at least make the ratings worth *something* - as opposed to currently, when they're completely nebulous and serve no purpose beyond being an arbitrary metric for people to argue about (to the point that there are forum rules meant to stop it - not that they work).

Either split the ratings by genre to give them a purpose, or do the opposite and scrap ratings altogether since they currently serve no purpose (beyond causing arguments over something meaningless).

That's my take, anyway.

Supreme Seireitei - Captain of the 10th Court Guard Squad

8 hours ago

#118

Zero_Xero_

Offline

Jan 2024

12

Reply to Mathi786

@Zero_Xero_ now imagine if there was a saperate list for only romance. than wouldn't you trust it more? wouldn't you say if it's up there in romance than it must be a good romance anime?

@Mathi786 Well it will be like this...not many of us are fans of romance so I would doubt about the rating will change so drastically. Sadly...But yeah as in a comment mentioned above you can really check for the highest rated anime for a certain genre by tagging it...
If the rating system is supposed to be changed I think it will be better if it count in the no. of members who actually rated that anime is also taken into count...Just as an example since it is one of my favs, YLIA got a rating of 8.64 after about 1.4 million people rated on it but Kaoru Hana slipped passed it with around 100k members rating it...If the rating is also changed from the no. of people who rated the show as well as I think it will be fair...cuz that show is already well balanced in the community to the extent that you can't say that it isn't a biased rating. With that much of people rating there are bound to be both the type that loves & dislikes the show...
Thank You for reading that all btw...

4 hours ago

#119

silversurfeer

Offline

Jan 2022

102

Why pointing out problems when its never been there in the first place ?, there are already a sort feature and that is good enough. you just being salty and sad, i mean what if i say that aot and monster doesn’t deserve to come near the ranks of kaoruhana in the overall ranking ? You probably flip every table in your home

3 hours ago

#120

Krautschi

I love Dubs!💘

Offline

May 2015

168

Reply to Mathi786

@Krautschi my thing should be by default. without any filters.

To discover anime, there can be a saperate page that can show ratings of every anime but rankings shouldn't be decided like it's decided currently

@Mathi786
A poll would have been cool to see if more people would like the thing you want.

Like...
"Would you prefer top-lists that are separated by genre by default?"
- Yes
- No
- Other (specify in comment pls :) )

I can understand that it would be easier to just navigate to e.g.
https://myanimelist.net/topanime.php?type=airing
and then have a separate row beneath the "All Anime | Top Airing | etc." row with the genres.
Or just having a filter feature directly beneath it like in the advanced search.
Would be easier to discover than the advanced search.

Krautschi2 hours ago

» Can there be a different completed status for rewatching a show? Rally- - Oct 3	5	by Zekkenshin »» 3 hours ago
» Why isn't there a decimal rating system on mal already ( 1 2 ) joyandhappiness - Sep 30	77	by AnimeManiac4Life »» Yesterday, 2:58 PM
» An option to see which users have favorited a series or characters JKKH - Oct 7	0	by JKKH »» Oct 7, 5:25 PM
» The required minimum length for reviews should be lower. scrimau - Oct 19, 2020	44	by CC »» Oct 7, 7:58 AM
» MAL should not split larger seasons which airs with a break in between as seperate. jacobPOL - Oct 1	7	by Nirinbo »» Oct 7, 1:25 AM

Separate rating lists by genre for more fair comparisons

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» Can there be a different completed status for rewatching a show?

» Why isn't there a decimal rating system on mal already ( 1 2 )

» An option to see which users have favorited a series or characters

» The required minimum length for reviews should be lower.

» MAL should not split larger seasons which airs with a break in between as seperate.

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