[Update 11/10] Final Features Restored & API Development Update

Y_TZ said:


Everybody crying over the fact that they removed the fansub section, while I'm here still waiting for more details on the API. Will it eventually come back? I mean it has been four months since it was disabled. Four freaking months. Asking the "support" team for updates is just like talking to a robot. Delayed and standard responses that got nothing to do with the issue. While I don't really want to leave MAL, I'm considering migrating to AniDB because of all of this.

cipheron said:
I think "cozy up to CR" is missing the mark here. It's too much of a Western perspective. Like I said before, myanimelist is owned by a Japanese company smack bang in the middle of the anime thing back home.

Keeping their nose clean about piracy is about more than schmoozing Crunchyroll. In fact, DeNA (MAL's Japanese parent company) would definitely be considering the possibility of cutting out the middle man for international streaming. In Japan, DeNA own one of the biggest cellphone platforms, and they have major partners, such as other games companies like Nintendo, and the major anime studios.

Now, they've bought a popular international anime platform complete with a vast user-base. Then, they added streaming to it, but bootstrapped that by first partnering with Daisuki and now with Crunchyroll and Hulu. You can bet that DeNA's longterm plan is to cut those middle-men out of the equation. Working with Crunchyroll is just the needed middle-step to boostrapping their own streaming service which licenses stuff straight from Japan.

Note, that DeNA's yearly revenue is 140 billion yen, or almost $1.4 billion US dollars. This makes Crunchyroll look like flyshit in comparison. Crunchyroll are just a convienient puppet for the Japanese owners until they get the infrastructure in place to have worldwide streaming services owned by Japanese companies.

cipheron said:


People can help support the Japanese part of the industry by watching shows on here rather than have a Crunchyroll account. If enough people do that, it makes it more viable for DeNA to hire some of the old fansubbers and sub their own shows.

alpha_shadow said:


Add the fansub section back you cowards. This was a feature that had use for older anime and for non English anime watchers.

Great, now will you add more shit and useless garbage that bloats the website?

AniDB has a better database in every way. As others said, you are a database, not a streaming website. Removing data from your database is actually fucking dumb.

alpha_shadow said:


Important

To people that still want to use the fansub database for specific older anime, you can do that if you access the web archive, you get the MAL URL, make sure the URL only has the database number and select a capture from 2014 or earlier, because in 2014 fansubs were still visible even for people that didn't have accounts on MAL.

For example, Code Geass, this is how you should search for it in the Web Archive
https://myanimelist.net/anime/1575/

Zadion said:

I love how in 5 years as a user here, the only post you've ever made is this post.

Lindholmaren said:


I don't know if that's supposed to be funny at the expense of me or mal but I used to have an older account with an embarrassing name, embarrassing posts tied to an email that I lost around 2009 (because it was like "firstname.lastname@ISP.countrycode" and we switched ISP), and then I didn't watch anime for like 2 years.

I never participated in the episode discussions here because I prefer going to imageboards or chatrooms, I'd occasionally read them though. I never participated in the sub discussions because I didn't need to to benefit from it. Usually I don't read the reviews here anymore but sometimes it's useful for getting similar shows.
Regardless of this I would be against removing any of these features, especially for reasons as bad as these.

azulakina said:


If you have to explain yourself then you're probably doing it wrong...

And you just had to.

It's not funny, it's just really interesting and like-able.

Lindholmaren said:


What do you mean doing it wrong?

-R said:
You can actually still view fansub info via group pages. You can search for groups here: https://myanimelist.net/fansub-groups.php

Here is a good example of a group with added projects, comments, and votes: https://myanimelist.net/fansub-groups.php?id=5977

Obviously this is less than ideal as you have to already know a group did a project, but the info is there. I wonder if it would be possible to somehow export this to an external site and make it all easier to go through?

Also, the contributions page is still set so only moderators can view? As far as I can tell, this wasn't the case before MAL went down: https://myanimelist.net/profile/MyAnimeListLLC/contributions

cipheron said:


What's wrong with fansubs is that it's illegal to distribute copyrighted material. And MAL is trying to stay on the legit side of the law.

This isn't just about Crunchyroll. MAL has been owned by Japanese company DeNA since the start of 2015, who make mobile games, some of which have been made into anime. Two examples are the Shingeki no Bahamut anime and the Hackadolls anime. Both were based on games made by DeNA, myanimelist's parent company. If fansub groups sub these series and are promoted on MAL then MAL is effectively promoting piracy of titles based on works by MAL's own parent company, as well as many of DeNA's commercial partners in Japan.

myanimelist is actually more legitimately Japanese that crunchyroll. Watch anime on here instead of crunchyroll to help support the Japanese industry directly. MAL currently takes content from CR and Hulu, but by watching it here, on a Japanese-owned website then there's a real possibility for them to cut the American middle-man out of the equation in future.

cipheron said:


Myanimelist removing the fansub info from the database doesn't prevent you doing that. That is in fact completely tangential.

The whole point was to explain why MAL did what they did. They have partners directly in Japan so they can't be undercutting them. People are still free to talk about fansubs in the forums or the like, but there just won't be any legitimizing of piracy in the database itself.

And anyway, the argument that you need to watch stolen stuff because it's not officially release is moot. You do not if fact need to watch anything. Nothing bad actually happens if you miss out on a show.

azulakina said:


You feel insecure about something and you just can help starting to explain yourself.

Lindholmaren said:


I explained because I was unsure of whether it was an attempt at a "gotcha" of me or not, I needlessly elaborated because I was pondering the exact dates myself and was puzzling together a timeline of events around that time in my head.
I then finished it off with a still-on-topic segment because this thread isn't about my post history.
Speaking of which, will we get an actual, elaborated on description of the motivation behind this decision besides "derr fansub bad official gud" or will we have to settle for the most likely case of seeking/getting that big streaming sponsor dosh? Mobile is laggy as HECK on my phone and forum posts aren't really as official as public MAL statements so no "read the thread" pl0x.

myanimelistllc said:
Dear Users,

Thank you for using MyAnimeList.

The final features have been restored:

・My Signature
・Database User Submissions
・About Pages
・Tutorials
・Remaining RSS Feeds

As part of ongoing efforts to support the anime and manga industry, the Fansub Group section of the site has been removed.

We are currently working a new terms of use for third party application developers. Also, we have mostly finished reviewing all the tasks necessary for completing development. We are planning to start work on the remaining development some time next week.

Click here to read a list of all previous announcements.

Thank you for your patience, understanding and continued support of MyAnimeList.

MLLu said:
I hope they will soon launch the MAL app for iOS! :D

Maffy said:
Awww, you seem so happy and that's why I'd hate to see you disappointed down the road, so I'll tell you to not have many hopes of that happening soon. They did say that when the android version came out, but with the site going down and all, it seems everything now is going really slow, much less the introduction of something new. The API that was promised years ago is still going really slow judging by their "updates" and the android version hasn't had any update (though it's hidden still so I'm not surprised, but either way). It may eventually come out, but by then I think the API will already be out and hopefully an ios app based on that will be made once again, which will be better by what DeNA will have made.

Don't have too much faith in them, the company seems a bit out of order for a while.

myanimelistllc said:

As part of ongoing efforts to support the anime and manga industry, the Fansub Group section of the site has been removed.

Taluun said:
For those complaining about lack of fansub info, you can always use aniDB which has always had a much more thorough and informative section on fansubs

azulakina said:
Reading this thread is just turning into a big waste of time with folks talking of how MAL got into a deal with companies like Daisuki, which seems to be out of business and a lot of other rumours about deals with Hulu and Crunchyroll - and yet we are not getting any relevant statements from admins.

What the hell?

This thread is spewed with a tonne of rumours and bullshit and it literary very difficult to even tell what is what at this point unless we got a statement from an admin.

And, anyway, even if MAL got into a deal with Hulu and Crunchyroll, I'm way too content with what I get from bootlegging sites to bothering with sites that have my country geolocked.

Maffy said:
Awww, you seem so happy and that's why I'd hate to see you disappointed down the road, so I'll tell you to not have many hopes of that happening soon. They did say that when the android version came out, but with the site going down and all, it seems everything now is going really slow, much less the introduction of something new. The API that was promised years ago is still going really slow judging by their "updates" and the android version hasn't had any update (though it's hidden still so I'm not surprised, but either way). It may eventually come out, but by then I think the API will already be out and hopefully an ios app based on that will be made once again, which will be better by what DeNA will have made.

Don't have too much faith in them, the company seems a bit out of order for a while.

Lindholmaren said:

I don't know if that's supposed to be funny at the expense of me or mal but I used to have an older account with an embarrassing name, embarrassing posts tied to an email that I lost around 2009 (because it was like "firstname.lastname@ISP.countrycode" and we switched ISP), and then I didn't watch anime for like 2 years.

I never participated in the episode discussions here because I prefer going to imageboards or chatrooms, I'd occasionally read them though. I never participated in the sub discussions because I didn't need to to benefit from it. Usually I don't read the reviews here anymore but sometimes it's useful for getting similar shows.
Regardless of this I would be against removing any of these features, especially for reasons as bad as these.

cipheron said:


The point is, being content with pirate sites does nothing to prevent Crunchyroll having a near-monopoly. Encouraging competition does, and on here you're drawing from two different sites. That instantly makes it that much more viable for Hulu to bid against Crunchyroll for anime series. And thirdly, DeNa are a big enough company to set up up their own streaming sources and cut the American middle-man completely out of the loop, but only if they get enough people watching shows on here. So it doesn't matter if you, in particular are geolocked and can't watch all shows: watching fansubs isn't going to help with that. You need to make yourself a viewer worth reaching. Watch *what you can* through third-party sites since that makes the third party sites more viable and makes your country more viable to legally stream to.

Netsplite said:


iMAL for iOS has some functionality back, developer has to resort to workarounds because the API will likely not return in any usable state soon (months / years who knows).

What I think will happen is some sort of middleware solution which uses web scraping that apps can use, sorta like others we had to use because of how shitty the old API was.
MAL has the large community and great moderators going for it as otherwise, AniList would have stayed as my primary.

Zadion said:


I wasn't trying to do a "gotcha" or whatever. I just thought it was amusing that in 5 years of using and browsing MAL, this is the topic that finally made you want to post something. Not a rib at you or at MAL, just an interesting event I felt like highlighting. I apologize if it might've come across as crass; it's a sad environment that we can't make such comments without having to be worried someone is trying to anonymously humiliate us on the internet.

Netsplite said:
iMAL for iOS has some functionality back, developer has to resort to workarounds because the API will likely not return in any usable state soon (months / years who knows).

What I think will happen is some sort of middleware solution which uses web scraping that apps can use, sorta like others we had to use because of how shitty the old API was.
MAL has the large community and great moderators going for it as otherwise AniList would have stayed as my primary.

IATGOF said:


That's already what iMAL and probably other apps are doing. But without the API, there is no easy way to get and update lists, which is the main use for a MAL app anyway. Web scrapping "static" pages is one thing, but login and extracting cookies information to keep a fake logged context when getting pages adds extra pain.

Zadion said:

I wasn't trying to do a "gotcha" or whatever. I just thought it was amusing that in 5 years of using and browsing MAL, this is the topic that finally made you want to post something. Not a rib at you or at MAL, just an interesting event I felt like highlighting. I apologize if it might've come across as crass; it's a sad environment that we can't make such comments without having to be worried someone is trying to anonymously humiliate us on the internet.

Lindholmaren said:


It's fine, I chuckled at first and then saw that you had several thousand posts and unfortunately assumed the worst. This finally being what got me bothered enough to post (atleast for the first time in like 9 years) is funny to me too.
Honestly I kinda feel bad for the staff of MAL. I realize that the suddenness of the site going down and the lack of communication was, seemingly, entirely DeNA's fault, but I really don't feel like I can support a site that kneecaps user features like this (I switched when I got sick of having to go to the website/use the gimped app).

azulakina said:

Makes me wonder what someone means by "anonymously" - would a video discussion instead of forum discussion make this place less anonymous?

What makes you think that this place is anonymous? And what's the difference between someone trying to humiliate you here and someone trying to humiliate you in real life?

klimbo12 said:
MAL needs to pretend that fansub groups are not a good thing for anime industry.

cipheron said:
But that doesn't mean they're a great thing *now* for the industry when they're directly competing against legitimate streaming that is often supported merely by advertising.

All that fansubs are really good for is getting hold of old and/or obscure series for free. All that really does now is allow hardcore anime-geeks to "watch em all" and does very little to help the industry or the creators of those works.

myanimelistllc said:
Dear Users,

Thank you for using MyAnimeList.

We have continued to solve potential concerns with the new ToU internally while continuing work on establishing it’s creation. We have also completed listing out all of the remaining development tasks, and begun development of the said tasks, with the development of login authentication being mostly completed.

Thank you for your patience, understanding, and continued support of MyAnimeList.

cipheron said:


They were a good thing because they grew the audience in the early days when the stuff lacked exposure. But that was then.

But that doesn't mean they're a great thing *now* for the industry when they're directly competing against legitimate streaming that is often supported merely by advertising. Anime doesn't need additional exposure, it's everywhere. So fansubs no longer do that one thing that they were really good at - building out the anime fandom in the first place so people could find out that there's something worth checking out.

All that fansubs are really good for is getting hold of old and/or obscure series for free. All that really does now is allow hardcore anime-geeks to "watch em all" and does very little to help the industry or the creators of those works.

The kind of behaviour where you wait for people to jump-start you then ditch them only to continue enjoying the benefits of being jump-started is uncouth.

cipheron said:


This is BS really. The anime studios didn't ask people to "jump start" stuff. People pirated anime for their own selfish reasons in the first place. If someone is copying your work illegally (and unrequested) and that happens to make you better known, that's just a bonus, but it doesn't mean you owe the pirates anything.

the point is that those people who "jump started" the thing aren't actually the owners of the series and were never authorized or asked or expected to do that.

cipheron said:


Each episode of an anime costs a LOT of money to produce. Fansubbers aren't expending much to sub an episode, and they do not carry any of the financial risk. The risk-taker is the creator studio, who invest millions of dollars up-front in a series on the hope that it does well. Fansubbers only come along later and take already-paid-for series and sub it. They come along after the other guy's already taken the big risks.

Again, fansubbing is a low-cost, low-risk action taken at the expense of the people who invested a ton of actual money into the venture in the first place. The fansubber is not owed any of that. Not every anime idea sees fruition, many projects fail, are cancelled, or are not profitable.

cipheron said:


It's not like every anime studio is rolling in dosh so they can afford to lose sales to fansubbers. Anime studios go bankrupt and lay off workers all the time. For example, the studio that made several recent animes including Gonna be the Twin-Tail and High School Fleet recently went bankrupt:

https://goboiano.com/anime-studio-production-ims-has-gone-bankrupt/

Every couple of years there's a major bankruptcy or studio failure including Madhouse, Gonzo, Manglobe.

Fansubbing is *not* a low-cost activity. For one you need to learn enough Japanese to watch raw anime then subtitles are not just translations, you have to express emotions e.t.c - basically, a lot of stuff. At the same time, your English needs to be up to the task(I doubt they're so many Japanese folks who speak "cool" English as I do)