Anime, Manga &amp; Character Relations

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Oh? everminded to my rescue! :D

Yup, she's got it right. To aviod the character list just sprawling down filled with the obvious (like Chikane and Himeko are gay for each other), we've reserved the character relations list for:

1. Yuri characters in non-yuri anime.

egs.

Kouya and Yamato in Loveless. Loveless is a yaoi shotacon anime, yet KouYamato is one of the big pairings in yuri because Loveless features an entire arc based on their story. Before Loveless used to be in the anime relations, and a lot of people gave complaints about watching Loveless and going into it not realising it was a primarily yaoi anime.

Another example would be Suruga Kanbaru from Bakemonogatari. That is not a yuri anime in the slightest, but Kabaru is an open lesbian (and lolicon and masochist and flirt and fujoshi).

2. Yuri characters in S class yuri anime.

eg. Marimite --> strong yuri atmosphere, but only a few lesbians or women who are romantically interested in other women.

3. Canon yuri characters in vaguely/fanonically/perspectively/considerably yuri anime.

eg. Mai-HiME has a big yuri element from the foe yay and les yay all over the place, and in many circles, Mai-HiME is seen as an anime with yuri as one of its sub-genres, but the only actual yuri characters are Shizuru and Natsuki, even if you can make pairings out of Haruka and that glasses girl, Mai and Mikoto, and a myriad of other characters simply because of the strong attraction/bonds/chemistry between them.

Jan 21, 2010 9:33 AM

#156

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Are bi characters okay for character relations? If so, I'll suggest Motoko from GitS and Haruhi and Mikuru from MoHS.

MawootadJan 21, 2010 9:37 AM

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Jan 21, 2010 10:30 AM

#157

akai_ribbon

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Mawootad said:
Are bi characters okay for character relations? If so, I'll suggest Motoko from GitS and Haruhi and Mikuru from MoHS.

wtf.

Jan 21, 2010 11:53 AM

#158

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Mawootad said:
Are bi characters okay for character relations? If so, I'll suggest Motoko from GitS and Haruhi and Mikuru from MoHS.

Bisexual characters are all right if they've had a significant relationship with or had overwhelming feelings for or has powerful attraction to other women at some point in their life.

Egs.

Yomi from Zombie-Loan (she has a split personality; her "normal" side is straight, but the other side of her is in love with the female protagonist).

from Bakemonogatari (she claims she's a lesbian and she does in fact lust after girls and had a very significant crush on Senjougahara, but she seems to have taken a liking to Araragi).

Nene from Hyakko (she's an admitted bisexual, but so far, it seems she only lusts after girls and has a bit of a thing for Torako).

In the case of the Major, I don't think she's bisexual so much as she loves having sex with women. It is stated in the GitS universe that female cyborgs have greater sexual pleasure when they do it with other female borgs rather than with men. I did see her having the orgy on the yacht, and it was all very, "Well, see ya next time." She's never had an important relationship, emotional or sexual, with a woman to be considered really bisexual.

EDIT for lulz:

Mikuru is not bisexual in any way whatsoever. In fact, it's quite evident that she likes Kyon. Actually, it's evident that every girl in the series (and arguably Itsuki, the guy) like Kyon, I wonder if SHnY knows it's a subverted harem?

Anyway, Haruhi's sexuality has always been a great debate for some people, but she's not into women at all. She just likes groping Mikuru to make her miserable.

tehnominatorJan 21, 2010 11:56 AM

Jan 21, 2010 6:33 PM

#159

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tehnominator said:
Mikuru is not bisexual in any way whatsoever. In fact, it's quite evident that she likes Kyon. Actually, it's evident that every girl in the series (and arguably Itsuki, the guy) like Kyon, I wonder if SHnY knows it's a subverted harem?

Anyway, Haruhi's sexuality has always been a great debate for some people, but she's not into women at all. She just likes groping Mikuru to make her miserable.

Actually, going by events in the novels (which I haven't read, I'm just getting this from other sources) Mikuru really is bisexual, due to her being gay for Haruhi. Supposedly, this is made most clear in a chapter(s?) called "Snow Mountain Syndrom" (so the following stuff may have spoilers of some sorts) that (according to fans, as there's no other explanation) involved each member being visited by fakes of the person they were attracted to the most (leading to Kyon being visited by Mikuru, Mikuru being visited by Haruhi, and Yuki, Itsuki, and Haruhi all being visited by Kyon). Not that that's written outright, but whatever.

Haruhi, on the other hand, is... Haruhi. I'd find decent evidence, but I don't have the patience to find specific evidence atm.

In any case, please add Kuro from Kodomo no Jikan, as she is canonically in love with Rin (stated outright in one of the KnJ OVA's).

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Jan 21, 2010 9:53 PM

#160

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Mawootad said:

tehnominator said:
Mikuru is not bisexual in any way whatsoever. In fact, it's quite evident that she likes Kyon. Actually, it's evident that every girl in the series (and arguably Itsuki, the guy) like Kyon, I wonder if SHnY knows it's a subverted harem?

Anyway, Haruhi's sexuality has always been a great debate for some people, but she's not into women at all. She just likes groping Mikuru to make her miserable.

Actually, going by events in the novels (which I haven't read, I'm just getting this from other sources) Mikuru really is bisexual, due to her being gay for Haruhi. Supposedly, this is made most clear in a chapter(s?) called "Snow Mountain Syndrom" (so the following stuff may have spoilers of some sorts) that (according to fans, as there's no other explanation) involved each member being visited by fakes of the person they were attracted to the most (leading to Kyon being visited by Mikuru, Mikuru being visited by Haruhi, and Yuki, Itsuki, and Haruhi all being visited by Kyon). Not that that's written outright, but whatever.

Haruhi, on the other hand, is... Haruhi. I'd find decent evidence, but I don't have the patience to find specific evidence atm.

In any case, please add Kuro from Kodomo no Jikan, as she is canonically in love with Rin (stated outright in one of the KnJ OVA's).

Will add Kuro. Maybe Mikuru is a masochist? And her attraction to Haruhi is as her tormentor.

Jan 21, 2010 10:20 PM

#161

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tehnominator said:
Will add Kuro. Maybe Mikuru is a masochist? And her attraction to Haruhi is as her tormentor.

Idk, I don't really see it myself, tbh. Other than older Haruhi really not minding what Haruhi did. Which is um... yeah. Only reason why I care about it is because it would make Yuki ending up as the winning girl less painful.

On a side note, I'm pretty sure that there at least some of the girls in Vandread are lesbians (can't remember which, atm, but they do come from an all female planet), can we add them?

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Jan 21, 2010 10:55 PM

#162

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Mawootad said:

tehnominator said:
Will add Kuro. Maybe Mikuru is a masochist? And her attraction to Haruhi is as her tormentor.

Idk, I don't really see it myself, tbh. Other than older Haruhi really not minding what Haruhi did. Which is um... yeah. Only reason why I care about it is because it would make Yuki ending up as the winning girl less painful.

On a side note, I'm pretty sure that there at least some of the girls in Vandread are lesbians (can't remember which, atm, but they do come from an all female planet), can we add them?

Didn't all the girls in Vandread eventually straighten out?

Jan 22, 2010 8:09 AM

#163

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tehnominator said:

Mawootad said:

tehnominator said:
Will add Kuro. Maybe Mikuru is a masochist? And her attraction to Haruhi is as her tormentor.

Idk, I don't really see it myself, tbh. Other than older Haruhi really not minding what Haruhi did. Which is um... yeah. Only reason why I care about it is because it would make Yuki ending up as the winning girl less painful.

On a side note, I'm pretty sure that there at least some of the girls in Vandread are lesbians (can't remember which, atm, but they do come from an all female planet), can we add them?

Didn't all the girls in Vandread eventually straighten out?

Dita, Meia, and Parfet do, but, IIRC, Ezra and Barnette certainly don't, and Jura's obsession with Hibiki doesn't really have anything to do with attraction (her character profile even assumes that she and Barnette are lovers).

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Jan 24, 2010 12:40 PM

#164

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Suggesting Miharu from BakaTest.

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Jan 24, 2010 1:45 PM

#165

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Mawootad said:
Suggesting Miharu from BakaTest.

Ah yes, I should add her. I just wanted to wait it out for more episodes of BakaTest since in comedies like this one, these things are just fleeting or played for laughs. I mean, if we were to take some of it seriously, I'd say a few of the guys were bisexual.

But I'll keep her in mind. It's a short series, so it won't be too hard or take too long to decide.

Jan 25, 2010 11:25 AM

#166

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Suggesting Kaede from Kampfer, Kuchinashi from Needless (Wiki and TV Tropes say so. I would find evidence from the manga if it weren't for the fact that only a handful of chapters are translated), and Minori from Toradora.

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Jan 25, 2010 1:48 PM

#167

fireaxe

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I know it was brought up already (Sae from Hidamari Sketch), but maybe you'll want to reconsider:

:)

Yeah, I guess that Sae and Hiro aren't hard gay, but they do dream of each other, litterally... Episode 3 of Hoshimittsu made that pretty clear. :P
The thing is, Hidamari Sketch has very little yuri undertones outside of the Hiro x Sae relationship. It's not yuri by any means, yet those two makes the shows a must watch for yuri fans (which is the point of those character relations, right?). Their love isn't physical, but it's definitely there (or at least they WANT us to believe it's there :P).

If you have time, take a look at the latest episode. It'll give you a decent idea of their relationship.

fireaxeJan 25, 2010 1:53 PM

Jan 25, 2010 3:13 PM

#168

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fireaxe said:
I know it was brought up already (Sae from Hidamari Sketch), but maybe you'll want to reconsider:

:)

Yeah, I guess that Sae and Hiro aren't hard gay, but they do dream of each other, litterally... Episode 3 of Hoshimittsu made that pretty clear. :P
The thing is, Hidamari Sketch has very little yuri undertones outside of the Hiro x Sae relationship. It's not yuri by any means, yet those two makes the shows a must watch for yuri fans (which is the point of those character relations, right?). Their love isn't physical, but it's definitely there (or at least they WANT us to believe it's there :P).

If you have time, take a look at the latest episode. It'll give you a decent idea of their relationship.

As much as it does seem that way, I think it's a case of applying goggles to a friendship that seems like a relationship but is essentially still a friendship.

Jan 25, 2010 4:02 PM

#169

Supernova141

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But aren't MOST of our anime and manga relations based on implied relationships? If you're say that the relationship has to be confirmed, take off CANAAN... and half the rest of the list too, while you're at it.

Jan 25, 2010 6:35 PM

#170

fireaxe

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Supernova141 said:
But aren't MOST of our anime and manga relations based on implied relationships? If you're say that the relationship has to be confirmed, take off CANAAN... and half the rest of the list too, while you're at it.

Exactly. And a few characters on your lists have only implied relationship... How Setsuna's from Negima any different..?? Or Meg from Burst Angels?

I guess it's one of those cases where you actually have to see it to understand.

Jan 26, 2010 3:29 AM

#171

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Supernova141 said:
But aren't MOST of our anime and manga relations based on implied relationships? If you're say that the relationship has to be confirmed, take off CANAAN... and half the rest of the list too, while you're at it.

There's a difference with CANAAN-- I think I beat the point to death already, but let me go back to it. What Canaan and Maria share is nothing one would call a BFF relationship. Goggles can work for their interaction, but even if you take them off, what still remains is a relationship between two women whose entire lives literally revolve around each other.

And no, the addition of the subtextual and ambiguous anime is exactly because they are there where the writers intentionally imply. If you watch more anime especially older ones, the writers refused to actually veer into canonical yuri territory. Take Nanoha for instance. The writers refuse to the death to answer any questions based on Nanoha and Fate's relationship.

I believe you need to see more classical yuri to understand the difference between the "implications" of their yuri content as opposed to the modern goggles of things like Hidamari Sketch.

CANAAN is much more classic in its style than people would think.

A list of anime where there is real subtext as opposed to using goggles:

Maria-sama ga Miteru (because like CANAAN, there is only one lesbian in it), CANAAN, Noir, Onii-sama e..., Devilman Lady (though it gets pretty canon in some places), Candy Boy (yes, Candy Boy, despite people's rants about how hard gay those two are together, their relationship is clearly still ambiguous).

fireaxe said:
And a few characters on your lists have only implied relationship... How Setsuna's from Negima any different..?? Or Meg from Burst Angels?

I think you are misunderstanding-- we're not listing them because of shipping or relationships, but for who the characters are personally and if they do in fact like women/a woman. Meg is here because she clearly has a thing for Jo, but Jo's not here because we don't know what she feels for Meg other than "Let me rescue her-- she's important to me."

Jan 26, 2010 6:20 AM

#172

fireaxe

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Nah, I understand what you mean, but the thing is, what defines "clearly"? My point is that, unless I'm wrong, Setsuna's and Meg's orientation is based on speculations by fans. Because you know, to me (and for a lot of people) Sae clearly has a thing for Hiro.

** I wrote "implied relationship" in my previous post, but that wasn't exactly what I meant. My bad. I was really refering to the character's orientation being more or less implied and not really clear **

It does sound like I'm beating a dead horse though.... I think I'm gonna drop it now. :P

Jan 26, 2010 6:49 AM

#173

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I personally think that even if Sae doesn't count, Natsume definitely does.

On a side note, could you please add Kaede from Kampfer and Kuchinashi from Needless?

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Jan 26, 2010 2:48 PM

#174

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Mawootad said:
I personally think that even if Sae doesn't count, Natsume definitely does.

On a side note, could you please add Kaede from Kampfer and Kuchinashi from Needless?

Right, right-- Kaede and Kuchinashi. What gets me is that I watched those two anime myself and didn't add them :P I suppose I've seen so much ecchi and faux-gay stuff that I start tossing aside my yuri goggles for any of these types of series. But I heard that Kuchinashi is not interested in Ms. Dean Drive Fox Hound in the manga-- confirmation on that?

Jan 26, 2010 4:09 PM

#175

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tehnominator said:

Mawootad said:
I personally think that even if Sae doesn't count, Natsume definitely does.

On a side note, could you please add Kaede from Kampfer and Kuchinashi from Needless?

Right, right-- Kaede and Kuchinashi. What gets me is that I watched those two anime myself and didn't add them :P I suppose I've seen so much ecchi and faux-gay stuff that I start tossing aside my yuri goggles for any of these types of series. But I heard that Kuchinashi is not interested in Ms. Dean Drive Fox Hound in the manga-- confirmation on that?

As I haven't read much of the manga (afaik, chapters 18-49 are untranslated. I think it's currently got 51 chapters), I'll quote Wikipedia's character profile:

Wikipedia said:
Kuchinashi (梔?) Voiced by: Minori Chihara

Which, I guess, could her only sort of gay, as she's attracted to a cross dressing guy, but w/e.

MawootadJan 26, 2010 6:03 PM

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Jan 26, 2010 5:08 PM

#176

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Mawootad said:
]As I haven't read much of the manga (afaik, chapters 18-49 are untranslated. I think it's currently got 51 chapters), I'll quote Wikipedia's character profile:

Wikipedia said:
Kuchinashi (梔?) Voiced by: Minori Chihara

Which, I guess, could her only sort of gay, as she's attracted to a cross dressing guy, but w/e.

Huh, that's a whole lot of spoilers for Needless in that one explanation...

tehnominatorJan 27, 2010 2:56 AM

Jan 26, 2010 6:04 PM

#177

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tehnominator said:
Huh, that's a whole lot of spoilers for Needless in that one explanation...

Now spoilered. Didn't quite realize just how much that description contained.

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Feb 21, 2010 8:03 AM

#178

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Strike Witches should be added.

Also, Katsuragi Hana and Ekaterina Kurae should probably be added.

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Feb 22, 2010 6:22 PM

#179

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Mawootad said:
Strike Witches should be added.

Also, Katsuragi Hana and Ekaterina Kurae should probably be added.

Well, most of SW was service, but Perrine genuinely seems to be one of our ranks, and she was added a long time ago. Also, lmao, Qwaser.

I'm watching it myself, so I'm gonna add them when I see it just to be sure. Thanks for the recs!

Mar 1, 2010 12:48 PM

#180

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I feel we need to discuss Hitohira, Mouryou no Hako, and Saki

Mar 2, 2010 3:52 AM

#181

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Taru-chan said:
I feel we need to discuss Hitohira, Mouryou no Hako, and Saki

Is Saki not in the anime relations, though...? I think I added it. I think. I don't know anything about Hitohira and the girls in Mouryou seemed to be really obsessed with one another in a classic yuri way.

Mar 2, 2010 8:53 PM

#182

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In using Aria and Nanoha as examples of intimate or affectionate friendships on one end and something that isn't widely accepted as yuri by everyone like Canaan and Bakurestu Tenshi on the other end, I feel like Hitohira leans more toward the latter. Sure, people, or even non-yuri watchers may say there were just affectionate friendships, and those with goggles would ogle at the sight- they must have been responsible for the AMV's on you-tube. I feel there was enough chemistry and subtleties to shed some light on it.

As for Mouryou no Hako, you've seen some of it I know. Those two were a bit obsessive.

Saki. I mentioned Saki not to add it, for it is already on the list, but to remove it in favor of only posting those characters in the series that are yuri. Saki is a slice of life school anime centered around Mahjong, where mahjong is a central theme and the anime goes quite into detail about how to play and score, more than K-on goes into detail about forming a band and the elements of a guitar, and yuri is not really an integral part where some of the plot depends on it or anything. There are a lot of characters in the anime and maybe just those whom are pretty much gay should be added to the character list instead of the whole anime.

Mar 7, 2010 7:31 AM

#183

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Isuzu's Counter... scanlated by 4chan, a bit mature but yuri. 3 chapter manga. Not great though.

Apr 2, 2010 1:50 AM

#184

everminded

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Suggesting Elliot from Mai-Otome 0~S.ifr~, they're all pretty gay (it is part of the Mai series after all), but Elliot's love is rather obvious.

It's serious but also has fanservice/used-as-comedy moments. Screencap example -

"I'm always sleeping in my forest of thorns."
- Satou Sei

Apr 2, 2010 5:32 AM

#185

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Taru-chan said:
Isuzu's Counter... scanlated by 4chan, a bit mature but yuri. 3 chapter manga. Not great though.

everminded said:
Suggesting Elliot from Mai-Otome 0~S.ifr~, they're all pretty gay (it is part of the Mai series after all), but Elliot's love is rather obvious.

It's serious but also has fanservice/used-as-comedy moments. Screencap example -

Done and done. It's Kurogane Ken, so no questions asked, and I don't know anything about Mai-HiME Swiffer, so I will go with what you say.

Apr 2, 2010 8:46 AM

#186

kaigen

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I'd like to present the notion, that if something like Cannan is in amine relations then Ga-rei zero should also be considered, for amine relations. What do you all think?

; Kaigen

-"Just an ordinary woman who won't ever regret, being with the person she loves."
(Rokujou Ruri, Azure Dream, manga)

-"Shinobu, even if this body should turn to ash, I will never leave you."
(Naitou Momoko, shoujo-sect, manga)

Apr 2, 2010 9:31 AM

#187

everminded

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I think tehno will reject it. :P

They really had much more of a sistery relationship imo, and i'm saying this as a person who rolls their eyes (mentally, a lady would never actually roll her eyes) everytime someone chalks up lesbian subtext to being a 'sisterly' relationship.

"I'm always sleeping in my forest of thorns."
- Satou Sei

Apr 2, 2010 10:31 AM

#188

kaigen

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I understand your point, but I felt thought watching that, the element of “sisterly” love seemed contrived or an afterthought. I felt similarly, when I saw Canaan which is why I bring Ga- rei to the table at all, otherwise I would agree with you everminded. If Canaan wasn’t there already, then I would see no other precedence or basis for my opinion; But as is I think that I have a case. ^_~

; Kaigen

-"Just an ordinary woman who won't ever regret, being with the person she loves."
(Rokujou Ruri, Azure Dream, manga)

-"Shinobu, even if this body should turn to ash, I will never leave you."
(Naitou Momoko, shoujo-sect, manga)

Apr 2, 2010 10:36 AM

#189

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Ga-Rei is never going to be added to the list, sorry... the basis of the anime wasn't built around Kagura and Yomi's relationship, and yes, a lot of people said Kagura was the drive blah blah, but that wasn't the case from where I was watching it.

And outside of making out with each other, their feelings for one another are in no way romantic or even the driving force of their actions. In CANAAN, it's different. Maria and Canaan are essentially the reasons for one another's existence. Everything they do is with the other in mind. While their relationship is not romantic, it certainly is the driving force of the series. Which is why it's there.

Apr 6, 2010 8:16 AM

#190

kaigen

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Now, I don’t want to contest your decision not to add Ga-rai, that’s fine with me, however I would like to contest the reasoning behind that decision if you are willing to debate with me for a bit ^_^;
Saying “their feelings for one another are in no way romantic or even the driving force of their actions.” Now I agree with the first line but the second .

How did you interpret these events?

Ta-ta; Kaigen

-"Just an ordinary woman who won't ever regret, being with the person she loves."
(Rokujou Ruri, Azure Dream, manga)

-"Shinobu, even if this body should turn to ash, I will never leave you."
(Naitou Momoko, shoujo-sect, manga)

Apr 7, 2010 9:31 AM

#191

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To be honest, I thought it was poorly written teenage melodrama, so I don't interpret these events as anything since poor characterisation via bad writing doesn't do it for me. Besides, at that point, I was too busy trying to keep my eyes open from how boring the series became.

I've nothing against Ga-Rei Zero. Or Yomi. Or even Kagura, who sucks. It's just not yuri.

Apr 30, 2010 7:14 PM

#192

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Just wanted to point out that the second and third seasons of Koihime Musou should probably be added to the relations list.

Also, you may want to consider Miharu from BakaTest, given that she's hard gay for Minami.

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Jul 25, 2010 8:30 AM

#193

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Mawootad said:
Just wanted to point out that the second and third seasons of Koihime Musou should probably be added to the relations list.

Also, you may want to consider Miharu from BakaTest, given that she's hard gay for Minami.

Miharu added, and second and third seasons aren't added if the first is already there. There has been some anomalies such as the second season of Steel Angel Kurumi being added, but that's because season 1 was extremely het while season 2 was extremely yuri.

Jul 25, 2010 8:41 AM

#194

sorsha

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-koihime musou
-shin koihime musou
-shin koihime musou otome tairan

onegaishimasu^^

Jul 28, 2010 4:08 PM

#195

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Taru-chan said:
Oh, and we need to add it to the manga relations. It's under its Japanese name Dounika Naru Hibi . Also add the anime I asked you to look at !

Should add Dounika Naru Hibi to the manga relations (Happy Go Lucky Days)

And take a look to make a determination on Hitohira and Mouryou no Hako. Some girls say yes, others say no, others say maybe so.

Jul 28, 2010 4:15 PM

#196

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Taru-chan said:

Taru-chan said:
Oh, and we need to add it to the manga relations. It's under its Japanese name Dounika Naru Hibi . Also add the anime I asked you to look at !

Should add Dounika Naru Hibi to the manga relations (Happy Go Lucky Days)

And take a look to make a determination on Hitohira and Mouryou no Hako. Some girls say yes, others say no, others say maybe so.

I saw Mouryou no Hako and even though the first few episodes screamed "destructive lesbian obsession/relationship" the rest of the series didn't seem to touch on it at all. I don't even know what to say about that relationship other than it was just mostly that-- a darkly obsessive relationship. And yes, I know most love is painted that way in fiction, but does it mean either one of them had a kind of fruitful relationship whatsoever? And to be honest, I don't even remember what the hell happened to them.

As for Hitohira, isn't it just one of the girls who has a "crush" on the other...? So I read and heard.

And Happy/Days (LOL), it seems kind of weird to add the series when only two of the MANY stories were yuri. If they were separate one-shots, I might bait, or if the characters would listed, they'd definitely go on the list, but since the series focusses mostly on heterosexual situations, I don't see many people being thrilled about that. I know that's the fuss again with Loveless back when it was there. People thought it was yuri because it was on the lists for yuri, many lists, and were angry when they saw shotacon yaoi.

I suppose I can make a move into adding the characters to the database and after they're approved, I can add them to the club.

Jul 28, 2010 4:20 PM

#197

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You don't remember what happened to the girls in Mouryou no Hako? OMG. How can you forget that? Ah .. g ..s. .h h ? ~ ? ? ........................ _____ There's a reason why it was only the first couple of episodes. ^_^ Then add the characters then only.

Jul 28, 2010 5:29 PM

#198

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Taru-chan said:
You don't remember what happened to the girls in Mouryou no Hako? OMG. How can you forget that? Ah .. g ..s. .h h ? ~ ? ? ........................ _____ There's a reason why it was only the first couple of episodes. ^_^ Then add the characters then only.

No, I really don't. It's one of the few shows that I cannot remember. I dunno,

Jul 28, 2010 6:31 PM

#199

Offline

Mar 2009

128

At nomi:

Jul 28, 2010 7:08 PM

#200