there is an increase in animation quality?

deg said:


i beg to disagree
examples
https://www.sakugabooru.com/post/show/140429
https://www.sakugabooru.com/post/show/140425 (suppose normal scene)
and more here https://www.sakugabooru.com/post?tags=jujutsu_kaisen+character_acting

SoranoCloud said:

Thank you man, because with all the people praising ep 2 I'm beginning to doubt my sanity. To me it looked absolutely horrid. I have as many CG titans ans still shots as MAPPA is able to fit in an episode, but bad rotoscoping... Please MAPPA, be merciful (and save your money) and never do this to my poor eyes again.

Krugerman said:





art wise WIT is def better than MAPPA, but animation-wise not rly, MAPPA does have better animation overall. ANd yea Kabaneri art was so fucking gorgeous- even more better than aot s2.

crypt0l0gy said:
Where is all this WIT hate coming from? You guys forget that WITs adaptation is what made the franchise so big in the first place. As far as raw talent goes they‘ll beat MAPPA in every aspect. Art Consistency, Animation Complexity, Composition & Coloring, Effects, Photography, etc. Most of their in-house staff are industry veterans with lots of experience.

https://blog.sakugabooru.com/2019/05/19/attack-on-titan-at-its-wits-end/

WIT delivered a slightly worse season with S3P2 because their priorities shifted. Also they lost a lot of freelancers working for them for important roles such as CAD. On top of that they were producing Kabaneri Movie and Vinland Saga the same time while being such a small studio. WIT with all its resources beats MAPPA any time. They just didn’t put all their effort into AoT because they got paid sh*t. Look at the animation in Kabaneri, not even Peak Season 2 comes closes to this level let alone any work from MAPPA. Not that MAPPA is bad, but their staff quality overall is worse. Everyone in the industry would agree to that.

MAPPA didn‘t even put their best team for working on AoT. Just wait until we have footage to compare complex animation sequences such as the 3D-Maneuver gear scenes. You‘ll see where MAPPA is lacking. The episodes until know never required top-level animation. For doing dialogue heavy episodes every studio would be sufficient. And even then MAPPA delivered nothing special imo. It does not go any higher than what the source material provided in the first place, it even falls flat in comparison sometimes. The previous seasons on the other hand really helped to elevate it despite its flaws. MAPPA delivers a slightly worse than decent job, but AoT never had the standard for being just decent.

Harsha1314 said:
also do watch inuyashiki by mappa.

Krugerman said:





art wise WIT is def better than MAPPA, but animation-wise not rly, MAPPA does have better animation overall. ANd yea Kabaneri art was so fucking gorgeous- even more better than aot s2.

Harsha1314 said:
also becuase they worked on it for like 3 long years and nearly all their talent budget and effort went to it for almost 99.99 percent

Krugerman said:





art wise WIT is def better than MAPPA, but animation-wise not rly, MAPPA does have better animation overall. ANd yea Kabaneri art was so fucking gorgeous- even more better than aot s2.

Harsha1314 said:
no im saying wit would've nailed it with that much time and money if they were prod community. just saying no mappa's adaptation isn't anywhere as worse as you described it to be in which case s3 pt 1 was a nightmare to me

crypt0l0gy said:


Overall meaning what? Fluidity, Movement, what do you mean? I mean how can you give a comparison without specifically mentioning the advantages other than just the term “animation“? Art Style is also an integrated part of animation.

crypt0l0gy said:


Bro I dunno what you‘re smoking or we must have watched two separate shows. Levi vs Kenny Scene? Mikasa vs Kenny‘s Team? Historia vs Rod Reiss? The scouts on top of the wall? Eren‘s Hardening scenes? Flashback to Grisha’s Titan? Background Art for the cave? The gorgeous ED? Teaser with Berthold, Reiner & Zeke with contains the most polished art of the armored titan to this day?

Must be hard to have endured this nightmare.

crypt0l0gy said:


Bro I dunno what you‘re smoking or we must have watched two separate shows. Levi vs Kenny Scene? Mikasa vs Kenny‘s Team? Historia vs Rod Reiss? The scouts on top of the wall? Eren‘s Hardening scenes? Flashback to Grisha’s Titan? Background Art for the cave? The gorgeous ED? Teaser with Berthold, Reiner & Zeke with contains the most polished art of the armored titan to this day?

Must be hard to have endured this nightmare.

Krugerman said:



animation as in movement( sakuga)- MAPPA has had better animations and connections to freelancers compared to WIT. Their action and character acting is better compared to WIT too. For example JJk, GOH, dororo( although it was abit inconsistent in second half- it had rly good sakugas). Zombieland saga has rly good character acting, jjk, garo and goh has amazing action animation, dororo has amazing sword fighting animation and they have alot of connections to freelancers like i said,

JJk had so many freelancers like tanaka, watanabe, ishida, fujimototo and many others, Kakegurui also had tanaka, garo and goh had more or less similiar lvls of freelancers, dororo had also alot, dorohedoro- despite being a Cg anime had Gosei oda- a rly good animation to wrok on it. AOT has also Kameda for trailer and op and possibly even in upcoming acion scenes.

crypt0l0gy said:


Bro I dunno what you‘re smoking or we must have watched two separate shows. Levi vs Kenny Scene? Mikasa vs Kenny‘s Team? Historia vs Rod Reiss? The scouts on top of the wall? Eren‘s Hardening scenes? Flashback to Grisha’s Titan? Background Art for the cave? The gorgeous ED? Teaser with Berthold, Reiner & Zeke with contains the most polished art of the armored titan to this day?

Must be hard to have endured this nightmare.

crypt0l0gy said:


At which point did we have Sakuga Scenes in Season 4? Their work with JJK is really good, nothing on Bones top-level tho which is the best studio for such kind of anime imo. Also lacking a lot of fluidity (in-betweens) sometimes (as in EP7). As for AoT Imai and Ebisu are a far better fit than either Oda or Kameda. Almost all of these Animators worked on OPM S1 for example. Genos vs Saitama (done by Imai) is still far better and memorable than either contribution of Oda or Kameda imo.

Again MAPPA is a really solid studio but they don’t have this raw talented, highly experienced staff compared to other established studios.

Harsha1314 said:
yeah but they literally added all those fucking fights and bloody destroyed the entire characterization of mikasa. like they made her into a fkin 1 d simp for eren whereas in the manga they explored so much more about her! why her love for eren stands strong. why she feels like a motherly figure for erne. and even levi's characterization, well most of it is lost, like all the traits which show his human side and what you can see in him to look upto and also why u really shouldn't look up to him is all gone! the uprising arc in the manga was like the best one ok. even better than shiganshina retireval! compared to that i think this is a great adaptation which adds a lot more from the manga!

crypt0l0gy said:


We were talking about Animation in the first place but since you can‘t make a valid argument let‘s talk about the series composition. You know what? Isayama requested these changes on behave of a faster pacing because he wasn‘t satisfied with how the original handled it.

Sure some Mikasa and Levi‘s interactions got cut more heavily but again you‘re just searching for flaws now. If you want blame anyone then Isayama.

Oh I forgot MAPPA did cut more than entire chapters too! Oh we just get 16 Episodes for an adaptation til Chapter 122! Oh Reiner walking down the stair is now a 30s Clip with no emotional impact! MAPPA brought a nightmare /s

Harsha1314 said:
and fucking seriously u have yet to see anything at all. yes ep 3 was rather disappointing even for me but the anime onlies are down for it as the best ep of s4 to date with some of the best moments in the entire anime! You r comparing those huge ass revalations which were set up since s1 and comparing them to things which have been set up this season? cause ep 3 actually did justice to a lot of the set up of s1-s3 as well, at least to the anime onlies, and i have a ton of anime only friends. you must not have read the manga for s3 pt1 because then you wouldn't be shitting around this way

crypt0l0gy said:


We were talking about Animation in the first place but since you can‘t make a valid argument let‘s talk about the series composition. You know what? Isayama requested these changes on behave of a faster pacing because he wasn‘t satisfied with how the original handled it.

Sure some Mikasa and Levi‘s interactions got cut more heavily but again you‘re just searching for flaws now. If you want blame anyone then Isayama.

Oh I forgot MAPPA did cut more than entire chapters too! Oh we just get 16 Episodes for an adaptation til Chapter 122! Oh Reiner walking down the stair is now a 30s Clip with no emotional impact! MAPPA brought a nightmare /s

crypt0l0gy said:


At which point did we have Sakuga Scenes in Season 4? Their work with JJK is really good, nothing on Bones top-level tho which is the best studio for such kind of anime imo. Also lacking a lot of fluidity (in-betweens) sometimes (as in EP7). As for AoT Imai and Ebisu are a far better fit than either Oda or Kameda. Almost all of these Animators worked on OPM S1 for example. Genos vs Saitama (done by Imai) is still far better and memorable than either contribution of Oda or Kameda imo.

Again MAPPA is a really solid studio but they don’t have this raw talented, highly experienced staff compared to other established studios.

Harsha1314 said:
WTF???? did you just shit on kameda????? he literally made the best fight scene in fmab and almost all the epicness youve seen in mob psycho!!!

crypt0l0gy said:


Nah Kameda is a legend but he is more acquainted with Bones than MAPPA. Also his style is not the best fit for AoT. Besides in which way does his contribution to the OP where nothing is shown help to elevate the overall animation experience? If he isn‘t doing any action sequences which is his speciality and it wouldn’t be impossible considering the titans are mostly CG why bother with him in the first place?

Harsha1314 said:
no thats not fkin true for s3 pt1. no one would want their best arc to be butchered that way. i dont even think he is all that ok with the cuts in ep3 of s4. heh? how is reiner walking down stairs is supposed to have impact? its not like he knew he was walking into the basement like he was going to detonate a bomb is he? he just fkin followed falco. and what you said is so shitty and just proves yet again why s3 pt1 wouldve been a nightmare if i saw it the way you r seeing s4 which is the worst most shitty and meaningless elitist way possible.

Krugerman said:


I never said s4 has sakuga scenes I said for later eps, of course it's not as good as Bones- top lvl lol they have Fucking Nakamura. Imai and Ebisu are more experienced with AOt and besides we haven't' seen Kameda in action yet so it's too soon to judge. Also tbf the other studios like u mention- bones, Production Ig, A-1, Madhouse are very old studios and WIT is under IG and so they had alot of help while MAPPA just had the founder of MADHOUSE and that's it.

crypt0l0gy said:


Nah Kameda is a legend but he is more acquainted with Bones than MAPPA. Also his style is not the best fit for AoT. Besides in which way does his contribution to the OP where nothing is shown help to elevate the overall animation experience? If he isn‘t doing any action sequences which is his speciality and it wouldn’t be impossible considering the titans are mostly CG why bother with him in the first place?

Krugerman said:



pls stop both of u, Kodansha gave little eps for uprising and s4 but so far pacing for those- although a bit too fast was still enjoyable- don't overexaggerate and don't have double standards

crypt0l0gy said:


Your comment just further proved my point that WIT is in a better position overall and you don‘t even seem to realize it. Thank you.

On a side note: I‘m not here to hate on MAPPA in any way because they‘re a great studio but if we‘re talking facts let‘s talk facts.

Harsha1314 said:
no thats not fkin true for s3 pt1. no one would want their best arc to be butchered that way. i dont even think he is all that ok with the cuts in ep3 of s4. heh? how is reiner walking down stairs is supposed to have impact? its not like he knew he was walking into the basement like he was going to detonate a bomb is he? he just fkin followed falco. and what you said is so shitty and just proves yet again why s3 pt1 wouldve been a nightmare if i saw it the way you r seeing s4 which is the worst most shitty and meaningless elitist way possible.

Harsha1314 said:
nah i just meant that if i actually watched s3 pt1 the way he is watching s4 rn, i would've hated it no doubt. im just asking him to stop spreading false info and false "facts" on s4 and mappa which would give people the wrong idea and literally give space for more trolls

crypt0l0gy said:


Bro Isayama literally requested it, he wasn‘t satisfied with Uprising and how it was done in the manga, just look it up. Make him feel sorry that he thought this way or whatnot I don‘t know what I should tell you lol. Also this has nothing to do with the original discussion anymore so I‘ll leave it like that.

crypt0l0gy said:


Bro Isayama literally requested it, he wasn‘t satisfied with Uprising and how it was done in the manga, just look it up. Make him feel sorry that he thought this way or whatnot I don‘t know what I should tell you lol. Also this has nothing to do with the original discussion anymore so I‘ll leave it like that.

Krugerman said:





what false info did he spread?

Harsha1314 said:
then that's a lucas descision he made i'd say. in that case if he really did make changes for s4 as well as ive seen everywhere in internet, its not great.

Krugerman said:



His changes were good, nothing wrong- just that the pacing was too fast, anime and manga are different, we can look at uprising manga and anime and enjoy both the variations lol

Harsha1314 said:
about mappa not really being able to do it as good as wit maybe better, just cause he didn't like the art style and also comparing the current events to events which were set far before and established which were clearly superior to the ones so far in s4 even in manga

Krugerman said:



Both are good and talented studios but they have different ways to adapt. MAPPA went for a more realitic art while WIT was more asthetic and fantasy like. I like MAPPA cds more cause they look more realitic but WIT cds were also top tier, Sawano is better than Kohta but I still like Kohta's music style and the vibe it brings. MAPPA has CG while WIT has 2D titans- some people like 2D, some likes CG and some likes both, personally idc as long as it looks good. If I had a choice between s2 quality lvl titans or CG of course I'll choose 2D but compard to s3p2- eren vs reiner which was still decent- I prefer CG. WIT has better composition while MAPPA's is still good. MAPPA has better character animation but WIT's is abit stiff but still goood regardless

Harsha1314 said:
yeah man, that is what i mean! if i were to see s3 pt1 in the way he is watching s4 it wouldn't have been good at all! and please don't tell me animation of s3 pt1 was better because it had what 2 good fight scenes and 1 amazing one, s4 is having a lot more and till now we have only seen 1 which beats reiner v eren s3 pt2. and also if u realise he is pointing out there are no sakuga scenes whereas odm gear didnt enter the chat yet. thats bs

Krugerman said:





Liek I said, WIT is better in some aspects and MAPPA in other aspects. MAPPA animation is better for me and WIT has better art. If we are looking at s1 sakuga- it was amazing because IG helped them but s2 onwards IG was less and less involved leading to most of the scenes by Imai but regardless peak WIT has amazing art compared to MAPPA

Harsha1314 said:
yes i understand . imeant he is literally saying no way mappa could've done it as good as wit even if given enought ime because with the kabaneri reference it totally feels like he wanted to say something like that which is totally false

crypt0l0gy said:


Man we be running in cycles here. Again clearify what you mean by animation. It’s just a generic term for many aspects. Sakuga-wise this Season so far has nothing on the previous seasons not even close. So I don‘t understand how MAPPAs „animation“ by your definition is better when almost every episode so far had less action scenes than the previous ones if we talk only sakuga here. Even if MAPPA wanted they couldn’t prove that they‘re better. Maybe you mean CG-Sakuga? /s

Also MAPPAs art is more complex, especially for Zeke & Reiner than compared to wit. You could even say this is one aspect where MAPPA is superior. This would contradict with your claim but yeah how you feel about it is completely subjective tho. Anyways these statements again don’t add any relevant content we could talk about for further discussion.

Krugerman said:


idk man, I don't place any of them higher and it's unfair to WIT cause MAPPA used CG to lessen workload( I'm not discounting MAPPA's CG btw)
If we are talking abt Tv production then ( even though MAPPA used CG) I'll say

s2> s3p1 = s4 > s1 > s3p2

s1 had alot of good sakuga but other wise was abit meh for Tv version but blu ray improved all the issues i had with it

Krugerman said:



If both studios are given enough time, I'll say WIT will have better art but MAPPA will have better animation for action

Krugerman said:



Both are good and talented studios but they have different ways to adapt. MAPPA went for a more realitic art while WIT was more asthetic and fantasy like. I like MAPPA cds more cause they look more realitic but WIT cds were also top tier, Sawano is better than Kohta but I still like Kohta's music style and the vibe it brings. MAPPA has CG while WIT has 2D titans- some people like 2D, some likes CG and some likes both, personally idc as long as it looks good. If I had a choice between s2 quality lvl titans or CG of course I'll choose 2D but compard to s3p2- eren vs reiner which was still decent- I prefer CG. WIT has better composition while MAPPA's is still good. MAPPA has better character animation but WIT's is abit stiff but still goood regardless

Harsha1314 said:
about mappa not really being able to do it as good as wit maybe better, just cause he didn't like the art style and also comparing the current events to events which were set far before and established which were clearly superior to the ones so far in s4 even in manga

Harsha1314 said:
yes i understand . imeant he is literally saying no way mappa could've done it as good as wit even if given enought ime because with the kabaneri reference it totally feels like he wanted to say something like that which is totally false[/quote

You clearly have problems with comprehension. Even if it was my point how is voicing my opinion spreading false info? How old are you even? Also I mentioned earlier that MAPPAs art is definitely more complex. Did you even follow our conversation? You don’t have to mix up everything I said just because you dislike my views on things.

Harsha1314 said:
yes i understand . imeant he is literally saying no way mappa could've done it as good as wit even if given enought ime because with the kabaneri reference it totally feels like he wanted to say something like that which is totally false

crypt0l0gy said:
anyone can have an opinion. in that case even hitler had an opinion. apprently its false

crypt0l0gy said:


No I‘m just upset with the unreasonable hate for WIT. I tried to convey my perspective on why I think WIT would provide an overall better product if both studios would go all out.

crypt0l0gy said:


No I‘m just upset with the unreasonable hate for WIT. I tried to convey my perspective on why I think WIT would provide an overall better product if both studios would go all out.

Harsha1314 said:


Bruh you just mad kid. Talk to me again when you‘ve grown up ;)

Krugerman said:



no I meant as in MAPPA as a studio not aot s4 adaptation, like u brought in Kabaneri, WIT has better art from all it's projects but MAPPA has better animation overall from all it's projects, get it?

For s4 action let's wait and see

crypt0l0gy said:


Okay scene to scene comparison. Give me one scene by any MAPPA project that stands above Levi vs Kenny or Levi vs Beast. You guys don‘t seem to understand what level of complexity and visual thinking lies behind these scenes. The amount of talent you have to have to do this is almost non-measurable. Combat scenes like in Dragon Ball, BNH, JJK don‘t have this level of expertise. They rely more on exaggerating human movements and camera angles as well as Impact frames or Hand-to-Hand combat.