Love and Lies
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May 19, 6:54 AM
#1
I think the mangaka switched Misaki’s and Ririna’s personalities in their respective route endings. For example, in Misaki’s route, Ririna leaves the main character after being rejected—even though she was the one who encouraged him to go after Misaki from the beginning. She later developed feelings for him but was always supportive, even if he ended up with Misaki. On the other hand, in Ririna’s route, Misaki starts acting strangely. She almost sacrifices herself by jumping, just because she can't be with the main character due to his illness and treatment. But then she suddenly becomes okay with everything and tells him she just wants him to remember that she was his first love. At that point, it feels like she suddenly adopted Ririna’s personality. Instead of going with separate routes, I think the author should have gone with a single ending where the main character chooses Misaki, and Ririna supports them—because that’s how the story was progressing before that weird illness twist came out of nowhere. The whole point of the manga was about choosing your own partner instead of being forced by the government into a relationship. The Ririna route completely ruins that message and basically supports the idea of just accepting what the government decides for you. And if you believe that the main character actually loved Ririna, then what was even the point of the story? He was already assigned to her from the start. Everything that happened from the beginning would lose its meaning in that case. |
May 20, 1:54 AM
#2
Misaki starts acting strangely? First of all, Misaki has been in constant worry and thought throughout the entire manga due to her illicit love for Yukari and the failure of her parents marriage. With such burdens of having to choose between the one she loves or her assigned partner, and the ramifications of choosing Yukari whilst being fully aware of the potential health risks Yukari may suffer. It makes sense that such a person would make irrational impulsive decisions. To address Misaki 'almost jumping' in the Ririna chapters, I don't think she had any intention to jump. Prior to her knowing that Yukari had come after her, she was just at the edge of the cliff staring out in to the distance. As soon as she saw Yukari, she decided to jump. This was probably because her mind instantly went to the conclusion that Yukari has come to rescue her, where he has probably made up his mind to accept her as his partner. Misaki throughout the entire manga has made it clear that she is against being with Yukari even if it collides with their mutual feelings for each other. After Yukari successfully pulls her up, she admits that she would have returned home and gone to school as if nothing had happened. This clearly means that she had no intention of jumping, but impulsively jumped at the first sight of unexpectedly seeing Yukari, as she really didn't want Yukari to choose her. Also, Misaki hasn't shown any suicidal thoughts in the past, she most likely ventured in to the forest because she had just received details of her assigned partner that she is reluctant to get with , so goes to the one place that she is able to think and sort out her feelings. You also say that the illness of Yukari came out of nowhere. The actions of Misaki were foreshadowing that there is some barrier preventing her from expressing her love to Yukari. She even explicitly says that there is a secret that can not be exposed, which then gets exposed by Shuu Igurashi. You view the mangas message to be to choose one's own partner. However the manga goes against this message frequently through the portrayal of the failed marriage of Misaki's parents and the quarrelsome marriage of the parents of Ichijou. Also every marriage set up through the government system is a success where the divorce rate is very low. Even the marriage between Ichijou and her husband seems to be going well, even though she continues to have lingering feelings for Yajima. I would say the true message of the manga is to believe and trust in the government system, due to it's effectiveness. In terms of real life, how many high school sweet hearts do you know? From what I've seen such relationships from high school don't last and are temporary. My thoughts honestly oppose yours as I think the Ririna ending is the better ending. It's true that Yukari did not love Ririna from the very start, however love is a complicated feeling that takes time to appear. Yukari was definitely attracted to Ririna as he clearly stated that he has never seen such a girl of such beauty apart from Misaki when first taking a glimpse of Ririna during their first meeting. Due to him being so blinded by his love for Misaki, he wasn't considering Ririna as a potential partner as his mind was so clouded by the thought of plotting a way of getting with Misaki even if it's frowned upon by the government and society. When Yukari and Ririna start to spend more time together, he sees the unique charm that Ririna has. This formed through the time he spent with her in the forest, initiating a kiss with her when they shared a room for the first time and how passionate she was to fulfill Yukari's desire of getting with Misaki even if there will be consequences on her side. Basically, love takes time to blossom. Some of the only reasons for Yukari liking Misaki would be her appearance and his observation of her personality within a school setting. His liking for Misaki was more of a crush as he hadn't spent a significant time with her, he had concluded that he 'loves' Misaki based on his attraction to her and her appearance. Attraction does first initiate as being physically attracted to someone, however for it to transition to love, there needs to be some more substance apart from just being appearance based. So I would say he eventually does truly loves Ririna because he spends significant private time with her and truly gets to know her. Also they are biologically and psychologically meant to be compatible through the government testing, so it adds another layer to why he ends up loving Ririna. |
May 20, 4:11 AM
#3
Reply to kou_starz
Misaki starts acting strangely?
First of all, Misaki has been in constant worry and thought throughout the entire manga due to her illicit love for Yukari and the failure of her parents marriage. With such burdens of having to choose between the one she loves or her assigned partner, and the ramifications of choosing Yukari whilst being fully aware of the potential health risks Yukari may suffer. It makes sense that such a person would make irrational impulsive decisions.
To address Misaki 'almost jumping' in the Ririna chapters, I don't think she had any intention to jump. Prior to her knowing that Yukari had come after her, she was just at the edge of the cliff staring out in to the distance. As soon as she saw Yukari, she decided to jump. This was probably because her mind instantly went to the conclusion that Yukari has come to rescue her, where he has probably made up his mind to accept her as his partner. Misaki throughout the entire manga has made it clear that she is against being with Yukari even if it collides with their mutual feelings for each other. After Yukari successfully pulls her up, she admits that she would have returned home and gone to school as if nothing had happened. This clearly means that she had no intention of jumping, but impulsively jumped at the first sight of unexpectedly seeing Yukari, as she really didn't want Yukari to choose her. Also, Misaki hasn't shown any suicidal thoughts in the past, she most likely ventured in to the forest because she had just received details of her assigned partner that she is reluctant to get with , so goes to the one place that she is able to think and sort out her feelings.
You also say that the illness of Yukari came out of nowhere. The actions of Misaki were foreshadowing that there is some barrier preventing her from expressing her love to Yukari. She even explicitly says that there is a secret that can not be exposed, which then gets exposed by Shuu Igurashi.
You view the mangas message to be to choose one's own partner. However the manga goes against this message frequently through the portrayal of the failed marriage of Misaki's parents and the quarrelsome marriage of the parents of Ichijou. Also every marriage set up through the government system is a success where the divorce rate is very low. Even the marriage between Ichijou and her husband seems to be going well, even though she continues to have lingering feelings for Yajima. I would say the true message of the manga is to believe and trust in the government system, due to it's effectiveness. In terms of real life, how many high school sweet hearts do you know? From what I've seen such relationships from high school don't last and are temporary.
My thoughts honestly oppose yours as I think the Ririna ending is the better ending.
It's true that Yukari did not love Ririna from the very start, however love is a complicated feeling that takes time to appear. Yukari was definitely attracted to Ririna as he clearly stated that he has never seen such a girl of such beauty apart from Misaki when first taking a glimpse of Ririna during their first meeting. Due to him being so blinded by his love for Misaki, he wasn't considering Ririna as a potential partner as his mind was so clouded by the thought of plotting a way of getting with Misaki even if it's frowned upon by the government and society.
When Yukari and Ririna start to spend more time together, he sees the unique charm that Ririna has. This formed through the time he spent with her in the forest, initiating a kiss with her when they shared a room for the first time and how passionate she was to fulfill Yukari's desire of getting with Misaki even if there will be consequences on her side.
Basically, love takes time to blossom. Some of the only reasons for Yukari liking Misaki would be her appearance and his observation of her personality within a school setting. His liking for Misaki was more of a crush as he hadn't spent a significant time with her, he had concluded that he 'loves' Misaki based on his attraction to her and her appearance. Attraction does first initiate as being physically attracted to someone, however for it to transition to love, there needs to be some more substance apart from just being appearance based.
So I would say he eventually does truly loves Ririna because he spends significant private time with her and truly gets to know her. Also they are biologically and psychologically meant to be compatible through the government testing, so it adds another layer to why he ends up loving Ririna.
| @kou_starz I can agree with some of your points—like Misaki waiting for the MC before jumping, and the MC starting to like both Misaki and Ririna near the end of the manga before choosing either one. But I completely disagree with your point that the manga tries to show the government marriage system as a complete success. Misaki's ending literally shows that you can choose your own happiness without being forced. It's not just about my personal view—it’s clearly evident that the main theme of the manga is either surrendering to the system and letting the government choose for you, or standing up for yourself and choosing your own partner. It's also obvious that the MC likes both Misaki and Ririna before the story branches into different routes. And in Ririna's ending, it's just a coincidence that he ends up liking the girl the government paired him with. That coincidence doesn't carry any meaningful message. Put yourself in this situation: you have a fatal disease, and the government is blackmailing the person you love into accepting a partner who has athletic genes, just so they can produce a genetically talented child. This system isn’t about love—it’s more like a business deal meant to gain something. I don’t know about you, but I believe in choosing for myself without being forced to pick a life partner. That’s why I prefer Misaki’s ending. You know what? If you reversed the roles—if Ririna had been his childhood love and Misaki the new girl or the government-assigned partner—then I would’ve chosen Ririna. Simply put, I like both Misaki and Ririna as characters. Personality-wise, Ririna is much better, while Misaki is more appealing looks-wise. If the author had made Ririna the first love and Misaki the new partner, and then the MC chose Ririna in a single, absolute route, I would have loved that ending. But that would have felt like a copy-paste of Nisekoi, which is probably why we got the ending we did. As per the current story, I prefer Misaki as the love interest only because the MC has the freedom to choose or reject her. With Ririna, I always feel like it’s surrendering to the government—like being forced. And there’s no way everyone could be happy under that kind of system. If Japan’s population is declining, it's more because of depression, and forcing people to love someone won’t solve that core issue. |
Deadwings1889May 20, 4:17 AM
May 20, 3:32 PM
#4
Deadwings1889 said: @kou_starz I can agree with some of your points—like Misaki waiting for the MC before jumping, and the MC starting to like both Misaki and Ririna near the end of the manga before choosing either one. But I completely disagree with your point that the manga tries to show the government marriage system as a complete success. Misaki's ending literally shows that you can choose your own happiness without being forced. It's not just about my personal view—it’s clearly evident that the main theme of the manga is either surrendering to the system and letting the government choose for you, or standing up for yourself and choosing your own partner. It's also obvious that the MC likes both Misaki and Ririna before the story branches into different routes. And in Ririna's ending, it's just a coincidence that he ends up liking the girl the government paired him with. That coincidence doesn't carry any meaningful message. Put yourself in this situation: you have a fatal disease, and the government is blackmailing the person you love into accepting a partner who has athletic genes, just so they can produce a genetically talented child. This system isn’t about love—it’s more like a business deal meant to gain something. I don’t know about you, but I believe in choosing for myself without being forced to pick a life partner. That’s why I prefer Misaki’s ending. You know what? If you reversed the roles—if Ririna had been his childhood love and Misaki the new girl or the government-assigned partner—then I would’ve chosen Ririna. Simply put, I like both Misaki and Ririna as characters. Personality-wise, Ririna is much better, while Misaki is more appealing looks-wise. If the author had made Ririna the first love and Misaki the new partner, and then the MC chose Ririna in a single, absolute route, I would have loved that ending. But that would have felt like a copy-paste of Nisekoi, which is probably why we got the ending we did. As per the current story, I prefer Misaki as the love interest only because the MC has the freedom to choose or reject her. With Ririna, I always feel like it’s surrendering to the government—like being forced. And there’s no way everyone could be happy under that kind of system. If Japan’s population is declining, it's more because of depression, and forcing people to love someone won’t solve that core issue. I understand that you think that one should have their own autonomy in regards to picking their life partner and establishing a romantic relationship with another. Of course the government system isn't always a success where there will be a miniscule percentage of couples that do end up not being as compatible or not reproducing as intended. While I get why the idea of love should be rooted in freedom, the wider impact of systemic pairings deserves more credit. There is a clash in our views. You think that one should have the free will and autonomy to naturally choose their own partners. I oppose that and think that society is already enabling people to choose their own partners, however there are so many issues such as an epidemic of male loneliness, high divorce rate, females having incredibly high standards, record high number of male virgins in their 20s and of course the low birth rate. If this government system is leading to more successful marriages and increase in the birth rate where it lowers the societal issues named previously, then I'm totally an advocate of the government system. You've also made an assumption that Yukari likes both Ririna and Misaki, and also that Yukari loves Misaki. Yukari is 16 years old and initiating his romance journey, he likely doesn't know what love is. From the details we are as the viewers are aware of, this liking he has for Misaki is very superficial and has no real substance to it. I remember reading this chapter where Yukari was asking Misaki why she genuinely likes him as he is aware that he is just the average guy and there are many other guys that Misaki could have easily fallen for. So it's likely that Yukari's liking for Misaki is him having a first crush and mistaking it for love. Love is quite a complicated feeling which encompasses many different factors such as their appearance, personality, etiquette, manners and memories made with them. It's not just solely based on appearance and seeing them in a school setting. If I was in the situation of Yukari where the government was providing the option for my crush to get with a partner with desirable genetics, I would feel slightly disheartened,. However I understand that the government will partner me up with someone that I'm scientifically compatible with, who I'll likely like more than someone I choose myself. If you've ever been on dating apps, you'll know how hard it is as a guy to get a date with a girl that you are genuinely attracted to. You mentioned that Japan's birth rate is probably declining because of depression. I disagree and think it's more of an economic problem. If men were able to work an average job and support an entire family, women wouldn't also need to compete in male dominated fields. Due to women also having to work to live a comfortable life, they delay getting married and giving birth where this does not align with their biology as they are in their prime in their early 20s. Also, women working intensifies hypergamy as they will be seeking for a guy more capable than them in terms of the guys wealth and income, which increases their standards. I understand that this system in koi to uso seems kind of dystopian where there is an aspect of eugenics. You dislike how the government is almost forcing people to get with their assigned partner. However the couple are almost guaranteed to be compatible and like each other and if it's tackling many of the societal issues mentioned previously, I would be an advocate for it. |
Jul 13, 7:17 PM
#5
Reply to kou_starz
Deadwings1889 said:
@kou_starz
I can agree with some of your points—like Misaki waiting for the MC before jumping, and the MC starting to like both Misaki and Ririna near the end of the manga before choosing either one. But I completely disagree with your point that the manga tries to show the government marriage system as a complete success. Misaki's ending literally shows that you can choose your own happiness without being forced.
It's not just about my personal view—it’s clearly evident that the main theme of the manga is either surrendering to the system and letting the government choose for you, or standing up for yourself and choosing your own partner. It's also obvious that the MC likes both Misaki and Ririna before the story branches into different routes. And in Ririna's ending, it's just a coincidence that he ends up liking the girl the government paired him with. That coincidence doesn't carry any meaningful message.
Put yourself in this situation: you have a fatal disease, and the government is blackmailing the person you love into accepting a partner who has athletic genes, just so they can produce a genetically talented child. This system isn’t about love—it’s more like a business deal meant to gain something.
I don’t know about you, but I believe in choosing for myself without being forced to pick a life partner. That’s why I prefer Misaki’s ending.
You know what? If you reversed the roles—if Ririna had been his childhood love and Misaki the new girl or the government-assigned partner—then I would’ve chosen Ririna. Simply put, I like both Misaki and Ririna as characters. Personality-wise, Ririna is much better, while Misaki is more appealing looks-wise.
If the author had made Ririna the first love and Misaki the new partner, and then the MC chose Ririna in a single, absolute route, I would have loved that ending. But that would have felt like a copy-paste of Nisekoi, which is probably why we got the ending we did.
As per the current story, I prefer Misaki as the love interest only because the MC has the freedom to choose or reject her. With Ririna, I always feel like it’s surrendering to the government—like being forced. And there’s no way everyone could be happy under that kind of system. If Japan’s population is declining, it's more because of depression, and forcing people to love someone won’t solve that core issue.
@kou_starz
I can agree with some of your points—like Misaki waiting for the MC before jumping, and the MC starting to like both Misaki and Ririna near the end of the manga before choosing either one. But I completely disagree with your point that the manga tries to show the government marriage system as a complete success. Misaki's ending literally shows that you can choose your own happiness without being forced.
It's not just about my personal view—it’s clearly evident that the main theme of the manga is either surrendering to the system and letting the government choose for you, or standing up for yourself and choosing your own partner. It's also obvious that the MC likes both Misaki and Ririna before the story branches into different routes. And in Ririna's ending, it's just a coincidence that he ends up liking the girl the government paired him with. That coincidence doesn't carry any meaningful message.
Put yourself in this situation: you have a fatal disease, and the government is blackmailing the person you love into accepting a partner who has athletic genes, just so they can produce a genetically talented child. This system isn’t about love—it’s more like a business deal meant to gain something.
I don’t know about you, but I believe in choosing for myself without being forced to pick a life partner. That’s why I prefer Misaki’s ending.
You know what? If you reversed the roles—if Ririna had been his childhood love and Misaki the new girl or the government-assigned partner—then I would’ve chosen Ririna. Simply put, I like both Misaki and Ririna as characters. Personality-wise, Ririna is much better, while Misaki is more appealing looks-wise.
If the author had made Ririna the first love and Misaki the new partner, and then the MC chose Ririna in a single, absolute route, I would have loved that ending. But that would have felt like a copy-paste of Nisekoi, which is probably why we got the ending we did.
As per the current story, I prefer Misaki as the love interest only because the MC has the freedom to choose or reject her. With Ririna, I always feel like it’s surrendering to the government—like being forced. And there’s no way everyone could be happy under that kind of system. If Japan’s population is declining, it's more because of depression, and forcing people to love someone won’t solve that core issue.
I understand that you think that one should have their own autonomy in regards to picking their life partner and establishing a romantic relationship with another. Of course the government system isn't always a success where there will be a miniscule percentage of couples that do end up not being as compatible or not reproducing as intended. While I get why the idea of love should be rooted in freedom, the wider impact of systemic pairings deserves more credit.
There is a clash in our views. You think that one should have the free will and autonomy to naturally choose their own partners. I oppose that and think that society is already enabling people to choose their own partners, however there are so many issues such as an epidemic of male loneliness, high divorce rate, females having incredibly high standards, record high number of male virgins in their 20s and of course the low birth rate. If this government system is leading to more successful marriages and increase in the birth rate where it lowers the societal issues named previously, then I'm totally an advocate of the government system.
You've also made an assumption that Yukari likes both Ririna and Misaki, and also that Yukari loves Misaki. Yukari is 16 years old and initiating his romance journey, he likely doesn't know what love is. From the details we are as the viewers are aware of, this liking he has for Misaki is very superficial and has no real substance to it. I remember reading this chapter where Yukari was asking Misaki why she genuinely likes him as he is aware that he is just the average guy and there are many other guys that Misaki could have easily fallen for. So it's likely that Yukari's liking for Misaki is him having a first crush and mistaking it for love. Love is quite a complicated feeling which encompasses many different factors such as their appearance, personality, etiquette, manners and memories made with them. It's not just solely based on appearance and seeing them in a school setting.
If I was in the situation of Yukari where the government was providing the option for my crush to get with a partner with desirable genetics, I would feel slightly disheartened,. However I understand that the government will partner me up with someone that I'm scientifically compatible with, who I'll likely like more than someone I choose myself.
If you've ever been on dating apps, you'll know how hard it is as a guy to get a date with a girl that you are genuinely attracted to.
You mentioned that Japan's birth rate is probably declining because of depression. I disagree and think it's more of an economic problem. If men were able to work an average job and support an entire family, women wouldn't also need to compete in male dominated fields. Due to women also having to work to live a comfortable life, they delay getting married and giving birth where this does not align with their biology as they are in their prime in their early 20s. Also, women working intensifies hypergamy as they will be seeking for a guy more capable than them in terms of the guys wealth and income, which increases their standards.
I understand that this system in koi to uso seems kind of dystopian where there is an aspect of eugenics. You dislike how the government is almost forcing people to get with their assigned partner. However the couple are almost guaranteed to be compatible and like each other and if it's tackling many of the societal issues mentioned previously, I would be an advocate for it.
| @kou_starz Thanks for your reply. I completely forgot about this form. I respect your opinion — it's just that our views on the story are quite different, which is totally fine. I appreciate you taking the time to fill out the form and share your thoughts. |
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