| Some of you may know the often asked question of why ToG isn't published on MAL. This is because MAL claims that Naver (and other webtoon sites) is not a publisher. Here are their reasons: (http://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=592709&show=0#msg23049281) Reason one: A more extensive answer: However, if you read my posts at the end of this thread, you can see undeniable proof of the complete opposite. Do not only take my word for it. Search it up yourself of you would like. Using the phrase "naver publishing webtoon" to search will be just fine. This means, webtoon readers, that you can now add not only ToG but any webtoon to the database - you always could. However, MAL refuses to see this and simply passes off a fan's desire to see ToG (and/or other webtoon) on the database as feelings and nothing else. As of currently, there has been no huge or sufficient proof of Naver's publication abilities (that I have seen, anyway) until now. Please spread the word as much as you can of this evidence. By doing this you add not only ToG but other webtoon stories as well. This struggle of webtoon and MAL can come to an end faster than you may think. |
TomDayMar 7, 2018 11:15 AM
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| the mal rules themselves are somewhat confusing. They may apply to some but not on another manhwa that fits the description. I can draw up a license contract with my best friend and post her comics on the internet, too. And she can work herself into the ground to meet the stipulations I give her. But I am not a reputable publishing company, even though I may be publishing her work digitally. Many authors can get a license but only the best are chosen by naver. I think people should read this. Challenge Manhwa which are pretty much the equivalent of trade shows for amateurs. Anyone can submit Challenge Manhwa, they are not paid for it, it is more of a hobby. Best Manhwa which are the best among Challenge Manhwa. Naver handpicks people from the Challenge Manhwa category to promote them to Best Manhwa. This simply means that they are growing in popularity. They are still essentially amateurs, they are still not paid by Naver. This is comparable to Akamaru Jump/Jump NEXT!. The most popular manhwa from this section are often promoted to webtoons. Webtoons are exclusively professionals handpicked by Naver. They are often moved up to this category from Best Manhwa unless they are already an established manhwa artist/author. There is absolutely no reason not to think of this as an equivalent to being published as it is literally the exact same thing in a digital format (which the database specifically allows for). The process itself shows how professional and picky naver is which should help people understand webtoons are not just a ''hobby'' for authors. Also, reLIFE is a wecomic. But since its japenese, it was added. Now thats just plain discrimination >_< :D I really wonder if the mods will read this and go on with the same BS like its not a publisher and stuff. They have their own website(collaborated with Line i guess--which is another reputable company), they are improving constantly. Even trying out anime adaptations!!!! @allenvonstein @logic340 What do you guys think of it? |
ironaceJul 8, 2016 12:38 AM
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ironace said: Also, reLIFE is a wecomic. But since its japenese, it was added. Now thats just plain discrimination >_< :D I really wonder if the mods will read this and go on with the same BS like its not a publisher and stuff. They have their own website(collaborated with Line i guess--which is another reputable company), they are improving constantly. Even trying out anime adaptations!!!! lol i forgot about that. it is indeed a webcomic. kamerl2 said: I agree that MAL guideline is little ambiguous. I think all people have their own definition about publisher, reputable, publishing etc. They need too make their rule more clear. they aren't vague at all. you may only add webtoon/comic only if they are published by an official company (as if you would need to say that about manga). For example Lezhincomics is webtoon publisher, and they start publishing business(printed book) (I already write about that on MangaDB Forum) So why I can't add lezhin webtoons? you're right, without a doubt lezhin comics is certinaly a publisher. MAL just doesn't want to either acknowledge that or go through all the trouble of adding new webtoon content. sure manga gets added all the time, but if they allowed webtoon to be added there would be a gigantic influx of adding from all the stuff they missed over the years. ------ update: found more proof that webtoon are indeed published online by whatever website, naver is not specific in any way. 1: 2: 3: 5:40 - 6:18 *pay special attention to 5:56 - 6:04* again, spread word as much as you can with others. |
TomDayMar 7, 2018 11:17 AM
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Laugasts said: True. Some Webtoons are produced by high quality Art Studios like YLAB. the heck is YLAB, lol. |
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| also: by MAL's rules, a webtoon needs to be published (physical) before making it to the DB. here is an explanation here: (http://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=1364388) Only manga published by reputable publishing companies will be admitted to the manga database, with the following exceptions: Manhwa is in the exceptions, but it has to be published, too: c. Manhwa, Manhua: professionally published comics made in Korea or China for their respective markets. however, in anilist they say almost the exact same thing: (http://anilist.co/guidelines#new) Type Manga - Professionally published manga with more than one chapter. Novel - Light Novels. Manhua - Professionally published comics made in China. Manhwa - Professionally published comics made in Korea. and, as expected, they allow webtoon/comics. they basically say the same thing but are treated differently for some reason. |
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| @Laugasts oh wow, terror man! i read that, it's so good. just a question, would they have anything to do with this? http://english.donga.com/Home/3/all/26/521814/1 |
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YoyoIsMyNickname said: I swear this is genuine horseshit, a lot of the rules are contradicting themselves MAL has been called out multiple times for being biased and straight up making no sense. the most we have ever received are snarky, disgusting replied from the ignorant mods. |
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| I think the real reason is that if they allowed 'unpublished' webtoons, the database would double. This means more data, but more importantly, more upkeep work. That being said, I think their stated reasons are utter bullcrap and they should just own up to not having the manpower to support webtoons. The reasons they stated are utter garbage. Naver is a media company that dominates Korea. To my knowledge, there are news articles hosted by Naver, along with other content. They are one of the biggest, if not THE dominant media outlet. According to wikiL https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naver, it started out akin to google search engine, but is owned by Naver corporation, which is an internet content service provider. They publish korean video content on their 'youtube' V-Live, Webtoons, etc. etc. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naver_(corporation) They are the most legitimate company you could find in Korea, and they sure as hell publish content. It's just not published in the same way, it's not print media. And that being the distinction is almost discriminatory towards the digital market Korea aims toward. Korea is a very different media market than Japan, so I can understand the desire to keep the website centered around Japanese animation, but manhwa go hand in hand. I think 5 years ago (if not longer) it might have been okay to not have webtoons, because they were 'unproven'. But now? Korean webtoons are becoming more and more integrated in manga reading databases. Perhaps have a chapter requirement, but it should be ingrained into this database too. I think the issue is really, possibly developing an API that can auto upload the pages with relevant information... but since it's all sourced on a small number of websites it shouldn't actually be that difficult. This is all coming from someone that's actually not a big webtoon reader. I've read a bunch, but I'm honestly not a big fan of any one series, and have been out of touch in a lot of ways. But even I, am seeing more and more webtoons come into the mainstream. What the mods here are doing, is actually really ignorant in some ways. I have been hearing news from DKDKTV who are korean youtubers who comment on kpop/korean society. They, among others, have made it very clear that Naver is the main source of entertainment in Korea, and control the media. If something is not reported on Naver, or if it's hidden by Naver due to corruption (which there apparently is a lot therein), then no one will know. They are very powerful and have a lot of control. For the mods to make Naver seem like a small, unestablished and unreputable company, is hot garbage. Naver Corporation (which owns Naver Webtoons) is ranked #34 on Forbes' Top 100 Digital Companies in 2018 Naver on the Forbes Top 100 Digital Companies List https://www.forbes.com/companies/naver/ Also according to forbes, they are Korea's biggest internet company https://www.forbes.com/sites/elaineramirez/2017/03/19/south-korean-tech-giant-has-its-first-female-ceo/ Here's an article showcasing that though Naver doesn't publish articles itself, it's aggregation of content is powerful. https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/12/naver-news-ad-revenue/547412/ Naver is very legitimate, and many koreans digest digital media, that Naver is distributing to them. It's as reputable as you get in Korea, and the mods are beyond out of touch if they are STILL hiding behind the rubbish argument of illegitimacy. EDIT: Also, just to quote the atlantic article: The company directly pays 124 outlets as “Naver News in-link partners.” The outlets’ stories are published on Naver’s portal, making the site a one-stop source of articles and video and eliminating the need for readers to leave and visit the original news site. |
DarkAngelzJan 28, 2019 8:07 PM
| @DarkAngelz saying the database would double isn't good enough reasoning, since (1 they should have done it long ago, and traffic wouldn't have built as it has now and (2 other sites have done it, it can't be that hard. it's nice to see that info on naver (which btw it recently hit 1tril won aka 1bill dollars); if you would like to see more of the legitmacy of naver and the webtoon insutry, i suggest you waltz over to the news thread, where i try to piece any piece of small information on what's going on right now. i very much agree on your mods post as well. it's clear their rules are drowned in ignorance and what's more they don't care. that's what they're being call out on the most, more than their not acknowledging webtoon. their plain ignorance and titanic bias to manga has been exposed repeatedly. |
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| I keep track of my approved submissions. I’ve also recently started keeping track of my denied submissions. Here are some: I noticed that my manhwa submissions get denied right away compared to my manga submissions. Seldom do my manga submissions get denied, the only reason is it’s probably a duplicate entry. Some of my manga submissions take a while to get approved whereas some do get approved immediately. That’s never the case with my few manhwa submissions. I only try to submit titles that I really like or have read because I know manhwa are rarely approved. But when I submit manhwa or even manga I check across a number of official manhwa reading sites as well as the database queue. And most of the titles can be found in more than one site like Lezhin, Bomtoon, Tappytoon, Ridi Books and Mr. Blue. Some titles even have official English translations which can be found in Lezhin and INKR Comics. Other popular titles even have their own K-drama. MAL should really update their database guidelines or at least their list of reputable publishers. I think by now manhwa found in Lezhin, Naver, Kakao, Tappytoon, Bomtoon, Ridi Books and Mr. Blue should be approved. They’re pretty reputable and carry the more popular manhwa and manga titles. There’re also Toomics, Webcomics, TOPTOON, Manta and Netcomics. Most of these sites have official translations in Korean, English, Japanese, French, Spanish and so on. The ones in Webtoon or Tapas are debatable and need more scrutiny because not only manga and manhwa can be found there. Lezhin only publishes manhwa and manga on their site unlike Webtoon or Tapas. Those published by Lezhin often have official Korean and English translations and sometimes Japanese and get physical copies eventually. MAL moderators should acquaint themselves with more manhwa publishers/sites. The trend is also leaning more on digital so they should shouldn’t always require titles to have physical copies. I mean they do approve some anime aired mainly on YouTube as well as PVs and CMs. Do they require anime be shown first on TV/theater and have physical copies before approval? It’ll be a lot easier if they provide a list of what they consider as reputable publishers. |
| So MAL is finally adding more webtoons, digital-only manga and manhwa: Manga DB Expands: More webtoons & digital-only manga to be added Here's MAL's list of what they consider as reputable webtoon/manhwa publishers so far: Cycomics GANMA! KakaoPage Lezhin Comics Webtoon Naver Webtoon They should consider manga/manwha from these sites as well: INKR Comics Bomtoon Tappytoon Ridi Books Mr. Blue Toomics Webcomics TOPTOON Manta Netcomics While those in Webtoon and Tapas need more scrutiny. |
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