| 1. As an adaptation? What could it have kept from the VN (which I have not read except for the first 3 hours)? Which of the changes made were good, seemed logical or were just blasphemous? 2. As an anime? (anime alone, NOT adaptation) 3. Anything (minor or major) you feel could have been done to make it better? 4. Was Shirou butchered again?? I wouldn't know. How was all the other character development? 5. Want to compare it to DEEN FSN, go ahead. Try using the spoiler tag. Try not to turn this into a FSN vs FZ war. We can (and should) do that once HF is out. Personally, while I can't answer Q1, Season 2 lack bite and just wasn't tight (I don't know what else to call it). FZ felt well done and complete overall, like a finished product, like a perfect football performance from a great team which won 4-0. UBW though felt 3/4 complete and put in a great performance but did have to defend a lot at times, won 3-1. Sorry for the confusing analogy. And I am comparing the two simply because the same studio made it. |
| As an anime alone, if not for the production value and pretty visuals/action scenes, the writing is actually on par with your ordinary harem/action/ecchi light novel story. Might read the vn someday, read some parts of it before and I don't find it that bad. The main issue I have with this adaption is the characters. Shirou kind of got his spotlight taken away by the other more appealing characters like the servants. And I don't feel much of a connection with shirou. All I know was that he was saved in a fire by kiritsugu and had low self esteem. Which I think requires more explanation. Doesn't really make sense that you have low self worth if your life is saved before. (Would you feel crappier as a human if you have been saved from drowning/fire/natural disasters before?) Development in the second season was awkward. That's because shirou's ideals of 'saving everyone' was not fully explained. To me, shirou just looked like someone with chunni trying to imitate his idol. In the end, he wasn't somebody I could sympathise or put my perspective into him because I feel no connection to him at all. You don't get to grow with him. You know what I mean? :x I think it would be better if they give us more of a connection between the main character and the viewers. By that I mean show us his thoughts and feelings. E.g. The shirou episode (epi 1?) should be in first person perspective instead of third. Then we would know what he felt when he recalls bout the fire. If i had to describe the episode in one line, it would be 'cameraman follows behind Shirou for 40 minutes'. Just my two cents. Not hating (though my first line was kind of harsh). ^^ |
UzukichanJun 21, 2015 9:57 PM
| 1. Never read the VN so I can't answer that. 2. As an anime it was entertaining every week but it wasn't as good as some other anime I was watching this season. Gets an 8/10 overall. 3. Lacked clarity on a lot of parts and unless you read the visual novel, you wouldn't grasp all of what was happening. Shirou was very inconsistent throughout the entire adaptation and needed more build up on his fighting. More Saber and less school bullshit from the first season. Not enough Sakura and yes I know HF will have her being much more of a presence. The fight between Gil vs Shirou was very disappointing and so was Lancers end. 4. Shirou as I said before was inconsistent and yes I think he wasn't done all that well. Too preachy and just plain. Very hollow and lacked depth imho. 5. Never seen DEEN so can't answer. Why did you bring up Fate Zero? This has nothing to do with Zero and you are just inviting this thread to spiral out of control. |
Gov said: Why did you bring up Fate Zero? This has nothing to do with Zero and you are just inviting this thread to spiral out of control.  |
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ZeroDragon said: Gov said: Why did you bring up Fate Zero? This has nothing to do with Zero and you are just inviting this thread to spiral out of control.  |
| 1. To be frank. Shit. The only good changes were Shirou's design and Taiga visiting Kerry's grave. Everything else that was changed or removed, mostly caused things to go for the worse or created problems in the future. 2. A generic, if flashy, shonen fighting show. Good to pass time if you turn off your brain. 3. Different director and an actually competent staff for starters. Then of I don't know - how about NOT trying to turn it into some ensemble cast show? 4. Yes. As was Medea, Sasaki and Rin. But none of them to the degree Shirou was. At least DEENFSN simply forgot to cover his personality or details that explain his actions. UfoFSN outright has altered scenes to make him look worse. 5. UFOFSN has better animation. And soundtrack(too bad you don't hear it most of time and it is in very short segments). DEEN FSN has better emotion and atmosphere set up. |
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| *I'll only answer two. Objectively speaking, it's a solid 8/10. |
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| 2. As an anime, pretty good, weekly entertainment. Climax episode was great, it made all the journey from 1st episode worth it, and made me thinking about giving it about 8/10 (previously 7/10). Still thinking though coz some other episodes sometimes felt lackluster. 3. The ones that could be done better is characterization imo. Also idk why but usually I can't get enough tension or feels atmosphere in many episodes, only some are good. Many episodes feel, mm.. how should I say it, soulless? 4. Characterization of Shirou is pretty bad imo. Shirou got a decent development near the end of the series though. Rin is... mm, she is the best in prologue, other episodes usually can't portray her way of thinking well and she is reduced to just a tsundere (but it's okay, I love tsunderes LOL). Saber is pretty useless in this route, Archer was rather decent but I'm not really interested in his motivation. Other minor characters mostly don't have any decent characterization, especially Rider. Caster, Kuzuki, Illya, Assassin(u got a flashback and then they're dead -.-) , Kirei, Gilgamesh is badly characterized too. (berserker is a special case and he can't have a good characterization coz the nature of his class I think) Shinji is the most characterized imo. We can see how ugly he is as a human being. (just kidding, but could be true LOL) 5. Both are pretty good. UBW has the advantage of animation though. Never read VN so can't comment anything about it. |
JJHRTDJun 21, 2015 11:29 PM
| UBW suffers from being watched week-to-week. From now on people who marathon in will have a better experience and from October on people can even watch the Blu-Ray version which will probably improve it even more. |
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Grey-Zone said: UBW suffers from being watched week-to-week. From now on people who marathon in will have a better experience and from October on people can even watch the Blu-Ray version which will probably improve it even more. |
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| Anime only: 7/10 After reading the VN: 8/10 I could have easily been a 9/10. |
 Anime is good, fucking deal with it. |
| They always say: "It is easier said than done". |
| This thread is remarkably restrained and un-salty. I guess everybody is too lazy to re-iterate what they've been saying this entire time. Obviously nobody has actually run out of salt. That's just silly, we still have the HF films. |
| So, putting the OP questions aside. What makes me think that this series is not really that good could be bias, coz I watched Deen's movie, and pretty much know what events would happen. Maybe it took away some of my enjoyment and tension. How about VN readers? Do u think this also happen u guys? Knowing what would happen really decrease the level of enjoyment imo. Also, for a battle royal setting, I prefer an ensemble cast. From a first person POV, it felt like we just follow Shirou meeting some kind of troubles, solve that trouble, repeat again until the final obstacle. We also don't get a decent characterization of other characters. Btw could someone check thoroughly, did Taiga has more screentime than Kuzuki? I think she did LOL. (after skimming some episodes) |
JJHRTDJun 21, 2015 11:50 PM
fst said: This thread is remarkably restrained and un-salty. I guess everybody is too lazy to re-iterate what they've been saying this entire time. Obviously nobody has actually run out of salt. That's just silly, we still have the HF films. Did you miss fai's post, or did you just completely ignore it? Besides that, yes we've actually done good in this thread. As for the questions: 1. The Ilya vs Rin scene was great, Gil using EA against something other than Shirou in episode 23 was good (although why it was a giant hand, i don't know). 2. I'll give it a 8/10 3. Monologues, or less subtle hints towards development and more explanations of the lore. 4. Hmm hard to explain this, I think the problem is that watching it week by week you forget alot, his development is a lot more apparent marathoning it. Also, there is a lot of subtle things that are easy to miss, which is why you get people misinterpreting things. (Although I have to ask if some people watched the same show, because they're so far off the mark it's not even funny.) 5. Deen UBW or Deen FSN, I think Deen FSN is a different route it's hard to compare other than quality of the animation. Which ufotable kicks it's ass in. (I'll have to wait until part 2 of the ost comes out to compare osts). Deen UBW was an AMV, don't let people fool you UFO:UBW wins that one. |
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| Season 1 BD is objectively shit outside of the louder OSTs, even watching it marathon. Gotta see how they changed things in Season 2 BD. |
KamiCity said: fst said: This thread is remarkably restrained and un-salty. I guess everybody is too lazy to re-iterate what they've been saying this entire time. Obviously nobody has actually run out of salt. That's just silly, we still have the HF films. Did you miss fai's post, or did you just completely ignore it? . I didn't miss it but its shorter and less flamboyant than what he usually shits into the episode thread |
ProphecyPriest said: Season 1 BD is objectively shit outside of the louder OSTs, even watching it marathon. Gotta see how they changed things in Season 2 BD. Lol at calling your opinions "objective" |
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KamiCity said: ProphecyPriest said: Season 1 BD is objectively shit outside of the louder OSTs, even watching it marathon. Gotta see how they changed things in Season 2 BD. Lol at calling your opinions "objective" Well, I can't see much improvement aside of the graphics and sounds, hence why I called "objective" in my own opinion. Then again, I'm no film/anime critics, so I can accept your statement. |
| If next episode is regular length (which it most likely is), then we get about 30 min of runtime for the 2nd BD that are not accounted for. Luckily that is too short for "lol, OST" this time, unless the 2nd OST has less than 1/3rd the length of the first one. |
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ProphecyPriest said: KamiCity said: Lol at calling your opinions "objective" Well, I can't see much improvement aside of the graphics and sounds, hence why I called "objective" in my own opinion. Then again, I'm no film/anime critics, so I can accept your statement. You said season 1 bd's were objectively shit, there was no mention that you were talking about the improvements. It's hard to say that your opinions on the first season are objective, if however you meant the improvements then yes it's easier to make the argument that the improvements were objectively not that good. |
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KamiCity said: ProphecyPriest said: Well, I can't see much improvement aside of the graphics and sounds, hence why I called "objective" in my own opinion. Then again, I'm no film/anime critics, so I can accept your statement. You said season 1 bd's were objectively shit, there was no mention that you were talking about the improvements. It's hard to say that your opinions on the first season are objective, if however you meant the improvements then yes it's easier to make the argument that the improvements were objectively not that good. But that's what I was implying, though? ufotable just can't make the UBW S1 BDs improvements satisfactory enough in this one, unlike Fate/zero BDs which expand on some particular scenes and added tidbits like Einzbern's Consultation Room. |
ProphecyPriest said: KamiCity said: You said season 1 bd's were objectively shit, there was no mention that you were talking about the improvements. It's hard to say that your opinions on the first season are objective, if however you meant the improvements then yes it's easier to make the argument that the improvements were objectively not that good. But that's what I was implying, though? ufotable just can't make the UBW S1 BDs improvements satisfactory enough in this one, unlike Fate/zero BDs which expand on some particular scenes and added tidbits like Einzbern's Consultation Room. That makes more sense now |
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ProphecyPriest said: KamiCity said: You said season 1 bd's were objectively shit, there was no mention that you were talking about the improvements. It's hard to say that your opinions on the first season are objective, if however you meant the improvements then yes it's easier to make the argument that the improvements were objectively not that good. But that's what I was implying, though? ufotable just can't make the UBW S1 BDs improvements satisfactory enough in this one, unlike Fate/zero BDs which expand on some particular scenes and added tidbits like Einzbern's Consultation Room. UBW S2 BD adding in a little Tiger Dojo OVA would be fantastic |
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Grey-Zone said: If next episode is regular length (which it most likely is), then we get about 30 min of runtime for the 2nd BD that are not accounted for. Luckily that is too short for "lol, OST" this time, unless the 2nd OST has less than 1/3rd the length of the first one. I will definitely buy the second cour OST. The remixes are just too great. And we have some CONFIRMED cut scenes. So rest assured. |
| its not as awesome as Fate/Zero story wise but i still give it a 9/10 score like what i have scored Fate/Zero |
ChickenFry said: And we have some CONFIRMED cut scenes. So rest assured. For first three or four episodes. None of scenes confirmed add ANYTHING towards fixing the problems with this cour(oh wow Sella and Liz are walking down the hallway arguing, such content). We had such confirmations in previous cour too. Except that at least one such confirmation from Nasu himself turned out to be bullshit because he has no idea what is in the actual episodes. |
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| As I just finished the HF routes and F/Z, I have these comments : 1. Story-wise,the 2nd season of UBW, did not connect to me, emotionally and intellectually. The writing is just average and I think they could flesh the characters better. I did not know what is Ilya's motivation without resorting to HF and FZ movies. 2. I really don't like Shirou as a character. He is dumb as brick and his ideals did not resonate to me. In contrast of Kerry's dark ideals, Shirou's ideals seem to be childish. His fight with Archer and Archer's acceptance of Shirou's, seeems fake and forced. Ufo should add more monologues to get the point. But I found this adaptation to be talky enough, so I really don't know. 3. Gilgamesh is more interesting than Shirou. It is just a pity that they castrated his interactions with Saber. Gil wants to posses Saber but in this adaptation, they barely talk. 4. The animation is Ufotable and it's amazing. I think Ufo is giving KyoAni a run of money on gorgeous visuals. I am looking forward to HF movies as I think it would be on the same line as FZ as it is darker than UBW. Current score : 8/10 Depends on the next episode : 7/10 |
| F0XFIRE said: OP 4 most butthurt bitch on MAL. |
CookingPriest said: ChickenFry said: And we have some CONFIRMED cut scenes. So rest assured. For first three or four episodes. None of scenes confirmed add ANYTHING towards fixing the problems with this cour(oh wow Sella and Liz are walking down the hallway arguing, such content). Why I don't consider AO to be problems? It adds more to the characters that we rarely see. I love AO. And unlike you, I don't wish it to fix anything. |
peeyaj said: As I just finished the HF routes and F/Z, I have these comments : 1. Story-wise,the 2nd season of UBW, did not connect to me, emotionally and intellectually. The writing is just average and I think they could flesh the characters better. I did not know what is Ilya's motivation without resorting to HF and FZ movies. And there comes the problem with adapting only 1 routes of FSN. You need all 3 routes to see the full picture. In fact, in the anime, they add more for Illya than the route in the VN itself offers. |
| Adapting other routes does absolutely ZERO to characterization of main characters, especially Shirou's. You do not need "three routes" to like him. Each route Shirou is different. Same for Rin, even if she just like Shirou is all over three routes. UBW proper would not make you care for Illya but it certainly would make one understand and see depth of Shirou and Rin, as well as like and see the complexity of Medea. |
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| Specifically in UBW route,you start to like him quite earlier on.I am not sure how many got his character untill episode 20 in this adaptation by UFO. |
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CookingPriest said: Adapting other routes does absolutely ZERO to characterization of main characters, especially Shirou's. You do not need "three routes" to like him. Each route Shirou is different. Same for Rin, even if she just like Shirou is all over three routes. UBW proper would not make you care for Illya but it certainly would make one understand and see depth of Shirou and Rin, as well as like and see the complexity of Medea. Isn't he talking about Illya? You don't have to take any single chance to bash this adaption. We already know you hate it. Just one advice, too much salt is not good for you heath. |
laidellent said: Specifically in UBW route,you start to like him quite earlier on.I am not sure how many got his character untill episode 20 in this adaptation by UFO. Who is "you" here? As many people don't like him until HF... And I know people who finished the VN and give zero fuck about him. |
Just_ChickenJun 22, 2015 3:51 AM
ChickenFry said: laidellent said: Specifically in UBW route,you start to like him quite earlier on.I am not sure how many got his character untill episode 20 in this adaptation by UFO. Who is "you" here? As many people don't like him until HF... You haven't lurked around the last couple of ep discussion threads have you? Really?Thats news to me.. I like him more than his HF counterpart. The ones in irl that I have talked with who have played the VN share the same sentiment |
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KamiCity said: , Gil using EA against something other than Shirou in episode 23 was good Out of character. |
laidellent said: Specifically in UBW route,you start to like him quite earlier on.I am not sure how many got his character untill episode 20 in this adaptation by UFO. Yep. UBW Shirou is the most likeable and he becomes likeable the earliest(while Fate takes time till he gets out of his triggered mental state and HF just gets worse and worse and you are not really supposed to "like" him there). It takes MAJOR talent(or lack of it) to make someone as UBW Shirou, who is consistently snarky and competent and thoughtful, into completely unlikeable naive blank slate. Insertanamehere said: KamiCity said: , Gil using EA against something other than Shirou in episode 23 was good Out of character. Agreed. Not to mention plot hole as the dickhand had no reason to go after Gil in that moment yet. |
AhenshihaelJun 22, 2015 4:22 AM
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1. As an adaptation? What could it have kept from the VN (which I have not read except for the first 3 hours)? Which of the changes made were good, seemed logical or were just blasphemous? More or less the only thing that comes to mind for me is the music. But that's just nostalgia talking, technically (if this was Umineko, it would've been more than just nostalgia, that's for sure). It was nice to hear so many VN tracks in ep24, but more could've been used earlier. I would've liked to hear Church on the Hill for example. As a VN adaptation in general, it's definitely one of the most entertaining I've seen. It does make a difference though that it was never my favourite part in the VN to begin with. I might be more harsh while watching the HF movies, but we'll see. 2. As an anime? (anime alone, NOT adaptation) As an anime, compared to other anime... really great. More so when marathoned, guaranteed. I was always looking forward to the next episode each week, which says a lot because that's certainly not how it's been with most airing anime I've watched. And it's gorgeous looking, obviously. 3. Anything (minor or major) you feel could have been done to make it better? Scene transitions/switching in some episodes felt off. Maybe pacing, though some of that gets better with added BD scenes. Oh yea, and more explanations for certain things. |
| 1. Some changes were not needed like taiganapping , illya's death, rin keeping Shirou down before YAMEROOOOOO TEMEEEEEEEE. Also his scary face in distortion(i never got the feeling that he was scared in that scene in the VN). Also Medea's Master's backstory which never gave her any development. 2. It's good but but still doesn't reach the depth of the VN mainly the fault of Miura-sama i presume still 8/10. 3.More focus on Shirou as we actually see the whole story from his POV and as he is a character who develops the most but according to Miura(the director) he never changes and Archer is the perfect man(LMFAO). Also some more inner monologues for shirou to understand his psychological conflict with his ideals. Here his monologues are spelled by archer which is not bad but......you see one more scene to make the perfect man shine. 4.The thing is you see Nasu is expecting a lot from his viewers , you literally have to observe his character alot to speculate what he is actually thinking(quiet hard for an anime only) the thing is Miura decided to change many of the scene where he shines into where archer is great scenes(taiganapping) as he is Miura's perfect man. Rin also lacked characterization in some cases. She is not that tsundere in the VN. 5. As an anime only DEEN Night is bad because it shows the characters(specially shirou) as someone who he not. The DEEN staff did't get Shirou's character at all. But i think the Distortion scene in UBW movie was better than UfoUBW. Overall a good anime but no SO good as an adaptation. |
nsa23x said: 1. As an adaptation? What could it have kept from the VN (which I have not read except for the first 3 hours)? Which of the changes made were good, seemed logical or were just blasphemous? 2. As an anime? (anime alone, NOT adaptation) 3. Anything (minor or major) you feel could have been done to make it better? 4. Was Shirou butchered again?? I wouldn't know. How was all the other character development? 5. Want to compare it to DEEN FSN, go ahead. Try using the spoiler tag. Try not to turn this into a FSN vs FZ war. We can (and should) do that once HF is out. Personally, while I can't answer Q1, Season 2 lack bite and just wasn't tight (I don't know what else to call it). FZ felt well done and complete overall, like a finished product, like a perfect football performance from a great team which won 4-0. UBW though felt 3/4 complete and put in a great performance but did have to defend a lot at times, won 3-1. Sorry for the confusing analogy. And I am comparing the two simply because the same studio made it. 1) I think GradationAir might be copying and pasting his huge post listing everything they could have added to improve the characterisation of Shirou. I'll just say more monologues and not showing Shirou failing/losing when he doesn't. (Like really, what was the point in him TRIPPING in the church...) 2)As an anime? I really enjoyed it, 7 or 8/10. F/Z for me as an anime is 9/10. As an anime it was genuinely really good but some scenes were just legitimately bad without even taking into consideration the VN; Assassin vs Saber round 2 comes to mind... 3)Monologues and being more true to the fights I guess. Saber taking a life off Berserker at the start really detracts from the fact that she's only in the fight because of Archer's support which becomes more obvious if you watch DEEN Fate which does show this I think). 4)Lol... ermmm, I'm honestly not sure if "butchered" is the right term, because they kinda for the most part pulled him back on track in the final episodes. But by then it is too little too late, they most DEFINITELY didn't do his character justice. 5)Honestly, I'm in the minority here but I genuinely really enjoyed F/SN DEEN and UBW DEEN. It's what brought me back into Anime. Yes there are flaws but it is still genuinely enjoyable. The animation is awful, Shirou is awful but the music is GODLY (I still prefer DEEN music to UFO music even though UFO music is still really good). DEEN doesn't really make any of the scenes make any sense (apart from a few exceptions) but they still capture the emotions and soul of the scenes better than UFO IMO. DEEN also has my favourite fight in the fate series which shows the absoloute best way to build up to casting UBW IMO. |
peeyaj said: [...]Ufo should add more monologues to get the point. But I found this adaptation to be talky enough, so I really don't know.[...] That's the #1 issue with adapting UBW in general (despite what some people here may claim, and no I am NOT saying it was done "as good as possible" here). UBW just isn't something that can be easily adapted into anime format since it relies on tons and tons of exposition and Unlimited Monologue Works is not really suited for the anime medium. It similarily applies to the Fate route as well, but with Fate route you can just pander to Saber fans to the maximum to hide the "problems" of the adaption, which Rin in UBW is much less suited for. As for Heaven's Feel... I think it's generally better suited to the anime medium, however there is one aspect which can make people inpatient and that is the 4 or 5 endless talks with Kirei in the route. They drag on and on and on and on. Well you could make that more tolerable by using flashbacks to the 3rd and 4th wars like they did with Gil's talk in UBW EP21, but I am not sure if that would be enough. Guess the movie format allows for a bit more talk, so it remains to be seen how that is handled... another problem is the part near the end that is like 3 days straight inside the Emiya household... oh well maybe they add some filler fights or something... or simply let Miura direct that part. |
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| There are plenty of anime with far more talking and monologues. |
Grey-Zone said: peeyaj said: [...]Ufo should add more monologues to get the point. But I found this adaptation to be talky enough, so I really don't know.[...] That's the #1 issue with adapting UBW in general (despite what some people here may claim, and no I am NOT saying it was done "as good as possible" here). UBW just isn't something that can be easily adapted into anime format since it relies on tons and tons of exposition and Unlimited Monologue Works is not really suited for the anime medium. It similarily applies to the Fate route as well, but with Fate route you can just pander to Saber fans to the maximum to hide the "problems" of the adaption, which Rin in UBW is much less suited for. As for Heaven's Feel... I think it's generally better suited to the anime medium, however there is one aspect which can make people inpatient and that is the 4 or 5 endless talks with Kirei in the route. They drag on and on and on and on. Well you could make that more tolerable by using flashbacks to the 3rd and 4th wars like they did with Gil's talk in UBW EP21, but I am not sure if that would be enough. Guess the movie format allows for a bit more talk, so it remains to be seen how that is handled... another problem is the part near the end that is like 3 days straight inside the Emiya household... oh well maybe they add some filler fights or something... or simply let Miura direct that part. The thing is they could have some of the talking being done whilst action was taking place. I just rewatched the UFO Shirou vs Archer and I really love it, I really do but I still think that they could have learnt just one thing from DEEN and that is that it isn't a bad thing to have them talking WHILST fighting. I think there was maybe in the 22 minute vid about 4 minutes of actual action. |
| That Kirei speech will make the movie it's in an F/Z recap episode, which is alright, but may prove to be extremely boring for almost everyone who's seen F/Z before. Another problem in HF i have no idea how they'll deal with, is the extreme lack of action scenes in the first 60~70% of the story. HF will be way more talk-y than even UBW. People say that UBW was talk-y when it was the most action packed route in the entire novel. |
nsa23x said: 1. As an adaptation? What could it have kept from the VN (which I have not read except for the first 3 hours)? Which of the changes made were good, seemed logical or were just blasphemous? 2. As an anime? (anime alone, NOT adaptation) 3. Anything (minor or major) you feel could have been done to make it better? 4. Was Shirou butchered again?? I wouldn't know. How was all the other character development? 5. Want to compare it to DEEN FSN, go ahead. 1) Pretty bad. Major problem with the show is that it doesn't know what it wants to be, and that really shows. Does it want to be a fanservice for the VN readers, or to be an entry point for new people to the franchise? Does it want to be a standalone, or to depend on Fate route (which was released for free in Japan) or Zero? Does it want to be an ensemble cast unlike VN, or stay true to the source and follow Shirou? Other than that, there are no explanations from VN (some of them being important, like Shirou's capability to analyze weapons), good amount of scenes being altered for no reason (What was the point of Berserker breaking Enkidu after Illya died in anime, again?), some of the necessary backstory (Caster's, mainly) being removed in exchange for useless AO stuff, monologues removed and not replaced with something else that suits the medium, restoration of booted out scenes (Shirou searching for Rin in the 1st episode of 2nd cour) etc. etc. etc. It's mostly minor problems that keep piling over time that make show become worse and worse the longer it goes. Cour 1 was great overall, but all those minor problems really hurt cour 2. 2) Depends on what you're looking at. Visuals are fairly nice, and it has some moments which can keep you entertained (especially if you want flashy fights). Other problems I mentioned at #1 can be also treat as anime problems. 3) From the major things... boot out Caster's original Master's backstory and replace it with her backstory... and move away Illya's backstory to the beginning or the end of the fight if you need to keep it (I'm talking purely about AO part). Changing Shirou vs Gil so that Gil is locked in melee fight would be great as well. From the minor things, there are numerous ones I'll need to rewatch whole series to pinpoint. But it usually boils down to adding an expression to Shirou here, putting a small monologue there, not changing the order or events, not adding ridiculous AO segments, fixing animation errors etc. 4) Butchered? Compared to FSN DEEN, not really. Still, Shirou is not the character that can be understood by looking solely from the outside (something anime tried to do) as what he shows on the outside isn't really what's inside, his characterization comes waaaaay too late, and even then it is not complete. Not to mention he's made to look dumb in some scenes when he really isn't (though few of the cases can be attributed to needless changes). From other characters, Archer is probably the only character properly characterized, closely followed by Rin. 5) Compared to DEEN adaptations, this one holds much better but feels hollow. For all the flashy fights and good animation, there's no emotional investment in it, nor do scenes carry the same emotional power as in VN. DEEN, regardless of how shitty they made F/SN, still managed to retain at least that emotional power. Still, stuffing 12 hour long route into 2 hour long movie is bad no matter how you look at it. Phew. For someone very salty about this whole thing, this came out fairly tame. |
astroprogs said: If HF ended up being a single movie, what would it need to do so it can get a high score from all of you? Not air. |
astroprogs said: Another problem in HF i have no idea how they'll deal with, is the extreme lack of action scenes in the first 60~70% of the story. HF will be way more talk-y than even UBW. People say that UBW was talk-y when it was the most action packed route in the entire novel. My God. I just remember that Shirou being as stupid as he is in HF had a more 3 loonng conversations with Kirei. It would be a snooze-fest if they would feature all dialogues esp the Mafo Tofu scene. And True Assasin/Kirei talk!! They should make HF a two part movie, then. |
| F0XFIRE said: OP 4 most butthurt bitch on MAL. |
Grey-Zone said: peeyaj said: [...]Ufo should add more monologues to get the point. But I found this adaptation to be talky enough, so I really don't know.[...] That's the #1 issue with adapting UBW in general (despite what some people here may claim, and no I am NOT saying it was done "as good as possible" here). UBW just isn't something that can be easily adapted into anime format since it relies on tons and tons of exposition and Unlimited Monologue Works is not really suited for the anime medium. It similarily applies to the Fate route as well, but with Fate route you can just pander to Saber fans to the maximum to hide the "problems" of the adaption, which Rin in UBW is much less suited for. As for Heaven's Feel... I think it's generally better suited to the anime medium, however there is one aspect which can make people inpatient and that is the 4 or 5 endless talks with Kirei in the route. They drag on and on and on and on. Well you could make that more tolerable by using flashbacks to the 3rd and 4th wars like they did with Gil's talk in UBW EP21, but I am not sure if that would be enough. Guess the movie format allows for a bit more talk, so it remains to be seen how that is handled... another problem is the part near the end that is like 3 days straight inside the Emiya household... oh well maybe they add some filler fights or something... or simply let Miura direct that part. This is why we need shaft x ufotable to do fate. |
Anime is good, fucking deal with it. |
peeyaj said: astroprogs said: Another problem in HF i have no idea how they'll deal with, is the extreme lack of action scenes in the first 60~70% of the story. HF will be way more talk-y than even UBW. People say that UBW was talk-y when it was the most action packed route in the entire novel. My God. I just remember that Shirou being as stupid as he is in HF had a more 3 loonng conversations with Kirei. It would be a snooze-fest if they would feature all dialogues esp the Mafo Tofu scene. And True Assasin/Kirei talk!! They should make HF a two part movie, then. 6 hour total would be the ideal length imo. 3 2 hours films looks good enough. |
Anime is good, fucking deal with it. |
| 1) It was an okay adaptation, overall. Could have been much better, but meh, it's a better adaptation than 99% of VNs will ever receive. A shame it wasn't as good as F/Z or KnK, but what can you do? Ufotable cycles their directors, and this happened to be given to Miura. Not losing any sleep over it. 2) A better show than most, with believable character development and great thematic progression. Its treatment of characters like Saber and Kirei harm it as a standalone, though. 3) More competent staffing. Where the hell were the people who animated the gorgeous Realta Nua openings? Or KnK's fantastic directors? Come on, Ufo. 4) Yeah, unfortunately, but I feel the show got his character development across fairly well. |
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