Mini Game v23: Angel Beats! Mafia | Game Thread | Game END - Town won!

Shinichi-Kun said:
Can we go back to worrying about soren and dono lol cause they are the targets not me and ari.

Bee-Boy said:
I hate this so much.

aa-dono said:

The phase or activity? Or the lynch targets?

Bee-Boy said:
I feel pretty shitty about this game honestly. I don't feel strongly toward anyone being scum and I am constantly second guessing my town readsI just feel like I am going through the motions of lynching people right now who aren't giving me strong town vibes. Maybe I am having trouble adapting to the 24h deadlines as I have 1/14th the usual time I have to sort peoples alignments but my reads just feel so iffy :/

Crossbell said:
Okay, going to talk through my reads to see if this generates any useful content.

(Also, spoilering since it will likely be pretty long, and I am thankful I have the time needed in order to this. God I'm addicted to this game)



Crossbell
Jackrito
Bee-Boy
SoulEaterQUEEN
Shinichi-kun
Arrisu
LucianRoy
Togs
Shuuka
bioshade2
followind
SightlessReality
Soren
aa-dono

Reads at the moment.

I'll take a look more at aa-dono in the morning, maybe, but @aa-dono: Who do you want to lynch, and why? Same question I asked Soren - you have a triple barreled gun, and you need to shoot a scum or lose. Who do you shoot?

Someone should double check me as well, as I'm nearly certain I'm wrong somewhere about one of my reads, heh. If I'm wrong it's either Arrisu or Lucian, maybe SoulEaterQUEEN since I don't have an idea of her scum range, but if she's scum I'm just resigning to her and losing in final three or something so yeah.

It /feels/ wrong for all the active, experienced players to be scum though. Experience tells me that there's a Deep Scum to figure out but we need to catch all of the lurker scum before them due to the modified scum win condition.

aa-dono said:

I've always been called out for my lack of follow-up. Why are you saying you're not used to it?
And it's true I usually don't place a vote if I don't see someone as a potential mafia. But I explained that it wasn't an OMGUS vote. On the lurking part, well that's just me trying to change. It's kinda exciting to actually be active.

Jackrito said:
Who else did you scumread in that phase then or pressure

Jackrito said:
All I saw was a fear of scumreading incase it led back to you.

Jackrito said:
If you had no ideas to pressure me why bother so much, I just see stuff here that makes no sense you say you did not spend all your time pressureing me, you did apart from some twlight talk.

Jackrito said:
You say nullreads need to be worked out too which is true so why not spread it out more since you know reading me is a waste of time and had no real plans to.

Jackrito said:
On the last point I don't see a town, you policy lynching which added with the lack of overall scuhunting does not make me read you as town. It just reads to me as a fear to commit to something which an townie should not have and I know you don't normally.

Shinichi-Kun said:
Tbf at first ya I didn't understand the policy lynch cause it wasn't you but when you said the reason behind it i kinda understand but at the same time jack also brought up good points on why did u leave you rvs for so long.

Shinichi-Kun said:
Reason I think it makes you scum is because you as town I can't see you willing to sacrifice 2 town at the chance of catching 1 or 2 scum, but scum soren now I can see him risking people than defending himself by saying the reads I got will help town and so on. Of course i'm scare because I don't want 2 or 3 townies to die at the chance of catching scum like day 1 lynching is one thing but if we double lynch 2 townies and then they nk another we get put into a bad position. The fact that your ok with that risk makes me think your scum who doesn't care about the consequences because he wants to get rid of town.

SightlessReality said:
Anyways, I'll put a vote in for Soren due to him putting a vote on me as a policy lynch. You'd think with me flipping town so much he'd think twice about doing so. But at the same time I can't entirely fault him for it do to my play style. It's still an odd move none the less.

Vote: Soran

Arrisu said:

Very weak reasoning, doesn't wait or make any mention about his feeling on dono before voting.

I don't like this at all.

Soren said:
I do something different in the game and people are unfamiliar to it so they scum read me for it, I've explained the policy lynch already, ignore it, disregard it, disagree with it, do what you want. I gave my reasons already, I don't need you to accept it.
Look, I don't actually scumhunt day 1 that much, unless there is something incredibly telling about someone's alignment I won't actually say much. People have this idea of me that I make wall posts, reads and analysis and expect that of me on day 1, and when they don't see that they immediately think that I am scum. What people don't realise is that I do those things later in the game. If you can find a game from me in the past six months where I have made wall posts, reads and analysis day 1 and was town then I'd say you're onto something. But I can guarantee that you won't find a game like that. The point that I'm trying to make here is that me not doing much on day 1 is not indicative of me being scum. @Arrisu can vouch on me for that.

SightlessReality said:

Cool. I don't like either of the candidates but you guys put them into twilight so one has to be picked.

Arrisu said:

Wrong again. No lynch is an option. Though I don't personally like this option, why would you vote against anybody whom you don't want to lynch? That makes no sense.

Soren said:
No one in particular because it was only a few hours into the game and I quite liked what everyone was posting at that time. I needed to hear more from other players before I could start formulating some scum reads. This assumption is heavily derived from the thought that I am scum and that you think that I have a fear of scumhunting when I am scum. So far you have only misrepresented what I have been doing in this game, therefore your own reasons to scum read me are self defeating in itself. Your idea that I have a fear of scumhunting derived from you thinking that I am scum is now defeated since your scum read on me is self defeating. Not only that, anyone can say that someone hasn't been scum hunting because they have a fear of scum hunting. If you can actually show me something more substantial that I have a fear of scum hunting and how that actually is something alignment indicative, then you have something important to say. One of the main things going on during that time in the game was you and soul going back and forth. Of course I'm going to have my own thoughts on that and some questions about it. Reading you is not a waste of time. You've got to be worked out at some point. If there is something I notice that I want answers to at a point in the game, I'm going to ask it.I do something different in the game and people are unfamiliar to it so they scum read me for it, I've explained the policy lynch already, ignore it, disregard it, disagree with it, do what you want. I gave my reasons already, I don't need you to accept it.
Look, I don't actually scumhunt day 1 that much, unless there is something incredibly telling about someone's alignment I won't actually say much. People have this idea of me that I make wall posts, reads and analysis and expect that of me on day 1, and when they don't see that they immediately think that I am scum. What people don't realise is that I do those things later in the game. If you can find a game from me in the past six months where I have made wall posts, reads and analysis day 1 and was town then I'd say you're onto something. But I can guarantee that you won't find a game like that. The point that I'm trying to make here is that me not doing much on day 1 is not indicative of me being scum. @Arrisu can vouch on me for that.

SightlessReality said:

For information purposes. Why else? A No lynch does nothing because at the end of the day we'v wasted not 1 but 2 days on two people only to ultimately learn nothing.

Arrisu said:


Yes. I was actually going to agree with this about you, even if you didn't poke me about it. Like I said, it's a null read to me, yet people have already began voting for you before hearing out what you had to say.

I'd appreciate a claim at this point in time from you & @aa-dono though, since I still am not sure on my future actions. Also Soren, if you could provide a reads list that would be helpful.

I think you're being pinned for the wrong reasons, even in the off chance that my belief in your innocence is wrong.

Jackrito said:


Why did you not question taking Soren to this stage if you think the reasons are bad.

Arrisu said:


I had a plan: bring my scum-read into the Twilight & another random null read. Observe for voting patterns, see who votes for who & for what reasons.

So far, there's interesting stuff being said (such as Sightless' vote). I wanted to put scum in a cringy situation with just enough hope put into them that they would avoid a D1 lynch. It wouldn't work with Shinichi since he might actually be scum. I don't know if this makes sense but feel free to ask me to elaborate if you want. :D

Shinichi-Kun said:
Not sure what they even pointed out that actually make's me trully seem scummy also if and when I do die it's gonna be funny when both their read's are thrown back at them and they get mindblown unless they are both scum cause they just be happy I died.

Shinichi-Kun said:
Only defend people on day 1 most of the time and if someone is scum who I'm defending oh well it happens just like how a day 1 lynch can lead to a townies death.

Shinichi-Kun said:
At the same time i don't see any harm in what I'm doing because it's up to other's to follow me.

Shinichi-Kun said:
Nope I defend people day 1 regardless of alignment and I understand your logic it's just kinda part of my good moral I defend people that's what I do lmao.

Shinichi-Kun said:
I would have to reread everything to give you an accurate answer to the reads on that train which i will be doing tomorrow morning or soonish maybe if i'm still awake.

Shinichi-Kun said:
Can you quote me where i said its gunranteed town will be lynched day 1 cause even I've been in games where mafia have been lynched on day 1.

Shinichi-Kun said:
I don't plan on shaming anyone if a townie get's lynched because of their own reasoning that's on them, though not sure how I'm setting up anyone to be discouraged by defending people where I see fit.

Shinichi-Kun said:
Not true atleast for me cause when I finally do a read list I gotta reread everything stuff and post's so stick in my head so for me to accurately answer a read question i gotta go back and find every post at that moment so for me its easier to just say someone is a neutral read till i can atleast gather my thoughts.

Shinichi-Kun said:
Also I think I've hinted at my role a few times in all my post.

Shuuka said:
still having a hard time reading people :/

Arrisu said:

Well I know this is your first game so... is there a reason in particular that you find it difficult?

aa-dono said:

What kind of defense do you want from me? I am posting as I read. Why do you keep on saying you want to hear my defense but never actually ask me anything?

Bee-Boy said:
You guys lose quotes I will make a post after this one without quotes because this is annoying me >:I



Ok I think this is really scummy because I think sorting everyone's alignment is important even if we can't lynch them.

Bee-Boy said:
{Ari}
{SoulEaterQUEEN}
{Togs, Crossbell}
{LucianRoy}
{Soren, SightlessReality, followind}
{Jackrito}
{Shuuka, aa-dono}
{Shinichi-kun}


Ari - I had reasons to town read Ari originally which I don't want to get into because it helps scum more then it helps town. But I really liked the recent Ari posts I feel like she is proactively trying to solve the game.
Togs - Reads make sense and are easy to follow townie.
SoulEaterQUEEN - Proactively engaging with everyone she just feels really obviously town. If I am wrong here just due to her sheer activity I am confident this read can develop.
Togs and Crossbell - Making strong efforts to solve the game.
LucianRoy - I have the same read as the above but like I am hesitant because it almost feels robotic like he is going through motions in his catch up posts which make me uncomfortable but he is likely town.
Soren - Not sure why out of all the lurkers we chose him to be double lynched today in all honesty...
Slightless - Not sure what he is doing this game but this is usual play from what I understand so it isn't worth looking into.
followind - Has posts I haven't seen anything that as stood out in them in all honesty but maybe I am just not observing properly.
Jackrito - I still think there is a lack of scum hunting from this slot the only reason I have him so high up compared to before is how highly my town reads view him. I know that I should have my own reads but mafia is a team based game so *shrugs* I let people influence me.
Shuuka - There is a sheer lack of anything coming from this slot.
dono - I feel like there is a sheer lack of things coming from this slot but I am seeing posts but nothing memorable is coming out of them. I know that isn't the strongest read in the world but that's how I read people this is just giving me bad gut feelings.
Shinichi-kun - A variety of scummy things throughout the game. I don't like how he has defended other players it messes in the way I don't like. I don't like how he is dealing with the pressure and above I quoted a post I don't like.

Soren said:
Soul and you I'd say are town. Soul's questioning of Jack aided her in getting a better read of him, and has been actively engaged in the game while aiding in the tieing the votes for twilight phase. I like your entrance to the game and how you approached aa-dono and shinichi in the game. These are transparency of your town game.

aa-dono hasn't been a town read for me, I'd say a null so far. Because she has been posting way too many questions in the game. But I know that it is in aa-dono's character as a human being, not as a player, to ask a lot of questions. So I'm trying to understand whether that actually make's her scummy. I will have to revisit her posts and see if there is anything alignment indicative to be found.

Shinichi defending many people during the day raised alarm bells for me and quite a few people were scum reading him for it. But he raised a good point, unless someone can link a game where he defended people and flipped scum in the game then this meta holds no value to me. I don't care what he has done in other games, especially when it cannot be backed up, I'm going to assess what his actions are telling me in this game. I almost wanted to scum read Shinichi when he voted on you. It was plain bad and only voted you when prompted by someone. It showed sign of hesitation, lack of certainty and a hint of emotional stir. Then he made a post where he will have to look at Ari's post later and to come up with reasons for scum reading her. There was two ways for me to look at this.
1. He is scum and purports to find evidence to fit the theory that Ari is scum. As oppose to having evidence that suggests that Ari is scum.
2. Poor play stirred by an emotional response to the engagement with Ari.
I decided to go with the 2nd reasoning because of a post that Shinichi made in his #397. I tried really hard to see if scum would talk in the manner that Shinichi did, and I couldn't see it.

Let's break down his post a little bit more so I can demonstrate why I think it is a really townie post.
Displays a genuine confusion to people's scum read of them, because he understands his actions and knows that he did not do them with a scummy intention. Secondly, take note of Shinchi's pleasure when he considers his death/flip and how that would make the player's who scum read him feel. He's not scared of getting lynched because when he does and his alignment is revealed, he knows exactly how the players would react to him flipping town.
I don't really have a problem with this. It's possible that people he defends will turn out to be scum, but he defends people with his notion of what he thinks are good intentions. As he doesn't want to see people getting lynched for stupid reasons.
This statement shows a level of independence and confidence in his own actions.
It is in Shinichi's character to defend people. This is evident in Shinichi as a human being too as well as a player in a game.
I am seeing town motivation behind Shinichi in declaring that he will reread the game to come up with reads and answers to things about the game. Furthermore, he actually does do this and came up with a read list.
Here he is sure of what he has said and knows that he did not say that it is guaranteed that town will be lynched day 1 and requests for evidence so that he is not misrepresented.
Reveals to me his stance on town shaming. Not exactly alignment indicative here, but I like what he is saying. If town gets lynched because they failed to provide, then that is their own problem.
This is evidently true as he made a read list.
I don't really see scum!Shinichi doing this. If he was scum I think he would revealed that he did hint his role when he is on the verge of getting lynched. But this is based on my personal gut feeling on how Shinichi would act.

SightlessReality said:
Anyways, I'll put a vote in for Soren due to him putting a vote on me as a policy lynch. You'd think with me flipping town so much he'd think twice about doing so. But at the same time I can't entirely fault him for it do to my play style. It's still an odd move none the less.

Vote: Soran

Crossbell said:
@Soren: You have a triple barreled gun. You need to shoot at least one scum, or else the game ends right there and town loses. Which three people do you shoot?

Arrisu said:

Wrong again. No lynch is an option. Though I don't personally like this option, why would you vote against anybody whom you don't want to lynch? That makes no sense.

Shinichi-Kun said:


No lynch is always an option a rare option but sometimes its the best choice.

Soren said:
My read list

Town:
SoulEaterQUEEN
Arrisu
Crossbell

Slight Town Read:
Shinichi-kun
Togs
Jackrito
Bee-Boy

Null:
SightlessReality
LucianRoy
followind
aa-dono
bioshade2
Shuuka

SightlessReality said:
Anyways, I'll put a vote in for Soren due to him putting a vote on me as a policy lynch. You'd think with me flipping town so much he'd think twice about doing so. But at the same time I can't entirely fault him for it do to my play style. It's still an odd move none the less.

Vote: Soran

Shinichi-Kun said:


No lynch is always an option a rare option but sometimes its the best choice.

Arrisu said:
Hm... Mind expanding on your town read of bee-boy? I don't really how you are town reading him.

Arrisu said:

When is it a good option to do a no lynch? Especially during day 1.

Soren said:
I do something different in the game and people are unfamiliar to it so they scum read me for it, I've explained the policy lynch already, ignore it, disregard it, disagree with it, do what you want. I gave my reasons already, I don't need you to accept it.
Look, I don't actually scumhunt day 1 that much, unless there is something incredibly telling about someone's alignment I won't actually say much. People have this idea of me that I make wall posts, reads and analysis and expect that of me on day 1, and when they don't see that they immediately think that I am scum. What people don't realise is that I do those things later in the game. If you can find a game from me in the past six months where I have made wall posts, reads and analysis day 1 and was town then I'd say you're onto something. But I can guarantee that you won't find a game like that. The point that I'm trying to make here is that me not doing much on day 1 is not indicative of me being scum. @Arrisu can vouch on me for that.

Shinichi-Kun said:


The asking ari to vouch at the end doesn't sit well with me, but I do understand where your coming from reading this. You def brought up alot of points to go against jack's prosecution of you but in the end a defense doesn't really prove your innocent. You can commit a crime and get away with it if you have an amazing defense jsut saying :P.

Soren said:
If you believe that I have defended myself well then that means that there are no good scum read on me. Under that premise, you are just saying that I could still be scum without anything to back it up. You might as well have just lynched someone random if you want to play the skeptic.

Crossbell said:
Soren seems to be quite overdefensive and has not really scumhunted nor has provided much in twilight phase, and dono seems to be nitpicking. I would make a separate case for each of them but my internet gets really bad at night and navigating the thread is a chore. I'll make time tomorrow maybe if we need it?

Shinichi-Kun said:


Tbh I'm leaning more towards a no lynch right now anyways cause I myself can't bring up enough evidence to convict either of you.