LelouchviBritMER said: Phantomnocomics said: keep in mind, that this is the *writer*, not the director, the author of a show is the director not the writer. That argument is moot since we know for a fact that the decision to kill off Lelouch was taken unanimously. The director also agreed with Lelouch's death. This was shown in Continue Vol.42 Continue: Was there a dispute among the staff members regarding the ending? Okouchi: No. It was decided fairly naturally. During the "Code Geass" script meetings, there are many cases in which there were a number of disputes, but there were barely any when it came to the scripts for (the previous series's) episode 25 and the final episode. I think everyone felt the same when it came to the end of the character that is Lelouch. This is further expanded on in the "Geass Memories" series: - "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." Source Screenshot Translation As you can see, director Taniguchi agreed with killing off Lelouch, thus on this matter the wruiters speak in name of the director too. Phantomnocomics said: Ichiro Okouchi doesn't state that lelouch is dead, whoever said that is using his/her own mis-interpretation as an argument, he stated that he PAID his sins with Death and that, that was agreed upon since the initialization of the show with the director, no more no less. his life stat is unclear. You're saying that when someone is dead it's unclear whether he's alive? That is just silly. Especially because we KNOW that Lelouch does not have the code because the anime itself makes it impossible. We KNOW that for years now, that has been conclusively proven. You're years out of date if you still believe in the debunked code theory. In any case, they repeatedly stated Lelouch is dead. for example: - "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." Same source as before. Phantomnocomics said: and while authors ''director, not writer'' can Retcon or add canon stuff, it is not confirmed till said stuff is materialized It IS published material! The offical guidebook very clearly states that Lelouch is dead, multiple times even! Just one example: "For those two who bear the heavy sin known as killing their fathers, they share the belief that they can forgive each other by imposing the greatest punishments on themselves. Death for Lelouch who wishes for a tomorrow with his sister, life for Suzaku who wishes to atone for his sins through death." That book isn't a spinoff or so, it is THE book about the anime. And the 2009 remade epilogue is also part of the anime, it is officially listed as such! this new epilogue drops the sometimes misunderstood cart scene and replaces it with C.C. explicitly explaining that Lelouch is dead. Lelouch is dead because the anime itself makes code theory impossible because Lelouch having a code would have violated the rules the anime itself established. if you want the full explanation of that, read it here, it's "Part 2" of that post. "Part 1" is a list of all the official statements which all confirm that Lelouch is truly dead, all backed up by sources, links and pictures. No, it is not a moot point since this is canon authority we are talking about, what the director says has to be backed up, let alone that of an irrelevant writer, as for Ichiro 'cause of the 3 new movies, Ichirō Ōkouchi released a series of tweets called "Geass Memories". In these he looks back at the days when he and his colleagues were making Code Geass and sheds some light on the production process, old anecdotes and etc These are the relevant quotes: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that the end of Lelouch will be death." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with his death." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by his death. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't choose death. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't die, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." -------------------- there is nothing in the tweets that says something about the director agreeing that lelouch is dead nor is is there a tweet where it says lelouch is dead, only lelouch wouldn't choose death and the end of lelouch will be death, he pays his sins with death there is a difference between what the writer said, and what you are saying. choosing/paying your sins with death and being dead are different ----------------------- no, what i said and what you think i said are different things, again here is what i wrote: ''the writer: Ichiro Okouchi doesn't state that lelouch is dead, whoever said that is using his/her own mis-interpretation as an argument, he stated that he PAID his sins with Death and that, that was agreed upon since the initialization of the show with the director, no more no less. his life stat is unclear.'' ---------------------- No, accepting one thing does not mean others, the only thing the director accepted upon is that which is that the lelouch's END will be death, not that he's dead and you are just repeating yourself. i already stated in a prior post that there is no violation with the show setting, the show having to be directive about it or else, it being not there is a fallacy by itself.No show entitled to show its informations directly so only. therefore, what OP says is not necessary wrong because it's not directly stated. and for multiple times, you have used: wish to stone his sins through death as a = he's dead. which is again, a mis-interpretation there is no such Epilogue i LelouchviBritMER said: Phantomnocomics said: keep in mind, that this is the *writer*, not the director, the author of a show is the director not the writer. That argument is moot since we know for a fact that the decision to kill off Lelouch was taken unanimously. The director also agreed with Lelouch's death. This was shown in Continue Vol.42 Continue: Was there a dispute among the staff members regarding the ending? Okouchi: No. It was decided fairly naturally. During the "Code Geass" script meetings, there are many cases in which there were a number of disputes, but there were barely any when it came to the scripts for (the previous series's) episode 25 and the final episode. I think everyone felt the same when it came to the end of the character that is Lelouch. This is further expanded on in the "Geass Memories" series: - "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." Source Screenshot Translation As you can see, director Taniguchi agreed with killing off Lelouch, thus on this matter the wruiters speak in name of the director too. Phantomnocomics said: Ichiro Okouchi doesn't state that lelouch is dead, whoever said that is using his/her own mis-interpretation as an argument, he stated that he PAID his sins with Death and that, that was agreed upon since the initialization of the show with the director, no more no less. his life stat is unclear. You're saying that when someone is dead it's unclear whether he's alive? That is just silly. Especially because we KNOW that Lelouch does not have the code because the anime itself makes it impossible. We KNOW that for years now, that has been conclusively proven. You're years out of date if you still believe in the debunked code theory. In any case, they repeatedly stated Lelouch is dead. for example: - "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." Same source as before. Phantomnocomics said: and while authors ''director, not writer'' can Retcon or add canon stuff, it is not confirmed till said stuff is materialized It IS published material! The offical guidebook very clearly states that Lelouch is dead, multiple times even! Just one example: "For those two who bear the heavy sin known as killing their fathers, they share the belief that they can forgive each other by imposing the greatest punishments on themselves. Death for Lelouch who wishes for a tomorrow with his sister, life for Suzaku who wishes to atone for his sins through death." That book isn't a spinoff or so, it is THE book about the anime. And the 2009 remade epilogue is also part of the anime, it is officially listed as such! this new epilogue drops the sometimes misunderstood cart scene and replaces it with C.C. explicitly explaining that Lelouch is dead. Lelouch is dead because the anime itself makes code theory impossible because Lelouch having a code would have violated the rules the anime itself established. if you want the full explanation of that, read it here, it's "Part 2" of that post. "Part 1" is a list of all the official statements which all confirm that Lelouch is truly dead, all backed up by sources, links and pictures. No, it's not a moot argument since it's canon authority we are talking about. never was there a statement about the director agreeing about lelouch's death. the wirter only confirmed since the initialization of the show with 'director, something, the thing being that the END of lelouch will be death, not that he's dead. --------------------------------- i'm aware of thost stuff or else i wouldn't be here so you quoting it only made your post un-necessary long because of the 3 new movies, Ichirō Ōkouch, writer for Code geass started a series of tweets called "Geass Memories". In these he looks back at the days when he and his colleagues were making Code Geass and sheds some light on the production process, old anecdotes and etc. some quotes: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that the end of Lelouch will be death." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with his death." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by his death. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't choose death. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't die, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode. never once was there a statement of lelouch is dead, Only that lelouch changed, and that he pays his sins with death, and that lelouch's end wil be death. which you interpret as this = lelouch's dead which is a fallacy by itself, since no such thing is stated, there is a difference between that lelouch's end will be death and lelouch is dead, same thing applies to the other statements, for lelouch will pay his sins with death and the lelouch wouldn't choose death, he will try to avoid it, for nunally as well, but we see him changed in the last episode No, the director never agreed to anything, the writer only confirmed with the director about lelouch's end being death, One thing does not translate to others --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No, what you think i said and what i said are different things, here is i what i said the writer: Ichiro Okouchi doesn't state that lelouch is dead, whoever said that is using his/her own mis-interpretation as an argument, he stated that he PAID his sins with Death and that, that was agreed upon since the initialization of the show with the director, no more no less. his life stat is unclear. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- the guidebook needs what is about to back it up, it is a spin-off. and read what i said about the spin-off part, and again, you are using the mis-interpretation of death for = is dead if you mean that fan-made last scene where lelouch appears and smiles, that's just a fan-made scene. for my information, never was there a source for that scene, only claims to it ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- you just repeated what you said before, the only new part is what you wrote finally and to that, no, the whole thing you wrote is a mis-interpretation of death for = dead is from tweet quotes about the initial production of the show, the other being the guidebook which is a spin-off by itself, and like i stated before, there is no violation of the show's setting, and i'm aware of the setting, unless you point out a contradiction with the show's setting, there isn't really one, and your sole argument is that *it was never stated directly in the show*. which i already mentioned why it's simply not a real argument. OP's argument is valid. |
LelouchviBritMER said: Phantomnocomics said: did you even read what the OP wrote?, the rules are fine, there is no violation nor and read what i wrote, and there is not lelouch scene, that one is fan-made. This has been known for years now. The anime established the rule that everyone who gets the code loses the geass. Charles even explicitly confirms that himself. Lelouch never lost his geass, therefore it is impossible for him to have the code. Code conspiracy theorists tried to fix that MASSIVE hole in their theory by adding more assumptions, but they are even more problematic. - The assumption that codes need to be activated through death is contradicted by the anime itself. Charles was already immortal before he shot himself, the anime shows that because he has no red eyes and there is no blue brain scene. That means he was already immune to geass and thus he already has an "active" code, which means codes do NOT need to be activated at all. This was even officially and explicitly explained in a live commentary by the show staff! パパんにギアス掛けるシーンも、「これギアス掛かってないのに死んだふりするんだよ」「息子を驚かせようと」「ルルーシュくんかわいそう」「これ一番ショックなタイミング計ってるよね」「絶対笑いこらえてるよ」って色々言われてて笑った。 "He isn't geassed, just pretends he dies!" " He tries to surprise his son!" "Poor Lelouch" "He tries to choose the most shocking timing, doesn't he" "I'm sure he tries hard not to laugh" So both the anime and the show staff make it clear that codes do NOT need to be activated! -The assumption that Lelouch was a special case for whom the established rules don't apply is downright wrong. Never ever in the anime is there any hint of the possibility of exceptions even existing. Nobody thinks about it, talks about it, wonders about it, mentions it, etc. The idea is completely disconnected from the lore of the show. As such it's just pure fanfic and thus wrong. ALL four cases shown by the anime tell us that people who get the code, lose the geass. Lelouch never lost his geass. Therefore the anime itself made it impossible for Lelouch to have a code. All of the arguments made by code theory have already been fully debunked. They are either complete misinterpretations of scenes, or contradicted by the anime, or just flat out lies such as that fake, fan-made video of him being the cart driver. impressive, now we are talking about the actual stuff, finally, a proper discussion that is intelligent alright. Lad, i will try to keep this short and simple That's not how it works, lad, CC was shown to be in a blood lake when she got her Code the death part is Necessary for the code to activate evidence being that charles had his code yet didn't lose his Geass, till the code is activated the Geass would still work a Code only activate once said person dies. < charle didn't die till Geass killed him so. . . . Charles had a Geass even though he had the Code < hence how charle had code abilities the rest of your writing was you rambling about the theory rather than discussing it and how it's a plot hole and other off-topic stuff, so try to be in-topic. lad, i told you before, why and how The code works, and that it doesn't violate the rules if anything, you're the one making assumptions, as far as the show is concerned, The Loss part only happened for those who obtained their code from those who they formed a contract with, so you are a making an assumption yourself by assuming that this also applies to those who they didn't make a contract with it's simple, you can have a code and a geass if the Code is not activated. since the death part is necessary. |
PhantomnocomicsNov 17, 2018 8:42 AM
Huntik said: And here i came after 7 years to say : He's not dead, in fact we're getting more Code geass :P actually, the next series is a sequel to the new canon, that is the film series, not the TV. |
LelouchviBritMER said: You didn't read anything of what I wrote, did you? The distinction between the writer and the director IS moot because we know from several sources that the director agreed with the writer. As such the writer can talk with the canon authority of the director. You quote a tweet which literally says that the director confirmed that Lelouch died and then you go on saying he never said that. Wut? There is no difference between being death and choosing to pay for your sins with death when we see him get impaled on a sword and know that the anime makes it impossible for Lelouch to have the code as that would have violated the rules which were established by the anime itself. There is NO difference between "Lelouch's end is death" and "Lelouch is dead" when we see him get impaled. The show DID make very clear that there are rules concerning codes, no matter what you try to claim. One of those rules was that everyone who gets the code loses the geass, Lelouch never loses the geass and thus he cannot have the code. Quod erat demonstrandum. If Lelouch, who is confirmed to have the wish to pay for his sins by death, does not have the code (as the anime makes crystal clear) and gets impaled, on a sword, how can he not be dead? The guide book is a spinoff? Are you trolling me? Is this discussion a joke for you? The guide book is the official compendium for the anime series, it goes hand in hand! to summarize: 1) various sources have already stated that the director agreed with the writer on Lelouch's fate: death 2) the anime established rules on how codes work and are transferred, one of those rules says that you lose the geass when you get the code, Lelouch never lost his geass, ergo Lelouch does not have a code 3) without code, getting impaled on a sword = death. The story of Lelouch ended with death. his wish was to pay for hissins through death and the sword through his gut assured that. 4) The official guide book which is the compendium of the anime, it is literally a GUIDE BOOK to the anime. it is NOT some disconnected spinoff! You can't just declare something a spinoff just because it refutes your words. Everything you need to know about the ending of Code Geass can be found in the Code Geass database which you clearly didn't read. It shows how the ANIME ITSELF tells the audience that Lelouch has no code, and how the show staff have been repeating and confirming for 10 years that Lelouch is indeed truly dead, just as the anime tells us. for starters, you keep coming back to this point again and again there is a LINE between a writer, and a director, the one gets the say over the show is the director, not the writer. this is 101 and should not be a discussion the other thing is, you are mis-interpreting stuff, the Only time there was an agreement between the writer and director, would be the writer confirming that the initial thought behind end of lelouch that it will be death no more no less nor should it be a discussion . what you are saying is: because he agreed to that, he therefore he agreed to the anything the writer does which is a mis-interpretation ----------------------------------- the tweets that i quoted are that of the writer repeating what i said since post 1, that lelouch's end will be deah, which you are interpreting as = lelouch is dead if akira toriyama would have said, goku end would be death, it doesn't necessarily mean that he's dead, as by death, he could mean that the end event for goku would be death but necessarily mean that he is dead in a sense. Which is the interpretation being used a fact, which is a mis-interpretation by itself and no, there is a BIG difference between, the end of Lelouch would be death and lelouch is dead ------------------------------ welcome to anime, lad < i already explained how the rules works and why you yourself are making an assumption, and how there is no actual violation to the show setting, there is a SOUL that violated a Geass contract yet was able to keep its Geass via a plot hole. this is more worthy to the discussion than the other 'definition of claim: to make up stuff but not confirm it'', already discussed why the rules aren't violated at all, your assumption though is a different matter, and again, you returned to the same point that was already discussed that is by itself an assumption, *Geass Code users lose their geass if their code is activated hence why C.C was killed by the nun ''or else how can someone survive a blood lake* or how charles had code abilities yet didn't lose his Geass* your statement which is backed up by an assumption is only but the half truth for sake of your argument Guidebooks can be wrong, welcome to anime, again, just ask the fate series and Yes, they are spin offs, they can introduce stuff that wasn't originally there and like stated, if it's backed up by the material or/and contradicted, it's not canon you're assuming that the book does not contradict the material, which is not my issue, whether it does or not is just something to keep in mind --------------------------------- Long story short: there are Only writer tweets ''who is not the director'' about initial thought when making the show that the end for Lelouch will be death and the writer confirming that with the director when they were making the show. ''only source'' -there is no violation of the rules, you are using an assumption/half-truth for the sake of arguing -not all spin offs are disconnected, that is silly, Guidebooks have different types of them. No, not once was there a Guidebook stating that lelouch is dead, you are using an argument equivalent to that of the writer statement as a: it said this therefore it means that to say it refutes me the show said nothing about said nothing about lelouch's death,and just because the show wasn't direct about something doesn't mean it's not there. moral of story: an assumption/half truth is not a violation nor is a writer initial thought of a lelouch's END. that is all of your argument broken without all the stretching lad. from a fate fan |
PhantomnocomicsNov 17, 2018 10:24 AM
LelouchviBritMER said: [/quote]You are years out of date. these things were proven to be misinterpretations based on the wishful thinking of some fans aaaages ago. The anime itself fully contradicts this point. When Lelouch attempts to geass Charles, there were no red eyes or blue brain scenes, that means he was already immune, just like when Lelouch tried to geass C.C. in season 1. that means he already had a code which was "active" before he died, which means codes do not require activation through dead. This is even explicitly confirmed by the show staff have have explained that Charles did NOT die but faked his death to mess with his son. This was said during a live commentary: パパんにギアス掛けるシーンも、「これギアス掛かってないのに死んだふりするんだよ」「息子を驚かせようと」「ルルーシュくんかわいそう」「これ一番ショックなタイミング計ってるよね」「絶対笑いこらえてるよ」って色々言われてて笑った。 "He isn't geassed, just pretends he dies!" " He tries to surprise his son!" "Poor Lelouch" "He tries to choose the most shocking timing, doesn't he" "I'm sure he tries hard not to laugh" Are you going to pretend that the people who made the show do't understand their own work? Jesus, dude. You need to rewatch the show. in that very scene Charles himself explicitly confirms that he doesn't have the geass anymore because he had exchanged it for the code. Seriously, you need to get out of your bubble and talk to actual fans such as on reddit, because your understanding of the show is below zero. You spout things which are known to be wrong for many years by now. Did you never read the post I linked you? I'm sure you didn't because otherwise you wouldn't be saying such debunked nonsense. Read this post which explains everything about code geass before continuing this conversation. Otherwise it's just a waste of time. Codes do not require activation, the anime is very very very clear about that. It is IMPOSSIBLE for to keep your geass when you get the code. The show made that abundantly clear withh ALL the precedents. Believing Lelouch is a special snowflake from whom the rules don't apply is crazy fanfic nonsense. i will make it relevant to the other posts so that the prior points are mentioned alongside new ones it's not like V.V didn't have those scenes as well < -those are not necessary, this is an assumption that this happens everytime a Geass user tries to Geass every Geass Code user, C.C happen to be the Geass contractor for Lelouch and Mao didn't have those scenes nor were any scenes like that with V.V< -a Code Geass user is still a Code Geass user, activated or not is about the succession and immortality -since there is no stat of who made the statement, it is dismiss-able and if the said material contradict it, Yep, a retcon require a material, welcom to anime the other stuff are off-topic and point-less to the discussion |
LelouchviBritMER said: Phantomnocomics said: there is a LINE between a writer, and a director, the one gets the say over the show is the director, not the writer. this is 101 and should not be a discussion You keep brining up that moot point. i already explained why it's moot but you just choose to ignore it because it doesn't fit your fantasy. I repeat: In Continue Vol.42 it was explained that when it came to the death of Lelouch everyone agreed, the decision to kill him off was taken unanimously. in case you don't understand what that means, it means that the director agreed that Lelouch was to be killed. this means that whenever a writer says Lelouch is dead, he also voices the opinion of the director. As such, this entire point is moot! Continue: Was there a dispute among the staff members regarding the ending? Okouchi: No. It was decided fairly naturally. During the "Code Geass" script meetings, there are many cases in which there were a number of disputes, but there were barely any when it came to the scripts for (the previous series's) episode 25 and the final episode. I think everyone felt the same when it came to the end of the character that is Lelouch. And in the "geass memories" series they repeated this: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." You can find these tweets on their twitter here. A screenshot of the tweets. The translation of the tweets. So there it is, the director himself agreed that THE END OF LELOUCH IS DEATh. And his choice for death was part of his character arc. By the end of the series, Lelouch chose to die. The info is all there. how are you not getting this? Phantomnocomics said: the other thing is, you are mis-interpreting stuff, the Only time there was an agreement between the writer and director, would be the writer confirming the end of lelouch no more no less Dude, they explicitly explain thatbhis end was death, that this is what was agreed between the writer and the director. Lelouch chose death at the end of the series! I cannot believe you can't understand this, i think you're pretending just because you refuse to have your fantasy bubble popped. The info they gave us cannot be any more explicit. The end of Lelouch is death. he chose this in the final episode because he is no longer the same character as at the start of the series. Explain how YOU are you from "the end of Lelouch is death" and "Lelouch chose death" to "he must be alive" Phantomnocomics said: what you are saying is: because he agreed to that, he therefore he agreed to the anything the writer does First of all, if the director hadn't agreed, it wouldn't have been green-lit. If the director hadn't agreed that Leloiuch was dead, he wouldn't have let the anime make it clear that Lelouch could not have the code and he wouldn't have allowed the anime to establish the rules that prevented Lelouch from getting a code. Secondly, you're just attemptingnto create a smokescreen with that point because the director explicitly agreed with Lelouch dying, as has been shown several times Phantomnocomics said: the tweets that i quoted are that of the writer repeating what i said since post 1, that lelouch's end will be deah, which you are interpreting as = lelouch is dead These interviews are from 2008 and the tweets refer to how the original series were amde. there was no movie sequel in the makes back then. Season 2 was the end of the Lelouch, therefore Lelouch was truly dead. They say so very very literally, HE CHOSE DEATH Phantomnocomics said: if akira toriyama would have said, goku end would be death, it doesn't necessarily mean that he's dead, as by death, he could mean that the end for goku would be death but not that goku itself is dead What a fallacy! If the series ended there and Goku was ran through with a sword with no means to survive it, then yes the end of goku would be dead. Phantomnocomics said: i already explained how the rules works and why you are yourself an assumption, and how there is no actual violation to the show setting No, you didn't. All you did was postyulate some assumptions. Prove them! Show screenshots, show dialogue which shows that having a code and a geass at the same time is possible! And don't even think to say "it was never shown, therefore it is possible" because that is a ridiculous fallacy. That's like the joke in the Simpsons where Lisa says she has a rock which keeps bears away. But there are no bears here? Yeah, good rock, isn't it? Do you see your fallacy? There is not a single frame in the entire anime, not a single line of dialogue or inner monologue which hints at the possibility of there being exceptions to the established rule of losing your geass when you get the code. If you can't do that, then your assumption is wrong because it has no basis in the anime. What the anime shows us is the following. C.C. had a geass in the past. She later confirms Lelouch's suspicions that she can't use geass herself in the present. Charles has a geass. he himself explicitly explains he has exchanged his geass for the code. V.V. must have had a geass (because otherwise he couldn't have the code) and never shows any signs of having geass. The nun as well, she must have had geass, and by the end she didn't anymore. Charles himself explicitly explained that the loss of geass was caused by receiving the code. The show is very very very clear: when you get the code, you lose the geass. Not once is it ever suggested that there are exceptions or conditions to this. Phantomnocomics said: you returned to the same point that was already discussed that is by itself an assumption It's not an assumption if the anime itself spells it out for us. If the anime shows us it is so, then it's a fact and not an assumption. Phantomnocomics said: Geass Code users lose their geass if their code is activated There is NO code activation. Dude, rewatch the show. the anime itself makes that crystal clear. charles was never affected by Lelouch's geass, he had no red eyes and there was no blue brain stuff. Therefore he was immune to geass and thus he had a code BEFORE he shot himself, which means codes no not require death to activate. Phantomnocomics said: hence why C.C was killed by the nun ''or else how can someone survive a blood lake* First of all, there is no logical way to go from "she's lying in a pool of blood" to "codes MUST be activated through death". that is a big fallacy as that deduction is entirely wrong. Secondly, it is extremely easy to explain what happened there. As the nun said she tricked C.C., she stabbed C.C. to force a dilemma on her "accept my code and survive, or refuse and die", C.C. didn't want to die so she accepted the code, became immortal and survived. people with the code still bleed, you know. That was shown in episode 1 when she was shot in the head and lay in a pool of blood too. Charles himself contradicts you on that. he says he lost his geass when he got the code! "I have gained a new power in place of geass" are his exact words. It's not an assumption when the anime itself is the one saying it! Dude, don't try to use such weak arguments. The guide book confirmed what the anime said: Lelouch is dead and has no code. The guide book confirmed what the show staff said: Lelouch is truly truly dead. Therefore, when it comes to the fate of Lelouch, the guide book is not wrong. It's such a childish defense to say that all the facts which disagree with you are wrong. A spinoff is a story in the same universe which doesn't focus on the main character of the original series. Akito was a spinoff. A guide book which is the literal compendium to the show, is NOT a spinoff. You're just digging your hole deeper and deeper by showing that you don't understand what you're talking about. Phantomnocomics said: if it's backed up by the material and contradicted, it's not canon It doesn't contradict what the anime said. It confirms it! The guide book confirmed what the anime said: Lelouch is dead and has no code. The guide book confirmed what the show staff said: Lelouch is truly truly dead. The guide book is canon. Again, you misuse the word assuming. The guide book confirms what the show has said and what the show staff have literally repeated for 10 years. Those are verifiable facts, not assumptions. Phantomnocomics said: Long story short: there are Only writer tweets ''who is not the director'' about lelouch will be death Moot moot moot! The director agreed that lelouch died, I have provided sources for that above. When it comes to the death of Lelouch, the writer speaks as the mouth of the director. Phantomnocomics said: -there is no violation of the rules, you are using an assumption/half-truth for the sake of arguing Dude. Seriously. The anime made it crystal clear that everyone loses the geass when they get the code. ALL the precedents show us that. Charles himself confirmed it. Not once is there ever a point in the anime when it is suggested that this may not always be so, NOT ONCE! You are taking your fantasies for facts. What? LOL I have given you the links to the guide book. Did you think I fabricated that book or so? The guide book says REPEAtEDLY that he's dead. If you don't believe me that the book exists, here is the book for sale on amazon. Still don't believe there's a guide book which says he's dead? I'll give you some excerpts from the book. You can find pictures here "Pierced by Suzaku's sword, Lelouch dies with a satisfied smile on his face." "For those two who bear the heavy sin known as killing their fathers, they share the belief that they can forgive each other by imposing the greatest punishments on themselves. Death for Lelouch who wishes for a tomorrow with his sister, life for Suzaku who wishes to atone for his sins through death." [i]"Until right before her brother dies, she seems to want to hate him for that. Upon realizing the truth behind her brother's actions, Nunnally clings to her brother's corpse and wails."[/b] "Suzaku, masquerading as Zero who is thought to have died in the war before, appears and stabs Lelouch to death" Do you still deny the existence of an official guide book which is the compendium of the series which says that Lelouch is dead? The anime told us very clearly that people lsoe the geass when they get the code, Lelouch never lost his geass so it's impossible for him to have the code! Even Nunnally, who can sense truthfullness when she touches someone's hand was crying. Why would she be crying if she could feel he wasn't dead? Hell, the show was even VERY on the nose with foreshadowing Lelouch's death! Lelouch's mantra was “The only ones who should kill, are those who are prepared to be killed." He repeats this several times throughout the series, it bookends the series and he even repeats this as his final words before getting impaled! the mantra is NOT “The only ones who should kill, are those who are prepared to fake their death" or “The only ones who should kill, are those who are prepared to be dead for 2 minutes" Even more, in the very first episode his death was foreshadowed by the following conversation between Lelouch and Rivalz: Rivalz: Do you fantasize about running a major corporation? Lelouch: No way. Ambitions like that will ruin your health You are joking. I provided a massive amount of proof through linking transcripts of dialogues, pointing out how the anime portrayed things, pictures of interviews, pictures of the guide book, official statements from the writer and the director, etc. What have you delivered? Nothing! Nothing but "I say this and thus it must be". You go against the words of the director, you deny the existence of books which I have already linked, you deny what the anime has clearly said; And all of that without a shred of proof. Show screenshots of where they say there are exceptions to the rule of losing the geass! Show interviews of where they say (in 2008!) that the end of R2 was not the end of Lelouch. Until you provide such proof your words are wind The amount of stretching those posts have, is, something to say the least - already posted and discussed the tweet about the Ichiro Okouchi initially confirming the thing about the end of lelouch will be death with the Goro taniguchi. you should others' posts before posting or else things can get repetitive which is a concession to the discussion -you bring up a lot of irrelevant stuff, the only important staff in here is the *director* Goro Taniguchi and and semi-important *writer* Ichiro Okouchi, whoever else is unimportant, what else, the animator agreed to it? - you are still using your misinterpretation to justify your reasoning which was been shown to be false posts before, but to remind you here it is again: Ichiro is releasing the tweet series where he talks about the initials and stuff about the production days of code geass, he mentions that he confirmed something, the thing being that the end of lelouch will be his death with the director there is no such thing as a *Director agreed to director other than what is stated above, don't make up stuff that is not there. and end of lelouch will be death =/= lelouch is dead. this was said long ago -and the explanation is simply, read above, don't use an mis-interpretation of something stated as a fact, lad, one simply does not translate to the other -again, you are trying to claim that just because he agreed to the writer initial thought of ''end of lelouch will be death'' statement to other stuff, one does not translate to the other, sure, he confirmed it with the writer, but no more no less, don't stretch something more than it is -tweets =/= interviews, make sure to read properly before responding, the DB response made no sense, care to elaborate in it and explain as it is confusing? -as for the rule things gtGJZshwUS4 C.C had two Geass when she got the Geass Code/mark from the nun who stated that someone to have it, they have to possess a certain level of Geass -------- As mao said, Geass simply does not Work, in C.C its Geass contractor and a Geass Code user Geass work in those who you did form a Geass code users contract with, you can violate the contract and still have your geass -------------------------- the only reason why Lelouch Geass didn't work in charles is because they were in the World of C although it did work in the collective un-consiciousness which is an exception by itself, where Geass power does not work since the place is not a normal spacial place and any visual block or space alterations can cause the the Geass power to be ineffective none of the above is stated directly in the show, rings a bell? and you are still assuming stuff, never was there a scene where someone obtained a Geass code from not their contractor, goes to show what the level of discussion is, denying it only breaks your argument, lad --------------------------- and if there was no activation process, there would be No Point in C.C fatal bleeding lake if that were to be the case, then the injurey would have had to happen after C.C obtaining her Geass Mark which makes no sense as that would be the equivalent of the nun forcing C.C to kill her while injuring C.C after becoming a mortal which is a mere headcanon story wise - let me introduce you in something that might blow your mind canon wise: Feats > statements, he simply was lying or was wrong - again, never was there a scene where someone obtains a Geass code while not being contracted to the user, stop making shit up, lad ---------------------------------- - Guidebooks being wrong = week argument. ok lad, i guess the DB Guidebook was right about frieza being able to destroy the universe in his second form - No, a Spin off is a side material to another main ONE. your def is broken. lad - as said, those are just remainders, if the material contradict the side materials/spin offs then they are not canon, simple as that. your claimed confirmation is, let me guess, end of lelouch will be death? --------------------------------- and you are still assuming that the book does not contradict the material, since what the book says need to be backed up by the material, if not, then it's not canon, your so called facts are mere quotes and interpretations from the book that are irrelevant, as of the moment -director =/= writer. director agreed to the initial production thing: ''end of lelouch will be death'' by the writer, there is NOTHING more than it, and no, a screenwriter is not the mount of director, lad, you should study what post strucutalism is, but please, have the honor of calling it a moot point with no reason -claimed statement in the Guidebook: Lelouch is dead =/= actual statement: Lelouch dies| Lelouch to death. and read what i said about the guidebooks ---------------------------------- -keep in mind that the only time this happened was when said person obtained the Geass mark of their contractors, who they cannot be effected by the Geass of those why they contract into. the show says nothing about obtaining the Geass mark of a Geass mark user who you are not contracted to, and again, your counter argument is a mere assumption and the contract violation marianne did is a proof that there are exceptions to the rules, lad! ----------------------------------- and let me rephease it for ya: your argument is an interpretation of a copy-pasta some writer's initial thought of placing death as the end of some characters and stretching to the director for agreeing to such thought making him as if he agreed to the other stuff ------------------------------------ your other argument is an assumption and head-canon. never was there a scene for your assumption to work and the other would be head canon since there is no scene of it nor does it make sense -------------------------------- no need to make a book for an argument, if one exists, then ONE line is more than enough. |
PhantomnocomicsNov 17, 2018 1:38 PM
LelouchviBritMER said: Which scenes are you talking about? Phantomnocomics said: -those are not necessary, this is an assumption that this happens everytime a Geass user tries to Geass every Geass Code user It's not an assumption when the anime itself shows us that this is the case. if this is your argument, that it wsn't shown for C.C. because she was his contractor than that means that Charles was also his contractor. Do you see your mistake? It wasn't done for mao, it was done for Lelouch (and Rolo). The reason it wasn't done for Mao is because the red rings and blue brain scenes are non-diegetic and wouldn't provide useful information. But this is irrelevant because w are talking about Lelouch, for whose geass it IS shown, and not about Mao. What are you saying? We never see V.V. use his geass because he had already lost it before we met him. There is no such thing as a "code geass" user. Show me ONE screenshot where such a thing is referenced. The show is crystal clear that everyone loses the geass when they get the code. It's even explciitly confirmed by Charles himself. Denying this is like denying that Lelouch is a prince. What statement? I have no idea what you're talking about here. Please provide a context for your words. point is, the argument is broken, even if they were to be exlusive for those who you form a contract with, Mao still Got No mental images from trying to Geass C.C, his Geass marker, and marianne already Geassed C.C, Geass code/mark user with no issue, lad ---------------------------- and the argument which i just debunked lad. --------------------------- don't quote one half and leave and other and be like: do you see your mistake?.< actual statement, ironic --------------------------- those were mental images, lad, not visual, and the Geass still connects the same way as Lelouch does, just different powers -------------------------- actually, we see him when he had it as a child --------------------------- don't have to post something that is not said but present, that's a fallacy. it's the equivalent of saying: post that the nun said C.C has to have two eyes of Geass so the succession work and for the activation part, read what i said ------------------------- Scan the stater, you can't post a statement without stating its stater, imagine if you posted what some animator said?, the writer is an enough of an issue, and the live commentary< ------------------------ Lelouch is not a PRINCE anymore since he was disowned/abadoned in his heritage< Geass mark Haver<, does this sound better, and the term is stated in the show even in the lelouch killing charles in the C world. |
LelouchviBritMER said: Phantomnocomics said: you should others' posts before posting or else things can get repetitive which is a concession to the discussion Things are repetitive because you don't understand that you're doing massive mental gymnastics in an attempt to make an erroneous point. Phantomnocomics said: -you bring up a lot of irrelevant stuff, the only important staff in here is the *director* Goro Taniguchi and and semi-important *writer* Ichiro Okouchi, whoever else is unimportant, what else, the animator agreed to it? You keep ignoring the point. The decision was made unanimously! There was consensus! I guess you don't know what those words mean? that means that everyone present agreed to what was decided. Which means that everybody present when it was decided has the same opinion. So if the writer says "everyone decided to kill off Lelouch" that means the director decided that too and thus he also speaks in name of the director. You keep trying to create a smokescreen by ignoring those facts for which I have even provided sources. this is a clear case of desperately trying to stay in the discussion even though you have no more real arguments. Phantomnocomics said: - you are still using your misinterpretation to justify your reasoning which was been shown to be false posts before, There are no false posts, all those posts were official and correct and have been properly sourced by links. Phantomnocomics said: but to remind you here it is again: Ichiro is releasing the tweet series where he talks about the initials and stuff about the production days of code geass, he mentions that he confirmed something, the thing being that the end of lelouch will be his death with the director there is no such thing as a *Director agreed to director other than what is stated above, don't make up stuff that is not there. You just said it yourself, the director agreed that the end of Lelouch is death. Season 2's ending was the end of Lelouch. they even literally say so! There are probably a lot of people who think of it as a Bad End, a tragedy, considering the protagonist's, Lelouch's end as well. However, Lelouch says in the first episode: "Only those prepared to be shot are allowed to pull the trigger themselves." If you were to think of that as his pride, then I think his getting shot (killed) in the end was a logical end. To put it in logical terminology: (Season 2 ending = Lelouch's end) ∨ (Lelouch's end = death) ⇒ (Season 2's ending = Lelouch's death) This conclusion is inescapable, it is pure logic. So stop repeating the nonsense that Lelouch ending = death is not the same as Lelouch being dead. Phantomnocomics said: -again, you are trying to claim that just because he agreed to the writer initial thought of ''end of lelouch will be death'' statement to other stuff, one does not translate to the other, sure, he confirmed it with the writer, but no more no less, don't stretch something more than it is You repeating and repeating and repeating the same erroneous folly over and over again doesn't make it right. The final episode was the end of Lelouch, and it was death. Phantomnocomics said: As mao said, Geass simply does not Work, in C.C its Geass contractor and a Geass Code user You twist the anime's words yet again. Mao does not say "geass doesn't work on you because you're the one who gave me geass. Geass doesn't work any anybody who has the code, regardless of whether they were the geasser's contractor or not. Noit only is the explciitly confirmed by show staff in a live commentary (already copy pasted above, where they confirm Charles was not geassed by Lelouch and faking his death), but even the anime itself proves you wrong: Turn 20 Lelouch: Sorry, Rivalz. And good luck. Kallen, take care of C.C. I have to kill him even if I die doing it! I’m gambling that I can kill immortal who never ages and who’s immune to the power of Geass. That’s the only chance I have left! Lelouch said Charles is immune to his geass. But Charles isn't the contractor of Lelouch, so if you had been right, Charles shouldn't have been immune to Lelouch's geass. Therefore all code bearers are immune to all geass. Therefore Charles being immune to Lelouch's geass in Tuurn 15 proves that he had a code and this proves that codes do not require activation! Quod erat demonstrandum. Phantomnocomics said: Geass work in those who you did form a Geass code users contract with, you can violate the contract and still have your geass I have no idea what you're saying here. Reformulate in proper English. Phantomnocomics said: the only reason why Lelouch Geass didn't work in charles is because they were in the World of C And where does the anime say that? You're just making up stuff. It is NEVER said that geass doesn't work in C's World. Phantomnocomics said: although it did work in the collective un-consiciousness which is an exception by itself, Lelouch did not geass god, he made a request, to not stop the march of time. Lelouch even says so literally, he doesn't intend to defeat/geass god: Charles: You’re a fool, Lelouch! God cannot be defeated by the power of the king! Lelouch: I don’t intend to defeat God! This is a request! Phantomnocomics said: where Geass power does not work since the place is not a normal spacial place and any visual block or space alterations can cause the the Geass power to be ineffective Again, you're making stuff up because you have no arguments. Show screenshots where this was said. if you don't then it's clear that these fantasies are not part of the anime. Phantomnocomics said: never was there a scene where someone obtained a Geass code from not their contractor Exactly! And that shows that that detail is irrelevant. if the person/source of your geass was relevant, then it was crucial to know this and then they would have addressed this is some way. BUT THEY NEVER DID Which shows it is NOT relevant at all. They also never say what happens when you get kissed by green haired girls. Does that do anything special? No, because if it did it would have been addressed. Likewise with getting geass from one person and code from another. Those are irrelevant details. Might as well fantasize a rule that it matters what day of the week you get the code. If it's not addressed by the show, it doesn't play a role. Phantomnocomics said: , goes to show what the level of discussion is, denying it only breaks your argument, lad If you truly believe that, then you have no idea how to formulate a corrrect, logical deduction. The above reasoning about assumptions which lack information in the show was proven in this post Phantomnocomics said: and if there was no activation process, there would be No Point in C.C fatal bleeding lake Yes there is and i already explained. I'll have to repeat myself yet again, hoping you will understand this time. The nun said she tricked C.C., she gravely injured C.C. to force a dilemma on her "accept my code and live, or refuse and die". That's why the blood is there! Without injury she couldn't force her code on C.C. Phantomnocomics said: if that were to be the case, then the injurey would have had to happen after C.C obtaining her Geass Mark which makes no sense as that would be the equivalent of the nun forcing C.C to kill her while injuring C.C after becoming a mortal which is a mere headcanon story wise The correct order of what happened is: 1) the immortal nun injures a normally mortal C.C. 2) this imposes the dilemma on C.C. "accept code or die" 3) C.C. accepts the code, she become immortal and the nun become immortal 4) the nun who is now mortal again commits suicide, which is evidenced by her peaceful posture and the fact that none of C.C.'s blood is near the nun which shows that C.C. had no hand in the nun's death. who was and where? Phantomnocomics said: - again, never was there a scene where someone obtains a Geass code while not being contracted to the user, stop making shit up, lad EEEEEXACTLY! Precisely because it was never addressed it means it has no significance. There's an infinite amount of things which are never addressed by the show, none of those things are of any significance. if something is required to be known in order to understand the story, they will inform the audience of this. There's a litreally infinite amount of variables when the codes are transferred: the time of day, the color of the code bearere's hair, the position of the stars, the geass user's breakfast, etc etc etc, literally infinite. None of those things are brought up because none of thsoe things are of significance. likwise the source of the code, it doesn't matter who gives the code to whom, because it is NOT addressed by the show and thus is is of no significance. You completely dug your own gave here. Assuming things without basis in the show is pure hedacanon, it's fantasy, and it's not related to the canon lore. Thusly, it matters not that Charles and Lelouch had no geass contract, precisely because it was never mentioned by the show. Phantomnocomics said: - Guidebooks being wrong = week argument. ok lad, i guess the DB Guidebook was right about frieza being able to destroy the universe in his second form I know nothing about DB or its guide books, and it matters not because we're talking about Code Geass. What you're doing is a strawman fallacy. We talk about X, and you bring in Y which has no relation to X and start arguing about Y. Phantomnocomics said: if the material contradict the side materials/spin offs then they are not canon, simple as that. your claimed confirmation is, let me guess, end of lelouch will be death? There is no contradiction, all the guide book did was confirm what the anime already said. The anime has made it crystal clear that it is impossible for Lelouch to have a code, and thus a sword through the gut is death. Anime and guide book are in 100% agreement Phantomnocomics said: -director =/= writer. director agreed to the initial production thing: ''end of lelouch will be death'' by the writer, there is NOTHING more than it, and no, a screenwriter is not the mount of director, lad, you should study what post strucutalism is, but please, have the honor of calling it a moot point with no reason This again? The director and the writer shared the same oopinion, thus one can speak for the other. And the end of season 2 was (in 2008) the end of Lelouch. Phantomnocomics said: the show says nothing about obtaining the Geass mark of a Geass mark user who you are not contracted to, and again, your counter argument is a mere assumption You repeat your own undoing. Precisely because it wasn't mentioned, it means that is of no significance, just like the infinite of other things which weren't mentioned. if it had been important to know to understand the ending, it would have been mentioned. THUS, "it wasn't mentioned" ⇒ "it is of no significance". Read the post which logically deduces this. Phantomnocomics said: and the contract violation marianne did is a proof that there are exceptions to the rules, lad! Marianne didn't violate her contract. She died before she could fullfil it. That's not violating a contract. Your arguments are so terribly out of date, all of them have already been fully debunked years ago by the fandom. read this Code geass database if you wish to understand the show impressive, One Response? guess things are progressing, thought i would see 4 separates response with each one detailing one part of each line. ---- No, lad, do you even read?, i'm not the one who repeats myself, posting once and quoting it is more than enough, re-posting it is point-less and repetitive and a concession to the discussion, i simply repeat what is already said to your repetitive posts ---- like i said, just don't bring up irrelevant stuff, keep it restricted to writer and the director, whoever else is unimportant ---- being sourced does not equal correct ---- terminology: an END of a character means that the said character ended as in, never is shown again, then there is death, which is duh. then put it into application and it's contradicted logic wise since the character never ended once their death was shown, canon wise. ''and Yes, it's a nitpick-y point but i'm making a point'' the other thing being, the end of character being death doesn't necessarily mean the character stat is dead and even if they were to specify that the character stat is dead the material would need to back it up ---------------- lad, if you read your posts, you would understand the confusion for why I am dismissing your repetitive ''director confirms with writer lelouch character end will be death'' --------------- like stated before, i don't have to post what the show says nor if i do it, i have to do in a one to one ratio, the point of my post is that C.C is Mao Geass contractor. and he cannot Geass her therefore, duh and the material contradict your statement of the: Geass does not work in Code Geass users, marianne< --------------- and lad, what can i say, i'm amazed, after writing probably a mini novella worth of text, i screwed up at some point, what a shock! but let me rephrase it: ''Geass work in Code Geass users who you did not a from a contract with and, you can violate the contract and still have the Geass'' and it means what it says lad --------------- Rewatch the video, lad, Charles says that Lelouch Powers won't work in the C world and this is backed up by the source material since lelouch powers did not work specifically in the C world except for the collective un-conciousness because mankind will is not equal or some fake deep stuff, lad ------------- The Command is/was : do not stop time you should really learn what the imperative mood is lad, Lelouch power is commanding, not requesting, This is Headcanon territoy, so watch out, lad ------------- i'm simply stating the established rules in the show that is being, that someone with the power like Lelouch, cannot command if he can't meet an eye with an eye, and any block to it, will deem the power ineffective and this might be SHOCKING, lad, but C world is a dimension, and since regular space does not work like that DIMENSION does, it's not a SHOCK that it doesn't have the same space, this should goes without saying, a soul materializing in it in a physical level is more than enough to confirm it, but go ahead, lad. counter that ---------------- lad, you just agreed that your assumption was point-less all along, then tried to dismiss it with off-topic excuses but for safe measures here it is again: there is no Scenes in the show where someone obtains a Code Geass from someone who they did not a from a contract with. Assuming otherwise is head-canon ------------ read the above lad, it did break one of your arguments and the one who re-confirmed that it is s broken is none other than the broken argument stater ----------- you don't understand lad, Yes, the nun did state that she act as if she tricked C.C, but that where it stops, it jumps to the Nun being dead, C.C having the Code Geass but that make no sense context wise, why would she force it into her?, why would she injure C.C fatally and why would C.C kill the nun and *like that* ? and how would the nun be able to pass it while all of that is happening? < instead of simply, it happening like with V.V and Charles, where nothing graphic seems happened? it's a head-canon and a one that make no sense, lad ------------ Might be Shocking but feats > statements. therefore, Charles was simply wrong or lying. don't know why you keep refusing this fact when charles himself was wrong about marianne death. so a character action have more value than their statements ----------- understand what a strawman fallacy is before stating it, i'm not putting words in your mouth, i'm making an example of why Guildebooks can be wrong, lad, BIG difference, while the said show is irrelevant to the discussion, its Guidebook being Wrong is not. which is what the example is about ---------- the guidebooks simply repeat the was already in the show, the only one thing other than that, is the writer said this and that, which is what your argument is all about --------- sharing the same opinion therefore one can speak in behalf of the other =/= a writer who confirmed a thing, it being the end of a show's character with the director one simply does not translate to the other --------- and let me post the video again Marianne: Oh, but i'm thankful to you, for giving me this Geass C.C : even though you violated the contract. notes: people who suicide don't fall in their backs with their hands crossed and their head bleeding in their back ------ you said it, lad, she *DIED* yet is still alive ------ accept it, lad, there are Exeptions to the rules and your argument is broken. it's clear as the sky |
PhantomnocomicsNov 17, 2018 8:37 PM
LelouchviBritMER said: Phantomnocomics said: like i said, just don't bring up irrelevant stuff, keep it restricted to writer and the director, whoever else is unimportant And what animator or voice octors or whtanot have I cited? It's a whole lot better than being unsourced like you are with your claims that Lelouch is a special snowflake for whom the established rules don't apply. On top of that, my sources were the director and the writer, so yes, being sourced IS being correct in this case. or are you claiming you are a greater authority than the director? Phantomnocomics said: terminology: an END of a character means that the said character ended as in, never is shown again, then there is death, which is duh. And they said he chose death in the final episode. So ... Phantomnocomics said: then put it into application and it's contradicted logic wise since the character never ended once their death was shown, canon wise. ''and Yes, it's a nitpick-y point but i'm making a point'' You're a jester if you believe that the end of the series with the MC getting impaled on a sword isn't the end of the MC, especially because it was officially confirmed he chose to die in that moment. Yes by the director and the writer. Phantomnocomics said: the other thing being, the end of character being death doesn't necessarily mean the character stat is dead and even if they were to specify that the character stat is dead the material would need to back it up The "character stat"? He is labeled as dead by both the director and the writer, that is more than sufficient. You, as a random fan, don't have the authority to overrule that. Even the anime made it clear he was dead since it was made impossible for him to have the code. No your debunked fantasy assumptions don't apply to canon. All the anime ever did was establish that people lose the geass when they get the code. Not once was it suggested that there were exceptions to this. Not once was it mentioned that that it mattered who you got what from. Those are just fan fantasies and not canon. "I don't have to deliver proof" Ok, gotcha, no evidence. Kinda shaky ground for your fantasies then. Phantomnocomics said: C.C is Mao Geass contractor. and he cannot Geass her therefore, duh and the material contradict your statement of the: Geass does not work in Code Geass users, marianne< LOL dude, Marianne did not geass C.C. That wasn't a soul transfer, that's the telepathic link C.C. has with Marianne, she's been talking to her all throughout both seasons. C.C. is immune to geass. C.C. herself said so: Stage 15 Lelouch: C.C., you know way too much about me now.I can’t let you walk away like this. Don’t go! C.C., stay here with me! C.C.: Geass does not work on me. Didn’t I mention that? This was explicitly confirmed by director Taniguchi and writer Okouchi during the live commentary! They had this conversation: パパんにギアス掛けるシーンも、「これギアス掛かってないのに死んだふりするんだよ」「息子を驚かせようと」「ルルーシュくんかわいそう」「これ一番ショックなタイミング計ってるよね」「絶対笑いこらえてるよ」って色々言われてて笑った。 "He isn't geassed, just pretends he dies!" " He tries to surprise his son!" "Poor Lelouch" "He tries to choose the most shocking timing, doesn't he" "I'm sure he tries hard not to laugh" If you had read the Code Geass database which i keep linking you would know that. Not only does that show that code bearers can't be geassed, even if the geasser isn't their contractee, but it also shows that codes do not need to be activated. Yes, that's your beloved director doubly contradicting you there. Phantomnocomics said: ''Geass work in Code Geass users who you did not a from a contract with and, you can violate the contract and still have the Geass'' I still don't quite get what you're saying here. What does "work in users" mean? You mean "on users"? And what is violating the contract? Not killing C.C.? Nobody ever killed her, so I'm not sure what meaning you're giving this. And why would people who don't kill C.C. lose their geass that you'd add the line "and still have the geass". Of course do people who haven't killed C.C. still their geass. Phantomnocomics said: Rewatch the video, lad, Charles says that Lelouch Powers won't work in the C world and this is backed up by the source material since lelouch powers did not work specifically in the C world except for the collective un-conciousness because mankind will is not equal or some fake deep stuff, lad' You completely misunderstand Charles' words. Here's what he says: "Your Geass power will have no effect on me nor will it on anyone else here!. He doesn't say anything about it not working because he's in C's World. It's because Charles has the code and thus immune (as the director himself has explicitly stated), Marianne is dead and only her soul and not her body is there (as seen when she enters), C.C. is immune because she has the code, and Suzaku has already been geassed before. It was not a command, itw as a request. He says so himself. "I don’t intend to defeat God! This is a request! " Yes indeed. An imperative is not accompanied by the word "please" Lelouch says: "Collective unconscious! Please, don’t stop the march of time!" Adding "please" changes it from a command to a request, as Lelouch himself has already stated. (Turn 21) Phantomnocomics said: Lelouch power is commanding, not requesting, This is Headcanon territoy, so watch out, lad Lelouch himself disagrees with you, boy. I think it's been too long since you last saw the show, you are clearly misremembering a lot and are in dire need of a rewatch. Lelouch most lietrally says "this is a request" and you say that is my headcanon. the same applies to all your other mistakes. You misremember and think your own headcanon is canon and can no longer recognize true canon when it is cited. Phantomnocomics said: and this might be SHOCKING, lad, but C world is a dimension, and since regular space does not work like that DIMENSION does, it's not a SHOCK that it doesn't have the same space, this should goes without saying, a soul materializing in it in a physical level is more than enough to confirm it, but go ahead, lad. counter that The nature of C's World was never explained, is it physical or metaphysical? is it real or in the mind? None of that is ever explained. what works or doesn't work is also never explained. Any fan explanations are headcanon and not canon. Phantomnocomics said: but for safe measures here it is again: there is no Scenes in the show where someone obtains a Code Geass from someone who they did not a from a contract with. That is no proof for your assumption at all. The anime also doesn't show any other 17 year old boys getting a geass. Does that make him being a 17 year old boy an exception to the established rules? No of course not. The fact that they never mention such a detail means that the detail has no meaning. the lack of precedents means that it has no effect on the rules. thus, the default rules apply. And what are the default rules? What the anime has shown us 100% of the time: people who got the code lost the geass. ALL of them. Do you not know how proof works? The show also never shows that C.C. is not bald and isn't wearing a green wig. Is this now proof that C.C. is bald and does wear a wig? Of course not. But that the exact same reasoning you're applying here. If you want to proof that getting the code and geass from different people doesn't work like the show has always shown us, then you have to point at something that exists in the show, not at something that doesn't exist. Do you not see the irony? You cannot give screenshots or dialogue which support your claims, while I can show you how it works. ALL precedents show that the geass is lost, even Charles confirms it. And yet you say that my words are headcanon? No boy, my words come straight from the anime, yours are but unsubstantiated fantasy. Phantomnocomics said: read the above lad, it did break one of your arguments and the one who re-confirmed that it is s broken is none other than the broken argument stater It would help if you provided context for your words by using the quote system like I do because I have no idea what you're talking about. Phantomnocomics said: you don't understand lad, Yes, the nun did state that she act as if she tricked C.C, but that where it stops, it jumps to the Nun being dead, C.C having the Code Geass And how does that prove your point in any way? It doesn't. to guarantee 100% success rate, to make sure she finally could die. Dude, come on, I just explained that! The nun wounded C.C. so that C.C. would accept the code to survive the wound, which would make the nun mortal again so the nun could finally commit suicide. She didn't! I explained all of this in detail, even with a step by step chronology. Jesus, do some effort reading my posts. No wonder I have to keep repeating myself! C.C. did NOT kill the nun! the nun commited suicide! This is evidenced by the peaceful posture of the nun's corpse and the fact that none of C.C.'s blood was any way near the nun, so C.C. hadn't come close to the nun. Because C.C. had double eyes and willingly accepted the nun's code because C.C. didn't want to die from her injury. Phantomnocomics said: < instead of simply, it happening like with V.V and Charles, where nothing graphic seems happened? Charles didn't need trickery to get the code, he already willingly took V.V.'s code. Stabbing isn't necessary, you know. The stabbing was the trick the nun used, it made C.C. choose between accepting the code or death. You didn't even understand what I said, boy. Phantomnocomics said: Might be Shocking but feats > statements. therefore, Charles was simply wrong or lying. So all the characters who prove your wrong are liars. Okay then I guess the anime itself must be lying too then, because it provides no basis for the exceptions you are postulating. Because the anme itself proves him right. Show me one example of him being wrong. One precedent. What are you on about? Charles wasn't wrong about Marianne's death. Ah, so you admit that Leolouch's death was in the show? Phantomnocomics said: the only one thing other than that, is the writer said this and that, which is what your argument is all about And now you resort to petty lying. Shocker! My arguments have always been two-fold: the anime itself AND the official statements. I have said a million times that the anime itself made it crystal clear that Lelouch cannot have the code. The anime has established rules about codes and Lelouch having the code would have violated those rules. Phantomnocomics said: sharing the same opinion therefore one can speak in behalf of the other =/= a writer who confirmed a thing, it being the end of a show's character with the director What a fallacy. If A and B have a meeting and come to the agreement that the apple is red, and it is reported that A and b were in agreement during the apple meeting, and later A says that the apple is red, then it's correct to deduce that b also finds that the apple is red. Phantomnocomics said: Marianne: Oh, but i'm thankful to you, for giving me this Geass C.C : even though you violated the contract. Fansubs. The official translation can be found here Marianne: Because I appreciate what you did. At least as far as giving me my Geass power. C.C: And you never fulfilled your contract. Violating the contract makes no sense because there was never a required time limit or anything of the sorts. If you and i have a deal that one day I'll give you 1 euro, and tomorrow i haven't done it yet, that's not violating the deal, that's simply not yet having fulfilled the deal. Violating contracts makes no sense in the context of C.C.'s contracts. Phantomnocomics said: notes: people who suicide don't fall in their backs with their hands crossed and their head bleeding in their back They don't "fall" at all. They cut their throat, lay themselves down in a peaceful, religous pose and bleed out. Death is rarely instant, if your brain isn't blown out or so. Bleeding out takes time. She? Who are you talking about, C.C.? The nun? Sailor Moon? Please use the quote system to provide context. It's there for a reason. What exceptions? your mistaken belief that Marianne geassed C.C.? Even though that's clearly not the case as in that case Marianne's soul would be in C.C.'s body and control it like she did with Anya,a nd we see that that doesn't happen. C.C. remains in control of her own body and marianne's soul is still in Anya. Marianne didn't use her geass on C.C. at all. Once again you are making stuff up which the anime flat out denies. Edit: that part about Marianne makes me think you never saw the official translations. Maybe that's why you're mistaken about so many things, who knows what kind of butchered fansubs you saw. I'll help you. Go to the transcript's main page, there you'll find a downloadable file with all the official bandai subs. Don't worry if your pc says it doesn't recognize the episode files, they're just text files and can be opened with wordpad or whatever you want. The text files contain all the official subs, including the time stamps of the dialogue, accurate to 1/100th of a second. Enjoy :) -Well, lad, you clearly don't understand what state whose the stater means -lad, what a shock, it's not like my SOURCE is the material itself, while Yours is just what some writer said about a production initial and it being a decade ago, and confirming that initial still does not grant writer director/author privilege, i don't know why you can't get it, but i will keep mentioning it --------------- and you still don't comprehend that confirming a production initial a decade ago with the director does not grant the writer's a director/author privilege -------------- -choosing death means what it is, that someone choose death, nothing, more, nothing less, it does not necessarily translate to other things. ------------- -read the above, and again, it seems you Keep ignoring what i say in the second line, soi might just put it in simple terms: DIRECTOR =/= WRITER, the so called confirmation is the quote of what i wrote i just wrote before this, don't be vague for the sake of your argument, lad --------------- -Director =/= Writer, ''WRITER'', and a Character facing death or it being the end of their character does not translate to their character stat being dead nor is there one that says so ---------------- -amazing, lad, it amuse me how even though i told you to quote the whole part, you quote one part and leave the other for the sake of arguing like some professional fallacy maker but to compensate, don't have to post something that is not said but present, that's a fallacy. it's the equivalent of saying: post that the nun said C.C has to have two eyes of Geass so the succession work in other words, i'm still right, the proof does not have to be a copy-pasta, lad. -------- it seems you didn't understand what i wrote before : Feats > statements, and marianne still was able to Geass herself Into the World of memories, which is a Geass work by itself -------- Geass works in Code Geass Holders, and Violating a contract does not necessarily mean that the person will lose their Geass, there are exceptions. ------ the it is never stated in how it WORKS is not even an argument < by that, 90% of what is is written in here is not stated, it is simply Guessed from how the show implications and hints, the NUN saying someone must reach a certain level of Geass does not necessarily means that she was refering to C.C having two Geass by your sense which is essentially a fallacy by itself since i already explained that a show is not entitled to be direct about it so no, it's not a FAN explanation, SPACE does not WORK like that. and really, you are gonna ignore the part where this a FREAKING SOUL with PHYSICAL BODIES? and marianne power is clear, she can only transfer her soul into other PERSONS, that's HER POWERS<, so the WORLD of C has to be some kind of a BEING/Person, so it could be both metaphysical and physical -------------- read what i wrote above a physical soul is still physical charles is not lelouch contract former You can still Geass Code Holders, read what i said about marianne Geassing C.C, in an other note: don't forget that C.C broke Charles Geass, it's possible that Note holders can overwrite/break other Geass, but that doesn't change the fact that marianne still did Geass C.C even if it as C.C who allowed it --------------- Lelouch power is not requesting, it is commanding nor was the command what you wrote this is the command: collective un-consiousness, do not stop time the other was merely a response to charles cool, headcanon, lad --------------- and really, what an argument!?, he said Please with a command therefore it is a request?, what a shock, i guess the other commands where he says please is a request power "Teacher, please tell me the answers for tomorrow's test." it's called headcanon, lad --------------- def of assumption: A thing that is accepted as true or as certain to happen, without proof the scenes is not there, therefore it is my PROOF, however your False equivalent is not there, and let me say it this way: if it's not there, it's not there. thinking just because the scenes is not there doesn't mean it didn't happen is an assumption, talk about irony, and quote all of it --------------- Your made up a context for a scene that doesn't exist, and tried to use existing scenes that to justify your make up point is, she ACTS as if she tricked C.C, but that where it stops and jumps to the other scene with the nun and C.C being dead and ...immortal? in other words, the point proven is that it's a head-canon lad ------------------ a character does not translate to a show nor is a character is always right and they can be wrong, assuming otherwise is a fallacy you also forget that Charles was wrong about Marianne death ------------------- Marianne did die twice, and Charles didn't know that V.V already killed her once since she pretended not to see V.V and agreed to his plan by making Nunnally witness and returning to her body to yet die again --------------------------- violating a contract does make a sense, there is a Promise given when making a contract, never fulfilling the promise is a violation by itself, but, semantics --------------------------- side notes: we both are using the material as it is the center of the discussion, even a 2 year old can know and say that, however, your main argument is that of the writer statement, not that of the material itself, calling it a lie is ironically what a word like petty would be suitable for ---------- notes: a Nun who would suicide wouldn't fall in her back with her hands crossed and have the head of her back bleed by then nor does it make sense in your context Your made up context make no sense: if C.C willingly let the Nun, the Nun wouldn't had a reason to USE force, as INJURING someone fatally is not necessary for that process. the Only reason why she would Use FORCE is IF C.C rejected that Process, accept it lad, it's a nonsensical head-canon. point is, Yes, you can use the points that happen in those two scenes C.C showing a blood lake that is only near her while being fatally injured, and the Nun having the back of her head bleeding which could only happen by the time she fall and her being wound-less and a posture. but that's just an interpretation, so don't use an interpretation out of the endless, lad, there is more than One scenario for that to happen ------------ and you said it lad, Code geass, the show where peope died and face death yet are alive. ----------- marianne is a living proof of that ------------------------------------ the rules have exceptions you say charles wasn't wrong about marianne death even though Marianne herself pretended to fool charles you say charles statement can't be wrong even though said writing above says otherwise you say that the Dimension cannot be explained even though marianne powers pretty much sups what that place is you say that Geass cannot work in those with Codes yet marianne used her Geass to transport her soul into the world of memories alongside her Geass you say that Geass cannot work in the World of C yet it does in the collective un-conciousness you say it is a request because he said PLEASE, which is hilarious since that's not even an argument and lelouch already said it once before to a teacher you say that C.C fatal wounds were made by the nun even though the nun was blood-free and if she caused those woulds she would have had to have some blood in her or some evidence to it, and C.C being in one place and the Nun being in another while the nun having back of her head bleeding which can only happen like that if it bleeded after shall lied in the ground and not before i t and C.C who was fatally bleeding who did not move from her place since that would leave a spot and it would be noticeable so your head-canon is simply that, that's an mis-interpretation OP theory is still valid but let's the if the next reponse will any half quoting and stretches to it. lad By a Fate fan |
PhantomnocomicsNov 18, 2018 11:28 AM
LelouchviBritMER said: To any Code geass fan, just ignore the vandalizing troll who is trying to deceive people by saying things like that code bearers can be geassed (see here), that souls are physical objects (see here) and who calls the official subs from Bandai "headcanon" (see here). Don't waste your time Here's what is known about the ending of the anime: Lelouch is truly dead and does not have the code. The old code theory was fully debunked years ago. The community already knows this for years because: - the anime makes it clear that it is impossible for Lelouch to have the code as that would have violated the rules the anime itself established, i.e. everyone who gets the code loses the geass, there are no canon exceptions. Lelouch never lost his geass. - the show staff themselves have been repeating for 10 years that Lelouch is truly dead, sometimes poetically, sometimes very very explicitly. For those interested, you can read the community Code Geass database which has gathered all the official statements (interviews, live commentaries, tweets, the remade epilogue from 2009, the official guide book, etc), all with sources, links and even pictures! It also uses the anime itself to show that it is 100% impossible for Lelouch to have the code. As a small example of the linked database, here is a part of the "Geass Memories" where show staff talked about how they made the anime 10 years ago: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with HIS DEATH." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by HIS DEATH. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." Source Screenshot Translation ---------------------------- ---------------------------- If you're asking for sources, they have always been incorporated. I'm not going to repeat myself yet again. All the sources, links and even pictures of who said what and when ican be found in (the Code Geass database Have you fully read it yet? It isn't. You misquoted things based on faulty fansubs. I've already given you a link to the official bandai subs. Use those. Furtermore you pretend that things which aren't part of the anime are somehow part of it, and then of course unable to back that up with screenshots and the like. Your words are misguided headcanon, and NOT the anime itself. And there you go again, completely ignoring half of what i said. by now I no longer think that you are just confused or missed something i said, I'm convinced you're just a lying troll. All throughout this discussion I have used TWO sources the anime itself and the show staff. You keep pretending that I never use the anime itself, but that is justa big fat lie. And the irony is that you yourself don't use the anime but rather some contradicted misinterpretations. Well obviously! The anime was made a decade ago. Phantomnocomics said: and confirming that initial still does not grant writer director/author privilege, I'm going to repeat the facts as long as you keep broadcasting those lies and that attempt at a smokescreen to deceive people. The writer and the director agreed on the death of Lelouch, the decision to kill him off was UNANIMOUS, there was CONSENSUS. That means the distinction between writer and director is moot since they both agreed. So stop pretending that the distinction matters, you're just lying to deceive people. And as long as you keep lying to the people here, i will be here to point out your lies! Phantomnocomics said: -choosing death means what it is, that someone choose death, nothing, more, nothing less, it does not necessarily translate to other things. Are you pretending that Lelouch did not get impaled? Are you pretending that the Zero Requiem did not happen? Lelouch chose death during the Zero requiem, therefore he is dead. You're making a mockery of yourself saying such silly things. Phantomnocomics said: post that the nun said C.C has to have two eyes of Geass so the succession work What, Are you now saying that you don't need double geass eyes to be able to accept someone's code? Your trolling is becoming too obvious. Phantomnocomics said: in other words, i'm still right, the proof does not have to be a copy-pasta, lad. You have no proof for the nonsense you spout because it doesn't exist. claiming that you don't need proof isn't going to help your case. Phantomnocomics said: it seems you didn't understand what i wrote before : Feats > statements, and marianne still was able to Geass herself Into the World of memories, which is a Geass work by itself You still don't understand how Marianne's geass works. her souls is able to inhabit another body. Marianne did not geass C.C. because 1) C.C. has the code and cannot be geassed, 2) Marianne did not take over C.C.'s body, 3) Marianne was still in Anya's body. I find it really really hard to believe you actually mean the nonsense you say about Marianne's geass. I really think that every word you write is just deliberate trolling to antagonize the community. Phantomnocomics said: Geass works in Code Geass Holders, and Violating a contract does not necessarily mean that the person will lose their Geass, there are exceptions. You can't violate agreements which don't have time restrictions. the anime doesn't even ever say Marianne violated her contract, I have shown you the official Bandai subs, they don't say that at all. Phantomnocomics said: so no, it's not a FAN explanation, SPACE does not WORK like that. and really, you are gonna ignore the part where this a FREAKING SOUL with PHYSICAL BODIES? Marianne says "i can only take my original appearance in this system You believe her body just appeared out of thin air? She refers to it as an appearance, not a body. You think souls are physical objects? Pray tell, what shape, colour and weight does a soul have? The anime disagrees with you. the whole Code Geass community disagrees with you. In all my years of discussing Code Geass I have never met someone who made such wild claims which are blatantly contradicted by the anime itself. There's literally nobody but you who believes you can geass code bearers. Dude, really, rewatch the anime or interact with the community or read up on the story, but do something to stop embarrassing yourself like that. Code bearers can NOT be geassed. Not a single person in the community believes that because the anime makes that very clear. I know you're just trying to be a troll, but you're just humiliating yourself here. Which is why Lelouch didn't use his powers. Duh That was a direct copy-paste from the official bandai subs. You think you know better than the people who made this show? You are attacking official subs, the things the anime literally says. Your attempts at trolling are so weak. I'm going to copy directly from the official bandai subs and even keep the time stamps for this, so all can see. Dialogue: 0,0:15:55.95,0:15:58.52,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,The power of the king cannot defeat God! Dialogue: 0,0:15:58.52,0:16:01.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I don't intend to defeat God! This is a request! Dialogue: 0,0:16:01.47,0:16:04.56,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,That's right! Now, I know who I really am! Dialogue: 0,0:16:04.56,0:16:07.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,God! Collective unconscious! Dialogue: 0,0:16:10.91,0:16:13.28,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Please, don't stop the march of time! He literally says he requests it and adds "please". You call the official subs from bandai "headcanon"? Phantomnocomics said: if it's not there, it's not there. thinking just because the scenes is not there doesn't mean it didn't happen is an assumption, You fail to understand how fiction works. An author of fiction wants his audience to understand his work, therefore he will always include all necessary information which is needed to understand the story. that means that if something is not included, it is not necessary for the story. Therefore, if the information isn't present, it's not correct to assume that it is there. Aah yes, your classic. Every time a character contradicts your headcanon, the character is lying. Every time a show staff member contradicts your headcanon, he is lying. Every time the anime contradicts your headcanon, the anime is lying. Sure, buddy, keep it up. hahaha that again. you have still not said what Charles is wrong about. You brought ths up out of the blue, without pointing out how this in any way aids your position, or even what exactly Charles is supposedly wrong about. Again, tell me, what is he wrong about? She got shot ONCE, you do understand that Charles can imprint false memories in people, right? Dude. Duuuude! When V.V. lied to Charles, we hear Charles saying that V.V. was lying. Dude, he knew. Seriously. Dude! Phantomnocomics said: C.C showing a blood lake that is only near her while being fatally injured, and the Nun having the back of her head bleeding which could only happen by the time she fall and her being wound-less and a posture. Lol, do you even read what you write? yes sure, the blood can oooonly come from falling. Sure buddy, sure. Phantomnocomics said: Marianne herself pretended to fool charles What show are you talking baout because it sure as hell ain't Code Geass Phantomnocomics said: you say that Geass cannot work in the World of C yet it does in the collective un-conciousness Lol, getting confused here buddy? I'm not the one who said that geass can't be used in C's World, that was you saying that. You're expsoing yourself as an ordinary troll again, and failed to keep track of who said what. ----------------------------------- ----------------------------------- To any Code geass fan, just ignore the vandalizing troll who is trying to deceive people by saying things like that code bearers can be geassed (see here), that souls are physical objects (see here) and who calls the official subs from Bandai "headcanon" (see here). Don't waste your time Here's what is known about the ending of the anime: Lelouch is truly dead and does not have the code. The old code theory was fully debunked years ago. The community already knows this for years because: - the anime makes it clear that it is impossible for Lelouch to have the code as that would have violated the rules the anime itself established, i.e. everyone who gets the code loses the geass, there are no canon exceptions. Lelouch never lost his geass. - the show staff themselves have been repeating for 10 years that Lelouch is truly dead, sometimes poetically, sometimes very very explicitly. For those interested, you can read the community Code Geass database which has gathered all the official statements (interviews, live commentaries, tweets, the remade epilogue from 2009, the official guide book, etc), all with sources, links and even pictures! It also uses the anime itself to show that it is 100% impossible for Lelouch to have the code. As a small example of the linked database, here is a part of the "Geass Memories" where show staff talked about how they made the anime 10 years ago: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with HIS DEATH." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by HIS DEATH. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." Source Screenshot Translation ''it's a troll guys therefore i am right, and he is wrong, and to prove it!, i have a tweet and a sub-reddit that says i am right!.'' lad, save up the embarrassment of what you just did and pretend it never happened, i read all of the guidebook or else i wouldn't be here. I will repeat what i said since page 1, your are using a tweet of a writer as an argument and that's it. your claimed scan is a Sub-Reddit that is not even a proper wiki, link true scans As far i'm concerned, i have debunked all of your arguments -A character feat is always above their statement if not backed up by a feat, said character being a wrong does not translate to the show being wrong -the writer is not the director nor does the writer stating :i confirmed with the director something, thing being the end of lelouch will be death when they were making the show translate to the writer being the director -Marianne Power transfer her soul alongside her Geass, she transfer her soul to the C world and materialize in it, a feat only possible in the world of memories, therefore, that place is alike it while being a physical place -Lelouch does use his Geass in the Collective Unconsciousness and he confirms that it will work -Lelouch Power does not work because he says Please. ''hilarious'' .it works because as he explained it, the world is made up of mankind will and mankind is inequal therefore so is their will and the world -marianne agreed to V.V plan and pretended that he didn't kill her to fool charles at first. and while charles realized this later on by making the implication ''you lied to me again, Big brother'' when V.V tried to assassinate lelouch he did not at the start of the show, therefore, characters can be wrong and technically she died twice, but that was just a point to explain why someone dying doesn't necessarily that they are dead don't embarrass yourself and concede if you don't have arguments ----------- you made up a head-canon context for the two scenes of the nun and C.C, i corrected it and why it doesn't work, if SHE Injured her that fatally, she would have marks of that, but no blood, no mark, and the Nun was laying in the ground with the back of her head bleeding and only that place C.C was the only one that was fatally bleeding and One spot that is different from the spot where the scenes leave off from not was there any weapon that was shown for that to happen your fan theory doesn't work and base-less --------------- there is MORE than ONE official subtitle, lad, shocking, but i should have used the dub instead, but again, you are arguing semantics that i have already said that that what is the dub and in that sub mean the same thing, not doing what the contract is suppose to do. read before responding the source is not a database, it's a Sub-reddit that tries to act as a wiki that tries to be a Database, but this however is a Direct scan from the Guidebook: https://code-geass.livejournal.com/1178870.html Your statement: *lelouch is Truely dead* and it being anime statement is fake but nice try and nowhere near is it stated in any official material you are not one to speak for a community nor is a selective of elites or in this case, and unless you mean a sub-reddit: lelouch is dead community The rules have exceptions, Lelouch in fact, made the exception by using his Geass in the collective consciousness in the C world , saying there are no exceptions is a Hypocrisy, Marianne is another exception for someone who have used a Geass in a C.C a Code user who she did not form a contract with, and C.C who broke Charles Geass off lelouch | . those are are all examples of why you are wrong yet you don't want to accept that. and the rule you speak of is based of one instance and does not represent another,in fact, your argument is an assumption that it does. the code theory is based of a different instance, it being that the code is obtained from someone who you did not a form contract with nor does the show dismiss it, in fact, Marianne opened the possibility for such with this comment: Linking reddit and claiming it as a source that prove your argument while calling it as a database is hilarious and won't not make your argument untrue. it only means you don't have the scans you claim to have to link it Geass memories are tweets, by the writer, not the director, and they are about the initials of the show production as an unofficial production documentary, not a Q/A confirmation panel. and writer =/= director | writer =/= staff An initial about character END/finale being death does not translate to the character stat being dead Ask Marianne The director agreed to nothing that's just an interpretation of what you think he did, what actually happened is: Tat the writer Only confirmed that a character finale will be death as an initial with the director. whatever else said is an interpretation "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that the end of Lelouch will be death." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with his death." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by his death. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't choose death. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't die, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." here is the twitter for the writer: https://twitter.com/ichirou_o/status/998739675895365633 Geass memories is an unofficial production documentary. not a Q/A confirmation panel, an Initial is not a confirmation stat nor is is a character finale being death means they are dead Marianne: why did you seal your code just when you had what you wanted, the wish to die C.C : even i don't know why i did it. the show confirms that the obtaining a code from someone who you did not a form a Geass contract with is possible and i'm amazed, backing off statements, now?, well, if you backed off the Geass cannot work in the C world, then it only works for me and Lelouch Geass is not the power of requesting, lad, that's head-canon, it's the power of commanding i guess lelouch foreshadowed his secret requesting power to the teacher!, ''hilarious''. someone else however is making a request to anyone who wants to discuss to head to a sub reddit disguised as a wiki disguised as a database. where special/s who can't discuss live don't be silly. i and lelouch is not dead, OP theory confirms it, for anyone interested, go back to page 1, the person above had all of their arguments shot down, they only repeat themselves to look right and edit stuff/backs out when they are proven wrong. but for civility sake, if still have a PROPER Argument for why OP theory doesn't work, then post it, and try not to half-quote and stretch/repeat stuff as it gets boring by a fate fan |
Huntik said: And here i came after 7 years to say : He's not dead, in fact we're getting more Code geass :P you are technically not wrong though |
LelouchviBritMER said: To any Code geass fan, just ignore the vandalizing troll who is trying to deceive people by saying things like that code bearers can be geassed (see here), that souls are physical objects (see here) and who calls the official subs from Bandai "headcanon" (see here). Don't waste your time Here's what is known about the ending of the anime: Lelouch is truly dead and does not have the code. The old code theory was fully debunked years ago. The community already knows this for years because: - the anime makes it clear that it is impossible for Lelouch to have the code as that would have violated the rules the anime itself established, i.e. everyone who gets the code loses the geass, there are no canon exceptions. Lelouch never lost his geass. - the show staff themselves have been repeating for 10 years that Lelouch is truly dead, sometimes poetically, sometimes very very explicitly. For those interested, you can read the community Code Geass database which has gathered all the official statements (interviews, live commentaries, tweets, the remade epilogue from 2009, the official guide book, etc), all with sources, links and even pictures! It also uses the anime itself to show that it is 100% impossible for Lelouch to have the code. As a small example of the linked database, here is a part of the "Geass Memories" where show staff talked about how they made the anime 10 years ago: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with HIS DEATH." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by HIS DEATH. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." Source Screenshot Translation ------------------- ------------------- (in progress) Out of arguments? then i shall post the argument take-downers one by one Counter argument N.1: Lelouch can't use Geass in the C World argument debunk: he used it in the collective unconsciousness Counter argument N.2: Lelouch did not use his commanding power, he said PLEASE and requested it argument debunk: Lelouch already Said Please once to the teacher who he used his Geass into and/nor does it change the fact that is is a Command and the request part was a response to charles talk nor was it a part of the initial command. counter argument N.3: Geass doesn't work in those who have Code Geass. argument debunk: irrelevant to OP theory counter argument N.4 : death is not necessary. argument debunk: if that was the case, then C.C wouldn't have had to die nor would charles had to die either counter argument N.5: CC didn't die because of that, it was the Nun! argument debunk:duh, the nun killed her, so she can have her own code Geass mark forever last argument: but the writer said that Lelouch end will be death counter argument: the writer is not the director, nor what he says is relevant if not backed up by the material, this is a post structuralism era. https://code-geass.livejournal.com/1178870.html < a True scan of the guidebook https://twitter.com/ichirou_o?lang=en < the twitter of the writer who made a documentary series called Geass memories where he talks about production initials and some other stuff the other person is a troll, don't fall for it, lads!, just check out his Half-quoting / stretching and not willing to even tag!,and the amount of repetitions in those posts!, it's not even a joke evidence: he's not even tagging anymore! -a fate fan. |
PhantomnocomicsNov 18, 2018 3:37 PM
LelouchviBritMER said: To any Code geass fan, just ignore the vandalizing troll who is trying to deceive people by saying things like that code bearers can be geassed (see here), that souls are physical objects (see here) and who calls the official subs from Bandai "headcanon" (see here). Don't waste your time Here's what is known about the ending of the anime: Lelouch is truly dead and does not have the code. The old code theory was fully debunked years ago. The community already knows this for years because: - the anime makes it clear that it is impossible for Lelouch to have the code as that would have violated the rules the anime itself established, i.e. everyone who gets the code loses the geass, there are no canon exceptions. Lelouch never lost his geass. - the show staff themselves have been repeating for 10 years that Lelouch is truly dead, sometimes poetically, sometimes very very explicitly. For those interested, you can read the community Code Geass database which has gathered all the official statements (interviews, live commentaries, tweets, the remade epilogue from 2009, the official guide book, etc), all with sources, links and even pictures! It also uses the anime itself to show that it is 100% impossible for Lelouch to have the code. As a small example of the linked database, here is a part of the "Geass Memories" where show staff talked about how they made the anime 10 years ago: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with HIS DEATH." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by HIS DEATH. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." Source Screenshot Translation ------------------- ------------------- oh, so now you also read japanese as well? What other skills did you suddenly develop? On top of being able to "determin" that Bandai's subs are only headcanon and the theological insight that souls are physical objects? While you mysteriously developed the ability to read Japanese you did not develop the skill to understand English. the director and the writer have reached CONSENSUS, their decision was UNANIMOUS. They speak with one voice. When it comes to Lelouch, the distinction between them is moot. No matter how many times you pretend it's not by sticking your head in the sand. Phantomnocomics said: -Marianne Power transfer her soul alongside her Geass, she transfer her soul to the C world and materialize in it That is not her power. Her power is to inhabit the body of another person, not to materialize in C's World. She materialized in C's World because she (in Anya's body) went to the entrance and entered it. And now you say he does while earlier you said he didn't. Pick a story and stick to it, low effort troll. Anyways, Lelouch did use geass but it failed to affect Charles because Charles was already immune because he already had the code. As said by director Taniguchi himself. パパんにギアス掛けるシーンも、「これギアス掛かってないのに死んだふりするんだよ」「息子を驚かせようと」「ルルーシュくんかわいそう」「これ一番ショックなタイミング計ってるよね」「絶対笑いこらえてるよ」って色々言われてて笑った。 "He isn't geassed, just pretends he dies!" " He tries to surprise his son!" "Poor Lelouch" "He tries to choose the most shocking timing, doesn't he" "I'm sure he tries hard not to laugh" Phantomnocomics said: -marianne agreed to V.V plan and pretended that he didn't kill her to fool charles So Marianne got killed and then pretended that V.V. hadn't killed her? How can someone who is dead pretend that he's not dead? Hilarious. You missed a career as comedian! ''you lied to me again, Big brother'' V.V. never tried to assassinate Lelouch. Charles and V.V. used Lelouch as bait to lure out C.C., that was the whole point of season 2. Phantomnocomics said: if SHE Injured her that fatally, she would have marks of that, but no blood, no mark, and the Nun was laying in the ground with the back of her head bleeding and only that place While you may have a promissing career as comedian you're better off not trying to be a police officer if you think that injuring someone necessarily means you get all covered in blood. Crime fighting would be so much easier if the culprits were always drowned in blood! The nun looked pretty dead to me. Or is being dead not the same as having had a fatal wound to you? Like how the director saying that Lelouch's end was death is not the same as Lelouch being, you know, dead. On top f being a comedian, you could be a gymnast, a mental gymnast. Fansubs aren't the same as the official subs from Bandai There is no set time limit, therefore you can't violate the agreement. Saying "one day I'll give you 1 euro" and not having done it the next day is NOT violating the agreement. Thanks for providing a tranlsation for for the guide book, however it's already part of the database. The database also includes pictures of the relevant sections, the Japanese text is on display and has been translated. The database is the work of the community. but if you preferred the wiki link here it is Phantomnocomics said: The rules have exceptions, Lelouch in fact, made the exception by using his Geass in the collective consciousness in the C world , how is that an exception? you just said yourself that was possible. Quit changing stories, troll. Phantomnocomics said: Marianne is another exception for someone who have used a Geass in a C.C a Code user Still amusing to read that. never thought that after all these years I'd see someone say that people with the code can be geassed. Marianne DID form a contract with C.C.! Where he literally says he and the director agreed to kill off Lelouch. Are you calling the show staff a bunch of liars? My god, you ARE calling Okouchi a liar, because Okouchi DID say director Taneguchi agreed I guess everyone in this world is a liar and you are the only one who knows the truth. Phantomnocomics said: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that the end of Lelouch will be death." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with his death." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by his death. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't choose death. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't die, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." EXACTLY! They agreed that Lelouch was to die at the end to pay for his sins. People who have died are dead, you know. Phantomnocomics said: the show confirms that the obtaining a code from someone who you did not a form a Geass contract with is possible Yes. Kind of an odd argument since I never said it wasn't. The contracts aren't involved in code transfer. That is known. Just as fulfilling your contract isn't necessary to acquire the code because the contract between Charles and V.V. was killing god and that was never done either, and yet Charles got the code anyway. Now you're just digging up irrelevant stuff. Phantomnocomics said: you backed off the Geass cannot work in the C world, Dude, i didn't say anything like that. I said lelouch's geass failed because charles already ahd the code and thus was immune to geass (as shown by both the anime and explciitly confirmed by show staff). I NEVER said it was because they were in C's World, that's just your fantasy again. The whole point is that it failed because Charles was already immune. Comedy gold, coming from a troll who constantly backflips on his story ------------------------ ------------------------ To any Code geass fan, just ignore the vandalizing troll who is trying to deceive people by saying things like that code bearers can be geassed (see here), that souls are physical objects (see here) and who calls the official subs from Bandai "headcanon" (see here). Don't waste your time Here's what is known about the ending of the anime: Lelouch is truly dead and does not have the code. The old code theory was fully debunked years ago. The community already knows this for years because: - the anime makes it clear that it is impossible for Lelouch to have the code as that would have violated the rules the anime itself established, i.e. everyone who gets the code loses the geass, there are no canon exceptions. Lelouch never lost his geass. - the show staff themselves have been repeating for 10 years that Lelouch is truly dead, sometimes poetically, sometimes very very explicitly. For those interested, you can read the community Code Geass database which has gathered all the official statements (interviews, live commentaries, tweets, the remade epilogue from 2009, the official guide book, etc), all with sources, links and even pictures! It also uses the anime itself to show that it is 100% impossible for Lelouch to have the code. As a small example of the linked database, here is a part of the "Geass Memories" where show staff talked about how they made the anime 10 years ago: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with HIS DEATH." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by HIS DEATH. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." Source Screenshot Translation [quote=LelouchviBritMER message=56260012] funny because you tried to post without tagging does this ring any bell? Phantomnocomics said: LelouchviBritMER said: To any Code geass fan, just ignore the vandalizing troll who is trying to deceive people by saying things like that code bearers can be geassed (see here), that souls are physical objects (see here) and who calls the official subs from Bandai "headcanon" (see here). Don't waste your time Here's what is known about the ending of the anime: Lelouch is truly dead and does not have the code. The old code theory was fully debunked years ago. The community already knows this for years because: - the anime makes it clear that it is impossible for Lelouch to have the code as that would have violated the rules the anime itself established, i.e. everyone who gets the code loses the geass, there are no canon exceptions. Lelouch never lost his geass. - the show staff themselves have been repeating for 10 years that Lelouch is truly dead, sometimes poetically, sometimes very very explicitly. For those interested, you can read the community Code Geass database which has gathered all the official statements (interviews, live commentaries, tweets, the remade epilogue from 2009, the official guide book, etc), all with sources, links and even pictures! It also uses the anime itself to show that it is 100% impossible for Lelouch to have the code. As a small example of the linked database, here is a part of the "Geass Memories" where show staff talked about how they made the anime 10 years ago: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with HIS DEATH." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by HIS DEATH. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." Source Screenshot Translation ------------------- ------------------- (in progress) Out of arguments? then i shall post the argument take-downers one by one Counter argument N.1: Lelouch can't use Geass in the C World argument debunk: he used it in the collective unconsciousness Counter argument N.2: Lelouch did not use his commanding power, he said PLEASE and requested it argument debunk: Lelouch already Said Please once to the teacher who he used his Geass into and/nor does it change the fact that is is a Command and the request part was a response to charles talk nor was it a part of the initial command. counter argument N.3: Geass doesn't work in those who have Code Geass. argument debunk: irrelevant to OP theory counter argument N.4 : death is not necessary. argument debunk: if that was the case, then C.C wouldn't have had to die nor would charles had to die either counter argument N.5: CC didn't die because of that, it was the Nun! argument debunk:duh, the nun killed her, so she can have her own code Geass mark forever last argument: but the writer said that Lelouch end will be death counter argument: the writer is not the director, nor what he says is relevant if not backed up by the material, this is a post structuralism era. https://code-geass.livejournal.com/1178870.html < a True scan of the guidebook https://twitter.com/ichirou_o?lang=en < the twitter of the writer who made a documentary series called Geass memories where he talks about production initials and some other stuff the other person is a troll, don't fall for it, lads!, just check out his Half-quoting / stretching and not willing to even tag!,and the amount of repetitions in those posts!, it's not even a joke evidence: he's not even tagging anymore! -a fate fan. i'm not gonna say things like: too bad you didn't listen to my advice or too bad you deleted it late but don't do stuff like that i will keep it as it should No, Anya was outside of the C world when Marianne was in IT ------- No, she transfer her souls to others, that's her power, and the only time she materialize is in the C world and the world of memories ------- as far as i'm concerned, Not once did i say lelouch Geass doesn't work in the collective unconsciousness, in fact, here is my first post about it ''although it did work in the collective un-consiciousness'' it happens ------- Yes, V.V killed her and she pretended that didn't happen to fool charless she's also a soul welcome to anime, a place where people die yet are alive ------- "Big brother is it true that you were the one who sent an assassin after Lelouch?" "Yes, and thanks to that I've been the victim to his assassins, but I've also learnt something, that Lelouch is Zero, that he even tricked Nunnally." "You lied to me once again big brother... nope ------- Your equivalent is false, there wasn't any tool, and the spots were changed, and the victim was bleeding fatally in her front with no marks of blood leaving that spot ------ that's right, C.C is the one who marainne formed a contract with. it's just a typo i missed while editing, lad. but be my guest and try to exploit it for your ad hominem arguments, lad of geass ----- there are more than one official sub and the response is = fansubs are not like official bandai subs. so only bandai make official subs,now and focus, the center of the discussion is the dub? ----- he didn't say agreed, he say he confirmed with the director a thing. Big difference ---- the only requirement to get a code is to have two geass ----- if the C World disable Geass power, Marianne and Lelouch wouldn't have had worked. OP theory explains how Lelouch used Geass in charles. ---- you say and try to call me a troll even though you are the one who is misquoting and tries to post with no tag and don't be silly >respond without tagging, half-quote to stretch points, misquote stuff. learn what troll means, lad. i might not be serious all the time but neither am i a troll for that the twitter of the screenwriter is : https://twitter.com/ichirou_o?lang=en the true scan of the guidebook is as well : https://code-geass.livejournal.com/1178870.html and a sub reddit page users are not a community lad. i understand your passion for the way you think but don't be ridiculous. |
PhantomnocomicsNov 18, 2018 4:30 PM
LelouchviBritMER said: To any Code geass fan, just ignore the vandalizing troll who is trying to deceive people by saying things like that code bearers can be geassed (see here), that souls are physical objects (see here) and who calls the official subs from Bandai "headcanon" (see here). Don't waste your time Here's what is known about the ending of the anime: Lelouch is truly dead and does not have the code. The old code theory was fully debunked years ago. The community already knows this for years because: - the anime makes it clear that it is impossible for Lelouch to have the code as that would have violated the rules the anime itself established, i.e. everyone who gets the code loses the geass, there are no canon exceptions. Lelouch never lost his geass. - the show staff themselves have been repeating for 10 years that Lelouch is truly dead, sometimes poetically, sometimes very very explicitly. For those interested, you can read the community Code Geass database which has gathered all the official statements (interviews, live commentaries, tweets, the remade epilogue from 2009, the official guide book, etc), all with sources, links and even pictures! It also uses the anime itself to show that it is 100% impossible for Lelouch to have the code. As a small example of the linked database, here is a part of the "Geass Memories" where show staff talked about how they made the anime 10 years ago: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with HIS DEATH." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by HIS DEATH. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." Source Screenshot Translation ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------------ As it says, it was in progress Waht's your problem with that? Phantomnocomics said: Counter argument N.1: Lelouch can't use Geass in the C World argument debunk: he used it in the collective unconsciousness lolwut? Dude, i never said that and have already told you I never said that This is exactly why you are a troll, you spout nothing but lies. You were initially the one who said Lelouch couldn't use his geass in there and then did some backflips. What i said was that Lelouch tried to use his geass but it failed because Charles was already immune, not because he was in C's World. So stop spouting your lies, troll. The geass failed because Charles already had the code. This was shown by the anime itself and explicitly confirmed during a live commentary with writer Okouchi and producer Taniguchi: パパんにギアス掛けるシーンも、「これギアス掛かってないのに死んだふりするんだよ」「息子を驚かせようと」「ルルーシュくんかわいそう」「これ一番ショックなタイミング計ってるよね」「絶対笑いこらえてるよ」って色々言われてて笑った。 "He isn't geassed, just pretends he dies!" " He tries to surprise his son!" "Poor Lelouch" "He tries to choose the most shocking timing, doesn't he" "I'm sure he tries hard not to laugh" Phantomnocomics said: Counter argument N.2: Lelouch did not use his commanding power, he said PLEASE and requested it i told you he himself explicitly said he didn't intend to "deafeat god" but wanted to make a request. that's what his dialogue said. But then you called the official subs from Bandai "headcanon" Phantomnocomics said: counter argument N.3: Geass doesn't work in those who have Code Geass. argument debunk: irrelevant to OP theory EXTREEEEMELY relevant! How many times do i need to explain this? Lelouch's geass on his father failed, we see this because there were no red eyes or blue brain scenes, and it was explicitly confirmed by the director (see above). What this means is that Charles already had his code and immortality before he shot himself, which means that codes do NOT require activation like the debunked code theory erroneously claims. Phantomnocomics said: counter argument N.4 : death is not necessary. argument debunk: if that was the case, then C.C wouldn't have had to die nor would charles had to die either God, dude. how many times do i have to type the same stuff? See points 1 and 3 Charles didn't die. This completely scuttles your entire argument. Phantomnocomics said: counter argument N.5: CC didn't die because of that, it was the Nun! argument debunk:duh, the nun killed her, so she can have her own code Geass mark forever You try to use already debunked arguments (see points 1, 3 and 4) over and over again. C.C. didn't have to die to get the code because Charles also got his code without dying, as per words from the director himself, and as per anime itself. Phantomnocomics said: last argument: but the writer said that Lelouch end will be death counter argument: the writer is not the director, nor what he says is relevant if not backed up by the material, this is a post structuralism era. I have said this a million times before! This was shown in Continue Vol.42 Continue: Was there a dispute among the staff members regarding the ending? Okouchi: No. It was decided fairly naturally. During the "Code Geass" script meetings, there are many cases in which there were a number of disputes, but there were barely any when it came to the scripts for (the previous series's) episode 25 and the final episode. I think everyone felt the same when it came to the end of the character that is Lelouch. This is further expanded on in the "Geass Memories" series: - "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." Source Screenshot Translation The writer and the director both agreed to the same thing, the decision to kill Lelouch was made UNANIMOUSLY, it was a CONSENSUS. Since both peple are in agreement, one can speak for the other, so in the context of the death of Lelouch, the distinction between writer and director is moot. I've told you this like 5-6 times already and you keep ignoring my words. Phantomnocomics said: https://code-geass.livejournal.com/1178870.html < a True scan of the guidebook yes and it is in full agreement with the Code geass community database Idem Dude, you're mixing everything up! You said marianne used geass on C.C. i said taht's not true because her geas sis to inhabit other people's bodies and control it, and during the "alledged geassing" marianne's soul was still in Anya and not controlling C.C. And now, in your defense, you mention something which happens way way later. This just shiws again that you are a troll. You are saying that someone who got murdered is going around pretending that she isn't dead ... Do i really need to comment on that? In Anya's body. Are you saying that Anya-marianne was pretending that Marianne didn't get killed? What sense does that make? Reddit isn't a community?? God, don't tell them that lol ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------------ To any Code geass fan, just ignore the vandalizing troll who is trying to deceive people by saying things like that code bearers can be geassed (see here), that souls are physical objects (see here) and who calls the official subs from Bandai "headcanon" (see here). Don't waste your time Here's what is known about the ending of the anime: Lelouch is truly dead and does not have the code. The old code theory was fully debunked years ago. The community already knows this for years because: - the anime makes it clear that it is impossible for Lelouch to have the code as that would have violated the rules the anime itself established, i.e. everyone who gets the code loses the geass, there are no canon exceptions. Lelouch never lost his geass. - the show staff themselves have been repeating for 10 years that Lelouch is truly dead, sometimes poetically, sometimes very very explicitly. For those interested, you can read the community Code Geass database which has gathered all the official statements (interviews, live commentaries, tweets, the remade epilogue from 2009, the official guide book, etc), all with sources, links and even pictures! It also uses the anime itself to show that it is 100% impossible for Lelouch to have the code. As a small example of the linked database, here is a part of the "Geass Memories" where show staff talked about how they made the anime 10 years ago: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with HIS DEATH." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by HIS DEATH. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." Source Screenshot Translation are you seriously gonna pretend that you didn't try that post without tagging me?. but if said it was an in progress as an excuse then sure i suppose since i don't want things to go off-topic ------- since we both agree that Geass works in the C world, let's go to the other aguments ----------- reason it is irrelevant is because for starter the OP theory is about those who have not yet activated their code, so comparing someone who did with someone who did not in said context is a false equivalence ''in said context'' but if you think otherwise, then here it is again Marianne Used her Geass in C.C who had her Code sealed at the time to enter the world of memories one could interpret that she only managed such a feat because of C.C code being sealed but it being sealed is as good as being inactivated ------------- characters die yet stay alive, it's not a shock, come on, it's Code Geass and i never said they have to die to get the code, i said to get it forever, as in, to activate it don't play dumb to it, you know what i meant. ------------ my response: Marianne Power transfer her soul alongside her Geass, she transfer her soul to the C world and materialize in it ---- Lelouchvibritmer response: That is not her power. Her power is to inhabit the body of another person, not to materialize in C's World. She materialized in C's World because she (in Anya's body) went to the entrance and entered it. ---- my Response: No, Anya was outside of the C world when Marianne was in IT ---- lelouchvibritmer response: Dude, you're mixing everything up! You said marianne used geass on C.C. i said taht's not true because her geas sis to inhabit other people's bodies and control it, and during the "alledged geassing" marianne's soul was still in Anya and not controlling C.C. And now, in your defense, you mention something which happens way way later. This just shiws again that you are a troll. ---- Me?, a troll? ...no, you would be better off as one than me for being so salty about discussing --------------- he didn't say agreed, he say he confirmed with the director a thing. Big difference the thing is the show ending being like that the other says the staff ''un-named who specifically'' decided upon that ending, above is still valid. -------------- using those statements is the equivalent of saying lelouch was killed Your equivalent is false, there wasn't any tool, so things would had to have happened manually, and the character spots were changed from the two scenes with the latter having C.C fatally bleeding in her front without the blood leaving that spot or was there a blood mark or trace in the nun who was in the other spot lying in her back with her hand crossed and her head back bleeding which would totally have to happen before she dies. you say you debunked me yet what is written above says otherwise ------- initially my response: -marianne agreed to V.V plan and pretended that he didn't kill her to fool charles at first. and while charles realized this later on by making the implication ''you lied to me again, Big brother'' when V.V tried to assassinate lelouch ---- lelouchvitbritmer response: So Marianne got killed and then pretended that V.V. hadn't killed her? How can someone who is dead pretend that he's not dead? Hilarious. V.V. never tried to assassinate Lelouch. Charles and V.V. used Lelouch as bait to lure out C.C., that was the whole point of season 2. --- my response:"Big brother is it true that you were the one who sent an assassin after Lelouch?" "Yes, and thanks to that I've been the victim to his assassins, but I've also learnt something, that Lelouch is Zero, that he even tricked Nunnally." "You lied to me once again big brother... and again, Nope and Yes if you can counter it, with scans that is as for your question, No, never once did i say marianne went pretending that she didn't die as ayna read what is above ---- -a Sub Reddit page users =/= reddit. and i'm than willing to say it ---- thing is lad, the theory works if you think about it this way now that i'm thinking about it, C.C could have totally passed down her code to Mao and granted herself her wish what a plot hole, i guess she was more concerned about what he might do with his immortality than her own wish |
LelouchviBritMER said: To any Code geass fan, just ignore the vandalizing troll who is trying to deceive people by saying things like that code bearers can be geassed (see here), that souls are physical objects (see here) and who calls the official subs from Bandai "headcanon" (see here). He even admits to not having watched all of Code Geass because he thought it was fake deep (see here). Don't waste your time with that troll. Here's what is known about the ending of the anime: Lelouch is truly dead and does not have the code. The old code theory was fully debunked years ago. The community already knows this for years because: - the anime makes it clear that it is impossible for Lelouch to have the code as that would have violated the rules the anime itself established, i.e. everyone who gets the code loses the geass, there are no canon exceptions. Lelouch never lost his geass. - the show staff themselves have been repeating for 10 years that Lelouch is truly dead, sometimes poetically, sometimes very very explicitly. For those interested, you can read the Code Geass community database which has gathered all the official statements (interviews, live commentaries, tweets, the remade epilogue from 2009, the official guide book, etc), all with sources, links and even pictures! It also uses the anime itself to show that it is 100% impossible for Lelouch to have the code. As a small example of the linked database, here is a part of the "Geass Memories" where show staff talked about how they made the anime 10 years ago: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with HIS DEATH." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by HIS DEATH. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." Source Screenshot Translation ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------------ Phantomnocomics said: are you seriously gonna pretend that you didn't try that post without tagging me? Tagging? What is tagging? I am quoting your words for context, if that's what you mean. Phantomnocomics said: reason it is irrelevant is because for starter the OP theory is about those who have not yet activated their code, so comparing someone who did with someone who did not in said context is a false equivalence ''in said context'' It is relevant when the conclusion is that inactive codes do not exist, codes do not need activating. I'll run you through the reasoning again, so you can see how it reached that conclusion and why it IS relevant. Lelouch tried to geass Charles by failed. We know this because the anime showed us (no red eyes, no blue brain stuff). We also know this because the director has said so in a live commentary with the writer パパんにギアス掛けるシーンも、「これギアス掛かってないのに死んだふりするんだよ」「息子を驚かせようと」「ルルーシュくんかわいそう」「これ一番ショックなタイミング計ってるよね」「絶対笑いこらえてるよ」って色々言われてて笑った。 "He isn't geassed, just pretends he dies!" " He tries to surprise his son!" "Poor Lelouch" "He tries to choose the most shocking timing, doesn't he" "I'm sure he tries hard not to laugh" It is 100% certain that Charles was immune to geass before he shot himself and did not die when he was shot. That means he already had a code and was already immortal, before he shot himself That means that his code was already "active" before he "died". That means that codes do NOT require activation. That, combined with the fact that everyone loses their geass when they get the code, as the anime made very clear because we see it apply to everyone (no exceptions!), and Lelouch who never lost his geass, means A FORTIORI that Lelouch can NOt have the code. it's simply impossible, the anime forbids it. I told you, Marianne did not geass C.C. People with the code are immune to geass, this was said explicitly by the anime. Several times! Marianne's geass allows her soul to enter someone else's body and control it. Marianne was not controlling C.C., and Marianne was still inside Anya. Phantomnocomics said: one could interpret that she only managed such a feat because of C.C code being sealed but it being sealed is as good as being inactivated No we can't, because even if marianne somehow managed to geass C.C., then Marianne would have been inside C.C., and yet we see her still inside Anya. Phantomnocomics said: and i never said they have to die to get the code, i said to get it forever, as in, to activate it Codes do not need to be activated. Charles' case makes that abundantly clear. See above for that reasoning. I don't always do because you say weird things like people with codes getting geassed and souls being physical objects. With such weird things, i don't know what other weird stuff to expect from you. Also, your English is sometimes a bit wonky, but I can't complain about that because it's not my first language either. Phantomnocomics said: my response: Marianne Power transfer her soul alongside her Geass, she transfer her soul to the C world and materialize in it That's not how Marianne's geass works. She can send her soul into someone's mind, nothing else is said. Here are her own words: My Geass power was to cross over into another person’s mind She doesn't say anything about traveling to C's World because of her power, she talks about entering someone's mind. What she did with C.C. was just the telepathic link between her and C.C.; like we've seen since season 1. And no, I don't know how that link works, it may be a C.C. thing, i don't know because the anime never bothered to give any kind of explanation. but it's NOT her geass, because that was explained, and being a soul parasite is very different from telepathic communications. Phantomnocomics said: Lelouchvibritmer response: That is not her power. Her power is to inhabit the body of another person, not to materialize in C's World. She materialized in C's World because she (in Anya's body) went to the entrance and entered it. my Response: No, Anya was outside of the C world when Marianne was in IT of course Anya was outside. We see it all happening. This is the order of events: Marianne is inside Anya and goes to the entrance. Marianne-Anya lays her hand on the entrance and on C.C. and then we see Marianne's soul, with the help of C.C. leave Anya. Anya's body falls down. Marianne is inside C's World. Marianne can not go in on her own, she says "C.C., could you please?"! Phantomnocomics said: Me?, a troll? ...no, you would be better off as one than me for being so salty about discussing I'm just making sure your trolling doesn't confuse any of the newer viewers. You make a lot of erroneous claims, things which are known to be wrong. Completely ignore what is being said by me, like how the distinction between writer and director doesn't matter when it comes to the death of Lelouch because both people are in agreement on that. You put words in my mouth which i never said. You say really weird stuff like that the Bandai official subs are "headcanon", which just shows taht you cannot be taken seriously or want to have a serious conversation. that just showed to me ou are a troll. Nobody who isn't a troll would be attacking the official Bandai subs as "headcanon". Phantomnocomics said: he didn't say agreed, he say he confirmed with the director a thing. Big difference the thing is the show ending being like that First of all, confirming with the director means he agreed. if the director hadn't agreed, he would have made the writer write something else, and corrected the misinterpretation of the writer. And that's not what happens. So your semantic juggle doesn't work here. Secondly, we do know he agreed because in the Continue interview they explicitly said that everyone who was present at the meeting agreed on killing off Lelouch. Phantomnocomics said: the other says the staff ''un-named who specifically'' decided upon that ending, above is still valid. Un-named staff? What are you talking about? Phantomnocomics said: initially my response: -marianne agreed to V.V plan and pretended that he didn't kill her to fool charles at first. This is one of those really weird things you say. How can a murdered corpse pretend not to have been murdered? If you mean her soul, in Anya, that doesn't change anything because the corpse is still there. And why would Marianne who has always been 100% on Charles' side want to fool Charles? It makes no sense. Phantomnocomics said: "Big brother is it true that you were the one who sent an assassin after Lelouch?" "Yes, and thanks to that I've been the victim to his assassins, but I've also learnt something, that Lelouch is Zero, that he even tricked Nunnally." Right, my goof here. I will admit that that one line had escaped me. V.V. did say once he sent an assassin to lelouch. I was thinking about the time between season 1 and 2, which was why i said they used Lelouch as bait. oops. mea culpa But how is this in any way relevant to Lelouch having/not having a code? That was created by the community there. There's even credits for pictures of magazines and stuff, it was a joint effort. Phantomnocomics said: now that i'm thinking about it, C.C could have totally passed down her code to Mao and granted herself her wish what a plot hole, i guess she was more concerned about what he might do with his immortality than her own wish Yes she could have, but she didn't want to use the same trick as the nun. She knew Mao, who had double eyes, was in love with her and thus would never accept her code because that would make her mortal and indirectly cause her death. her only option was to trick him like the nun did to her but she didn't because she was getting emotionally attached to him. That's why she said to herself about Lelouch that she mustn't make the same mistake again. But this she meant that she didn't want to allow herself to get emotionally attached to lelouch. in the end she left mao because, as she says, "If you have someone you don’t want to lose, you should keep them at a distance." But probably the nun's trick wouldn't even have worked on mao. If C.C. had stabbed mao, mao would probably rather die than make his beloved C.C. mortal. So C.C. could have tried it, but it would have failed. ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------------ To any Code geass fan, just ignore the vandalizing troll who is trying to deceive people by saying things like that code bearers can be geassed (see here), that souls are physical objects (see here) and who calls the official subs from Bandai "headcanon" (see here). He even admits to not having watched all of Code Geass because he thought it was fake deep (see here). Don't waste your time with that troll. Here's what is known about the ending of the anime: Lelouch is truly dead and does not have the code. The old code theory was fully debunked years ago. The community already knows this for years because: - the anime makes it clear that it is impossible for Lelouch to have the code as that would have violated the rules the anime itself established, i.e. everyone who gets the code loses the geass, there are no canon exceptions. Lelouch never lost his geass. - the show staff themselves have been repeating for 10 years that Lelouch is truly dead, sometimes poetically, sometimes very very explicitly. For those interested, you can read the Code Geass community database which has gathered all the official statements (interviews, live commentaries, tweets, the remade epilogue from 2009, the official guide book, etc), all with sources, links and even pictures! It also uses the anime itself to show that it is 100% impossible for Lelouch to have the code. As a small example of the linked database, here is a part of the "Geass Memories" where show staff talked about how they made the anime 10 years ago: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with HIS DEATH." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by HIS DEATH. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." Source Screenshot Translation lad, i can't even understand why you keep bringing up the ''confirmed end will be death initial'', it's the equivalent of saying the show ended with lelouch death i get it, the show ended and lelouch was killed therefore, his end was death ------------ the Geass rejection did not have to Mao, you might argue that it is only exclusive to lelouch because of the nature of his geass, but it would still make no sense nor did that happen to marianne but that is an anomaly by itself ---------- Yes, the staff does say that charles was never influenced by the geass < this, could have ended this thread since page 1 but, what we are discussing is whether the material supports this or not --------- No, she wasn't Anya, the only she was seen inside Anya is when she got out of C.C, so said interpretation can still wrok --------- lad, the only thing different from what i said and what you said is this : ''mine: she transfers her soul alongside her geass/and yours: to someone else mind i already said this before, i just shortened it in a sense but you missed my point, if you truely that fixated about the rules, you should understand it is impossible for her to do such a feat without that place being with her Geass parameter ------------ there is a light novel explanation, BUT, using an adaptation would not be OK in this context ------------ it was never confirmed whether the so called telepathic link and her soul materialization in the world of memories is the same though, so it's an unclear state ------------- Anya was awake when Marianne was INSIDE the C world active/materialized ------------- as for how charles/marianne/V.V confusing love plot, it was just to point out that characters can be wrong statement wise and not always be right ------------ not once did i say that the bandai subs are headcanon, you are confused lad or this is one of those attempts when someone try to win an argument by: but it's a troll! in an other note: did you even read what i said? i said that there is more than one official subs, and that it shouldn't matter since the center of the discussion is the dub and that i should have used it instead? in fact, here is the quotes: my response: there are more than one official sub ---- lelouchbritvibritmer: Fansubs aren't the same as the official subs from Bandai ---- my response: so only bandai make official subs,now and focus, the center of the discussion is the dub? ---- and i already said way ago that the dub is the center of the discussion and since it says it,that's it for all we know, sure, they confirmed the initial, but the agreement at how it might have happened is not necessarily true. and like i said, it's a wasted effort to discuss this since it's the equivalent of: here is how the show ended. i know, LELOUCH get stabbed and supposedly died < this is what the discussion is about ------------------ and by ''un-named staff'' = no staff is important other than the director/writer you might try to make a context for why C.C didn't want to grant her WISH neither from charles or Mao but it would still make no sense, or in C.C words: i don't know it's a plot-hole -------------- sure, i understand the passion for making a database, but if you are gonna do it, then do it properly and make a site for it but baby steps i suppose, and plus, i hear code geass don't have an official/fan DB site yet? ------------ and double posts you say?, i would appreaciate if you would stop calling me a troll, if you bothered to think a second then you would know if a was a troll?, i wouldn't be here discussing to the end . we are near the end of the discussion, lad of Geass |
| what a lad!, i sure triggered some lad of geass off-topic: this is hilarious, you should read what ad hominem fallacy is, anyone with HALF a brain knows anyone who committed such fallacy is not trust-worthy. you made a post about separate directed at killing the discussion and redirecting it to somewhere else where people will be biased to you since that's the point without even quoting/tagging me? may i need to remind you that you were exposed? may i need to remind you how many points you mentioned that i have countered and i keep countering/you keep repeating it with new angles each time? :*lelouch requested* < hilarious not once did you debunk a point i mentioned, only half/mis-quoting, stretching, and fallacies ---- in-topic: confirmed that lelouch end will be death =/= lelouch is dead ---- his end was death =/= lelouch is dead < posts more than once that lelouch end will be death = gets called as denying it you ok there, lad?, do you even read by this point? ----------- the geass code rejection scenes did not happen to mao or marianne, or to lelouch for that matter when he tried to use geass in charles, you might try to say: it's exlusive to C.C/lelouch but it will still make no sense. those scenes are mental images and only happened once, lad. and i'm amazed, lad?, you mean to tell me that the geass sound effect stops when it reach someone eye? what a shock ''you're trying to get into any ground you can by now'' this already happened to others, and there were already scenes where the blue nerves scenes did not happen --------- i'm not shocked that you lost track of which point is which since i don't use the quoting because it will only make it unnecessary longer it is than it is already but also confusing for you if you make your response way long than it should. *hilarious* and hilarious, did you even read what i wrote?, i wrote that i didn't even watch all of it and was aware of that since the show is fake deep and pseudo smart, does it trigger you, lad? read up what Textomy fallacy is, lad. beside, anyone with half a brain will know fallacy user = bad ---- are you sure we are talking about the same charles from the same show who because of his over trusting caused the death of his wife, and almost, his children who were a fundamental core to his plan ---- i don't know what you meant by this but the telepathic link is not necessarily when anya Geass her soul into C.C world of memories, a feat only seen when C.C had her code sealed ----- The Marianne Feat that she did was the equivalent to that of the world of memories the world of memories is a World inside the mind of C.C. her powers only allow her to transfer her soul into the mind of others therefore, the World of C has to fit her parameter, being a Mind for her and a physical others for others, therefore, she did materialize in a physical place in a technical level ---------- confirmed that the initial, it being the end of lelouch will be death does not translate/or is necessarily the equivalent of how it might happen and never once did they say: *lelouch is dead* never once in the tv anime or the guidebooks you ok there lad? ------------------------- my initial response: ''she can only transfer her soul into other PERSONS'' in the prior posts'' lelouchvibritmer response: lad, the only thing different from what i said and what you said is this : ''mine: she transfers her soul alongside her geass/and yours: to someone else mind No, the difference is that you say Marianne geassed C.C. while i say she can't do that and that the anime doesn't support your interprettaion. the interpretation is a different case about the code sealing being an equivalent of the code inactivated < which makes sense marianne using her Geass in C.C is a different case, which she totally did and you contradicted yourself lad, that wasn't the telepathic ability she spoke of since it was her geass and she was in the world of memories where her geass is seen active ----------------------- No, i can use it as a *feat > statement* since charles was wrong ''because of .....''' does not matter, since you agreed that characters can be wrong about their statements if so, therefore, you can't dismiss that he can be wrong about the codes ------------------------ and the blue nerves scenes does not happen always, lelouch par example did not have a blue nerve scene when he used the geass in the soliders once he regained his memories, so it's not an all-case, it's a case-by-case basis ------------------------ and for the actual sky, you are still convinced that it wasn't his Geass power? charles: fool, lelouch, god cannot be defeated by the power of the king lelouch: i do not intent to defeat god, this is a request, Yes, now i know who i really am, God!, collective unconsciousness, do not stop the march of time. < the command of geass your argument is hilarious C.C is was still liying about her wanting to die BTW < plot hole she could have done that twice either by charles or mao, the thing is ------------------- off-topic and your question was already answered but *O no, i missed that* happens, i'm here to discuss the canon of the stuff i watch, i did like Akito the exiled though, a much better show imo but lelouch waterphillia made it somehow obnoxious and DB = database myanimelist is a database <, kanzenshuu is a database ''to dragon ball''. >a sub reddit page where someone quotes some links is not, don't get triggered by it, i'm just stating the truth a person is better off checking out the twitter of the writer where half of the quotes come from and directly to some site where the guidebook is fully posted there -fate is best series in the worlds |
PhantomnocomicsNov 19, 2018 1:29 PM
| [quote=LelouchviBritMER message=56266610]To any Code geass fan, just ignore the vandalizing troll who is trying to deceive people by saying things like that code bearers can be geassed (see here), that souls are physical objects (see here) and who calls the official subs from Bandai "headcanon" (see here). He even admits to not having watched all of Code Geass because he thought it was fake deep (see here). Don't waste your time with that troll. Here's what is known about the ending of the anime: Lelouch is truly dead and does not have the code. The old code theory was fully debunked years ago. The community already knows this for years because: - the anime makes it clear that it is impossible for Lelouch to have the code as that would have violated the rules the anime itself established, i.e. everyone who gets the code loses the geass, there are no canon exceptions. Lelouch never lost his geass. - the show staff themselves have been repeating for 10 years that Lelouch is truly dead, sometimes poetically, sometimes very very explicitly. For those interested, you can read the Code Geass community database which has gathered all the official statements (interviews, live commentaries, tweets, the remade epilogue from 2009, the official guide book, etc), all with sources, links and even pictures! It also uses the anime itself to show that it is 100% impossible for Lelouch to have the code. As a small example of the linked database, here is a part of the "Geass Memories" where show staff talked about how they made the anime 10 years ago: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with HIS DEATH." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by HIS DEATH. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." Source Screenshot Translation ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------------ Phantomnocomics said: you made a post about separate directed at killing the discussion and redirecting it to somewhere else where people will be biased to you since that's the point without even quoting/tagging me? What are you on about? I'm the one who is constantly providing context through quotes. You never quote appropriately use the quote system. LelouchviBritMER said: What are you on about? I'm the one who is constantly providing context through quotes. You never quote appropriately use the quote system is this what you meant by: work in prgoress?, because, i thought you were trying to spam a troll alert silently?. just try post the response at once, this can be misunderstood like that LelouchviBritMER said: None calling official Bandai subs "headcanon" is not countering someone. Constantly and erroneously making moot points is not countering. Making wild claims which are directly contradicted by the anime, such as marianne geassing C.C., is not countering didn't i already prove you were wrong about this? why do you keep bringing it up every two post? | a part of the previous post: not once did i say that the bandai subs are headcanon, you are confused lad or this is one of those attempts when someone try to win an argument by: but it's a troll! in an other note: did you even read what i said? i said that there is more than one official subs, and that it shouldn't matter since the center of the discussion is the dub and that i should have used it instead? in fact, here is the quotes: my response: there are more than one official sub ---- lelouchbritvibritmer: Fansubs aren't the same as the official subs from Bandai ---- my response: so only bandai make official subs,now and focus, the center of the discussion is the dub? ---- and i already said way ago that the dub is the center of the discussion and since it says it,that's it |. nice strawman and mixing up points to cause confusion ''which is a fallacy'', won't help you LelouchviBritMER said: using your definition of countering, i.e. spouting inconsistent nosnense, i didn't indeed. but by the normal definiton of using the anime and everything we know, i most definitely did counter you. Marianne never geassed C.C. Charles was already immune to geass before he shot himself. The show makes it impossible Lelouch to have a code. The director himself has stated that Lelouch is dead. this should not even be discuss-able, what is it that says otherwise? her Geass is seen active and we hear the Geass sound effect/her powers is to transfer her soul which she does to the world of memories when C.C had her code sealed hence why she had to look at her eyes No, it doesn't as of now, i have proved that Geass works in a sealed code, which can be equaled to that of an inactivated one No such statement exist. and No, Countering is not = Not she did not or no, it is impossible. Countering would be the debunk of a claim using the material of reference < as of now, you did none. outside statements are not a valid material and no, No such a statement exist ''last line'' read what the def of minsinterpreting is:misinterpretation /mɪsɪntəːprɪˈteɪʃ(ə)n/Submit noun the action of interpreting something wrongly. read what the def of interpreting is:interpretation /ɪntəːprɪˈteɪʃ(ə)n/Submit noun the action of explaining the meaning of something. your Logic: screenwriter= director which is wrong, the screenwriter write the script for the film under the supervision of the director. just because some screenwriter confirmed that the ending will have death for lelouch with the director does not mean that the screenwriter magically becomes the director >this has been said multiple times, but please, feel free to repeat this point again LelouchviBritMER said: Nonsense like this is what identifies you as a troll. You're not looking for a proper discussion, you're just trying to spread disinformation and confuse people. or trigger people as you said yourself. "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." Lelouch chose death in the last episode. saying that choosing death is not the same as actually dying, while you set up a plan to get a sword ran through yo, is beyond silly. Choosing death does not translate to: character stat: dead. it's logical those are just production initials that are only used to mislead people who are interested, the production initials are in fact, point less since they are only spoilers for the show and you admitted it, you are triggered from discussing this that you called me a troll and misinterpreted/misquote what i say in a fallacious way LelouchviBritMER said: what is a "geass code rejection scene"? What is a "geass code"? There's geass, and there's code, there's no geass code. let me rephrase it this way for you then: Blue nerve scenes are a case by case basis Phantomnocomics said: or to lelouch for that matter when he tried to use geass in charles, you might try to say: it's exlusive to C.C/lelouch but it will still make no sense. those scenes are mental images and only happened once, lad. LelouchviBritMER said: Seriously, what are you on about? More than half of the stuff you write is so damn hard to read. It's like you're in a monologue with yourself, referring to stuff that wasn't written byanyone. Exclusive to C.C./Lelouch? What is? Why would it be? How does any of this relate to anything I have said? let me say it again then: blue nerves are not an all-case and are a case by case basis Phantomnocomics said: i'm not shocked that you lost track of which point is which since i don't use the quoting because it will only make it unnecessary longer LelouchviBritMER said: It makes the text more understandable. Half the time you seem to be talking about completely different topics. fine, i'm using it, typical i hate this kind of ''way of talk'' but since you caught my interest, then why not Phantomnocomics said: i wrote that i didn't even watch all of it and was aware of that since the show is fake deep and pseudo smart, does it trigger you, lad? LelouchviBritMER said: It doesn't trigger me in the slightest. But it does demonstrate that you lack information about the show because you didn't even watch all of it. And yet, despite having only seen pieces, you are here claiming that you know better than anyone, saying things like that people with the code can be geassed, or that a dead marianne fooled Charles about her own death. You not having seen the entire show clarifies why you make such outlandish statements It provides the perfect context to understand the misinterpretations you have about the show. yet you lack the important question: how much did i not watch?. and the answer is: 2. i'm pretty sure two boring episodes from the first season are not that important, but if it will rejoice you, i just recently watched them, and let me say, they are still boring but the dub makes it nice Phantomnocomics said: the world of memories is a World inside the mind of C.C. her powers only allow her to transfer her soul into the mind of others LelouchviBritMER said: False again. Lelouch also saw her past, her memories, when he was in C's World. She even confirms that by saying "These are my memories. You can't interfere." If that was because the world of memories is inside C.C.'s mind and you get there by soul transfer as you say, then Lelouch must have had Marianne's geass to get there. And that is not true. Therefore, your assumptions is incorrect. No, It was C.C who sent him there, he tried to interfere with her fall, but couldn't, that's where she informs him that those were just memories nice try to twist stuff Phantomnocomics said: the World of C has to fit her parameter parameter /pəˈramɪtə/Submit noun 1. TECHNICAL a numerical or other measurable factor forming one of a set that defines a system or sets the conditions of its operation. new word?, understandable! Phantomnocomics said: confirmed that the initial, it being the end of lelouch will be death does not translate/or is necessarily the equivalent of how it might happen LelouchviBritMER said: Not HOW it will happen, but THAT it will happen. And we do see it happen: sword through the gut. Since the anime was crystal clear that it is impossible for Lelouch to have the code because that would have violated the rules the anime itself established, this is death. yeah sure, it's not like characters cheat death through geass powers. and that's not a rule the show etsablished, nor is it a rule def of rule: rule /ruːl/Submit noun 1. one of a set of explicit or understood regulations or principles governing conduct or procedure within a particular area of activity. know what words mean before using them, an initial. Not a rule. an initial equal to show's ending and like stated before, characters ending being death does not translate to them being dead Phantomnocomics said: and never once did they say: *lelouch is dead* never once in the tv anime or the guidebooks LelouchviBritMER said: Dude, stop lying! The guide book even calls Lelouch a corpse! "Until right before her brother dies, she seems to want to hate him for that. Upon realizing the truth behind her brother's actions, Nunnally clings to her brother's corpse and wails." And when they explain the Zero requiem: "For those two who bear the heavy sin known as killing their fathers, they share the belief that they can forgive each other by imposing the greatest punishments on themselves. Death for Lelouch who wishes for a tomorrow with his sister, life for Suzaku who wishes to atone for his sins through death." "There are probably a lot of people who think of it as a Bad End, a tragedy, considering the protagonist's, Lelouch's end as well." "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." the ending of season 2 = "end of Lelouch + "Lelouch's end is death" ⇒ ending of season 2 = Lelouch is dead. Yeah, it's not like C.C was a corpse ''when her body was fatally bleeding''. then turned immortal we know he dies, but the theory point is that he's not dead just like C.C lie2 /lʌɪ/Submit noun noun: lie; plural noun: lies 1. an intentionally false statement. your dictionary needs some work, not once was there the statemet: lelouch is dead in the tv anime nor in the guidebooks, that's just a thing you made up from your misinterpretation LelouchviBritMER said: Codes are NEVER inactive. The anime makes that crystal clear. The assumption that codes need to be activated through death is contradicted by the anime itself. Charles was already immortal before he shot himself, the anime shows that because he has no red eyes and there is no blue brain scene. That means he was already immune to geass and thus he already has an "active" code, which means codes do NOT need to be activated at all. This was even officially and explicitly explained by the director in a live commentary! パパんにギアス掛けるシーンも、「これギアス掛かってないのに死んだふりするんだよ」「息子を驚かせようと」「ルルーシュくんかわいそう」「これ一番ショックなタイミング計ってるよね」「絶対笑いこらえてるよ」って色々言われてて笑った。 "He isn't geassed, just pretends he dies!" " He tries to surprise his son!" "Poor Lelouch" "He tries to choose the most shocking timing, doesn't he" "I'm sure he tries hard not to laugh" Charles was already immune to geass and immortal before he shot himself, that means his code was already "active" before "dying", that means codes do NOt need to be activated. So both the anime and the director make it clear that codes do NOT need to be activated! the blue nerve scenes are a case by case basis, no one knows what happens when someone is passed the code, pretends means to act as if but not, for all we know, it could mean that since his code activated he then didn't die because of it therefore only pretended to do so Phantomnocomics said: No, i can use it as a *feat > statement* since charles was wrong ''because of .....''' does not matter, since you agreed that characters can be wrong about their statements LelouchviBritMER said: Everything the anime shows confirms Charles' words. you have no basis to say he was wrong, just because he contradicted your headcanon. No, more than once, did i prove characters can be wrong: ''C.C wanting to die is contradicted by her actions, twice in fact''. charles believed V.V words about marianne death till it was retconned in the assassin scene charles was wrong about lelouch not being able to use his Geass against the collective unconsiciousness face it, character statements can be wrong, and i have no basis?, and this is headcanon? this is hilarious!, it's like talking to someone who says: but do you have a proof that it happened? this has to be one of the best appeal to ignorance fallacy i have seen since ''it's aliens'' moment Phantomnocomics said: and the blue nerves scenes does not happen always, lelouch par example did not have a blue nerve scene when he used the geass in the soliders once he regained his memories LelouchviBritMER said: And yet more falsehoods. rewatch the scene. he geasses the soldiers and the blue brains tuff DOES happen, time stamp is 20:43 to 20:49, go watch it. as usual, you misinterpret what you say, there is more than one scene of lelouch using geass in soldiers after he regains memories in that video, it was just to specify which R, since being vaguely with you leads to fallacies, and to specifes more, it's kolchak and the soliders with him in 10:00 where the scene only happens once to kolchak Phantomnocomics said: and for the actual sky, you are still convinced that it wasn't his Geass power? LelouchviBritMER said: Doesn't look anything like when Lelouch uses his geass. his geass victims NEVER showed the geass symbol on them. maybe because the SAID victim is not a human therefore that's a false equivalence? and it is required that he makes an eye contact with another human and said thing is not a human confirming that is an actual false equivalence maybe because the place is where a soul materialize in a place where physical beings are ?, don't be silly. Phantomnocomics said: myanimelist is a database <, kanzenshuu is a database ''to dragon ball''. >a sub reddit page where someone quotes some links is not, don't get triggered by it, i'm just stating the truth LelouchviBritMER said: A database is a place where information is gathered. it doesn't have to be one of the websites you mentioned. it can be any place, online and offline A database is an organized collection of data, generally stored and accessed electronically from a computer system. You always try to create smokescreen by trying to distract with semantics. Such distraction tactics are typcial for trolls. well, read up what the def for that is and i certainly don't meet the requirement therefore i'm not, and it's a fallacy to target the person behind the argument. a Database can simply mean a Database, < what it is defined as depends of the context, in the said case the context is a proper Code Geass Database like said kenzenshuu and it's not an issue if the fans don't have enough resource for such a feat and maybe in the future? Phantomnocomics said: a person is better off checking out the twitter of the writer where half of the quotes come from and directly to some site where the guidebook is fully posted there LelouchviBritMER said: Funny you say that because the Code Geass community database has links to both. and why go to it exactly for the links, why not post the links in here? the thing, garden of the thing https://twitter.com/karice67/status/920078079388614656?lang=en < twitter https://code-geass.livejournal.com/1178870.html < guidebook and a true scan in a note, Akito the exiled > Lelouch of the rebillion and OP theory is still valid in an other note, calling others trolls for being debunked is just hilarious! ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------------ To any Code geass fan, just ignore the vandalizing troll who is trying to deceive people by saying things like that code bearers can be geassed (see here), that souls are physical objects (see here) and who calls the official subs from Bandai "headcanon" (see here). He even admits to not having watched all of Code Geass because he thought it was fake deep (see here). Don't waste your time with that troll. Here's what is known about the ending of the anime: Lelouch is truly dead and does not have the code. The old code theory was fully debunked years ago. The community already knows this for years because: - the anime makes it clear that it is impossible for Lelouch to have the code as that would have violated the rules the anime itself established, i.e. everyone who gets the code loses the geass, there are no canon exceptions. Lelouch never lost his geass. - the show staff themselves have been repeating for 10 years that Lelouch is truly dead, sometimes poetically, sometimes very very explicitly. For those interested, you can read the Code Geass community database which has gathered all the official statements (interviews, live commentaries, tweets, the remade epilogue from 2009, the official guide book, etc), all with sources, links and even pictures! It also uses the anime itself to show that it is 100% impossible for Lelouch to have the code. As a small example of the linked database, here is a part of the "Geass Memories" where show staff talked about how they made the anime 10 years ago: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with HIS DEATH." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by HIS DEATH. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." Source Screenshot Translation Phantomnocomics commands you, obey me and know the truth of the show!. fans |
PhantomnocomicsNov 19, 2018 6:58 PM
| [quote=LelouchviBritMER message=56268339]To any Code geass fan, just ignore the vandalizing troll who is trying to deceive people by saying things like that code bearers can be geassed (see here), that souls are physical objects (see here) and who calls the official subs from Bandai "headcanon" (see here). He even admits to not having watched all of Code Geass because he thought it was fake deep (see here). Don't waste your time with that troll. Here's what is known about the ending of the anime: Lelouch is truly dead and does not have the code. The old code theory was fully debunked years ago. The community already knows this for years because: - the anime makes it clear that it is impossible for Lelouch to have the code as that would have violated the rules the anime itself established, i.e. everyone who gets the code loses the geass, there are no canon exceptions. Lelouch never lost his geass. - the show staff themselves have been repeating for 10 years that Lelouch is truly dead, sometimes poetically, sometimes very very explicitly. For those interested, you can read the Code Geass community database which has gathered all the official statements (interviews, live commentaries, tweets, the remade epilogue from 2009, the official guide book, etc), all with sources, links and even pictures! It also uses the anime itself to show that it is 100% impossible for Lelouch to have the code. As a small example of the linked database, here is a part of the "Geass Memories" where show staff talked about how they made the anime 10 years ago: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with HIS DEATH." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by HIS DEATH. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." Source Screenshot Translation ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------------ Phantomnocomics said: is this what you meant by: work in prgoress?, because, i thought you were trying to spam a troll alert silently?. just try post the response at once, this can be misunderstood like that The "work in progress" means that the posts are too big to do in one go, so I start and divide in pieces, and edit them in. LelouchviBritMER said: You never "proved" that Marianne geassed C.C. You just stated your opinion. But Marianne's soul never left Anya's body which would have happened if marianne had been able to geass C.C. that means Anya's body would have been unconscious on the floor, like when Marianne leaves it to enter C's World. But when we cut back to C.C. and Marianne talking normally we see that Anya is not on the floor, but still standing there with Marianne inside it. There's just no way Marianne geassed C.C. there. well, she still Used her Geass to enter that world, ''as seen from her having to make an eye contact'' and the ''sound effect'', but i suppose she entered it as anya rather than marianne, as Unlike the C World where she leaves the body and enter it without having to change, this happens in the world of memories LelouchviBritMER said: because code bearers being immune to geass, as the anime has established, is important in the bigger picture of Lelouch's fate. said establishment ''and impressive, you didn't call it a rule'', Only apply to those who you formed a contract with though, it is unknown whether said establishment works for those who you did not a form a contract with, it's an unclear stat since the show never confirmed it and same goes for someone whose code is sealed LelouchviBritMER said: I do, but admittedly it's sometimes hard to puzzle together what you mean. English is not your mother tongue, and I don't want to scold you for that because it isn't mine either, but sometimes it's really hard to see the meaning of your words. things like "the parameter of C.C." Errr, what? this happens when i make Long writing, hence why i like to keep it short and clean but ....o well LelouchviBritMER said: There isn't. Bandai are the ones making the official subs. Any other subs, which use different words are thus not official. That's like saying fan art is official. Bandai OWNS Code Geass! Sunrise Inc. (株式会社サンライズ Kabushiki gaisha Sanraizu) is a Japanese animation studio and production company which is a subsidiary of Bandai Namco Holdings. One of Japan's largest and best-known studios,[citation needed] Sunrise is renowned for critically praised and popular original anime series such as Gundam,...blah blah, Code Geass: Lelouch of the Rebellion, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunrise_(company) I do see your point but you do not see mine, the *so bandai are the only one who make official subtitle ones* is sarcasm, and i never specified in which language <, but that was just sarcasm Phantomnocomics said: and that it shouldn't matter since the center of the discussion is the dub and that i should have used it instead? LelouchviBritMER said: Sub or dub doesn't matter, she doesn't say "violated the contract" in dub either. we can argue semantics in which i previously stated that they mean the same thing to me or get to the actual discussion LelouchviBritMER said: The video you linked shows exactly what i described above. if Marianne had left Anya, she would have been unconscious as happens later, instead we even cut back to Anya and marianne mid-sentence with Anya standing and Marianne still inside of Anya. C.C left anya body in the C world but not in the world of memories. < we are in the same page then and i never said she left anya Body to transfer to the world of memories or to C.C body < you realize how silly this sounds? however, mariann did go to the world of memories as anya before changing to her true form Phantomnocomics said: No, it doesn't as of now, i have proved that Geass works in a sealed code, which can be equaled to that of an inactivated one LelouchviBritMER said: No you didn't. Nothing points at Marianne geassing C.C. It had already been stated that code bearers can't be geassed, we see that happen. and marianne geassing C.C. doesn't match with what we see because we see Anya still standing there with Marianne inside her and not inside C.C. as marianne's geass would have done. The forced eye contact / sound effect / the visual presentation showing us the Geass going into C.C eye the establishment is about those who you form a contract with, not those you do not with nor those whose code are sealed, and marianne made the implication of going there before marianne: what are you doing?, closing yourself up like this again. C.C was never seen sealing her code other than that time in the show, so it must have happened while marianne was still alive you have to state what the thing being countered is or else, else it didn't happen, and i already responded with my own counters, lad. you know, it would be better if you quote the whole thing, quoting it a piece by piece like this only lead to stuff/this kind of responses and no, it did not and i stated why above Phantomnocomics said: your Logic: screenwriter= director which is wrong, LelouchviBritMER said: Not once have I ever said that. now you're just blatantly lying again. it's because of lies like these that i call you a troll. i have already explained a million times how the difference between director and writer doesn't matter when it comes to lelouch's death because they have stated that they agreed on that matter. Saying that they both can speak on each other's behalf because of the consensus they reached is not the same as saying they are the same person. quote the part where someone claims that you said it, i made a logical in-equivalent to summarize why said in-equivalent would not work from your points that say otherwise because of the director to the screenwriter initial confirmation that you keep mentioning it Phantomnocomics said: just because some screenwriter confirmed that the ending will have death for lelouch with the director does not mean that the screenwriter magically becomes the director LelouchviBritMER said: Do the words "consensus" and "unanimously" not mean anything to you? the writer did not "become" the director, but he can speak on his behalf on a certain matter if they have a consensus on that matter, because they both agreed to the decision. Yes, he can talk in the matter they agreed/confirmed in, but talk as a DIRECTOR?. no at least, that's what comprehended from it, if it's not the initial point, then you may just ignore it LelouchviBritMER said: Zero requiem was Lelouch chosing death. Zero requiem happened. That means Lelouch is dead because the anime forbids him having the code. Are you saying Lelouch chose death but accidentally failed and is accidentally still alive? The sword stab accidentally didn't kill him because it missed all organs despite completely impaling his chest? lelouch died, No one is arguing that, what we are arguing is whether he's dead or not. Phantomnocomics said: those are just production initials that are only used to mislead people who are interested, the production initials are in fact, point less since they are only spoilers for the show LelouchviBritMER said: Spoilers? "Geass Memories" was made in 2018 to celebrate 10 years Code Geass. During Geass memories they talked about how the show was made 10 years earlier. There are no more spoilers at that point, he speaks freely and isn't lying as you seem to suggest. Your whole argument boils down to "the show staff mislead us, the show staff lie to us". that is just paranoid conspiracy thinking. i figured you would misinterpret that, or the very least, misunderstand that by that, it means that stating that point is like someone stating what happened in the last episode: O no, Lelouch died!. see what i mean? Phantomnocomics said: and you admitted it, you are triggered from discussing this that you called me a troll and misinterpreted/misquote what i say in a fallacious way LelouchviBritMER said: Me calling you a troll is based on the nonsense you spout, the backflips you've done, the absolute refusal to stop fussing about moot points, the blatant lying, and so on. It has nothing to do with me being triggered or not. But the fact that you keep checking if I'm triggered is a clear sign you're doing this to get a rise out of me. You're bored so you decided to go pester some fans of a show you don't even like (your own words). That's what's called being a troll. >this might be a SHOCK, but akito the exiled is a *code geass*, never said that i don't like the show, i said it is fake deep/pseudo smart, < which it is but that's a different discussion don't call others trolls for that, and you keep being offensive about it, therefore ''triggered'' is a logical conclusion Phantomnocomics said: fine, i'm using it, typical i hate this kind of ''way of talk'' but since you caught my interest, then why not Much easier for me. thanks LelouchviBritMER said: honestly though, i just wasn't prepared when i wrote that someone actually would be still interested in this thread, and yeah, i acted a bit trollish thinking the discussion would end after one or two responses, but shockingly enough, you are discussing to the end, well, your passion is certainly admirable Phantomnocomics said: yet you lack the important question: how much did i not watch?. and the answer is: 2. i'm pretty sure two boring episodes from the first season are not that important, but if it will rejoice you, i just recently watched them, and let me say, they are still boring but the dub makes it nice LelouchviBritMER said: It's not because they are season 1 episodes that they aren't important. For example, it's a season 1 episode which explains that C.C. cannot be geassed. it was episode 18 and 19, the amount of fan service was something, and other was too goofy Phantomnocomics said: No, It was C.C who sent him there, he tried to interfere with her falling, but couldn't, that's where she informs him that those were just memories LelouchviBritMER said: So now you're saying C.C. can absorb people with her mind, a bit like a reverse Marianne geass? maybe, but who knows, all i know, she somehow sent lelouch to the world of memories, guess a code ability? Phantomnocomics said: the World of C has to fit her parameter LelouchviBritMER said: the way you use it makes no sense. What is "C.C.'s parameter"? How does C's World fit "C.C.'s parameter"? i said her though, and think of it this way, Mao can't read someone who has no mind and lelouch cannot order someone who has no eye therefore since mariann power is kind of both the world would have to appeal to her power to work < at least the eye part is confirmed because of lelouch LelouchviBritMER said: Lelouch can't because the anime forbids him from having the code. ALL people who get the code lose the geass. NO exceptions at all or there would have been foreshadowing, setup, precedents, information, anything at al. But there isn't. So no exceptions within the canon of the anime. Lelouch never lost his geass. Ergo, Lelouch cannot have the code. well, it's a grey area whether someone can get a code from an other who they did not form a contract with, but, marianne did imply that it is possible by telling C.C that charles could have granted her wish and he had the eyes, and charles is an Anomly though remember, he Used Geass more than once in lelouch, once to alter his memories into julies kingley and the other to R2 and not only that, but he had a Code only ability while having his geass and the way lelouch would have obtained it from is from the collective unconsiousness, remember, who disabled charles immortality < and killed a *soul*, so it's possible that lelouch got the code that way Phantomnocomics said: Yeah, it's not like C.C was a corpse ''when her body was fatally bleeding''. then turned immortal LelouchviBritMER said: No she wasn't a corpse. corpses are dead people. Immortal people don't die immortal /ɪˈmɔːt(ə)l/ adjective adjective: immortal 1. living forever; never dying or decaying. but i see your point, although, one does become a corpse technically once they die. but then again, charles was revived moments later and C.C i suppose minutes?, hours? immortal means undead though, i should know, because i speak french. we can't know that though since when she got her code she was in a *awkward scenario*, it is very possible that she was dying when she got the code otherwise, it would be weird that she got her code and then was injured?, - if so, then she would had to have passed her code to C.C when she was ....injuring her?, fatally? . -the nun would have had to have been alive before she fall into that pose and spot and the bleeding would have to start by then Phantomnocomics said: not once was there the statemet: lelouch is dead in the tv anime nor in the guidebooks, that's just a thing you made up from your misinterpretation LelouchviBritMER said: yet another beautiful example of why you are a troll. i just showed you how the guidebook said her brother dies and her brother's corpse and yet you continue saying "they didn't say he died, they didn't say he died". yes they did! may i need to remind you that you are in a place specifically where the center of discussion is whether the said character dying/died is dead? this is why i told why you should fully quote stuff Phantomnocomics said: No, more than once, did i prove characters can be wrong: ''C.C wanting to die is contradicted by her actions, twice in fact''. LelouchviBritMER said: That's not C.C. being "wrong", that's C.C. changing her mind, character progression, character development, story arcs. She did want to die, but her time with Lelouch made her reconsider. it's because of him that she decided to accept life again and start living again instead of just accumulating experiences. Mao and charle happened before lelouch, so.... Phantomnocomics said: charles believed V.V words about marianne death till it was retconned in the assassin scene Phantomnocomics said: The series didn't retcon anything. Show me that he believed V.V.'s lies in season 1. marianne agreed to V.V plan, and she was never seen telling charles about it, and when V.V talked about it as innocent, charles didn't state it as a lie. this only happened when V.V sent assassins after lelouch and charles state that he lied alongside it being the second! Phantomnocomics said: charles was wrong about lelouch not being able to use his Geass against the collective unconsiciousness LelouchviBritMER said: He never said he couldn't. He hadn't considered the possibility. The difefernce here with charles saying that getting the code makes you lose the geass is that Charles not considering all options with Lelouch's geass is explicitly shown to us. Whereas his statement about losing geass is never shown to be wrong, on the contrary even, everything the show tells us corroborates Charles' words. When characters are mistaken, a fiction will tell you in some way. A reader never can willy nilly decide which characters are wrong/lying without any factual basis in the fiction. that would be foreshadowing, and there isn't, its absence if my basis so, it's still valid even if he just *never thought about it* LelouchviBritMER said: Not without being shown wrong. You can't go, for example, say that the entire world has been lying to Lelouch, that he in relaity was never a prince but just a found baby in the street. If a character lies or is wrong, for example Lelouch being wrong that Nunnally is dead, a fiction will always make that clear to its audience, because that is crucial storytelling. The anime never showed that Charles was wrong about losing geass. On the contrary, it constantly proved him right. again, that would be foreshadowing, and if a character statement has a *inconsistency* then they were either wrong/liying Phantomnocomics said: maybe because the SAID victim is not a human therefore that's a false equivalence? If the victim is too different from a human, how can you even say he was geassed? Lelouch says very clearly he doesn't intent to deafeat god, he merely has a request from it. it's a Being made by the Will of humans, humanly close enough and Geass work there and Lelouch commanded it. and again, and that would be his command, let's not repeat what has been said Phantomnocomics said: and it is required that he makes an eye contact with another human and said thing is not a human LelouchviBritMER said: how to geass it then? You can't how did she marianne geass in then? i guess she also can't? LelouchviBritMER said: I'm not calling you a troll to counter your arguments. i counter your arguments to counter your arguments. I call you a troll because you are obviously one. i call you a troll so you know that I'm aware that your sole intention is to trigger people and thus that it won't work on me. targeting the person behind the argument whether you are arguing or not is still a fallacy. Phantomnocomics said: and why go to it exactly for the links, why not post the links in here? the thing, garden of the thing https://twitter.com/karice67/status/920078079388614656?lang=en < twitter https://code-geass.livejournal.com/1178870.html < guidebook and a true scan LelouchviBritMER said: Because [url=https://www.reddit.com/user/GeassedbyLelouch/comments/8hklfr/evaluating_code_theory_main_body_index/the Code Geass community database[/url], as a database, contains much more information than just those two links. it also contains the remade epilogue (2009) where the cart scene is dropped and the new scene has C.C. explicitly explain that Lelouch is dead, and links to many other interviews, pictures of interviews, etc. ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------------ To any Code geass fan, just ignore the vandalizing troll who is trying to deceive people by saying things like that code bearers can be geassed (see here), that souls are physical objects (see here) and who calls the official subs from Bandai "headcanon" (see here). He even admits to not having watched all of Code Geass because he thought it was fake deep (see here). Don't waste your time with that troll. Here's what is known about the ending of the anime: Lelouch is truly dead and does not have the code. The old code theory was fully debunked years ago. The community already knows this for years because: - the anime makes it clear that it is impossible for Lelouch to have the code as that would have violated the rules the anime itself established, i.e. everyone who gets the code loses the geass, there are no canon exceptions. Lelouch never lost his geass. - the show staff themselves have been repeating for 10 years that Lelouch is truly dead, sometimes poetically, sometimes very very explicitly. For those interested, you can read the Code Geass community database which has gathered all the official statements (interviews, live commentaries, tweets, the remade epilogue from 2009, the official guide book, etc), all with sources, links and even pictures! It also uses the anime itself to show that it is 100% impossible for Lelouch to have the code. As a small example of the linked database, here is a part of the "Geass Memories" where show staff talked about how they made the anime 10 years ago: "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that THE END OF LELOUCH WILL BE DEATH." "Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't CHOOSE DEATH. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't DIE, for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." "At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with HIS DEATH." "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by HIS DEATH. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." Source Screenshot Translation well, it's still too complicated than it should, here is how it should, short and clean as it should https://twitter.com/karice67/status/920078079388614656?lang=en < twitter https://code-geass.livejournal.com/1178870.html < guidebook and a true scan Phantomnocomics commands you, seek the truth, fans! |
Huntik said: Phantomnocomics said: actually, the next series is a sequel to the new canon, that is the film series, not the TV. I'm pretty sure i didn't stated that it's TV series or no. I just said more Code Geass :P Fuc*ing brilliant and you know, stuff like this is why i still have faith in some humans |
| you thought a prehistoric computer is bad? i just almost shot mine for freezing just when i was about to finish writing the response. eternal punishment < time travel, here i am! |
| @LelouchviBritMER To any Code geass fan, akito > lelouch, that's a fact! LelouchviBritMER said: That makes no sense if you say she entered because of her geass. Her geass is a soul tranfer. Marianne's soul is Marianne, not Anya. my initial post is the still the same just thought of adding that weird part where she enters the world of memories briefly as Anya before switching to her look, i suppose she can switch between anya look and her look in the world of memories. Phantomnocomics said: , Only apply to those who you formed a contract with though, LelouchviBritMER said: The anime NEVER makes any mention of it. No hints, no suggestions, no precedents, no character thinks about it, no character talks about it, no character wonders if there's a possibility to the rules as they know them, etc. There is most literally zero basis for such assumption in the anime's canon. All that the anime does is tell us that people lose the geass when they get the code. i'm not basing if off character statements, i'm basing if off feats, there is no Feat that says a Geass user cannot use their Geass in someone who they did not a contract with and, not to mention, the other two feats, one being Charles code ability yet having geass and marianne using geass in C.C and awkwardly enough, Charles used Geass twice in lelouch inbetween S1 and S2? but yeah, you would think the memories of julius would show int the flashbacks scenes, but i guess since akito the exiled came afterward later on, they weren't thought of yet, a retcon i suppose Phantomnocomics said: it is unknown whether said establishment works for those who you did not a form contract with, it's an unclear stat since the show never confirmed it LelouchviBritMER said: At least you now say it's unknown and never confirmed. It's true that the information is lacking, but that already is a very very big indication. The creator of a work of fiction always wants his audience to understand his work. therefore if there is a piece of information which is necessary to understand the work, he will provide his audience with that information. Knowing that there are exception to the shown and explicitly confirmed rules is a crucial piece of information to be able to understand the story. If it had been true that there are exceptions, they would have made some kind of mention about it. But that anime is absolutely silent about it. That means that the assumption is just wrong. Just like the million other unique details about Lelouch's geass are not mentioned to be the cause for exceptions on the established rules. Lelouch was the first to get a geass on that very day. Lelouch was the first Britannian prince in exile to get the geass. Lelouch was the first to get his geass while standing in front of a firing squad. And so on and so on. All of these things are unique to Lelouch's situation. none of these things matter at all when it comes to the functioning of his geass, we know this because those unique details are never mentioned to have an effect. Therefore any other totally unique details which are unmentioned also don't have any effect. And thus getting a geass and a code from different people is NOT a reason to be an exception, because it is never mentioned in any kind of way. translation: the feat is not there but if it was important it would have been there, therefore the assumption is wrong and here is an equivalent: lelouch was the first exiled prince to get a Geass in a firing squad but it has nothing to do with how his Geass work, therefore, getting a code from someone who you did not form a contract with is wrong that's what i got from reading that .... *but if it were important* is not an argument, and the equivalent is false, the circumstance where lelouch Gets his Geass in has nothing to do with his Geass power, you can make someone falling off the sky get a Geass and it would still not matter, "I will give you a power you desire most,in return you have to make my one wish come true." this is what C.C said to lelouch, it is what the power the person desired the most is what is given to in exchange of fulfilling the contract Phantomnocomics said: I do see your point but you do not see mine, the *so bandai are the only one who make official subtitle ones* is sarcasm, and i never specified in which language <, but that was just sarcasm LelouchviBritMER said: Sarcasm? ok then. But it's impossible for me to know when you are being serious or sarcastic. when i pose a fact in a question tense, then that's sarcasm, but never mind it since it was just a one time thing Phantomnocomics said: we can argue semantics in which i previously stated that they mean the same thing to me or get to the actual discussion LelouchviBritMER said: Putting the difference between violated and not yet fulfilled aside, nobody has ever fulfilled C.C.'s contract, so everyone has violated (to use your word) the contract. Including Lelouch and Mao. You said that the violation of the contract was what allowed Marianne to geass C.C., but then Lelouch'sand Mao's geass should also have worked on C.C., and it didn't. Charles, and Mao happened before lelouch, so .... and it was C.C who blocked her contracts being fulfilled twice Phantomnocomics said: C.C left anya body in the C world but not in the world of memories. < we are in the same page then LelouchviBritMER said: Marianne's geass is a soul transfer, not a body transfer. When Marianne geassed Anya, her whole body also didn't travel with her inside Anya. how would that even work? Marianne's geass only works on her soul, it wouldn't suddenly start working completely differently. No one said her *actual body* it could be a virtual body, metaphysical body, etc, and i wrote it but to recall it, she did go to the world of memories as Anya briefly before switching her look Phantomnocomics said: however, mariann did go to the world of memories as anya before changing to her true form LelouchviBritMER said: that was just a manifestation. if that had been a real body, where did Anya's body suddenly go when Marianne changed into her own body? Did it disappear and stop existing? And where did Marianne's body suddenly appear from? i wrote it before but quoting the whole thing would be better time/space wise and i wouldn't have to write stuff eternally it wasn't her actual body, it was just the body/look of Anya, and it was still there outside looking at C.C eyes, No, don't be silly, that's the thing lad, she just switched to her body/look lelouch however is a different case that makes no sense Phantomnocomics said: No, it doesn't as of now, i have proved that Geass works in a sealed code, which can be equaled to that of an inactivated one LelouchviBritMER said: While they were looking at each other it is impossible to deduce from this that it was a mandatory requirement. Especially because before they looked at each other there was no need for the memory stuff to happen, as it wasn't clear to Anya yet what was going on and why C.C. was behaving so weird. It's only when Anya realizes what is going on and says "Don't tell me that you've actually..." that the memory stuff happens, and it happens IMMEDIATELY as soon as she realizes it. So it is impossible to tell from that if the eye contact was mandatory or just coincidental because they were talking to each other. lad, Anya was still standing there looking at her eyes and Marianne is already familiar with the world of memories, if there was another way beside that, she would have had done it LelouchviBritMER said: Very debatable, the sound is shorter than a normal geass effect, and with only a partial sound effect you just can't compare. There is A sound, but saying they're the same is a bridge too far. ?, Yes, it is very debatable since it is a broad point but far fetched?, no, that's just silly the sound effect differs from one to another though, Lelouch Geass sound effect differs from that to rolo and from that to charles. and it's not partial thought, it might be without the nerves scenes but those don't happen always and are a case by case Like in kolchak soliders or charles, it's a case by case thing. So it's not far fetched at all, it's logical LelouchviBritMER said: It went inside her eye because it's to show that it is C.C.'s memories. Unlike when Marianne used her geass on Anya, this time the "travel path" didn't start at Mariann the world of memories is not C.C memories though, it's a World that exist alongside the World of C, where C.C memories are, from the past, present, and future, as seen when Lelouch goes to it in episode 15 of R2 while marianne used her geass in anya to transfer her soul into. and i said it before, marianne stated that she was already in the world of memories before and since C.C left when marianne was kiled, so. . . . . LelouchviBritMER said: You are right about this. Marianne does say "Clsoing yourself up in here again like this" And this refutes your interpretation. yous ay there are 2 reasons why code bearers can be geassed, if they don't have a contracta nd if teh code is sealed. But the first part is never shown in the anime, and Marianne DID form a contract with C.C., does that doesn't explain anything here. And this is the only time that C.C. sealed her code, so if sealing is the reason that this is possible, Marianne couldn't have said "again". ironically enough, it does the opposite for me, if the code user is not the one who you formed a contract with and if the code is sealed and marianne said what are you doing, closing up yourself again in this place?. and the only time where C.C was seen in that place is when she sealed her code, so . . . . the only logical explanation is that C.C sealed her code once before Marianne was killed. as C.C in the world of memories, the one that exist in all times i suppose was ignored by marianne and marianne went for the actual C.C, someone who can only be there when the code is sealed. Phantomnocomics said: C.C was never seen sealing her code other than that time in the show, so it must have happened while marianne was still alive Impossible because marianne says "The power that had been dormant for so long activated for the first time as I was dying." LelouchviBritMER said: she could be refering to her soul being transfered to that of someone else, as it doesn't seem that you lose your soul out of your body when you go to the world of memories either that, or they met as anya before she met lelouch Phantomnocomics said: Yes, he can talk in the matter they agreed/confirmed in, but talk as a DIRECTOR?. no LelouchviBritMER said: On the matters they agreed upon, yes. If writer and director agreed that apples are red, the the writer can say that apples are red and make it count as the director's opinion because we were already informed that writer and director have the same opinion about apples. if the director says something or confirmed something then that's that, what's Important is the director and finally, you agreed to it, if some Producer said the director stated once that X is Y then this is the same for the writer and the director glad this is cleared out. Phantomnocomics said: lelouch died, No one is arguing that, what we are arguing is whether he's dead or not. LelouchviBritMER said: The anime made it impossible for him to have the code. EVERYONE who gets the code loses the geass. The anime never ever ever ever mentions anything at all about it being possible to keep both. that makes the idea that Lelouch is special not part of the canon lore and thus fanfic. codes also don't need to be activated, the show is very clear on that because Charles was already immortal and immune to geass before he shot himself. Therefore, without code, having died means you're dead. Looking at what the show staff have said, lelouch paid for his sins with death. if his death was just fake or only lasted minute, what kind of punishment would that be? That's no way to redeem for all his sins like causing the Japanese genocide or the death of the people he loved (Euphy, Shirley) And looking at the forshaoding of the show: “The only ones who should kill, are those who are prepared to be killed.” loses all meaning i "prepared to be killed" is "prepared to fake his own death" or ""prepared to be death for just a minute" death of author, and Dying is not a punishment? .....i'm dead!, i fall off the chair reading this?, you know it is a *torturing tactic* to stop someone heart to leak out information out of someone, right? imagine stopping it via being stabbed?....that's a punishment, lad. again, that only happened to those who they formed a contract with ''canon wise'' in a side note, charles pretty much confirmed that you can have more than one code and awkwardly enough, C.C implied that she lelouch could have killed her with one eye.....i guess having two eyes is not even a requirement by now, just do the contract conditions lad or not if you didn't form a contract with a code user you think a show losing its meaning is bad?, i have a spoiler for ya: Akito the exiled lost all meaning, once the MC started doing the contradiction of what the premise of his character was suppose to be and he technically did accept death though, it just happens that it wasn't a permanent kind of death in this context Phantomnocomics said: by that, it means that stating that point is like someone stating what happened in the last episode: O no, Lelouch died!. see what i mean? LelouchviBritMER said: yeah, the last episode of a show which ended 10 years ago. And nobody who hasn't seen the show would be reading "geass Memories" anyways On top of that, the event of the death is still "spoiled", so fake death or not, he did "spoil" that such an event happens. So no, your attempt to dismiss his words make no sense. The point was flied so over your head that you made another no existing one it's about the equivalent of that statement being the scene of lelouch dying, it's pointless to state it, and it adds nothing to it Phantomnocomics said: well, it's a grey area whether someone can get a code from an other who they did not form a contract with LelouchviBritMER said: the show never mentions the possibility in any kind of way. that means there's no basis to believe such a thing at all. All that the show tells us is that people who get the code lose the geass. Any exceptions to that are never mentioned. If we had to know that exceptions were possible, they would have given SOME hint about it, but the show simply didn't mention anything at all. actually, lad, who is the SHOW?. jokes aside, it has no mention in the show? damn, so charles getting C.C code is not existent anymore lad? *i intentionally wrote it as a grey area to see whether you are gonna refernece this or not to check whether you are actually biased or actually factual with the show* or, maybe you forgot, it could be that, either way, you should rewatch the show Phantomnocomics said: but, marianne did imply that it is possible by telling C.C that charles could have granted her wish LelouchviBritMER said: Yes, which means that people with the code can also take the code from other code bearers. But that's not relevant to Lelouch's case. It may be possible that there's more needed than just having the code to take someone else's code. because why else would Charles wait all those years to take C.C.'s code? it may have to do with getting all the thought elevators ready or so. But that's just speculation and really isn't relevant in this discussion. no, because according to marianne, C.C refused to let charle grant her wish, and she state her contract conditions to mao, or to lelouch for that matter till later on in the show and she has given lelouch the chance to kill her in the world of C, and she stated that chalre C.C: of all those i made a contract with, none has reached that point, but now there is Charles, he has done it. lelouch: you mean, you made a contract with me so that you can cease to exist? C.C: correct ----------------- C.C: in the final stage of geass, the user retains the position of the one who granted him his power, thus, you have gained the power to kill me. lelouch: kill you?!.., C2. C.C: you will have to kill me, do that, and you will be charles equal and be finally able to beat him. lelouch: tsk........ C.C: ....so fairly well, lelouch, you're too kind to end our contract C.C: charles, why did you steal V.V code chalres: is there any point in asking that question, after all, you are about to die C.C: i suppose you are right so there you have it, a code bearer can have more than one code from both someone who they formed a contract with or not and having two geass is not a necessity. Phantomnocomics said: remember, he Used Geass more than once in lelouch, once to alter his memories into julies kingley and the other to R2 LelouchviBritMER said: yes, true. Mao and Rolo also used their geass multiple times on the same people. Only Lelouch has that 1-time constraint LelouchviBritMER said: No, charles never had both code and geass. Charles himself says "I've gained a new power in place of geass" Feats > statements, are you telling me that someone who would be killing someone yet telling them he's not is actually not killing?. don't be silly you might call it a plot hole, but that's the point, for some it's a plot hole, for some it's an easter egg Phantomnocomics said: and the way lelouch would have obtained it from is from the collective unconsiousness, remember, who disabled charles immortality < and killed a *soul*, so it's possible that lelouch got the code that way LelouchviBritMER said: that still doesn't explain how Lleouch could keep his geass. the show never ever mentions the possibility to keep the geass when having the code, while it repeats several times that it is lost. god giving Lelouch a code would also be a gigantic asspull because it foes against everything the show ever explained about how codes are tansferred. So if god gave the code, the transfer isn't explained, the not losing the geass is not explained, him having the code is never foreshadowed or mentioned, and so on. So no, god did not give lelouch a code. it is impossible to kill someone with a code mark, even if you destroy them at a sub atomic level, the only logical explanation is that the code was stolen from Charles, and the only way a code can be stolen is if it is either taken/given to another Code bearer or a Geass Bearer and C.C made it clear that obtaining a code from someone who you did not form a contract with is possible command: do not stop the track of time event. cause of the event: the Ragnarok connection and the thought elevator Cause of the Ragnarok connection is the codes of Charles and C.C even though it could have been only charles. the thought elevator is destroyed, but the thought elevator can be opened by C.C again therefore, the track of time will be stopped by the the Ragnarok connection then it must be disconnected, and to do that, you will have to break the codes connection, and to do that, you will have to get Charles code off him but the only way to get a code off is to transfer it to someone else since the code itself is the source of immortality, so it would be either C.C or lelouch since suzaku is not a Geass/Code Bearer so, removing and transfering both the codes of C.C and charles to Lelouch would have been the logical conclusion but instead, we got an idiotic conclusion C.C Code is kept because ....she doesn't want to open it the thought elevator anymore and Charles and marianne are killed because .....??????? the only thing about this is an implication made by C.C and marianned asking why isn't Collective unconsciousness killing C.C? then C.C says because she doesn't to stop the track of time. now, here is the issue, it doesn't matter what you want, but what you can do < the collective unconsciousness doesn't follow this method and instead does the reverse so instead of transferring C.C code to lelouch she is instead spared and says that is because she doesn't want to stop the track of time, if so, then the command/collective unconsciousness does not effect those who ....won't opposite the command?, guess god has a truth/future proof mechanic but marianne and charles were which is weird since marianne has nothing to do with the events/causes, < this could only mean that even if you don't cause the events but will oppose it future wise, then you will be destroyed shockingly enough, this could also mean that marianne might have possibly managed to stop the track of time again in the future if left unchecked, way to go marianne! but then again, marianne had nothing to do with the causes, killing her is like killing anyone in the world who might possibly opposite the command in the future it's stupid and awkwardly enough, their killing process speed was inconsistent, guess because of their ''beliefs'', and it only accelerated when Lelouch Shout at them, but meh back to the main stuff so it is possible and the only explanation in how charles would be killed Phantomnocomics said: but i see your point, although, one does become a corpse technically once they die. LelouchviBritMER said: immortal people don't die, ever. they fall down, bleedinga nd whatnot, but they don't die. Ever. That what being immortal means. No, they can DIE, but cannot be DEAD, immortal = UNDEAD. not UNDIE. *Glory* par example, You can destroy the universe where some immortal is thus making their immortality useless till said destroyed universe is created again, so while they are not dead, they have died technically but their undying process won't work Phantomnocomics said: but then again, charles was revived moments later and C.C i suppose minutes?, hours? LelouchviBritMER said: C.C. also never died. She grasped lleouch arm moments after getting a bullet in the head. She kept lying still for the rest, for obvious reasons. She didn't want the soldiers and Lelouch to know that she could take a bullet to the head and shrug it off. Later, at Narita, it does seem to take longer. but maybe she fainted from pain or so, that's not clear. but she wasn't dead because her wound had already healed while still lying there. dead bodies don't heal. damn it, you took glory by self correcting!, stop that!, i command you!, but Yeah, you said, it did a lot longer in narita, which makes sense, you can't expect every injury to have the same healing span so, she did in a sense in narita at least. but those are just semantics in this context LelouchviBritMER said: Undead means things like zombie or ghost or vampire. that's something else entirely. Undead are between dead and alive. immortal people don't die, they are fully alive. no, that's the *literal* meaning, You see, Mort means death in french, Mortal is the adjectif form of it, and IM is self explanatory, so Im-mort-al literally means Undead and zombies aren't undead, since they are kill-able but ghosts might be they are more of a case by case than ghost = undead Phantomnocomics said: we can't know that though since when she got her code she was in a *awkward scenario*, it is very possible that she was dying when she got the code LelouchviBritMER said: We do know that because the code gives immortality which prevents her from dying. She was wounded and about to die, but then she accepted the nun's code, so she ended up surviving the wound. you are right in some context, since the nun would have *had* to finish the process in where C.C was before go to the spot where she dies then C.C would have been bleeding at the time thing is though, the nun blood is not leaking anymore, that would take around an hour to happen, so she would have died almost an hour ago before the scene transition, but thing is lad, the nun hands are clean, so how did she injure her exactly without using her hands or body for that matter, one could say , that she Injured her once before she started bleeding, and it's a head injury, and why did the nun unclothe C.C?, if she was gonna transfer it to her head in the first place as i'm sure it would have been obvious if she was gonna do otherwise since that was her start to go place as discussed figures Phantomnocomics said: - if so, then she would had to have passed her code to C.C when she was ....injuring her?, fatally? LelouchviBritMER said: the nun injured C.C. C.C. probably would have died there if she had remained mortal. The nun offered her the code. C.C. accepted. the newly acquired immortality prevented C.C; from dying to her injury. the nun now was mortal and committed suicide because she didn't want to live anymore. with that amount of blood leaking?, do you know how wide/deep the wound would have to be?,she would have minutes before she faint!, which makes considering the blood of the nun dried out which takes around an hour, so things would happen in the span of minutes for the transfer Phantomnocomics said: -the nun would have had to have been alive before she fall into that pose and spot and the bleeding would have to start by then LelouchviBritMER said: Yes definitely. Dying from bleeding out takes a while. first you need to lose enough blood for the brain to suffocate from lack of oxygen, and the suffocation isn't instant either. plenty of time to take that pose Yes, and to add to that, the bleeding doesn't deem to have left that spot, so she takes the pose then the bleeding starts but her death was most likely instant as i doubt she would have chosen this kind of death where she stays conscious while fainting from the bleeding Phantomnocomics said: may i need to remind you that you are in a place specifically where the center of discussion is whether the said character dying/died is dead? LelouchviBritMER said: immoral people don't die, that's what immortal means. Lelouch chose death because he was aware of his sins and wanted redemption. he saw death as the only fitting punishment. What kind of punishment/redemption would that be if he were to be only dead for a minute? let's not forget that this wasn't the first time Lelouch went kamikaze for his own redemption. in Turn 20, before the final confrontation with Charles, Lelouch comes up with a plan to get rid of Charles and at the same time getting his redemption. The only way he knows of defeating an immortal: locking up Charles forver in C's World. instead of blowing up the exit with only charles inside, lelouch actually locks himself up too. And he says "Now, let us repent. Suffering together for all eternity! the Zero requiem is essential the same idea. Creating a better world while redeeming your sins. Lying on the floor for a minute and then walking away because you're immortal is NOT redemption. Lelouch chose death, that was the only fitting punishment in his eyes. being dead and not staying dead simply is no redemption. As theye xplained, the punishment for Lelouch was death and the punishment for Suzaku was life. Also, lelouch chose to die. if the code prevented him from what he wanted: dying, then why doesn't he give a geass to suzaku, have it develop to two eyes and then give him the code? that way the punishment would be complete: life for Suzaku (through the code) and death for Lelouch (because he passed on the code) lelouch with the code just doesn't make sense in any context No, Immortals can die but not be dead that's what immortal literal meaning is ---- and fuc*ing brilliant!, you should have wrote the script, i'm serious, Dead serious and no joke, what you said is just.....damn you have a talent in writing and no for redemption as that can be done by multiple ways, it's the *i will kill myself for killing another person* instead of *i will fix what killing that person caused and make their wish in life come true instead of them* or similar stuff LelouchviBritMER said: mao would never accept the code because he was in love with C.C. Mao was not an opportunity for C.C. to die. those two opportunities were with Charles in turn 15 and Turn 21. She refused both opportunities because by then she had been ith Lelouch for over a year. she still contracted her statements, sure, feat wise this is what happened, and context can be extracted from those feats ''that even a 2 year child can'' but it still prove my point that feats > statements LelouchviBritMER said: No she didn't, she didn't know what V.V.'s plan was. She complied to sending her guards away because V.V. asked, but she didn't know why V.V. wanted that, she acted in good faith, thinking that V.V. had good intentions, like talking about ragnarok would guards being around to hear it. But V.V. ambushed her. She never knew what he was going to kill her. no, she didn't know that V.V was gonna try to kill her, but she still agreed to the plan by making it look like not V.V who did it by not telling charles about it LelouchviBritMER said: We don't see her tell Charles, but Charles knew. Maybe marianne, as Anya, told him, maybe C.C. informed him, who knows. but Charles knew because they say this: Charles: [i]I spoke with my brother about it, however…[i] V.V: I heard. What a tragedy. I shall miss Marianne. Charles: My brother lied to me. After we had sworn to create a world without deceit. So Charles most definitely knew what had happened, marianne never fooled charles. he never stated this in the first time with V.V, it wasn't till later on that this was stated and C.C left once Marianne informed her Anya was never seen near the places charles is and i doubt they would allow her it's most likely that he figured out by himself since in one scenes, he told a solider who told him that the remains have arrived that he was conversing with Clovis so, the world of C is an afterlife prototype now? Phantomnocomics said: and when V.V talked about it as innocent, charles didn't state it as a lie. this only happened when V.V sent assassins after lelouch LelouchviBritMER said: No, in the flashback in turn 21 we see that Charles always knew that v.V. was marianne's killer. lad, you missed my point, that Marianne was cooperating with V.V plan and he didn't know about it, he only figured out that it was V.V who killed her by making the implication later on LelouchviBritMER said: and yet it's a being powerful enough to erase the existence of an immortal. i'd say that's very far removed from a normal human You can't erase an immortal of existence, that defies the point of being immortal, You can rewrite an immortal to being mortal again and then do that, but do the prior without the latter?, no Phantomnocomics said: targeting the person behind the argument whether you are arguing or not is still a fallacy. LelouchviBritMER said: A fallacy is an erroneous argument during a discussion. Giving an opinion about a person is not an argument and thus not a fallacy Saying you're a troll because of the way you behave and what you say is my opinion, it's not an argument not fallacy. Arguing that my opinion about you being a troll is an argument IS a fallacy, however, because that's an argument, and not an opinion about my person. definition of ad hominem fallacy: Ad hominem (Latin for "to the person"), short for argumentum ad hominem, is a fallacious argumentative strategy whereby genuine discussion of the topic at hand is avoided by instead attacking the character, motive, or other attribute of the person making the argument, or persons associated with the argument, rather the argument itself Yeah, good luck arguing that *ad hominem* doesn't apply because it's your opinion Phantomnocomics said: well, it's still too complicated than it should, here is how it should, short and clean as it should LelouchviBritMER said: it's thorough and as complete as possible, that's why it's long and not short. it's inevitable. Phantomnocomics commands you, make your response shorter!, and acknowledge that akito > Lelouch |
PhantomnocomicsNov 22, 2018 12:36 AM
LelouchviBritMER said: Phantomnocomics said: you thought a prehistoric computer is bad? i just almost shot mine for freezing just when i was about to finish writing the response. eternal punishment < time travel, here i am! When my pc starts to lag when i post something. i quickly do "select all" and "copy" You clever little fool!, i wish i thought of that! |
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