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Was there better trans or gay representation in the show?
Jul 26, 2015 6:08 PM
#1
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Jan 2015
7
Alright, so we have Bob as the friend of Saiga as the gay representation, and Bob's sister and her fellow trans woman performers as the trans representation. All of them goodies and treated warmly by Saiga and Kagura.

The reason I'm wondering about this is because the show sets out to portray a corrupt, twisted and sordid world and the writers seemed to think that having a character as gay wasn't enough for that, and instead had him being explicitly 'nonjudgmental' when he thought Saiga was in a sexual relationship with a minor. The trans women on the other hand had no additional thing making them any more corrupt, twisted or sordid. This means the writers thought they already achieved that simply by having trans women coz apparently they are inherently fucked up (not my opinion).
Jul 26, 2015 7:02 PM
#2
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Dec 2014
3
Ah I was wondering this too when I saw it the first time. I think what you're saying makes sense, I agree that the intentions of the writers are pretty unclear when it comes to trans and gay representation. I'm glad the trans women aren't being portrayed as ~evil and corrupt~ but at the same time it makes me question what the writers thought their inclusion brought to the story/ its setting.
Jul 27, 2015 11:13 AM
#3
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Feb 2015
1
Yeh, ^same . I really think that representation in media is important, and I think a lot of how effective it is has to do with the writers' underlying intentions, so I was curious about this myself :/
Mar 11, 2016 5:26 AM
#4
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Jan 2015
1
Hm... I haven't voted in the poll since I'm undecided on what I think about it.
However, although I'm not sure that I think that the representation of trans women in the show necessarily means that the writers think that they are inherently fucked up or perverse or something along those lines. Perhaps they are playing with viewers expectations? In that, generally, people tend to have transphobic and transmisogynistic views (either maliciously or just through how society moulds us). So the audience would see these women in the show, and assume they would be sordid or perverse. But actually, they are some of the more likeable and good hearted incidental characters. Instead, it is the people whom society would expect to be 'respectable' that are the most fucked up. For example, the politicians, the businessmen, etc.
Or perhaps I am giving the writers too much credit.
I'll need to think a bit more about its handling of its gay characters to comment on that, but wanted to put down what my initial thoughts were. :3
ineedsunflowersMar 11, 2016 5:31 AM
Oct 6, 8:39 AM
#5
Call me Oniichan

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Jan 2007
1646
Another tourist that doesn't understand the difference between trans and crossdresser.
Oct 6, 1:12 PM
#6
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Jan 2015
7
Reply to BigBoyAdvance
Another tourist that doesn't understand the difference between trans and crossdresser.
@BigBoyAdvance ooh, interesting point! so, are you familiar with japanese culture enough to say that they were crossdressers and not trans women? Coz as far as I am aware, such a grouping of people in the UK would either be trans women, or at very least a mix of trans women and crossdressers, at least as far as I'm aware... but that's the limit of my knowledge. I guess idk what gatherings of crossdressers specifically are like.

Do you have deeper insight u can provide? I'd 100% value it!
Oct 6, 1:17 PM
#7
Call me Oniichan

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Jan 2007
1646
Reply to herbeey
@BigBoyAdvance ooh, interesting point! so, are you familiar with japanese culture enough to say that they were crossdressers and not trans women? Coz as far as I am aware, such a grouping of people in the UK would either be trans women, or at very least a mix of trans women and crossdressers, at least as far as I'm aware... but that's the limit of my knowledge. I guess idk what gatherings of crossdressers specifically are like.

Do you have deeper insight u can provide? I'd 100% value it!
@herbeey Did you watch the anime? Those characters were complaining about having a dick between their legs and they looked like 100% natural men, not like men who took HRT to look like women. So yes, they were crossdressers, not trans. Being trans requires advanced modifications to your body via HRT and/or surgery.
Oct 6, 1:39 PM
#8
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Jan 2015
7
Reply to BigBoyAdvance
@herbeey Did you watch the anime? Those characters were complaining about having a dick between their legs and they looked like 100% natural men, not like men who took HRT to look like women. So yes, they were crossdressers, not trans. Being trans requires advanced modifications to your body via HRT and/or surgery.
@BigBoyAdvance um, ok, now you're the one sounding like a tourist. Either that or truscum...

I'm a trans women and know many trans women and access to medical intervention is limited to the rich and the very lucky. HRT is easier to get access to, but in Scotland at least, I reckon trying to get it now would probably take upwards of 10 years. Also dysphoria is not a prerequisite of being trans. Again, I don't know much about the context of Japan, but I would imagine access to HRT and gender confirming surgery to be pretty limited.

My context is the UK, so, like, my perspective is limited...

All the same, trans women don't become trans women when they begin HRT or get bottom surgery. They are valid women before that ever happens. Given the living situation of these crossdressers or trans women or whatever they be... I would wager that they are very poor. So I would guess that their access to HRT and/or surgery to be impossible. Crossdressers to an extent can go home and be normal cis people, whereas for trans women, it is not a costume they put on. Which I reckon aligns more with what we see in the show.

Like, are you saying i'm not a trans women because I complain about having a dick between my legs? coz I've been trying for years to change that but I'm not rich enough to make it happen, and even before I was trying to do that, I was still a valid trans woman.

Are you still truly convinced these can't be trans women, coz what you've said so far seems entirely unconvincing to me. Like, are you a trans woman or crossdresser? I'm not really sure where you're coming from when you call me a tourist?
Oct 6, 1:42 PM
#9
Call me Oniichan

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Jan 2007
1646
Reply to herbeey
@BigBoyAdvance um, ok, now you're the one sounding like a tourist. Either that or truscum...

I'm a trans women and know many trans women and access to medical intervention is limited to the rich and the very lucky. HRT is easier to get access to, but in Scotland at least, I reckon trying to get it now would probably take upwards of 10 years. Also dysphoria is not a prerequisite of being trans. Again, I don't know much about the context of Japan, but I would imagine access to HRT and gender confirming surgery to be pretty limited.

My context is the UK, so, like, my perspective is limited...

All the same, trans women don't become trans women when they begin HRT or get bottom surgery. They are valid women before that ever happens. Given the living situation of these crossdressers or trans women or whatever they be... I would wager that they are very poor. So I would guess that their access to HRT and/or surgery to be impossible. Crossdressers to an extent can go home and be normal cis people, whereas for trans women, it is not a costume they put on. Which I reckon aligns more with what we see in the show.

Like, are you saying i'm not a trans women because I complain about having a dick between my legs? coz I've been trying for years to change that but I'm not rich enough to make it happen, and even before I was trying to do that, I was still a valid trans woman.

Are you still truly convinced these can't be trans women, coz what you've said so far seems entirely unconvincing to me. Like, are you a trans woman or crossdresser? I'm not really sure where you're coming from when you call me a tourist?
tl;dr
Please remember that you will never be a woman.
Oct 6, 2:16 PM
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Jan 2015
7
Reply to BigBoyAdvance
tl;dr
Please remember that you will never be a woman.
@BigBoyAdvance lmao, gotcha

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