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| THIS IS AN ANIME ONLY DISCUSSION POST. DO NOT DISCUSS THE MANGA BEYOND THIS EPISODE. ----------------------------------------  This episode had so much emotion and game music. I was blown away. Did DEEN really do this episode? |
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| where did you watch the raw? I can't find it this time |
hirahira said: where did you watch the raw? I can't find it this time http://say-move.org/comeplay.php?comeid=30619 |
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| @PsychFreak |
hirahiraOct 14, 2009 1:59 PM
| WTF MAGICAL BUNNY GIRLS THIS SHOW SUCKS That's how most of the anime-only people will react and they'll probably ignore the rest of the episode. This is an episode that I probably would have liked a lot better if I hadn't read the VN. I really miss the Western duel part and Eva-Beatrice jumping in front of Belphegor like that was dumb. Kyrie's part was awesome though. Anime Leviathan sure is different from VN Leviathan. But that's okay since I don't like VN Leviathan. I love Belphegor's voice. I guess she really is the best Stake. I hate Siesta 410's voice. 45's is fine. Eva-Beatrice's voice is much better now too. The scene with Eva-Beatrice and Hideyoshi wasn't as emotional as it was in the VN but it was still good and I loved seeing her get slapped. I think this episode killed one of my theories again D: This episode was definitely the best episode PsychFreak said: hirahira said: @PsychFreak Lol done, good idea. |
hirahira said: WTF MAGICAL BUNNY GIRLS THIS SHOW SUCKS The people who cling to the hope that the series will return to being a normal mystery (like the first arc) will probably feel that way. But it should be known that UMINEKO WILL NEVER RETURN TO A NORMAL MYSTERY BECAUSE IT ISN'T ONE. The first arc was merely a fake out. Until the tea party, it fooled you into thinking it's just another murder island mystery. |
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| When the Seagulls cry? More like When the Witches get slapped. Waiting for subs on this one... |
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 Lol. Hideyoshi's pimp hand is strong indeed. |
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| once again another witch got slapped lol. I like the bunny sisters, they provide quite a few lulz~ Anyway, red words strike again: "Rosa and Maria are murdered by someone else." does that mean Rosa really did die there? it feels almost the same as the red words in 2nd arc about "Kanon was murdered in that room". I hardly see any way to deny Rosa's death after those words... not that it is a huge problem though, it can go under the category "different possibilities". The one who has the very first murder intent and who starts this "game" doesnt change throughout different arcs, but whether or not he succeeds in his murder series or who or how he kills, is again another question. And as I speculated a few eps before, sacrificing all servants at the very beginning would prove difficulties for later deeds. Now it actually becomes so difficult (to kill cunning armed adults) that the suspect can no longer follow the exact words on the epitaph anymore, or it could mean that the suspect has changed, though he still intents to follow that same pattern but no longer puts as much effort into reproducing the exact words of the epitaph. eitherway, pretty entertaining episode, with quite a few laughs. waiting for next~ |
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vinesage said: once again another witch got slapped lol. I like the bunny sisters, they provide quite a few lulz~ Anyway, red words strike again: "Rosa and Maria are murdered by someone else." does that mean Rosa really did die there? it feels almost the same as the red words in 2nd arc about "Kanon was murdered in that room". I hardly see any way to deny Rosa's death after those words... not that it is a huge problem though, it can go under the category "different possibilities". The one who has the very first murder intent and who starts this "game" doesnt change throughout different arcs, but whether or not he succeeds in his murder series or who or how he kills, is again another question. And as I speculated a few eps before, sacrificing all servants at the very beginning would prove difficulties for later deeds. Now it actually becomes so difficult (to kill cunning armed adults) that the suspect can no longer follow the exact words on the epitaph anymore, or it could mean that the suspect has changed, though he still intents to follow that same pattern but no longer puts as much effort into reproducing the exact words of the epitaph. eitherway, pretty entertaining episode, with quite a few laughs. waiting for next~ Well just to go a little deeper into your quote to show some odd things with that line of thought. If the culprit is different from the other arcs it's a little odd that the culprit would still have the stakes as well as continuing to follow what the epitaph says. The only noticeable difference between arcs is the gunshot wounds. Plus if the main culprit is the same in the First Twilight then killing all the servants shouldn't slow down the culprit to much because he/she was the one who decided to killed them. |
| I think the culprit is different and is following the epitaph to make people believe that it it's the same one from the first twilight. But the question lies, where does one get those demonic stakes? |
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PlatinumHawke said: MarthX said: Did DEEN really do this episode? DEEN has actually been putting effort into the 3rd arc. Which is great, because the last two question arcs are basically the best and the turning points of the series. My expectations are on the rise DEEN. Sad part is that all that effort will go down the drain with an incredibly rushed last episode of the arc. It's going to be episode 11 all over again. |
| This was a good episode. I will have to look for OST because when Kyrie and Rudolf were fighting Leviathan and Belphegor the music was incredible and superb. Maria looked so pitiful with Rosa death reminding me of this was sad. :( That was unfair. Beato looked soft for some time with Battler. It was great joy to have seen Belphegor bleeding but I did not see Leviathan being killed. Is that thing dead? Kyrie expression of anger was well done around 13:25. I though the Siestas sister were the Stakes of Purgatory......are the Siestas sisters only the property of Eva Beatrice? I am also confused as to why the Siestas sister act like some robot system computer to attack and share information??? I was hoping Hideyoshi would heal Kyrie and Rudolf or stop Eva Beatrice but instead he gets killed. D: Very disappointed. I would hope someone dethrones Eva Beatrice. A sad death for Kyrie and Rudolf but a great struggle they put up. OmegaDenmad said: Lol. Hideyoshi's pimp hand is strong indeed. Yeah that was great but instead of stopping Eva Beatrice it made her angry and she killed Hideyoshi. vinesage said: once again another witch got slapped lol. That was satisfying! |
francismeunierOct 15, 2009 3:01 AM
 In spoiler my anime list for now. |
| Hmmm, very interesting developments once again. I'm liking how Beatrice is evolving right now. |
 In every age, in every place, the deeds of men remain the same. |
| Virgillia rocks! <3 |
deadoptimist said: Though I think shit-flinging should also have standards - no personal, no behind the scenes. |
| After seeing the subs I admit that Siesta 45 is better than the other. Was more shocked at the whole Asumu/Kyrie situation. Pretty sad the stillborn story. :( I am thinking they will make Eva into the culprit. My head hurts and I would really want someone to explain me something: what is the whole talking about the traveler/north wind/sun thing. My heads hurt thinking about it and can't understand it. I do understand Battler not believing that a cruel witch exists and challenge but the rest is a no to understanding. |
In spoiler my anime list for now. |
Dark_Requiem said: The noticeable difference in this arc is the fatal wounds: they don’t appear to be killed exactly like the epitaph described. This conflicts very much with the course of action we know from arc 1 and 2. vinesage said: Well just to go a little deeper into your quote to show some odd things with that line of thought. If the culprit is different from the other arcs it's a little odd that the culprit would still have the stakes as well as continuing to follow what the epitaph says. The only noticeable difference between arcs is the gunshot wounds. Plus if the main culprit is the same in the First Twilight then killing all the servants shouldn't slow down the culprit to much because he/she was the one who decided to killed them.Immediately follows the question: why so? and 2 possibilities appeared to me: 1). same suspect but changed circumstances made it too difficult or, 2). suspect changed. The fact Eva and Rosa found the gold indicates things are not same like in earlier arcs. Reason to this change I believe is because all adults are alive after 1st twilight, like I speculated in ep13 thread that killing all servants at first wouldn’t be a wise decision. (ep13 discussion) and the 2 things you pointed out dont seem odd to me. First, I don’t remember if it is ever discussed where those stakes are from. So, as long as we don’t know where the culprit gets his hands on those stakes, it is still very reasonable to assume the “2nd” culprit can somehow get those stakes as well. (If I would say the Rosa got those stakes from the gold room, why should Eva be unable to get those?) Second, just because it was the culprit himself who made the plan (killing servants first or whatever) doesn’t necessarily mean it was well thought out. Base on 1st and 2nd arc we can safely assume that person is quite cunning, but it doesn’t mean he is perfect (quote: nobody is perfect :-) ), neither are his plans. As I speculate that “different arcs reflects the different possibilities how things could have happened/turned out”, this arc might have pointed out the possibility that however cunning he might be as we knew him from earlier arcs, its totally possible for him to fail miserably in his plan as well. |
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| Now that this series has took an 180 degree turn, it is like I am watching another drama action series. Beside that, this is episode is awesome by Battler’s parent. |
SivaOct 15, 2009 9:55 AM
 "A Legend is but a tale of a beautiful lie." |
vinesage said: while nothing supports the 2nd theory “suspect changed” at the meantime, red words proved Rosa is dead(unless you can find a way around). Since she was the prime suspect, I cant help but assume someone else picked up from where she left. and the 2 things you pointed out dont seem odd to me. First, I don’t remember if it is ever discussed where those stakes are from. So, as long as we don’t know where the culprit gets his hands on those stakes, it is still very reasonable to assume the “2nd” culprit can somehow get those stakes as well. (If I would say the Rosa got those stakes from the gold room, why should Eva be unable to get those?) Second, just because it was the culprit himself who made the plan (killing servants first or whatever) doesn’t necessarily mean it was well thought out. Base on 1st and 2nd arc we can safely assume that person is quite cunning, but it doesn’t mean he is perfect (quote: nobody is perfect :-) ), neither are his plans. As I speculate that “different arcs reflects the different possibilities how things could have happened/turned out”, this arc might have pointed out the possibility that however cunning he might be as we knew him from earlier arcs, its totally possible for him to fail miserably in his plan as well. I think that your thoughts on Rosa being the culprit of the 2nd arc might be clouding your judgments on there being a different main killer this arc (when I started reading EP3 of the VN I had the same thought process; if Rosa and Genji are dead it is probably a different killer) . I mean no one has the real answer to who the culprit is, but I see Ryukishi trying to make 1 person the blatantly obvious killer in an attempt to lead us to the wrong conclusions. Well sure, it might be possible for anyone to get the stakes, but totally disregarding them isn't a smart move. Making to many assumptions will destroy the foundations of a theory. Plus since he was willing to kill all of the servants I doubt the culprit would corner himself so much (unless you want to go into a whole story about how all the servants figured out the culprits plans). The only noticeable difference between the killings and the epitaph is the 2nd twilight where in this arc a mother-daughter relationship was killed not a lover relationship. Though the epitaph says "the two who are close" so it still follows it (though I actually believe Eva was the culprit for just this twilight) |
Golden_TruthOct 15, 2009 9:38 AM
| Hideyoshi giving EVA-Beatrice a noogie was hillarious. The Siesta squad/brigade appears ! |
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| Eva-Beatrice really pisses me off -.- Until now, i didn't really noticed Rudolf character but i have to say i love him now <3 and his wife! <3 Liked also the entry of the two Siesta, other weirdooos yeaah! I still like Beato now but i'd love to see other psyco-Beato scenes! Come back to me! <3 Waiting for the next ep! |
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| Meh... okay episode. No Kyrie math was shit, but better than the last ones at least. |
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francismeunier said: I am thinking they will make Eva into the culprit. My head hurts and I would really want someone to explain me something: what is the whole talking about the traveler/north wind/sun thing. My heads hurt thinking about it and can't understand it. I do understand Battler not believing that a cruel witch exists and challenge but the rest is a no to understanding. That's a fable. This: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_wind_and_the_sun |
| I still don't get it why the evul Beato has suddenly turned all dere. Another good episode. |
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OmegaDenmad said: Lol. Hideyoshi's pimp hand is strong indeed. Haha Not As Strong As Battler's Lol |
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| Fuck yeah, this time DEEN did well. The emotion flows were expressed very well, also the important scenes didn't get cutted. 2 more episode for banquet, i guess they will cut it heavily due to still much to shown. The Mr. & Mrs. Ushiromiya moment were very well made. From Rudolf's side weren't too good, not as epic as the VN but the emotion on Kyrie's side were awesome, truly badass. And oh yeah, Asumu were told. 410 and 45's seiyuu were also really fit, the golden arrow shooting scene were also awesome. Sadly, the emotional Eva-Beatrice-Hideyoshi moment aren't that good. Well, good job DEEN, keep up the good work ! |
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| I liked it, I wonder how will Beato do later =O |
| Siestas ftw. Disappointed with Rudolf and Kyrie's duels, it was epic during the sound novel runs and got watered down a bit here. I guess the gunshot is kinda weak compared to the one they used in the game. |
Dark_Requiem said: No, I come to the conclusion that suspect might have changed is not because both Rosa and Genji died at all. (it was actually the other way around if you read ep14 discussion :-) ) Whether or not they die, has little meaning to this.I think that your thoughts on Rosa being the culprit of the 2nd arc might be clouding your judgments on there being a different main killer this arc (when I started reading EP3 of the VN I had the same thought process; if Rosa and Genji are dead it is probably a different killer) . I mean no one has the real answer to who the culprit is, but I see Ryukishi trying to make 1 person the blatantly obvious killer in an attempt to lead us to the wrong conclusions. The only noticeable difference between the killings and the epitaph is the 2nd twilight where in this arc a mother-daughter relationship was killed not a lover relationship. Though the epitaph says "the two who are close" so it still follows it (though I actually believe Eva was the culprit for just this twilight) Its the difference of these murders in this arc. The fatal wound and far more importantly, the place where the corpse are found are what matter. If you think about how those 6 bodies were found earlier this arc (6 death in 6 different locked rooms) or how Jessica was found dead in a locked room where seemingly no on could have entered or so on... All earlier murders (as far as I can recall) have the very obvious intent to give the impression that "this impossible for human". (ep13 discussion again :-) ) But this is different in recent murders. Maria and Rosa were found in the garden while the 3 adults were found in the main hall of the house, where theres thousands of possibilities for a human to enter. Anyone could access these places (Garden, House), theres just no mystery behind it. Its in fact telling the survivors that there murderer among them, and I think this could have never happened to the previous culprit we knew from 1st and 2nd arc. Plus the fact how they were wounded/killed: Maria was strangled, the 3 adults were shot. None of these can make the slightest hint to the existence of witch. |
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| Somewhere between an ok and bad episode. There wasn't much to take out of this episode except that the killing is more erratic, and Kyrie's little scene with Envy which seemed totally worthless. There was a follow up with the red words regarding Rosa and Maria's death that I felt Battler should have addressed. Ronove said they were killled by "other people." I wonder if that's a translation error, or if this shows that there indeed are two different factions of killers. I also feel like what happened in the main house is a bit indicative of this. That 3 people who got killed (two of which are married and have guns) got killed kind of makes me feel like there was a fourth person who evened up things for Hideyoshi. But then I honestly don't think Rudolph and Kyrie are involved in the murders, so I'm also inclined to think another accident happend. This is just a mess arc, that so far doesn't fit with the previous games, so I not sure to even take much of this to heart besides the emphasis on Eva. |
noteDheroOct 15, 2009 12:19 PM
| As an adaptation this was probably one of the best episodes so far. Well paced, good music and they knew what needed to be cut and what didn't. On another topic, is it for sure that Banquet will be 7 episodes? With the pacing of it so far I'm starting to think that 8 episodes for banquet and 7 for alliance might be possible. Unless of course the airing schedule already has episode 18 as a "mate" episode. |
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| Ehhhh so Eva Beatrice ends up being some brat who's all "i got me da magic stick". Well at least Battler's parents went out with a semi-bang and we finally got to see these Siesta girls. |
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Wattson said: . On another topic, is it for sure that Banquet will be 7 episodes? With the pacing of it so far I'm starting to think that 8 episodes for banquet and 7 for alliance might be possible. Unless of course the airing schedule already has episode 18 as a "mate" episode. Yes, we know for sure it will be 7 episodes. I'm scared that the last episode will be super rushed again |
| Yeah, I was clinging to my 8 episode theory so I didn't have to worry about that. Now I'm scared its going to be super rushed too. VN reader rant |
WattsonOct 15, 2009 12:28 PM
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noteDhero said: Kyrie's little scene with Envy which seemed totally worthless. If anything, that's the most important piece of information the episode gave. Battler isn't Kyrie's son, he's Asumu's Kyrie has another side to her that's not calm. 18 years of pent up envy and hatred. noteDhero said: This is just a mess arc, that so far doesn't fit with the previous games That's kind of the point. The letters stopped appearing, they aren't closed room mysteries, the victims aren't killed in fancy ways. Strangulation and gunshots. It heavily implies that it's not the same person. Something else that's strange. Why did they risk going to the mansion? Food is important, but not that important. They could have easily gone a day without eating much. |
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Wattson said: Yeah, I was clinging to my 8 episode theory so I didn't have to worry about that. Now I'm scared its going to be super rushed too. VN reader rant |
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Wattson said: |
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MarthX said: If anything, that's the most important piece of information the episode gave. Battler isn't Kyrie's son, he's Asumu's Kyrie has another side to her that's not calm. 18 years of pent up envy and hatred. To me, it's not important because there's nothing to really do with it. It doesn't seem like she holds any resentment to Battler or Rudolf, and by extension his family, but then again, she hasn't been focused on so that's why I said "seemed." And we already knew that she wasn't Battler's mother, I believe that got squared off either in the introductions or within the first couple of episodes. He's called her "Kyrie," and not "mom." That's kind of point. The letters stopped appearing, they aren't closed room mysteries, the victims aren't killed in fancy ways. Strangulation and gunshots. It heavily implies that it's not the same person. Something else that's strange. Why did they risk going to the mansion? Food is important, but not that important. They could have easily gone a day without eating much. And that would be another problem I have with the show if there are separate killers for each game. Then there really is no point of thinking about the show as a whole (since you can't carry anything over from one game to the next), and that would also just leave the real murders solely as an excuse to do these games. On the other hand, if there are two different factions and the games show different outcomes of the battle, then there's more leeway. I think the bigger question is why, if they decided that they needed food, did they not all go together? Someone had just proposed that the killer was someone that Rosa could let her guard down with, and yet they decided to send three people out to the main house. I was immediately reminded of the wolves and sheep game. |
francismeunier said: My head hurts and I would really want someone to explain me something: what is the whole talking about the traveler/north wind/sun thing. My heads hurt thinking about it and can't understand it. I do understand Battler not believing that a cruel witch exists and challenge but the rest is a no to understanding. I'll explain as wikipedia doesn't really explain what it means. The Sun represents love and care, kindness, etc.. The North Wind is brutal and harsh. So the meaning is that forcing someone to admit or do something doesn't always work, whilst love and care does. |
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| The first twilight had letters and was a closed room. I think the normal culprit (the one involved in all the previous arcs) was killed and someone else took over. The new culprit is following the epitaph but isn't making the murders look like the work of a witch. |
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| Great episode! I'm really enjoy how Beatrice is changing. As silly as this sounds, I think it'd be sweet if at the very end of all this Battler and Beatrice end up together. |
(Almost) 13 years on MAL! ()__() (='.'=) (")_(") |
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