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Anime Stats
Days: 83.4
Mean Score: 6.47
  • Total Entries275
  • Rewatched0
  • Episodes5,047
Anime History Last Anime Updates
Monster
Monster
Oct 22, 1:18 AM
Completed 74/74 · Scored 10
Death Note
Death Note
Sep 27, 1:11 AM
Completed 37/37 · Scored 9
Yuu☆Yuu☆Hakusho
Yuu☆Yuu☆Hakusho
Sep 3, 7:38 AM
Completed 112/112 · Scored 8
Manga Stats
Days: 10.3
Mean Score: 9.40
  • Total Entries10
  • Reread0
  • Chapters1,692
  • Volumes138
Manga History Last Manga Updates
Vinland Saga
Vinland Saga
Jul 25, 1:58 AM
On-Hold 184/? · Scored 9
Grand Blue
Grand Blue
Jul 14, 11:27 PM
Reading 68/? · Scored 9
Berserk
Berserk
Jul 14, 11:27 PM
On-Hold 358/380 · Scored 10

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All Comments (18) Comments

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Bayek 4 hours ago
The fixation on my yandere comment is getting tiresome. Before this gets absolutely autistic, I'll just say that it's possible for Mikasa to care about other characters AND still have intensely one-sided feelings for Eren. Yes, she has reasons and many of them are valid. However, her dedication & fixation on Eren was very clearly established as being somewhat delusional. Ironically, that's what I actually liked about her character. It's when the romance started getting pushed in as a serious plot point that I became critical of it. Namely because just like other prominent battle shounen authors, Isayama doesn't know how to do it.

Let's be real, there were dozens of other ways to let Historia and other characters fade into the background as we segued into the next major arc. There were plenty of options between the time skip to come up with something better. I've always found AoT to be more story driven than character, so I wouldn't have had much of a problem if she had just bowed out quietly. It was the deliberate decision to bait us with that red herring and then split people into shipping debates that made it easily the worst part of AoT by & large.

What's worse is when people start debating whether Mikasa x Jean is healthy for her as a woman or not. The priorities for good storytelling & character building are so far gone on that one.

It's been a while since we started discussing AoT, so I'll just clarify by saying that I'm not an "ending hater." I'd say the final arc was decent albeit that's very disappointing for something that I was a diehard fan of up until it. I only picked up the manga because I'd finished Final Season P1 convinced that Attack on Titan had become my all time favorite anime/manga/everything period.
Bayek Yesterday, 4:56 AM
Sure, you're making valid points and I think from a thematic point of view, you're not wrong. The problem is that you're citing everything that happens after 123 - the part of the story that I am fundamentally dissatisfied with. Everything from Hange's Hollywood "I'll hold them off!" to conveniently making the final battle the lowest stakes moment in the series are a culmination of my many grievances where the thrill of AoT began to lose its edge. What transpired makes sense, it just wasn't that good compared to the buildup.

Well actually, Mikasa clearly snapped and attacked Levi because he smacked Eren. The nitpicking is getting pretty ridiculous. Calling Mikasa borderline yandere was intentionally facetious, but it doesn't negate the overall track record of her one-sided obsession with him. This is like saying that Sakura's crush on Sasuke was serious, well developed romance just because she kept saying she loved him despite her only serious interaction with him was as a fangirl.

Also, many of AoT's characters are based off various tropes & archetypes found in manga/anime. Levi is based off of BL archetypes that are popular with yaoi fangirls, hence his insane popularity with the ladies. That doesn't mean he was literally gay and I commend Isayama for the subtle hints of his relationship with Petra.

I'm really only going to say it one more time - supporting the pregnancy subplot doesn't make someone an "EreHisu" fan or an EH shipper. And with how it was handled, I actually would have preferred if it had been scrapped altogether. AoT was better off without sex or romance as a whole and I think I've abundantly reiterated this point.
Bayek Oct 24, 2:32 PM
Yeah, but the power of love literally resolves the final battle. Ymir breaks the 2,000 year titan curse because of EM. It's coherent for what it's worth, but very poorly planned and ultimately dulls the build up of much larger themes of fighting for survival that have been in the works since the start.

"I don't remember any "borderline Yandere" doing this."

- Mirai Nikki would like to have a word with you. Saying Mikasa possessed yandere attributes doesn't invalidate her feelings or cordon her off into one-dimensional tropes. It's just undeniable that she was violently possessive of Eren and this is seen numerous times when she gives Annie or Bert those insane death stares.

You're completely missing the point I'm making about Eren & Historia. Eren does not need to choose, love, marry or bond with Historia to impregnate her. Eren had two objectives - to protect Historia and to thwart the MPs attempt at seizing the power of the titans. If Eren knocked up Historia, the MPs would have had direct cause to move against him. However, if he covered it up under the premise of Historia having a liaison with a lover, then Historia is safe as Eren can make his next move.

That isn't shipping. That's an observation based off of the dozens of hints and foreshadowing that were directly pointing at this outcome. The only thing Farmer-kun does is make Historia conveniently irrelevant to the bigger picture, which was a poor choice. And again, that's not about choosing between Historia & Mikasa like it's the final season of Nisekoi. Both characters had far more potential and frankly both were squandered.

And for the record, it wouldn't take more than 10 minutes for Eren to knock Historia up.

Another thing you should understand is that while I don't wish suffering on characters I care about, a story like AoT obviously requires some degree of tragedy & pain. Saying things shouldn't have happened because it would hurt Mikasa's feelings or be toxic is just bad storytelling.
Bayek Oct 24, 2:54 AM
I fundamentally have two problems with EM:
1. It becomes too much of a driving force in the final arc. Any semblance of romance is too scarce to make believable and is nowhere near the caliber of foreshadowing & world building that AoT otherwise has lived up to.

2. Scenes like this one establish very early on the clear distinction between Eren's familial love for Mikasa as a sister vs Mikasa's one-sided, borderline yandere obsession with him.

Well as far as we know, Farmer-kun is an abusive bully who threw rocks at a little girl and became pensive when he realized how hot the queen had become. Look, I don't really care about the moral hypotheticals - that subplot was the opportunity of a lifetime and it was utterly squandered (likely because of shipping, ironically enough). Eren could have pumped & dumped Historia if it meant showing how diabolical his master plan was. I mean, let's be serious here. The guy gets his mother savaged, manipulates his father into going for absolute carnage & spits on his half-brother's life work as he asserts his authority to put Eldians at the top of the food chain. Yet here we are, debating which girl's hand he should have been more nervous to grab.

I don't mind continuing to discuss AoT, but I don't really feel like doing any in-depth takes or detailed analysis at this point. I might get in the mood during the final season, but I think I've made up my mind about it otherwise.
Bayek Oct 8, 10:26 PM
Unfortunately the page you linked is gone. My thoughts on shipping - AoT was better off without it. It didn't need cheap romance and any attempt at it fell flat. I didn't want EreHisu either albeit it's preferable if I'm forced to choose one. It was clear they had more chemistry throughout and the pregnancy subplot could have been infinitely more interesting if Yams wasn't afraid of incurring the wrath of EM fans.

But on a side note, EH is just more aesthetically pleasing. Titanfolk made me a fan of the fanart, at least.
WutIsDis Oct 4, 5:52 AM
Sorry for replying a month later since I was pretty busy during this time.

And to make it clear, I am not a fan of AnR theory so I don't think that would have been the ideal ending. Nor am I on the chaderen train.

I have several problems with the ending. Maybe I will find answers to them? Anyways...

First off all I think that the events in the last chapter were rushed. It can be fleshed out in the anime. Second I think that their are probably less plot holes in the ending. But the plot points were explained badly. For instance, in chapter 122, Ymir was moved by Eren's words. But in 139, she was actually moved by Mikasa, which didn't make sense to me. If she was moved by Mikasa's actions, why show the entire thing in 122? In 131, Eren's monologue was shown, which was proven false in 139. In 122, it was shown that Ymir realized that she was not a slave and she had her own free will. But in 139, it was shown that Ymir did all this so that she can understand a similar love. But how is Mikasa's love similar to Ymir's love? I don't get it either.

Also i don't understand how everybody instantly forgives Eren. Hadn't they realized it earlier that he was prepared to destroy the world for Eldia's sake? If they realized it and then thought that everybody's lives mattered, why did they forgive him in the ending?

I have complaints regarding Eren's character, most of which arise from not giving the complete explanation. What did that "I don't know I just wanted to do it" mean? Why exactly did he kill his mom? I also don't hate the crying Eren or his love for Mikasa, but why did Isayama, in the extra pages, drew that Mikasa had married? If he was going to draw it anyways, why make the last 2 chapters romance heavy? I dunno.

Lastly, I don't understand what is aot's central theme. I thought that it was that the paradisians were fighting this cruel world to utopia. But the last scene doesn't convey that "Fighting is eternal". It shows that "Paradis was destroyed and all the fighting was useless and Eren should have rumbled 100%". It is not a beautiful theme imo.

I think these are my major problems with the ending. I think this ending is very disappointing compared to aot. I don't hate it, as it is not utter trash or an eyesore, but i don't like it either. It is a 6/10 from me. AOT is still a great show tho.

Feel free to send me a reply, I would like to know any counterarguments or if I have missed anything.
KeyMovingForward Sep 15, 11:34 AM
I saw screenshots, but I did not go to it myself.
Bayek Sep 15, 6:29 AM
Yeah, I'm not going to say Eren's character was retconned, but the whole "fight for my nakama" angle really just didn't do it for me. I would rather have seen something along the lines of him being consumed by the attack titan's memories & drive for freedom. There was certainly a precedent for it during S3P2 where he was starting to lose his own sense of self.

The Mikasa - Ymir connection makes sense for what it's worth, but I just found it poorly managed and doubly so in its execution. I've rewatched the anime half a dozen times and I loved being able to see how each intricate plot point carried through thoughtfully in each step of the journey. Even months later, I don't see that being the case with the final arc barring fan interpretations that kinda sorta make it work out in hindsight. I won't outright reject the thematic value at play, but there were clearly issues with the direction the finale took that even an anime-only such as myself was able to sense immediately on the day the manga ended.
Alvacka97 Sep 7, 4:14 PM
Let me tell you a little fact about Aerosmith224: He's a coward who'll delete your comments if you call out his bullshit or make fun of him, it hurts his fragile ego, he's done that with me and plenty others. He loves to dish it out, but runs away when others do the same to him. He also has no conviction on his own ideals and opinions.

My advice: Don't bother trying to reason with that waste of skin
RealKurapikaTard Sep 2, 12:04 AM
Fact#1: Eren's failure to protect everyone (I'm not Yeagerist even if he had won it would've been Controversial)

Fact#2: The whole Stockholm Syndrome thing is actually Lazy Writing because it's Origins is SEXIST (I'm not Feminist btw)

Fact#3: You're less than 15% Minority who defend the Ending
RealKurapikaTard Sep 1, 11:52 PM
Lmao OK
It was so Accurate Sarcastic 😂😂 cuz you can't change my Mind I've got enough facts
Bayek Aug 31, 7:08 AM
Well fan translation or not, I will pay to hear Reiner say "Eren, what a man you are!"

Yeah I feel like I've mellowed on the AoT hype for now. I'm not really as critical at the moment so I'll just have to see what happens when the final season drops next year. I'm planning to marathon the entire series a few days before the final episode drops. I still consider S3P2 the best part of the series and even if the ending had been a 1/10, it wouldn't take away from what that achieved.

Highly doubtful about dove ellen, but if he were a bird, this would be his outro: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uPWqEy-d8mY&ab_channel=hitomi-Topic

I have a vague theory about Eren, but it would only make sense if the Beren sequel meme really transpires. And I hope to Ymir that it does not. But only she knows.

Yeah I don't actually have a problem with Mikasa's character. I found her quite endearing. My issue is more with the direction she's taken towards the end as the parallels with Ymir feel heavily contrived.

That Eren character study is very well thought out and I strongly agree with the overarching idea of being enslaved to freedom. Gen Urobuchi does a phenomenal job at this type of notion in his works as he sets up highly idealistic characters for failure. This is what I mean when I say that I prefer Light Eren over Lelouch Eren - a tragic anti-hero who becomes consumed by ideals that set him up to lose everything else.
WutIsDis Aug 26, 11:47 AM
Thanks for sending the request! I am an SnK fan too.
KeyMovingForward Aug 5, 2:26 AM
All I will say is that we shall see.
KeyMovingForward Aug 4, 1:18 PM
That was a great thread. Eren's outward persona is one of the things that got him frequently misunderstood by the fanbase, and I'm glad to see people can recognize what exactly he represents. A greek tragedy is often a story where the hero falls because of one fatal flaw, and Eren's concept of freedom is precisely that. It's all in the text. Thanks for sharing.