Carole & Tuesday Episode 22 Discussion

MiiyoSon said:


I repeat Tobe is there to make sure that their songs are polished. He's not writing the songs or playing the instruments for them. That's C&T's job like we have seen through multiple different montages. This is a key part. I would agree with you if Tobe made them use AI like most artist in the show but that's not the case.




No. I don't. Gus is their music manager. His job is to make sure C&T's names get out there and to make sure that, since they decided that they wanted but money and freedom, they will be able to keep their creative freedom while earning as much as they can.

I Disagree

TheDopplerEffect said:


I don't know how else to explain it to you. If a story of two girls succeeding in music without any major problems sounds compelling to you, that's fine, there's nothing I can do about it. I explained why it isn't compelling to me.

MiiyoSon said:


They've had problems all throughout the first half of the show. From failing to keep a job for than two seconds to a failed music video to a failed first music festival to a failed attempt at dealing with an obsessed fan to even almost breaking up so I don't know how you came to the conclusion that they haven't struggled.
Playing a song 52 times to make sure it's right can't be easy bruh. Again we have seen multiple different montages of them struggling to come up with lyrics and melodies. On top of that the world they live in is starting to become more and more chaotic to the point where even they can sense that something is going to happen. And it's in close proximity too with Tuesday's very own mother spouting potentially dangerous rhetoric that could affect Carole in a huge way.

Did some of ya'll want C&T to feel some angst or something? That's definitely not needed IMO because they're main want and need in life was fulfilled when they first met. Ever since it's been hella fun just watching them interact. You're not going to tell me that Tuesday singing happy birthday to Carole, giving her a present, and Carole looking at it with tears of joy was not the sweetest thing that happened in this show. Especially considering that Carole probably has never been given a gift for her birthday ever in her life. This is super dope stuff.

This is just a differing opinion I know but at this point I've held my tongue long enough. This show's second half has been way too dope for me to not say anything anymore.

Even if this 7 minute miracle is wack, I can't bring myself to not at least gives this an 8/10.

TheDopplerEffect said:


They had it pretty easy when it comes to their careers, and that's what I was thinking we'd get more of. There's nothing wrong with the main leads and their interactions between one another, but I didn't find their journey to be anything interesting, to be honest.
The only reason I kept watching this after about episode 13, is to see wether the writer can actually tie all of the subplots together and for Angela's story. Hers I have no problems with whatsoever.
I'm not trying to hate on this show, I wanted it to be good. And it was good, for about half a season.

MiiyoSon said:


No they haven't as I just explained.
It's still good now though. Fantastic even.

TheDopplerEffect said:


They had it pretty easy when it comes to their careers, and that's what I was thinking we'd get more of. There's nothing wrong with the main leads and their interactions between one another, but I didn't find their journey to be anything interesting, to be honest.
The only reason I kept watching this after about episode 13, is to see wether the writer can actually tie all of the subplots together and for Angela's story. Hers I have no problems with whatsoever.
I'm not trying to hate on this show, I wanted it to be good. And it was good, for about half a season.

TheDopplerEffect said:

Are you not listening? They met a guy who set everything up for them. This is what I'm talking about when I say they have it easy. They did what he told them to do and got progressively more popular in a short span of a year.

Old_School_Akira said:



C&T didn’t have careers as easy as Angela did.

Tuesday is timid a got drunk on their 1st stage performance and the crowd hated them. Carole can't keep a job. C&T were both out of sync during the 2nd round of American idol arc because Tuesday isn't good at speaking up to people. Carole can't interact with her dad. They didn't sign the American idol contract so C&T had to work as indie artists. ertegun called their music generic without listening to it first. they write their songs themselves too. Tobe calls their music shit most of the time. they were nobodies before

Angela had it very easy in the beginning. Angela was popular before she became a singer and was super confident. She was a star already before and Tao was helping her out. She didn't have to audition for American idol because she is already a celebrity. She won American idol and signed the contract. her song “breath again” was #1 on the billboard charts while C&T “army of 2” was #48. when ertegun(a big name artist) was a judge he said Angela would be the only artist he would want to collaborate with (which he did even when he was at C&T's house and used Carole’s keyboard ).
Edit: she won the Grammys too even if she couldn’t enjoy the win.

This and the part with the black_knight stalker was probably the 1st time Angela actually struggled.

MiiyoSon said:


Which is a manager's job. To get their names out there. At any point, C&T could of said "no get us a different gig" but Gus with the help of Roddy has been a dope manager for them most part. So why wouldn't they trust him?

TheDopplerEffect said:


Jesus, you're just walking me in circles right now.
Alright, metaphor time.
Suppose I decided to make a show about a guy with a lot of problems. The show is about him trying to solve those problems. Then, 3 episodes in, he meets a fairy with magic wand, who says that her duty is to to solve those problems with this here wand.Then she goes ahead and solves all of them. The rest of the season is just the protagonist sitting on the beach and drinking pina coladas. Sounds like a good story to you?
And if you try to complain about the fairy, I'm just gonna say "It makes sense, I mean that's what her role in the story is, she said as much herself"
This is of course an exaggeration, but I hope you can see my point now

TheDopplerEffect said:


I can't with you anymore. The fairy is Gus. He decides what the girls do to prove themselves, and hires a producer to ensure their music is good. If you don't find it boring, good. You do you. For me this is not fun to watch. Which is what I was saying all this time

Talim said:
Crystal is literally wearing the identical dress that Taylor Swift wore one year to the Grammy's. Looks a bit more sparkly in the anime but it's legit identical. Same shoes too, tho they're slightly cut off in the Crystal pic.

Merciless said:
The end with Angela....was not expecting that O_O

When Ertegun was talking about true friends, I thought he was talking about Tao but in terms of him and Angela. I guess we learned that he didn't care about Angela texting him for help.

And this doesn't feel anywhere close to the end of a story, don't know how they wrap this up in 2 episodes if there isn't going to be a 2nd season



Ugh i hope that Crystal isn't supposed to be a representation of Taylor. Already starting to dislike Crystal due to the thought of that now

shayed__ said:
huh I felt like this episode was lacking. C&T song was super blant but I guess that was on purpose to make Angela's performance stand out more, it makes sense I guess. But just in general things felt slightly off. Angela's performance could have been handled much better.

_MushiRock11_ said:


Angela's performance was meant to be a little down than her standards to get her recent hardships and mishaps across, I reckon.

shayed__ said:
What I meant was directorial wise. Not the performance the acting or the song but just the way they executed the scene

SouthRzVa said:
And by the way, Ertegun talking about true friends and naming Tao instead of my boy Roddy is pure bulllshit.

ttcchen said:


Roddy is the best bro. Ertegun has forgotten how much Roddy has helped him.
Or he could just be doing it for show because he's in public and he needs to say something about Tao

saengdao said:
woah i thought we were finally to the miraculous seven minutes but it took a twist real fast. the way the last five minutes of this episode was executed was amazing in a directorial stance, i love how this show is showing a darker side of music.
i like carole & tuesday, but now i'm more interested in angela's storyline

ShiningLion said:
There is so much in this episode that disturbed me. I was disgusted watching all the Mars celebrities sit there cracking political jokes and basically using Carole & Tuesday as puppets to try to push their political views when the girls don't even fully understand their place in that or why Crystal wanted them to sing that kind of song. I feel like the industry is using them, and it's irregardless of whether their political views are justified or not. It's just petty to sit there cracking political jabs at a candidate while people within their own industry like Angela were suffering through so much with no support (so ironic too since she's the new artist of the year and the talk of the industry), and of course there are seemingly victims of poverty and the political climate as well who aren't mentioned and don't have a voice. It really feels like it shows the privilege of celebrity elites to be able to sit at their fancy, elaborate awards shows in expensive clothing and make cracks about the world while outside people suffer. Meanwhile, Angela seems to have written her own song for the first time. It feels like a bit of a role reversal, where she was the one being used by the industry previously but now Carole and Tuesday are.

I don't know if the After the Fire was really meant to come off as having been truly inspirational or what we were supposed to feel. A big problem I have with this show is I often can't tell what it is we're supposed to be feeling. Were my feelings of disgust toward the elites intended? Or were we supposed to be moved and feel all these artists are inspiring the world? It's hard to, when in real life and in Hollywood there is so much hypocrisy and lip service. Anyway, the song was really generic and I didn't care for it. Angela's Light a Fire is more moving to me. Her performance on this episode was haunting and beautiful as well. I prefer it over C&T's.

And on that note, this really has become "The Angela Show". To me, it feels like Carole & Tuesday aren't even the main characters in regards to the show's writing. Angela is way more fleshed out as a character and has more believable and dynamic struggles. C&T just sort of float through everything with lots of luck, support, and coincidences on their side, and almost no consequences to them personally when they have failures. Everyone else around them gets hurt, but they rarely do, and when they do, it's resolved too quickly (like Cybele's attack or Valerie kidnapping Tuesday) or over something trivial (like Tuesday's poorly established crush on the reporter).

Idk what to think. I'm not expecting a lot from the ending, but I am very glad the show has shifted to focus so much on Angela because she has been the most compelling character in this show since midway through the first arc. I clapped when she won the award. She deserves it. I do still hope that in the end she becomes friends with C&T and collaborates with them. I get what C&T are supposed to represent: hope, new energy, creativity, faith in yourself, ability to inspire others, etc. but as characters they are still so stereotypical and not as complex as ones like Angela.

I've been predicting the 7 Minute Miracle will also involve Angela in some way as a plot twist, but now that she's laid up I don't know. I also predict that the final episode's title will be "Imagine" by John Lennon, or something similar. Just throwing out some guesses. I REALLY can't wait for this show to end b/c so much of the messaging has felt vague or gray that I want to know where they're going with all this

P.S. Lol Keanu Reeves cameo