| Anime got the viking burial it deserved. Now we just need to learn to accept its bastard son. |
I'm also filled with pure-hearted ulterior motives. |
| this answers it ANN said: It used to be, back in the 80s when Japan was flush with money, a company would just decide to make a one- or two-part OAV. They'd throw a few hundred thousand dollars at an animation production company, and the production company would haphazardly churn out an OAV. They'd release it on video, a few thousand rental shops across Japan would buy copies, and the show would turn a tidy profit. Or if a longer series seemed possible, the TV networks would pay most of the cost, and support the show with commercials. Those days are long gone. The collapse of Japan's bubble economy hit the rental market hard, and media companies stopped feeling so adventurous about making direct-to-video content. The TV networks also drastically cut the number of shows they're willing to spend money on, since most anime don't bring in ratings, and it's far cheaper for them to just make another cheap talk show. So, in the early 90s, anime producers faced a challenge: how would they keep getting investment to make new shows? The answer, it turns out, was to join forces with other companies, and form what's called "Production Committee," or Seisaku Iinkai. The producer meets with other companies that could also benefit from a show being made, and tries to convince them to chip in. http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/feature/2012-03-05 TL;DR japan entered economic slowdown so TV channels/networks can no longer fund anime on their own |
| I like anime as it is now with the exceptions being the neutered mcs and bad LN adaptations, and both are often related to each other, I don't want a neutered male lead, anime needs real men who live right not a man that acts like a woman more than the women. |
 |
Rametheus said: Holybaptiser said: I do not think so, unlike cinema and literature where there are some titles from the past held in very high regard, analyzed even today, and known by almost everyone whilst the average fan only read/watch the popular stuff that's made to sell, anime has no such thing. Everyone knows Shakespeare, but not everyone knows Evangelion.Anime got the viking burial it deserved. Now we just need to learn to accept its bastard son. English writer and his work is taught in school vs. a 26 episode Japanese cartoon. It's just saturated with less than innovative titles, but you can only know that by looking at from the inside. Just like you can think French cinema is great but you only name a couple titles because the rest are shit. |
| did you mean: Death of Creativity & Innovation Within the MAL Forums although I guess that ^ already started happening a long time ago |
 |
Rametheus said: However, after anime went digital in the 21st century, creativity along with quality went down the drain. -Adapts generic light novels and mangas most of them are ads, and they are only booming -Instead of being about quality, anime is made to pander through wish fulfillment i fail to see corelation between quality and wish fullfillment. isn't entertainment medium is wish fullfillment to begin with? -the influx of harems, ecchi, high school anime, and edgy shounen that tries to be smart Go Nagai laugh at this statement. anime this days are soo pussy. -Everything is now done in moe style older shows even have bigger eyes. especaly 80's. glad we now also get big iris -Male characters are now feminine, and aimed at a market that wants homosexuality, and the "trap" stuff where males look and act like females nice, now i don't see exagrated muscle everywhere, also asian not really like big body to begin with -Characters are usually the same tropes with different color pallettes as difference you can put old charater on most type charater nowdays. they are more series made = more charater made= more similiarity -There's almost no variety in art style, but visuals are used to cover up bad-writing just go with this season, you can enjoy scifi-ish style (dimension w) until showa style (eresed and showa ganroku rakugo shinju -Slice of lifes about about are started being made they are always like that since long time ago. ask sazae-san for answer -Dumbed down shows for cheap entertainment anime is entertainment medium to begin with, one of the way showing it is stupidity -Quantity over Quality more people = more sorce = more competition = more shows people change, industry change, that's how the world works. deal with it or leave. |
 "If taking responsibility for a mistake that cannot be undone means death, it's not that hard to die. At least, not as hard as to live on." |
| The only good thing about old anime is that they're almost entirely hand drawn and look very fluid, regardless of the visual quality. Whereas nowadays it's all CG and cheap panning shots to pad out the episode, in spite of technological advancements. |
| The anime industry was going fine until Haruhi blew up and changed everything. |
| Remind me of this topic yesterday. http://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=1478642&show=0 Most people here don't paid for anime. If you don't like modern anime, then you should quit watching anime. Anime industry is actually growing more than ever. http://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=1421080 Anime industry is growing and not declining. Just because you don't like something or you think it's bad, doesn't mean other people think it's bad. Just quit being anime fan and you will make your life better.How to make anime good again or perhaps should I say how can you make anime industry create anime that is consider good by your standard is by buying the anime bluray/dvd that you think is good. You don't have the right to complain if you do not paid for it. Moe, ecchi, special school, harem, SoL anime does help the industry generate money. According to Youku, a Chinese streaming website, Musaigen no Phantom World is currently the most viewed anime in 2016. http://www.youku.com/v_olist/c_100_a_%E6%97%A5%E6%9C%AC_r_2016_s_1_d_4.html Here are other top viewed anime in Youku in previous years. 2015 http://www.youku.com/v_olist/c_100_a_%E6%97%A5%E6%9C%AC_r_2015_s_1_d_4.html 2014 http://www.youku.com/v_olist/c_100_a_%E6%97%A5%E6%9C%AC_r_2014_s_1_d_4.html Absolute Duo, Seiken no World Break and Trinity Seven are among those most viewed anime in Youku and I believe Youku is a legitimate streamers where anime industry get money from it. There is NOTHING you can do to change it unless you decided to pour money into it. No amount of complain in MAL or youtube reviewer such as thatanimesnob will change the industry. |
ZapredonFeb 2, 2016 10:36 PM
But it's important to remember that a movie review is subjective;it only gives you one person's opinion. http://www.classzone.com/books/lnetwork_gr08/page_build.cfm?content=analyz_media&ch=30 It doesn't matter if you like LoGH,Monster etc.If you are a jobless or college/school dropout living in your mom basement, you are still an unintelligent loser. Taste in anime does not make you a better person.If elitist don't exist, casual pleb and shit taste also don't exist. |
| Lmao, anime fans become more and more similar if not exactly the same already with wrestling fans. Wrestling fans :"#PG-era sucks bring #Attitude-era back" in every forum about wwe. Anime fans:"Today anime suck full of ecchi harem bullcrap bring back the gud ol days back!" in every anime discussion forum. Its quite mind-boggling how people can't just suck it up or just leave it already if he thinks the industry has fallen that bad. |
 |
tr1ckst3r said: Lmao, anime fans become more and more similar if not exactly the same already with wrestling fans. Wrestling fans :"#PG-era sucks bring #Attitude-era back" in every forum about wwe. Anime fans:"Today anime suck full of ecchi harem bullcrap bring back the gud ol days back!" in every anime discussion forum. Its quite mind-boggling how people can't just suck it up or just leave it already if he thinks the industry has fallen that bad. Its the same thing with video games as well. For eg, old final fantasy gamers can't accept that the newer final fantasy games are not turn base anymore. Technology has improved and trend has change, its either you adapt to these changes or move on to something else. |
| You don't have to watch anime. Just watch older stuff if you don't like new stuff. Anime producers are mostly targeting Japanese children and teenagers. You are not part of this demographic and have no reason to complain. I personally enjoy modern anime, but if you don't then you don't have to go on about it. There are modern American TV shows that will likely interest you more. |
  |
| Just my 2 cents I bet people from the 80's said the same shit that you're saying OP like "animu from the 80's sucks, 50's animus are the best" or be like "80's animu sucks, animu from the stone age are the best" like seriously if you're actually confident in your taste in anime, you wouldn't feel the need to express that kind of bullcrap and just shove it on everyone's faces. |
MizunashiFeb 2, 2016 10:56 PM
 |
OP said: Male characters are now feminine, and aimed at a market that wants homosexuality I approve of this :^) But seriously, there's actually less BL/Yaoi/Shounen-Ai shows now compared to before which is pretty odd. Also, at the "more feminine" thing, please look at the entire shoujo/BL timeline. If anything, the designs are getting better and more real looking.  |
MayukaFeb 2, 2016 11:05 PM
| This thread is basically "I like old anime but not new anime, so therefore the industry is dying!!!!" I disagree with you OP. While it's true that new anime aren't as creative, don't go around and pretend like old anime were all creative and innovative. All animes draws their inspiration from somewhere, even the old ones, not to mention there have been plenty of new shows that were successful/popular both in JP and the west. |
 |
| Honestly, buy the blu-rays of the anime you like and hope for the best |
 |
| I can't agree with this. Sure there are those 'generic' animes that just seem to have a repeat every season, however there are ones that are fresh and interesting. I'm sure you'd like examples but I'm too lazy to list them. Besides it's all up to opinion in the end. |
 |
| wow i've never seen this type of thread before... oh well, at least this time it wasn't made by someone who has seen only like 10 shows |
 |
Rametheus said: However, after anime went digital in the 21st century, creativity along with quality went down the drain. -Adapts generic light novels and mangas -Instead of being about quality, anime is made to pander through wish fulfillment -The influx of harems, ecchi, high school anime, and edgy shounen that tries to be smart -Everything is now done in moe style -Male characters are now feminine, and aimed at a market that wants homosexuality, and the "trap" stuff where males look and act like females -Characters are usually the same tropes with different color pallettes as difference -There's almost no variety in art style, but visuals are used to cover up bad-writing -Slice of lifes about about are started being made -Dumbed down shows for cheap entertainment -Quantity over Quality Not all new anime is bad, there are always exceptions, but modern anime as a whole is collectively getting worse. How can anime be good again? What caused anime to change so much? Is it the shift in viewerbase, where the new generation enjoys being pandered to and doesn't do much thinking because of technology? Is anime now made to appeal to a more liberal mindset in current society? What do you think of this issue as a whole? Discuss. According to your profile you watched an absolute fuck ton of anime. Though with a mean score of under 4 it makes me wonder why? Like idgaf bout this thread topic cuz' it's been beaten to death harder than the creativity in the anime industry. I just want to know why? Why do you continue to watch anime (you claim 1200+ series) if you hate 95% of it? Everything gets shittier over time, it's called reality. As long as there is a medium where I can watch cute girls doing cute things and contemplate my existence by watching Makoto Shinkai films I'm happy. |
RozenAquaMarine said: Just my 2 cents I bet people from the 80's said the same shit that you're saying OP like "animu from the 80's sucks, 50's animus are the best" or be like "80's animu sucks, animu from the stone age are the best" like seriously if you're actually confident in your taste in anime, you wouldn't feel the need to express that kind of bullcrap and just shove it on everyone's faces. this is silly too. what does confidence in your taste have to do with expressing problems? |
Mayuka said: did you call holier than thou bitch right here last.fm |
| I said what I have to say about this in here: http://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=1478642&show=0 |
| Anime is fine as it is today, for me last year was one of the best years in anime overall so I got nothing to complain about. Also Shingeki no Kyojin 2nd will save anime. |
| I guess I disagree...sure, fanservice has gotten more extreme and prominent in a lot of anime, but that sexualisation is the same with literally every medium nowadays. I hate to say it, but sex really does sell; all industries have to evolve with the times and the anime industry struggles as is. So yes, there has been an increase in ecchi/fanservice anime, but that does not mean there has been a death of innovation in the anime industry! Many may disagree, but I don't necessarily believe anime was better years ago- there were good and bad anime then, and there are good and bad anime now. You only have to watch more recent anime like Death Parade, Fate/Zero, Psycho-Pass, Yuri Kuma Arashi, Zankyou no Terror etc. as well the the currently airing Boku Dake no Inai Machi to see that anime is still creative and innovative. I think a lot of people look back on shows from the '80s and '90s that are considered classics and hold them in high regard because during the time they aired they were genre defining. Perhaps in another ten years, anime that aired in recent years will be held in the same regard to newer fans. |
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
keragamming said: Its the same thing with video games as well. For eg, old final fantasy gamers can't accept that the newer final fantasy games are not turn base anymore. Technology has improved and trend has change, its either you adapt to these changes or move on to something else. Real-time RPGs have been possible since my PC started being able to run RPGs at all, which was like 20 years ago. Did you know the Elder Scrolls line was real-time from its start in 1994? Might and Magic line of games was turn-based from 1986, and its latest release is still turn-based in 2014. Turn-based RPGs exist for a reason. They are for the people who prefer chess over basketball. CapitalistGod said: I said what I have to say about this in here: http://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=1478642&show=0 And I said my words here: http://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=1478642&show=50#msg44540719 MAL has its own seasonal chart: http://myanimelist.net/anime/season Besides looking for a fresh anime to watch, it's really good at seeing the true picture of the shows which happen in a season: there are all sorts of shows. Right now, the top ones are: a mysterious show; a show about school and supernatural battles and girls; a slow-paced fantasy adventure in a game-like world; a comedy show; a strategic show about JSDF doing to a fantasy country the same things USA does to near-east countries; a sci-fi detective show. In short, there is still plenty of variety in anime, and there are still experimental, unusual and artsy works. |
FCT77 said: I also dont understand the point of saying that "originals were made", like, does that matter at all? What i want is something good i dont care the source material for it. Basically, anime-originals are better adapted to anime format than adaptations are. Visual novels of the dating sim variety are particularly infamous for being adapted into ill-conceived harems as the authors try to cram multiple mutually-exclusive timelines into an anime's linear timeline. |
umashikaneko said: j0x said: TL;DR japan entered economic slowdown so TV channels/networks can no longer fund anime on their own More like there is no reason that to put money on anime because they become lower ratings. Market wise ad revenue is almost flat in late-90s to 00s and the pure budget wise,anime is pretty cheap compared with live-action drama,just anime viewer rating got into slump because of aging society so no reason to air primetime except programs still can earn high viewer ships or toy-selling anime. ye that too, anime is targeted at young audiences but japan has a aging population and not much old people watch anime there now a days |
| You know what I've notice is that you guys complain about how modern anime sucks, but yet you guys eat it all up. And watch all the modern anime and also watch all the ovas,movies, spinoff and specials for those modern series as well. I understand that some people are completionist, but to go out of your way to watch all the fairy tail specials, movies, ova ect is another thing. Obviously it shows that you have some interest in modern anime. if modern anime was that bad as you claim I don't think you would be so in to it. @Flannan the turnbase fanbase for final fantasy isn't as big anymore, plus they want the new final fantasy series to be more appealing for people that don't like turnbase game. Basically they are trying to win over new fans to get into the final fantasy franchise by not using turnbase system. This is a business after all, there main goal is to make more money. People generally don't like changes. Everything should be the same all the time. |
keragammingFeb 3, 2016 12:37 AM
| It's impressive how much bullshit you managed to fit in one post OP I hope one day I can be a great shitposter like you. |
 |
keragamming said: You know what I've notice is that you guys complain about how modern anime sucks, but yet you guys eat it all up. And watch all the modern anime and also watch all the OVAs, movies, spinoff and specials for those modern series as well. People generally don't like changes. Everything should be the same all the time. Agreed. It is funny that some of us just constantly complained how the some of the modern anime seemed mediocre in their eyes when there are some of the old anime that felt mediocre as well. They just forget the bad ones and remembered the good ones (to be specific, any animated series that have Western influence... which is something we don't see often in modern anime, which most of them are oriented towards Japanese audience due to their culture being explored by those shows). It is quite funny too that despite while they do complain, they are still watching modern anime even if they will expect that most of them will be mediocre in the end. To be honest, one solution for that matter for those people: quit watching anime and find a new hobby, like making an anime out of your ideal storyline. -- Also, I am wondering what do you mean by 'actual good novels' (for older anime), OP? Have you actually read those novels then to judge that they are good or better than those novels that have anime adaptations among modern anime shows? |
Frankies_MonsterFeb 3, 2016 1:26 AM
FCT77 said: flannan said: Basically, anime-originals are better adapted to anime format than adaptations are. Visual novels of the dating sim variety are particularly infamous for being adapted into ill-conceived harems as the authors try to cram multiple mutually-exclusive timelines into an anime's linear timeline. I wasnt particularly thinking of visual novels but, it seems you are talking more of a bad adaptation than adaptations in general. I dont play visual novels but from what i have heard Clannad, Kanon and Steins Gate are good VN adaptations, its depends on the director and not only for VA´s but for every adaptation. Kanon did suffer from this flaw. It is good because the original was good, but its composition is the same pointless mashup of different routes. I'm not sure if Steins; Gate was even a dating sim. But those are not the only kinds of source material that suffers in adaptation, just the most infamous one. There are also fillers for long-running anime, anime stretched (Rokka no Yuusha) or cramped (Ichiban Ushiro no Daimaou) to fit into 12 or 24 episodes, anime censored to hell (Mahou Sensei Negima and Kodomo no Jikan), anime adapted from light novels which contain more long-winded explanations than fast-paced action (SAO)... |
| Here's an idea. If you can produce a research or a paper that proves it, some study that shows the past used to be so much better I'll believe you. |
| WEAPONS - My blog, for reviews of music, anime, books, and other things |
| I will not deny that anime from the 90s to mid 2000s is a lot different from the majority of stuff there is now. Just watching an episode of Bebop can show that. BUT I do think it's starting to get somewhat better. Shows like Death Parade, Terror in Resonance, Junketsu no Maria, Gatchaman Crowds, Kekkai Sensen, Gakkou Gurashi, Rage of Bahamut, etc have all shown that creative force is moving in a good direction in the industry (hopefully). |
amk_2397Feb 3, 2016 4:26 PM
 |
| Animu needs more MOE like K-ON! or animu that can make a good atmosphere! Deep? Pretentious? Oh cmon, EVERYTHING IN ANIMU IS PRETENTIOUS!! Stop sayin that one animu was pretentious while others not!! Animu itslf is an escapism from our work, so wish fulfulment shows are the best to save our stress! Anyone that disagree with me wanted to just stressed themselves until the point of suicide. K-ON is objectively better than LoGH. |
YouFeb 3, 2016 2:38 AM
 |
| I have not watched old anime and don't intend to do it, so I can't compare. Anyway, the decreasing of the innovation is totally clear. The industry is not dying, I think they are really happy with this situation. Writers don't even need to think, just write something safe (cliched, ecchi, harem, stereotypes) and wait the money. "In declining cultures, wherever the decision comes to rest with the masses, authenticity becomes superfluous, disadvantageous, a liability." Friedrich Nietzsche |
| Duuuuudeeeeee do you even watch prehistoric anime bruh? Paleolithic Era was the peak of the wall carving anime industry. Studio Neanderthal was the best! But no one appreciates them cause they're all watching all of those sh*t A.D. shows. |
| “Humankind cannot gain anything without first giving something in return. To obtain, something of equal value must be lost. That is alchemy's first law of Equivalent Exchange. In those days, we really believed that to be the world's one, and only, truth. But the world isn't perfect, and the law is incomplete..." -Alphonse Elric "Then and now, what I protect has never changed!" -Sakata Gintoki I'll take anything like The Pet Girl of Sakurasou. Anything as good as that. |
Rametheus said: Anime was at its height between the years of 1980 and 2000, the greatest anime were conceived during this period. -There were a greater variety of anime -The best directors were allowed much more creative freedom -Originals were being made -Actual good novels are adapted -Anime made during this time utilizes deep and relevant themes -Had its really bad stuff like the gore OVAs, but the renowned titles are deserving -Violence and sex are treated in a mature way to tell a good story -Lots of variety in art styles -Male characters look and act like males, and uphold male values -Shows actually required the input of your thinking -Quality over Quantity However, after anime went digital in the 21st century, creativity along with quality went down the drain. -Adapts generic light novels and mangas -Instead of being about quality, anime is made to pander through wish fulfillment -The influx of harems, ecchi, high school anime, and edgy shounen that tries to be smart -Everything is now done in moe style -Male characters are now feminine, and aimed at a market that wants homosexuality, and the "trap" stuff where males look and act like females -Characters are usually the same tropes with different color pallettes as difference -There's almost no variety in art style, but visuals are used to cover up bad-writing -Slice of lifes about about are started being made -Dumbed down shows for cheap entertainment -Quantity over Quality Not all new anime is bad, there are always exceptions, but modern anime as a whole is collectively getting worse. How can anime be good again? What caused anime to change so much? Is it the shift in viewerbase, where the new generation enjoys being pandered to and doesn't do much thinking because of technology? Is anime now made to appeal to a more liberal mindset in current society? What do you think of this issue as a whole? Discuss. THIS SHIT AGAIN! Why? Are you literally watching no shows? 1. Of course the directors were given creative freedom. No one knew what they were doing. They didn't even have to try hard. There was NO COMPETITION. Anime is a hard place to survive in. Everyone's trying to outdo one another and really really amazing anime are coming from it. 2. Fuck anime originals. Animators aren't story writers, most "Anime Originals" are the quality of Guilty Crown and "Chaos Dragon." Some of the best material in anime are adaptations. To Aru Hikuushiii No Koiuta is a great anime, based off of a LN. 3. Outside of Legend of Galactic Heroes what old anime novel adaptations were good? The future has Spice and Wolf and Durarara. 4. Violence and Sex was always shallow for the most part. We still get shows that treat violence and sexuality with respect like Gangsta, but old and new anime had fanservice moe anime, and hyper violent edgefests. 5. This complaining about male characters shit again. Male characters right now are fucking fantastic. They're usually either extremely interesting or flawed. Hitsugi no Chaika has a great male MC. Gundam IBO just came out with fantastic male characters. Rakudai Kishi's male character is also really good. Same with Taimadou and Erased, and I'm going to stop listing. Your argument is idiotic. 6. >Characters are usually the same tropes with different color pallettes as difference Old anime had no real memorable characters. They were so very samey, and when they were "unique" they stuck to tropes. Anime developed and they realized that to create memorable characters they had to dramatize certain elements of their characters and thus "created" tropes. One of the best old anime Space Battleship Yamato has the hotblooded character, the Kuudere, and the ditzy heroine trope in it. 7. >Quality over Quantity Have you actually looked at old seasons of anime? http://anichart.net/archive/fall-95 2 good shows aired that season. http://anichart.net/archive/fall-13 I enjoyed like 10 shows that season. |
| OP your thread couldn't be more bias, you just like older anime compared to the newer stuff. You don't have to write paragraphs to explain that. |
 |
| This is one of the dumbest post ever. Some of the stuff in that list is hilarious. "Violence and sex are treated in a mature way to tell a good story". "Male characters look and act like males, and uphold male values" "Anime made during this time utilizes deep and relevant themes" "Actual good novels are adapted' You have to be trolling. I can go to any year between 1990-and 2000 and prove you wrong. |
 |
Snappynator said: This thread is basically "I like old anime but not new anime, so therefore the industry is dying!!!!" I disagree with you OP. While it's true that new anime aren't as creative, don't go around and pretend like old anime were all creative and innovative. All animes draws their inspiration from somewhere, even the old ones, not to mention there have been plenty of new shows that were successful/popular both in JP and the west. Completely agree with this . Also Creativity was and still the same , if there are more shows then its more likely that there will be more bad shows as well . You just took the best from those 20 years and compared them to the new shows . I'm sure there was bad shows in that period , but people forgot about them . In short : You're Biased towards old anime . |
Rametheus said: so change = worse? no you are not. And I have my right to complain about it if the changes are for the worse. also you are not answer any of my argument. |
"If taking responsibility for a mistake that cannot be undone means death, it's not that hard to die. At least, not as hard as to live on." |
I will say this again. Anime are Commercial Advertisement instead of Medium telling a story. If you think 90`s era are the best then there are tons of bad anime are made like those 90`s OVA too. The good old anime in the past are the popular and memorable ones while the forgotten anime are the bad ones and the ones aimed at children. You can`t force japan to change the industry, if you do then they`ll laugh at you for being a Baka Gaijin. P.S. LOTGH Novel and Browser game is more popular than the anime in japan. |
| Do you play Azure Lane? Then please join my fanclub https://myanimelist.net/clubs.php?cid=74907 |
More topics from this board
Poll: » has the majority of people (here) seen the big 3 ? ( 1 2 3 )ame - Yesterday |
123 |
by ame
»»
14 minutes ago |
|
Poll: » Do you tend to watch newer seasonal shows, or older shows?Akuya - 2 hours ago |
8 |
by Rod7
»»
16 minutes ago |
|
Poll: » Hentai is the worst anime genre ever created. ( 1 2 )Alpha_1_Zero - 10 hours ago |
53 |
by Noelle43
»»
17 minutes ago |
|
» Characters that ya think are a Genderbent YouIpreferEcchi - Apr 15 |
28 |
by MyFriendIbis
»»
28 minutes ago |
|
» Why were children’s anime dubs so unappreciated?funtime43_tr - Today |
22 |
by Kirjath
»»
55 minutes ago |