| do u think suicide is right when u have a big fatal wound ? for example, your arm has been cut off and ur in the desert with no way out and no help u have a knife. i know its a bad example, but use your head, do u think suicide is right when u have a fatal wound under these circumstances do u think suicide is right? |
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| As long as you succeed, sure. |
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| you're gonna pass out and die from blood loss anyhow if your arm has been cut off. It shouldn't take all too long either. If you have no help, and are just lying there losing blood, you're gonna die either way if you commit suicide or not.I dont know if it would be right, but I dont see the problem of killing yourself about an hour or so before you actually die. Although, under that specific situation, I dont think suicide is the first thing that will go through a person's head? |
| Suicide is the coward's way out. |
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| The person has to know what direction of action is best. I would likely be too chicken to actually kill myself though I'm not below begging someone to do the job for me. So my answer is maybe. If we assume suicide is wrong, I'm willing to assume there are also circumstances which could make room for some pardon (i.e. If I was forced to kill someone important to me, I might choose to kill myself, or something of that nature.). |
| Suicide is suicide. I condone it because I'm sure I'll end up like that in due time. |
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Plun said: watIf you do suicide, I'll see you in Hell from Heaven. |
| some people might not wanna go through the pain and slow death of a fatal wound so thats were suicide comes in |
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| It's not about right or not right, you're gonna die anyway, nobody cares. |
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llxwarbirdxll said: mosdefind said: Some people might not wanna go through the pain of ETERNAL LIFE IN HELL. So that's where the not suicide comes in.some people might not wanna go through the pain and slow death of a fatal wound so thats were suicide comes in that depends only on the persons belief samurai's believed that suicide waz honorable their belief is in the bushido code it depends on the religion u follow |
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Itachi-san said: It's not about right or not right, you're gonna die anyway, nobody cares. I believe this is the most logical and informative answer, actually. |
mosdefind said: No it doesn't. God exists regardless of your faith.llxwarbirdxll said: mosdefind said: Some people might not wanna go through the pain of ETERNAL LIFE IN HELL. So that's where the not suicide comes in.some people might not wanna go through the pain and slow death of a fatal wound so thats were suicide comes in that depends only on the persons belief samurai's believed that suicide waz honorable their belief is in the bushido code it depends on the religion u follow |
LolitaDecay said: This is what a suicidal person afraid of one's own nature would say.Suicide is the coward's way out. Any way, seeing the human primal urge to stay alive and fear death, I fail to see the cowardice? It's simply the culmination of rationality and suppression of animal urges through ratio: - Things are most likely not going to get better. - Irrationally hoping them to get better will not enhance these chances. - More time you wait, more time wasted in pain. - What's the big omg about staying alive any way? Suicide is rationality. |
mosdefind said: llxwarbirdxll said: mosdefind said: Some people might not wanna go through the pain of ETERNAL LIFE IN HELL. So that's where the not suicide comes in.some people might not wanna go through the pain and slow death of a fatal wound so thats were suicide comes in that depends only on the persons belief samurai's believed that suicide waz honorable their belief is in the bushido code it depends on the religion u follow If you are in pain, it's because god thinks you deserve it. If you are going to die, it's because god thinks you deserve it. And of course, god is always right. I hope you finally understand why believing in god is such a relief. |
khorven said: LolitaDecay said: This is what a suicidal person afraid of one's own nature would say.Suicide is the coward's way out. Any way, seeing the human primal urge to stay alive and fear death, I fail to see the cowardice? It's simply the culmination of rationality and suppression of animal urges through ratio: - Things are most likely not going to get better. - Irrationally hoping them to get better will not enhance these chances. - More time you wait, more time wasted in pain. - What's the big omg about staying alive any way? Suicide is rationality. I'm just inspired to give my two cents, that's all, but I can't seriously see suicide unless things were bad. As in really bad.Like if you knew you were going to be taken to a concentration camp, or you would be tortured, or you would be used to hurt those important to you (in an unforgivable sense), you are going through unbearable physical suffering and that which will remain for the rest of your life, etc. Many people feel suicidal at some points in life and some seriously consider it (hell or not) but most people can endure the pain at the time and are likely to be able to find ways to cope and/or distance themselves from what they are going through. But in rare circumstances, one cannot escape...and in those circumstances...maybe. |
llxwarbirdxll said: mosdefind said: No it doesn't. God exists regardless of your faith.llxwarbirdxll said: mosdefind said: Some people might not wanna go through the pain of ETERNAL LIFE IN HELL. So that's where the not suicide comes in.some people might not wanna go through the pain and slow death of a fatal wound so thats were suicide comes in that depends only on the persons belief samurai's believed that suicide waz honorable their belief is in the bushido code it depends on the religion u follow thats what u believe but not everybody believes that god exists thats just the way people are its called free will free will to believe in anything and do anything |
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mosdefind said: llxwarbirdxll said: mosdefind said: No it doesn't. God exists regardless of your faith.llxwarbirdxll said: mosdefind said: Some people might not wanna go through the pain of ETERNAL LIFE IN HELL. So that's where the not suicide comes in.some people might not wanna go through the pain and slow death of a fatal wound so thats were suicide comes in that depends only on the persons belief samurai's believed that suicide waz honorable their belief is in the bushido code it depends on the religion u follow thats what u believe but not everybody believes that god exists thats just the way people are its called free will free will to believe in anything and do anything There is no such thing as free will, only destiny. Destiny is already decided by god, and we play in it's hands. |
LolitaDecay said: Suicide is the coward's way out. |
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mosdefind said: Who cares what everyone else believes? Like I said, God exists, regardless of what you think.llxwarbirdxll said: mosdefind said: No it doesn't. God exists regardless of your faith.llxwarbirdxll said: mosdefind said: Some people might not wanna go through the pain of ETERNAL LIFE IN HELL. So that's where the not suicide comes in.some people might not wanna go through the pain and slow death of a fatal wound so thats were suicide comes in that depends only on the persons belief samurai's believed that suicide waz honorable their belief is in the bushido code it depends on the religion u follow thats what u believe but not everybody believes that god exists thats just the way people are its called free will free will to believe in anything and do anything |
Chavez said: mosdefind said: llxwarbirdxll said: mosdefind said: Some people might not wanna go through the pain of ETERNAL LIFE IN HELL. So that's where the not suicide comes in.some people might not wanna go through the pain and slow death of a fatal wound so thats were suicide comes in that depends only on the persons belief samurai's believed that suicide waz honorable their belief is in the bushido code it depends on the religion u follow If you are in pain, it's because god thinks you deserve it. If you are going to die, it's because god thinks you deserve it. And of course, god is always right. I hope you finally understand why believing in god is such a relief. And you mostly illustrated the things that have made me want to stop believing in God completely or why I have a distant relationship at best. I also blame the doom and gloom fanatics. They made me consider suicide plenty of times. Don't worry, I blamed myself for breathing too many times to count in the name of humility and repentance. I'm glad I'm an unholy hedonist, now. Haven't had depression, physical sickness induced by anxiety, or an overly stick-in-the-ass attitude since. And life is fun. Imagine that. Most of my friends are Christian, though, but they are good chums and inspire me, too. I guess you could call me a jaded person of faith who has learned that caring too much isn't always wisdom or constructive to yourself and those around you. |
| .....I'm at loss of words 'cause this thread..... |
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Chavez said: mosdefind said: llxwarbirdxll said: mosdefind said: No it doesn't. God exists regardless of your faith.llxwarbirdxll said: mosdefind said: Some people might not wanna go through the pain of ETERNAL LIFE IN HELL. So that's where the not suicide comes in.some people might not wanna go through the pain and slow death of a fatal wound so thats were suicide comes in that depends only on the persons belief samurai's believed that suicide waz honorable their belief is in the bushido code it depends on the religion u follow thats what u believe but not everybody believes that god exists thats just the way people are its called free will free will to believe in anything and do anything There is no such thing as free will, only destiny. Destiny is already decided by god, and we play in it's hands. i dont believe in destiny i form my own destiny i believe in god but it doesn't mean i also believe in free will god doesn't even have a say in that |
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\Who cares what everyone else believes? Like I said, God exists, regardless of what you think. nobody cares but that still doesn't void what everybody else thinks |
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net_nomad said: No, I actually think that at the first sign of misfortune it's quite rational to commit suicide instantly. As some people didn't have it at that time. You are sub-average if you have a misfortune before a fortune. Better commit suicide then.khorven said: LolitaDecay said: This is what a suicidal person afraid of one's own nature would say.Suicide is the coward's way out. Any way, seeing the human primal urge to stay alive and fear death, I fail to see the cowardice? It's simply the culmination of rationality and suppression of animal urges through ratio: - Things are most likely not going to get better. - Irrationally hoping them to get better will not enhance these chances. - More time you wait, more time wasted in pain. - What's the big omg about staying alive any way? Suicide is rationality. I'm just inspired to give my two cents, that's all, but I can't seriously see suicide unless things were bad. As in really bad.Like if you knew you were going to be taken to a concentration camp, or you would be tortured, or you would be used to hurt those important to you (in an unforgivable sense), you are going through unbearable physical suffering and that which will remain for the rest of your life, etc. Many people feel suicidal at some points in life and some seriously consider it (hell or not) but most people can endure the pain at the time and are likely to be able to find ways to cope and/or distance themselves from what they are going through. But in rare circumstances, one cannot escape...and in those circumstances...maybe. I seriously do not get the dogma of 'try to stay alive at all costs', but seeing that humans are ultimately an evolved species, and not a designed one, this irrationality is of course explainable, but not defendable. Suicide is rationality. |
| khorven, are you trolling? |
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| My question is if you are in a desert how do you manage to get your arm cut off? I am against it, even under this circumstance there might be some hope of living on. When you commit suicide you must think of everyone you are leaving behind and how they feel. Suicide is a selfish act |
Esley said: khorven, are you trolling? It's entirely possible, but if he's serious, each to his own. I wouldn't be surprised if the World Bank is secretly trying to implement that sort of thinking on the misfortunate people of this world by their policies, but going on further would surely result in thread derailment. |
burntlettuce said: My question is if you are in a desert how do you manage to get your arm cut off? I am against it, even under this circumstance there might be some hope of living on. When you commit suicide you must think of everyone you are leaving behind and how they feel. Suicide is a selfish act it was just a example suicide may be selfish but its a solution |
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| I'm probably going to want to stay alive at all costs, simply because I have things in my life that I want to life for, and things that I want to do and see before I cease to exist. I like existing and breathing and all that fun stuff, thankyouverymuch. :3 But, at the same time, if I was severely injured and bleeding and dying, suicide would be the last thing from my mind. After all, I'm on death's doorstep anyways. As for "I just became a cripple/lost someone so I will commit suicide" type thing, well, I wouldn't. I'd find a way to get through it eventually. I may not be happy for a long time, but if I committed suicide I would never get the chance to be happy again, ever. I'd understand why people would want to die. I think it's their life and their business, as long as they understand the kind of consequences this will have on the people they leave behind. And when you're suffering from a chronic illness, I believe in the right to choose when to die, and the right to die painlessly, and with dignity. So if someone wants euthanasia, they should get it. Just IMO. As for God and after life and whatnot: I'm an agnostic, I guess. I can't rationally justify the existence of such things, but I hold the teeny tiny sliver of hope in my heart that they do exist, because if they do, then that's just really cool and awesome. :) |
     I am the senpai that notices you. |
Esley said: Nope. And ratio is on my side. There's no rational reason to why suicide would be any thing 'bad', it's simply another irrational moral custom. You know me well enough to that I take no heed to those.khorven, are you trolling? |
| If God doesn't forgive you for making a rational decision to reduce your own personal suffering if your death is inevitable by a number of minutes to several hours, I think you need to start questioning the God (or better yet, question whoever told you to blindly believe in this rule imposed by him). I will continue to live even if I don't want to, because I know my death will bring about lifelong suffering to some people. Even if I explained the whole nature blah blah we're just organic beings etc, their natural attachment can't be erased. If it was just me I would probably be afraid to do it, but in theory it's not a terribly big deal since our lifespans are just blinks of an eye in the history of the Earth, and everyone dies eventually in the same manner. Billions of people have died already, countless have died in wars, countless are dying every day in countries with no food or medical facilities, where is your God now, etc. We're bound by the limits of nature and fall right into the natural order of living species, sorry to burst your bubble. We're so close to certain species that we can test certain medicines and behavior on them and achieve similar results on ourselves. Our bodies work in almost exactly the same way as many animals. So to answer your question, use your brain and make a decision. That's the only reason human beings are at their level today and able to dominate over other species...because of their highly developed cognitive ability. The biggest thing we have that other living things don't is our ability to plan ahead, so make use of it. |
| Commit suicide as you wish. I, for one, know that unless I die suddenly I'll kill myself. Nothing by the sort of finding life too horrible to go on with (it's horrible, but interesting, thus good enough for me), it's just, I'm going to die anyway so I'd like to do it as I wish. Will be a while before I'm bored with life though, I figure. I see no reason people should denounce the damn act, by the way. Do with your life as you wish. It's hardly cowardly, it generally takes a lot of courage to off yourself. It did for me, too much of it too. Evidently. |
How is the world ruled and how do wars start? Diplomats tell lies to journalists and then believe what they read. | Report rules abuse | Your Panel | Clubs | Messages | Forum | Recent <img src="http://img593.imageshack.us/img593/4672/stuhlbarg.png" /> |
| The people you leave behind is also a faulty argument. Because when you die (according to SCIENCE) the world stops existing from your perspective. It's ultimately the same question as - what if the world had just started a second ago, with all your memories intact? Feeling guilty for some one you killed or hurt before that second is the same as doing so for those you leave behind. |
khorven said: The people you leave behind is also a faulty argument. Because when you die (according to SCIENCE) the world stops existing from your perspective. It's ultimately the same question as - what if the world had just started a second ago, with all your memories intact? Feeling guilty for some one you killed or hurt before that second is the same as doing so for those you leave behind. I don't want my parents etc to suffer. I'm not an asshole to a point where I'll make them suffer for the rest of their lives, whether I'm alive or dead. I'm indebted to them for everything they've done for me. That's my own personal feeling, social conditioning or gut "feels bad man" feeling. The world doesn't stop existing...it continues going on as it always has (for billions of years). |
| It's more: How do you know the world's not going to stop existing after you die? And the point is, counter intuitive as it appears. It's the exact same thing if it does or doesn't. It are two repraesentations of the same object. That is inferribly. |
| But do your parents want you to suffer? I find it selfish to say no to someone who wishes to stop living because it hurts them too much... because it'd hurt you that they were gone. Why not be happy they at last do not suffer any more? Provided we're talking suicide out of pain of any kind, of course. |
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khorven said: It's more: How do you know the world's not going to stop existing after you die? And the point is, counter intuitive as it appears. It's the exact same thing if it does or doesn't. It are two repraesentations of the same object. That is inferribly. Whether it's going to or not, I have to assume that it won't. Because if it stops existing, I don't lose anything by being alive, but if it doesn't stop existing, well I'm up shit creek because I just royally screwed them over. Kaiserpingvin said: But do your parents want you to suffer? I find it selfish to say no to someone who wishes to stop living because it hurts them too much... because it'd hurt you that they were gone. Why not be happy they at last do not suffer any more? Provided we're talking suicide out of pain of any kind, of course. Oh, I was referring to just selfish out-of-nowhere suicide. They're rational beings and will probably agree with most decisions I make. Of course, I doubt I would kill myself in that situation. I think most people would cling onto life in that scenario. Of course in a rhetorical situation, if suicide is no doubt the best option (like being tortured in the most painful method possible for a week with 0 chance of being rescued and being killed 100% for sure at the end), I think suicide is the smarter idea. Unfortunately, we can never assume such things and can almost always hope for a miraculous escape like The Count. |
FuiJun 14, 2009 1:31 PM
Fui said: Sounds like they got what was coming to them.khorven said: It's more: How do you know the world's not going to stop existing after you die? And the point is, counter intuitive as it appears. It's the exact same thing if it does or doesn't. It are two repraesentations of the same object. That is inferribly. Whether it's going to or not, I have to assume that it won't. Because if it stops existing, I don't lose anything by being alive, but if it doesn't stop existing, well I'm up shit creek because I just royally screwed them over. They put you into this world, once could argue that giving life is immoral. |
Plun said: lol. so if i don't believe in hell, i'll go anyway, because you said so.windy said: Plun said: watIf you do suicide, I'll see you in Hell from Heaven. What do you mean 'wat'? If you suicide, you go to hell. I don't care if you don't believe in Heaven, Hell, God, Devil, or whatever. where did you get this idea? i'm genuinely curious. |
windyJun 14, 2009 2:17 PM
| I think suicide is an action performed by those who were too weak to believe in themselves. Whether they were disillusioned by an event in life or chose to believe on those not themselves. I, have no right to judge anyone who performed or considered suicide. Personally, I believe in tomorrow. These are what I believe leads to suicide. These are the following circumstances I can think of right now that will have me considering death. But, If I choose death, I will not commit suicide, I will ask someone who hates me and wants me dead. |
Hayato_kunJun 14, 2009 5:44 PM
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windy said: Plun said: lol. so if i don't believe in hell, i'll go anyway, because you said so.windy said: Plun said: watIf you do suicide, I'll see you in Hell from Heaven. What do you mean 'wat'? If you suicide, you go to hell. I don't care if you don't believe in Heaven, Hell, God, Devil, or whatever. where did you get this idea? i'm genuinely curious. He never said you'll go to hell because you dont believe in it, he's saying if you kill yourself, you're going to hell, regardless if you dont believe in it or not. : / I for one have nothing against suicide, there are different situations out there, and some of them have all the right in the world to kill themselves, while other just do it since it's the easy way out of their problems. I don't really care, but I'm not one to talk, my life is great, and killing myself has never been an option. I'm planning on gettin old and seeing my grandkids grow up. Hopefully I dont get killed or something before this happens. |
Itachi-san said: It's not about right or not right, you're gonna die anyway, nobody cares. |
| Skipping all the pages of metaphysical conversation... I've been very near to my own death and it's not pleasant. I killed creatures myself and it's not pleasant. Death may be something fantastic, but it really does not seem so from the outside. Under no circumstance I'd die or let people around me die for no reason at all. Anyone that has not seen it with their own eyes does not really have any right to considerate whatever. I was all pro suicide until I tried myself. I was also all pro death until I saw it. You'll have to drag me by force to my coffin, because I won't go there by free will. |
 Waratte Oemashou Sore ha Chiisana Inori |
Hayato_kun said: These are what I believe leads to suicide. Attachment, well that's vague, but if it is attachment to something that exists, then it seems rather stupid to cease to be for it. Greed, wat. "I want more so I'll kill myself, that way I can get more"? Beliefs, yes, that's kind of far too vague to say anything. Ignorance, wat. Really, wat. Imperceptibility? wat again, so if I am invisible I'll kill myself? Too vague words really. I'll say that what leads to suicide is pretty much anything. In my failed case, it was boredom and self-hate, neither of which fit into these categories. |
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Pineappledishes said: .....windy said: Plun said: lol. so if i don't believe in hell, i'll go anyway, because you said so.windy said: Plun said: watIf you do suicide, I'll see you in Hell from Heaven. What do you mean 'wat'? If you suicide, you go to hell. I don't care if you don't believe in Heaven, Hell, God, Devil, or whatever. where did you get this idea? i'm genuinely curious. He never said you'll go to hell because you dont believe in it, he's saying if you kill yourself, you're going to hell, regardless if you dont believe in it or not. : /. hahahaha why am i even bothering with this thread |
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