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#1
Oct 18, 2013 8:37 AM

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Simple question:

Is a lion justified because they eat other animals to survive?

Answer YES:

Answer NO:


@edit
Refering to anime was stupid idea edited poll

@edit2 Bonus question:
It's year 2020 on sky apear thousands of saucers new cyvilization from space tell humanity that they must take few thousand of ppl and breed them to use as thier food cause they must eat food with higher iq than animal iq.

Would u accept it even if someone would be close to you or would you rather sacryfice yourself for humanity and fight agnist occupant?
Modified by Krunchy, Oct 18, 2013 11:11 AM
 
#2
Oct 18, 2013 8:40 AM

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Is this a spoiler by any chance?
 
#3
Oct 18, 2013 8:42 AM

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Mkayyy said:
Is this a spoiler by any chance?
There is no anime spoilers inside.
 
#4
Oct 18, 2013 8:43 AM
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Mkayyy said:
Is this a spoiler by any chance?
Ehh not rly.

I don't think there is a right answer, only opinions.

Btw, should this not be in shiki sub forum, since its directly related to Sunako?
 
#5
Oct 18, 2013 9:17 AM

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I have no idea who Kirishiki Sunako is so idk if I should just ignore that bit and answer the other question or
deadoptimist said:
Though I think shit-flinging should also have standards - no personal, no behind the scenes.
 
#6
Oct 18, 2013 9:20 AM
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kawaiiyuris said:
I have no idea who Kirishiki Sunako is so idk if I should just ignore that bit and answer the other question or
That's why this should be in the shiki sub forum.
 
#7
Oct 18, 2013 9:30 AM

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circle of life.

no I don't feel guilty for eating animals, meat tastes good.
 
#8
Oct 18, 2013 9:46 AM

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Sushiii said:
kawaiiyuris said:
I have no idea who Kirishiki Sunako is so idk if I should just ignore that bit and answer the other question or
That's why this should be in the shiki sub forum.
It was just an example, count her as lion.
 
#9
Oct 18, 2013 9:47 AM
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Animals are delicious.
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Oct 18, 2013 10:15 AM

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Wait, this is about an anime? *deep sigh*

Whatever. Survival of the fittest.

That's like calling animal cruelty activists for seeing an amoeba engulf a bacterium. "AAAAGH THAT AMOEBA IS A MURDERER!"
 
Oct 18, 2013 10:21 AM

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It has never been morally right, but it has been around for so long that people have just accepted it, myself included.
 
Oct 18, 2013 10:32 AM

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Attempting to apply morality across species isn't a good idea.

Lions and humans operate on different systems of right and wrong. So I cannot say if a lion has a right to kill from a human standpoint, because a lion is not a human. If a lion was attempting to kill a human, I wouldn't say the lion has a right to kill, or a demand not to kill.

Shiki asked a similar question.

I don't feel bad about eating animals or plants, but sometimes chewing steak make me feel sick.
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Oct 18, 2013 10:38 AM

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If I don't eat them someone else is going to eat them and please don't tell me about everyone stopping cause it's not gonna happen.
 
Oct 18, 2013 11:00 AM

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Okay let's say:

It's year 2020 on sky apear thousands of saucers new cyvilization from space tell humanity that they must take few thousand of ppl and breed them to use as thier food cause they must eat food with higher iq than animal iq.

Would u accept it even if someone would be close to you or would you rather sacryfice yourself for humanity and fight agnist occupant?

@down
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Modified by Krunchy, Oct 18, 2013 11:10 AM
 
Oct 18, 2013 11:04 AM

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Work on your English.

Fight back, neither of us is morally wrong.
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Oct 18, 2013 11:08 AM

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The only time when it's okay to kill imo is in self defense (usually happens accidentally) or when defending someone (who's life is in direct danger, and you harm the attacker)

Of course a lion is justified for killing other animals for food. It's how nature works. We kill other animals for food too.
deadoptimist said:
Though I think shit-flinging should also have standards - no personal, no behind the scenes.
 
Oct 18, 2013 11:25 AM

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Sourire said:
circle of life.

no I don't feel guilty for eating animals, meat tastes good.
+1
 
Oct 18, 2013 1:52 PM

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Lions are just doing what they normally do in nature

Humans do it too; thus, why should someone think the lion is "in the wrong" here? This is just nature and food chains/webs at work.
Modified by monster7foot6, Oct 18, 2013 9:43 PM
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Oct 18, 2013 1:59 PM

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I don't feel guilty but at the same time I wouldn't let some aliens kill me and east me because I want to live. Just as I expect the pig to fight the futile fight against it's own demise, so I would try and avoid being eaten.
 
Oct 18, 2013 2:24 PM

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Krunchy said:
Is a lion justified because they eat other animals to survive?

That's a strange question. It's pretty much the same as asking whether a lion is justified to exist as it is. Lions are carnivores, they don't need justification to eat other animals as it's part of what they are.

Krunchy said:
Do u feel guilty eating animals and plants?

Eating meat is pleasurable. I eat meat because I can and I feel no guilt over consuming other animals. What I would feel guilty about is eating meat from animals that might have been raised in horrid conditions. Our ethical duty lies in ensuring that the animals we eat are raised in decent conditions and cared for properly.

And plants? You might as well ask us whether we feel guilty about eating altogether.

Krunchy said:
It's year 2020 on sky apear thousands of saucers new cyvilization from space tell humanity that they must take few thousand of ppl and breed them to use as thier food cause they must eat food with higher iq than animal iq.

Would u accept it even if someone would be close to you or would you rather sacryfice yourself for humanity and fight agnist occupant?

It's not morally wrong, but that doesn't mean you just have to accept to be eaten. Humanity should fight back if such a thing happens. It's not as if animals that are consumed by predators in the wild just submit to their fate without putting up a fight.
But let's just hope aliens wouldn't be into meat as much as we are, and in the case it turns out they are, we could try acting cute so they'd think we're too adorable to eat, like puppies do (although that's proven useless against some people).
Modified by bacchi, Oct 18, 2013 2:46 PM
 
Oct 18, 2013 2:37 PM

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Krunchy said:
@edit2 Bonus question:
It's year 2020 on sky apear thousands of saucers new cyvilization from space tell humanity that they must take few thousand of ppl and breed them to use as thier food cause they must eat food with higher iq than animal iq.

Would u accept it even if someone would be close to you or would you rather sacryfice yourself for humanity and fight agnist occupant?
I don't see that whether it would be in your self conceived interest to fight back has anything to do with a "right".
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Oct 18, 2013 3:29 PM

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Justification depends heavily on the person, and it's not really needed. You could say justification isn't justified in any case.
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Oct 18, 2013 3:44 PM
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Applying ethics to animals...
I don't think it works that way, moral questions only have a meaning if free will is involved.

Listen, everybody wants change, don't nobody want to change though
don't nobody want to pray, till they got something to pray for
now everybody's gonna die, but don't everybody live though
 
Oct 18, 2013 8:50 PM

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ye if a nigga tryna start pipin mad shit bout mah shoes ima have to roll strap on'em, like dese jauns gucci yammsayin?
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Oct 18, 2013 9:00 PM

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I only feel guilty for eating bacon when I check the nutrition facts on the packaging...
 
Oct 18, 2013 9:02 PM

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Well seeing as how I am the apex predator on this planet, I feel that I'm justified in eating anything that isn't a human.
 
Oct 18, 2013 9:04 PM

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If we would be dominated by stronger cyvilization and we would be used as thier food would it be justified?


Yes.
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Oct 18, 2013 9:05 PM

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i think there is a right to kill but most people dont do it because of the law
RRRRRRRRRR
 
Oct 18, 2013 9:30 PM

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In reality there is no rights. There is only opportunity.
Titan of 20+ virgins club.
 
Oct 18, 2013 9:32 PM
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thats how nature works its food cycle - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_web so the lion is correct
 
Oct 18, 2013 9:55 PM

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ye m8 lions rather live lol.. food cycle crap wuteva dat guy said^

 
Oct 18, 2013 10:06 PM
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Higashi_no_Kaze said:
Applying ethics to animals...
I don't think it works that way, moral questions only have a meaning if free will is involved.

Yeah this is a pretty easy question. Reminded me of the example my philosopher professor gave us in class: "What happens when a lion kills a person? Can we say that it's wrong (or not justified) for the lion to kill the person?" No because lions don't have the concept of right or wrong, it can't rationalize. And in order to have a concept of right or wrong, it needs to have a self-conscious.
 
Oct 18, 2013 11:16 PM

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For those aliens it's probably not something strange to eat us, humans. However, it does not mean that we won't fight back. That and also morality is human concept, it does not applies to anything beyond our species.

Take another example that is debated by scientists about the prospect of terraforming Mars. Since there is no solid evidence yet about life on Mars, some scientist argues that we should attempt to terraform it as a 'second Earth'. However some scientist also argues that there is a small probability that Mars might have a primitive lifeform (ex. Bacteria, Virus, or simple organism) yet to be discovered. If we terraform Mars we might killed these organism and cause a planetary extinction. Is it a right thing to do for us to terraform Mars?
 
Oct 18, 2013 11:33 PM

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Probably those bacterias will finish like Indians in America.
 
Oct 19, 2013 12:35 AM
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kuuderes_shadow said:
If we would be dominated by stronger cyvilization and we would be used as thier food would it be justified?


Yes.


to be fair you probably said yes because it didn't happen. but when it does and we are all being captured or eaten.. your answer would probably be different.
 
Oct 19, 2013 1:10 AM

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Higashi_no_Kaze said:
Applying ethics to animals...
I don't think it works that way, moral questions only have a meaning if free will is involved.


rofl
that is all
so now animals are robots and if we strip people of their right to choose then we can do whatever w/o moral repercussions?
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Oct 19, 2013 1:23 AM
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"Is a lion justified because they eat other animals to survive?"

This is a weird formulated question. "Justified?". You can ask that how much you want, but the lion will not, not kill. It will eat in order to stay alive. Justified? No. Necessary? Yes.

If we would be dominated by stronger cyvilization and we would be used as thier food would it be justified?

Still wouldn't make it what the definition of "justified" means, but we'd have no choice. Just as I (and a lot of other people) don't care about what type of meat they put in their mouths, so wouldn't a superior being. It's necessary in order to stay alive.
 
Oct 19, 2013 10:20 AM

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drinkbeer said:
kuuderes_shadow said:
If we would be dominated by stronger cyvilization and we would be used as thier food would it be justified?


Yes.


to be fair you probably said yes because it didn't happen. but when it does and we are all being captured or eaten.. your answer would probably be different.


No I wouldn't. (when? you sound confident that this is actually going to happen.)

It is entirely justified for the civilisation to use us as food. Just as we would be entirely justified in doing whatever we can to stop it from doing so.
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Oct 19, 2013 10:26 AM

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Fulfillment of niche in the food chain

A little off topic (?): Most people are so sensitive about dogs, cats, other pets being "abused", but those people enjoy eating other animal meat anyway. Animals are animals. People seem to care a lot when kittens are killed but no one gives a damn when chicks who haven't even hatched yet are boiled. Meh.
 
Oct 19, 2013 10:32 AM

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Giriene said:
People seem to care a lot when kittens are killed but no one gives a damn when chicks who haven't even hatched yet are boiled. Meh.

Umm I'm pretty sure we eat the eggs that haven't been fertilized.....
The ones from the hens without a mate
But yeah some people do eat a fertile egg with a developing chick inside
 
Oct 19, 2013 10:36 AM

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FirstFamiliar said:
Giriene said:
People seem to care a lot when kittens are killed but no one gives a damn when chicks who haven't even hatched yet are boiled. Meh.

Umm I'm pretty sure we eat the eggs that haven't been fertilized.....
The ones from the hens without a mate
But yeah some people do eat a fertile egg with a developing chick inside


In our country, what you're referring to is called "Balot" and is quite a popular delicacy here...when you open the egg up you can clearly see the developing chick + a couple of its tiny hair ...
 
Oct 19, 2013 10:56 AM

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Giriene said:
FirstFamiliar said:
Giriene said:
People seem to care a lot when kittens are killed but no one gives a damn when chicks who haven't even hatched yet are boiled. Meh.

Umm I'm pretty sure we eat the eggs that haven't been fertilized.....
The ones from the hens without a mate
But yeah some people do eat a fertile egg with a developing chick inside


In our country, what you're referring to is called "Balot" and is quite a popular delicacy here...when you open the egg up you can clearly see the developing chick + a couple of its tiny hair ...

No no please don't remind me
 
Oct 19, 2013 4:51 PM

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Some animals can't survive without eating meat. Humans on the other hand can. We can get whatever we want (not literally) be it meat or vegetables, we'll still make it to the next day.
 
Oct 19, 2013 10:36 PM

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azzuRe said:
For those aliens it's probably not something strange to eat us, humans. However, it does not mean that we won't fight back. That and also morality is human concept, it does not applies to anything beyond our species.

Take another example that is debated by scientists about the prospect of terraforming Mars. Since there is no solid evidence yet about life on Mars, some scientist argues that we should attempt to terraform it as a 'second Earth'. However some scientist also argues that there is a small probability that Mars might have a primitive lifeform (ex. Bacteria, Virus, or simple organism) yet to be discovered. If we terraform Mars we might killed these organism and cause a planetary extinction. Is it a right thing to do for us to terraform Mars?


Cant wait till SPACE colonialism!!!
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Oct 19, 2013 10:55 PM

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azzuRe said:
If we terraform Mars we might killed these organism and cause a planetary extinction.
So?? What the fuck. I can't see why that should even be in consideration.
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Oct 20, 2013 12:18 AM

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dankickyou said:
azzuRe said:
For those aliens it's probably not something strange to eat us, humans. However, it does not mean that we won't fight back. That and also morality is human concept, it does not applies to anything beyond our species.

Take another example that is debated by scientists about the prospect of terraforming Mars. Since there is no solid evidence yet about life on Mars, some scientist argues that we should attempt to terraform it as a 'second Earth'. However some scientist also argues that there is a small probability that Mars might have a primitive lifeform (ex. Bacteria, Virus, or simple organism) yet to be discovered. If we terraform Mars we might killed these organism and cause a planetary extinction. Is it a right thing to do for us to terraform Mars?


Cant wait till SPACE colonialism!!!


Let us hope that we are on the front line of space colonialism, at least on our galaxy.

elite-sama said:
azzuRe said:
If we terraform Mars we might killed these organism and cause a planetary extinction.
So?? What the fuck. I can't see why that should even be in consideration.


Well, some people are still clinging on preserving it in it's natural state instead to use Mars entirely for human advancement. I am entirely in for the colonization, as it will open up lots of alternative possibilities for our future technology. However, studying Mars lifeforms (if they exist) might broaden our horizon and understanding regarding one of the biggest mystery of life, of how it was started, and how it evolved to its environment. Although we can say, colonization of mars would have more concern to our future rather than our past.
 
Oct 20, 2013 10:48 AM
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I'm not a big believer on "rights". I am a big believer on choices, so people have the choice to kill for whatever reason and they usually do make that choice.
 
Oct 20, 2013 10:59 AM

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I think its okay for lions to eat other animals. I don't think its okay for humans to eat other humans or for a higher species to eat humans (should a higher species exist) since humans are sentient beings. If a being is sentient, it is not okay to kill that being.
 
Oct 20, 2013 11:16 AM

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It's okay for a lion to kill another animal, yes. Why? The lion has to survive. In order to survive, the lion must eat. (unless it's trying to become a model or something)
Humans kill animals in order to eat, too. Is it okay? Yes. Why? We have to survive. In order for us to survive, we must eat. (unless we're trying to become models or something)

Will it be wrong to kill other humans for a food source? I won't say whether it's wrong or right, it's just strange. We have so many other food sources. It's also strange because the two will be the same group.
Imagine a lion killing a lion for a food source. You'd look at the lion like it's cray.

Krunchy said:
Bonus question:
It's year 2020 on sky apear thousands of saucers new cyvilization from space tell humanity that they must take few thousand of ppl and breed them to use as thier food cause they must eat food with higher iq than animal iq.

Would u accept it even if someone would be close to you or would you rather sacryfice yourself for humanity and fight agnist occupant?


I would fight, but that will do little. The aliens are obviously more advanced in this case. If there was an alliance (like the military for example) that's working on to counter attack them, then yes I would join.
 
Oct 20, 2013 12:06 PM

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Where one thinks lies right.
 
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