| You can discuss the war operations on the Balkans here. |
| A past can last a lifetime. How to Read Manga! | AnimeBytes | iMangaScans |
| Always hard to start of a discussion : P Anyway, i find that the Balkan campaigns did not have any significance to the larger picture of Europe in WWII, unlike WWI. What happened in WWII was mainly decided in Russia, North Africa/Italy and Normandy. reprimand me. |
| When it comes to the Balkans, they were not that significant during the Second World War. For example, Bulgaria which participated in a few campaigns with a lot of casualties during WWI stayed put during WWII and was the least affected country by the war on the peninsula. In my opinion, this was mainly because of the vast technological differences at the time. The Balkans were not as advanced comparatively, they did not have as good planes and tanks as the Germans. As you mention, North Africa was important for the war. The Allies held Malta and used it to supply their troops - if I'm not mistaken, it was nearly impossible to do it by boat because of German submarines. Greece would have become important for Germany to serve as a supply point, and maybe even to house bombers. I'm not sure to what extent it was used for this. I think the Balkans were not as important to Germany as they were to Italy, and the reason for their alliance would have been Italy's interest in the region. I might be wrong. I think this is as good a place as any to mention why Bulgaria entered the Axis. Many of this is my personal interpretation of the situation. Before the war the political situation in Bulgaria was a Totalitarian Monarchy (I think that is what it's called). There was a government, but the king was, well, king. He had the backing of the military and controlled everything. The popular opinion was somewhat in favour of Germany. They had fought together in WWI, and Hitler's reasoning behind his invasions was similar to the way Bulgarians thought. After WWI Bulgaria had to pay large sums of money and cede territory to Greece, Romania and Yugoslavia. Bulgaria was never very fond of its neighbours. One of the reasons Bulgaria allied itself with Germany was the promise of the return of pre WWI territory. Hitler seems to have favoured Bulgarians, because he didn't require any support in his military campaigns, did not mess with Bulgarian internal affairs and even allowed for Bulgaria to keep its Jewish population - strange, since he counted Slavs among the nations that should be exterminated (Serbians, Russians, Polish, etc.) Was it because he thought Bulgarians were honourable for having fought on the side of Germany during WWI or because he did not consider them Slavs? (well, there is this joke that the Arian race is not, in fact, people with blond hair and blue eyes, but people from Bavaria, Hungara and Bulgaria - notice the aria at the end.) |
| A past can last a lifetime. How to Read Manga! | AnimeBytes | iMangaScans |
| Well i believe that in such a complicated war everything matters and in this certain case the defeat of the Italians and the delay of the Germans by 6 weeks before they invade USSR was important. If it wasn't for the winter factor it probably wouldn't be very important but because of that it become important. |
MonadJan 16, 2009 8:37 AM
| The winter factor definitely made a difference. Like others who tried fast conquest of Russia, Hitler found that Russian warfare is different that European warfare. Roads in Russia are not as good as in Europe, and it becomes increasingly harder to supply the army as it goes further eastward. What I don't understand is why Hitler was in such a hurry. Sure, the Balkans slowed him down more than he expected, but why couldn't he wait till the winter was over? Stalin was not preparing defences against Germany anyway. |
| A past can last a lifetime. How to Read Manga! | AnimeBytes | iMangaScans |
| what i don't get is why they even bothered with Greece. They could have had their Balkan allies invade, and even if the British prevailed in greece, they would never be able to hold a long front against the germans. |
| I think it was a matter of pride. I don't think Hitler let any of his allies do all the fighting alone. The German troops were by far superior to any of his allies - very disciplined. Wherever there was no German presence the allies had rather easy victories - in North Africa, for example, when fighting only Italian troops. Perhaps Hitler didn't want to leave the Balkans unfinished and felt uncomfortable leaving it up to his allies. |
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Sohei said: what i don't get is why they even bothered with Greece. They could have had their Balkan allies invade, and even if the British prevailed in greece, they would never be able to hold a long front against the germans. Well some reasons why they bothered i gave to you in the nuclear bombs thread.On the other hand Hitler was a little nuts maybe he just wanted Greece. Some rumors even say he believed that Greeks were Aryan race and all that, who knows. But basically i believe it was because of those strategic reasons i gave in that thread. Let's not forget that there was a battle in Africa also. Now about there Balkans allies well excuse me but that's a joke. There strongest ally in Europe was Italy. In absolute numbers and material power Italy was a lot stronger than Greece so Hitler did exactly what you said he let Greece to one of his allies with a very logical assumption that they will manage and they screw up. Not only they lost but they were about do get push out of Albania also the way they were going. And that was the stronger ally he had in Europe. I believe it was quite obvious he had to do the job himself after that. |
Monad said: Sohei said: what i don't get is why they even bothered with Greece. They could have had their Balkan allies invade, and even if the British prevailed in greece, they would never be able to hold a long front against the germans. Well some reasons why they bothered i gave to you in the nuclear bombs thread.On the other hand Hitler was a little nuts maybe he just wanted Greece. Some rumors even say he believed that Greeks were Aryan race and all that, who knows. But basically i believe it was because of those strategic reasons i gave in that thread. Let's not forget that there was a battle in Africa also. Now about there Balkans allies well excuse me but that's a joke. There strongest ally in Europe was Italy. In absolute numbers and material power Italy was a lot stronger than Greece so Hitler did exactly what you said he let Greece to one of his allies with a very logical assumption that they will manage and they screw up. Not only they lost but they were about do get push out of Albania also the way they were going. And that was the stronger ally he had in Europe. I believe it was quite obvious he had to do the job himself after that. But Italy's military was a joke. They couldn't even hold a small front against Greek irregulars. They even had trouble in Abyssinia in 1933 with a bunch of guys with spears. The North African front at that was already pretty much given up, i believe the battles at el-alamein were already fought. Anyway, instead of insisting on using German troops in Greece, i believe the germans should have just let it be as it was. There simply wasn't enough allied presence in the balkans/eastern meditteranean to form a threat for germany, even if Britain supported Greece As for the aryan thing, if that was true, the greeks wouldn't have been treated as horribly during the war. Also, greeks weren't allowed into the wehrmacht i believe. |
| The Germans did not want any trouble in the Balkans prior to their invasion of Russia. Hitler explicitly told Mussolini this when he met with him (in I believe either the Fall or Winter of 1940). Mussolini however, decided to go ahead with his invasion of Greece regardless. It was a poorly conceived plan, and the Greek military had been badly underestimated by the Italians. Thus not only were the Italians stopped but they were being pushed back into Albania (from where they launched the invasion). Even worse, from the German prespective was that the British were already providing support and troops to the Greeks which they simply couldn't ignore. That's why they quickly drew up plans to invade and occupy Greece, which they executed efficiently like almost everything else they had done up to that point. As for the effects the Balkan campaign had on the Germans. I doubt any significant effect. The only two that I can think of off hand are the delay in the start of Barbarossa, which is likely negligble since the Russian muddy season was late that year would have caused a delay regardless. And the second being the distrust Hitler showed for Airborne operations after the Invasion of Crete. Given the nature of battles on the East Front, I doubt airborne strikes would have proven effective or desirable. |
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