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People who make electronic music aren't musicians.

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#1
Jun 6, 2013 1:42 PM
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People who use their computers to make electronic "music" aren't musicians.

Musicians play real musical instruments, not computers.
"There is no more effective method of concealment than the broadest publicity."
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#2
Jun 6, 2013 1:43 PM
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They're called producers.
And what's your point? Just here to prove that you've learned something?
 
#3
Jun 6, 2013 1:48 PM
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I wish they'd understand they aren't musicians.
"There is no more effective method of concealment than the broadest publicity."
"naw just be like "in facist america burger is you comrade""
"if maps are hard, suicide is impossible"
 
#4
Jun 6, 2013 1:50 PM
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Captain-Hawkeye said:
I wish they'd understand they aren't musicians.
Ignorant people be ignorant.
Don't you feel special when you know something they don't?
 
#5
Jun 6, 2013 1:52 PM

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I thought this was relevant. While I think there are plenty of producers who aren't very talented and let DAW's and other software do the job for them, there are also a lot who are very talented in terms of composing music. Basically, yea you can make music on a computer with out much talent, but you can make music with an instrument with out much talent. So there's not much of a difference in my opinion.

Edit: Also you contradict yourself. A lot of artists who use computers to make electronic music use keyboards, so seeing as piano is an instrument they are by your own definition musicians. Some do just use audio samples and drag and drop notes ext. I would bet that a lot of them know more about music theory then yourself.
Modified by Fintan, Jun 6, 2013 1:58 PM
 
#6
Jun 6, 2013 1:56 PM

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Captain-Hawkeye said:

Musicians play real musical instruments, not computers.
I feel like i dont even need to make a a response to this just cause its so dumb it already speaks for itself

Immahnoob said:
Jizzy, I know you have no idea how to argue for shit,

tokiyashiro said:

Jizzy as you would call yourself because youre a dick The most butthurt award goes to you And clearly you havent watched that many shows thats why you cant determine if a show is unique or not Or maybe you're just a child who likes common stuffs where hero saves the day and guys gets all the girls. Sad taste you have there kid you came up to me in the first place making you look more like a kid who got slapped without me even knowing it and start crying about it to me

 
#7
Jun 6, 2013 2:04 PM
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TinkleTinkle-Hoy said:


. A lot of artists who use computers to make electronic music use keyboards, so seeing as piano is an instrument they are by your own definition musicians..


Keyboars and notes =/= playing a piano. Totally different things. Have you seen someone play a piano compared to someone using a keyboard for their computer "music"?
"There is no more effective method of concealment than the broadest publicity."
"naw just be like "in facist america burger is you comrade""
"if maps are hard, suicide is impossible"
 
#8
Jun 6, 2013 2:16 PM

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So a composer who doesn't play his own music shouldn't be considered a musician?
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#9
Jun 6, 2013 2:18 PM

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By definition, "a musician is a person who plays a musical instrument, especially (although not necessarily) as a profession, or is musically talented." That being said, the stuff people create on electronics does have rhythm, melody, harmony, tempos, dynamics and whatnot.
 
Jun 6, 2013 2:22 PM

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Are you a musician? Do you have any music you've created that I can listen to? I'm very open minded and listen to a wide range of genres. If you're not, then seriously just stop. You're coming off as an idiot who is trying to act like an elitist snob. Like I said, a lot of these producers almost certainly have more knowledge of music theory then yourself. Yet you claim they are not musicians, because you're not a fan of electronic music.... Yea, you're really convincing me here.
 
Jun 6, 2013 2:24 PM

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I don't understand this regressive attitude when it comes to computer music (although I do feel that the prevalance of the computer in contemporary pop music is a method of reducing human resources - in other words, you have to pay a group of live musicians more than a computer and a producer - but that's a tangential issue) - would you rather hear another shitty one-man-and-a-guitar singer-songwriter or some boring fucking 4/5 piece rock outfit or what?.
 
Jun 6, 2013 2:25 PM

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A contractor who uses a bulldozer isnt a builder
an animator who uses CGI isnt an animator
A carpenter who uses woodworking machinery arent carpenters.
A warrior who uses a gun aren't warriors
An artist who uses computer programs isnt an artist.
A lumberjack who uses a chainsaw isnt a lumberjack

HERP DERP
The Art of Eight
 
Jun 6, 2013 2:29 PM

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dankickyou said:
A contractor who uses a bulldozer isnt a builder
an animator who uses CGI isnt an animator
A carpenter who uses woodworking machinery arent carpenters.
A warrior who uses a gun aren't warriors
An artist who uses computer programs isnt an artist.
A lumberjack who uses a chainsaw isnt a lumberjack

HERP DERP
Yup, there is an evolution in the meanings of terms through time.
 
Jun 6, 2013 2:36 PM

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I'm not too fussed what you call them, so long as you don't assume all music that isn't written by a performer is worthless or somehow invalid. They are composers and they translate their ideas and musical know how onto paper or some music software, performance isn't the only aspect of music that can be enjoyed. Delius continued to write music despite being paralyzed from the neck down, his lack of playing hasn't effected the quality of his work.
 
Jun 6, 2013 2:37 PM
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QueenJenny said:
So a composer who doesn't play his own music shouldn't be considered a musician?


They would be a composer? Since they, ya know, compose.

TinkleTinkle-Hoy said:
Are you a musician? Do you have any music you've created that I can listen to? I'm very open minded and listen to a wide range of genres. If you're not, then seriously just stop. You're coming off as an idiot who is trying to act like an elitist snob. Like I said, a lot of these producers almost certainly have more knowledge of music theory then yourself. Yet you claim they are not musicians, because you're not a fan of electronic music.... Yea, you're really convincing me here.


I play around with instruments, but I'm far from someone who I would consider a musician, since I do not write music. That being said, A guitar player in some shitty band =/= a guitarist, same for bass player and bassist, they're two completely different levels of playing.

PachucoCadaver said:
I don't understand this regressive attitude when it comes to computer music (although I do feel that the prevalance of the computer in contemporary pop music is a method of reducing human resources - in other words, you have to pay a group of live musicians more than a computer and a producer - but that's a tangential issue) - would you rather hear another shitty one-man-and-a-guitar singer-songwriter or some boring fucking 4/5 piece rock outfit or what?.


Someone who puts in hundreds of hours of practice into playing their instrument deserves the title of "musician" than some loser who sits in his basement and plays with artificial sounds on his macbook.
"There is no more effective method of concealment than the broadest publicity."
"naw just be like "in facist america burger is you comrade""
"if maps are hard, suicide is impossible"
 
Jun 6, 2013 3:19 PM

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Who spends hundreds of hours mastering the art of manipulating sound and continuously furthering his or her knowledge of structure, form, and harmonic and rhythmic balance. A computer is a tool like any instrument, and proficiency is required to use it properly.
 
Jun 6, 2013 3:32 PM

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Electronica/Ambiance is one of the best genres when done right (Aphex Twin).
 
Jun 6, 2013 3:33 PM
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PachucoCadaver said:
Who spends hundreds of hours mastering the art of manipulating sound and continuously furthering his or her knowledge of structure, form, and harmonic and rhythmic balance. A computer is a tool like any instrument, and proficiency is required to use it properly.


Someone who's dedicated and has a passion for music and musical instruments. Computers aren't musical instruments.
"There is no more effective method of concealment than the broadest publicity."
"naw just be like "in facist america burger is you comrade""
"if maps are hard, suicide is impossible"
 
Jun 6, 2013 3:35 PM
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OP voted for Mozart.
 
Jun 6, 2013 3:37 PM

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FacelessVixen said:


OP voted for Mozart.


Dubstep is the worst sub-genre of electronica, and Skrillex is just awful.
 
Jun 6, 2013 3:38 PM
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FacelessVixen said:


OP voted for Mozart.


Vivaldi > Mozart
"There is no more effective method of concealment than the broadest publicity."
"naw just be like "in facist america burger is you comrade""
"if maps are hard, suicide is impossible"
 
Jun 6, 2013 3:39 PM
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spyrocoot said:
Dubstep is the worst sub-genre of electronica, and Skrillex is just awful.

But without Skrillex, we wouldn't have the cooking with Skrillex macros. Those are hilarious.
 
Jun 6, 2013 3:41 PM

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FacelessVixen said:
spyrocoot said:
Dubstep is the worst sub-genre of electronica, and Skrillex is just awful.

But without Skrillex, we wouldn't have the cooking with Skrillex macros. Those are hilarious.


That's a good point you raise.
 
Jun 6, 2013 3:50 PM

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Captain-Hawkeye said:
Someone who's dedicated and has a passion for music and musical instruments. Computers aren't musical instruments.

You haven't understood. I wasn't asking "who?", I was answering your final quote. Computers can be utilised as musical instruments, and anyone who says otherwise is a philistine of the highest calibre. Varèse, Xenakis, Don Preston, more recently, Trey Spruance. All serious, adept composers who utilised computers and other electronic instruments. Perhaps one of the earliest electronic pieces, "Poeme Electronique" pioneered the use of electronic instruments and is a forerunner of modern electronic music, and if you think Varèse wasn't a musician, you have no credibility.
 
Jun 6, 2013 3:51 PM

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Captain-Hawkeye said:
People who use their computers to make electronic "music" aren't musicians.

Musicians play real musical instruments, not computers.


welcome to MAL. Since we have enough retards to go around, your membership will sadly be revoked.
 
Jun 6, 2013 4:00 PM
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PachucoCadaver said:
Captain-Hawkeye said:
Someone who's dedicated and has a passion for music and musical instruments. Computers aren't musical instruments.

You haven't understood. I wasn't asking "who?", I was answering your final quote. Computers can be utilised as musical instruments, and anyone who says otherwise is a philistine of the highest calibre. Varèse, Xenakis, Don Preston, more recently, Trey Spruance. All serious, adept composers who utilised computers and other electronic instruments. Perhaps one of the earliest electronic pieces, "Poeme Electronique" pioneered the use of electronic instruments and is a forerunner of modern electronic music, and if you think Varèse wasn't a musician, you have no credibility.


There's times and places where they can be used, but unless you play an instrument to make music, you're not a musician. How is this so hard to understand?
"There is no more effective method of concealment than the broadest publicity."
"naw just be like "in facist america burger is you comrade""
"if maps are hard, suicide is impossible"
 
Jun 6, 2013 4:02 PM
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spyrocoot said:
FacelessVixen said:
spyrocoot said:
Dubstep is the worst sub-genre of electronica, and Skrillex is just awful.

But without Skrillex, we wouldn't have the cooking with Skrillex macros. Those are hilarious.

That's a good point you raise.

If only where was a source for the original video footage of that gif of Skrillex vs the bee, otherwise I'd edit that meme by adding audio from The Wicker Man with Nick Cage.


Anyway, without eletronica or Microsoft Sam, we wouldn't have this:



Computers have brought us some awesome shit.
 
Jun 6, 2013 4:16 PM

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Want to note that my favorite genre is Classical Rock ... however saying that the entirety of electronic takes 0 talent is RETARDED ... If this was true then why wouldn't everybody be making money off of some song or another ... Your other statement that Electronic is ONLY ON THE COMPUTER ... is also retarded... but there you go, ignorance is a disease you should rid yourself of soon ...
 
Jun 6, 2013 4:19 PM

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Captain-Hawkeye said:
There's times and places where they can be used, but unless you play an instrument to make music, you're not a musician. How is this so hard to understand?

But, simpleton, the computer is an instrument if used as such, and it is used as such by electronic musicians.
 
Jun 6, 2013 4:35 PM
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Pirating_Ninja said:



Want to note that my favorite genre is Classical Rock ... however saying that the entirety of electronic takes 0 talent is RETARDED ... If this was true then why wouldn't everybody be making money off of some song or another ... Your other statement that Electronic is ONLY ON THE COMPUTER ... is also retarded... but there you go, ignorance is a disease you should rid yourself of soon ...


Singing is fine, but when you add auto-tune to it, no. And making money =/= being a musician.

PachucoCadaver said:
Captain-Hawkeye said:
There's times and places where they can be used, but unless you play an instrument to make music, you're not a musician. How is this so hard to understand?

But, simpleton, the computer is an instrument if used as such, and it is used as such by electronic musicians.


Computers are tools, not musical instruments.
"There is no more effective method of concealment than the broadest publicity."
"naw just be like "in facist america burger is you comrade""
"if maps are hard, suicide is impossible"
 
Jun 6, 2013 4:46 PM

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Captain-Hawkeye said:
Pirating_Ninja said:



Want to note that my favorite genre is Classical Rock ... however saying that the entirety of electronic takes 0 talent is RETARDED ... If this was true then why wouldn't everybody be making money off of some song or another ... Your other statement that Electronic is ONLY ON THE COMPUTER ... is also retarded... but there you go, ignorance is a disease you should rid yourself of soon ...


Singing is fine, but when you add auto-tune to it, no. And making money =/= being a musician.
And the others? 3 of the 4 videos posted were instrumental genius ... do those not count? Does disproving your retarded rant upset you in such a way that you feel the need to ignore it and in turn remain ignorant?

Also grats on missing the point I made, you took out of my statement that I was saying making $$$ = Musician? What are you, 8? Can you really not understand the logic I used, it was pretty simple, let me dummy it down for you though since it's clear you aren't too wise.

The fact that electronic music is a field in which there are artists that are more popular, and then there artists that aren't as popular, indicates that people see some artists as being "better" than others ... Now we take Joe Schmoe, he wants to be an Electronic Musician too, after all as you stated it takes 0 skill, but he doesn't understand how to use the software, nor does he have any musical talent, in other words he doesn't have an ear for what would sound good and will be popular. But! Electronic Music takes 0 skill to make, SO he succeeds in using whatever program he decided to use and makes a solid F note for 20 minutes ... Odd ... Isn't it? Supposedly it is something that takes no skill, yet, with no skill Joe Schmoe wasn't able to accomplish a thing.

Ignorance thy name is Captain-Hawkeye





Captain-Hawkeye said:
PachucoCadaver said:
Captain-Hawkeye said:
There's times and places where they can be used, but unless you play an instrument to make music, you're not a musician. How is this so hard to understand?

But, simpleton, the computer is an instrument if used as such, and it is used as such by electronic musicians.


Computers are tools, not musical instruments.
Musical Instrument: a device used to produce music

Idiot.
Modified by Pirating_Ninja, Jun 6, 2013 4:50 PM
 
Jun 6, 2013 4:52 PM

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So what are they?

Just this once, I'll fulfill whatever your wish is.
 
Jun 6, 2013 4:56 PM
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Pirating_Ninja said:
Captain-Hawkeye said:
Pirating_Ninja said:



Want to note that my favorite genre is Classical Rock ... however saying that the entirety of electronic takes 0 talent is RETARDED ... If this was true then why wouldn't everybody be making money off of some song or another ... Your other statement that Electronic is ONLY ON THE COMPUTER ... is also retarded... but there you go, ignorance is a disease you should rid yourself of soon ...


Singing is fine, but when you add auto-tune to it, no. And making money =/= being a musician.
And the others? 3 of the 4 videos posted were instrumental genius ... do those not count? Does disproving your retarded rant upset you in such a way that you feel the need to ignore it and in turn remain ignorant?

Also grats on missing the point I made, you took out of my statement that I was saying making $$$ = Musician? What are you, 8? Can you really not understand the logic I used, it was pretty simple, let me dummy it down for you though since it's clear you aren't too wise.

The fact that electronic music is a field in which there are artists that are more popular, and then there artists that aren't as popular, indicates that people see some artists as being "better" than others ... Now we take Joe Schmoe, he wants to be an Electronic Musician too, after all as you stated it takes 0 skill, but he doesn't understand how to use the software, nor does he have any musical talent, in other words he doesn't have an ear for what would sound good and will be popular. But! Electronic Music takes 0 skill to make, SO he succeeds in using whatever program he decided to use and makes a solid F note for 20 minutes ... Odd ... Isn't it? Supposedly it is something that takes no skill, yet, with no skill Joe Schmoe wasn't able to accomplish a thing.

Ignorance thy name is Captain-Hawkeye





Captain-Hawkeye said:
PachucoCadaver said:
Captain-Hawkeye said:
There's times and places where they can be used, but unless you play an instrument to make music, you're not a musician. How is this so hard to understand?

But, simpleton, the computer is an instrument if used as such, and it is used as such by electronic musicians.


Computers are tools, not musical instruments.
Musical Instrument: a device used to produce music

Idiot.


First, artist? Sure, I'll give them that, but not musician, since "computer" and "computer software" aren't instruments.

Second, again, computers are tools, they don't produce music. Musical instruments produce music.
"There is no more effective method of concealment than the broadest publicity."
"naw just be like "in facist america burger is you comrade""
"if maps are hard, suicide is impossible"
 
Jun 6, 2013 5:04 PM

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Captain-Hawkeye said:
Pirating_Ninja said:
Captain-Hawkeye said:
Pirating_Ninja said:



Want to note that my favorite genre is Classical Rock ... however saying that the entirety of electronic takes 0 talent is RETARDED ... If this was true then why wouldn't everybody be making money off of some song or another ... Your other statement that Electronic is ONLY ON THE COMPUTER ... is also retarded... but there you go, ignorance is a disease you should rid yourself of soon ...


Singing is fine, but when you add auto-tune to it, no. And making money =/= being a musician.
And the others? 3 of the 4 videos posted were instrumental genius ... do those not count? Does disproving your retarded rant upset you in such a way that you feel the need to ignore it and in turn remain ignorant?

Also grats on missing the point I made, you took out of my statement that I was saying making $$$ = Musician? What are you, 8? Can you really not understand the logic I used, it was pretty simple, let me dummy it down for you though since it's clear you aren't too wise.

The fact that electronic music is a field in which there are artists that are more popular, and then there artists that aren't as popular, indicates that people see some artists as being "better" than others ... Now we take Joe Schmoe, he wants to be an Electronic Musician too, after all as you stated it takes 0 skill, but he doesn't understand how to use the software, nor does he have any musical talent, in other words he doesn't have an ear for what would sound good and will be popular. But! Electronic Music takes 0 skill to make, SO he succeeds in using whatever program he decided to use and makes a solid F note for 20 minutes ... Odd ... Isn't it? Supposedly it is something that takes no skill, yet, with no skill Joe Schmoe wasn't able to accomplish a thing.

Ignorance thy name is Captain-Hawkeye





Captain-Hawkeye said:
PachucoCadaver said:
Captain-Hawkeye said:
There's times and places where they can be used, but unless you play an instrument to make music, you're not a musician. How is this so hard to understand?

But, simpleton, the computer is an instrument if used as such, and it is used as such by electronic musicians.


Computers are tools, not musical instruments.
Musical Instrument: a device used to produce music

Idiot.


First, artist? Sure, I'll give them that, but not musician, since "computer" and "computer software" aren't instruments.

Second, again, computers are tools, they don't produce music. Musical instruments produce music.
Second time ignoring the main point I brought up about how many Electronic Musicians use "Real Instruments", so going to stop after this post, since you have ignored this twice now, in other words you are incompetent of actually realizing an err in your way of thinking. Rather simple-minded and dimwitted if you ask me, but of course that is just my opinion.

now then, You say that Musical Instruments are things that produce music, but a computer doesn't produce music? Are you perhaps saying that only Acoustic Instruments are "real instruments"? After all, w/o electricity an electric piano won't produce music, an electric guitar won't produce ... well I suppose it produces a sound ... But the definition of a Musical Instrument (or a tool in which music is produced) would include a computer if that is what you are using a computer for.
 
Jun 6, 2013 5:04 PM

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Captain-Hawkeye said:

Second, again, computers are tools, they don't produce music. Musical instruments produce music.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/tool

Just this once, I'll fulfill whatever your wish is.
 
Jun 6, 2013 5:23 PM

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Captain-Hawkeye said:

Second, again, computers are tools, they don't produce music. Musical instruments produce music.


Can't help but jump on the train and play the part of condescending prick #3 but musical instruments don't produce music, they make noises. Music is only produced when it's manipulated a certain way, much like a computer. To be sure it takes less skill since the person doing it doesn't really need to worry about keeping time unless they are inputting the entire thing from a keyboard in one take, most electronic composers don't manipulate the timbre to it's full extent and when it is done there is no need to do it in real time. That said the method to recording a studio album is usually a hell of a lot different to what you'd see live.

The only real difference is a composition done through a computer doesn't give you as much proof of your work as one done through a wooden box and a bit of string. Both the instrument and the computer are tools used to produce music, trying to gauge the skill or the work gone into a piece by working solely from the tool used would be ineffective.
 
Jun 6, 2013 5:29 PM

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That's the type of stuff I listen to if you say it uses electronics and not instruments your confused..anyway



I believe That a song made entirely with a computer Program using pre-recorded sounds with no effort isn't music

I believe Music created using a computer is music, because A lot of old video games music was used entirely with a computer and most consider that music.

I personally don't mind it, unless it is entirely relied on.
 
Jun 6, 2013 5:39 PM

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Electronic keyboards....?
 
Jun 6, 2013 5:49 PM

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Well you can shove it. Music is subjective and exists for those who enjoy it, not to be gauged by your plebeian standards.

 
Jun 6, 2013 7:30 PM

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What's to say a computer cannot be an instrument.
Let's face it, we have our wind/brass, our string, and our percussion instruments; it's only a matter of time before 'digital' becomes a variety of instrument.
 
Jun 6, 2013 8:02 PM

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ok

i go distroy the karpal rejions of some1 who plaes un instrument preferablyafuckingpianist

dey proseed to maek musik using the computor!!1!!11
 
Jun 7, 2013 12:47 AM

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DarChronicle said:
What's to say a computer cannot be an instrument.
Let's face it, we have our wind/brass, our string, and our percussion instruments; it's only a matter of time before 'digital' becomes a variety of instrument.


Its only a matter of time when computer completely takes over instruments.
Also OP is trolling.
lol @ img bbcode not working, mal is such a great site
 
Jun 7, 2013 12:51 AM
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biitchstick said:
Its only a matter of time when computer completely takes over instruments.

Hatsune Miku vs Tupac.
 
Jun 7, 2013 1:22 AM

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Music isn't even music guys, come on.
 
Jun 7, 2013 6:41 AM
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how many Electronic Musicians use "Real Instruments"


That's an oxymoron

Secondviennese said:
Captain-Hawkeye said:

Second, again, computers are tools, they don't produce music. Musical instruments produce music.


Can't help but jump on the train and play the part of condescending prick #3 but musical instruments don't produce music, they make noises. Music is only produced when it's manipulated a certain way, much like a computer. To be sure it takes less skill since the person doing it doesn't really need to worry about keeping time unless they are inputting the entire thing from a keyboard in one take, most electronic composers don't manipulate the timbre to it's full extent and when it is done there is no need to do it in real time. That said the method to recording a studio album is usually a hell of a lot different to what you'd see live.

The only real difference is a composition done through a computer doesn't give you as much proof of your work as one done through a wooden box and a bit of string. Both the instrument and the computer are tools used to produce music, trying to gauge the skill or the work gone into a piece by working solely from the tool used would be ineffective.


And you can't b a musician unless you play an instrument. I play all kinds of things on my computer, but I don't consider myself a musician, a gamer, programmer, etc. because I can do these things on my computer.

biitchstick said:
DarChronicle said:
What's to say a computer cannot be an instrument.
Let's face it, we have our wind/brass, our string, and our percussion instruments; it's only a matter of time before 'digital' becomes a variety of instrument.


Its only a matter of time when computer completely takes over instruments.
Also OP is trolling.


I'm being serious.
"There is no more effective method of concealment than the broadest publicity."
"naw just be like "in facist america burger is you comrade""
"if maps are hard, suicide is impossible"
 
Jun 7, 2013 8:20 AM

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Anyone who says Electronic artists are not musicians are either so uneducated that their opinions don't matter in the first place, and thus aren't worth discussion.

OR;

They're trolling
 
Jun 7, 2013 9:34 AM

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If you're not trolling i hope you realize how stupid you look in front of everybody in this forum right now but i shouldn't have said that cuz you're trolling.
lol @ img bbcode not working, mal is such a great site
 
Jun 7, 2013 9:37 AM
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biitchstick said:
If you're not trolling i hope you realize how stupid you look in front of everybody in this forum right now but i shouldn't have said that cuz you're trolling.
But.. your username..
 
Jun 7, 2013 9:58 AM

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toothbrush said:
biitchstick said:
If you're not trolling i hope you realize how stupid you look in front of everybody in this forum right now but i shouldn't have said that cuz you're trolling.
But.. your username..

what about it, Toothbrush?
lol @ img bbcode not working, mal is such a great site
 
Jun 7, 2013 10:05 AM
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Posts: 1845
biitchstick said:
toothbrush said:
biitchstick said:
If you're not trolling i hope you realize how stupid you look in front of everybody in this forum right now but i shouldn't have said that cuz you're trolling.
But.. your username..

what about it, Toothbrush?
it's lovely. are you an angel?
 
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