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May 12, 2013 12:37 PM

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On the question of why not <a href="#">...

Most people do this when they want a "link" to fire some javascript event. They use "#" for the href because without an href, the browser won't make the link keyboard focusable.

The problem arises when javascript is broken or not loaded. Clicking on that link will end up sending people to the "top" of the page (not the desired behavior).

When you have something clickable that you want to require javascript to use, a BUTTON should be used instead of an anchor (a button is keyboard focusable). If the button does not POST back to the server when there is no javascript, then the button itself should be added to the DOM with javascript. That way there isn't something there for people to focus/click that doesn't do anything.

------------------------

On the question of why your class names aren't good...

Separation of concerns on the web (this can be tough to get your head around at first):
1. HTML (content and structure)
2. CSS (presentation)
3. ECMAScript (behavior)

When you have an element with class="right red" you are putting presentation information into the content layer. What if I want to change it to be left and blue? Now you would have to change the content in order to change the presentation (this is not good).

Let's look at an example (based on your code but edited for example):
<section class="reviews">
<a class="red right" href="writeReviewPage">Write a review</a>

The CSS for the review link:
.red { background-color: #830000;}
.right {float: right;}

A better way to have your markup and CSS:
<section class="reviews">
<a class="review" href="writeReviewPage">Write a review</a>

CSS:
a.review {background-color: #830000; float: right;}

With this, if you want to make change the review button left and blue, all you have to do is make a change to the presentation layer (CSS) for that link, which is the whole point of having a presentation layer separate from the content.

If you really want to get clever and take it another step to reduce possibly unneeded markup:
<section class="reviews">
<a href="writeReviewPage">Write a review</a>

section.reviews a[href=writeReviewPage]{background-color: #830000; float: right;} 
/* this won't work in old stuff like IE6 though */



Some resources:
[url=http://www.456bereastreet.com]http://www.456bereastreet.com for accessibility and css stuff
[url=http://www.howtocreate.co.uk]http://www.howtocreate.co.uk just a good quick reference

dperolio said:
And no, it's better to link from Google's CDN because their servers are much faster, and it's likely people will already have it cached, so it won't add any loading time or HTTP requests at all.
... not with NoScript and RequestPolicy blocking it. ^_^ I realize that most people don't block everything like I do, but your site will still likely end up "not working" on my first visit if you depend on 3rd parties for functionality. What can I say... blocking 3rd party content and watching websites break amuses me...
 
May 12, 2013 1:02 PM

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BurntJelly said:


I'm not going to argue with you, but again I just do it the same as Google, MSN, Mashable, etc. If it's good enough for them, I'm sure it will be good enough for me. As for supporting IE6... I have no plans of it. :p IE8 maybe, but probably only IE9+. Even Bootstrap is dropping support from IE8 and below.

Your fancy selector is also a poor performant CSS selector, and I would advise against it if you want to save speed (which I do). Sure the HTML markup is a bit messier/bloated, but in the end it leads to a bit faster website. Here's a decent read on CSS selector performance for you. http://csswizardry.com/2011/09/writing-efficient-css-selectors/

Modified by dperolio, May 12, 2013 2:34 PM
 
May 12, 2013 1:04 PM

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BurntJelly said:
On the question of why not <a href="#">...

Most people do this when they want a "link" to fire some javascript event. They use "#" for the href because without an href, the browser won't make the link keyboard focusable.

The problem arises when javascript is broken or not loaded. Clicking on that link will end up sending people to the "top" of the page (not the desired behavior).

When you have something clickable that you want to require javascript to use, a BUTTON should be used instead of an anchor (a button is keyboard focusable). If the button does not POST back to the server when there is no javascript, then the button itself should be added to the DOM with javascript. That way there isn't something there for people to focus/click that doesn't do anything.

When JavaScript isn't loaded than that is your smallest problem. Especially sending the user to the top..srsly. Who cares. I get your point but I see it rather as a fallback behaviour that is tolerable in case JS isn't available. Your reasons against it are all highly debatable or neglictible. Especially as there is - by all means - no absolute standard saying you have to use buttons. Otherwise Google, Apple and whoever wouldn't use href="#". They do it for a reason. There are nice papers about this topic scattered around the net.
And btw, buttons tend to screw up CSS as they need more styling than links (usually) to fit the page. Especially when your CSS is on a CDN.^^

BurntJelly said:
dperolio said:
And no, it's better to link from Google's CDN because their servers are much faster, and it's likely people will already have it cached, so it won't add any loading time or HTTP requests at all.
... not with NoScript and RequestPolicy blocking it. ^_^ I realize that most people don't block everything like I do, but your site will still likely end up "not working" on my first visit if you depend on 3rd parties for functionality. What can I say... blocking 3rd party content and watching websites break amuses me...

Depending on what you focus on, Lint, Chrome DevTools and similar performance .."advisers" say you should load from a CDN. Again, for reasons.
However loading it from Google is a lot better as dperolio said already, when a user has it already cached the site doesn't need to load it again.
I am using NoScript myself with autoblocking everything so I need to unblock every site I visit anyway (frequent sites are allowed, random sites temporarily) that's what I signed up for when I installed NoScript, arguing now against people using that because it breaks websites 3rd party content is a bit.. off?
I don't use Google CDN because.. Google and other minor reasons but if people really block something essential as that and having a site that doesn't work.. well.
 
May 12, 2013 8:43 PM

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gundam34 said:
Yes, a CSS customizable list is definitively a must. I don't understand what do you mean with clubs having "gotten out of hand" but if you mean "many people are using them" I fail to see how is that a bad thing.

I mean 'gotten out of hand' as in people making a club, it dieing and they make another and the whole cycle repeats itself. Especially the card clubs and roleplaying clubs. They could 'help' the servers by just deleting the clubs previous intention and just put all new information. Yes this brings up the point that means they would have to work to get people to get back interested, but if they don't want to do the work to get their club active again then they shouldn't have made it in the first place.

gundam34 said:
I agree wholeheartedly, buwie. I am even against bringing Asian live action into the site, since I consider them completely different mediums, even conflicting with each other. For example, when Haganai was made into anime people where rejoicing, but when the same public learned that it was going to be made into a Live action movie the author himself had to give a statement asking the fans to ignore it.


I wasn't saying it be an immediate addition but something to think about as an ease into the movies and tv shows. But I agree they are different mediums, but many are as you said live adaptations of anime and manga, and some people prefer the live adaptations better. But I see the VN and LN happening before the drama's do. To be honest.
 
May 13, 2013 3:29 AM

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I wasn't even aware this thread existed.

Very interesting...

I look forward to seeing how it turns out.
 
May 13, 2013 9:57 AM
Knight Radiant

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Very nice, like the design.

But:

"Go Premium to disable ads"

Excuse me?
 
May 14, 2013 6:30 AM

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The flashing hover is not neccesarily a problem,some might think of it as snappy.

It seems too much like a MAL ripoff though.
"Efficiency is not king, efficacy is."

Post a comment on my profile. Profile comments are fun.

 
May 14, 2013 7:14 AM

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bluedragon777 said:
The flashing hover is not neccesarily a problem,some might think of it as snappy.

It seems too much like a MAL ripoff though.


Flashing hover?
 
May 15, 2013 7:27 AM

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The grey words on the black background, hard to read. I actually do have a problem with my eyes before anyone asks but fuck - MAL is fine to me -_-.

Changing premium to donate and listing some of the benefits in the donate page would probably be a better choice. The people who are attracted to things like "premium" aspects would probably be disappointed by the lack of features and the ones who liked to donate and free users would probably be off-put by the "premium" word in the current system.

Aside from that, supposing there's different color choices then the design is great. I'd probably test it out at the least and perhaps stay if the functionality was better than MALs which is admittedly somewhat poor but at least easy to use.


dperolio said:
Can I just ask, if you had to pick your favorite thing about MAL, what would it be? (User profiles, anime/manga page set-up, forums, clubs, lists, etc.).


I think I'm with most people when I say the animelist and database. Both their ease of use/simplicity and their depth. General terms for sure but I think it's pretty obvious what I mean if you just compare it to another less popular site that has trouble with a less extensive and poorly maintained database along with clunky interfaces.

The forums/clubs/profiles are all nice additions but I wouldn't bother with this site if it wasn't for the aforementioned. I think I've said this before in another thread but I'll say it again, modern for modern's sake is bullshit. If you can't come up with a legit reason that doesn't have a drawback in functionality for a change saying because it's new won't cut it especially for people that still use a site like MAL.

Good luck and I hope it works out.

Edit: Forgot to mention, fansub groups are very useful for a large amount of people. It definitely isn't a waste of space to include them.
Modified by Brotwo, May 15, 2013 7:40 AM
 
May 15, 2013 8:36 AM

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Brotwo said:
Forgot to mention, fansub groups are very useful for a large amount of people. It definitely isn't a waste of space to include them.

I can't stress this enough, but this is extremely useful so it's better to keep it.
 
May 25, 2013 11:41 PM

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Unfortunately, I won't be including fansubs, as I agree with the stances of some other similar websites I know of. They're illegal (assuming the content has already been licensed --- and even if not, it's still controversial as to whether it's "legal" or not), and they hurt the anime market, since a lot of people just freeload off them. Both of these points are debatable and I don't want to start an argument, but that's the stance I'm going to take with them.

I haven't been doing nothing. I've decided to change the name to "animangos"; wanted something shorter and more original.

Anyway, I've done a couple more semi-versions. Here's the latest design sample I've done. Going to restart once again though, because it still doesn't seem right after looking at it. It still has a busy feel to it as well I think.

I need to force myself to go even simpler I think. It should be super clean, super easy to navigate, super easy to create and share lists, and find recommendations. I can semi-visualize what I want, just having a hard time putting it all together in the right package.

I would really like to do an HTML5 app for the website, as I think that would be best for sure, but I don't think I have the skills for that so I'll probably have to settle with a regular website for now.

Anyway, I'm not using this design, but feel free to give me your comments about it anyway. As you can see, I went with a largely "flat" concept this time, but still have some gradients and shadows. The idea was that the sidebar would be fixed and have a chrome-type scrollbar appear on hover for those that don't have a large enough resolution. The top orange bar would also be fixed. The sidebar would be able to be "minimized" to a 50 pixel width version with icons instead of as you see it. The idea would be to be able to easily drag and drop people/anime/manga to your followers/favorites/list. I also want the design to be fluid. Basically what I was going for in this design, but even cleaner and with a less busy feel.

EDIT: Oops, forgot to link the design. http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/7670/animangos.png

Here's a version with some of the dropdowns and sidebar scrollbar visible, and a different comments version:

http://img826.imageshack.us/img826/8741/animangosvis.png


All in all, I'm still interested in keeping a fixed left sidebar, fixed top header, and ability to drag and drop items to the sidebar; I just want to do it better than I did with this design. It needs to be very clean, content-focused, and not seem busy.
Modified by dperolio, May 26, 2013 12:23 AM
 
May 26, 2013 8:38 AM

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Your alternative will take so long to create not because you are basically alone doing it but - as I already said - you are a perfectionist and can't stick with one fucking idea.
This way a lot of criticism will kinda go to waste again because you change it completely for the next "preview". Do yourself and us a favor: stick with one idea and work with it.
Instead of starting each time all over again..
Your prior version was a bit busy looking, yes but that'd be easy to change as others and I pointed out. Otherwise it was great looking and well-thought out. Why throwing it - completely - away again?
I admit, this version looks cleaner (being a profile page this time) and I wouldn't mind if it this one's going live but the other version looked much better imo and gave much more functionality despite its flaws. It wasn't as overwhelming with information as this one (don't be confused, to have a clean design doesn't mean having less information). In this version it's just too much noise. While the navigation might be clearer, there's just too much text/images and as a user you don't know on what to focus. It feels cramped.
Too much pictures in the middle. Followers, Following should be under Anime/Manga as your site should be focused on those, not who follows who OR just make Followers/Following as links and display them when someone wants to see that.
Only two good things here: The sidebar (make the headers Anime List, Manga List and the featured stuff with its corresponding sublists retractable.) and the two Toolbars. Semantics of each toolbar is separated (ie. stuff regarding your account in the lower bar). However, how do you intend to get to your profile when you're not on your profile? Or do you intend to leave both toolbars displayed?
Modified by nantuko, May 26, 2013 8:42 AM
 
May 26, 2013 10:29 AM

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I agree with him, you are changing it a lot. Why not focus on one and make it perfect for what you want. You shouldn't be completely focused on how MAL users like it, they are used to this. Focus on new users and maybe the ones from the smaller sites like Anime Planet.

Well first it was myanimelist, now you're basing it off of hummingbird and facebook. It's not bad looking, the mood thing doesn't look very interesting though.
I see there is a like button for comments and a list of people you're following and who are following you. So does that mean this is going to be like twitter? How do you want people to interact?

I really like the banner, especially if it can be a gif. But is that all the customizing they can do? No other sorts of pictures or showing of your creativity like on here? The user's favorite anime and manga is below the followers showing what you think is important. Is the social aspect the main part of the whole webiste? In that case why don't you just make a site connected to MAL instead of a different one.

What's the featured anime and manga on the side panel? Is that you're own or what?

Is that a back button at the top? I don't think that's needed, you can push up your little account info up which will move the side info a little up. The side bar looks a little crowded.
Does that sidebar only show your own stats? Anyways I think each of the (completed, watching, on hold, plan to watch) thing is too big especially since it shows all of them for both anime and manga, you might not even need a top bar if you make those collapsible. And do you really need a "to the top" button that high up on the page?

I still don't like that you're labeling people if they choose to donate.
Modified by IntroverTurtle, May 26, 2013 10:33 AM
 
May 26, 2013 5:03 PM

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I like this a lot more than animanga stockpile, but this looks like an iPad app tbh. Now that I think about it, it looks eerily similar to the crunchyroll app.

I also see you plan on keeping the premium model :(
 
May 26, 2013 9:40 PM
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Ambient_ said:
I like this a lot more than animanga stockpile, but this looks like an iPad app tbh. Now that I think about it, it looks eerily similar to the crunchyroll app.

I also see you plan on keeping the premium model :(


Why does that matter, He has explicitly said it is for only a few features, and won't inhibit the actual normal user experience at all, they still have access to basically the whole site's functionality. Also he wants it to be like an ipad app, that was more or less the design goal this time around.
 
May 26, 2013 9:45 PM

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Dibes said:
Ambient_ said:
I like this a lot more than animanga stockpile, but this looks like an iPad app tbh. Now that I think about it, it looks eerily similar to the crunchyroll app.

I also see you plan on keeping the premium model :(


Why does that matter, He has explicitly said it is for only a few features, and won't inhibit the actual normal user experience at all, they still have access to basically the whole site's functionality. Also he wants it to be like an ipad app, that was more or less the design goal this time around.
Because he's labeling and seperating users, that's why. They get a nice big gold pro mark next to their name everywhere on the site, and of course other features that normal users don't get.
 
May 27, 2013 1:20 AM

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IntroverTurtle said:
Dibes said:
Ambient_ said:
I like this a lot more than animanga stockpile, but this looks like an iPad app tbh. Now that I think about it, it looks eerily similar to the crunchyroll app.

I also see you plan on keeping the premium model :(


Why does that matter, He has explicitly said it is for only a few features, and won't inhibit the actual normal user experience at all, they still have access to basically the whole site's functionality. Also he wants it to be like an ipad app, that was more or less the design goal this time around.
Because he's labeling and seperating users, that's why. They get a nice big gold pro mark next to their name everywhere on the site, and of course other features that normal users don't get.

Whether or not there is a premium option doesn't really affect me at all. It just seems out of place for a forum. I understand why Crunchyroll has a premium model, since it actually needs one to fund purchasing licenses and the like. I understand why sites like IGN need premium, since they've got employees and produce their own content. But dperolio has already expressed that he plans his site to be primarily run by the community (well at least episode summaries). So why are those contributors getting excluded from the pay? Unless dperolio plans to hire employees to manage the site, there really is no need for a premium model. But then again, even just ad-revenue suffices for most forums. In the end, it just seems like a cheap grab at extra money, and in the process, excludes the majority of users from experiencing the site in its entirety.

This would probably be the first site I've seen that has a premium model without a valid reason. Yes, its largely unobtrusive, but it just leaves a bad taste in the mouth.
Modified by Revenant_, May 27, 2013 2:22 AM
 
May 27, 2013 7:22 AM

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Ambient_ said:
It just seems out of place for a forum. I understand why Crunchyroll has a premium model, since it actually needs one to fund purchasing licenses and the like. I understand why sites like IGN need premium, since they've got employees and produce their own content. But dperolio has already expressed that he plans his site to be primarily run by the community (well at least episode summaries). So why are those contributors getting excluded from the pay? Unless dperolio plans to hire employees to manage the site, there really is no need for a premium model. But then again, even just ad-revenue suffices for most forums. In the end, it just seems like a cheap grab at extra money, and in the process, excludes the majority of users from experiencing the site in its entirety.

This would probably be the first site I've seen that has a premium model without a valid reason. Yes, its largely unobtrusive, but it just leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about, do you? Please stop spreading such nonsense in such a hateful manner.
Servers cost money. Money that ads don't bring in. You are more or less lucky when your ads suffice what's rarely the case.
Ads that usually need to be clicked to get you a fraction of a cent, just showing them is useless. Most (smart) people on the internetz use some kind of AdBlocker and don't see these ads in the first place. Also it's a nice thing to let people pay if and only if they want.
In addition dperolios site would be community driven but he has to put in some work as well to keep it running and evolving (support and stuff as well), work that he could get paid for everywhere else. Asking people to pay is perfectly valid.

While I respect the criticism that you people bring (I don't understand it, though) don't exaggerate before anything is decided.
Let's rather focus on kicking dperolios butt to actually put something live.
 
May 27, 2013 8:28 AM

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There wasn't any hate in my response at all, just my opinion. Admittedly, much of it was just speculations based on observations, so please, tell me how every other forum is able to suffice with just advertising and other passive income schemes? It's not like acquiring an audience is going to be terribly hard for this site, with how much of a niche anime websites are. And dperolio has already done some very effective advertisement for his upcoming site here on MAL. It's also strategically timed, since MAL has become stale and begun its decline. Lots of MAL users will inevitably flock to the more superior option.

And its not so much asking, when you're deliberately excluding features to entice them to pay. A donation button is asking, this is just a subscription.

And you're making it sound that I'm just insulting him. I've been encouraging him back since he started designing things for MAL, starting from when sought help for his animelist design, to when he released his modern mal mockup, and up till now. And I still intend to encourage him throughout his projects. I'm just raising an issue which I honestly couldn't care less about, but I know that it'll be a concern for many people, as has already been expressed by various people in this thread.
Modified by Revenant_, May 27, 2013 8:42 AM
 
May 27, 2013 8:41 AM

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Encouragement is absolutely fine. Sharp criticism too, but the way you spread that nonsense is quite negative, mean and most of all partly very wrong.
If you want to know how forums survive look for yourself how people make or don't make money with websites and how and where they keep it running. There are more than enough possible sources of information. I make no money with my site (there's more to it than you can see), I just put my money in it. Knowing that I wouldn't make the cut with ads because I looked intensively around for this. That's that.

Ambient_ said:
Also its not so much asking, when you're deliberately excluding features to entice them to pay. A donation button is asking, this is just a subscription.

Don't be ridiculous. "deliberately excluding features" What features? There's nothing out yet and people on MAL are already bitching about it. Typically MAL, huh. So far all is theory and thoughts.
I am just saying hold your horses aka preconceptions and wait until there's real reason to go on a rampage.
Focus on what's important now: getting dperolio to put something live that he sticks with.
 
May 27, 2013 9:03 AM

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Alright, fine. I'll hold my "rampage" until dperolio releases more about what he's going to do with this premium model. But I still think that the features would have to be at least somewhat substantial to really call it "premium". Otherwise I reckon it'd be wiser to call it something like "Donation with benefits" since Premium/Pro has such a negative connotation to users, as well as an expectation to the quality/quantity of benefits it entails.

And really, this issue shouldn't really impede dperolio's progress, since all he's focusing on is the design at the moment, rather than the minor features, which this is pertinent to.
Modified by Revenant_, May 27, 2013 9:23 AM
 
May 27, 2013 10:14 AM

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Ambient_ said:
Otherwise I reckon it'd be wiser to call it something like "Donation with benefits" since Premium/Pro has such a negative connotation to users, as well as an expectation to the quality/quantity of benefits it entails.

Well, I can at least agree to that. But what dperolio does so far is more or less a working draft. I'd prefer sponsor in that case as a status, too.
However, this issue won't impede him, true, but the disussion around it surely deflects the more important things now as this is a rather sensitive topic as it seems. Even though as a whole it's just a tiny thing in a greater project.
 
May 27, 2013 2:24 PM

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dperolio said:
Unfortunately, I won't be including fansubs, as I agree with the stances of some other similar websites I know of. They're illegal (assuming the content has already been licensed --- and even if not, it's still controversial as to whether it's "legal" or not), and they hurt the anime market, since a lot of people just freeload off them. Both of these points are debatable and I don't want to start an argument, but that's the stance I'm going to take with them.

You really need to look up how much we "help" anime industry, at all. Also, that's a very outdated belief and it's just going to hurt your website (from every perspective). We're not starting an argument but take that as bro tip because you'll really need it.

nantuko said:
I make no money with my site (there's more to it than you can see), I just put my money in it. Knowing that I wouldn't make the cut with ads because I looked intensively around for this. That's that.

What's your website about again? The way you imply that ads are not reliable it's very far fetched. It is but only when you have traffic and focused content. While it's true that most people use Adblock, you mentioned yourself the user would still need to click in the ad so it could have succesfully made it's job, and less than 10% usually does that (either because the content is irrelevant or simply uninterested, e.g 4chan ads), with or without Adblock the situation would be the same for most part.

I agree with nantuko and IntroverTurtle for most part in the design choices. I also believe it's better to focus on one design instead of just messing around with different ones or you'll never get anywhere, if you want to at least. One last thing: If you'll still insist in using the "Premium" thing, then I'd recommend you to at least listen to the users and use "donate" instead so we it doesn't leave a bad taste in the mouth (like Ambient said). Otherwise, the scheme is likely not to work because you need to make your website "worth" of that purchase. What I mean by that is that you need to give the impression that your website will have what we don't - and work on that image (that's how YouTube and many successful websites are working now).
 
May 27, 2013 8:25 PM

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dperolio said:
Here's a decent read on CSS selector performance for you. http://csswizardry.com/2011/09/writing-efficient-css-selectors/
Neat! Thanks.
 
May 27, 2013 11:22 PM

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About the first design, from an aesthetic point of view it looks great. That issue about the switching to staff & cast and others isn't really an issue, I have to defend it. It doesn't take much time to click on the link to the specific page you want to see, not more than a second and not much more to just turn back. My only complain would be that the main anime page is very long, very very long.
I'm also not fond of that premium button. I agree that isn't needed in any way. If you want to implement the option for users to donate, simply do it, but I wouldn't go as far as granting donators special features, whatever it may be and even if it wouldn't be missed by users that do not donate. It doesn't really matter which benefits would come with it, stuff like this is no good.

As for your new design idea (why not just stick with the current and change here and there if you aren't satisfied? A project like this is huge and I mean HUGE huge. You said yourself it will take few years to finish, so I suppose you know that and I don't want to hold a speech to you about your responsibilities.), it simply reminds me of facebook (I joined there once again, but for certain purposes, as soon as I can I will leave this hell filled with filth), especially the upper part. I hate facebook. I liked the previous idea and design better and I found the name pretty original also. It kinda gives the idea about what you're facing, unlike "animangos", err just no.

I most likely won't join your site, whatever it may look like. But I wish you good luck on your "mission" and that you finally decide on a friggin' design and stick to it and finish it. I'm a perfectionist myself, but there are limits to it. However, keep up the good work and even while I'm not a supporter of your idea in general, I'm a supporter to your talent and I'm curious as to how you will use it to create the project that is like you desired it to be and that will make users happy.
 
May 31, 2013 7:24 PM

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I was a little disappointed that you changed the whole look...until I saw the new design. I have to say I LOVE IT!

A few things I have to side with people on: The followers and following. Should be under the favorite anime and manga. I also don't think you should have followers at all. Following is fine though. Cause I have to agree with Turtle...it looks a lot like twitter, as as much as I like the blue bird I'm really not keen on it mixing with my anime sites. At least not a glaring aspect. The logout button. Please move it to the top, or somewhere closer to the top, or even a link to log out in a drop down menu. I hate having to scroll down to log out >.< It's a very big turn off for me. And the like and dislike on the comments. Are you trying to be Youtube and facebook?

I however don't mind so much the lack of expression on the profile. It gives people interested a chance to TALK to you, instead of read your profile. Because not many people bother to read about me's anyway. So I like the lack of expression. Plus I think it would cut back on the server strain. Especially if you are wanting to focus more on other features of the site.
 
Jun 1, 2013 4:14 AM

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Amazing... What languages did you use? Not too familiar with javascript so I can't tell if it uses it.
 
Jun 1, 2013 5:54 PM

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Sorry for the long wait guys. I think some of you have some misconceptions about some of the functionality of how I planned this design to work. Remember though, I'm working on a new design, so this design won't be used. Again, I still like the critiques, but don't be surprised when I post another new, "completely different" design. I don't plan to make any more design after the one I'm currently working on though, so if it doesn't seem favored, we'll see where to go from there in regards to my former designs. I understand all your concerns about the Premium/PRO thing already, let's avoid that discussion for now please. :p
nantuko said:
Your alternative will take so long to create not because you are basically alone doing it but - as I already said - you are a perfectionist and can't stick with one fucking idea.
This way a lot of criticism will kinda go to waste again because you change it completely for the next "preview". Do yourself and us a favor: stick with one idea and work with it.
Instead of starting each time all over again..

You know me very well. :p I like you. That being said, I know what you say is true, but I can't change who I am or how I feel. I don't feel any of your criticism are "wasted" because they help me realize what's important to you and improve upon it in my next attempt, I like to think anyway.
nantuko said:
Your prior version was a bit busy looking, yes but that'd be easy to change as others and I pointed out. Otherwise it was great looking and well-thought out. Why throwing it - completely - away again?
I admit, this version looks cleaner (being a profile page this time) and I wouldn't mind if it this one's going live but the other version looked much better imo and gave much more functionality despite its flaws. It wasn't as overwhelming with information as this one (don't be confused, to have a clean design doesn't mean having less information). In this version it's just too much noise. While the navigation might be clearer, there's just too much text/images and as a user you don't know on what to focus. It feels cramped.
Too much pictures in the middle. Followers, Following should be under Anime/Manga as your site should be focused on those, not who follows who OR just make Followers/Following as links and display them when someone wants to see that.
Only two good things here: The sidebar (make the headers Anime List, Manga List and the featured stuff with its corresponding sublists retractable.) and the two Toolbars. Semantics of each toolbar is separated (ie. stuff regarding your account in the lower bar). However, how do you intend to get to your profile when you're not on your profile? Or do you intend to leave both toolbars displayed?

I agree with pretty much everything you said here. You could get to your profile by clicking your name/avatar on the sidebar. Yes, both toolbars (sidebar and orange topnav) would be fixed.
IntroverTurtle said:
I agree with him, you are changing it a lot. Why not focus on one and make it perfect for what you want. You shouldn't be completely focused on how MAL users like it, they are used to this. Focus on new users and maybe the ones from the smaller sites like Anime Planet.

See my above response to nantuko.
IntroverTurtle said:
Well first it was myanimelist, now you're basing it off of hummingbird and facebook. I see there is a like button for comments and a list of people you're following and who are following you. So does that mean this is going to be like twitter? How do you want people to interact?

Yes, the plan is that this will be an anime social network list database. Think MAL but with an activity feed to see what your friends (following) have recently watched/done, be able to follow anime/manga for notifications when a change or sequel or something is added to the database, and being able to like/"vote up" content. There may be an option to sort by highest votes in a forum thread for instance, or there may not be; if there is though, that will be as far as it goes. It will mainly be there to award extra karma and highlight high rated content. Highly rated content will not be pushed up to overshadow other content though.

So I guess a mix of Facebook/Twitter/Reddit/MAL if you want to look at it that way.

For the record, Hummingbird never planned to go social like this, I had the idea first. >.>

IntroverTurtle said:
It's not bad looking, the mood thing doesn't look very interesting though.

I thought the mood thing was cute, just a quick extra to quickly see what mood someone's currently in when you visit their profile. Would also give extra reason to strike up a conversation on their profile, "Aww, what's up? Why are you feeling down?"
IntroverTurtle said:
I really like the banner, especially if it can be a gif. But is that all the customizing they can do? No other sorts of pictures or showing of your creativity like on here? The user's favorite anime and manga is below the followers showing what you think is important. Is the social aspect the main part of the whole webiste? In that case why don't you just make a site connected to MAL instead of a different one.

I don't know if I would say the main part of the whole website. You'll still have every feature MAL has, just more. And more notification/sharing-based. If you want, of course. You could just use it without any "social" features if you wanted.
IntroverTurtle said:
What's the featured anime and manga on the side panel? Is that you're own or what?

No, those would be either selected by weekly/monthly community poll or selected by the staff weekly/monthly. The little purple, red, green, etc. icons correspond to whether you've watched, are watching, dropped, etc. that particular item.
IntroverTurtle said:
Is that a back button at the top? I don't think that's needed, you can push up your little account info up which will move the side info a little up. The side bar looks a little crowded.
Does that sidebar only show your own stats? Anyways I think each of the (completed, watching, on hold, plan to watch) thing is too big especially since it shows all of them for both anime and manga, you might not even need a top bar if you make those collapsible. And do you really need a "to the top" button that high up on the page?

Nope, that was meant to be a toggle button at the top. Pushing it would slide the menu to the left and be a ~50px wide version (skinny) of the sidebar. Pressing it again would slide it right to show the full sidebar again.
The sidebar would be fixed. The logout and to the top buttons would be fixed to the bottom left of your screen.
BurntJelly said:
dperolio said:
Here's a decent read on CSS selector performance for you. http://csswizardry.com/2011/09/writing-efficient-css-selectors/
Neat! Thanks.

No problem. :)
SquChan said:
As for your new design idea (why not just stick with the current and change here and there if you aren't satisfied? A project like this is huge and I mean HUGE huge. You said yourself it will take few years to finish, so I suppose you know that and I don't want to hold a speech to you about your responsibilities.), it simply reminds me of facebook (I joined there once again, but for certain purposes, as soon as I can I will leave this hell filled with filth), especially the upper part. I hate facebook. I liked the previous idea and design better and I found the name pretty original also. It kinda gives the idea about what you're facing, unlike "animangos", err just no.

I most likely won't join your site, whatever it may look like. But I wish you good luck on your "mission" and that you finally decide on a friggin' design and stick to it and finish it. I'm a perfectionist myself, but there are limits to it. However, keep up the good work and even while I'm not a supporter of your idea in general, I'm a supporter to your talent and I'm curious as to how you will use it to create the project that is like you desired it to be and that will make users happy.

Sticking with "animangos." :p I think it's about the experience provided and not the name anyway. I mean, just look at "Google." >.> And yes, I know it's a problem of mine not being able to stick to a single design, but as you said, this is a HUGE project. I would establish a good design from the start, otherwise the project certainly won't go anywhere, and it would take a lot of effort to completely re-do it, whereas I can re-do it now as many times as I want until I'm satisfy with very little overhead involved since it's not connected with any backend or frontend. I appreciate your comments, and sorry to hear you aren't interested in joining something like this.
buwie said:
I was a little disappointed that you changed the whole look...until I saw the new design. I have to say I LOVE IT!

A few things I have to side with people on: The followers and following. Should be under the favorite anime and manga. I also don't think you should have followers at all. Following is fine though. Cause I have to agree with Turtle...it looks a lot like twitter, as as much as I like the blue bird I'm really not keen on it mixing with my anime sites. At least not a glaring aspect. The logout button. Please move it to the top, or somewhere closer to the top, or even a link to log out in a drop down menu. I hate having to scroll down to log out >.< It's a very big turn off for me. And the like and dislike on the comments. Are you trying to be Youtube and facebook?

I however don't mind so much the lack of expression on the profile. It gives people interested a chance to TALK to you, instead of read your profile. Because not many people bother to read about me's anyway. So I like the lack of expression. Plus I think it would cut back on the server strain. Especially if you are wanting to focus more on other features of the site.

Touched on most of this above. Glad you like the design, but again this probably won't be the one I'll use. :x
HauntingShock said:
Amazing... What languages did you use? Not too familiar with javascript so I can't tell if it uses it.

Thanks. :p Yup, just HTML/CSS/Javascript.


Oh, forgot to say, you would have more customization of course. That was the profile "hub"/main page. If you'll notice here's a link to About Me which would have your bio and things like that.
 
Jun 3, 2013 10:04 PM

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I don't mind MAL's design. Certainly, you're page looks better, but many of the changes aren't necessary as far as functionality goes. The rating slider, for example, while easier to use, really only saves the user a half page scroll down compared to MAL, not to mention most users will probably prefer adding, rating, editing watch information about anime from their lists. The title language change would perhaps be best implemented in the user profile, although since most users cannot read Hiragana it seems superfluous. And unless you anticipate these pages to be user-updated, I don't see the point of the "Edit this page" and "Report this page" buttons.

I agree with the other users that the layout is too busy. The darker, contrasty colors add to that perception, but the animated review scores, for example, while they look cool at first, distract the user from what should be the highlight of the section -- the actual reviews -- and are wholly unnecessary in my opinion. The header and especially the sidebar, which lose that "fixed" effect as you reach the top or bottom, seem to add more moving parts. Perhaps the header could be excused as it is helpful, although I suggest that it should persist even at the top of the page (if you need a large logo, put it in the home page); I would also suggest that the header should be only half as tall, it should not take up so much UI real estate for what is essentially a menu. I suggest you keep your theme to light colors so that users focus on the text. The best website designs are often ones that don't stand out, but facilitate functionality of the site. Less is more.
My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com
THE CHAT CLUB.
 
Jun 4, 2013 3:00 AM
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katsucats said:
Less is more.


agreed, Minimalism is the trend in web design now a days anyway too
 
Jun 10, 2013 1:01 PM

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Sorry guys, still working on it. >.> Creating a design, but keeping it to no design is actually pretty tough.

I'm also working on making it responsive, which I've never worked with before (usable on cell phones and tablets). Having a lot of fun, but going very slowly.

Hopefully I'll be able to give a preview or something in a couple of days.
 
Jun 10, 2013 8:40 PM

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We'll be waiting. I'm kinda hyped up for it now.
 
Jun 13, 2013 5:48 AM

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Niyawa said:
We'll be waiting. I'm kinda hyped up for it now.


Same here :D
 
Jun 26, 2013 8:09 PM

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Got hacked? ._.
 
Jun 26, 2013 8:13 PM

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HauntingShock said:
Got hacked? ._.

I asked him about it four days ago...

Seems it still hasn't been fixed.
 
Jun 26, 2013 8:51 PM
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D4rkR4v3nz and ManSyk3z...

Us1ng numb3rs 1s th3 n3w c00l th1ng t0 d0.
 
Jun 26, 2013 9:20 PM

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Yeah, sorry. It seems I no longer have access to my files. Working on contacting my host. :x
 
Jun 26, 2013 11:00 PM

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Site was hacked? That sucks. What immature skids leave their names after a sucessful infiltration? That's just like a kid getting away with stealing then writing "I was here" all over where it was stolen. Anyways, I hope the site can be fixed and I can view it as it was originally intended.
 
Jul 8, 2013 11:32 PM

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Alright guys, after doing a couple more drafts, I've finally got a preview to show.

I should post a more expanded preview not too far off. Might even post a live preview of a few pages. Just letting you know I'm still here, slow as I am. :p

I know you can't see much here, sorry about that, just some brief preview images taken from the browser, for now:

http://puu.sh/3ysnd.jpg - Desktop (1920x1080)
http://puu.sh/3yspf.jpg - Tablet
http://puu.sh/3ysrN.jpg - Phone, menu opened
 
Jul 8, 2013 11:36 PM
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dperolio said:
Alright guys, after doing a couple more drafts, I've finally got a preview to show.

I should post a more expanded preview not too far off. Might even post a live preview of a few pages. Just letting you know I'm still here, slow as I am. :p

I know you can't see much here, sorry about that, just some brief preview images taken from the browser, for now:

http://puu.sh/3ysnd.jpg - Desktop (1920x1080)
http://puu.sh/3yspf.jpg - Tablet
http://puu.sh/3ysrN.jpg - Phone, menu opened


Looks really really nice! I can't wait till the live preview comes out :D
 
Jul 8, 2013 11:37 PM
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dperolio said:
Alright guys, after doing a couple more drafts, I've finally got a preview to show.

I should post a more expanded preview not too far off. Might even post a live preview of a few pages. Just letting you know I'm still here, slow as I am. :p

I know you can't see much here, sorry about that, just some brief preview images taken from the browser, for now:

http://puu.sh/3ysnd.jpg - Desktop (1920x1080)
http://puu.sh/3yspf.jpg - Tablet
http://puu.sh/3ysrN.jpg - Phone, menu opened


the design looks good but will there be separate forums for each anime entries btw? since Hummingbird do not have that great feature afaik
 
Jul 8, 2013 11:40 PM

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j0x said:
dperolio said:
Alright guys, after doing a couple more drafts, I've finally got a preview to show.

I should post a more expanded preview not too far off. Might even post a live preview of a few pages. Just letting you know I'm still here, slow as I am. :p

I know you can't see much here, sorry about that, just some brief preview images taken from the browser, for now:

http://puu.sh/3ysnd.jpg - Desktop (1920x1080)
http://puu.sh/3yspf.jpg - Tablet
http://puu.sh/3ysrN.jpg - Phone, menu opened


the design looks good but will there be separate forums for each anime entries btw? since Hummingbird do not have that great feature afaik


Thanks for the quick reply!

And yes, there will be separate forums for each anime and manga. :)
 
Jul 8, 2013 11:41 PM
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dperolio said:
And yes, there will be separate forums for each anime and manga. :)


cool news and btw this design looks like facebook so are you planning to add members chatbox too just like facebook has?
 
Jul 8, 2013 11:43 PM
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Great update!
 
Jul 9, 2013 12:25 AM

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Meh. Why do you insist on dark themes?
 
Jul 9, 2013 1:53 AM

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Looks great! I'm guessing the cover photo scales with browser window width? Will you impose a file size limit for it? I'm a bit worried about pixelation at larger resolutions.


I also think it may need a bit more color. It doesn't look that inviting tbh.
 
Jul 9, 2013 1:57 AM
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Ambient_ said:
I also think it may need a bit more color. It doesn't look that inviting tbh.


nah its just too dark, he can just change the black colors to the blue color that MAL uses and it will be alright
 
Jul 9, 2013 2:07 AM

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it definitely does look interesting and i have to admit i'm excited how it'll look like in the end. but i also have to agree with some other people here - i don't really like the dark colors. of course that's just a minor issue. but i think it was you who had an option to change the color in of the previous versions (if it wasn't you and i just confuse it with another preview right now, then take a look here. in the right left corner you can change the colors of the website). why don't you do the same thing? being able to switch between light and dark colors would be amazing. just an idea.
 
Jul 9, 2013 2:07 AM

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j0x said:
Ambient_ said:
I also think it may need a bit more color. It doesn't look that inviting tbh.


nah its just too dark, he can just change the black colors to the blue color that MAL uses and it will be alright


Blue and red don't mix well lol. I was thinking of using red for the highlights in the sidebar. But that'll mean that he'd have to use red for the topbar highlights as well, and that'll conflict with the dropdown color. Dunno, unless he changes the color scheme.
 
Jul 9, 2013 2:14 AM
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Ambient_ said:
Blue and red don't mix well lol


facebook has red (notifications) and blue since his design reminds me a lot of facebook new interface
 
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