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Advanced MPC-HC Setup Guide - with madVR (v1.2) (Read note on first post)

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Sep 2, 2013 10:41 PM

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Jrittmayer said:
The TV I use now (an 32 inch LG LED HDTV) claims a 120Hz refresh rate but my PC only lets it go up to 60Hz, is this because the refresh rate isn't a true 120Hz or something?

LG TVs are known for using bad terms, such as 120hz for 60hz with interpolation. However only you can say if it's a 120hz or not cause I don't have the TV serial number myself. A simple Google search will tell you though.
 
Sep 5, 2013 9:07 PM
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Need help, in the screenshot with the statistics, for 10-bit it says frames dropped, but for me both 8 and 10-bit say frame-repeat. Is this a problem? How do I fix it?
 
Sep 6, 2013 4:34 AM

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Ahnime said:
Need help, in the screenshot with the statistics, for 10-bit it says frames dropped, but for me both 8 and 10-bit say frame-repeat. Is this a problem? How do I fix it?

I need more info first, how many dropped frames? Are they constant or just from the start of the video? How long is the cooldown between frame repeat? Using ReClock you should expect hours, without ReClock seconds.
 
Sep 6, 2013 5:45 AM
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madVR does not play well with Virtu technology at all, especially I-mode. I always used to game a lot so I almost always used Virtu's D-mode. But since I've cut back on the GPU intensive gaming, I switched to I-mode.

I easily noticed 720p or higher anime had sluggishness come up, whether it hardware acceleration could be used for the anime or not. Evangelion 1.11 (1080p, 8 bit) just got slaughtered when I used the seek bar to jump ahead. (Seeking is always a bit slugghish with MadVR)

Should I expecting such issues from a stock i5-2500k + Intel HD 3000 + 7950.
 
Sep 6, 2013 8:19 AM
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I was using this setup on my previous PC, but I bought a new laptop, this one needs a 64bit system, so since there is always "download/install 32bit", will this work on 64bit without problems ?

And I have another question, which one is "better" since now I can choose both.
CUVID for NVidia GPUs.
QuickSync for Sandy Bridge architecture or newer.

I even installed just a K-Lite mega codeck pack, but after comparison I want this setup again :D

It seems that I can find "search this thread option" and reading 40+ pages is not entertaining enough. Sorry if it was already asked.
Modified by rankor, Sep 6, 2013 8:30 AM
 
Sep 6, 2013 8:46 AM

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roninmedia said:
Should I expecting such issues from a stock i5-2500k + Intel HD 3000 + 7950.

I don't know? My experience with virtual box is very little to none. Besides this is way beyond my range of support.


rankor said:
I was using this setup on my previous PC, but I bought a new laptop, this one needs a 64bit system, so since there is always "download/install 32bit", will this work on 64bit without problems ?

Yes. x64 systems are completely compatible with x86 programs.

rankor said:
And I have another question, which one is "better" since now I can choose both.
CUVID for NVidia GPUs.
QuickSync for Sandy Bridge architecture or newer.

Depends on what your goal is. CUVID is generally more useful since it can be used for decoding of video both in playback and in encoding, it also does some good for image and video editing. QuickSync is just Intel's version of DXVA2 as far as I'm aware. For this guide? I'd recommend not using any DXVA, they're more problem than usually worth.

rankor said:
I even installed just a K-Lite mega codeck pack, but after comparison I want this setup again :D

Wise decision.

rankor said:
It seems that I can find "search this thread option" and reading 40+ pages is not entertaining enough. Sorry if it was already asked.

No problem. I only have gripe with questions that you can find by easily reading the guide throughly or just doing a simple Google search. Also can you check if you made a double post? Or maybe it's a bug with the forum, I dunno.
 
Sep 6, 2013 9:33 AM
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Niyawa said:

No problem. I only have gripe with questions that you can find by easily reading the guide throughly or just doing a simple Google search. Also can you check if you made a double post? Or maybe it's a bug with the forum, I dunno.


I see our posts on page 43 and 44, so just some weird bug.

Thanks for answers :)
 
Sep 7, 2013 9:35 AM
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Hello. I was wondering WHY in the WORLD I'm getting dropped frames with a GTX 680 on the High (not even highest) settings.

My specs are:

  • GA-H67MA-UD2H-B3
  • Core i5-2400
  • 4 GB DDR3 RAM (1333 MHz, Corsair Value Select)
  • NVidia GeForce GTX 680, reference design


I don't thing the hard drive matters, but it's a 2 TB Seagate one, with 64 MB cache. I'm on 1920x1080 screen res. Surely, If I can play Batman: Arkham City with stuff maxed out, this shouldn't be an issue. The video I'm playing (MediaInfo):

Modified by hameer3, Sep 8, 2013 4:57 AM
 
Sep 7, 2013 11:55 PM

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hameer3 said:
Hello. I was wondering WHY in the WORLD I'm getting dropped frames with a GTX 680 on the High (not even highest) settings.

Are they constant or just at the start of the video? If it's at the start of the video that's okay, it always happens.

If not, then are you sure your GTX is being used? I've had issues with Intel overriding GPU work with their integrated graphics. Make sure to make an exception in NVidia Control Panel/you name it to always use the graphics card with MPC-HC/BE.

Also, I'd appreciate if you could apply a spoiler tag in the MediaInfo text. Just to make things more clean.
 
Sep 8, 2013 4:27 AM

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notice you said there is a way to "make an exception in NVidia Control Panel/you name it to always use the graphics card with MPC-HC/BE".......wondering how you do this? would be a great help to me and thanks for all yr. hard work!
 
Sep 8, 2013 5:14 AM
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Niyawa said:
Are they constant or just at the start of the video?

Every few seconds, a frame is dropped. The rest is ordinary, and I'm not bothered about it. (start, switching from windowed to full or vice versa, scanning)
Niyawa said:
If not, then are you sure your GTX is being used?

I'm fairly certain the GPU is being used, as it jumps up from ~2% to ~25% according to GPU-Z at the start of video playback. XVID isn't played via CUVID, so that can't be the issue in this instance. Also, the CPU stays at <10% always, and the RAM at <1.5 GB (out of 4). All I can say is that MadVR is under-utilizing my system, at the cost of dropped frames.

Is the MPC-HC built-in subtitle viewer the source of the issue? I'll try installing your preferred one, and check then, and report back.

Edit: No go. Subtitles are lower quality (low-res) AND the dropped frames are the same.
Niyawa said:
Also, I'd appreciate if you could apply a spoiler tag in the MediaInfo text.

Done. Sorry about the wall of text.

Also, thanks for taking the time to reply. :)
octal9 said:
notice you said there is a way to "make an exception in NVidia Control Panel/you name it to always use the graphics card with MPC-HC/BE".......wondering how you do this? would be a great help to me and thanks for all yr. hard work!

+1 for this. I've been through the panel and can't see such a setting. I'm not on Optimus (which, I believe is only for laptops).
Modified by hameer3, Sep 8, 2013 5:29 AM
 
Sep 9, 2013 4:50 AM

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hameer3 said:
Every few seconds, a frame is dropped. The rest is ordinary, and I'm not bothered about it. (start, switching from windowed to full or vice versa, scanning)

In that case, give me a screenie of your OSD panel after a few minutes of playback so I can check it out if it's a madVR related problem or not.

hameer3 said:
I'm fairly certain the GPU is being used, as it jumps up from ~2% to ~25% according to GPU-Z at the start of video playback. XVID isn't played via CUVID, so that can't be the issue in this instance. Also, the CPU stays at <10% always, and the RAM at <1.5 GB (out of 4). All I can say is that MadVR is under-utilizing my system, at the cost of dropped frames.

You can try increasing the queue in madVR's options (general settings). The more queue you put, the more system resources it will use. Do it with caution though, values that are too high might cause more strain than it's necessary.

hameer3 said:
Is the MPC-HC built-in subtitle viewer the source of the issue? I'll try installing your preferred one, and check then, and report back.

You're not supposed to use that one as far as performance goes but I don't think so. I mean it happens in all the videos you watch right?

hameer3 said:
octal9 said:
notice you said there is a way to "make an exception in NVidia Control Panel/you name it to always use the graphics card with MPC-HC/BE".......wondering how you do this? would be a great help to me and thanks for all yr. hard work!

+1 for this. I've been through the panel and can't see such a setting. I'm not on Optimus (which, I believe is only for laptops).

Ahhh... I'm not so sure myself. I... don't have a NVidia hardware so I've never touched their Control Panel. It might be an option only available through Optimus as far as I'm concerned (since they're constantly changing which GPU is used for better battery life). I'm sorry but that's as far as my knowledge takes me.
Modified by Niyawa, Sep 10, 2013 9:22 PM
 
Sep 10, 2013 12:35 PM

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Hye!! i have done exactly as you tell except using reclock i since it optional.so my spec is :
GC:Sapphire HD 7750
CPU:AMD athlon dual core 3.4 GHZ
my problem is when i ply 10 bit video
it's says [1 FRAME REPEATED EVERY 42.59 second] and if i ply 8 bit video like horriblesubs it become more worse 1 frame repeate after 5 second the dropped frame for 10 bit in 4 minute playing is 178 delayed 31.So i want to ask how come the picture for true 10 bit is [1 FRAME REPEATED EVERY 16.18 HOUR ] and the 8 bit is every 50 second.Did i messed up some setting ?
 
Sep 10, 2013 1:59 PM
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elevenletters said:
I get a little sound hiccup in the beginning of every video (0:02 mark)

That's normal if you're using Reclock in WASAPI mode.

Ryuzaki-light said:
horriblesubs it become more worse 1 frame repeate after 5 second the dropped frame for 10 bit in 4 minute playing is 178 delayed 31.

HorribleSubs' videos are always something like 23.810 or 29.97 fps, which is causing the repeated frames.

Ryuzaki-light said:
So i want to ask how come the picture for true 10 bit is [1 FRAME REPEATED EVERY 16.18 HOUR ] and the 8 bit is every 50 second.Did i messed up some setting ?

I see this problem on my end too and I'm not sure what causes it. The "1 frame repeat every 16.18 hours" is just an estimate. You shouldn't worry about it if there aren't any dropped or delayed frames. If you're getting dropped frames, move down one preset for the upscaling algorithms.
 
Sep 10, 2013 4:10 PM
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hameer3 said:
Hello. I was wondering WHY in the WORLD I'm getting dropped frames with a GTX 680 on the High (not even highest) settings.


My setup is i7, GTX660M and 8GB RAM.

I would give a LOT to know that, the problem is, I have framedrops on highest, but on high everything is allright, though Im using 1366x768, BUT the BIGGER problem is that fking Optimus, when Im playing anime, my GTX660 is not working* (it works only while while playing normal .mkv movie) and I have no idea how to force it :|.

I choose to use CUVID for video rendering but it doesn't change anything.

In the NVidia panel it seems that I can't change a "prefered graphic card" for MPC, its just the defult "Integrated graphic card"

If I find any solution I will be sure to post it here for future reference, for now Im stuck.

*I know it because you can set a tray icon "Usage of the NVidia card" and it shows what apps are using it :| and cmon, I shouldn't have any frame drops.
Modified by rankor, Sep 10, 2013 4:13 PM
 
Sep 10, 2013 6:14 PM
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rankor said:
In the NVidia panel it seems that I can't change a "prefered graphic card" for MPC, its just the defult "Integrated graphic card"

This isn't the first time someone has asked this. You have to go to the folder where you installed MPC-HC (e.g. "C:\Program Files (x86)\MPC-HC") and rename mpc-hc.exe to something else. mpc-hc2.exe for example. Then you can change the preferred graphics processor to your dedicated GPU.

@Niyawa
It wouldn't hurt to put this in the first post.
 
Sep 10, 2013 9:18 PM

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elevenletters said:
I get a little sound hiccup in the beginning of every video (0:02 mark) but apart from that I've definitely seen an improvement.

That's normal for ReClock. As mentioned in the guide, you can decrease that hiccup by using a lower ms for buffer settings.

Soulthus said:
That's normal if you're using Reclock in WASAPI mode.

It also happens with DirectSound, at least on my end.

Soulthus said:
It wouldn't hurt to put this in the first post.

Funny you say that. I was actually skimming through previous posts to see where was the post that explained how to deal with the whole Optimus thing so I could post it in my guide as a Protip. That will have to wait until next 1.3 update though (which is not far away).
 
Sep 11, 2013 6:36 AM
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Niyawa said:
In that case, give me a screenie of your OSD panel after a few minutes of playback so I can check it out if it's a madVR related problem or not.


This is a different video. 21-ish minutes. No major dropped frame increases, but delayed ones increased every ~30 secs. http://i.imgur.com/Ab4B9SO.png

GPU use jumped up from ~1% to ~17% this time around. Let me try playing a heavy-ish game to see if it goes above that.

Yup. Batman: AC maxed out takes it to max 78%. With madVR, it varies b/w 14 and 17.


Niyawa said:
You can try increasing the queue in madVR's options (general settings). The more queue you put, the more system resources it will use. Do it with caution though, values that are too high might cause more strain than it's necessary.


This last one is with 16 GPU and 32 CPU queue, highest settings.

Niyawa said:
You're not supposed to use that one as far as performance goes but I don't think so. I mean it happens in all the videos you watch right?


This last video was without subtitles. However, turning them on/off had no measurable effect on the duration b/w delayed frames.

Niyawa said:
Ahhh... I'm not so sure myself. I... don't have a NVidia hardware so I've never touched their Control Panel. It might be an option only available through Optimus as far as I'm concerned (since they're constantly changing which GPU is used for better battery life). I'm sorry but that's as far as my knowledge takes me.


It's normally in right-click on desktop -> Configure switchable graphics. You can set prefs for each app individually there.
 
Sep 11, 2013 8:30 AM
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Soulthus said:

This isn't the first time someone has asked this. You have to go to the folder where you installed MPC-HC (e.g. "C:Program Files (x86)MPC-HC") and rename mpc-hc.exe to something else. mpc-hc2.exe for example. Then you can change the preferred graphics processor to your dedicated GPU.

@Niyawa
It wouldn't hurt to put this in the first post.


You are my personal hero :D I have this laptop for 4 days, so I didn't do any serious looking for it since I have more important stuff to do.

No frame drop except the one that should be there.
Thanks, works perfectly.
 
Sep 11, 2013 3:32 PM

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kuuurt said:
Weird problem I came across with. I tried playing [Coalgirls]_The_Idolmaster_06_(1280x720_Blu-ray_FLAC)_[0A364040], and a madVR "Please wait a moment..." box comes up, which is followed by 2 error messages ("An error occurred in the application." and "An error occured in madVR.") After that, mpc-hc.exe doesn't respond, but the audio still plays. This is the first time this happened.

Not sure what I can do, I'm not a developer so I don't understand everything that screenshot is telling me. It doesn't seem to be a problem with your setup though so it's either madVR bug or a problem with the file itself. I recommend you to send a bug report to madshi or if you want post it in here (crash file, etc) so I can ask him for his opinion.

If you want to try a possible fix, re-install madVR (by overwriting the current folder with a new one) and try opening it again.

hameer3 said:
This is a different video. 21-ish minutes. No major dropped frame increases, but delayed ones increased every ~30 secs.

Hmmmmm... I don't believe the problem is related to PAL video, I have a sample here and no delays. I also see nothing out of ordinary in that OSD screenie. If you're using the same settings as this guide this shouldn't be a issue. Could you try higher backbuffer values and see if that does anything? I'll see what I can do on my end.

Make sure you're using update components and drivers too.

hameer3 said:
It's normally in right-click on desktop -> Configure switchable graphics. You can set prefs for each app individually there.

I see, thanks for the heads up.
 
Sep 11, 2013 8:19 PM
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Niyawa, excelent post.

I see marked improvements with Madvr using your 29/7/2013 guide. If I can make a suggestion to you: can you Bold "uncheck all internal filters in MPC-HC" bold an big, coz I miss this the first time and can't see any difference.

Anyway, I really can see the improvement after I reformat my system (windows 8) and re-installing the latest driver from individual manufacturer, NOT from the motherboard manufacturer.

To share with other users (who might have similar setup with me), here is my set-up: (beginning)
- MB : Asus H77-MPRO
- Intel 2470 (HD2500)
- M4 SSD 128 (My OS is here)
- 2 x 1 tb WD green (Sata 2) - independent
- 1 x 2tb WD green (Sata 3)
- Screen: Sharp 40L500M' (old model, 60 HZ)
- Audio: Carver 742 (really old 1992?), Jamo surround 100 (cheap old speaker)

After formatting, I made the WD 1 tb in RAID 0 Mode and get "copy" rate of 100+mb persec (need to install intell driver and set the write buffer cache to disable - google this for detail). - This 'may be' required if you are watching HD content from Blu Ray (8 GB) files (at least I can see diff when I watch from external HDD (Usb2?) - Bandwidth issue, I notice this when I copy the movie to SSD and play it from SSD.

Then I install all other necessarily driver (Graphic and Sound), then open control panel for the graphic, set the resolution and hertz (60p), and play with other setting as well (which I think will optimize the display)

Next, I install DirectX update and Net Framework 3.5 (not sure if got any effect, but Win 8 does not come with complete with those.

Then I install MPC-BE, follow Niyawa's guide, using "High" setting for MadVr. I found some movie a bit shuttering, but this can be solved by opening Reclock Properties (when playing the movie, and change "Automatic" to 60hz).

I have not install VLC after i reformat (updated my system), so I can't really comment how much different in term of quality using the updated driver/proper setup. (i am not sure how VLC look after I updated the driver), but compared to VLC before I re-install, MPC-BE and MadVr definitely better. - I won't install VLC coz I'm not fond of the idea of deleting software or re-installing my system.

Also I have Macbook Air 13 inch (SSD) running win7, I can only see slight improvement after I use MPC-BE and Madvr. (slight as in almost unnoticeable). Not sure because of driver issue or because I installed codec pack and VLC before.

Hope the above can help some newbie like myself to get the most from their PC.

Before ending this, I got 1 question:
Above I put my stereo system (the old Carver 742), it only accept RCA connection (analog?) from the ALC892 (motherboard sound card) is there anyway for me to improve the sound quality? with out spending $$$? (no sound card, DAC, etc.)

I read somewhere WASAPI is just layer, as same as ASIO. Accordingly both are losses, but ASIO software are limited and buggy. DirectX is lossy.

I did compare the sound coming from my PC to the sound coming from my Samsung Handphone using 3.5mm to RCA to my Carver, I can't notice any difference. (It is possible due to my source file also (not high quality enough). However any input is appreciated.

On the side note: The sound coming from My Sharp TV (Via HDMI), can't compare to the sound coming from my old Carver (clarity and dialog)

Thanks
 
Sep 12, 2013 4:46 AM
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Yet another video. Format info maintained, video info stripped for privacy.


OSD: http://i.imgur.com/gt5iYhs.png
CUVID/DXVA/internal filters disabled completely this time

GPU usage at 12-13%, spikes at scan/play from pause, GPU mem at 1.0 GB / 2.0 GB

Backbuffer and Queue at max (8/24/128)

I'm using the latest drivers already.

CPU use is ~10%, memory use is 2.4 GB/4 GB

Niyawa said:
(crash file, etc)


Where do I get this stuff?
 
Sep 12, 2013 3:11 PM

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A little update before the new version...

So... we're almost closing in the half of September and this guide has been up for almost a year now. I'm happy to be able to talk and help people regarding playback and everything in general. I decided to do this in like, one night when I was bored and never thought it would grow this much. Some people came in, some people got out (or maybe they're still here lurking, I dunno). I've received a lot of thanks but I need to thank everyone as well for being patient with my procrastination issues and my relative IRL problems that sometimes slowed me down when I was trying to give support.

Oh, talking about slowing things down... I usually reply with 2-6 hours range (if I'm not sleeping/busy that is) but MAL has been a bitch those days and for whatever reason sometimes I can't access the last page of this guide which doesn't let me reply to you so... you get it.

Now on to the guide itself. I plan to make an update next week or whenever madVR releases a new major version. It might not even come so soon because MAL is still dealing with bbcode issues and if the bbcode of my guide screws up, we're screwed. For now I need to update to 0.86.11 but there was only 1 fix which I'm not bothering to check out what it was about. LAV is stagnated for almost a month or more now and even KCP is not getting many updates as well. The next version won't have any sort of huge change. It will probably only take some updated screenshots and some new Protip's regarding a few details that were discussed here with feedback.

However, I do have plans for 2.0 that includes screenshots with steps (I've done this before but it was clunky) which the guide will adapt to and the removal of support for EVR-CP. The reason for that is that now madVR is required to use XySubFilter and XySubFilter is too awesome to let go 'cause of compatibility terms. Also for fuck's sake we're closing in on 2014, if you have problems with madVR with lowest settings I recommend you to do something about your hardware, that Intel Atom ins't gonna cut anymore sis.

Now that's said and done, I'll go back to HentaiVerse- wait WHAT, WHERE'S MY EQUIPMENT BAZAAR?

Charlesk74 said:
I see marked improvements with Madvr using your 29/7/2013 guide. If I can make a suggestion to you: can you Bold "uncheck all internal filters in MPC-HC" bold an big, coz I miss this the first time and can't see any difference.

Haha. 'kay, I'll see what I can do about that.

Charlesk74 said:
I install all other necessarily driver (Graphic and Sound), then open control panel for the graphic, set the resolution and hertz (60p), and play with other setting as well (which I think will optimize the display)

You should use the highest hz available (aside from 75, if you like to watch anime use 72).

Charlesk74 said:
Next, I install DirectX update and Net Framework 3.5 (not sure if got any effect, but Win 8 does not come with complete with those.

MPC-HC already has those. BE doesn't but it warns you to install it when it doesn't find the runtime. I thought about putting it in the guide just for safety but I've never heard of any problems with playback related to it so I didn't bother. I might actually do this for next version though...

Charlesk74 said:
Then I install MPC-BE, follow Niyawa's guide, using "High" setting for MadVr. I found some movie a bit shuttering, but this can be solved by opening Reclock Properties (when playing the movie, and change "Automatic" to 60hz).

Interesting...

Charlesk74 said:
Above I put my stereo system (the old Carver 742), it only accept RCA connection (analog?) from the ALC892 (motherboard sound card) is there anyway for me to improve the sound quality? with out spending $$$? (no sound card, DAC, etc.)

Hm, not that I'm aware of. I'm not an audiophile so I never touched a offboard sound card. However, if you use WASAPI exclusive with a decent headphone/hardware, I've heard there are very notable improvements over DirectSound. That's with audiophile equipment though.

Charlesk74 said:
I read somewhere WASAPI is just layer, as same as ASIO. Accordingly both are losses, but ASIO software are limited and buggy. DirectX is lossy.

That's correct. I don't know much about ASIO but from what I know of it it's not the best option.

hameer3 said:
Yet another video. Format info maintained, video info stripped for privacy.

'kay so, I was running out of options so did a search regarding delayed frames and why they happen. After skimming through a few pages I've found something madshi (madVR's dev) said himself:

"They should not happen, but they sometimes do. There are a multitude of possible reasons. E.g. some other process or service eating GPU or CPU resources or something like that. FSE mode is the ultimate solution to problems like this."

Using FSE appears to be the only solution for this. Now I also understand why it's so hard to for me to reproduce that issue. I use Windows 8.1 that doesn't have Aero thus making windowed related problem less likely to happen. Unfortunately it seems that unless you find a way to make your GPU exclusive to your MPC-HC when using it, that problem won't go away. You could also use a lower preset but with so much horsepower even I would look for another alternative.

hameer3 said:
Where do I get this stuff?

Crash reports only appear when your madVR, you know, crash. You can find them in your Desktop.

kuuurt said:
Thanks for the reply, OP. Your suggestion on re-installing madVR didn't work, but that's okay. I just sent a report, I hope they fix it fast.

My apologies for not being more helpful. I tried doing a search related to your problem but I literally didn't find anything. If that still persists after any future madVR update, tell me and I'll have a chat with madshi myself.
Modified by Niyawa, Sep 12, 2013 6:46 PM
 
Sep 13, 2013 1:52 AM
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Niyawa said:
I use Windows 8.1 that doesn't have Aero thus making windowed related problem less likely to happen.

I'm on 8 already, no Aero.
Niyawa said:
Unfortunately it seems that unless you find a way to make your GPU exclusive to your MPC-HC when using it, that problem won't go away.

Like I said earlier, it seems my GPU/CPU/Memory/Graphics Memory usage is minimal, stuff is under-utilized. I'm pretty sure this isn't a contention issue. W/o any graphics tasks running (just a browser window, GPU-Z, and Task Manager), my GPU sits at 0-1% and NEVER goes above 2%. GPU memory usage is 240 MB/2 GB in this case, so I doubt anything is touching the GPU, like you suggested. I'll try FSE and see if the issues improve.

Edit: Yep. Unless I mess with MPC's interface, NO frames are dropped/delayed whatsoever.
Modified by hameer3, Sep 13, 2013 2:00 AM
 
Sep 13, 2013 9:34 AM

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hameer3 said:
I'm on 8 already, no Aero.

You do? Ow. I thought it was Win7, sorry for my misunderstanding.

hameer3 said:
Yep. Unless I mess with MPC's interface, NO frames are dropped/delayed whatsoever.

Hm. I guess I do need to re-evaluate my view of FSE. It used to be so buggy, maybe we can do something with it now.
 
Sep 13, 2013 9:52 AM
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@ Niyawa:

The changing of re-clock which I mention in my previous post will make the video and audio out of sync.

However, I am confirming that for my system (i5 - 3470 - HD2500, 40 inch TV), can use Madvr "High" quality setting with no problem. You just need to make the hardware acceleration (Under LAV Video Property) to set to "None". I can play in "High" I can play movies (not anime) from 300 MB (1:30 min) to 24 GB (1:30 min), with no issue.

I also read somewhere that the best encoding is actually done by CPU, not by CUDA, Quicksync, or DXVA. However, if there is a consideration of efficiency (time vs. quality), then those other 3 are more preferred rather than using CPU. By the same token, logically best decoding also done by CPU - this last part just my 2 cents.

If I am not mistaken, rendering can't be done by CPU, thus it is dependent on the graphic card.

For Blu Ray > 8 GB, I can see the difference between High and Mid setting. However, there are some instances that for lower size files changing the quality from high to Mid setting might be better (I notice some sharper blocks on high setting and slight frame drop), but again these files are not original (downloaded from internet), so I can't draw any conclusion on the cause.
 
Sep 13, 2013 12:52 PM

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Charlesk74 said:
The changing of re-clock which I mention in my previous post will make the video and audio out of sync.

That was to be expected, thus I found interesting it had "fixed" your problem with stutter.

Charlesk74 said:
However, I am confirming that for my system (i5 - 3470 - HD2500, 40 inch TV), can use Madvr "High" quality setting with no problem. You just need to make the hardware acceleration (Under LAV Video Property) to set to "None".

DXVA is not recommended unless you need it for something like deinterlacing (which basically no anime has so). I only have it here in case someone out there likes to use GPU for everything, I've seen some folks like that.

Charlesk74 said:
I also read somewhere that the best encoding is actually done by CPU, not by CUDA, Quicksync, or DXVA. However, if there is a consideration of efficiency (time vs. quality), then those other 3 are more preferred rather than using CPU. By the same token, logically best decoding also done by CPU

Encoding done by the CPU is the one that gives the highest quality output, especially if only one core was used. Ain't nobody got time for that though so in some cases (especially if you're going to upload to YouTube) it's simply better to use CUDA shaders. Again, DXVA is not recommended unless you actually need/want it for something else. madVR's design doesn't go along with it.

Charlesk74 said:
If I am not mistaken, rendering can't be done by CPU, thus it is dependent on the graphic card.

madVR uses only GPU shaders for rendering, nothing else.

Charlesk74 said:
For Blu Ray > 8 GB, I can see the difference between High and Mid setting.

Well huh, the highest the quality of the file, the easier is to see differences between madVR and EVR-CP, but there are way too many other factors that goes into this. The quality of your monitor, the settings of your calibration in both the monitor and madVR, the settings of the algorithms, the environment of the room and especially a good trained eye. Some people notice it at first sight, others needs a few hours of playback before they grown accustomed to it. You shouldn't use any statistics nor your own view and opinion as accurate. Even screenshots lie.
 
Sep 13, 2013 8:04 PM
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Niyawa said:

Charlesk74 said:
However, I am confirming that for my system (i5 - 3470 - HD2500, 40 inch TV), can use Madvr "High" quality setting with no problem. You just need to make the hardware acceleration (Under LAV Video Property) to set to "None".

DXVA is not recommended unless you need it for something like deinterlacing (which basically no anime has so). I only have it here in case someone out there likes to use GPU for everything, I've seen some folks like that.


Errr (me . . . me . . . .me). . . I used to think like that. However, from this eercise, I notice that for low-end GPU, I need to give MadVr all resources available from the GPU, thus for lower-end of GPU, it MIGHT be better to suggest NOT to use hardware acceleration (again, I might be wrong here).

By the way, if I disable the hardware acceleration will it defaulting to DXVA? ( from your reply above)

Niyawa said:

Charlesk74 said:
If I am not mistaken, rendering can't be done by CPU, thus it is dependent on the graphic card.

madVR uses only GPU shaders for rendering, nothing else.


Thus it is also might be possible to use HD4000 for the "Highest" MadVr setting, by disabling hardware accelaration. . . If this is the case, then I should have spend the additional $ 30.00 last time to get the i5 3570K. . damn!!!

I did watch quite a number of movies (ISO ripped, Mkv, Mp4, Avi) yesterday, and compared (while watching) using MPC BE + MadVr V.S. WMP, noticeable diffrent of rendering quality at full screen. . . Happy with MPC-BE + MadVr
 
Sep 13, 2013 9:27 PM
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I have the following problem. The desktop (namely the borders of windows and contrasting wallpaper elements) are visible through the video in MPC. It happens both in windowed and fullscreen mode and is especially noticeable during darker scenes.
Is it abnormal? How do I fix it?
However, I do get a feeling that I don't understand something really basic here...
 
Sep 13, 2013 9:35 PM

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Charlesk74 said:
I notice that for low-end GPU, I need to give MadVr all resources available from the GPU, thus for lower-end of GPU, it MIGHT be better to suggest NOT to use hardware acceleration (again, I might be wrong here).

That will depend. If you have a low-end GPU with Intel + AMD/NVidia (or anything that is not full Intel) combination then you probably can't use "use a separate device for presentation", so a lower GPU queue will be necessary. I've heard this from madshi but I don't exactly remember how he put it so I'm not so sure either. What I do know is that if I don't enable that option, when I go beyond 6 queue, I get constant dropped frames.

Charlesk74 said:
By the way, if I disable the hardware acceleration will it defaulting to DXVA? ( from your reply above)

You just blew my mind. Hardware Acceleration is DXVA so I'm not sure what you're asking. If you want to know the option in LAV will go back to DXVA after you've set sit to "None"? No. It's the one you set for a lifetime, unless you change it yourself again nothing will change it.

Charlesk74 said:
Thus it is also might be possible to use HD4000 for the "Highest" MadVr setting, by disabling hardware accelaration. . . If this is the case, then I should have spend the additional $ 30.00 last time to get the i5 3570K. . damn!!!

Yes it's possible. I do know of some people who uses Highest with HD4000 without problems. However that's only possible with optimization so I'm not sure which settings goes for them. madshi does have an 4000 apparently, but I've never gone my away to ask him about it.

Charlesk74 said:
I did watch quite a number of movies (ISO ripped, Mkv, Mp4, Avi) yesterday, and compared (while watching) using MPC BE + MadVr V.S. WMP, noticeable diffrent of rendering quality at full screen. . . Happy with MPC-BE + MadVr

Good to know.

Arordael said:
I have the following problem. The desktop (namely the borders of windows and contrasting wallpaper elements) are visible through the video in MPC. It happens both in windowed and fullscreen mode and is especially noticeable during darker scenes.
Is it abnormal? How do I fix it?
However, I do get a feeling that I don't understand something really basic here...

Sorry, I'm not sure I get what you mean with that... a screenie would help?
 
Sep 14, 2013 5:32 AM
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Niyawa said:

Arordael said:
I have the following problem. The desktop (namely the borders of windows and contrasting wallpaper elements) are visible through the video in MPC. It happens both in windowed and fullscreen mode and is especially noticeable during darker scenes.
Is it abnormal? How do I fix it?
However, I do get a feeling that I don't understand something really basic here...

Sorry, I'm not sure I get what you mean with that... a screenie would help?

Well, here is a screenshot of an 'empty' fullscreen in MP Classic:
http://dobrochan.com/src/png/1309/1-16.png
The borders of desktop elements are visible. (They really are if you adjust your eyes).
Here is the contrast-tweaked version of the first screenshot. It wasn't done by me, but clearly indicates that the desktop is indeed visible through the video.
http://dobrochan.com/src/png/1309/1-17.png
This effect is taking place ONLY in MP Classic.
I've tried tweaking madVR's rendering in different ways, but nothing helped and the effect still remains.
It seems as if the picture is somehow translucent, but I can't find the corresponding options.

UPDATE: Enabling exclusive fullscreen actually helped. When switching to it the background becomes opaque. However the question still stays: why is it translucent in windowed mode?
Modified by iyashi_k, Sep 14, 2013 6:23 AM
 
Sep 14, 2013 9:31 AM

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Arordael said:
Enabling exclusive fullscreen actually helped. When switching to it the background becomes opaque. However the question still stays: why is it translucent in windowed mode?

I can't see those screenshots, I get 403 error. The website you used uses bandwidth saving tactics, try imgur.com instead.

Also, I kinda of more get what you mean that but I've never seen anything like it. I'll try a search in madVR forum and see if I can find anything related to it. What I do know though is that if the problem only happens with windowed mode, then it's likely Aero's fault (if you're using Win7). In that case it could be too many factors, from drivers to bugs in MPC classic, did you tried BE?
 
Sep 14, 2013 10:43 AM
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Niyawa said:

I can't see those screenshots, I get 403 error. The website you used uses bandwidth saving tactics, try imgur.com instead.

Okay.
http://i.imgur.com/bzw1G8e.png - the first one. As it looks in windowed mode or non-exclusive fullscreen.
http://i.imgur.com/NzjK9P2.jpg - the same screenshot with contrast settings changed.
http://i.imgur.com/iQ0MAya.jpg - a new one I've just made. Again, the background is translucent (barely, but it is still bothersome when the eyes are adjusted to the dark).

Niyawa said:

Also, I kinda of more get what you mean that but I've never seen anything like it. I'll try a search in madVR forum and see if I can find anything related to it. What I do know though is that if the problem only happens with windowed mode, then it's likely Aero's fault (if you're using Win7).

I'm using Win8, but yeah, I have Aero running as a separate process. Tried disabling it, but it didn't help.

Niyawa said:

In that case it could be too many factors, from drivers to bugs in MPC classic, did you tried BE?

I'm using the newest KCP tweaked according to your guide.

And one more thing: strangely enough, Google gives nothing about this problem, so I guess the solution should somehow appear to be ridiculously obvious.

-----

UPDATE: PROBLEM SOLVED
Yep, it really was Aero. Appears I simply had to reboot the PC after disabling it.
Thanks anyway, Niyawa, for pointing out the culprit in Aero.

PS: your guide rocks :3
Modified by iyashi_k, Sep 14, 2013 12:25 PM
 
Sep 14, 2013 4:53 PM

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Arordael said:
Yep, it really was Aero. Appears I simply had to reboot the PC after disabling it.
Thanks anyway, Niyawa, for pointing out the culprit in Aero.

Yup, I knew the moment I saw the screenshot with the custom theme, when you mentioned Windows 8 it was obvious that "winaero" was the culprit. It's basically alpha so you can expect nasty bugs from it.

Arordael said:
PS: your guide rocks :3

Aw, thanks. I noticed you use Taiga so kudos for that. Still getting used to it here (torrent filters kinda of a pain) but very good overall.
 
Sep 14, 2013 6:47 PM
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Niyawa said:
It's basically alpha so you can expect nasty bugs from it.

However, it does look too nice to just forget about it. So I decided to stick with exclusive fullscreen in my MPC for now. Anyway, it seems like for some reason smooth motion is working a bit better with exclusive fullscreen on (if it's not me imagining it, lol).

Niyawa said:
I noticed you use Taiga so kudos for that. Still getting used to it here (torrent filters kinda of a pain) but very good overall.

Yeah, I was really surprised with this utility. There are indeed some bugs with filters and recognition, but nothing major noticed by me yet.
 
Sep 20, 2013 7:46 AM
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Niyawa said:
Hm. I guess I do need to re-evaluate my view of FSE. It used to be so buggy, maybe we can do something with it now.


It IS buggy. Every time I interact using MPC-HC controls, it flickers black for a fraction of a second and drops a few frames (2-4).

Edit: Confession: I had installed KLCP and configured it EXACTLY according to your guide. I uninstalled everything, followed your guide to the letter, no difference in performance was detected. Same number of dropped frames.
Modified by hameer3, Sep 20, 2013 8:44 AM
 
Sep 24, 2013 8:35 PM

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kuuurt said:
'Sup, OP. I come here again for another question. Is there an option to automatically change madVR settings when playing 1080p? I get sudden dropped/delayed framerates when watching 1080p, but not on 720p using my usual settings.

Unfortunately, yes. There's no way to change the settings automatically and madshi has other priorities at this point. Using a lower preset/tuned configuration that is acceptable for all playback types is the only solution if you feel so inclined.

Also, are you watching 1080p on a 768px screen or is that just the screenshot? Upscaling 720p > 768 with High preset or more might give you much better results than downscaling with 1080p which is extremely hard on your machine with no actual gains in for most of the time. See for yourself though.
 
Sep 25, 2013 2:01 AM
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Hey, Niyawa. I just wanted to ask, is there a way one of the counters is flawed? My Clock Deviation is constant for MINUTES on end, doesn't vary AT ALL. Yet, a frame drops every few seconds. Is that normal?
 
Sep 25, 2013 11:41 AM

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hameer3 said:
Hey, Niyawa. I just wanted to ask, is there a way one of the counters is flawed? My Clock Deviation is constant for MINUTES on end, doesn't vary AT ALL. Yet, a frame drops every few seconds. Is that normal?

Not sure, it will depend on the fps of your content and the Hz of your display. For reference, I have a 60 hz display and 23fps content with ReClock gives me a deviation of 0.2%.
 
Sep 27, 2013 10:27 AM
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Hi, quick question. In Lav Audio settings, there's an "Output Formats" section. Should all the boxes be ticked for best quality?
 
Sep 27, 2013 5:45 PM

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Update #1 - No one knows one that knows nothing

Ugh, my apologies for this entrance, however this is the first update of a weekly one that I've decided to make to not let the lurkers bored with so not many updates so better not have a boring entrance as well.

As you'll are aware, there's basically nothing to update at this point, but not only that, I can't update even if it had. MAL still has bbcode disabled for most tags which means that the moment I update that guide, everything will be quite messy...

I have no idea when things will come back to normal, and I don't feel confident it will be any soon, but enough about that. nev (LAV's developer) is on vacation for about 2-3 weeks, which means that this is the perfect time for me to take a 'lil vacation as well. I will use that time to update those animes that are screaming for updates and now that I've restored most of what I lost with my hard drive failure, I'm good to go!... I think so at least.

Yes YES! I still have to reply to few comments in my profile, I'm sure some people even forgot that I exist at this point.

Happy weekend for all you folks.

derpyQ said:
Hi, quick question. In Lav Audio settings, there's an "Output Formats" section. Should all the boxes be ticked for best quality?

That will depend on your setting and monitor/TV you're using. I don't remember the details but the ones that do not come ticked by default will likely not make much difference for most of us.
 
Sep 27, 2013 9:00 PM
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At the moment I've disabled 32-bit Integer and 32-bit Floating Point... without really knowing what they are, just because my sound card (Creative ZXR) is set to output 24-bit audio. That's the highest I can set it, and I've not even heard of 32-bit audio, but then I may just be really confused about all this stuff (I am :p).

Should I enable 32-bit Integer and 32-bit Floating Point again?
Modified by derpyQ, Sep 27, 2013 9:22 PM
 
Sep 28, 2013 2:35 PM

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derpyQ said:
Should I enable 32-bit Integer and 32-bit Floating Point again?

If you don't use WASAPI then it doesn't matter, as DirectSound always output everything in 24-bit/48hz AFAIK.
 
Sep 28, 2013 4:00 PM
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I think I'm going to disable them then. Thanks very much.
 
Sep 28, 2013 10:28 PM

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If I want to update KCP, do I uninstall and reinstall it or just reinstall over the old version?
 
Sep 29, 2013 7:04 AM

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Lang said:
If I want to update KCP, do I uninstall and reinstall it or just reinstall over the old version?

Just reinstall it over. Soon enough you'll be able to keep your settings so don't forget to backup MPC-HC keys/config and whatnot.
 
Oct 7, 2013 6:27 AM
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Hey, Niyawa. Quick update - The other queues stay full always, but the backbuffer queue empties at the frame drop/delay. No frames are dropped or delayed at the start (which is weird enough in itself).

There was this one time I was able to achieve a 0/0 for over an hour and a half on a 720p upscaled to 1080p... This was with scanning and play/pause. But it was one time only, and subsequent tests with the same video yield varying results. That time, I killed off some non-driver background processes. I can't seem to single out the process causing it. I'll report back as soon as I find it.

I was using MSI AfterBurner that time to record my GPU usage, to see if it spikes or drops during a frame drop. Funnily enough, it was quite smooth.

I also went into nVidia Control Panel and changed all MPC-HC and madVR executables to a power profile of High Performance from Adaptive... Without any effect on the number of dropped frames.

I'll keep testing, let you know what comes of it.

EDIT: Funnily enough, it was the changing backgrounds. I tested on another user account, which doesn't have them.

Now, the focus shifts from drops to delays and from the backbuffer queue to the render queue. Doesn't go to zero, but reduces by 1 moments after a delay, and only then.

I locked my GPU to the highest frequency. GPU usage ~4% to ~5% constant (it was higher earlier because of a low clock frequency). No spikes or dips during delays.
Modified by hameer3, Oct 7, 2013 7:07 AM
 
Oct 7, 2013 10:08 AM

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hameer3 said:
Now, the focus shifts from drops to delays and from the backbuffer queue to the render queue. Doesn't go to zero, but reduces by 1 moments after a delay, and only then.

I locked my GPU to the highest frequency. GPU usage ~4% to ~5% constant (it was higher earlier because of a low clock frequency). No spikes or dips during delays.

Sooo... desktop is the culprit? Ugh. Just, wow. I need to ask madshi about this, not sure how changing backgrounds would affect video playback. It probably has something to do with windowed issues as always, too bad we don't have a "exclusive windowed mode".
 
Oct 7, 2013 7:58 PM
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Niyawa said:
Sooo... desktop is the culprit? Ugh. Just, wow. I need to ask madshi about this, not sure how changing backgrounds would affect video playback. It probably has something to do with windowed issues as always, too bad we don't have a "exclusive windowed mode".


It was the fading backgrounds. I had 99 fading backgrounds on shuffle every 10 seconds. They caused GPU usage to go to ~40% on the lowest frequency. On the highest, barely made a ~2% dent.
 
Oct 10, 2013 10:37 PM

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Update #2 - Why Yotsuba! is so cool, so goddamn cool

So I was going to make an update last Friday but I didn't really have much to talk about so I postponed it for well, today.

Some of you may be aware, Xinil onii-chan restored some of our beloved bbcode tags, but [img] still has yet to come back so I still can't update my guide without screwing up things... meaning that if you're dying to see what I have to offer, prepare your will.

Also, I had to give up in my plans to update those anime shows I've been dying to update cause life is horrible and man... ArGhH-!

Back on topic, I will start to prepare my update to 1.3 and then start working on 1.4 soon afterwards. If my intuition is right, about version 1.6 we'll have a full hardware-like feature support to help people customize their algorithms settings. No it's not like a database or something though seidweise did give me a good hope for KCP in that aspect.

I've taken an enormous liking to drawing these days... it's quite fun. Not sure if I should keep learning to code or drawing now, maybe both, what do you guys think?

Anyway, that is all for now, thanks for taking your time reading and I hope you have a fantastic day.
Modified by Niyawa, Oct 10, 2013 10:43 PM
 
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