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Poll: Kyoukaisenjou no Horizon II Episode 7 Discussion


#1
Aug 18, 2012 4:30 PM

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THIS IS AN ANIME ONLY DISCUSSION POST. DO NOT DISCUSS THE MANGA BEYOND THIS EPISODE.
----------------------------------------
Mary was there to be sacrificed?

Wow, that enemy that came out can split into two, and strong enough to KO OnoD's character.

Wow, Horizon can hide so many things in another space!

lol~ @ Tori for wearing female dress.

So Elizabeth was the queen?!

The talk was to announcing war against the world and get England as support? Spain's sudden come out and another mysterious guy's appearance at the end.

Ending = SunRise
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#2
Aug 18, 2012 8:12 PM

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I’m with Adelle: “umm… what are they talking about ?”
^^;

So… to address the worries of countries that handing over their sin armaments to Musashi will make them too weak to face other countries in war and history recreation, Musashi will use their power to help those countries and keep the power balance ? If England refused, they'll just go and offer the French, they're just two days trip away.

Should’ve posted this in eps 2 topic, but don't feel good with bumping.
Is it explained anywhere why Spain got two weapons ? the dejection and sorrow (before Muneshige lost it)
Shouldn't each country only have one ?
Modified by nseika, Aug 18, 2012 9:31 PM
 
#3
Aug 18, 2012 8:50 PM

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I love this series!

Right now, I'm not sure whether Mary's walked away from Tenzou because she doesn't want Tenzou to get caught up in England's matters. 'Cause I thought she actually liked Tenzou, but judging from how she healed Tenzou's wounds and how she said she would like to leave a scar on the man she loves, she might not have actually wanted to be with him. But then she's fine with holding out for a kiss! I don't get this anymore...and it sucks that Tenzou was so easily defeated.

Lol at Neito throwing objects at Toori, lol at Horizon pulling a huge bowl of whatever out of her storage room (apparently cooked by hot spring water?), and lol at Toori crossdressing and guys swarming up to perceived DFC.

The negotiation as always is brilliant in this series. 5/5
 
#4
Aug 18, 2012 11:51 PM
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dude this anime has been loosing ppl since season 1 haha, but it all become clear once it gets a few more under its belt. awsome episode i love how they are gana take on the entire world, reminds me of OP. when i saw tenzo approaching walter i thought he would pull out some ninja moves didn't think he'd get taken out tho damn how dissapointing. time to wait for the subs to see how much i actually understood. they are "negotiating" you know where that leads in an anime like this they challenge the whole damn world and look badass while doing it like i season 1 HA.
Modified by tyrolizard1, Aug 18, 2012 11:56 PM
 
#5
Aug 19, 2012 2:30 AM

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Cute and Naked Nate and Hawt Elizabeth

what else could I ask for...


 
#6
Aug 19, 2012 4:36 AM

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Why are they so worried about the result of the war anyway ?
They're recreating history according to Testament, so it's supposed to be more like an act rather than real war isn't it ? The victor should be foreordained already by Testament along with the important episodes in the war.
articuzwolf said:
what else could I ask for...
A special invitation from Elizabeth to Kimi for afternoon tea time together to scheme things for their brother/sister :D
Modified by nseika, Aug 19, 2012 4:00 PM
 
#7
Aug 19, 2012 5:05 PM

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tezann_t I wouldnt be overly worried about Tenzou and Mary lol

another fun Horizon episode ^-^
 
#8
Aug 19, 2012 11:34 PM
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nseika said:
Why are they so worried about the result of the war anyway ?
They're recreating history according to Testament, so it's supposed to be more like an act rather than real war isn't it ? The victor should be foreordained already by Testament along with the important episodes in the war.


It's politics and interpretation of the Testament. It may say England won Armada battle but that doesn't mean that Spain couldn't beat England to the ground and then retreat, fulfilling the historic requirement of 'Spain retreats' but making Spain's future position in relation to England a lot better. It's similar to how Pope was going to interpret the Testament in such a way that he could kill Horizon and seize control of Mikawa in S1.
 
#9
Aug 20, 2012 5:31 PM
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what would happen if they didn't follow the testament, is it something that will ABSOLUTLEY happen without any chance to avoid or work around? i need to read the LN. on another note i think its possible that the new guy tht showed up may be one of the 2 guys that was reffered to last week. i'd have to go check tho, no evidence to support this asside from him saying "ma chan" which could mean mary.
Modified by tyrolizard1, Aug 20, 2012 5:37 PM
 
Aug 20, 2012 7:49 PM

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tyrolizard1 said:
what would happen if they didn't follow the testament, is it something that will ABSOLUTLEY happen without any chance to avoid or work around? i need to read the LN. on another note i think its possible that the new guy tht showed up may be one of the 2 guys that was reffered to last week. i'd have to go check tho, no evidence to support this asside from him saying "ma chan" which could mean mary.


To the best of my understanding, the Testament is sort of like the Bible. Those of the Testament Union follow it in hopes that by going along with historical events (analogous to teachings of the Bible), they may return to their world (analogous to heaven) once again. So the naval battle between Spain and England isn't totally necessary other than the fact that they want to reenact history. England HAS to win technically, but as Dynellen mentions, there's something to be gained for Spain if it can defeat England then fulfill history by retreating.

Correct me if I'm wrong. This is the most accurate interpretation I can give without having read the LN.
 
Aug 20, 2012 7:55 PM

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In the first season it’s said that human has advanced to the point they went to heaven (space ?). Then trouble happened and they’re forced to go back to earth where things are not as nice as it was.

They can’t just make time machine to go back to the past and fix their misdoing, so the next best thing is they try to act out the events in the past according to records of Testament and then see where they originally screwed up. Hopefully they can then act it to the part where mankind reached the heaven again and this time they wont fail like what happened in the history. :)

If they failed to follow the Testament, worst case is they have to replay the scenario again from the beginning of history, after managing the turmoil of countries blaming each others for failing the grand project.

CMIIW, I never read the novel too.
 
Aug 21, 2012 9:26 AM

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Poor Mary, she has resigned herself to her fate.

Masazumi is Musashi's ace right now. She knows how to spin an argument.
 
Aug 21, 2012 10:31 AM

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A bit hard to follow but great episode neverthless. I'm just waiting to see how Mary'll be saved now.
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Aug 21, 2012 10:34 AM

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Forming there alliance is pretty complicated and very interesting and when they almost came to a conclusion Tress Espania had to interrupt.
But where they in time to stop there negotiations since it's pretty clear the Tress Espania will attack within a week.
I also like the fact that Holland was finally mentioned and off course if there offered the right amount of money there willing to do almost anything.
Still i wonder who will be next to get a visit from Musashi after England both France and the Netherlands where mentioned.
Here is the thing tho going be history France had a reasonable relationship with Spain and was like Spain mostly a Catholic nation while Holland was at war with Spain and had Protestant nation.
As like most wars in history the war England and Holland against Spain was mainly of religious cause and power.

So from that point of view Holland would be a better choice.
Then there is also the alliance between England and Holland meaning it would be easier to form a alliance with them as well.
Then again France was mentioned and we don't know the entire situation in there world and there is also the fact of the armaments.
In other words this is still very interesting.
 
Aug 21, 2012 10:54 AM

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Nate service <3
 
Aug 21, 2012 12:23 PM
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That is one voluptuous Queen Elizabeth.
Modified by Nasty001, Aug 21, 2012 12:31 PM
 
Aug 21, 2012 12:43 PM

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That was fucking horrible
 
Aug 21, 2012 1:36 PM

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To many monster boobs, their all going to be sagging to their knees in a few years. Guess people only obsess over monster women because they fantasize about fantasy women that stay young forever.
This is one confusing..random.. dumb told anime though. Not long left to go at least.
 
Aug 21, 2012 2:59 PM

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Aug 21, 2012 3:04 PM

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Great episode. Loved the fan service part from Nate. About Excalibur Caliburn, I think Tenzo may be the owner of it by the end of the series. Just have a hunch about it.
 
Aug 21, 2012 4:12 PM

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Epic Epic <3<3 Can't wait for the next episode. Omg I have no idea how will things go.
articuzwolf said:
Cute and Naked Nate and Hawt Elizabeth

what else could I ask for...


:D

Lol at Tomo's reaction to Tenzo getting owned. "Oh no, Tenzo got a boring death" LOL. Asama <3
 
Aug 21, 2012 5:31 PM
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Ohhhh. New guy appeared, wonder who he is....
 
Aug 21, 2012 7:20 PM
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Queen Elizabeth is delicious
 
Aug 21, 2012 8:06 PM

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Aversa said:
So from that point of view Holland would be a better choice.
Then there is also the alliance between England and Holland meaning it would be easier to form a alliance with them as well.
Then again France was mentioned and we don't know the entire situation in there world and there is also the fact of the armaments.
In other words this is still very interesting.
Musashi had personal relationship with France, so it might put the weight there. Musashi's king (Yoshina) is from France, and...


Holland doesn't seem to have sin armaments either (at least from the first season, they seems like small country compared to German, Italy, Middle East (Oda), or China (Takeda). That could make them fall to lower priority and Musashi might just protect them because they taking over the responsibility from England.
Modified by nseika, Aug 21, 2012 8:20 PM
 
Aug 21, 2012 10:28 PM

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OrochiPL said:
A bit hard to follow but great episode neverthless. I'm just waiting to see how Mary'll be saved now.

Perhaps Tenzou might have something to say about thatz
 
Aug 21, 2012 11:16 PM

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So the whole thing about Mary being saved was a lie, looks like this is a perfect opportunity for Tenzou and them to save her. I can't imagine Tori not end up saving her at the end somehow tbh.

Nate being naked and embarrassed was soooo cuteeeee, loveeee it. Lmfao at Tori with that dress on pretending to be Masazumi, hahaha that was awesome. The look that Asama had was just hilarious, and lol it seems like everyone but Masazumi and Futayo knew it was Tori.

These negotiations are great and I love it. Looks like it was going pretty good for Masazumi at the end till Tres España interrupted. And lol at that K.P.A. Italia guy saying he wants to ally with Musashi.
 
Aug 21, 2012 11:42 PM

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Loved the Neito and crosplaying Toori scenes, but that debate was great too. Loved the moment you could tell "Oh, yeah...Masazumi is going to win this one." Until Gin and Velazquez show up, that is.

More impressions, lots of screenshots, and in depth explanations located here: http://randomc.net/2012/08/21/kyoukai-senjou-no-horizon-ii-07/. Enjoy!
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Aug 22, 2012 1:45 AM

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Too much talking for my taste, but it still had funny moments. 3/5.
 
Aug 22, 2012 9:47 AM

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ZeroZx said:

These negotiations are great and I love it. Looks like it was going pretty good for Masazumi at the end till Tres España interrupted. And lol at that K.P.A. Italia guy saying he wants to ally with Musashi.


Actually, can someone tell me why Pope Innocentius would want to ally with Musashi? Because I thought Masazumi mentioned that the pre-condition for alliance would be to hand over the Mortal Sin Armaments, and since it's unlikely for the pope to give up his...

Plus, didn't he just try to kill Horizon? lol
 
Aug 22, 2012 12:45 PM

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tezann_t said:
ZeroZx said:

These negotiations are great and I love it. Looks like it was going pretty good for Masazumi at the end till Tres España interrupted. And lol at that K.P.A. Italia guy saying he wants to ally with Musashi.


Actually, can someone tell me why Pope Innocentius would want to ally with Musashi? Because I thought Masazumi mentioned that the pre-condition for alliance would be to hand over the Mortal Sin Armaments, and since it's unlikely for the pope to give up his...

Plus, didn't he just try to kill Horizon? lol


from my understanding:
Basically the same reasons that Queen Elizabeth mentioned when Masazumi offeedr the "Strengthening via trade" the part where England can become a Pioneer for the New World and be the first to leave the Far East.

Well, this is just my understanding, I'm still waiting from the tumblr infodump to confirm it.

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Aug 22, 2012 2:24 PM

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nseika said:
Aversa said:
So from that point of view Holland would be a better choice.
Then there is also the alliance between England and Holland meaning it would be easier to form a alliance with them as well.
Then again France was mentioned and we don't know the entire situation in there world and there is also the fact of the armaments.
In other words this is still very interesting.
Musashi had personal relationship with France, so it might put the weight there. Musashi's king (Yoshina) is from France, and...


Holland doesn't seem to have sin armaments either (at least from the first season, they seems like small country compared to German, Italy, Middle East (Oda), or China (Takeda). That could make them fall to lower priority and Musashi might just protect them because they taking over the responsibility from England.
There timeline is based on the history of our world and because it was stopped at some point there obvious differences compered to are history from that point of view it's hard to judge there current situation since there wasn't much mentioned about Holland.
However i am a bit familiar with history Holland might be a small country but during that time it's navel power was considered amongst the strongest in the world.
They also had a great influence on international trade.
And from that point of view it would make a interesting country to form a alliance with.
Then again the things you mentioned about France make them a interesting partner as well.
 
Aug 22, 2012 5:22 PM

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I still have no idea what the hell is going on but Nate was too good and Kimi in that dress, Tomo too and it aint an episode till they somehow get Tori doing some stupid and ending up being nude, i love this show its to good


Btw Tenzo was stupid for not taking that chance


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Aug 22, 2012 8:26 PM
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some people want tenzo to save mary tudor hell even i want him to only a little tho ( i always hoped he'd end up with neito) but what some overlook is that SHE KILLED 300 PPL.
 
Aug 22, 2012 8:42 PM

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general reaction after every damn episode of this:


reactions (in order of appearance)
FOR CHRIST'S SAKE KISS HER!!!
you could be a BIT more concerned about Tenzo...
Mitotsudaira = moe as fuck
dem outfits
Aoi trolling the brits like a boss
queen Elizabeth = DAT ARMOR
time for some fucking DIPLOMACY, bitches!!!
Modified by Catastrophic, Aug 22, 2012 8:46 PM
 
Aug 22, 2012 9:40 PM

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tyrolizard1 said:
some people want tenzo to save mary tudor hell even i want him to only a little tho ( i always hoped he'd end up with neito) but what some overlook is that SHE KILLED 300 PPL.


Doesn't matter that much in anime terms though.

And she killed 300 people for the sake of recreating history. Whether she liked it or not, The Testament will force her someway or another. She's even prepared to be executed for the sake of recreation.

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Aug 22, 2012 10:56 PM

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tyrolizard1 said:
some people want tenzo to save mary tudor hell even i want him to only a little tho ( i always hoped he'd end up with neito) but what some overlook is that SHE KILLED 300 PPL.


Yes, but not of her own volition. Remember that Tenzou said he would love to have his name left on history during the BBQ festival. Mary, on the other hand, was born into that responsibility. I think the fact that she was made to kill 300 people against her will makes her scenario all the sadder. If there's any bashing to be done, it should be on the Testament Union.
 
Aug 23, 2012 12:46 AM

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tyrolizard1 said:
some people want tenzo to save mary tudor hell even i want him to only a little tho ( i always hoped he'd end up with neito) but what some overlook is that SHE KILLED 300 PPL.

Mary Tudor who killed the Protestants is dead already. That’s how her sister became the queen of England :D
They’re executing the other Mary, Mary Stuart :D
Modified by nseika, Aug 23, 2012 1:18 AM
 
Aug 23, 2012 3:01 AM

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nseika said:
tyrolizard1 said:
some people want tenzo to save mary tudor hell even i want him to only a little tho ( i always hoped he'd end up with neito) but what some overlook is that SHE KILLED 300 PPL.

Mary Tudor who killed the Protestants is dead already. That’s how her sister became the queen of England :D
They’re executing the other Mary, Mary Stuart :D


No, you got something wrong. There was never "two" different Mary.
Go back to the previous Episode.

Facts:
-Queen Catherine was too weak to give birth, so There was "no" Mary Tudor
-Queen Anne (Boleyn) gave birth to Elizabeth, but in fact she had given birth to twins.

Since there was no Mary Tudor to reenact history, England used the other Twin to reenact two roles at once. Mary Tudor and Mary Stuart, hence they called her "Double Bloody Mary"

So, yes she indeed killed 300 protestants under the name of Mary Tudor, and will face execution under the name of Mary Stuart.

Basically England "sacrificed" the unexpected Twin, for the sake of the Testament and history reenactment.

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Aug 23, 2012 3:46 AM

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5/6 episodes left, Now I'm prettymuch excited on the upcoming Tenzo vs. Walter fight as the OP suggested. Tenzo's lost his honor there as a ninja. and also for the epic Neshinbara vs Shakespeare fight. Tori Aoi really needs to shine in this season as well.
 
Aug 23, 2012 4:19 AM

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kaimax said:
tyrolizard1 said:
some people want tenzo to save mary tudor hell even i want him to only a little tho ( i always hoped he'd end up with neito) but what some overlook is that SHE KILLED 300 PPL.


Doesn't matter that much in anime terms though.

And she killed 300 people for the sake of recreating history. Whether she liked it or not, The Testament will force her someway or another. She's even prepared to be executed for the sake of recreation.
Indeed they are trying to recreate history but looking at the timeline History already changed a great deal due to the actions in the testament are.
If you look at it time wise the original attack of the Spanish Armada on England was in 1588 however they already are in 1648 meaning they should have attacked 60 years ago in there timeline but that didn't happen.
The thing that makes this anime so interesting is the messed up timeline basically anything can still happen even Mary can be saved.
 
Aug 23, 2012 3:41 PM

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Wait... 1648 already ? <== always not paying attention to the date
What's their deadline for Westphalia meeting again ?
kaimax said:
No, you got something wrong. There was never "two" different Mary.
Go back to the previous Episode.
Got it about Double Bloody Mary, just thought it'll be fun :D
 
Aug 23, 2012 5:19 PM

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Masazumi is really the best character in this show..

and i saw another Yui Horie x Yukari Tamura VA reference.. they're once again paired as twins, Mary and Elizabeth.. why didn't i notice this last week?
 
Aug 24, 2012 1:06 AM

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Oh yeah and Tori is finally naked again! Woooooooooooooo
 
Aug 25, 2012 8:09 AM

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kaimax said:
tezann_t said:
ZeroZx said:

These negotiations are great and I love it. Looks like it was going pretty good for Masazumi at the end till Tres España interrupted. And lol at that K.P.A. Italia guy saying he wants to ally with Musashi.


Actually, can someone tell me why Pope Innocentius would want to ally with Musashi? Because I thought Masazumi mentioned that the pre-condition for alliance would be to hand over the Mortal Sin Armaments, and since it's unlikely for the pope to give up his...

Plus, didn't he just try to kill Horizon? lol


from my understanding:
Basically the same reasons that Queen Elizabeth mentioned when Masazumi offeedr the "Strengthening via trade" the part where England can become a Pioneer for the New World and be the first to leave the Far East.

Well, this is just my understanding, I'm still waiting from the tumblr infodump to confirm it.


Yup, just like I under stood.

From the infodump
Question
Why is KPA Italia willing to form an alliance with Musashi even though they were against their every move? Is it because they lost their Deadly Sin and is willing to take advantage of Mazasumi's offer to ally with anyone without one?

Answer
The Pope simply weighed the benefits of allying with the Musashi (huge boost in trade and commerce, etc.) and thought that it was worth giving up their Armament for.

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Aug 25, 2012 10:10 AM

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And that is exactly why Masazumi is my favorite, cant fight for s*** but she sure knows her politics. She totally crushed England and backed them into a corner by calling out Lizzie on her bluffs aswell as punking her out by putting England in the position of needing assistance from the other nations in the event of war breaking out against Musashi. With the promise to stimulate England's ailing economy, it looked like Lizzie was about to accept before Tres Espana intervened.

So many plot points are at play with Queen Mary's execution, the impending war with the Spanish Armada and Musashi goal of collecting all the AODS and it looks there still more on the Horizon.

Also lmao at Horizon's interdimensional storage facility. She was really reaching right up in there.
 
Aug 25, 2012 1:53 PM
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the bad thing about all this is we will have to wait who knows how long for a 3rd season. :(
 
Aug 25, 2012 3:00 PM
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Is Tenzo really dead?!
 
Aug 25, 2012 11:51 PM

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JeffreyZin said:
Is Tenzo really dead?!


No. Absolutely not. He may be severely injured, but he still has a huge role to play in S2 from the looks of things.
 
Aug 26, 2012 11:32 AM

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I actually understood it all for once, and in general I am understanding the series more. I am particularly interested in what will happen with the execution of the other sister. Anyway, 5/5 (because I actually understood it), although it was primarily talking.

 
Aug 27, 2012 7:46 AM
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tezann_t said:
No. Absolutely not. He may be severely injured, but he still has a huge role to play in S2 from the looks of things.


Great, I thought it supposed to be serious & darker in this one (Tori 'trolled' us out? who knows?) but... oh great.

Modified by JafriZin, Aug 28, 2012 7:41 PM
 
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