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Poll: Shakugan no Shana III (Final) Episode 20 Discussion


#1
Feb 24, 2012 8:57 AM

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THIS IS AN ANIME ONLY DISCUSSION POST. DO NOT DISCUSS THE MANGA BEYOND THIS EPISODE.
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Still can not understand the plan that has Shana along with others, but at least gave him a body shot of Sairei Hebi no.
 
#2
Feb 24, 2012 9:03 AM

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Shana finally manages to insert her modified Taimei Shihen into the core of Xanadu, while Margery and Wilhelmina finally going all out and giving Synodai trouble while he tries to protect Yuji.


Also Rofocale has realized the thing Pheles created really does, im sure every tomogara will react the same when they figure out what it does.

Slowly approaching the end of the final novel, im going to miss this series.
 
#3
Feb 24, 2012 10:49 AM

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We've got some nice fighting this episode. Especialy the strenght showdown of Shana vs Yuji at end. I think I can't be more excited about what will happen next. Time to reveal Shana's plan comes next week :)
 
#4
Feb 24, 2012 12:30 PM

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One of the best episodes so far. I was thinking that the blue shield had something to do with what was in the truck and Rafacole saw in his oracle.

4 more left! Now I'm not sure if I want next week to come as soon as possible.
 
#5
Feb 24, 2012 1:23 PM

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Finally, things coming to a close.
 
#6
Feb 24, 2012 1:55 PM

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DAMN IT, that was a brilliant episode(well ok semi-skipped the parts with the nun but whatevs) epic battle in the sky, though I really, REALLY hope Shana's plan is more than "I'm going to wreck Yujii's plan so I can save him" I will facepalm so hard my house will be destroyed by the ensuing shockwave if that happens
 
#7
Feb 24, 2012 2:00 PM

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i watched it i was like :D and at the ending i was like -.- and now im like >.> another week


._. yeah that would be all .


 
#8
Feb 24, 2012 3:04 PM

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I really liked this episode; since it seems that we are closing in on the actual plan for both sides; all though

Reialgo said:
I really, REALLY hope Shana's plan is more than "I'm going to wreck Yujii's plan so I can save him" I will facepalm so hard my house will be destroyed by the ensuing shockwave if that happens


I really hope this doesn't happen either, the only problem i've had with this season really has been the Flame Hazes, so at the very least i hope that Shana's plan actually has something to it, and isn't some idealistic BS that she believes is for the "greater good" kind of like when she said love was the strongest unrestricted spell.

Something i didn't quite get though, was when they were talking about Yuji's unrestricted spell; and Shana panicked saying she had to hurry before he mastered it; is Yuji's original power something that was even that formidable? i mean i know he was training before all of this in season 2, but i kind of figured the only reason he was beating any of them was his Contract of SoF, thus why he is weaker now that a lot of his power is used creating the new world.

Also interesting to see this new god, if i remember it was the God of guidance, so that means 3 gods; God of Atonement Alastor, God of Creation SoF, and God Guidance; look forward to see what role it plays.
 
#9
Feb 24, 2012 3:13 PM

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Bleh, horrible episode, didnt enjoy it at all.

Yuji is so weak now that it's silly. Also Margery's reasoning to get Wilhelmina back into the spirit for fighting was extremely weak. "Now you primary objective is gone, just do something about it and dont think too hard!" ? Really!? That's your reasoning to make someone fight? I expect that from Naruto or some other bs, not a series like this.

The gods pissed me off as usual, they are blatantly OP and not likable at all...this is further reinforced this episode. Would be nice for them to be defeated but unfortunately that seems very unlikely.

I facepalmed though when Shana is panicking about Yuji learning his own unrestricted spell but breaks through it easily anyway. Yeah that was really problematic...for all of 3 seconds. Not too sure about her plan but the smug smile she had at the end really irritated me. I really hope there is something to it rather than something like "Haha, now it wont happen, I win trololol!"

Really hoping for an improvement here but not felt this disappointed in an episode since the one where Decarabia got one shot.


 
Feb 24, 2012 3:42 PM
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Riptos said:
Bleh, horrible episode, didnt enjoy it at all.

Yuji is so weak now that it's silly. Also Margery's reasoning to get Wilhelmina back into the spirit for fighting was extremely weak. "Now you primary objective is gone, just do something about it and dont think too hard!" ? Really!? That's your reasoning to make someone fight? I expect that from Naruto or some other bs, not a series like this.

The gods pissed me off as usual, they are blatantly OP and not likable at all...this is further reinforced this episode. Would be nice for them to be defeated but unfortunately that seems very unlikely.

I facepalmed though when Shana is panicking about Yuji learning his own unrestricted spell but breaks through it easily anyway. Yeah that was really problematic...for all of 3 seconds. Not too sure about her plan but the smug smile she had at the end really irritated me. I really hope there is something to it rather than something like "Haha, now it wont happen, I win trololol!"

Really hoping for an improvement here but not felt this disappointed in an episode since the one where Decarabia got one shot.
oh there is realy more then just win in her plan that for sure and yes i agree with you i hate the 4 gods it seems they will fight against the denizens next episode so i hope at least one of them will die
 
Feb 24, 2012 4:46 PM

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Woman keeps lamenting over those deaths but she's just murdering all of em anyways. Stop crying you bitch.
Otherwise, okay episode despite the fact that Yuji is so weak he can't even fight anymore and relies on Sydonay to protect him.
 
Feb 24, 2012 4:53 PM

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This is that one instance where I wan't the bad guys to win for once...
 
Feb 24, 2012 5:17 PM

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It kinda feels like this is getting way too rushed.. I mean, where did those rings come from anyways? What's the background to them? How come they cause so much damage? They didn't even show us how Shana obtained them...
 
Feb 24, 2012 5:46 PM

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As for those saying Yuji is weak; this is just a guess but it seems reasonable enough; that Yuji is using almost all of his power to create the new world thus is weakened, and as pointed out in the last episode forum, he was never trying to fight all out against Shana, just buy time for midnight when the plan comes together. It was also said this episode that it was more difficult than he imaged to control the flow of power or something among those lines; implying he is multitasking while being handicapped (fighting and creating the new world), not exactly a easy scenario. So as for the rings, and all the questions I'm sure they will be answered (or least hope they will be...) when they both reveal there plans, because besides the fact that Yuji wants to create a new world, and Shana wants to stop him we don't know much about the details yet.
Modified by InfiniteDestiny, Feb 24, 2012 5:49 PM
 
Feb 24, 2012 6:14 PM

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Shana obtained the rings back in season 2.
In every age, in every place, the deeds of men remain the same.
 
Feb 24, 2012 6:29 PM

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Starbuck11 said:
Shana obtained the rings back in season 2.


Which episode, i completely forgot that, i assumed she received it recently as part of her plan.
 
Feb 24, 2012 6:39 PM

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Episode 3, where the Hecate clone was introduced.
In every age, in every place, the deeds of men remain the same.
 
Feb 24, 2012 6:45 PM

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Thanks, i honestly didn't remember it; why did she acquire them though, if i remember than Shana was focused on checking if the Hecate clone was real or not thus the whole jealousy thing that went on because she was clingy.
 
Feb 24, 2012 6:52 PM

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Reialgo said:
DAMN IT, that was a brilliant episode(well ok semi-skipped the parts with the nun but whatevs) epic battle in the sky, though I really, REALLY hope Shana's plan is more than "I'm going to wreck Yujii's plan so I can save him" I will facepalm so hard my house will be destroyed by the ensuing shockwave if that happens


I also hate that damn nun now and Shana acts like her now. I just know the flame haze act like the Catholic church back in the 1500s. They think change is evil.

I just know i hate the fucking hax flame haze side with a passion. All of a sudden they got power boost and now supposedly strong.

I hope them cheap 3 gods die asap. I hate how 3 people come in and let them rival Yuji's side.
Modified by bonifide, Feb 24, 2012 6:58 PM
 
Feb 24, 2012 6:53 PM

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Chorde are the rings of the Tomogara Shana kills in S2 (although in the novels she kills the same guy in the same way before she even meets Yuji), there should be no real reason why she wouldnt get them, I mean what else would she do...leave it on the ground where the guy died?

Also it was explained last episode but the rings are a tool that can be loaded with any unrestricted spell inside and then fired as a bullet. The anime may have made it a bit confusing but what Shana has loaded inside the ring is the spell Taimei Shihen.

Taimei Shihen as mentioned is pretty much the building blocks of Yuji's plan. The silver, the creation of Xanadu, how it will operate, etc...As to how Shana got the spell? Remember that Lamies offered Wilhelmina 2 things, information on Serei Den which was used during the war, and that little ball of "secrets" which Margery and Sale investigated.
 
Feb 24, 2012 6:59 PM

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And the reason is.... to be revealed next episode.
 
Feb 24, 2012 7:54 PM
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God it is so fucking obvious that the plot was altered such that Yuji became so damn weak
 
Feb 24, 2012 8:26 PM

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lol, dunno why I felt a little sad once she landed the hit on the egg. First time I've found myself rooting for Yuji, even if it was in the dying seconds of the episode.
 
Feb 24, 2012 9:00 PM

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newnar said:
God it is so fucking obvious that the plot was altered such that Yuji became so damn weak


He has to create a world while fighting, multitasking isn't easy, its not that surprising that he appears weak, the power to create the new world comes from somewhere right? Don't you think the real plot alter would be if he could destroy everyone and create the world at the same time? the creation is suppose to be a process which is why they are even fighting now; if he was as powerful as you wanted him to be then he could snap his fingers and call it a day.
Modified by InfiniteDestiny, Feb 24, 2012 9:06 PM
 
Feb 24, 2012 10:57 PM
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This has been bugging me for a while, but why does Shana not get hurt when she is blatantly blocking Yuji's Blutsauger?

I was under the impression that one could not directly block against the sword otherwise they would get hurt through the sword's special ability.

Seeing that they totally ignored that fact in Shana III really threw me off for a while.
 
Feb 24, 2012 10:59 PM

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Sharnid said:
This has been bugging me for a while, but why does Shana not get hurt when she is blatantly blocking Yuji's Blutsauger?

I was under the impression that one could not directly block against the sword otherwise they would get hurt through the sword's special ability.

Seeing that they totally ignored that fact in Shana III really threw me off for a while.


The effect only takes place when the wielder infused power of existence into the sword. Yuji just isnt doing it because he is not fighting to kill her here. This entire battle is only to stall for time, he is fighting defensively while at the same time using a large portion of his strength to create Xanadu.
 
Feb 24, 2012 11:11 PM

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FUUUUUU why is it that this anime pisses me off so much >:/
when the tomogara's were the bad guys the flame haze's were super weak and now when the flame hazes are the bad guys THEY ARE OVERPOWERED! i hope all these new retard flame hazes die, they piss me off!
 
Feb 25, 2012 12:33 AM

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InfiniteDestiny said:
newnar said:
God it is so fucking obvious that the plot was altered such that Yuji became so damn weak


He has to create a world while fighting, multitasking isn't easy, its not that surprising that he appears weak, the power to create the new world comes from somewhere right? Don't you think the real plot alter would be if he could destroy everyone and create the world at the same time? the creation is suppose to be a process which is why they are even fighting now; if he was as powerful as you wanted him to be then he could snap his fingers and call it a day.


Yea....When i think of the "God of Creation" i get the idea of being able to undo everything and send everyone into oblivion if he felt the need to etc, but i guess even a god's power is limited......The fact that Shana is a serious threat to them would further this fact, since summoning Alastor's form would put him on equal footing against the snake. It always made me wonder if he's the god of creation...Why are they so worried about Shana and Alastor? Since i saw that episode they were emerging from that other world. Now it all makes sense. This episode did surprise me a bit, i thought the masked guy with the stringed instrument was with Yuji and his party, but it seems not?
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Feb 25, 2012 12:36 AM

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game8910 said:
Sharnid said:
This has been bugging me for a while, but why does Shana not get hurt when she is blatantly blocking Yuji's Blutsauger?

I was under the impression that one could not directly block against the sword otherwise they would get hurt through the sword's special ability.

Seeing that they totally ignored that fact in Shana III really threw me off for a while.


The effect only takes place when the wielder infused power of existence into the sword. Yuji just isnt doing it because he is not fighting to kill her here. This entire battle is only to stall for time, he is fighting defensively while at the same time using a large portion of his strength to create Xanadu.


This, pretty much...Honestly the way i see it, if Shana dies then there is no reason for Yuji to carry out the task of creating a new world anymore. I was actually surprised when Thousand threw his spear at Shana, it would've done some heavy damage if not for Wilhelmina stepping in to save her.
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Feb 25, 2012 12:38 AM
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im loling so hard right now! why is yuji so weak and shana all of a sudden so strong (please god dont tell me its just the "love" aspect of it). back at the beginning of the season yuji smacked her ass around and now he is having trouble just staying alive. for some reason im beginning to dislike the flame hazes even more. all that hatred of the denizens throughout the first two seasons has somehow flip flopped. i generally have never wanted the "bad" guys to win but now after i saw that smug ass smile from shana at the end and the most pointless reasoning behind wanting to stop the yuji, ive just about had it with the flame hazes. was this intended by the creator of shakugan no shana?
 
Feb 25, 2012 12:41 AM

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God i hate waiting a week for another episode -.-
 
Feb 25, 2012 1:31 AM

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Arctic_Wolf said:
lol, dunno why I felt a little sad once she landed the hit on the egg. First time I've found myself rooting for Yuji, even if it was in the dying seconds of the episode.


yeah same with me 'damn u shana and your smug smile' lol
 
Feb 25, 2012 2:19 AM

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edmond321 said:
It kinda feels like this is getting way too rushed.. I mean, where did those rings come from anyways? What's the background to them? How come they cause so much damage? They didn't even show us how Shana obtained them...

yeah they did in season 2 with that Kasha guy
he was easy to beat but thats where she get the rings from
 
Feb 25, 2012 3:26 AM

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InfiniteDestiny said:
newnar said:
God it is so fucking obvious that the plot was altered such that Yuji became so damn weak


He has to create a world while fighting, multitasking isn't easy, its not that surprising that he appears weak, the power to create the new world comes from somewhere right? Don't you think the real plot alter would be if he could destroy everyone and create the world at the same time? the creation is suppose to be a process which is why they are even fighting now; if he was as powerful as you wanted him to be then he could snap his fingers and call it a day.


Yuji also lost one of his 'powers' when Johan left his body.
In every age, in every place, the deeds of men remain the same.
 
Feb 25, 2012 8:42 AM
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I also hope Shana doesn't want to simply ruin Yuji's plan, and I hate the other flame hazes more and more...
 
Feb 25, 2012 7:55 PM

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......

Who should I be supporting here?
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Feb 25, 2012 9:33 PM

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newnar said:
God it is so fucking obvious that the plot was altered such that Yuji became so damn weak


TsukiumiFanboy said:
im loling so hard right now! why is yuji so weak and shana all of a sudden so strong (please god dont tell me its just the "love" aspect of it). back at the beginning of the season yuji smacked her ass around and now he is having trouble just staying alive. for some reason im beginning to dislike the flame hazes even more. all that hatred of the denizens throughout the first two seasons has somehow flip flopped. i generally have never wanted the "bad" guys to win but now after i saw that smug ass smile from shana at the end and the most pointless reasoning behind wanting to stop the yuji, ive just about had it with the flame hazes. was this intended by the creator of shakugan no shana?


Yuji never was as strong as you thought he was.
The snake of the festival is a god level Tomogara the same way Shana is contracted to Alastor who's also a god level Tomogara. Shana isn't any weaker than Yuji.

When he came back to Misaki city Yuji was prepared to deal with everyone. The only reason it looked like he was overpowering everyone was because he was prepared. He knew the Silver would make Margery go nuts and he knew that by trapping Wilhelmina with her it would put Wilhelmina in a situation where she wouldn't be able to act for a while thus buying him time.
Then he also knew that Shana would be confused at the situation and giving that he is not any weaker than her this gave him the opportunity to trash her and take her with him.

Things is that now everyone is determined to fight against Yuji and they do not have any hesitation about that. If Wilhelmina and Margery would have been in a state to fight in the bridge fight then the outcome would have been a different story.
Yuji just lost part of his power (Since Joan left him) and he is fighting while protecting something, he can't just dodge attack aimed at the egg since that's the whole point he is fighting for so he gotta block them.
I think that he is doing pretty fine when all these things are against him.

People all goes 'Omg the snake is a god, how can he loses?' easy answer: When fighting another god aka Alastor which is contracted to Shana.
Also I would like to point out the type of god. The snake is the god of creation while Alastor is the god of destruction. Sound kind of easy but I think that it's normal that the god of destruction is physically stronger than the god of creation but maybe that's just me.
Alastor ain't considered for being the strongest being for nothing.
 
Feb 25, 2012 10:03 PM
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Maddo_scientisto said:
newnar said:
God it is so fucking obvious that the plot was altered such that Yuji became so damn weak


TsukiumiFanboy said:
im loling so hard right now! why is yuji so weak and shana all of a sudden so strong (please god dont tell me its just the "love" aspect of it). back at the beginning of the season yuji smacked her ass around and now he is having trouble just staying alive. for some reason im beginning to dislike the flame hazes even more. all that hatred of the denizens throughout the first two seasons has somehow flip flopped. i generally have never wanted the "bad" guys to win but now after i saw that smug ass smile from shana at the end and the most pointless reasoning behind wanting to stop the yuji, ive just about had it with the flame hazes. was this intended by the creator of shakugan no shana?


Yuji never was as strong as you thought he was.
The snake of the festival is a god level Tomogara the same way Shana is contracted to Alastor who's also a god level Tomogara. Shana isn't any weaker than Yuji.

When he came back to Misaki city Yuji was prepared to deal with everyone. The only reason it looked like he was overpowering everyone was because he was prepared. He knew the Silver would make Margery go nuts and he knew that by trapping Wilhelmina with her it would put Wilhelmina in a situation where she wouldn't be able to act for a while thus buying him time.
Then he also knew that Shana would be confused at the situation and giving that he is not any weaker than her this gave him the opportunity to trash her and take her with him.

Things is that now everyone is determined to fight against Yuji and they do not have any hesitation about that. If Wilhelmina and Margery would have been in a state to fight in the bridge fight then the outcome would have been a different story.
Yuji just lost part of his power (Since Joan left him) and he is fighting while protecting something, he can't just dodge attack aimed at the egg since that's the whole point he is fighting for so he gotta block them.
I think that he is doing pretty fine when all these things are against him.

People all goes 'Omg the snake is a god, how can he loses?' easy answer: When fighting another god aka Alastor which is contracted to Shana.
Also I would like to point out the type of god. The snake is the god of creation while Alastor is the god of destruction. Sound kind of easy but I think that it's normal that the god of destruction is physically stronger than the god of creation but maybe that's just me.
Alastor ain't considered for being the strongest being for nothing.
Maddo_scientisto said:
newnar said:
God it is so fucking obvious that the plot was altered such that Yuji became so damn weak


TsukiumiFanboy said:
im loling so hard right now! why is yuji so weak and shana all of a sudden so strong (please god dont tell me its just the "love" aspect of it). back at the beginning of the season yuji smacked her ass around and now he is having trouble just staying alive. for some reason im beginning to dislike the flame hazes even more. all that hatred of the denizens throughout the first two seasons has somehow flip flopped. i generally have never wanted the "bad" guys to win but now after i saw that smug ass smile from shana at the end and the most pointless reasoning behind wanting to stop the yuji, ive just about had it with the flame hazes. was this intended by the creator of shakugan no shana?


Yuji never was as strong as you thought he was.
The snake of the festival is a god level Tomogara the same way Shana is contracted to Alastor who's also a god level Tomogara. Shana isn't any weaker than Yuji.

When he came back to Misaki city Yuji was prepared to deal with everyone. The only reason it looked like he was overpowering everyone was because he was prepared. He knew the Silver would make Margery go nuts and he knew that by trapping Wilhelmina with her it would put Wilhelmina in a situation where she wouldn't be able to act for a while thus buying him time.
Then he also knew that Shana would be confused at the situation and giving that he is not any weaker than her this gave him the opportunity to trash her and take her with him.

Things is that now everyone is determined to fight against Yuji and they do not have any hesitation about that. If Wilhelmina and Margery would have been in a state to fight in the bridge fight then the outcome would have been a different story.
Yuji just lost part of his power (Since Joan left him) and he is fighting while protecting something, he can't just dodge attack aimed at the egg since that's the whole point he is fighting for so he gotta block them.
I think that he is doing pretty fine when all these things are against him.

People all goes 'Omg the snake is a god, how can he loses?' easy answer: When fighting another god aka Alastor which is contracted to Shana.
Also I would like to point out the type of god. The snake is the god of creation while Alastor is the god of destruction. Sound kind of easy but I think that it's normal that the god of destruction is physically stronger than the god of creation but maybe that's just me.
Alastor ain't considered for being the strongest being for nothing.



Shana super leveled up after she stop deceiving herself, another typical "awaken" moments where any hero becomes stronger just by doing nothing
 
Feb 25, 2012 10:16 PM
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The god of creation's goal is to grant wishes. This time, the wish is the World Creation, not the annihilation of the Flame Haze. If you noticed, the Snake never directly attacked the Flame Haze.

And yes, everything is progressing just as planned.

Xanadu will be Yuji and Shana's "child".
bla bla bla
The endless debate between fans and haters. At one point, after spending a lot of time on MAL, you just realize it's totally pointless.
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On MAL, everyone who has used the lame rating system becomes a critic and an intellectual by default, haven't you heard?
 
Feb 25, 2012 10:45 PM

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I really enjoyed this episode. Reading some of the complaining posts does kind of hurt my head a bit...
 
Feb 25, 2012 11:53 PM

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That Yuji is too fucking weak.... What the Hell.....
 
Feb 26, 2012 6:38 AM
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twonline said:
That Yuji is too fucking weak.... What the Hell.....


Sigh.

I'm disturbed by how many people here cannot properly evaluate the power level of characters....
bla bla bla
The endless debate between fans and haters. At one point, after spending a lot of time on MAL, you just realize it's totally pointless.
Niko-kun said:
On MAL, everyone who has used the lame rating system becomes a critic and an intellectual by default, haven't you heard?
 
Feb 26, 2012 7:37 AM

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wakka9ca said:

Sigh.

I'm disturbed by how many people here cannot properly evaluate the power level of characters....

dont bother, its already clear that many people (specially here on MAL) never pay attention to things they watch
 
Feb 26, 2012 8:47 AM

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Has anyone noticed that Yuji refers himself in the third person?
In every age, in every place, the deeds of men remain the same.
 
Feb 26, 2012 8:54 AM

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Starbuck11 said:
Has anyone noticed that Yuji refers himself in the third person?

 
Feb 26, 2012 11:36 AM
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As far as I'm concerned, the last 2 episodes have shown that if you were "bored" in the first half of season 2 and "skipped" it, it's basically coming back to bite you right now. With that said, this anime is unfortunately one that you can't watch properly without having read the novels and recalling the little details that occur throughout the series. It skips a lot compared to the first two season and requires more "reading between the lines" than many other light novels from what I've seen.

If anything, you may as well as consider yourself reading Shakespeare when reading/watching this show so it's not something that you can blatantly watch and expect to understand everything. If you do, the story is going to feel incredibly shallow and as if it were nonsense, which I presume is where a majority of the hate is coming from right now. It's one of those shows where you need to think about the events that happen and unfortunately, majority of the anime community dislikes thinking when they watch something <.<
 
Feb 26, 2012 11:53 AM
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Taimei shihen is the psalm right ? how could shana put it in the ring ? also she is trying to explode the egg with taimei shihen ?
 
Feb 26, 2012 12:53 PM

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MisterXX said:
Taimei shihen is the psalm right ? how could shana put it in the ring ? also she is trying to explode the egg with taimei shihen ?


She got the spell from Lamies, remember the "ball of secrets" he gave to Wilhelmina? She even says it this episode.
You could think of Taimei Shihen as the OS of the entire program. If she loads the rings with what is basically the source code of Xanadu, you could do pretty much anything to it.
 
Feb 26, 2012 1:06 PM
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It's already too late to stop the world creation process.

However, no one said you can't change the rules and laws of the new world...
bla bla bla
The endless debate between fans and haters. At one point, after spending a lot of time on MAL, you just realize it's totally pointless.
Niko-kun said:
On MAL, everyone who has used the lame rating system becomes a critic and an intellectual by default, haven't you heard?
 
Feb 26, 2012 4:01 PM
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Posts: 35
game8910 said:
MisterXX said:
Taimei shihen is the psalm right ? how could shana put it in the ring ? also she is trying to explode the egg with taimei shihen ?


She got the spell from Lamies, remember the "ball of secrets" he gave to Wilhelmina? She even says it this episode.
You could think of Taimei Shihen as the OS of the entire program. If she loads the rings with what is basically the source code of Xanadu, you could do pretty much anything to it.


Thank you , you've helped me a lot.
 
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