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Poll: Fate/Zero Episode 10 Discussion


Dec 3, 2011 11:00 PM

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Thess said:
Yumekichi11 said:
sallym613 said:
@ Yumekichi: I have nothing against Rin trying to save her classmate and the kids (even though its foolish, it was really brave of her regardless) but I feel like Rin's complete success with owning Ryuunosuke and getting the kids out of there alive without Ryuunosuke getting an opportunity to retaliate...just doesn't sit too well with me. Especially since Fate/Zero has made a strong impression on me of having an overall dark, serious mood...where things don't usually go well or happen on a happy tone.

Rin owning a despicable criminal was awesome..by itself. However, not within the context of Fate/Zero.
I understand but understand that after the shitty ass murdering shit that Uryuu did to kids, sheer justice with a4 hammer have been delivered of those dead kids by Rin. It is to say the least a homage to avenging those kids.

Point being that despite them changing things, glorifying Rin is good IMO.


No. It isn't. The entire episode is ridiculous in context of the anime (the premise of Zero is the Bad Guy Wins). There is no justice, no satisfactory gleam of hope, but despair. Save that earn your happy ending for Fate Stay Night. Save the almost 100% happy ending for Fate Hollow Ataraxia, the sequel.

Rin should have gotten her ass owned and pissed herself in fear if they wanted to expand things. She became an unrealistic piece of loli fan service in this episode, rather than an adorable and realistic kid. We first see her nearly flashing us to take this seriously. All she did in the LN was being scared witless while trying to find her friend and then faint while Kariya rescued her from trouble, all by savouring the bitter despair of the knowledge her best friend must be dead or worse than dead and this was a crappy idea.

They shouldn't have wasted money on pointless lolicon fan service, they could have very well axe this episode on half and set up the Mad Feast of Kings.
I understand your con view of this but fan service was definitely not in there. There were some very light suggestions but nothing near any ecchi nor even for that matter light ecchi it was shown.

Perhaps an alternate version of what you mention could be included in the BD Vol of this episode but that remains to be seen. They should give to their fans cut scenes or redo some scenes for sure.

The being said I tend to see it more positive of what they tried to show of Rin this episode. At least fan have been served. Not in fan service but in the joy of seeing Rin being glorified.

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Dec 3, 2011 11:08 PM

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Yumekichi11 said:
At least fan have been served. Not in fan service but in the joy of seeing Rin being glorified.

You just admitted that this episode is a dickstroking effort to Rin fans.

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Dec 3, 2011 11:17 PM

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Kind of a slow/boring ep imo.

Edit: lol only 3 more episodes for this "season" too, makes it even worse.
Modified by temporary, Dec 3, 2011 11:26 PM
 
Dec 3, 2011 11:29 PM

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A Rin-centric ep wasn't bad. Hope the last 3 eps will deliver as much.
 
Dec 3, 2011 11:46 PM

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I just hope the last episode will be epic.
"Why do I always realize it... when I've already lost it..." -Guts, Berserk
"Some things are beautiful because they cannot be obtained." -Gilgamesh, Fate/stay night
"We are constantly living in a peaceful world that somebody else won for us. Even if it were only a day of peace, I will be grateful for its value." - Minashiro Tsubaki, FAFNER
"Screw you, future me!" -Makise Kurisu, Steins;Gate
"We used to show off by waging wars and whatnot." -Watashi, Jinrui wa Suitai Shimashita
"Call me Moses. I'm going to part the sea of students before your eyes." -Moses?, Valvrave
"Time is guilty." -Andō & Tomoyo, INOU-Battle
 
Dec 3, 2011 11:56 PM

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Worst episode so far; but even with that said it wasn't that bad it was just that compared to the rest... Rin is awesome so the episode was ok, but even though it was nice to see what she was like as a kid it didn't fill the episode enough for me to say it was good; unlike all the other episodes which made me lose track of time this one felt average at best. It seems like its going to pick up next episode though from what they said in the preview.
 
Dec 4, 2011 12:07 AM

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I loved this episode. Really kept me at the edge of my seat. When the police drove by and Rin escaped detection I was hoping the police would find her and send her home but then she actually saved the kids and survived.

Everything went better than expected. :D
Blergh.
 
Dec 4, 2011 1:07 AM

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Bah! decent episode but the worst one so far, especially since they changed the whole meaning of Rin's little adventure. But everything else was top notch as usual.
Omniknight said:
dkrdude3 said:
This episode was a complete waste of time. One of the many things that makes F/Z so much better than F/SN is the relative absence of Rin, so focusing an episode on her as a kid is basically the worst idea I can think of.


I don't understand. Developping a beloved character from the original series is considered a waste of time? Of all the characters in F/SN, you hate Rin? I would love to remove Shirou from the picture entirely personally, in addition to all worthless, spinless male leads in anime in general.


LOL if you think Shirou is a spineless male lead, he has done more brave and badass things than nearly all the Masters and even some Servants put together. You can call him an idiot but spineless is the last word I would use to describe Shirou.
The Art of Eight
 
Dec 4, 2011 1:47 AM

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still waiting for berserker
not for berserker master
 
Dec 4, 2011 2:01 AM

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Aoi is such a doormat.
Kariya doesn't have very good taste in women, poor guy.
 
Dec 4, 2011 2:20 AM

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Thess said:
All she did in the LN was being scared witless while trying to find her friend and then faint while Kariya rescued her from trouble, all by savouring the bitter despair of the knowledge her best friend must be dead or worse than dead and this was a crappy idea.


REALLY? If I did read the novel then yeah, this would seem like an unnecessary addition for Rin fans... but I don't see the problem in how they executed it. I can agree that this isn't a great use of time considering there's only 3 episodes left, but then again... this isn't worse than the 1hr abomination of episode 1.

Although, out of all this, there are some interesting developments in Tokiomi and Kariya (not sure if it was in the novel as well) which may or may not justify the changes. So here's to hoping I can convince you to change your mind:

-Tokiomi was portrayed as the perfect father from Rin's perspective. It seems like the overarching theme of the entire episode is on how she wants to be a powerful magus like the father she looks up to. But we all know that in reality, he didn't give a rat's ass about Rin when she was in trouble; he could have commanded Assassin to swoop her out at any time, but didn't, to have assassin remain a tactical advantage.

Had she failed and went back feeling like crap, this doesn't exactly establish anything much but add more to the gloomy atmosphere. But when she succeeded, it adds more to the contrast of Tokiomi's two-sided character of what people perceive him as, and what he actually is. Thus, Rin's little adventure/flashback actually adds quite a bit to Tokiomi's villainy such that in the final scene between Kariya and Rin's mom, instead of not caring about their disputes (which is the neutral stance I took when they first introduced him), I took Kariya's side.
 
Dec 4, 2011 2:58 AM

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Haha, Rin never changed in all those years, from hair. I bet Tokiomi got rich by selling glass. Perhaps he's the main deliverer for Swarovski. Ouch, nearly got raped by a book. Only a bibliothecarian would like that. Kudos for Rin for going out so late and looking so loli. I knew it when they started about kidnapping... You bastard Caster. Wh-what, I was scared like hell when Kariya appeared.

Anyhow, the fact that Rin broke Ryunosuke's bracelet means 1) Caster and Ryunosuke are just weak or 2) Rin is already quite strong.

Good episode. :)
Dutch anime blogger with a love for Ikuhara's antics and proper storytelling.
 
Dec 4, 2011 3:07 AM

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it was ok ep but compare with the rest pretty dull.
 
Dec 4, 2011 3:11 AM

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It's always nice to see Rin no matter what age she is.
Her personality is just interesting.

And she is courageous as well traveling all alone at that age is impressive and than going after a killer tho i don't think she understood the seriousness of the last one.
I knew that she would be saved by someone but the what happened in between was unexpected.
The question is was Matou watching her the entire time or was he just at the right place during the right time.

Also it was nice to see some of Rin's youth she was much more open then she was in Fate/Stay night.
 
Dec 4, 2011 3:14 AM
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The only thing that justifies a happy ending, with Kotone living, is a bad ending actually violates her character development to FSN. Had she failed to save her friend in a bad ending, she would have been scarred for life with post-traumatic stress from a very vulnerable age, and she would have ended up with a completely different personality by Shirou's time with different motivations. (Can you imagine finding your friend dead at that young age? You probably would shit your pants). Why would she waste a jewel she had saved for years on Shirou, when the Holy Grail is at stake? If Kotone died, her reason for fighting would have been not so focused on the Holy Grail. If Shirou asked why she saved his life, she would have hinted about Kotone's death being the reason. It wouldn't be as simple as a highschool crush, which is how the VN plays it out from what I remember. I can see why the writers chose to use the good ending because of what I said. So you can blame them for extending a side-story, but don't blame them for choosing a good ending.

Anyway this episode was great. I loved the Fuyuki city backgrounds. It reminded me of the art in the FSN visual novel.
Modified by superzombie23, Dec 4, 2011 4:47 AM
 
Dec 4, 2011 3:56 AM

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Well, weakest episode so far, even thought it contained Rin which I really like.

Oh well. At least Berserkers master has shown itself again. I really hope to see more of that guy in the future, especially since he has great looking servant.
 
Dec 4, 2011 4:18 AM

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Admittedly not as gripping as previous episodes, but it was fun to watch nonetheless. The character development -- albeit rather minor -- of Tokiomi and Kariya were definitely the highlights. Even so, Kariya's confrontation with Aoi felt like it could of been done a lot better. It honestly felt like something was missing, and Kariya's fist pump was cheesy, really.

Overall, it was not too bad of an episode. Personally, I felt that Rin's perspective of the Holy Grail War was an interesting touch.
 
Dec 4, 2011 4:24 AM

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ideoidiom said:


-Tokiomi was portrayed as the perfect father from Rin's perspective. It seems like the overarching theme of the entire episode is on how she wants to be a powerful magus like the father she looks up to. But we all know that in reality, he didn't give a rat's ass about Rin when she was in trouble; he could have commanded Assassin to swoop her out at any time, but didn't, to have assassin remain a tactical advantage.

Had she failed and went back feeling like crap, this doesn't exactly establish anything much but add more to the gloomy atmosphere. But when she succeeded, it adds more to the contrast of Tokiomi's two-sided character of what people perceive him as, and what he actually is. Thus, Rin's little adventure/flashback actually adds quite a bit to Tokiomi's villainy such that in the final scene between Kariya and Rin's mom, instead of not caring about their disputes (which is the neutral stance I took when they first introduced him), I took Kariya's side.


Tokiomi had no idea that Rin had gone out that night, Rin and Aoi were living with the Zenjou family so as not to be involved in the War.

Kirei is monitoring all the Masters closely with Assassins trying to figure out why they seek the Grail, this is under Gilgamesh's request and Kirei doesn't share this with Tokiomi so he isn't aware of what the Assassins saw there.
 
Dec 4, 2011 4:54 AM
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Liked the ep, especially second half.
 
Dec 4, 2011 5:09 AM

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OMG RIN IS SO MOE!!!! <3 HER SO MUCH!
 
Dec 4, 2011 5:14 AM

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Hoooooly fucking shit. loli Tohsaka Rin-centric episode!? Yes, this was designed to pander to all the Rin fanboys. And I am one of them, proud to declare it worked.

Wait, 6 bastards voted 1/5? Well, fuck you. How can you not vote 5/5 for Rin!?

Seriously, fuck you.

Oh well, more Rin for me.
 
Dec 4, 2011 5:34 AM

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Nice Rins Adventure.
Kariya showing up was touching
 
Dec 4, 2011 6:07 AM

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haha.. finally something to watch that isn't in the novel (well, it was but they just added more, oh yeah).. and this one was actually presented well and adds more for this beloved character i have adored and spent a lot of time with in Fate/stay night (yep, 100-hrs in the vn).. now i see how and why she loves her father that much, how she loves the craft and how respectful she is as a magus even though she is just a child (yep, good end of this feels so better than ambiguous end).. while this ep may seem independent or a side story to Zero, it's one of the things that make it feel that it is a prequel paying respect to perhaps the most important character in stay night (other than the protag).. this ep also featured the triangle of characters (Tokiomi, Aoi, and Kariya) who has little screen time in the 1st season of Fate/Zero just to remind us that they have this conflict that they must settle.. thank you, ufotable for actually bringing more to the table than just purely adapting the novels and delivering it well.. still, one can really say that it is a weaker ep compared to the rest..

Otaku mode on: OMG loli Rin <3.. so moe moe.. Rin-chama, you're the best.. thank you ufotable for bringing more of her..
Modified by argilium, Dec 4, 2011 6:18 AM
 
Dec 4, 2011 6:26 AM
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Sometimes, a breather is necessary too.

And this episode was far from being bad. A different mood, but not bad at all.
bla bla bla
The endless debate between fans and haters. At one point, after spending a lot of time on MAL, you just realize it's totally pointless.
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On MAL, everyone who has used the lame rating system becomes a critic and an intellectual by default, haven't you heard?
 
Dec 4, 2011 6:30 AM

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ssjokg said:
so rin saved the kids...ok i dont see why everyone hates this or everything else about this ep.

I dont see why its bad to have A SINGLE episode about the child of one of the masters or why its bad that for once something good happens in this story.


Yeah,. besides as an episode alone it was actually quite an interesting little story. Also considering this a prequel isn't good to built on future characters? How can you say is unrelated with the story when is not a stand alone but a prequel?

Anyway i think the whole objection is from people who have a little hate for little Rin simply because they hate the popularity around her than the episode actually being bad.

Btw at the end there the thing that dropped from above in-fond of her was one of casters little monster wasn't it? And then that locust swarm it was Kariya that saved her from caster. Am i right?
Modified by Monad, Dec 4, 2011 6:36 AM
 
Dec 4, 2011 6:42 AM

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Monad said:
Btw at the end there the thing that dropped from above in-fond of her was one of casters little monster wasn't it? And the that wind thing was worms and it was Kariya that saved her from caster. Am i right?

Yep the thing was one of Caster tentacle monster, and that "wind thing" was indeed Kariya's magic, not really worms but insects (I don't thing they have worms with wings in their basement).
 
Dec 4, 2011 6:45 AM

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I was relieved Kariya was there. Good episode. The encounter between Ryuunosuke and Rin was a perfect circumstance to build Rin.
 
Dec 4, 2011 6:55 AM

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Well this was a fun original episode of "Loli" Tohsaka Rin. As we already know from the Visual Novel of Fate\Stay Night, she's one of the most awesome tsundere out there, and it also looks like the Ufotable studio couldn't resist Loli Tohsaka Rin either.

This was an indeed a fun episode with Tohsaka Rin. Seeing her as an honor student, helping everyone around her and working really hard to one day participate in a Holy Grail War. She works hard, gets excited and fails, and there a more father figure acting Tohsaka Tokimoi appears and advice her that would help her in her adventure to become a top Magi.

We now also see how Ryuunosuke keep kidnapping children to do his annoying sick works that he has every night since the Holy Grail has started and nothing was better to see Rin sabotage his sick minded work that night, more children saved woo! As the children gets taken care of by the Police, we see Rin hiding from the cops to she won't get sent home yet, then one of Caster's weird tentacle monster appear, Rin get scared (shocking), and a cloud of small bat looking creatures flies past Rin and kills the weird creature, she passes out and at some of the last frames, we can see Karyan's figure. What a noble dude he is, I'm really getting to like him.

As for the next episode, looks like the show is beginning to start on some real amazing stuff coming season 1 ending. Can't wait!
 
Dec 4, 2011 9:24 AM

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After reading through these posts I have one thing to say.

LEARN THE FUCKING MEANING OF FILLER YOU RETARDS.
No. This wasn't filler. Developing characters is not filler. Revealing a massive frigging plot point is not filler. Moving the story along is not bloody filler.
This episode did all that. Whether you believe it or not. I admit though that it wasn't the strongest episode but I peg it as enjoyable non the less.

"I always take life with a grain of salt, ...plus a slice of lemon, ...and a shot of tequila."

 
Dec 4, 2011 10:51 AM

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I thought that this would be nice, happy filler episode. But it wasn't. And I'm not least disappointed.
 
Dec 4, 2011 11:39 AM
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Only half of this episode was filler actually. I would've preferred the person who wrote the original material to go along the same lines the novel went though.

Like instead of Rin saving the kids, have her discover them dead or something, to keep the show on the cynical end of things.
 
Dec 4, 2011 12:13 PM

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AidanAK47 said:
After reading through these posts I have one thing to say.

LEARN THE FUCKING MEANING OF FILLER YOU RETARDS.
No. This wasn't filler. Developing characters is not filler. Revealing a massive frigging plot point is not filler. Moving the story along is not bloody filler.
This episode did all that. Whether you believe it or not. I admit though that it wasn't the strongest episode but I peg it as enjoyable non the less.


Quote for FUCKING thread.
 
Dec 4, 2011 1:02 PM

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I don't care if this was filler or not. Still an enjoyable episode and the animation just seems to get better and better. ufotable is amazing as always.
Modified by FatherAnderson, Dec 4, 2011 1:10 PM
 
Dec 4, 2011 1:39 PM

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TOHSAKA RIN EPISODE~! > w < THIS WILL FOREVER BE MY FAVORITE EPISODE. AAAH~

/frantically fangirling over her
 
Dec 4, 2011 4:08 PM

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AidanAK47 said:
After reading through these posts I have one thing to say.

LEARN THE FUCKING MEANING OF FILLER YOU RETARDS.
No. This wasn't filler. Developing characters is not filler. Revealing a massive frigging plot point is not filler. Moving the story along is not bloody filler.
This episode did all that. Whether you believe it or not. I admit though that it wasn't the strongest episode but I peg it as enjoyable non the less.


You're the fucking retard.

Much of it was filler, this is an adaptation of a Novel, they added stuff that didn't happen in the source material to fill time.

That's the very definition of filler, of course the whole thing wasn't filler, some of it was important to the plot and actually happened in the Novel, but they stretched it out to fill a whole episode with the other stuff.

And filler can still be enjoyable, you don't have to take it as an insult and respond in kind.
 
Dec 4, 2011 4:38 PM
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Fantastic episode, one of the best of the series. Rin's as awesome as ever and the character developments were great.

In every age, in every place, the deeds of men remain the same.
 
Dec 4, 2011 5:46 PM

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kinda meh espiode, where's my bro Rider? better be around next episode!
 
Dec 4, 2011 6:46 PM

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mystik said:
kinda meh espiode, where's my bro Rider? better be around next episode!


oh you so gonna need medical help after the next ep....
 
Dec 4, 2011 8:03 PM

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This episode was very HNGGGGH worthy, yeah sure lacking in really major events but it gives some interesting back-story on Rin.

 
Dec 4, 2011 9:47 PM

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i really like rin since fsn, but i don't like this episode... :(
kinda out of place, not necessary and ruining the atmosphere
 
Dec 4, 2011 9:57 PM

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Best part was with Kariya, Aoi, and Rin. Kariya is barely even involved in the story, so it was good to see the guy again. The whole scene was beautifully done too. DEATH FLAGS EVERYWHERE, I fear. =(
 
Dec 4, 2011 10:07 PM

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Wow, I actually found it kinda intense during the little fight in that room.
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Do you know where hell is? Inside your head-Chrona (Soul Eater)


 
Dec 5, 2011 12:09 AM

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The overall modifications from the actual source are still under supervision of Gen Uro, so I guess Uro must be agreed with this. Going all grim in every episode most of the times isn't a good option. Sometimes a bit of optimism will bring more impact to the upcoming grim moments.

So, this ep I liek.
 
Dec 5, 2011 2:13 AM
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A filler but the best looking filler eveeeeer
It was still very enjoyable. The animation was ^_^ O_O ^_^ The scene of Rin's eventual discovery of the children was very eery and i loved it
Even though this episode is some what of a side track, i have high hopes for the last 3 episodes. There was some progression into the story if you actually watched the episode in its entirety. Looks like Kirei is reassessing his loyalty to Tokiomi.

overall
3.7-3.9/5 episode
Modified by Diazt3r, Dec 5, 2011 2:16 AM
 
Dec 5, 2011 6:12 AM

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The whole episode about Rin, I love it. <3
 
Dec 5, 2011 10:58 AM

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El_Magus said:
It wasn't a filler and it was a great episode.

hmm great? i don't agree with that. as for me just good. i love Rin, but i definitely want more scenes with Rider :D
 
Dec 5, 2011 11:38 AM
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zeroyuki92 said:
The overall modifications from the actual source are still under supervision of Gen Uro, so I guess Uro must be agreed with this. Going all grim in every episode most of the times isn't a good option. Sometimes a bit of optimism will bring more impact to the upcoming grim moments.

So, this ep I liek.
IMO it felt more like something Nasu would add. Both Nasu and Gen are supervising, not just Gen. In fact, therewas talk that Nasu had written "original content" for the adaptation.

 
Dec 5, 2011 4:03 PM

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Leon-Gun said:
zeroyuki92 said:
The overall modifications from the actual source are still under supervision of Gen Uro, so I guess Uro must be agreed with this. Going all grim in every episode most of the times isn't a good option. Sometimes a bit of optimism will bring more impact to the upcoming grim moments.

So, this ep I liek.
IMO it felt more like something Nasu would add. Both Nasu and Gen are supervising, not just Gen. In fact, therewas talk that Nasu had written "original content" for the adaptation.
Remains to see if that and other content will be added as extras in the BDs. If the real content involves Rin crying and pissing herself to death so to speak then I would like to see that alternative. For TV this was the best IMO.

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Dec 5, 2011 5:34 PM

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Yeah, this wasn't filler . Character-development heavy yes but it fleshed out the ever sokawaii Rin-chan and we finally got to see Berserkers Master again. Poor Salura :/
 
Dec 5, 2011 9:32 PM

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i love the gloomy atmosphere in this ep :D, and Rin climbing that table was pretty cute too LOL
Nope.
 
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