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Poll: Legend of the Galactic Heroes Episode 72 Discussion


Aug 25, 2011 10:16 PM
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Kiercheis was really a great character...he's got everyone thinking the universe would be a better place if he were alive. I wonder if anyone else wants a Kiercheis pendant? I think Reuenthal does...
 
Jan 20, 2012 10:21 PM

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That toast to democrazy has to be right up there with Churchill's speech.
 
Jan 21, 2012 1:01 PM

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Grisle said:
Kiercheis was really a great character...he's got everyone thinking the universe would be a better place if he were alive. I wonder if anyone else wants a Kiercheis pendant? I think Reuenthal does...


I want one too, complete with red hair inside!
"...our faces marked by toil, by deceptions, by success, by love; our weary eyes looking still, looking always, looking anxiously for something out of life, that while it is expected is already gone – has passed unseen, in a sigh, in a flash – together with the youth, with the strength, with the romance of illusions.” - Joseph Conrad ('Youth')
 
Jan 21, 2012 4:02 PM

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koreye said:
Grisle said:
Kiercheis was really a great character...he's got everyone thinking the universe would be a better place if he were alive. I wonder if anyone else wants a Kiercheis pendant? I think Reuenthal does...


I want one too, complete with red hair inside!


*cuts eyerok's hair and puts into jar*
Even when I was in crowd, I was always alone
 
Feb 13, 2012 12:56 PM

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Sabinlerose said:
That toast to democrazy has to be right up there with Churchill's speech.
 
Apr 29, 2012 3:33 AM

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The most boring episode this season, but then again I do often find action more boring than, for example, slice of life. Must have been great for people who like space battles.

I've started to speculate again on how this series could possibly end. There's been all that foreshadowing for Yang's demise and now I'm thinking maybe Reinhard will die too, all the talk about how he wants to be defeated in a battle of equals. Foreshadowing aside, as long as both of them remain alive, we're at a stalemate because they're supposedly equal geniuses (although Lohengramm has so far been much more of a blunt force strategist than Yang). If Yang dies, Reinhard would have the galaxy under his thumb, so the whole series would just be a story of the galaxy being subjugated and Julian's growth into leadership would have little meaning. Or maybe he could be instated as a prime minister for autonomous Alliance, but that would leave us in the same situation as the beginning of this season. It's also possible Reinhard dies and the rest of the Empire falls into chaos and struggle for power again with Alliance going on independently. But I doubt that would be the case because the series has seemed like a long struggle to find a balance between two different forms of government. Reinhard's ambition is too big for there to be a balance if he remains alive.

The biggest problem with both of them dying is that Alliance side has shown the growth of a peacetime leader in Julian, but the Empire side has potential rulers only in military personnel like Reuenthal. He would definitely have the hunger for power for such a role but he hasn't shown compassion or skill that would work outside the battlefield. He doesn't seem like a character who would look past the war either, so if a peace was reached he might still have designs to conquer the Alliance. Hildegard is the one who has shown more skills there and she might be a good peacetime leader, but I doubt that would happen in a galaxy that only has about 5 women and some generic drones for Poplan to hit on. Women don't really have power or presence in this series.

So I think the most likely scenario is peaceful coexistence with neither side completely winning. The problem with this scenario is the biggest weakness of autocracy: when one ruler passes away, how to ensure that the next one is equally competent? We haven't seen Annerose lately but I still think she might play a bigger part in the series and she might be the next in line for the throne if Reinhard dies. Unless he marries Hildegard, which might very well happen. So maybe it is a female ruler after all?
 
Apr 30, 2012 6:14 PM

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Bucock's last moments and the recognition of salutes were beautiful.
 
May 13, 2012 9:28 PM

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Incidentally, even after the battle of Marr-Adetta, we're still not two-thirds of the way through the series.

Reinhard said:
Fleet Admiral Reuenthal. It seems that in some near future, I will face another enemy admiral in this format once again.


I'm not going to read too deeply into that line, but...
 
Jun 1, 2012 3:50 AM

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maarsaalis said:
If Kircheis were alive... ;-;
QFT

Mariendorf is as sensible as always, if things progresses as it does, she might replace Yang as my no. 1 favorite LoGH char, from what i see, she makes more sense than most of the people around her, she is more objective than Oberstein (while not being a Machiavellian), and her insight is also a spectacle, it's such a shame she only has ~18 users who added her to their list

Feorg said:

Foreshadowing aside, as long as both of them remain alive, we're at a stalemate because they're supposedly equal geniuses (although Lohengramm has so far been much more of a blunt force strategist than Yang).

Reinhard's ambition is too big for there to be a balance if he remains alive.

IMO, about the tally b/n Yang and Reinhard as of now, i would definitely think Yang wins, it may have been the result of being in a smaller force that allowed him to manipulate a handful amount of tactics to counteract Reinhards massive scaled ambitions and cause headaches for the Imperial Army(eg. using Geographical/Location advantages, being able to set traps, and using do or die tactics and last but not the least, trickery) , but you've got to give credit to the guy, most of the time he manages to come up with something that Reinhard doesn't expect

I agree that Reinhard's ambition is just too big, his massive conquest severely lessens the Density of his forces, he should have just Developed the two corridors and tried an enveloping strategy against the alliance, where they begin to close in slowly towards Alliance territory while building Supply systems and establishing a stable economy, and when Phezzan is pacified, Iserlohn immortalized, they begin a massive scale attack on the Alliance from a point where they at least don't have to worry too much about their escape route or supply lines getting cut off, I'm telling you, the massive attack against the Alliance was a huge bet, regardless of fleet size.

Hildegard is the one who has shown more skills there and she might be a good peacetime leader, but I doubt that would happen in a galaxy that only has about 5 women and some generic drones for Poplan to hit on. Women don't really have power or presence in this series.

I agree, women don't have much presence in this series, but one woman (Hilda), if I might say, accounts for more presence than all of the Admirals combined, she's greater than Mittermeyer and >= Reunthal.
Modified by RadiGen, Jun 1, 2012 4:30 AM
 
Jun 10, 2012 11:51 AM

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In anime, when they wonder so often what would happen if a determined character were alive, that generally means...
 
Aug 14, 2012 2:02 PM

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R.I.P Bucock

This episode made me miss Kircheis even more.
Emile is so lucky; I want to be Reinhard's servant and to help him take off his cape. ;_;
 
Sep 4, 2012 9:13 AM

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Bucocks last words put a tear to my eyes, he was one tough old man
*salute*
 
Sep 4, 2012 9:14 AM

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silversaint said:
Bucocks last words put a tear to my eyes, he was one tough old man
*salute*


But he is just another prey for our lion
Even when I was in crowd, I was always alone
 
May 29, 2013 10:14 AM

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"Democracy is the philosophy of making friends on equal terms, not of creating master-servant relationships. I want to have good friends and I want to be a good friend to other people. But I don't want to be a good master or to be a good servant. "
- Starfleet Commander Bucock

So simple, yet so beautiful, well said.

I really appreciate how I can root for both factions so easily, unlike certain other shows I can't label any of them as evil with a superficial excuse to do what they are doing. Lohengramm may be a despot, but he is not wicked.

I'm still rooting for Yang Wenli just a bit more though, not to mention that ever since Kircheis passed away, Reinhard hasn't really showed off his tactical/strategist skills. Excellent episode 5/5.
 
Jun 12, 2013 9:30 AM

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Respect for Bucocks ...
 
Jul 4, 2013 2:13 AM
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Bucocks' farewell speech was so beautiful. And in the same breath, he proved that despite Hilda's great tactical insight, she was the one who was narrow-minded. I'm guessing she thought those tough old men refusing to surrender to a great and kind emperor have to be narrow-minded. But Bucocks' master-slave vs equals speech completely shut her trap right there.

And it's precisely why Yang continues to oppose Reinhart and why he never has the ambition to become a ruler. He holds the notion that a bad democracy is still better than a good dictatorship. Plus, men like Reinhart are of a rare breed. The people can oust an elected leader if they want to, but trying to oust a dictator is a whole other thing since he can just crush political dissent (pre-emptively in some cases) it at the first signs.
 
Aug 4, 2013 7:25 PM

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This is the most emotional LOGH battle I've seen, I almost cried.
 
Aug 4, 2013 7:28 PM

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Reinhard said:
Fleet Admiral Reuenthal. It seems that in some near future, I will face another enemy admiral in this format once again.
That would be Yang lol
 
Aug 4, 2013 7:31 PM

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These LOGH discussions are so interesting.
 
Sep 15, 2013 12:27 AM

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Commander Bucock you will be remembered.
*Salute*
 
Sep 23, 2013 10:56 PM

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Wondering when Reinhard will figure out that Yang is now allied with El Facil and not Heinessen.
 
Apr 23, 2014 7:01 PM

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Paurge said:
Bucock was such a great character. I'm glad that Reinhard showed the respect he deserved after his death.


RIP Bucock, you were one of the only decent and moral Commanders in the FPA. Brilliant last battle as well considering the impossibility of victory, you went out with a fight befitting a Veteran Elite. I definitely was crying towards the end, especially by the respect paid to the enemy by the Galactic Empire fleets and their commanders.

Alas86 said:
Bucock's last words to Reinhard really stroke a chord to me, he described his disagreement with autocracy in so simple, yet meaningful, terms that I was completely surprised. Bucock died fullfilled and firm in his beliefs and principles and it speaks for Reinhard's greatness that he recognised these values in his opponent and paid him the respect he deserved.


Yes he is one of the few that lived by his morals and codes, and tried to uphold them till the end. Even Reinhard and his followers hold of him and give him credence.

maar-c said:
If Kircheis were alive... ;-;


Kircheis death is certainly the most important event in all of Logh( I can say this confidently even after only being 3/4th's through it). The history as we are shown would have turned out drastically different if he were around. Things would have been better for both the Galactic Empire and the FPA/Yang Wenli. I still miss him and consider him the 3rd most important character in LOGH even while only being a MC for 1/4th of the show. He is definitely the model for true friendship and loyalty, and I'm sure many of us wish to have an equivalent like him as a friend in our lives.
 
May 12, 2014 12:04 PM

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*Salute*.

This was such a meaningful episode. Bucock and Ootsuka Akio's voiced character will be missed. The final words between them and Reinhard, followed by the toast(s), to the annihilation, to the slow passing by of the dust with every single person saluting on Reinhard's orders.... then the flashback with Kircheis... just so... meaningful. Especially with the talk between Oskar/Mittermyer at the end there.

I think one thing people aren't interpreting right is Reinhard's words to Oskar on the ship. I felt he was praising Oskar's involvement at his side/on his ship by telling him he would like this formation again in his next battle (most likely Yang). Perhaps indirectly keeping him close/within sights as well?

Fraulein is proving so competent as usual. She's amazing. Bittenfield's fleet arrival had everyone holding their breath before it's confirmation lol.

This episode was very impacting so I can get away with a short break here until I continue through the rest of the series.

5/5
 
Aug 9, 2014 3:54 AM

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Whenever shit hits the fan; "If Kircheis were alive... "

;____;
 
Aug 18, 2014 2:49 PM

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RIP Bucock. His end was very touching, both the last drink and the salute that Reinhard ordered.
 
Oct 4, 2014 4:49 PM

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This was a very powerful episode. Bukock's final speech was very well thought out- It tied in very well with Reinhard's concerns within himself regarding his past. (I.E. his constant tinkering with his locket.) The salute scene was great, and overall, the episode once again sets up the next "arc" per se. I cannot wait to see what happens next.
I'm in a band! Check it here-
https://fanlink.to/tropicvibez
 
Nov 13, 2014 4:28 PM

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The Black Lancers got some good looking ships.
 
Mar 6, 2015 7:35 PM

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This fight ended pretty well. I enjoyed it and all its strategy. Buccock was a cool guy. Its too bad that he died.
 
Jun 2, 2015 9:27 AM

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Mad respect to both Reinhard and Bucock, Bucock died a very honourable death. Fitting for his character imo. Great episode.
 
Jun 17, 2015 2:16 PM

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Pretty impressive end of the battle! I do wonder what will happen next!
 
Jul 14, 2015 11:08 PM

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Damn this episode was hard to watch. A massive salute to both sides!
 
Aug 25, 2015 5:09 PM

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if only Kircheis were here
 
Jan 28, 2016 6:31 AM

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Truly an awe inspiring episode. I like how Bucock worded democracy as friends on equal terms whereas a monarchy/dictatorship would be that of a master and servant. That is not to say, however, that the latter cannot be as fruitful. Reinhard and Kircheis's relationship is proof of that and it goes to show that once again it's the people behind the principles that can make or break them.

The order to salute Bucock for his valiant efforts spoke volumes about how these men view war. Neither side harbors animosity or ill will towards their enemies. They are simply following the convictions of larger than life philosophies which leads to what they consider an unfortunate impasse (i.e. when Bucock mentions that he'd like a grandson like Reinhard).

That discussion between Reuenthal and Mittermeyer also helps to highlight why they've become such likable commanders. They both realize Kircheis's importance both when he was alive as well as what he means to Reinhard now as seen when Reuenthal notices the locket. It was also refreshing to hear them openly state Oberstein's impact on the military.
 
Mar 17, 2016 3:29 PM

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hilda is amazing...she is doing a important work....ON THE UNDERGROUND but he is ruling the empire...............
 
Apr 15, 2016 12:02 AM

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Reinhard sure breaks a lot of glasses.

A fantastic battle, indeed. I liked Bucock's speech and the way they lost with so much dignity.
 
May 24, 2016 2:52 AM
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Alas86 said:
I can't help but wonder though, were has Reinhard the brilliant tactician gone? Sure as a strategist he proves his ability time and again, but one can say that's because he has the whole galaxy's resources at his disposal, but tactically he is continuously humbled by inferior fleets, as if his loss against Yang in the battle of Vermillion wasn't enough, he now was nearly killed by Bucock as well. Is he just too powerfull for his own good?


Old post; I know.

In the beginning of the anime (and if you watched the side stories), much of both the alliance and imperial fleet were filled with incompetent commanders. All of the commanders that were incompetent are all gone, the Alliance forces are incredibly thin so the remaining survivors have to be competent. Bucock, Trung, and even Carlsen were more than capable commanders.

Not only that, but the Alliance utilized the terrain advantage very well. Using the small corridor to fight on equal terms and fighting not to survive (they knew death was inevitable) but to try to charge the Imperial Flagship were things that Reinhard's fleet didn't consider (although Reinhard and Reuenthal considered that ploy and were well prepared for it). Also, the first two sorties had the young admirals fighting against Bucock who had much more experience in battle than them.
 
Jun 21, 2016 12:17 PM

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A toast to democracy!

R.I.P Bucock and Trung :'(
 
Jul 9, 2016 5:17 AM

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*salute* R.I.P., Admiral Bucock and Trung Yu Chan. One of the most admirable deaths for one of the most admirable characters in the series. Bucock's final speech was beautiful. I wonder if that was sufficient to plant a seed of doubt in Reinhard's mind about whether his autocratic rule is the best way ahead. If so, Bucock has, with his sacrifice, made sure that in some way democracy can resurrect itself.

Reinhard really seems to be a pushover these days when it comes to decision-making, looks like he's role-playing a husband quite well *wink*

All this said, I feel like complaining a little - the space battles always seem either a little too simplistic, or a little too messy. One problem I've found is that the battles often happen in 2D - there is hardly any use of all the three available dimensions in space, which should be absolutely crucial (anyone who has read Ender's Game will know exactly what I'm talking about). Battles cannot be like those fought by land armies on Earth; and that's what it often turns out to be in this show. One of the fleets attacks Bucock from above towards the end, but that's a rare exception. They could have done this during the corridor shenanigans, for example. And why were the solar winds affecting only the Imperial fleet toward the end? The Alliance fleet seemed impervious to them, even without the anchors. Lots of convenient devices are used to give one side the temporary advantage over the other and make the battle swing this way and that, making it seem exciting, but it's not always convincing. \endrant

Did anyone think that Bucock will consider making that star into a nova/supernova somehow, thus eliminating both fleets? It sounds like an idea that's good enough to be used as a climax. Hmm. The final round of Yang vs Reinhard, I wonder..
Modified by Arachnophobic, Jul 9, 2016 5:24 AM
 
Oct 21, 2016 9:25 AM

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I feel what would have made this episode much better would be if we got to see the pov of an alliance ship's crew, especially of those who don't want to die or want to surrender even while the alliance admirals have accepted their inevitable deaths. LoGH already includes a lot of scenes with differing pov's within the same faction so it would have been nice to see some here too.
Modified by Aure0lin, Oct 21, 2016 9:29 AM
"I like young-girl sexual creations, Lolicon is just one hobby of my many hobbies," he says.
I ask what his wife, standing nearby, thinks of his "hobby".
"She probably thinks no problem," he replies. "Because she loves young boys sexually interacting with each other."
 
Nov 5, 2016 5:29 AM

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For a moment i though the plot will save Bucock, glad it didn't.
Great episode, very enjoyable battle.
 
Nov 28, 2016 1:13 PM

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Mikiyo said:
Certainly Bucock's death made me shiver, and yet more after that extremely beautiful song where the whole empire fleet was passing through the whole sea of destroyed battleships.

Anyway I didn't quite get that speech that Reinhard gave to Reuental in the flagship.
I will face another enemy admiral in this format once again...

I wonder if this has a meaning, given out the fact that he noticed Reuental's odd reaction to Reinhard holding the pendant.

fedaykin said:
Mikiyo said:

Anyway I didn't quite get that speech that Reinhard gave to Reuental in the flagship.

I wonder if this has a meaning, given out the fact that he noticed Reuental's odd reaction to Reinhard holding the pendant.


Indeed, that was curious. Surely Reinhard wouldn't suggest that they may end up fighting to Reuenthal's face, especially given that Reuenthal simply politely acquiesced? If not Reuenthal, then who did he mean though? Perhaps Reinhard is suggesting that this is the manner in which he would defeat Yang?

I do like these cryptic remarks and the wild speculation they permit us. :)

MostCuriousThing said:
Incidentally, even after the battle of Marr-Adetta, we're still not two-thirds of the way through the series.
Reinhard said:
Fleet Admiral Reuenthal. It seems that in some near future, I will face another enemy admiral in this format once again.

I'm not going to read too deeply into that line, but...

I'm currently rewatching the whole series.
Given the future episodes, I'm pretty sure that Reinhard's words relate to
It's both exciting and sad for me. Firstly, that he is considered a worthy opponent to the Kaiser, equal to Bucock or surpassing him. Secondly, the event I mention above is heart-breaking for me.

Bucock fought and died with dignity. RIP.
However, I don't agree with all his words. Just like Yang he idealizes the idea of democracy which is not so brilliant.

And "if only Kircheis was alive"... I find it very annoying. Especially when this phrase is repeated four times in one episode.
Modified by Maureval, Nov 28, 2016 1:30 PM
 
Jun 18, 2017 11:46 PM

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RIP Admiral Bucock :'(
 
Aug 6, 2017 1:59 PM

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Rest in peace Bucock :(
 
Nov 12, 2017 12:14 PM

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Bucock chooses died before that surrender!!!


Hello, my litte boy!


 
Feb 16, 2018 9:32 AM

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Fleet Admiral Bucock Rest in Peace.

Bucock death and Kircheis flashbacks that was so freaking sorrowful.
 
Apr 23, 2018 10:33 AM

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Aure0lin said:
I feel what would have made this episode much better would be if we got to see the pov of an alliance ship's crew, especially of those who don't want to die or want to surrender even while the alliance admirals have accepted their inevitable deaths. LoGH already includes a lot of scenes with differing pov's within the same faction so it would have been nice to see some here too.

yeah.. I'll drink to that
I kept thinking about it for the rest of the episode, so Bucock did not surrender and died honorably, but what about those who did not want to die?
Why, you say... Don't you get it?

If you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change.
 
May 13, 2018 9:15 PM
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RIP Trung and Buccock. Two great characters that will be sorely missed.

Reuenthal knows that the takeover of Iserhorn was his fault and is probably glad that he left Lutz to take the blame. I think Reinhard's words at the end to Oskar were about Yang.

The ray of hope tease with the oncoming fleet turning out to be the Black Lancers was very mean!

No Empire admiral died. I'm surprised.

So let's see how that changed the power game:

1) Empire. Won a great battle but as always it's tainted by a Yang victory.
2) Yang's fleet- Moving up thanks to the crushing defeat of the Alliance.
3) El Facil- Still keeping them seperate from Yang as I don't trust them one bit.
4) The Alliance. Their capital is still there but they are screwed now they've lost their two best military minds.
5) Rubinsky
6) Earth Cult
7) Goldenbaulm's

MVP of the Episode: Buccock again.
 
Oct 26, 2018 4:51 PM
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Bucock. Your death won't be in vain.

Damn, Hilda sure looked pissed off at Reinhard's orders at the ending.
 
Nov 8, 2018 2:14 AM

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Reinhard looks happiest in this episode when he's talking to Kircheis junior.
 
Mar 30, 2:40 PM

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The silence in the Imperial fleet when it was passing by the debris of the FPA ships made quite a powerful scene, all the respect to the opponents is incredibly beautiful
 
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