| According to ICv2's report "Internal Correspondence No.73", this year's DVD & Blu-ray market in US is estimated to be $160 ~ 200 million, which is 40% of that in 2005. ICv2 said it's difficult to make a precise estimation because Walmart hasn't revealed their sales data. Chart: Anime DVD & Blu-ray Market in US (2005 - 2010) no data in 2008 and 2009 Anime!Anime! speculates that the media sales of anime for "core" fans have dropped much severely because the sales of anime for general public (eg. Pokemon, Dragonball, Studio Ghibli anime) have been relatively unchanged. Source: Anime!Anime! ref. Anime Media Sales Keep Rising In Japan |
dtshykOct 7, 2010 7:04 AM
| Well, there was a recession.. Not speaking of the adverse effect of torrenting.. |
| Wow, the sales rates are sure dropping fast... |
| They do know that data is worthless if a company as huge as Walmart isn't even part of it right? Walmart has a huge market share in every department after all. And another thing, the US has been going through the worst recession since the Great Depression, did they really expect anything else. Most regular watchers now a days just watch through Crunchyroll. So this is just a matter of media changing. Instead of paying what, 30-40 dollars for 12 episodes, they'll watch it streamed (I'm talking legally here) and pay if they really want it. Something similar is happening with TV and movies, especially with how huge Netflix has become. |
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| in US huh? guess their failed dragonball movie gives such a bad impression |
| Well this is concerning. Everyone so far is saying (and they're gonna keep saying) that it's all due to the economic climate, the recession. Though is any other market in media & entertainment suffering as much as in anime? Even if Walmart's sales were to be included, it probably wouldn't make a huge difference since few stores that hold other DVDs and media, only display a couple of small shelves of anime DVDs. Leon-Gun said: So this is just a matter of media changing. Instead of paying what, 30-40 dollars for 12 episodes, they'll watch it streamed (I'm talking legally here) and pay if they really want it. Something similar is happening with TV and movies, especially with how huge Netflix has become. Everybody keeps making the whole "$50 for a 13 episode dual audio set" sound like a bad thing, though it seems hardly any different from the price of your average American television season box set or heck even your average video game. Not that the price for any of those things can't be expensive for many people, but at the same time, I can imagine a LOT more people buying American TV season box sets and more-so video games than Anime DVD sets which are priced roughly the same partly because there are just way more eyeballs. I frankly still stand by the notion that not enough people who would be considered consumers of anime in the "I'll casually buy a DVD set the way I would casually buy a video game," actually exist because they don't know the anime DVDs exist and it doesn't help that anime itself is suffers somewhat of a stigma. leeahseng said: in US huh? guess their failed dragonball movie gives such a bad impression *facepalm* Talk about a swing and a miss with your guess dude. |
HypeathonOct 7, 2010 7:31 AM
| I only buy manga |
Hypeathon said: Everybody keeps making the whole "$50 for a 13 episode dual audio set" sound like a bad thing, though it seems hardly any different from the price of your average American television season box set or heck even your average video game. Not that the price for any of those things can't be expensive for many people, but at the same time, I can imagine a LOT more people buying American TV season box sets and more-so video games than Anime DVD sets which are priced roughly the same partly because there are just way more eyeballs. I frankly still stand by the notion that not enough people who would be considered consumers of anime in the "I'll casually buy a DVD set the way I would casually buy a video game," actually exist because they don't know the anime DVDs exist and it doesn't help that anime itself is suffers somewhat of a stigma. Not really, I can pick up one season of a tv show for around £10 (I pre ordered series 1-5 supernatural for £50), and when more seasons appear they add a boxset which reduced the price by a lot an example being X-Files, 10 series for £60. The thing with anime is that they bring out 12-13 episode boxsets for £20+ and they hardly drop. I've found the average price for a 26 episode box set is £30, and the price sticks with that, too. Heck, even games drop to £17 pretty quickly nowadays, which is cheaper than 12 episode boxsets. I find it hard to buy an anime boxset when I compare it to live action tv. |
Sohei said: Well, there was a recession.. I don't know about you, but I've got a huge Wish List full of Anime on Amazon.com now that I have money. |
 Old avatar and sig retired for now. |
| I read my manga online as they come out, and if I love it enough I'll by the tankoban. Kinda as though I read in srtaight from the issue, but I didn't pay for the issue. |
BakaKawaii said: Not really, I can pick up one season of a tv show for around £10 (I pre ordered series 1-5 supernatural for £50), and when more seasons appear they add a boxset which reduced the price by a lot an example being X-Files, 10 series for £60. The thing with anime is that they bring out 12-13 episode boxsets for £20+ and they hardly drop. I've found the average price for a 26 episode box set is £30, and the price sticks with that, too. Well wait, are you referring to euros? Because I and the article itself is specifically referring to the American market, not anything within Europe which unless I'm mistaken is probably a whole other issue. The prices I'm talking about are your average video game being $50-60, your average TV series season box set being $40-50 and your average 12-13 episode set being $50 ($40 is it's subtitled only). jmal said: The more I think about this the more my reaction is "good riddance". I will keep to importing the Japanese BD, DVD etc., because this is not about price for me. The American industry has just become garbage and it gets worse every day, no matter how much cheaper it is. This is one of those reasons why more and more casual consumers being aware of the anime market in America would be very appreciative if this is the general attitude emitted out of anime fans, regardless of whatever these companies could possibly do in order to cater to them. |
HypeathonOct 7, 2010 8:12 AM
| Well, I somewhat expected this. Think: who buys anime? Usually, teenagers and young people, most of them without a job, or a well paid job. Then, there is a recession, and what happens? People will stop buying the things they don't believe necesary, and IMO, this is one of those things. But, of course, that's not the only problem, nor the most important. Just look at the graph. Sales started droping since 2005, and there was no recession at that time. I think that the most important problems manga and anime has to affront are the lack of advertising, and the somewhat bad reputation it has between the average people. PS: Sorry if there is something hard to understand, but sometimes my english isn't that good. |
papuelOct 7, 2010 8:12 AM
| Wornking on a new one since the previous one was 10px too big. |
| Simple answer: #1 Recession #2 Back in 2005 downloading anime wasn't as easy as it is today, not to mention the availability of today's anime is almost 100% of new anime that come out. #3 THE RECESSION!!!!! |
Hypeathon said: Well wait, are you referring to euros? Because I and the article itself is specifically referring to the American market, not anything within Europe which unless I'm mistaken is probably a whole other issue. The prices I'm talking about are your average video game being $50-60, your average TV series season box set being $40-50 and your average 12-13 episode set being $50 ($40 is it's subtitled only). It's the same issue at the end of the day: Anime discs are overpriced for what they're worth. As much as I love gintama, for example: $32 for 13 episodes is incredibly overpriced. That means you'd end up paying around $512 for every episode. And another example within that would be big bang theory series 1+2 for $46, now that's 4x the amount for just $14 more. Now personally, I can't bring myself to cough up the money for anime if it's this cost. However, just from checking amazon.com (as I don't know any US sites) we get cheaper dvds over here, as BBT 1-3 is £26.99, pretty nice price, so you have the harsher deal. |
| Eh, could care less. |
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Hypeathon said: BakaKawaii said: Not really, I can pick up one season of a tv show for around £10 (I pre ordered series 1-5 supernatural for £50), and when more seasons appear they add a boxset which reduced the price by a lot an example being X-Files, 10 series for £60. The thing with anime is that they bring out 12-13 episode boxsets for £20+ and they hardly drop. I've found the average price for a 26 episode box set is £30, and the price sticks with that, too. Well wait, are you referring to euros? Because I and the article itself is specifically referring to the American market, not anything within Europe which unless I'm mistaken is probably a whole other issue. The prices I'm talking about are your average video game being $50-60, your average TV series season box set being $40-50 and your average 12-13 episode set being $50 ($40 is it's subtitled only). His point is still the same. US TV series are always much cheaper than the anime sets. Go to your local Best Buy and they'll be $30 at most, maybe $40 for an new HBO series. (I'm talking full seasons here. So 13 60 minute episodes) |
outlawauron said: He also has a point with how other industries have faster price drops. For example games go from $60 to $20-$30 in what could be perceived as months. Try to buy anime from 2-3 years ago, it will still be $30-$40 dollars per volume.Hypeathon said: BakaKawaii said: Not really, I can pick up one season of a tv show for around £10 (I pre ordered series 1-5 supernatural for £50), and when more seasons appear they add a boxset which reduced the price by a lot an example being X-Files, 10 series for £60. The thing with anime is that they bring out 12-13 episode boxsets for £20+ and they hardly drop. I've found the average price for a 26 episode box set is £30, and the price sticks with that, too. Well wait, are you referring to euros? Because I and the article itself is specifically referring to the American market, not anything within Europe which unless I'm mistaken is probably a whole other issue. The prices I'm talking about are your average video game being $50-60, your average TV series season box set being $40-50 and your average 12-13 episode set being $50 ($40 is it's subtitled only). His point is still the same. US TV series are always much cheaper than the anime sets. Go to your local Best Buy and they'll be $30 at most, maybe $40 for an new HBO series. (I'm talking full seasons here. So 13 60 minute episodes) Of course this is a broad generalization, but fair-priced anime is few and far between. Maybe they should start looking at their sales methods and pricing before blaming the core fans for their blunders. |
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| Instant reaction was "isn't that what every companies sales looked like over the past few years?" Second reaction: "At least the rate of decline isn't quite so steep anymore" -_- Hey, I live in Europe so not my fault~ |
The Cart Driver <-- My awesome anime blog |
| well i kind a see that coming. |
| Wow wasn't expecting that... |
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
papuel said: Just look at the graph. Sales started droping since 2005, and there was no recession at that time. I would beg to differ on that point. The economy started nose-diving around 2002, it just started massively accelerating within the last 2-3 years. The decline really sort of started with the tech bubble popping, it just got progressively compounded with the burst of the housing and credit bubbles. The job market for the demographics that are most likely to buy anime was already beginning to shrivel up by 2005. I would wonder how much the advertising of it affects the sales, though. Around 2004-2005, Cartoon Network (bane that it is) shifted priority to Adult Swim, and shelved Toonami's previously more mature nature by axing it from the afternoon lineup and replacing it with that 'Miguzi' junk, and when Toonami finally did reappear it was past Prime Time and far less diverse than it had been. Then it just died off as more and more focus was put on Adult Swim. And of course, over the past 2 or 3 years, Adult Swim has been pushed more and more toward the Williams Street programming instead of anime. Sure, that doesn't really harm the hardcore fans because they were just as likely to ignore Adult Swim, but it and Toonami were probably of utmost importance in bringing in new, fresh crops of viewers, a demonstrably smaller portion of which would end up becoming more serious fans. Couple that with their general stagnation on action shows only, instead of branching out, and people will get tired of it after a while. Tapping into the other genres in the anime market might have made it a stronger force and been able to weather the recession better. |
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Leon-Gun said: And another thing, the US has been going through the worst recession since the Great Depression, did they really expect anything else. omg you guy should stop blaming it on a recession.... its not that bad. somebody cried recession and now everyone is not spending their money. the economy is directly the fault of our own citizens. and the size of my wallet has only grown throughout this whole recession... and i love spending money. |
 "For me to call a man my friend, he must be equal to me in all aspects" - Griffith, 'Berserk' |
| No, all DVDs have faced a sales slump in recent years. http://arstechnica.com/media/news/2010/01/dvd-sales-tank-in-2009-as-americans-head-to-the-cinema.ars |
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| Comparing domestic television releases to anime really isn't a fair comparison at all. Of course the domestic market can put out DVDs a lot cheaper. There is a much broader fanbase that will watch and purchase domestic media. Even in its biggest heyday anime has always been a niche when compared to the TV/movie markets. |
 ...even a saint needs a soldier to do the dirty work. |
| well i figuered they weren't doing so good.... the recession hits hard and its so expensive!!! i do buy box sets and some other movies and stuff sometimes but its been awhile =( i normally just buy manga since its cheeper and i can get just about all that i want from the book store ^^ |
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| Pretty simple reason why, Anime is no where nearly as popular in the US as it was 10 years ago. Look at whats happened in the last 10 years, Alot of the big publishers have folded up, anime is getting licensed even less and less, out of all the TV channels that where running anime 10 years ago during prime times, 95% of that don't show anime period anymore. And All of us who bought anime 10 years ago, have grown up and either learned how to steal it easily, or just stopped caring, except maybe for the minor few who actually even buy stuff anymore. Anime is dying in America, and I highly doubt it will ever get back to how it was before 2005. |
| It doesn't think, it doesn't feel, it doesn't laugh or cry..... All it does from dusk till dawn is make the soldiers die. |
jiyuudansei said: Eh, could care less. Just so you know, that means you care. Anywho, anime is expensive. I'd love to support the industry, but when I have to shell out a nice chunk of cash for one season of DVDs I'll probably only watch once, I can't exactly buy much. |
| I stopped buying Anime because they're overpriced. Or, atleast the newer ones. Older anime is a good price. If they stopped splitting seasons into over-expensive 'parts' then I would definitely buy more Anime! |
| Wal-Mart? The only anime dvd I've seen at Wal-Mart is Dead Leaves. |
| Well its not surprising, but in the 06/07 time is when the anime bubble burst when you had a number of factors. Way to many series being licensed and released in the archaic 4 episodes a volume format and most of those series really sucking too. Anime was way overpriced, though I think it is starting to come in line with a more reasonable pricing structure now. (atleast overseas - anime in Japan seems to still retain its silly pricing structure) But the economy world wide is crap too. Nobody has money or jobs and people are more concerned about using their money to keep things like their home or eating. Cant deny pirating is not an enormous factor but its not as much of a factor as the anime studios would like you to believe. |
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alexcampos said: Simple answer: #1 Recession #2 Back in 2005 downloading anime wasn't as easy as it is today, not to mention the availability of today's anime is almost 100% of new anime that come out. #3 THE RECESSION!!!!! #4 Avabilty back then it was easy to buy anime |
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Inujake7 said: Anime is ridiculously overpriced. There's not a lot of anime available where I live, but what I've seen can be ridiculous. $50 for 9 episodes of Gurren Lagann at Best Buy. $40 for 4 episodes of Haruhi Suzumiya, (with a few extras, but still.) Inuyasha season (26 episodes) for $80. Individual anime volumes with as little as 3 episodes can be $20 or more. Ohoh, I agree. I payed €150 for a complete season of both Haibane Renmei and SEL here in Norway (I know, shush). Approximately €6 per episode for every series in the whole (very rare) store. What to do, what to do... Went a little off on a tangent here. I wish they would measure these graphs more properly, but the fall is clearly visible... I wonder if this is what it's like in the western Europe too. |
| Does this chart include online sales? I buy my anime online, seeing how stores usually sell DVDs for twice as much. |
ukonkivi said: Sohei said: Well, there was a recession.. I don't know about you, but I've got a huge Wish List full of Anime on Amazon.com now that I have money. I do as well...but I don't have any money :( ^_- |
papuel said: Well, I somewhat expected this. Think: who buys anime? Usually, teenagers and young people, most of them without a job, or a well paid job. Then, there is a recession, and what happens? People will stop buying the things they don't believe necesary, and IMO, this is one of those things. But, of course, that's not the only problem, nor the most important. Just look at the graph. Sales started droping since 2005, and there was no recession at that time. I think that the most important problems manga and anime has to affront are the lack of advertising, and the somewhat bad reputation it has between the average people. PS: Sorry if there is something hard to understand, but sometimes my english isn't that good. no your right, there is no advertising for anime... i dont think ive realy seen any anime commercials on tv since Toonami died... this industry doesnt get much recognition outside of its regular fanbase... and were-as much of this group isn't overly rich... espcialy now, the decrease in sales is of course going to be hurting |
     "If only if only, the woodpecker cried, the bark on the tree was as soft as the sky" || ♪My mind, heart is broken♫ |
| Now, I don't think its just myself that trusts the basics of Economics but it seems like the marketing for anime publishers think its some silly superstition. ~_~ If you want to read up on a little bit of the basics head over to www.investopedia.com. This is one of the most well know yet most abused point in the laws of supply and demand by the anime industry at the moment: |
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| Anime and Manga? Expensive? lol (since when?) Not if you purchase from online retailers such as Amazon or Rightstuf (a vast majority of single volume releases can be found for only about $5 over at RS), and those without any way of obtaining income could ask a relative or two to purchase it for them (Xmas, Bday, Etc). |
GinkoartOct 7, 2010 3:16 PM
| Although torrenting may have adverse effects, it's really not big of a problem. If you think about consumer interests, yes people who torrent are interested but because in their minds, it's free. If torrents were to be removed completely only a small percentage of those people will actually BUY or subscribe to a legal streaming site. As many have pointed out, the recession definitely plays a part in this, as it does in almost every other industry out there. And Neverarine has a good point; there is no advertisements for anime, and your typical American child, teenager, or young adult probably grew up with American cartoons and without any exposure to anime. This isn't good though, anime quality is arguably declining as it is. I don't know how this will affect Japan's anime industry, maybe a bit less drastically, but this will definitely have impact on their production budgets. Let's just hope it really is just the recession. =( |
| In Korea, all animes are so cheap, I think even cheaper than Japan. It's all because Koreans are evil and always like free stuffs. |
ringoo4Oct 7, 2010 3:50 PM
| well the main reason for the sales drop is bad choices in what anime to market obviously and the fact THE WORLDS STILL IN recession IS ANOTHER one of the problems with the sales DUUUUUUUUUHHHHHHHH |
 I signed my screen and now its all smeary "When you meet your God tell him to leave me alone." check out my bloghttp://corpse69.wordpress.com/ fix MAL already |
| Part of the reason, in my opinion anyway, it's becoming harder and harder to find places to actually buy it in a lot of areas. Where I live for instance, 2 or 3 years ago Best Buy had a full section of nothing but anime box sets and movies. Along with a couple "islands" that displayed them. Wal-Mart and Target at least had the most popular stuff coming out. Bleach, Naruto, etc. Now I go to those stores and it's almost non-existant. Wal-mart and Target it is non-existant. Best-buy which had a rather sizable selection at one point has now dwindled down to just a small section of it. Last time I was in there they only had 10 different shows and those were just the most popular ones. Again being Bleach, Naruto, and a few Code Geass singles. Alot of people don't like buying things on the internet still. I'm one of them. I like being able to walk into a store, go through the selection and pick something out. Granted I live in a "smaller" area, but 9 times out of 10 I find better selection in used stores than I do trying to buy something new. Oh and anyone who says new releases of box sets are not expensive, well you are crazy. $50 is the average for a single volume of Shikabane Hime in the US right now. That's not the full series. You want the full series? You have to shell out $100 for 26 episodes. That's insane. That's just an example. It's like $20-$30 for single DVDs of Code Geass unless you catch them somewhere on sale. That's much for like 4 or 5 episodes. Bunch that up with the fact that there is a recession and you shouldn't at all suprised sales are way down and the use of torrents or Crunchyroll is increasing. |
Leon-Gun said: Of course this is a broad generalization, but fair-priced anime is few and far between. Maybe they should start looking at their sales methods and pricing before blaming the core fans for their blunders. If we're talking about a broad generalization or whatever, what you automatically believe comapnies say, "shame on you anime fans for not buying our stuff! Shame, shame, shame!" Seriously that whole, "you've brought it on yourselves, not us" notion is wearing itself a little thin. It not as if any of these people don't already know that either some people can't buy the stuff, or that not all anime fans are die-hard DVD collectors or that some don't even realize scanlations and fansubs are technically illegal or that there are such DVD boxsets of your favorite Japanese animated shows out there. It's becoming a little moronic at this point to honestly believe the people who are part of these companies don't listen to anime fans or are too stupid to notice or whatever. Leon-Gun said: Try to buy anime from 2-3 years ago, it will still be $30-$40 dollars per volume. - Nabari no Ou released last year by Funimation for $50 in 2 parts. Now it's released as a complete set, all 26 episodes for $60. - D. Gray-Man parts 1,2,3, & 4 released individually for $50 in 2009. Now they're combined into 2 season sets for $50, $60 if you get them on blu-ray! - Lucky Star released in single discs from 2008-9 for what, $20-25? Now in 2010, they've been released as a complete collection for about $36 at Best Buy. - Darker than Black, same thing. Single discs throughout 2009 for $20-25. Since this past may, complete set has been released for $50-60. - Hetalia parts 1 & 2 being released for $27! - All 4 box sets of Yu Yu Hakusho were repriced AGAIN to a fricken $20 each! Like I said before, I get how for some people anime are a pricey luxury product. But don't pretend that the value is cheaper is at a snails pace. Even though some of these complete sets are now $5-10 more than when in 12-13 episode parts, ultimately, they're still $60 as complete set then when you had to get the individual sets that would total to roughly $100. And while we're at it, before thinking of arguing back to me about the price problem or just pointing it out over and over again at these forums, try being a bit more proactive about it and ask these companies or anyone who is in the know about the anime market, and could answer your question as to why prices can't ultimately be about $30-40 or whatever ideal price point you had in mind. Seriously, if you're knowledgable enough to know about these things that are a problem for you, then you could figure out where to find answers to your question. Now I'm noticing everyone's "meh" response to this news, and I'm really believing anime fans as a whole are more cheap than ever. Note, that doesn't mean I'm blaming everyone for having that mentality, so I don't want everyone to come to me arguing, "well it's this company's fault." This isn't about that. If anything, this is about point out all the inconviences within the anime market. Anime DVDs are harder to locate, more anime fans are of a younger age demographic believing the internet is an oven and the Japanese are gods making fresh anime free fromof charge , advertsiing can't happen so easily on television or anywhere outside of the anime-based outlets like streaming website or anime magazines. And it doesn't help that Japan, the people who make this stuff, are in a way devaluing tmany of the shows they make with the moe/loli/otaku gimmicks thrown in without much of a narrative to the stories, thus the "I don't get it" reaction out of casual consumers. And there's about too many of these things no less. I mean, we have the simulcasting and official streaming websites thing, so more people are becoming aware that these shows are actually owned by companies and are part of an legal market. There's a plus there. Though I'm not totally sure what companies can actually do that would work beyond that. |
HypeathonOct 7, 2010 6:13 PM
| Hearing people complain about the high price of anime these days should be appreciate of the prices now, than they used to be. Paying $30 for half a set, I feel is a huge price difference and a deal when not to long ago, you would be paying that $30 for a SINGLE dvd. Considering that most companies would release anywhere from 6 - 7 volumes per series ( I'm looking at a typical 26 epidose series ) you're looking at $180 - $210 for a single series. Why would I want to go back to that? I am much happier with the way prices are set now. Is anime still expensive? Yes, but so are other forms of media which I think have already been made clear by others. |
| I'm not surprised to see the major decline. As many have said, anime is just ridiculously overpriced. I remember buying all three seasons of Rurouni Kenshin for a bit over $300. The Evangelion series was another $200, I think. Now, if I want an anime, I buy it used. First place I check is the local "Otaku Hobbies" and then one of the second-hand video stores around here. I will not buy a series new anymore. I may make an exception for the Blu-rays as I've found quite a few movies online at a reasonable price and I have yet to see one used. |
| ... |
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