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Apr 1, 3:26 AM
#52
Reply to LuxuriousHeart
@Kira_Illusionist I find it's the other way around. Shoujo fans are more open to Shounen and willing to watch it, than the other way around. Even the hardcore Shoujo fans manage to enjoy: Bloom Into You, Hunter x Hunter, Haikyuu, Horimiya, etc. How many hardcore Shounen fans enjoy even one Shoujo?
| @LuxuriousHeart LuxuriousHeart said: I find it's the other way around. I am talking about shaming, which I think you failed to notice.... You find Shonen fans shaming Shoujo fans???? Where???... I guess I will have to repeat myself, go to r/shoujo to experience the shaming shoujo fans do to shonen fans first hand.... Shonen fans never shame shoujo fans, infact they don't even think about shoujo at all If you are talking about which fans consuming which demographic, think about the examples you have given... Bloom into You, Horimiya could easily be shoujo stories and Hunter x Hunter, Haikyuu appeal to fujoshi crowds... Shonen works consider every demographic in their stories and try to make stories for everyone to enjoy, Horimiya is a big example of that.... So many fans actually don't like Hori that much and if that story was published in Shoujo magazine, Hori would be unbearable and it would be instant drop for many many shonen fans Bloom into You doesn't have men, Hunter x Hunter, Haikyuu, Horimiya all have likeable Male Leads that treat women well... Do you know what is the main appeal of shoujo romance stories? It is the LIKEABLE MALE LEADS THAT TREAT FEMALE PROTAGONIST WELL!! Shonen has enough stories that will satisfy even the most hardcore shoujo fans Do shoujo fans like Shield Hero, Mushoku Tensei, Megami no Cafe terrace, or in general harem shows?? No... Absolutely NOT! They complain, or even SHAME people who like those shows... They complain about ECHI all the time... They will watch Naruto and complain about Sakura for the whole 700 episodes saying the author just reduced her as a Love interest etc... Shonen fans don't do that... Shonen fans ALSO hate the reverse harems, unlikeable FEMALE PROTAGONISTs... So when they find those elements, they just drop it and shut their mouths... Shonen fans also need the LIKEABLE FEMALE LEADS THAT TREAT MALE PROTAGONIST WELL, which doesn't exist in shoujo LuxuriousHeart said: Shoujo fans are more open to Shounen and willing to watch it It is actually the opposite and here's why... Shonen magazines do publish reverse harem stories [Ex: Aoharu x Kikanjuu, Romantic Killer, Toilet bound Honako kun] BECAUSE enough shonen fans do buy them for them not to make losses But in reverse, there are NO harem stories in Shoujo magazines because the main Shoujo Fans do not buy them enough, so the magazine face losses... So let's do this exercise... I have given some examples of reverse harem stories, why don't you give some Shoujo stories that have LIKEABLE FEMALE LEADS THAT TREAT MALE PROTAGONIST WELL and doesn't flirt with other male leads in the story... When you do that you will find that those stories actually have a decent shonen fans liking them |
Apr 1, 3:48 AM
#53
Apr 1, 11:47 AM
#54
| Well I prefer shoujo anime. Like Sailor Moon and Puella Magi Madoka Magica over shounen anime. |
Apr 1, 2:44 PM
#55
Reply to Kira_Illusionist
@LuxuriousHeart
I am talking about shaming, which I think you failed to notice.... You find Shonen fans shaming Shoujo fans???? Where???... I guess I will have to repeat myself, go to r/shoujo to experience the shaming shoujo fans do to shonen fans first hand.... Shonen fans never shame shoujo fans, infact they don't even think about shoujo at all
If you are talking about which fans consuming which demographic, think about the examples you have given... Bloom into You, Horimiya could easily be shoujo stories and Hunter x Hunter, Haikyuu appeal to fujoshi crowds...
Shonen works consider every demographic in their stories and try to make stories for everyone to enjoy, Horimiya is a big example of that.... So many fans actually don't like Hori that much and if that story was published in Shoujo magazine, Hori would be unbearable and it would be instant drop for many many shonen fans
Bloom into You doesn't have men, Hunter x Hunter, Haikyuu, Horimiya all have likeable Male Leads that treat women well... Do you know what is the main appeal of shoujo romance stories? It is the LIKEABLE MALE LEADS THAT TREAT FEMALE PROTAGONIST WELL!! Shonen has enough stories that will satisfy even the most hardcore shoujo fans
Do shoujo fans like Shield Hero, Mushoku Tensei, Megami no Cafe terrace, or in general harem shows?? No... Absolutely NOT! They complain, or even SHAME people who like those shows... They complain about ECHI all the time... They will watch Naruto and complain about Sakura for the whole 700 episodes saying the author just reduced her as a Love interest etc...
Shonen fans don't do that... Shonen fans ALSO hate the reverse harems, unlikeable FEMALE PROTAGONISTs... So when they find those elements, they just drop it and shut their mouths... Shonen fans also need the LIKEABLE FEMALE LEADS THAT TREAT MALE PROTAGONIST WELL, which doesn't exist in shoujo
It is actually the opposite and here's why... Shonen magazines do publish reverse harem stories [Ex: Aoharu x Kikanjuu, Romantic Killer, Toilet bound Honako kun] BECAUSE enough shonen fans do buy them for them not to make losses
But in reverse, there are NO harem stories in Shoujo magazines because the main Shoujo Fans do not buy them enough, so the magazine face losses...
So let's do this exercise... I have given some examples of reverse harem stories, why don't you give some Shoujo stories that have LIKEABLE FEMALE LEADS THAT TREAT MALE PROTAGONIST WELL and doesn't flirt with other male leads in the story... When you do that you will find that those stories actually have a decent shonen fans liking them
LuxuriousHeart said:
I find it's the other way around.
I find it's the other way around.
I am talking about shaming, which I think you failed to notice.... You find Shonen fans shaming Shoujo fans???? Where???... I guess I will have to repeat myself, go to r/shoujo to experience the shaming shoujo fans do to shonen fans first hand.... Shonen fans never shame shoujo fans, infact they don't even think about shoujo at all
If you are talking about which fans consuming which demographic, think about the examples you have given... Bloom into You, Horimiya could easily be shoujo stories and Hunter x Hunter, Haikyuu appeal to fujoshi crowds...
Shonen works consider every demographic in their stories and try to make stories for everyone to enjoy, Horimiya is a big example of that.... So many fans actually don't like Hori that much and if that story was published in Shoujo magazine, Hori would be unbearable and it would be instant drop for many many shonen fans
Bloom into You doesn't have men, Hunter x Hunter, Haikyuu, Horimiya all have likeable Male Leads that treat women well... Do you know what is the main appeal of shoujo romance stories? It is the LIKEABLE MALE LEADS THAT TREAT FEMALE PROTAGONIST WELL!! Shonen has enough stories that will satisfy even the most hardcore shoujo fans
Do shoujo fans like Shield Hero, Mushoku Tensei, Megami no Cafe terrace, or in general harem shows?? No... Absolutely NOT! They complain, or even SHAME people who like those shows... They complain about ECHI all the time... They will watch Naruto and complain about Sakura for the whole 700 episodes saying the author just reduced her as a Love interest etc...
Shonen fans don't do that... Shonen fans ALSO hate the reverse harems, unlikeable FEMALE PROTAGONISTs... So when they find those elements, they just drop it and shut their mouths... Shonen fans also need the LIKEABLE FEMALE LEADS THAT TREAT MALE PROTAGONIST WELL, which doesn't exist in shoujo
LuxuriousHeart said:
Shoujo fans are more open to Shounen and willing to watch it
Shoujo fans are more open to Shounen and willing to watch it
It is actually the opposite and here's why... Shonen magazines do publish reverse harem stories [Ex: Aoharu x Kikanjuu, Romantic Killer, Toilet bound Honako kun] BECAUSE enough shonen fans do buy them for them not to make losses
But in reverse, there are NO harem stories in Shoujo magazines because the main Shoujo Fans do not buy them enough, so the magazine face losses...
So let's do this exercise... I have given some examples of reverse harem stories, why don't you give some Shoujo stories that have LIKEABLE FEMALE LEADS THAT TREAT MALE PROTAGONIST WELL and doesn't flirt with other male leads in the story... When you do that you will find that those stories actually have a decent shonen fans liking them
| @Kira_Illusionist They mock them for mostly watching romance, and stereotype Shoujo as just romance. There are Shoujo action series with a male protagonist, and some Shoujo series don't even have romance. It's not that Shoujo isn't universally appealing, it's that people automatically write it off. Shoujo magazines have reverse harem stories. Ouran High School host club is a reverse harem, and there are two Shoujo anime that are reverse harems that recently released. I have no interest in them, because I don't care for harems or reverse harems. Kira_Illusionist said: So let's do this exercise... I have given some examples of reverse harem stories, why don't you give some Shoujo stories that have LIKEABLE FEMALE LEADS THAT TREAT MALE PROTAGONIST WELL and doesn't flirt with other male leads in the story... When you do that you will find that those stories actually have a decent shonen fans liking them - Attack No 1 - Fruits Basket - Basara - My Neighborhood Story (ironically, the male lead is the trifling one for a bit) - Ghost Hunt - Sukeban Deka - Kimi ni Todoke - A Sign of Affection - Yona of the Dawn And then there are some Shoujo that don't have romance: - Vitamin - Life - Hell Girl - Tomie - Natsume's Book of Friends - Vampire Princess Miyu - Magical Girl Dandelion There are some with male leads: - DN Angel - Yuzuki Family's Four Sons - Children of the Whales - Banana Fish - Yakumotatsu - Top Secret - A Cruel God Reigns - X/1999 - Juu Ou Sei And funny thing is... When I recommend open Shounen fans some Shoujo, they actually enjoy them. One really liked Vitamin, and was surprised by the strength of the main character at the end. There are great stories if more Shounen fans are open-minded. That's part of the reason why people are annoyed with y'all... |
Apr 1, 2:48 PM
#56
Reply to DesuMaiden
Well I prefer shoujo anime. Like Sailor Moon and Puella Magi Madoka Magica over shounen anime.
| @DesuMaiden Madoka Magica is a Seinen. More magical girls shows were published in Seinen magazines, because the idea of cute girls having transformations and wearing different outfits was appealing to men. |
Apr 1, 2:59 PM
#57
| No , why would I look down on somebody that enjoys shounen ? I myself enjoy shounen . |
| What you see is what you get , Sorry my English is not the best . I won't be in the forums for a while , I'm busy right now. |
Apr 1, 4:02 PM
#58
Reply to internetguy214
No , why would I look down on somebody that enjoys shounen ? I myself enjoy shounen .
| @internetguy214 They mean people who only enjoy Shounen, and that's it. |
Apr 1, 4:26 PM
#59
| I prefer shoujo anime the most. I am an anime waifu lover.... |
Apr 2, 2:42 PM
#60
Reply to LuxuriousHeart
@internetguy214 They mean people who only enjoy Shounen, and that's it.
| @LuxuriousHeart I don't see a problem with enjoying just shounen if they aren't hurting other people or themselves. |
| What you see is what you get , Sorry my English is not the best . I won't be in the forums for a while , I'm busy right now. |
Apr 2, 3:25 PM
#61
| I don't really care what demographic or genre someone watches the most personally, and given how most popular anime are shonen I'd say the stigma is just an online thing |
Apr 2, 3:46 PM
#62
| No. I don't. I look down on people who feel the need to put others down for their taste in shows and push their own standards for "quality" entertainment onto others. I honestly don't understand people's desire to flex intellectualism on an unproductive activity such as watching shows. I have nothing against people who look at shows on a deep level. But I get tired of the grandstanding and people acting like others are plebs for not being hard please. Those exact same people get depressed and burnout on anime because they put their favorites on such a high pedestal that they can't enjoy anything else. |
Apr 2, 3:57 PM
#63
| Seinen is not even "more mature" than shonen all the time. Some seinen are CGDCT manga because those kind of stories cater to a specific young adult demography. Some seinen are absurdist comedies. Every light novel in existence is considered of seinen demography and that includes Sword Art Online, a show which didn't precisely became known for being thought-provoking entertainment. And then there are shonen shows like Death Note, Chainsaw Man and Attack on Titan which in no way can be considered immature stories. |
Apr 2, 4:49 PM
#64
Reply to internetguy214
@LuxuriousHeart
I don't see a problem with enjoying just shounen if they aren't hurting other people or themselves.
I don't see a problem with enjoying just shounen if they aren't hurting other people or themselves.
| @internetguy214 Eh. I still judge them, and I won't cap and say I don't. Like I said, fans of other demographics are able to explore outside of the bubble. |
Apr 2, 4:50 PM
#65
Reply to Atromentina
Seinen is not even "more mature" than shonen all the time. Some seinen are CGDCT manga because those kind of stories cater to a specific young adult demography. Some seinen are absurdist comedies. Every light novel in existence is considered of seinen demography and that includes Sword Art Online, a show which didn't precisely became known for being thought-provoking entertainment. And then there are shonen shows like Death Note, Chainsaw Man and Attack on Titan which in no way can be considered immature stories.
| @Atromentina Seinen is aimed at an older audience. Of course, Shounen stories can explore more mature themes. They can push the ratings. Though Seinen is by definition aimed an older audience, so I can see why people say it's more mature as a whole. |
Apr 3, 4:48 AM
#67
Reply to LuxuriousHeart
@Kira_Illusionist They mock them for mostly watching romance, and stereotype Shoujo as just romance.
There are Shoujo action series with a male protagonist, and some Shoujo series don't even have romance. It's not that Shoujo isn't universally appealing, it's that people automatically write it off.
Shoujo magazines have reverse harem stories. Ouran High School host club is a reverse harem, and there are two Shoujo anime that are reverse harems that recently released. I have no interest in them, because I don't care for harems or reverse harems.
- Attack No 1
- Fruits Basket
- Basara
- My Neighborhood Story (ironically, the male lead is the trifling one for a bit)
- Ghost Hunt
- Sukeban Deka
- Kimi ni Todoke
- A Sign of Affection
- Yona of the Dawn
And then there are some Shoujo that don't have romance:
- Vitamin
- Life
- Hell Girl
- Tomie
- Natsume's Book of Friends
- Vampire Princess Miyu
- Magical Girl Dandelion
There are some with male leads:
- DN Angel
- Yuzuki Family's Four Sons
- Children of the Whales
- Banana Fish
- Yakumotatsu
- Top Secret
- A Cruel God Reigns
- X/1999
- Juu Ou Sei
And funny thing is... When I recommend open Shounen fans some Shoujo, they actually enjoy them. One really liked Vitamin, and was surprised by the strength of the main character at the end. There are great stories if more Shounen fans are open-minded. That's part of the reason why people are annoyed with y'all...
There are Shoujo action series with a male protagonist, and some Shoujo series don't even have romance. It's not that Shoujo isn't universally appealing, it's that people automatically write it off.
Shoujo magazines have reverse harem stories. Ouran High School host club is a reverse harem, and there are two Shoujo anime that are reverse harems that recently released. I have no interest in them, because I don't care for harems or reverse harems.
Kira_Illusionist said:
So let's do this exercise... I have given some examples of reverse harem stories, why don't you give some Shoujo stories that have LIKEABLE FEMALE LEADS THAT TREAT MALE PROTAGONIST WELL and doesn't flirt with other male leads in the story... When you do that you will find that those stories actually have a decent shonen fans liking them
So let's do this exercise... I have given some examples of reverse harem stories, why don't you give some Shoujo stories that have LIKEABLE FEMALE LEADS THAT TREAT MALE PROTAGONIST WELL and doesn't flirt with other male leads in the story... When you do that you will find that those stories actually have a decent shonen fans liking them
- Attack No 1
- Fruits Basket
- Basara
- My Neighborhood Story (ironically, the male lead is the trifling one for a bit)
- Ghost Hunt
- Sukeban Deka
- Kimi ni Todoke
- A Sign of Affection
- Yona of the Dawn
And then there are some Shoujo that don't have romance:
- Vitamin
- Life
- Hell Girl
- Tomie
- Natsume's Book of Friends
- Vampire Princess Miyu
- Magical Girl Dandelion
There are some with male leads:
- DN Angel
- Yuzuki Family's Four Sons
- Children of the Whales
- Banana Fish
- Yakumotatsu
- Top Secret
- A Cruel God Reigns
- X/1999
- Juu Ou Sei
And funny thing is... When I recommend open Shounen fans some Shoujo, they actually enjoy them. One really liked Vitamin, and was surprised by the strength of the main character at the end. There are great stories if more Shounen fans are open-minded. That's part of the reason why people are annoyed with y'all...
| @LuxuriousHeart LuxuriousHeart said: They mock them for mostly watching romance, and stereotype Shoujo as just romance. So you DO recognise Shoujo fans mock/insult/shame Shonen fans... And shonen fans don't mock/insult/shame Shoujo fans... That is why Shoujo fans are the most toxic in the anime fanbase... You might give whatever reasons for Shoujo fans mocking Shonen fans, but mocking them is completely unnecessary and toxic... LuxuriousHeart said: Attack No 1 - Fruits Basket - Basara - My Neighborhood Story (ironically, the male lead is the trifling one for a bit) - Ghost Hunt - Sukeban Deka - Kimi ni Todoke - A Sign of Affection - Yona of the Dawn Look at how old these recommendations are... Sign of affection is the most modern one and it has 8.21 score with 128k members... You don't get to 128k members in MAL without shonen fans showing up... Shonen fans also showed up for Fruits basket, Kimi ni todoke and Yona of the Dawn because they are also relatively modern anime with decent Female Leads... Shonnen fans don't show up for very old anime because fans have moved on from old animation... EVEN Onepiece is struggling because of old animation in early episodes (hence Onepiece remake is announced for new fans) I am typing all of this is because your claim of "Shonen fans are not open minded"... They just want decent Female Leads to root for... You don't get that in Shoujo for like 90%+ while that is not the case in shonen... Shonen is more like 50% you get leads like Naruto which makes you want to root for and other 50% you get leads like Naofumi (Shield hero) and Kazuya (Rent a Girldfriend) which you don't want to root for... Shoujo fans wouldn't waste too much time by trying out Shonen stuff because there is 50-50 chance they might find something they enjoy because of likeable Male Protagonists... While Shonen fans waste time by trying Shoujo stuff because there is only 10% chance that they might find something they enjoy because of how UNLIKEABLE FEMALE PROTAGONISTS are... How can you call them closed minded if 90%+ shoujo works are instant drops for Shonen fans and hence they are reluctant to try new Shoujo works???? Even then Shone fans still showed up for A Sign of Affection because of a likeable Female Lead |
Apr 3, 5:03 AM
#68
| what shounen fans? that discussion is terrible, aren't your favs are also shonen like chainsaw man is publishing in shonen magazine, shounen is for tennage boys of age from 13 to 18 and seinen is basically young adult 18 and up but that doesnt matter because there are many manga like bochi the rock, kaguya sama, k on were published in seinen magazines despite it's target demographic they can be enjoyed by nearly everyone, please we live in 2025 in the age where information is massively avaible do your research properly, because it's not demographic but actual manga content and genre matters the most most of the time. |
Apr 3, 5:09 AM
#69
| Not at all,there's no reason to look down on anyone as if i'm better than them in any way However i used to do that during my teen years of watching anime and i'd act and talk like these anime elitists who think that their view on anime is the only acceptable one and that everybody should watch what they watch otherwise they're just a bunch of normies with a "bad taste" Fortunately i don't do that anymore but i still wonder why didn't someone to this day smack me in the face for these things i've been saying during that period,that truly amazes me:D |
Apr 3, 5:28 AM
#70
| ehh, I only look down on those edgy kids fans and moral faggy boys, tho |
Apr 3, 6:44 AM
#71
Reply to Kira_Illusionist
@LuxuriousHeart
So you DO recognise Shoujo fans mock/insult/shame Shonen fans... And shonen fans don't mock/insult/shame Shoujo fans... That is why Shoujo fans are the most toxic in the anime fanbase... You might give whatever reasons for Shoujo fans mocking Shonen fans, but mocking them is completely unnecessary and toxic...
Look at how old these recommendations are... Sign of affection is the most modern one and it has 8.21 score with 128k members... You don't get to 128k members in MAL without shonen fans showing up... Shonen fans also showed up for Fruits basket, Kimi ni todoke and Yona of the Dawn because they are also relatively modern anime with decent Female Leads... Shonnen fans don't show up for very old anime because fans have moved on from old animation... EVEN Onepiece is struggling because of old animation in early episodes (hence Onepiece remake is announced for new fans)
I am typing all of this is because your claim of "Shonen fans are not open minded"... They just want decent Female Leads to root for... You don't get that in Shoujo for like 90%+ while that is not the case in shonen... Shonen is more like 50% you get leads like Naruto which makes you want to root for and other 50% you get leads like Naofumi (Shield hero) and Kazuya (Rent a Girldfriend) which you don't want to root for...
Shoujo fans wouldn't waste too much time by trying out Shonen stuff because there is 50-50 chance they might find something they enjoy because of likeable Male Protagonists... While Shonen fans waste time by trying Shoujo stuff because there is only 10% chance that they might find something they enjoy because of how UNLIKEABLE FEMALE PROTAGONISTS are...
How can you call them closed minded if 90%+ shoujo works are instant drops for Shonen fans and hence they are reluctant to try new Shoujo works???? Even then Shone fans still showed up for A Sign of Affection because of a likeable Female Lead
LuxuriousHeart said:
They mock them for mostly watching romance, and stereotype Shoujo as just romance.
They mock them for mostly watching romance, and stereotype Shoujo as just romance.
So you DO recognise Shoujo fans mock/insult/shame Shonen fans... And shonen fans don't mock/insult/shame Shoujo fans... That is why Shoujo fans are the most toxic in the anime fanbase... You might give whatever reasons for Shoujo fans mocking Shonen fans, but mocking them is completely unnecessary and toxic...
LuxuriousHeart said:
Attack No 1
- Fruits Basket
- Basara
- My Neighborhood Story (ironically, the male lead is the trifling one for a bit)
- Ghost Hunt
- Sukeban Deka
- Kimi ni Todoke
- A Sign of Affection
- Yona of the Dawn
Attack No 1
- Fruits Basket
- Basara
- My Neighborhood Story (ironically, the male lead is the trifling one for a bit)
- Ghost Hunt
- Sukeban Deka
- Kimi ni Todoke
- A Sign of Affection
- Yona of the Dawn
Look at how old these recommendations are... Sign of affection is the most modern one and it has 8.21 score with 128k members... You don't get to 128k members in MAL without shonen fans showing up... Shonen fans also showed up for Fruits basket, Kimi ni todoke and Yona of the Dawn because they are also relatively modern anime with decent Female Leads... Shonnen fans don't show up for very old anime because fans have moved on from old animation... EVEN Onepiece is struggling because of old animation in early episodes (hence Onepiece remake is announced for new fans)
I am typing all of this is because your claim of "Shonen fans are not open minded"... They just want decent Female Leads to root for... You don't get that in Shoujo for like 90%+ while that is not the case in shonen... Shonen is more like 50% you get leads like Naruto which makes you want to root for and other 50% you get leads like Naofumi (Shield hero) and Kazuya (Rent a Girldfriend) which you don't want to root for...
Shoujo fans wouldn't waste too much time by trying out Shonen stuff because there is 50-50 chance they might find something they enjoy because of likeable Male Protagonists... While Shonen fans waste time by trying Shoujo stuff because there is only 10% chance that they might find something they enjoy because of how UNLIKEABLE FEMALE PROTAGONISTS are...
How can you call them closed minded if 90%+ shoujo works are instant drops for Shonen fans and hence they are reluctant to try new Shoujo works???? Even then Shone fans still showed up for A Sign of Affection because of a likeable Female Lead
| @Kira_Illusionist No, Shounen fans do the mocking... There's plenty of non-Shounen fans that like anime. What 90% of female leads don't you root for in Shoujo? 😐 Shoujo fans are open to everything. And how do you know that only 10% of Shoujo is worth watching? Why make this assumption? What Shoujo are Shounen fans dropping? How can they drop something that they don't even watch? |
Apr 3, 9:12 AM
#72
| That depends on the fan. I think the name stands for itself. Shounen is for young boys. I still have a part of it in me, but that doesn't mean I'll enjoy One Piece, Naruto, Fairy Tail or Yugi-oh the same way I did as a kid or a teen. Sure, recent SnK and Kimetsu no Yaiba have amazing animation, and they transcend the usual Shonen boundaries. But I think all these shows, including Marvel's rip-off "Boku no Hero Academia", encompass what you call a Shonen Fan. If they don't get past those, yea, maybe these fans are still at the entry-level. That doesn't mean they're bad people though, only inexperienced or young fans. (I've always hated the mature/immature tag. Teens can be responsible while adults can get very childish.) Here is what I'd consider beyond entry-level: > I'm currently watching Nurahiyon no mago because I had dropped it twice (slow start) and always promised to come back. Now I have not had enough of kami / spiritual youkai stuff with Amagami-san no Enmusubi, it was the time or never. Do I enjoy the overdramatic talk-before-battle, the triangle romance with Kana and Tsurara or the huge cast of characters? Yes, but I am not fawning all over the sweet stuff as much as before. Somehow I've slightly aged like wine or sake does, but not yet to the point the show would be boring to me. I'm here for the youkai stuff anyway, and Tsurara ♥ (Kana is young/cute though). > Same with Mairimashita Iruma-kun. Sure the school setting, youthful vibes and struggling to improve are very shonen spirit. But it's not your usual battle shonen. > Shows like Saki or Keijo!!!!!!!! (EIGHT-EXCLAMATION-POINTS) are full of competitive waifu. Age doesn't matter when you're a MAN OF CULTURE. > Vintage shows like EVA, DBZ or Jojo always come up in references or conversation. But truth be told, I've tried the two first and I'm bored to death by the slow pacing from the last century. While I enjoy shounen, they come in a variety of different forms. There is no unique path to discovering more anime sub genres. I've also watched quite a few Shoujo, occasionnally Seinen here and there, and even non-targeted audience anime. |
There is only one truth in this world かわいいは正義 Also, robots are your friends ✿❀(*ᴗ͈ˬᴗ͈)ꕤ*.゚⋆˚✿˖° Check our anime affinity, Senpai! Fellow cute girl lovers FR accepted. Watch NGNL, ฅ^•ﻌ•^ฅ you bastard~~desu Yuri is life. Now, break a sweat. ★May the stars shine upon you.★ |
Apr 3, 9:22 AM
#73
| Yes, 100% There's no reason to go beyond reading Dragonball, Hunter X Hunter, and Jojo. If you like anything else you're simply a femxle, most likely a fujo, who just wants an excuse to watch an anime with cute boys you can ship together. Examples of this include: Haikyuu, Jujutsu Kaisen, & My Hero Academia. If you're a mxle past the age of puberty and you're still hyping shit like Kagurabachi just come out as gay lil bro. |
Apr 3, 9:24 AM
#74
Reply to LuxuriousHeart
@Kira_Illusionist I find it's the other way around. Shoujo fans are more open to Shounen and willing to watch it, than the other way around. Even the hardcore Shoujo fans manage to enjoy: Bloom Into You, Hunter x Hunter, Haikyuu, Horimiya, etc. How many hardcore Shounen fans enjoy even one Shoujo?
| @LuxuriousHeart All the examples you listed are from womxn shipping boys together lmao. This can become really creepy like the very popular female ship of hisoka x gon or gon x killua. |
Apr 3, 10:55 AM
#75
Reply to Eldinis
That depends on the fan.
I think the name stands for itself. Shounen is for young boys.
I still have a part of it in me, but that doesn't mean I'll enjoy One Piece, Naruto, Fairy Tail or Yugi-oh the same way I did as a kid or a teen. Sure, recent SnK and Kimetsu no Yaiba have amazing animation, and they transcend the usual Shonen boundaries. But I think all these shows, including Marvel's rip-off "Boku no Hero Academia", encompass what you call a Shonen Fan.
If they don't get past those, yea, maybe these fans are still at the entry-level. That doesn't mean they're bad people though, only inexperienced or young fans. (I've always hated the mature/immature tag. Teens can be responsible while adults can get very childish.)
Here is what I'd consider beyond entry-level:
> I'm currently watching Nurahiyon no mago because I had dropped it twice (slow start) and always promised to come back. Now I have not had enough of kami / spiritual youkai stuff with Amagami-san no Enmusubi, it was the time or never.
Do I enjoy the overdramatic talk-before-battle, the triangle romance with Kana and Tsurara or the huge cast of characters? Yes, but I am not fawning all over the sweet stuff as much as before. Somehow I've slightly aged like wine or sake does, but not yet to the point the show would be boring to me. I'm here for the youkai stuff anyway, and Tsurara ♥ (Kana is young/cute though).
> Same with Mairimashita Iruma-kun. Sure the school setting, youthful vibes and struggling to improve are very shonen spirit. But it's not your usual battle shonen.
> Shows like Saki or Keijo!!!!!!!! (EIGHT-EXCLAMATION-POINTS) are full of competitive waifu. Age doesn't matter when you're a MAN OF CULTURE.
> Vintage shows like EVA, DBZ or Jojo always come up in references or conversation. But truth be told, I've tried the two first and I'm bored to death by the slow pacing from the last century.
While I enjoy shounen, they come in a variety of different forms. There is no unique path to discovering more anime sub genres.
I've also watched quite a few Shoujo, occasionnally Seinen here and there, and even non-targeted audience anime.
I think the name stands for itself. Shounen is for young boys.
I still have a part of it in me, but that doesn't mean I'll enjoy One Piece, Naruto, Fairy Tail or Yugi-oh the same way I did as a kid or a teen. Sure, recent SnK and Kimetsu no Yaiba have amazing animation, and they transcend the usual Shonen boundaries. But I think all these shows, including Marvel's rip-off "Boku no Hero Academia", encompass what you call a Shonen Fan.
If they don't get past those, yea, maybe these fans are still at the entry-level. That doesn't mean they're bad people though, only inexperienced or young fans. (I've always hated the mature/immature tag. Teens can be responsible while adults can get very childish.)
Here is what I'd consider beyond entry-level:
> I'm currently watching Nurahiyon no mago because I had dropped it twice (slow start) and always promised to come back. Now I have not had enough of kami / spiritual youkai stuff with Amagami-san no Enmusubi, it was the time or never.
Do I enjoy the overdramatic talk-before-battle, the triangle romance with Kana and Tsurara or the huge cast of characters? Yes, but I am not fawning all over the sweet stuff as much as before. Somehow I've slightly aged like wine or sake does, but not yet to the point the show would be boring to me. I'm here for the youkai stuff anyway, and Tsurara ♥ (Kana is young/cute though).
> Same with Mairimashita Iruma-kun. Sure the school setting, youthful vibes and struggling to improve are very shonen spirit. But it's not your usual battle shonen.
> Shows like Saki or Keijo!!!!!!!! (EIGHT-EXCLAMATION-POINTS) are full of competitive waifu. Age doesn't matter when you're a MAN OF CULTURE.
> Vintage shows like EVA, DBZ or Jojo always come up in references or conversation. But truth be told, I've tried the two first and I'm bored to death by the slow pacing from the last century.
While I enjoy shounen, they come in a variety of different forms. There is no unique path to discovering more anime sub genres.
I've also watched quite a few Shoujo, occasionnally Seinen here and there, and even non-targeted audience anime.
| @Eldinis Let's make two things clear 1 Shounen is a demographic, not a genre. 2 Mairimashita Iruma-kun is an isekai, not a battle shounen. Last but not least, the most influential manga of all time Tetsuwan Atom,, and the manga that has inspired a whole generation of Japanese people and created a lot of new mangakas, Ashita no Joe, are also shounen, which shows there is no such thing as "usual Shonen boundaries". Not to mention, Death Note is a shounen anime but many people seem to fail to notice it |
Apr 3, 12:14 PM
#76
| @LuxuriousHeart Wait... Before arguing about anything else, you really won't concede that Shonen fans showed up to watch A Sign of Affection??? Only weebiest of weebs would even bother to have MAL accounts let alone update and score on MAL and out of 128k of them you don't think there are Shonen fans also in there????? You really are close minded and completely biased against Shonen fans aren't you... It's not just 128k it is 128k on MAL!!... See how dismissive you are towards Shounen fans You say Shounen fans do the mocking/insulting but I saw your review on Shield Hero and this is what you said "The main character himself isn't likable at all. He gives me Reddit incel vibes"... You were the one insulting Shounen... Shoujo fans ARE like this, they insult, they complain, just because some Shounen stories doesn't fit into their box... Sad part is, it is not a very minor part of Shoujo fandom that does this, a significant part of Shoujo fandom, Shoujo fans like you who think of themselves as open minded and honorable, does the insulting of Shounen... Hence Shoujo fans are THE MOST TOXIC FANDOM in the anime culture and they are also the most biased against people who doesn't enjoy their fav demographic... If you go and say "I don't like Shounen so I won't watch it" to Shounen fans they won't insult you, they say you are missing out or insist you watch it but they won't insult you... Same with Seinen fans... But if you go to Shoujo fans and say "I don't like Shoujo so I won't watch it" you will be insulted... They will call you close minded, sexists and all other insults that attack your character and intelligence... You even called them close minded just because Shounen fans don't like to watch Shoujo You really think Shounen fans didn't even watch one Shoujo in their whole life???? Just take the journey of a new anime watcher before they even become aware of Shonen/Shoujo... That new anime watcher will watch the anime either from internet recommendations or MAL top anime list or whatever catches their eye... As they go down the rabbit hole and becoming weebs, weeb enough to create MAL account, weeb enough to understand Shoujo Shounen demographics, you really don't think they would even come across ATLEAST 5 Shoujo anime??? Just 5????? I am telling you, That 5 first shoujo would be enough for shonen fans to think "I don't like Shoujo so I won't watch it" See if Shounen fans are not enjoying Shoujo stories, then the problem lies with Shoujo stories... Shonen stories are good enough, powerful enough, diverse enough to draw in ANY HUMAN BEING on the planet... There is NO demographic that won't enjoy Naruto, even old people can enjoy Naruto... Shoujo stories are just not powerful enough to draw in Shounen fans... There are 3 types of Shonen anime, The Action fanatic, The Romance enjoyer and the Waifu arguer.... There is no Shoujo that is on par with Onepiece, Naruto, Hunter x Hunter, Attack on Titan, Death Note, Full metal alchemist brotherhood, MHA, JJK, Demon Slayer etc in terms of action, world building, characters, mystery, power systems being good ALL AT ONCE... That is why they are so special and transcends Shounen.... Any human with any gender, any age, any educational background, any cultural background, from any country, any political ideology, feminists, non feminists can enjoy these stories... For the Action Fanatic, the requirement of quality is sooo high that they call My Hero Academia "MID"... If My Hero Academia is Mid for them, what can CURRENT shoujo action stories even offer them??? Even if Shoujo stories have good action they fail at characters by having UNLIKEABLE FEMALE LEAD For the Romance enjoyer and the Waifu arguer, the quality of the romance interest AKA Female Lead is very very important to them... Shoujo stories fail at this BIG time by having UNLIKEBALE FEMALE LEADS in their stories with overwhelming majority... If Shoujo stories have likeable female leads like in A Sign of Affection, Lovely Complex, Blue spring ride, Orange, From me to you etc, Shonen fans who love romance DO show up and watch them... How you think Shonen romance enjoyers don't even consider Shoujo is beyond me It's not that Shonen fans are closed minded towards Shoujo, it is that Shoujo is not good enough to attract Shonen fans... Add to that the weird art style of Shoujo + unlikeable Female protagonists + Unrealistic/Unrelatable Male Leads + Unrealistic/Unrelatable Male friendships and it becomes a very hard sell for Shounen fans I will give you 5 Shounen/Seinen romance anime for Shoujo fans to enjoy which came out in LAST 5 YEARS... 1. Dangers of My heart, 2. The girl I like forgot her glasses, 3. Yofukashi no Uta, 4. Skip to Loafer, 5. Insomniacs after School.... They all have likeable Male Leads and Female Leads and the leads also treat each other very well in a way that warms your heart.... Now you give me 5 Shoujo/Josei romance anime for Shonen fans to enjoy which came out in LAST 5 YEARS with LIKEABLE MALE LEADS AND FEMALE LEADS and the LEADS ALSO TREAT EACH OTHER WELL... NO FLIRTING WITH OTHER PEOPLE FYI: Shonen/Seinen are soo open minded that they published Apothecary Dairies which is a shoujo light novel since they recognized that Shonen/Seinen fans are open minded enough that they will enjoy this story because of Likeable female lead... There is an upcoming anime called "May I Ask For One Final Thing?" where the Female Lead where iron gloves and dreams of beating the shit out of the Male Lead... Why would any Shounen fan or any MAN in general would wanna watch that kind of story??? Shoujo stories won't gain Shonen fans or Male fans if they publish these kind of stories Many present anime fans caught Pokemon, Dragon Ball Z, Naruto, Card Captor Sakura in their childhood... Many of them wouldn't even know "Anime" let alone "Shoujo or Shounen"... See how popular Pokemon, Dragon Ball Z, Naruto is when compared to Card Captor Sakura even with young boys ALL OVER THE WORLD ACROSS ALL CULTURES... That should give you an idea of how bad Shoujo stories are when catching the attention of young boys let alone Shonen fans and fully grown men... Shoujo stories really need to step up of they want boys, men and Shonen fans to look their way |
Kira_IllusionistApr 3, 12:36 PM
Apr 3, 2:07 PM
#77
Reply to JoeChip
@Eldinis
Let's make two things clear
1 Shounen is a demographic, not a genre.
2 Mairimashita Iruma-kun is an isekai, not a battle shounen.
Last but not least, the most influential manga of all time Tetsuwan Atom,, and the manga that has inspired a whole generation of Japanese people and created a lot of new mangakas, Ashita no Joe, are also shounen, which shows there is no such thing as "usual Shonen boundaries".
Not to mention, Death Note is a shounen anime but many people seem to fail to notice it
Let's make two things clear
1 Shounen is a demographic, not a genre.
2 Mairimashita Iruma-kun is an isekai, not a battle shounen.
Last but not least, the most influential manga of all time Tetsuwan Atom,, and the manga that has inspired a whole generation of Japanese people and created a lot of new mangakas, Ashita no Joe, are also shounen, which shows there is no such thing as "usual Shonen boundaries".
Not to mention, Death Note is a shounen anime but many people seem to fail to notice it
| @JoeChip Yes sorry about the mix up. You're right shounen is a demographic. I'll have to strongly disagree on Iruma-kun though. Let me expand to clarify my thoughts: It's such a mix of genres, but primarily a Comedy and a Fantasy (demon realm). It's not even an Isekai or an Action anime; it uses elements of those genres which I find highlight the very shonen spirit (as in shonen uses themes of growing through struggle and overcoming one's limits), while keeping it varied and entertaining - so it makes sense it appeals to such a broad audience. As you've said yourself, there is no real boundaries and Iruma-kun is a perfect modern example of that. However, I think the very concept of shonen spirit is at the core of shonen anime. It doesn't matter whether it's Astro Boy, Jojo's Bizarre Adventure or something more recent like Iruma-kun, Shingeki no Kyojin or Death Note. I'm taking it as my base definition for shonen. Now, maybe I'm wrong, but that's the best I've come up with for now. |
There is only one truth in this world かわいいは正義 Also, robots are your friends ✿❀(*ᴗ͈ˬᴗ͈)ꕤ*.゚⋆˚✿˖° Check our anime affinity, Senpai! Fellow cute girl lovers FR accepted. Watch NGNL, ฅ^•ﻌ•^ฅ you bastard~~desu Yuri is life. Now, break a sweat. ★May the stars shine upon you.★ |
Apr 3, 2:15 PM
#78
Reply to LuxuriousHeart
@internetguy214 Eh. I still judge them, and I won't cap and say I don't. Like I said, fans of other demographics are able to explore outside of the bubble.
| @LuxuriousHeart I agree that they should get out of their bubble maybe they will find a new favorite. |
| What you see is what you get , Sorry my English is not the best . I won't be in the forums for a while , I'm busy right now. |
Apr 4, 1:29 AM
#79
Reply to removed-user
@LuxuriousHeart All the examples you listed are from womxn shipping boys together lmao. This can become really creepy like the very popular female ship of hisoka x gon or gon x killua.
| @Dienen ??? You do realize that Bloom Into You is a GL Shounen anime, right? And Horimiya is a romance Shounen anime... |
Apr 4, 1:30 AM
#80
Reply to JoeChip
@Eldinis
Let's make two things clear
1 Shounen is a demographic, not a genre.
2 Mairimashita Iruma-kun is an isekai, not a battle shounen.
Last but not least, the most influential manga of all time Tetsuwan Atom,, and the manga that has inspired a whole generation of Japanese people and created a lot of new mangakas, Ashita no Joe, are also shounen, which shows there is no such thing as "usual Shonen boundaries".
Not to mention, Death Note is a shounen anime but many people seem to fail to notice it
Let's make two things clear
1 Shounen is a demographic, not a genre.
2 Mairimashita Iruma-kun is an isekai, not a battle shounen.
Last but not least, the most influential manga of all time Tetsuwan Atom,, and the manga that has inspired a whole generation of Japanese people and created a lot of new mangakas, Ashita no Joe, are also shounen, which shows there is no such thing as "usual Shonen boundaries".
Not to mention, Death Note is a shounen anime but many people seem to fail to notice it
| @JoeChip But then, that begs the question. Why can Shounen fans watch and read the diverse works in their demographic, but not in other demographics? |
Apr 4, 1:47 AM
#81
Apr 4, 1:50 AM
#82
Reply to Kira_Illusionist
@LuxuriousHeart
Wait... Before arguing about anything else, you really won't concede that Shonen fans showed up to watch A Sign of Affection??? Only weebiest of weebs would even bother to have MAL accounts let alone update and score on MAL and out of 128k of them you don't think there are Shonen fans also in there????? You really are close minded and completely biased against Shonen fans aren't you... It's not just 128k it is 128k on MAL!!... See how dismissive you are towards Shounen fans
You say Shounen fans do the mocking/insulting but I saw your review on Shield Hero and this is what you said "The main character himself isn't likable at all. He gives me Reddit incel vibes"... You were the one insulting Shounen... Shoujo fans ARE like this, they insult, they complain, just because some Shounen stories doesn't fit into their box... Sad part is, it is not a very minor part of Shoujo fandom that does this, a significant part of Shoujo fandom, Shoujo fans like you who think of themselves as open minded and honorable, does the insulting of Shounen... Hence Shoujo fans are THE MOST TOXIC FANDOM in the anime culture and they are also the most biased against people who doesn't enjoy their fav demographic...
If you go and say "I don't like Shounen so I won't watch it" to Shounen fans they won't insult you, they say you are missing out or insist you watch it but they won't insult you... Same with Seinen fans... But if you go to Shoujo fans and say "I don't like Shoujo so I won't watch it" you will be insulted... They will call you close minded, sexists and all other insults that attack your character and intelligence... You even called them close minded just because Shounen fans don't like to watch Shoujo
You really think Shounen fans didn't even watch one Shoujo in their whole life???? Just take the journey of a new anime watcher before they even become aware of Shonen/Shoujo... That new anime watcher will watch the anime either from internet recommendations or MAL top anime list or whatever catches their eye... As they go down the rabbit hole and becoming weebs, weeb enough to create MAL account, weeb enough to understand Shoujo Shounen demographics, you really don't think they would even come across ATLEAST 5 Shoujo anime??? Just 5????? I am telling you, That 5 first shoujo would be enough for shonen fans to think "I don't like Shoujo so I won't watch it"
See if Shounen fans are not enjoying Shoujo stories, then the problem lies with Shoujo stories... Shonen stories are good enough, powerful enough, diverse enough to draw in ANY HUMAN BEING on the planet... There is NO demographic that won't enjoy Naruto, even old people can enjoy Naruto... Shoujo stories are just not powerful enough to draw in Shounen fans...
There are 3 types of Shonen anime, The Action fanatic, The Romance enjoyer and the Waifu arguer.... There is no Shoujo that is on par with Onepiece, Naruto, Hunter x Hunter, Attack on Titan, Death Note, Full metal alchemist brotherhood, MHA, JJK, Demon Slayer etc in terms of action, world building, characters, mystery, power systems being good ALL AT ONCE... That is why they are so special and transcends Shounen.... Any human with any gender, any age, any educational background, any cultural background, from any country, any political ideology, feminists, non feminists can enjoy these stories... For the Action Fanatic, the requirement of quality is sooo high that they call My Hero Academia "MID"... If My Hero Academia is Mid for them, what can CURRENT shoujo action stories even offer them???
Even if Shoujo stories have good action they fail at characters by having UNLIKEABLE FEMALE LEAD
For the Romance enjoyer and the Waifu arguer, the quality of the romance interest AKA Female Lead is very very important to them... Shoujo stories fail at this BIG time by having UNLIKEBALE FEMALE LEADS in their stories with overwhelming majority... If Shoujo stories have likeable female leads like in A Sign of Affection, Lovely Complex, Blue spring ride, Orange, From me to you etc, Shonen fans who love romance DO show up and watch them... How you think Shonen romance enjoyers don't even consider Shoujo is beyond me
It's not that Shonen fans are closed minded towards Shoujo, it is that Shoujo is not good enough to attract Shonen fans... Add to that the weird art style of Shoujo + unlikeable Female protagonists + Unrealistic/Unrelatable Male Leads + Unrealistic/Unrelatable Male friendships and it becomes a very hard sell for Shounen fans
I will give you 5 Shounen/Seinen romance anime for Shoujo fans to enjoy which came out in LAST 5 YEARS... 1. Dangers of My heart, 2. The girl I like forgot her glasses, 3. Yofukashi no Uta, 4. Skip to Loafer, 5. Insomniacs after School.... They all have likeable Male Leads and Female Leads and the leads also treat each other very well in a way that warms your heart.... Now you give me 5 Shoujo/Josei romance anime for Shonen fans to enjoy which came out in LAST 5 YEARS with LIKEABLE MALE LEADS AND FEMALE LEADS and the LEADS ALSO TREAT EACH OTHER WELL... NO FLIRTING WITH OTHER PEOPLE
FYI: Shonen/Seinen are soo open minded that they published Apothecary Dairies which is a shoujo light novel since they recognized that Shonen/Seinen fans are open minded enough that they will enjoy this story because of Likeable female lead...
There is an upcoming anime called "May I Ask For One Final Thing?" where the Female Lead where iron gloves and dreams of beating the shit out of the Male Lead... Why would any Shounen fan or any MAN in general would wanna watch that kind of story??? Shoujo stories won't gain Shonen fans or Male fans if they publish these kind of stories
Many present anime fans caught Pokemon, Dragon Ball Z, Naruto, Card Captor Sakura in their childhood... Many of them wouldn't even know "Anime" let alone "Shoujo or Shounen"... See how popular Pokemon, Dragon Ball Z, Naruto is when compared to Card Captor Sakura even with young boys ALL OVER THE WORLD ACROSS ALL CULTURES... That should give you an idea of how bad Shoujo stories are when catching the attention of young boys let alone Shonen fans and fully grown men... Shoujo stories really need to step up of they want boys, men and Shonen fans to look their way
Wait... Before arguing about anything else, you really won't concede that Shonen fans showed up to watch A Sign of Affection??? Only weebiest of weebs would even bother to have MAL accounts let alone update and score on MAL and out of 128k of them you don't think there are Shonen fans also in there????? You really are close minded and completely biased against Shonen fans aren't you... It's not just 128k it is 128k on MAL!!... See how dismissive you are towards Shounen fans
You say Shounen fans do the mocking/insulting but I saw your review on Shield Hero and this is what you said "The main character himself isn't likable at all. He gives me Reddit incel vibes"... You were the one insulting Shounen... Shoujo fans ARE like this, they insult, they complain, just because some Shounen stories doesn't fit into their box... Sad part is, it is not a very minor part of Shoujo fandom that does this, a significant part of Shoujo fandom, Shoujo fans like you who think of themselves as open minded and honorable, does the insulting of Shounen... Hence Shoujo fans are THE MOST TOXIC FANDOM in the anime culture and they are also the most biased against people who doesn't enjoy their fav demographic...
If you go and say "I don't like Shounen so I won't watch it" to Shounen fans they won't insult you, they say you are missing out or insist you watch it but they won't insult you... Same with Seinen fans... But if you go to Shoujo fans and say "I don't like Shoujo so I won't watch it" you will be insulted... They will call you close minded, sexists and all other insults that attack your character and intelligence... You even called them close minded just because Shounen fans don't like to watch Shoujo
You really think Shounen fans didn't even watch one Shoujo in their whole life???? Just take the journey of a new anime watcher before they even become aware of Shonen/Shoujo... That new anime watcher will watch the anime either from internet recommendations or MAL top anime list or whatever catches their eye... As they go down the rabbit hole and becoming weebs, weeb enough to create MAL account, weeb enough to understand Shoujo Shounen demographics, you really don't think they would even come across ATLEAST 5 Shoujo anime??? Just 5????? I am telling you, That 5 first shoujo would be enough for shonen fans to think "I don't like Shoujo so I won't watch it"
See if Shounen fans are not enjoying Shoujo stories, then the problem lies with Shoujo stories... Shonen stories are good enough, powerful enough, diverse enough to draw in ANY HUMAN BEING on the planet... There is NO demographic that won't enjoy Naruto, even old people can enjoy Naruto... Shoujo stories are just not powerful enough to draw in Shounen fans...
There are 3 types of Shonen anime, The Action fanatic, The Romance enjoyer and the Waifu arguer.... There is no Shoujo that is on par with Onepiece, Naruto, Hunter x Hunter, Attack on Titan, Death Note, Full metal alchemist brotherhood, MHA, JJK, Demon Slayer etc in terms of action, world building, characters, mystery, power systems being good ALL AT ONCE... That is why they are so special and transcends Shounen.... Any human with any gender, any age, any educational background, any cultural background, from any country, any political ideology, feminists, non feminists can enjoy these stories... For the Action Fanatic, the requirement of quality is sooo high that they call My Hero Academia "MID"... If My Hero Academia is Mid for them, what can CURRENT shoujo action stories even offer them???
Even if Shoujo stories have good action they fail at characters by having UNLIKEABLE FEMALE LEAD
For the Romance enjoyer and the Waifu arguer, the quality of the romance interest AKA Female Lead is very very important to them... Shoujo stories fail at this BIG time by having UNLIKEBALE FEMALE LEADS in their stories with overwhelming majority... If Shoujo stories have likeable female leads like in A Sign of Affection, Lovely Complex, Blue spring ride, Orange, From me to you etc, Shonen fans who love romance DO show up and watch them... How you think Shonen romance enjoyers don't even consider Shoujo is beyond me
It's not that Shonen fans are closed minded towards Shoujo, it is that Shoujo is not good enough to attract Shonen fans... Add to that the weird art style of Shoujo + unlikeable Female protagonists + Unrealistic/Unrelatable Male Leads + Unrealistic/Unrelatable Male friendships and it becomes a very hard sell for Shounen fans
I will give you 5 Shounen/Seinen romance anime for Shoujo fans to enjoy which came out in LAST 5 YEARS... 1. Dangers of My heart, 2. The girl I like forgot her glasses, 3. Yofukashi no Uta, 4. Skip to Loafer, 5. Insomniacs after School.... They all have likeable Male Leads and Female Leads and the leads also treat each other very well in a way that warms your heart.... Now you give me 5 Shoujo/Josei romance anime for Shonen fans to enjoy which came out in LAST 5 YEARS with LIKEABLE MALE LEADS AND FEMALE LEADS and the LEADS ALSO TREAT EACH OTHER WELL... NO FLIRTING WITH OTHER PEOPLE
FYI: Shonen/Seinen are soo open minded that they published Apothecary Dairies which is a shoujo light novel since they recognized that Shonen/Seinen fans are open minded enough that they will enjoy this story because of Likeable female lead...
There is an upcoming anime called "May I Ask For One Final Thing?" where the Female Lead where iron gloves and dreams of beating the shit out of the Male Lead... Why would any Shounen fan or any MAN in general would wanna watch that kind of story??? Shoujo stories won't gain Shonen fans or Male fans if they publish these kind of stories
Many present anime fans caught Pokemon, Dragon Ball Z, Naruto, Card Captor Sakura in their childhood... Many of them wouldn't even know "Anime" let alone "Shoujo or Shounen"... See how popular Pokemon, Dragon Ball Z, Naruto is when compared to Card Captor Sakura even with young boys ALL OVER THE WORLD ACROSS ALL CULTURES... That should give you an idea of how bad Shoujo stories are when catching the attention of young boys let alone Shonen fans and fully grown men... Shoujo stories really need to step up of they want boys, men and Shonen fans to look their way
| @Kira_Illusionist Shounen fans don't show up for A Sign of Affection, and I stand by that. I've also given bad reviews to Shoujo, Josei, and Seinen anime. Shounen isn't unique in that aspect. Regardless of demographics, trash is trash and peak is peak. Except, even the people who claim to hate Shounen are willing to watch it. I've seen "Shounen haters" love and watch: - Frieren - Inuyasha - Spy x Family - Hunter x Hunter - Bloom Into You - Horimiya - etc I've yet to see a huge Shounen fan explore other demographics, aside from maybe the occasional Seinen that's action packed. The majority of Shounen fans don't watch Shoujo. Every once in a while, you'll see them watch Fruits Basket, Nana, Sailor Moon, or Yona of the Dawn, the Four Horseman of "see? I'm not a Shounentard! I can watch Shoujo!". Though even they're a minority. And there it is! Saying that Shoujo is simply not good enough... The funny thing is... Isayama (Attack on Titan) and Togashi (Hunter x Hunter) are fans of Shoujo. There's even a Shoujo spin off of Attack on Titan that explores Levi's backstory... What Shoujo have you read to claim the female leads are unlikable? 😐 Romance Shounen fans don't really watch romance Shoujo, aside from Fruits Basket and/or Nana. That's their "I'm not misogynistic! I like these particular Shoujo series!" But even then, they're rare. And ironically, Seinen fans are more likely to do that than Shounen fans. 5 Shoujo in the past 5 years: - Natsume's Book of Friends - A Sign of Affection - Fruits Basket - Kageki Shoujo - Yuzuki Family's Four Sons Josei: - Life Lessons with Uramichi - Gold Kingdom and Water Kingdom - Cocoon - Mr Villain's Day Off - Love of Kill Actually, Apothecary Diaries is a depressing example. It originally was a light novel aimed at women, but only the first book. The later light novel books were released in imprints aimed at men. They gained popularity from that, and even more when published in a Seinen magazine. Apothecary Diaries would've been ignored if it were put in a Josei magazine. And how do I know? Well, look at Raven of the Inner Palace. Very similar to Apothecary Diaries, but it's a Josei so people ignore it... Shounen fans were content with watching Akane beat the crap out of Ranma... Cardcaptor Sakura and Sailor Moon were popular. However, guys back then didn't really take them seriously like they took Dragon Ball Z and Naruto. They were seen as girly anime. |
Apr 4, 3:50 AM
#83
Reply to LuxuriousHeart
@Dienen ??? You do realize that Bloom Into You is a GL Shounen anime, right? And Horimiya is a romance Shounen anime...
| @LuxuriousHeart bloom into you is fetishistic yuri. it's not for people biologically femxle. blud said "womxn enjoy romance" and thinks thats a point. womxn literally find romance in asexual sports anime like haikyuu ans kuroko lil bro. |
Apr 4, 4:04 AM
#84
Reply to removed-user
@LuxuriousHeart bloom into you is fetishistic yuri. it's not for people biologically femxle. blud said "womxn enjoy romance" and thinks thats a point. womxn literally find romance in asexual sports anime like haikyuu ans kuroko lil bro.
| @Dienen What I mean is, Bloom Into You has been enjoyed by GL Shoujo and Josei fans. It's not because they ship the men, because the series is GL. Horimiya is appealing to Shoujo fans due to the romance. And there's more... Shoujo fans also enjoy: - Fullmetal Alchemist Brotherhood - Inuyasha - Bleach - Attack on Titan - Frieren - etc Which is the point... Most Shoujo fans are willing to watch Shounen (and Seinen). Even the ultra girly romcom and/or magical girl Shoujo fans will enjoy: - Apothecary Diaries - Skip and Loafer - Horimiya - Bloom Into You - Madoka Magica - Spy x Family - Dungeon Meshi - Blue Box - etc I don't see a lot of Shounen fans doing the reverse. Every once in a while you'll have a Shounen fan say: "I'm not a Shoujo hater! I've watched Nana/Fruits Basket/Yona of the Dawn/Sailor Moon!" However, even they're not very common. No matter what, Shounen fans are simply not open to other demographics, aside from the occasional mainstream Seinen (like One Punch Man, Tokyo Ghoul, Vinland Saga, Berserk, etc). |
Apr 4, 5:01 AM
#85
| Trend followed yes. To me it's like gaming. I don't want to hear about the same surface level stuff and only support from surface level stuff because they cycle and nothing more out there, ambitious or even fair safe but a good spin can do it if they keep supporting the same surface level. Branching out is challenging but it's not difficult either. To me being into whatever is fine. But some of us want to not see wow this is safe and this is safe and this is safe because they have no imagination or whatever is big their generation and the next and so on that happens to change. I'll experience anything if it's good but also ma U bad or average, I have a reference for the quality and the settings, what ifs and more. Not just whatever is realistic or medium/culturally understandable and limiting to other possibilities of it's too weird even by a little because they didn't experience it or their brain isn't big enough. If they want trend/whatever is epic/whatever is narrow surface level peer group stuff sure but some of us want more fiction angles to be pushed not just repetitive safe mainstream appeal by people too afraid to go out of their comfort zone or see more then their narrow view or only big because others say it's big. That and creators shouldn't aim for big but try and aim at the right amount then build upon it to get big or big but fan deep not mainstream big. |
Suntanned_Duck2Apr 4, 5:04 AM
Apr 4, 6:14 AM
#86
Reply to LuxuriousHeart
@Kira_Illusionist Shounen fans don't show up for A Sign of Affection, and I stand by that.
I've also given bad reviews to Shoujo, Josei, and Seinen anime. Shounen isn't unique in that aspect. Regardless of demographics, trash is trash and peak is peak.
Except, even the people who claim to hate Shounen are willing to watch it. I've seen "Shounen haters" love and watch:
- Frieren
- Inuyasha
- Spy x Family
- Hunter x Hunter
- Bloom Into You
- Horimiya
- etc
I've yet to see a huge Shounen fan explore other demographics, aside from maybe the occasional Seinen that's action packed.
The majority of Shounen fans don't watch Shoujo. Every once in a while, you'll see them watch Fruits Basket, Nana, Sailor Moon, or Yona of the Dawn, the Four Horseman of "see? I'm not a Shounentard! I can watch Shoujo!". Though even they're a minority.
And there it is! Saying that Shoujo is simply not good enough...
The funny thing is... Isayama (Attack on Titan) and Togashi (Hunter x Hunter) are fans of Shoujo. There's even a Shoujo spin off of Attack on Titan that explores Levi's backstory...
What Shoujo have you read to claim the female leads are unlikable? 😐
Romance Shounen fans don't really watch romance Shoujo, aside from Fruits Basket and/or Nana. That's their "I'm not misogynistic! I like these particular Shoujo series!" But even then, they're rare. And ironically, Seinen fans are more likely to do that than Shounen fans.
5 Shoujo in the past 5 years:
- Natsume's Book of Friends
- A Sign of Affection
- Fruits Basket
- Kageki Shoujo
- Yuzuki Family's Four Sons
Josei:
- Life Lessons with Uramichi
- Gold Kingdom and Water Kingdom
- Cocoon
- Mr Villain's Day Off
- Love of Kill
Actually, Apothecary Diaries is a depressing example. It originally was a light novel aimed at women, but only the first book. The later light novel books were released in imprints aimed at men. They gained popularity from that, and even more when published in a Seinen magazine. Apothecary Diaries would've been ignored if it were put in a Josei magazine. And how do I know? Well, look at Raven of the Inner Palace. Very similar to Apothecary Diaries, but it's a Josei so people ignore it...
Shounen fans were content with watching Akane beat the crap out of Ranma...
Cardcaptor Sakura and Sailor Moon were popular. However, guys back then didn't really take them seriously like they took Dragon Ball Z and Naruto. They were seen as girly anime.
I've also given bad reviews to Shoujo, Josei, and Seinen anime. Shounen isn't unique in that aspect. Regardless of demographics, trash is trash and peak is peak.
Except, even the people who claim to hate Shounen are willing to watch it. I've seen "Shounen haters" love and watch:
- Frieren
- Inuyasha
- Spy x Family
- Hunter x Hunter
- Bloom Into You
- Horimiya
- etc
I've yet to see a huge Shounen fan explore other demographics, aside from maybe the occasional Seinen that's action packed.
The majority of Shounen fans don't watch Shoujo. Every once in a while, you'll see them watch Fruits Basket, Nana, Sailor Moon, or Yona of the Dawn, the Four Horseman of "see? I'm not a Shounentard! I can watch Shoujo!". Though even they're a minority.
And there it is! Saying that Shoujo is simply not good enough...
The funny thing is... Isayama (Attack on Titan) and Togashi (Hunter x Hunter) are fans of Shoujo. There's even a Shoujo spin off of Attack on Titan that explores Levi's backstory...
What Shoujo have you read to claim the female leads are unlikable? 😐
Romance Shounen fans don't really watch romance Shoujo, aside from Fruits Basket and/or Nana. That's their "I'm not misogynistic! I like these particular Shoujo series!" But even then, they're rare. And ironically, Seinen fans are more likely to do that than Shounen fans.
5 Shoujo in the past 5 years:
- Natsume's Book of Friends
- A Sign of Affection
- Fruits Basket
- Kageki Shoujo
- Yuzuki Family's Four Sons
Josei:
- Life Lessons with Uramichi
- Gold Kingdom and Water Kingdom
- Cocoon
- Mr Villain's Day Off
- Love of Kill
Actually, Apothecary Diaries is a depressing example. It originally was a light novel aimed at women, but only the first book. The later light novel books were released in imprints aimed at men. They gained popularity from that, and even more when published in a Seinen magazine. Apothecary Diaries would've been ignored if it were put in a Josei magazine. And how do I know? Well, look at Raven of the Inner Palace. Very similar to Apothecary Diaries, but it's a Josei so people ignore it...
Shounen fans were content with watching Akane beat the crap out of Ranma...
Cardcaptor Sakura and Sailor Moon were popular. However, guys back then didn't really take them seriously like they took Dragon Ball Z and Naruto. They were seen as girly anime.
| @LuxuriousHeart LuxuriousHeart said: Shounen fans don't show up for A Sign of Affection, and I stand by that. See there is no Logic in this statement except your prejudice, that's it... Why are you so prejudiced against shonen fans??? What do you picture in your head when you think about "Shonen Fans"??? LuxuriousHeart said: bad reviews I am not talking about bad reviews, I am talking about insults... If you want to insult your fav demographic (Shoujo) go ahead but don't insult Shonen... That is toxic behaviour... Shonen fans are not Toxic like Shoujo fans are.... You used "Incel" insult, you commented on how much sex a person has had in their life... Don't be toxic towards Shonen LuxuriousHeart said: Shounen are willing to watch it Because how good those shows are.... All of the shows I listed in previous reply are powerful shows which can draw any human being on the entire planet... Hunter x Hunter and Frieren are soo good that they can even attract Shonen haters... This is what I am saying from the start... Shonen is good enough to even attract people who think "animation is for children" and they become anime fans later on... Why are you not admitting that stories like Naruto, Onepiece, Dragon Ball, Attack on Titan, Death Note are appealing to everyone?? Those stories are good enough, powerful enough to entertain any human being on the entire planet LuxuriousHeart said: I've yet to see a huge Shounen fan explore other demographics Again this is just your personal bias that doesn't really reflect on how ACTUALLY SHONEN FANDOM BEHAVES... No amount of logic, reasoning is sufficient for you to admit that Shonen fans DID show up for A Sign of Affection Check if you are confusing with casual anime fans (that don't watch much anime to begin with) with Shonen fans... If we are talking about Casual fans that only want to watch 5-8 shows per year, then obviously Shoujo/Josei will not make into their lists, since not many Shoujo/Josei anime are top 10 in a year... LuxuriousHeart said: Every once in a while, you'll see them watch Fruits Basket, Nana, Sailor Moon, or Yona of the Dawn, So you do admit that Shonen fans indeed watched some Shoujo shows... This is what I was saying again, Fruits Basket, Nana, Sailor Moon and Yona of the dawn are not good enough for Shonen fans to come back to Shoujo for more... The modern Shonen fans would not even complete these shows... Fruis Basket they would not reach 3rd season, majority of Shonen fans will drop it at 2nd season because of the direction the show takes... Nana characters are Toxic, Sailor Moon is just not good enough and Yona of the Dawn is not good for Shonen fans to think "I want some more of that"... So if they tasted peak Shoujo and it is not good enough for them why would they come back for Shoujo again??? Unless until they find something very very interesting like A Sign of Affection??? LuxuriousHeart said: That's their "I'm not misogynistic! I like these particular Shoujo series!" See again you are using insults like mysogynistic... Why would hating (instead of just not liking/not watching) Shoujo make someone Mysogynistic??? Does hating Shonen mean they are Misandristic??? of course not!... This is why Shoujo fans are very Toxic, they insult on someone's character just because they don't like watching Shoujo... JUST LIKE I SAID IN MY PREVIOUS REPLY Shoujo fans insult people's character if the say "I don't like Shoujo so I won't watch it" while Shonen fans don't do that... Shoujo fans make anime discussions Toxic by insulting people's character and intelligence hence they are the most Toxic fandom in anime Your list is reminding me of my episode 1 drop shows... Natsume book of friends, I dropped it on one episode 1 and isn't it a 10 year old anime???? A Sign of Affection was watched by Shonen Fans, Fruits Basket is dropped at 2nd season by majority of Shonen fans, Kageki Shoujo was not good enough... Yuzuki Family's Four Sons has annoyed me to no end, it felt like a mangaka's fantasy on how brothers act with each other and simultaneously preaching how brothers SHOULD act with each other... It felt like I was insulting my own blood related brother while watching it... Overwhelming majority of Shounen fans will be turned off by Yuzuki Family's Four Sons... Only 2 good shows out 5 for shounen fans and that too includes a remake of a classic... My recommendations are faar better shows than your recommendations FOR SHONEN FANS, hence shonen fans don't watch much Shoujo and rightfully so... I would even say my recommendations are better than your recommendations for even Shoujo fans if I take out Fruits Basket and Natsume's book as they are old classics... That's why Shoujo fans with their limited time is worth checking Shonen shows because they are good enough for them to enjoy... Life lessons with Uramichi is 2nd episode drop and Love of Kill is 1st episode drop... I was very very disappointed with Love of Kill cuz I had hopes on it LuxuriousHeart said: What Shoujo have you read to claim the female leads are unlikable? I don't read, I watch... I have taste tested atleast 1 shoujo anime per season for last past 5 years... I think the above paragraph should give you an idea how much chance I gave Shoujo anime... My biggest disappointment in Shoujo anime is 12 Kingdoms... I watched upto 12 episodes with patience 5 years back but could not continue it... This is what I am saying by Shonen fans only taste disappointment with 90%+ Shoujo anime... Now as I am getting older and busier, I have limited time to watch anime and I have to be selective with anime I watch and more often than not Shoujo anime just don't make the cut... A sign of Affection is the only Shoujo anime I remember fondly in the last 3 years Look at last season, the top 5 shows are Solo Levelling, Apothecary diaries, Dr stone, Sakamoto Days and 100 girlfriends.... There is no reason for a shonen fan to pick "My happy marriage" or "Honey Lemon Soda" over "100 girlfriends that really love you"... And still My Happy marriage still managed to pull some Shonen fans with it's decent magic system and with a Female Lead that is just "not bad"... If shonen fans did not want to watch 100 girlfriends they still had "I'm Getting Married to a Girl I Hate in My Class" and "I Have a Crush at Work" as alternatives LuxuriousHeart said: And how do I know? Well, look at Raven of the Inner Palace. No you don't know that... Just because both anime have palace harem and mystery it doesn't mean Raven of the inner palace is as good as Apothecary Diaries... Raven of the inner palace is not 8+ show while Apothecary diaries is easily 8.5+ show LuxuriousHeart said: Shounen fans were content with watching Akane beat the crap out of Ranma No they are not... With Takahashi Rumiko star power + OG anime fans watching the remake + Shoujo fans watching the remake and Ranma 1/2 2024 couldn't even touch 128k members which A sign of Affection a which is based on a relatively unknown manga did... The OG anime fans belong to the wife beating generation so they actually did not mind it.... Even then, Shonen fans have a 50 - 50 divide with Akane... The 50% who hate Akane still watched the show because of Shampoo, Ranma and Ukiyo, they just tolerated Akane... New shonen fans did not show up to Ranma 1/2 as much the brand should have attracted and with coming seasons even less and less Shonen fans will watch it... The modern Shonen fans despise the violent tsundere trope so Ranma 1/2 is a very hard sell for them Why don't you criticise Shoujo that promote violence towards boyfriends instead of justifying it by bringing up other Toxic characters like Akane? Out of the kids who watched DBZ, Naruto, Cardcaptor Sakura and Sailormoon, overwhelming majority preferred DBZ and Naruto... I don't think they even know what "girly anime" meant when they watched it... Even if the criticism is that it is a girly anime, then that is on the Cardcaptor Sakura and Sailormoon and not on Kids... The bottom line is Kids liked DBZ and Naruto and not the others and that's it... Kids will like what kids want, so if authors want kids to watch their Shoujo anime, then they should keep in mind what kids (audience) will like and won't like.. The anime needs to serve the audience not the other way around... Why can't Shoujo make neutral anime with great stories and characters instead of girly anime with unlikeable female protagonists is beyond me... How can you attract shounen fans if you don't give them what they want... Kids are much more entertained and inspired by Naruto and DBZ than they are with other shows because of good Naruto and DBZ is... Many DBZ fans will remember the moment Goku turning Super Saiyan till they die... That's how powerful these shows are You are saying it like "Sailor Moon and Cardcaptor Sakura are as good as DBZ and Naruto but they are not popular enough because they were girly anime".... No please don't say that... You are insulting both the kids and DBZ Naruto shows... Cardcaptor Sakura is not as good and Naruto and DBZ and that is why it is not as popular as those shows.... Please don't give excuses for CCS for it's failure to capture very large audience as DBZ, Naruto did... If you do that, Shoujo will never improve and they will fail to even capture the new anime fans... Please don't compare mangakas to casual anime fans.... For mangakas, reading mangas is their work and they would not waste time even by reading sub par works as they would learn lessons of what not to do... If you ask them which would they prefer Shonen or Shoujo you and I both know which would be their answer... You cannot deny the influence of Shonen Jump that had on them... Togashi might lie and say he prefers Shoujo because he is married to a Shoujo mangaka... Iasayama's biggest inspiration for Attack on Titan is Muv-Luv Alternative Visual Novel which is a Shonen/Seinen work... Why would any mangaka would publicly say I hate Shoujo/Shonen/Josei/Seinen??? Ofcourse they would say they are fan of something even if they won't read majority of the time for their entertainment Shoujo is not as good as Shonen... Shonen is very diverse and has 100's of shows to prove it's quality... Look at MAL top 100 anime and count how many Shoujo are there in that... You could count it on your fingers.... Shoujo is not good as Shonen, not as consistent as Shonen, not as diverse as Shonen so it is not worth your time to try different Shoujos and be disppointed 90%+ of the time |
Kira_IllusionistApr 4, 6:36 AM
Apr 4, 6:31 AM
#87
| To answer your question, both. There'x nothing wrong with being a shonen fan. Hell I didn't hardly watch anything but for the longest time. And I still like a very well done shonen, but those are really few and far between anymore. It's not the fans' fault. It's the producers with their programmable trope and cliche ridden glop. Plus there's been this propensity, especially in the last 10 years, where all that matters is flashy trash animation. Good characters and good writing have been chucked in the dumpster. |
Apr 4, 5:09 PM
#88
| Shounen anime is actually very enjoyable to watch tbh. I see nothing wrong with enjoying it. |
Apr 5, 12:50 AM
#89
Suntanned_Duck2 said: To me it's like gaming. I don't want to hear about the same surface level stuff and only support from surface level stuff because they cycle and nothing more out there, ambitious or even fair safe but a good spin can do it if they keep supporting the same surface level. Branching out is challenging but it's not difficult either. To me being into whatever is fine. Pretty much this... Shounen fans in animanga are the equivalent of the sports and shooter fans in gaming. Or Animal Crossing/The Sims only girlies. It's fine that you like those and only play them. However, I'd be lying if I said I don't judge. And I don't find such people interesting to talk to for long, as far as those particular topics are concerned. |
Apr 5, 1:09 AM
#90
| I look down all on people over 30 who only got into anime after AoT aired. If you are an old school shonen guy I give you more respect than the bandwagoners. But you had to have read stuff like Flame of Recca, SDK, get backers etc |
Apr 5, 1:12 AM
#91
Kira_Illusionist said: See there is no Logic in this statement except your prejudice, that's it... Why are you so prejudiced against shonen fans??? What do you picture in your head when you think about "Shonen Fans"??? From my experience, most of them just watch ultra mainstream action anime. That's it. And they only watch ultra mainstream male demographics. No exploration. They complain about Seinen elitists not being open minded, but they're just as closed minded as Seinen fans. For as much as they slander them, they act similar to them. Because how good those shows are.... All of the shows I listed in previous reply are powerful shows which can draw any human being on the entire planet... Hunter x Hunter and Frieren are soo good that they can even attract Shonen haters... This is what I am saying from the start... Shonen is good enough to even attract people who think "animation is for children" and they become anime fans later on... Why are you not admitting that stories like Naruto, Onepiece, Dragon Ball, Attack on Titan, Death Note are appealing to everyone?? Those stories are good enough, powerful enough to entertain any human being on the entire planet And we're bad to implying that an entire demographic is trash... See, this is why I mean when I say that Shounen fans are very similar to Seinen elitists. And ironically, ultra unpopular opinion, Seinen elitists are actually more open minded than Shounen fans. Again this is just your personal bias that doesn't really reflect on how ACTUALLY SHONEN FANDOM BEHAVES... No amount of logic, reasoning is sufficient for you to admit that Shonen fans DID show up for A Sign of Affection Check if you are confusing with casual anime fans (that don't watch much anime to begin with) with Shonen fans... If we are talking about Casual fans that only want to watch 5-8 shows per year, then obviously Shoujo/Josei will not make into their lists, since not many Shoujo/Josei anime are top 10 in a year... You say bias, but I literally just don't see it. I've seen a bunch of Shounen fans on multiple sites. This site, Reddit, Twitter, TikTok, and YouTube. Most of them will occasionally explore outside of Shounen to a mainstream Seinen, but that's it. When seeing their top 10 - 50 favorite anime/manga, it's rare that you'll see a single Shoujo or Josei on the list. With their collections, it's rare that you see a Shoujo or Josei. You'll see that when it's a collection of like 1,000 volumes. Compare that to Shoujo fans. In their top 10 - 50, you'll see Shounen and Seinen series. Even collections that just have 100 volumes will have a Shounen/Seinen series. So you do admit that Shonen fans indeed watched some Shoujo shows... This is what I was saying again, Fruits Basket, Nana, Sailor Moon and Yona of the dawn are not good enough for Shonen fans to come back to Shoujo for more... The modern Shonen fans would not even complete these shows... Fruis Basket they would not reach 3rd season, majority of Shonen fans will drop it at 2nd season because of the direction the show takes... Nana characters are Toxic, Sailor Moon is just not good enough and Yona of the Dawn is not good for Shonen fans to think "I want some more of that"... So if they tasted peak Shoujo and it is not good enough for them why would they come back for Shoujo again??? Unless until they find something very very interesting like A Sign of Affection??? As I said, it's very rare... And you're more likely to see Seinen fans watching Shoujo than Shounen fans. And once again, insulting an entire demographic... This is a normal conversation with Shounen fans, so I'm not surprised. It's funny in a way... Shounen fans pretend to not care about demographics, but they only watch Shounen and the occasional Seinen. Seinen Elitists pretend to only watch Seinen, but they'll have some dark Shounen, Shoujo, and Josei on their list. Why would hating (instead of just not liking/not watching) Shoujo make someone Mysogynistic??? Does hating Shonen mean they are Misandristic??? of course not!... This is why Shoujo fans are very Toxic, they insult on someone's character just because they don't like watching Shoujo... JUST LIKE I SAID IN MY PREVIOUS REPLY Shoujo fans insult people's character if the say "I don't like Shoujo so I won't watch it" while Shonen fans don't do that... Shoujo fans make anime discussions Toxic by insulting people's character and intelligence hence they are the most Toxic fandom in anime Except, Shounen haters are still open to watching Shounen. That's the difference. It's like with Seinen Elitists. Even if they claim that Seinen is superior to every other demographic, they'll still watch all demographics. Shounen fans say that demographics don't matter, but their habits show that they actually do matter... This is what I am saying by Shonen fans only taste disappointment with 90%+ Shoujo anime... Now as I am getting older and busier, I have limited time to watch anime and I have to be selective with anime I watch and more often than not Shoujo anime just don't make the cut... A sign of Affection is the only Shoujo anime I remember fondly in the last 3 years Look at last season, the top 5 shows are Solo Levelling, Apothecary diaries, Dr stone, Sakamoto Days and 100 girlfriends.... There is no reason for a shonen fan to pick "My happy marriage" or "Honey Lemon Soda" over "100 girlfriends that really love you"... And still My Happy marriage still managed to pull some Shonen fans with it's decent magic system and with a Female Lead that is just "not bad"... If shonen fans did not want to watch 100 girlfriends they still had "I'm Getting Married to a Girl I Hate in My Class" and "I Have a Crush at Work" as alternatives Statistics show that Shounen fans avoid Shoujo and Josei, btw... So Honey Lemon Soda and My Happy Marriage is not watched by them. Out of the kids who watched DBZ, Naruto, Cardcaptor Sakura and Sailormoon, overwhelming majority preferred DBZ and Naruto... I don't think they even know what "girly anime" meant when they watched it... Even if the criticism is that it is a girly anime, then that is on the Cardcaptor Sakura and Sailormoon and not on Kids... The bottom line is Kids liked DBZ and Naruto and not the others and that's it... Kids will like what kids want, so if authors want kids to watch their Shoujo anime, then they should keep in mind what kids (audience) will like and won't like.. The anime needs to serve the audience not the other way around... There's a reason why they preferred anime with a male protagonist in a male demographic over anime with female protagonists aimed at the female demographic. Why can't Shoujo make neutral anime with great stories and characters instead of girly anime with unlikeable female protagonists is beyond me... How can you attract shounen fans if you don't give them what they want... More looking down on demographics while proclaiming Shounen the victim. See, this is why no one takes Shounen fans seriously... For as much as Shoujo and Seinen roast the other demographics, they'll at least watch and enjoy some series from every demographic. Shounen fans simply don't do this. Shounen fans play victim and claim that demographics don't matter when Shounen is in the line of fire, but then they'll stay in their bubble and proclaim the other demographics as inferior... Please don't compare mangakas to casual anime fans.... For mangakas, reading mangas is their work and they would not waste time even by reading sub par works as they would learn lessons of what not to do... If you ask them which would they prefer Shonen or Shoujo you and I both know which would be their answer... You cannot deny the influence of Shonen Jump that had on them... Togashi might lie and say he prefers Shoujo because he is married to a Shoujo mangaka... Iasayama's biggest inspiration for Attack on Titan is Muv-Luv Alternative Visual Novel which is a Shonen/Seinen work... Togashi has talked about his love for Shoujo. You're not reading his interviews it seems... Isayama made a reference to Requiem of the Rose King, a dark fantasy Shoujo manga. Shoujo is not as good as Shonen... Shonen is very diverse and has 100's of shows to prove it's quality... Look at MAL top 100 anime and count how many Shoujo are there in that... You could count it on your fingers.... Shoujo is not good as Shonen, not as consistent as Shonen, not as diverse as Shonen so it is not worth your time to try different Shoujos and be disppointed 90%+ of the time More hypocrisy of Shounen fans. So when you crap on other demographics and simply call them inferior, it's okay. When people do the same to Shounen, it's bad? Once again, this is why most people dislike Shounen fans. And watch the other Shounen fans ignore this comment, but then get on a soap box about people looking down on Shounen. |
Apr 5, 1:21 AM
#92
Reply to jacobPOL
what shounen fans? that discussion is terrible, aren't your favs are also shonen like chainsaw man is publishing in shonen magazine, shounen is for tennage boys of age from 13 to 18 and seinen is basically young adult 18 and up but that doesnt matter because there are many manga like bochi the rock, kaguya sama, k on were published in seinen magazines despite it's target demographic they can be enjoyed by nearly everyone, please we live in 2025 in the age where information is massively avaible do your research properly, because it's not demographic but actual manga content and genre matters the most most of the time.
| @jacobPOL People say demographics don't matter, but that's far from the truth. |
Apr 5, 1:33 AM
#93
| Anyone who looks down on other people enjoying something is whack in my opinion. |
Apr 5, 2:52 AM
#94
Reply to LuxuriousHeart
@jacobPOL People say demographics don't matter, but that's far from the truth.
| @LuxuriousHeart So you mean in your mentality I should also look down on every novel reader that reads young adult novels as well? just let people what they enjoy reading, everyone that looks down on someone because they enjoy something people don't like are just immature. |
Apr 5, 4:44 AM
#95
| No because taste in anime does not determine the intelligence of someone is. |
| It doesn't matter if you like LoGH,Monster etc.If you are a jobless or college/school dropout living in your mom basement, you are still an unintelligent loser. Taste in anime does not make you a better person. |
Apr 5, 5:04 AM
#96
Reply to Papa_Scorch
No because taste in anime does not determine the intelligence of someone is.
| @Papa_Scorch but the anime industry tries to cater to the most people, and vice versa... it's still not about taste, but manipulation of the masses. one or other side have to be changed, or it will be just became an utopia... sad, but inevitable |
Apr 5, 5:28 AM
#97
| I look down on hood weebs and low attention span animetokers. |
Apr 5, 5:32 AM
#98
| I'm guessing this post is talking about battle shounen fans, since there's a lot of genres that shounen covers lol I generally try not to judge the genres someone enjoys (I think that kind of thing's stupid), but I'm also kind of a dick so sometimes I do. Battle shounen fans are usually casuals who only watch mainstream series, and there's nothing wrong with that, but I do find myself a bit dissapointed when I meet someone who likes anime but exclusively watches those sorts of shounen series. |
Apr 5, 5:33 AM
#99
Reply to Yotsuba84
@Papa_Scorch but the anime industry tries to cater to the most people, and vice versa... it's still not about taste, but manipulation of the masses. one or other side have to be changed, or it will be just became an utopia... sad, but inevitable
| @Yotsuba84 No idea what you are trying to say here.OP ask if you look down one someone for their type of anime they like.Answer is no whether they are shounen fans or not. I don't see how the side need to change. It's a free market and let people decide for themselves what anime they want to pay for with their own hard earn money. |
| It doesn't matter if you like LoGH,Monster etc.If you are a jobless or college/school dropout living in your mom basement, you are still an unintelligent loser. Taste in anime does not make you a better person. |
Apr 5, 5:38 AM
#100
| I look down on myself for many reasons, but enjoying a good Battle Shounen is not one of them. They keep me young ;) |
| I probably regret this post by now. |
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