DigiCat said: I'll try to keep this reply short since too tired from work to make an essay. People are taught to act differently in social situations and personally the way men are taught to act is not good and really shitty for themselves and potentially people around them. This goes double if they are raised in a heteronormative manner. So me as a gay ass pansexual enby piece of stupidity with fruity outward social tendencies have had to deal with shit from men over the years starting from my teenage years and even in my working life now. And as a side note I see too much of relationship problems and behavioral dysfunctions from men around me, my family, friends and the many many people I've acquainted. So ye I'd like to have the social concept of "man" totally revamped and made a small essay by accident here but it's better than the shit I could've done, like an actual essay with several pages. Sorry about that.Damn, how have you met so many?? The way i see it, there's always gonna be assholes in the world (and this isn't exclusive to being a man or straight), but they tend to just be a loud minority in most cases |
Deathko said: Am I missing something here? I know op mentioned dressing like a hooker or whatever, but I never brought it up myself, and this is a direct response towards my statement. Here I only brought up cleavage in general. Never brought up anything being super revealing...Either way all I can say is if you see someone showing skin and your first thought is "oh that's obviously a hooker" that sounds like more of a problem with you and your environment. Have I had thoughts that someone dressing a certain way is clearly looking for attention, sure. I'll admit to that. But I've never gone straight to "oh yeah, that's totally a hooker". @FanofAction " I always wonder how someone like this reacts to cleavage in real life if it bothers them so much on a fictional character " They probably just ask "how much" because only hookers dress like hookers IRL. Look I like anime and all that shit, but... Like, lets just take Cowboy Bebop so nobody will torch me alive for shitting on some show I don't like. Look at how Faye Valentine is dressing. Did that ever bothered me IRL? No, it never bothered me IRL, because I have legit never seen anyone dress like that besides the sex workers in my music school's street lmao. And considering how everybody around her looks normal, it's just very strange that she dresses like some downtown hooker. |
Nysse said: Taking away sexy women in fictional media in order to combat sexism, is like treating a bullet wound with a band-aid.It's mostly the amount of media that makes it problematic imo. Since over sexualization of women and girls has been proven to be a factor in making sexism worse especially among young men. I really do wanna have a better less shit societies all over the world and in small ways it can be a bit improved. Also I would love to live in a world where guys are less like assholes towards women and anyone who isn't a straight male but not sure how many people here care about that kinda opinion. Also not all men, yes yes I know just too many imo. But I still emphasize that personally I ALSO like booba cleavage so like yeah just wanna have a bit less of it over all I guess. There are other great ways to make attractive female characters as well really other than over using BOBS. |
| If you reply back to me and I never respond, I lost interest and don't care. Sorry about that. |
| Taking away sexy women in fictional media in order to combat sexism, is like treating a bullet wound with a band-aid.[/quote] Well yes it's not good to take away sexy women. I just personally prefer different kinds of sexy women, I love variety. And cleavage is nice. Sorry just feel like I didn't use words properly enough so the reason I've been spamming booba good. Basically tried to make it obvious I wasn't advocating for taking away the smexy, just having a different taste and outlook on the initial question which did go waaaayyy away from the original discussion, I am aware of that. But like gib smexy women yes. Also smexy men. GIB SMEX |
Nysse said: I'll try to keep this reply short since too tired from work to make an essay. People are taught to act differently in social situations and personally the way men are taught to act is not good and really shitty for themselves and potentially people around them. This goes double if they are raised in a heteronormative manner. So me as a gay ass pansexual enby piece of stupidity with fruity outward social tendencies have had to deal with shit from men over the years starting from my teenage years and even in my working life now. And as a side note I see too much of relationship problems and behavioral dysfunctions from men around me, my family, friends and the many many people I've acquainted. So ye I'd like to have the social concept of "man" totally revamped and made a small essay by accident here but it's better than the shit I could've done, like an actual essay with several pages. Sorry about that Oh no please no essays, i'm dyslexic AF 🙀 I kinda get where you're coming from, though i don't get what that has to do with being raised heteronormative (??), to be 100% honest i'm not even sure what that reffers too But i get the part of how growing up with many male a-holes can give you a perspective that this is a problem with most men For me for the longest time i had this problem with women, having grown up with my closest female relatives being complete a-holes, and too a lesser degree most of my school bullies being females, i was always very weary and found it hard to trust other women, and it got to the point that i'd see all (most) women as a-holes, which is obviously bullshit, 'cause i have tons of aunts and cousins and friends and my own sister who are genuinely nice people who care for me, but because i generalized the behaviour of the few bad women in my life as being the "norm" it took me a long time to see that |
| What debating with DigiCat is like according to APolygons2 That's why I thought a discussion would be pointless. It doesn't feel like a debate. It feels like I'm playing chess and somehow lose to an uno reverse card after loosing all my monopoly money lol |
| not a fan of big boobs, but for some reason weebs are obsessed with huge breasts, i dont get it |
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Nysse said: Maybe because we've seen more and more women forcing their female sexuality on men? Maybe because of growing sexual frustration caused by the attitudes tought to women (and their behavior never being questioned, unlike men)? Maybe looking inwards instead of victimizing onself could be the solution (unless you live in a little world where all men are evil child eaters)?DigiCat said: I'll try to keep this reply short since too tired from work to make an essay. People are taught to act differently in social situations and personally the way men are taught to act is not good and really shitty for themselves and potentially people around them. This goes double if they are raised in a heteronormative manner. So me as a gay ass pansexual enby piece of stupidity with fruity outward social tendencies have had to deal with shit from men over the years starting from my teenage years and even in my working life now. And as a side note I see too much of relationship problems and behavioral dysfunctions from men around me, my family, friends and the many many people I've acquainted. So ye I'd like to have the social concept of "man" totally revamped and made a small essay by accident here but it's better than the shit I could've done, like an actual essay with several pages. Sorry about that.Damn, how have you met so many?? The way i see it, there's always gonna be assholes in the world (and this isn't exclusive to being a man or straight), but they tend to just be a loud minority in most cases What's the "concept of man" ? I prefer a woman who assumes to be a woman, rather than a woman who is a sub-man because she wants to do everything like him without trying to achieve it. |
| “You’ve never succeeded at anything and you never will, and do you know why? Because you are vulgar, irremediably vulgar, and not only are you vulgar, you are ordinary.” - Maurice Pialat’s We Won't Grow Old Together (1972) |
| @Digicat "Ah, so standing out and not following fashion trends is only for the male gaze, it couldn't possibly be because a woman is comfortable dressing that way or likes that style of clothing" Are you implying that female fictional characters make conscious choices regarding their wardrobes that are somehow unrelated to their male writers? I think a quick "Faye Valentine cosplay" google search will reveal how much her clothes stand out and how it defines her as a person lol. It's not slut-shaming if I'm shitting on the male writers' choices. If you want to see a great anime that shreds slut-shaming tho, watch Panty & Stocking with Garterbelt. On the bit about "standing out" thx to clothes... we have a saying that says "the robe doesn't make a monk"... but you can't blame others for thinking you're a monk if you dress like one. If you decide to dress up like a sex worker, you can't blame others for thinking you're one. No shame either, I don't think I'd ever shame a hooker for doing this difficult job. Don't sweat it, you won't see me tripping up on my feminist subjects, this is the year 2023 and my ex (7 years!) is a twitter feminist, navigating this minefield is second nature by now UwU edit: damn, this site so broken now, can't use quotes or spoilers . I had a pretty hilarious pic of a bearded dude cosplaying as Faye, it was great U_U |
DeathkoFeb 11, 2023 3:16 PM
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| @FanofAction what I mean is, I have never seen anyone dress like some of the examples posted here IRL. I think the "Women have breasts, we need to accept this reality" comment you were answering kinda ignored that point. Women have breasts IRL indeed, but they tend not to flaunt them around for the pleasure of male viewers like they do in anime. Thus, the counter-argument could be made that "Women cover their breasts, we have to accept this reality", kinda nullifying the whole thing. Don't get me wrong, I'm a simple man like all of us. If tomorrow fashion switches to free nipples everywhere, I won't make a scandal about it, I'll just stop complaining about overkill fanservice in mainstream anime (^: |
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This thread is even more useless than tits on a snek... |
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DYNASTIA said: Nysse said: Maybe because we've seen more and more women forcing their female sexuality on men? Maybe because of growing sexual frustration caused by the attitudes tought to women (and their behavior never being questioned, unlike men)? Maybe looking inwards instead of victimizing onself could be the solution (unless you live in a little world where all men are evil child eaters)?I'll try to keep this reply short since too tired from work to make an essay. People are taught to act differently in social situations and personally the way men are taught to act is not good and really shitty for themselves and potentially people around them. This goes double if they are raised in a heteronormative manner. So me as a gay ass pansexual enby piece of stupidity with fruity outward social tendencies have had to deal with shit from men over the years starting from my teenage years and even in my working life now. And as a side note I see too much of relationship problems and behavioral dysfunctions from men around me, my family, friends and the many many people I've acquainted. So ye I'd like to have the social concept of "man" totally revamped and made a small essay by accident here but it's better than the shit I could've done, like an actual essay with several pages. Sorry about that. What's the "concept of man" ? I prefer a woman who assumes to be a woman, rather than a woman who is a sub-man because she wants to do everything like him without trying to achieve it. Aight so lil notes. "Social concept of man" not "concept of man" in itself. Basically revamping the current western conception of what makes a good man. Less machismo with more positive emotions and vulnerability. Like to start with. Tbh I just wanna abolish gender as a concept since the social shit that comes with it is personally probably not beneficial to the majority population and human experience. This is all IMO. Secondly referring to a victimizing situation felt weird just gonna say that. I dunno I felt like I was kinda clear in that I know too much a-holery from men. Not exclusively since a-holes are of all genders, just men in particular being the more troublesome kind. Lastly, what do you mean with female sexuality pushed on men? What you mean with a woman being a sub-man and not achieving things? Sounds like gender essentialism to me or whatever the f it was called. Some dumb stuff about construding sex and gender. Really rambly rn lol |
Deathko said: Are you implying that female fictional characters make conscious choices regarding their wardrobes that are somehow unrelated to their male writers? Judging by you only mentioning male writers i assume if it were a female writer it'd be just fine? Hypocrite much? And yes, good writing also means the writers are looking at things from the characters points of view, chances are every detail has been thought out, down to the costume Of course there's also gonna be character design elements that are appealing to the writer, but that is but the mear surfice of what goes into creating a character Deathko said: edit: damn, this site so broken now, can't use quotes or spoilers . I had a pretty hilarious pic of a bearded dude cosplaying as Faye, it was great U_U [spoiler][/spoiler] Click the last icon on top of the reply box to view BBcode |
| What debating with DigiCat is like according to APolygons2 That's why I thought a discussion would be pointless. It doesn't feel like a debate. It feels like I'm playing chess and somehow lose to an uno reverse card after loosing all my monopoly money lol |
Deathko said: Ever read what Kant has to say about objectification? We're all pieces of meat to some degree...@Digicat "Ah, so standing out and not following fashion trends is only for the male gaze, it couldn't possibly be because a woman is comfortable dressing that way or likes that style of clothing" Are you implying that female fictional characters make conscious choices regarding their wardrobes that are somehow unrelated to their male writers? I think a quick "Faye Valentine cosplay" google search will reveal how much her clothes stand out and how it defines her as a person lol. It's not slut-shaming if I'm shitting on the male writers' choices. If you want to see a great anime that shreds slut-shaming tho, watch Panty & Stocking with Garterbelt. On the bit about "standing out" thx to clothes... we have a saying that says "the robe doesn't make a monk"... but you can't blame others for thinking you're a monk if you dress like one. If you decide to dress up like a sex worker, you can't blame others for thinking you're one. No shame either, I don't think I'd ever shame a hooker for doing this difficult job. Don't sweat it, you won't see me tripping up on my feminist subjects, this is the year 2023 and my ex (7 years!) is a twitter feminist, navigating this minefield is second nature by now UwU edit: damn, this site so broken now, can't use quotes or spoilers . I had a pretty hilarious pic of a bearded dude cosplaying as Faye, it was great U_U You can look at the Jojo characters, or the instagram thurst under Chris Hemsworth's pecs pics... Yet you choose to look the other way... There are studies showing correlation between the depth of the cleavage and sexual availability... (Unconsciously) |
| “You’ve never succeeded at anything and you never will, and do you know why? Because you are vulgar, irremediably vulgar, and not only are you vulgar, you are ordinary.” - Maurice Pialat’s We Won't Grow Old Together (1972) |
| @Deathko Ok...So your stance on this, if I'm reading it correctly, is that this is bad because there's someone behind the scene making the characters dress this way? To me that just sounds like you're implying the creator of a character has no right to dress said character however the hell they want. Regardless of your thoughts, it's their character. They have just as much of a right to pick the outfits used as a real person does with their own clothing. |
Nysse said: In any case, there are no women who fit perfectly into the "feminine gender" model. You can be a woman and be aggressive, etc.Aight so lil notes. "Social concept of man" not "concept of man" in itself. Basically revamping the current western conception of what makes a good man. Less machismo with more positive emotions and vulnerability. Like to start with. Tbh I just wanna abolish gender as a concept since the social shit that comes with it is personally probably not beneficial to the majority population and human experience. This is all IMO. Just like being an emotional and irrational man ( even if I wouldn't consider this one as desirable). At the end of the day, the biological imperitive is still reproductive, for women to choose the best possible man to stay with as long as possible (and make use of "cunningness" (seduction is part of it), do tricks to get there) so that he protects her and the baby. While the man can reproduce with many females. This is divorced from the "social" aspect, but still "coded" into us. And whether we like it or not, our sexual urges have an impact on our behavior. Nysse said: Secondly referring to a victimizing situation felt weird just gonna say that. I dunno I felt like I was kinda clear in that I know too much a-holery from men. Not exclusively since a-holes are of all genders, just men in particular being the more troublesome kind. We are all sometimes victims, sometimes executioners... Quite simply because human relationships are complex. Lastly, what do you mean with female sexuality pushed on men? What you mean with a woman being a sub-man and not achieving things? Sounds like gender essentialism to me or whatever the f it was called. Some dumb stuff about construding sex and gender. The current goal is to push men to have the sexuality of dominated women, and that the woman herself has the right to have a man's sexuality without being judged as a slut. Women who want to take the biological place of men. @FanofAction I mean, you can also just resume Spike this way, he's just a hunk with his shirt open all the time, showing off his male slut chest hair. |
DYNASTIAFeb 11, 2023 5:05 PM
| “You’ve never succeeded at anything and you never will, and do you know why? Because you are vulgar, irremediably vulgar, and not only are you vulgar, you are ordinary.” - Maurice Pialat’s We Won't Grow Old Together (1972) |
| @ DYNASTIA But it doesn't count if a male character is showing any amount of skin though....he says totally non sarcastically. |
UberBat said: True, and it's so weird. Why do they remove nipples?Kind of loses it's appeal when it's everywhere. Need to be more exclusive and less annoying. Support the small chested! Another issue is the lack of nipples on topless men in anime |
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UberBat said: Kind of loses it's appeal when it's everywhere. Need to be more exclusive and less annoying. Support the small chested! Another issue is the lack of nipples on topless men in anime It does loses its appeal when used, so I agree. |
 Code Lyoko, we'll reset it all Code Lyoko, be there when you call Code Lyoko, we will stand real tall Code Lyoko, stronger after all |
| @DYNASTIA Maidenless behaviour. Sorry but you seem to want to roleplay as an intellectual but just seem to need to feel some loving. Quoting Kant and having Nietzsche etc. in your favorite people on an ANIME site is larpy. And slut shaming women while saying biology rules relationships and men can fuck around, wow that's hella dumb. Let people have sex when they wanna and as much as they wanna when it's not hurting others around them, thanks. |
Nysse said: 😂@DYNASTIA Maidenless behaviour. Sorry but you seem to want to roleplay as an intellectual but just seem to need to feel some loving. Quoting Kant and having Nietzsche etc. in your favorite people on an ANIME site is larpy. And slut shaming women while saying biology rules relationships and men can fuck around, wow that's hella dumb. Let people have sex when they wanna and as much as they wanna when it's not hurting others around them, thanks. Maidenless (sic) ? "feel some loving"? Um, no thanks, I'm not interested. Nonsense, I refer to Kant, but don't worry, without reading anything, without any culture, you understand what I'm talking about. Didn't know favorite lists were such a big deal, what will I do without your approval? 🤓 Ah, but I don't give a damn that a woman has a man's sexuality. But don't come and force me to have a woman's sexuality. Men and women are made to be together... Otherwise it's a collapse of the human species. I guess biology is too sexist... |
| “You’ve never succeeded at anything and you never will, and do you know why? Because you are vulgar, irremediably vulgar, and not only are you vulgar, you are ordinary.” - Maurice Pialat’s We Won't Grow Old Together (1972) |
| weganizm said: There doesn't have to be a deep reason for most guys to like big tits, we just do. Not hard to get. not a fan of big boobs, but for some reason weebs are obsessed with huge breasts, i dont get it |
| "Well, she's flatter than a pancake" -Mimi Alpacas "Woof" -Tobiichi Origami "Are you trying to turn the dormitory into a strip club!?! -Atena Saotome |
| @DYNASTIA Oh, I'd complain about the objectification of the male body too. Tho it's a bit irrelevant in the context of anime, because your average male in modern anime is a 50 kilos average teen that is hardly sexualized. We'd have to go back to the 80s to find hilariously muscular dudes. Jojo's just a straggler from the 80s. |
|
| Well, regardless of what it's called, I certainly wouldn't mind more male characters displaying it :p |
SaskiaDuchannes said: there animes that could be considered focused to both genders and even friendly to younger people What kid friendly anime has an extream amount of fanservice?? -YaoiBoy- said: Well, regardless of what it's called, I certainly wouldn't mind more male characters displaying it :p 😁👍👍 |
| What debating with DigiCat is like according to APolygons2 That's why I thought a discussion would be pointless. It doesn't feel like a debate. It feels like I'm playing chess and somehow lose to an uno reverse card after loosing all my monopoly money lol |
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