Platinum End Episode 12 Discussion

DrMondaiNashi said:
ok, that's cool and all but

viruses are not living beings. They're not classified under any of the Kingdoms within Systema Naturae .. I'm really sorry but I keep going over this many times and people just won't get it.

Not bashing the show I'm having a great time watching, but man .. could you please stop saying "KILL THE VIRUS" pretty please

Dukino said:
I understand Mirai point of view a lot more now. At first it was hard to empathize with someone who wouldn't kill the worst kind of people but I get it now. Mirai saying to Metropoliman that he's less than a cockroach, which is true, that Mirai doesn't want to sully his hands or jeopardize his own happiness just to kill someone like Metropoliman. He definitely deserves to be killed but what that act would do to Mirai psyche would cost too much. It would live with him the rest of his life, those words his parents said ringing true. Things were pretty intense when Mirai walked over to the crazy virus lady. I didn't know how he would get out of there unscaved but it worked out for the most part. Hajime sacrificing himself to save Saki after she flew down to block the syringes from injecting Mirai. While slashing the syringe tubes and stabbing the virus lady. So an even loss for both sides in that moment. Mirai ready to face down Metropoliman once and for all.

Emillian said:
Also the "kill the virus" part amplifies, even more, the fact that they are just spitting out bs. They are NOT EVEN ALIVE, to begin with, but the white arrows apply the same rules as a living basic organism.

Lucifrost said:

I'm willing to accept that a virus is similar enough to a cell to count as alive. Both have DNA inside a body of sorts. But the explanation in this show can only have come from someone who slept through his biology class.

Short_Circut said:
WHAT THE FUCK EVEN IS THIS FIGHT ANYMORE LOOOOOOOOL


HOW THE HELL CAN YOU JUST STAB A VIRUS. and if the white arrow can kill cells, then how come all the people who've died haven't disintegrated ala the virus

WHY THE FUCK DIDN'T MIRAI JUST LET GO AND RUN AWAY. bruhhhhhh in the time it took for those syringes to reach him both Saki and Hajime managed to get involved. And he so clearly went faster than the arrows to save Mukaidou so why the flying fuck didn't he just let go and run away lmao

WHY IS MIRAI ACTING LIKE A MORALFAG IN FRONT OF A LITERAL DERANGED BIOTERRORIST. like bro, I get he wants to not have to kill as many people as he can, but he of all people should know that not everyone has positive views. Man literally hears the word 'happiness' and begins to climax at the idea. damn this is like that Shield Hero situation all over again

WHY DOES MIRAI ACTUALLY THINK "EXPOSING" METROHIPSTER-KUN WOULD DO ANYTHING WHEN HE LITERALLY MURDERED 2 PEOPLE INCLUDING A CHILD ON LIVE TELEVISION AND NO ONE GAVE A SHIT







WHY DID UGLY BASTARD-KUN HAVE TO DIE FOR THIS SHIT

GhostCow said:
Didn't Mukaidou shoot Mirai with a red arrow? Then how come he isn't doing a single thing that Mukaidou is telling him to do? This show can't even follow it's own rules. Absolute trash.

Sigmar-Unberogen said:
Wow, so many edgelords in the comments...

People be hating on MC for not acting the way they would approve.
I for instance greatly respect MC and consider adding him into my favorites!
He's the rare type of person who stays true to his ideals/convictions, no matter what! That's such and underrated trait that is often seen by edgelords as weakness or naivety! (or absence o character development). In other words, people think MC should "grow some balls, or man up". Well here's a shocker... He's more manly than most of you!
To not give up on yourself when you meet great difficulties/chalanges in life - it's insanely hard and precisely why it's so rare and worth the praise!
MC values EVERY life, even if it's the life of a mortal enemy! People cry a lot about him being this way. They'd rather have him acting like your average human being and say "I'll make an exception and kill you, because I'm doing this in self-defense and shit". In other words, the majority would come up with a justification and be done with it.
MC is the type of guy who would rather die than kill someone. Imprint this in your heads and stop comparing this show with death note! It's been 12 episodes already. Get over it!

MC is selfish moral extremist. I get that killing someone is not what everyone can live with but somehow in Mirai's head he made this happiness rules, who he is to decide what is happines for other people? All people deserves happines? Murderers and rapists too? Jesus what a take.

If Metropoliman would get away again from this and continue with his plans, Mirai again failed in his goal. Because Metropoliman doesnt care about people and their happiness. So Mirais unability to kill him is cauing more unhappiness.

Sigmar-Unberogen said:
@Nagadir-chan
I don't think that's what MC meant. He isn't implying murderers and rapists (for instance) deserve happiness - the twisted way... (I mean, these people may well be raping and killing people to feel happy, right? so should they be allowed to do that? I don't think MC is implying something of the matter). I think, first of all, MC feels sorry for these people. The same rapists and murders likely lacked happiness in their lives hence why they turned into "rapists and murderers" to begin with. I think we can agree that no human is born evil. Every human deserves to be happy and experience what happiness means - THE USUAL WAY (which obviously doesn't include them feeling happiness by making others miserable). Sadly, children sometimes experience too much shit, abuse, terrible upbringing and hence turn into monsters, similar to who we see in this show. What MC is saying is that these people SHOULD'VE experienced happiness; they should've experienced happiness but didn't and hence why they're twisted now and why he can't bring himself to kill them because he knows all this could've been avoided if only they lived a happy life. Also, there's always some chance MC can win without murder so...

It certainly is risky to take prisoners... so should he go for the kill?

He should? But what if doesn't, and he succeeds?! Would you rather risk your life arresting a criminal to judge them for their crimes or kill them on the spot?

I mean, people sometimes say how (insert a mass-murderer name here) is a monster (meaning always was during his lifetime), and how it would be fine if someone did something as outrageous as time-travel to kill them before/ right after they were born. Even people like Hitler (for instance) deserved to be happy. You can interpret this as me saying "I wish Nazis had won and hence Hitler would be happy". No... when I say that I meant this: Was Hitler happy before he turned into a monster? No, he was constantly beaten by his dad, bullied at school, traumatized by the loss of a brother, then the mother he loved too much; was homeless for several years, lived in a society that was humiliated, impoverished and bullied by the victors. Had Hitler experienced happiness the average European/American experiences today, he wouldn't have become someone you'd wish you could kill today. But, sadly he didn't experience happiness, and you wish that he did, because then he would've been a completely different person!

This is how I think MC thinks and why I don't hate him at all or feel repulsed. After all, MC isn't some defenseless average human. He has wings and arrows; in other words, he has means to stop a criminal without killing them. I wonder how anyone can say MC is an egoist and a coward when he was desperately screaming and fighting Metropoliman's arrow with his own arrow after that tower-explosion scene! The way I see it, MC is devoted to his "faith". He has balls to take the 0.5% success chance option (route A) which may OR MAY NOT result in his own death and deaths of millions; instead of a 99.5% success chance option(Route B), even though route B guarantees millions of potential victims will be spared at a "minuscule" cost of MC's personal happiness (even though it's a fate worse than death for MC - to betray said "faith").

I kind of get it why so many would say MC is an egoist and a pussy or retarded considering lives of millions are at stake. "Who in their right mind" would take Route A, when Route B is clearly a win-win, right?
In other words, people expect MC to make sacrifices because that's what a "developed character" or a "grown up man" would do; and, completely neglect how amazing it is that MC isn't giving up on route A, which, as stupid as the odd looks, would still give way better results - IF SUCCESSFUL!

Remember when I said edgy, I meant this - People expect MC to stop being a "pussy who thinks about feelings" and sacrifice his "moral high ground and happiness" to save others lives and kill a dangerous criminal. Wouldn't this turn MC into an edgelord who than stays gloomy and depressed and scarred, unhappy with life even though he's a hero who saved everyone else's happiness?
I think it's the absence of faith in people that's the cause of this misunderstanding. I mean, there are religious people out there who would die for their faith. How many of us would die for our faith today? Throughout history, entire cities, towns and villages were massacred because inhabitants refused to betray their faith. Can you come out and call them selfish and stupid? Just because you (maybe) value your own skin more than some "morals or faith"? I wouldn't be surprised to hear YES, considering the era we live in today.
MC is a believer though. He may be wishing for a fairytale "everyone lived happily ever after" type of ending, but several times he had fought desperately, WITH HIS LIFE ON THE LINE, to make that dream a reality. Life is never so easy, but is it SO HARD for people to see and appreciate how MC is taking the worst odds to get that impossible 0.5% jackpot win??? That ugly-face dude eventually died instead of MC in the latest battle, but can you tell me that it's MC's fault, or he was too naive and should've killed the woman, hence avoiding that man's death? I'd say you're too harsh!

This is one twisted way of putting a blame on a "good guy" who did nothing wrong. MC knows Mertropoliman doesn't care, but MC is willing to risk own life to try and stop him and hence prevent more unhappiness. It all boils down to "It's not that Metropoliman is an actual POS of the story here, no... it's MC who's a POS for trying (so far unsuccessfully) to stop the villain without going for the kill!"
If we think that way, then tell me where we cross the line when deciding who dies and who doesn't (talking about criminals). Why shouldn't cops just kill murderers on the spot then? Why risk arresting these criminals or putting them in jail even though cops may die in an attempt to arrest them, and the criminal may run away and kill other innocent people as well? Is the justice system filled with egoists and pussies who should be executing criminals instead of trying to arrest them?

Well this show has some interesting ideas but is vommiting it in pretty bad way.
As an European your Hitler take is ridiculous. I know that he went through shit but it doesn't magically take the blame of what he did away from him, please just stop. Even if knowing this, that he had horrible childhood, he still deserved to be killed for what he was doing.

OK I can't get this. How can you like someone who is willing to risk lives of million by doing some stupid schtick instead of just putting the guy down immediately which would solve the problem without risking. MC here is winning because this is anime and everything is in his favour. If his risk would not work, then bye bye humanity. Excuse me? You are putting faith into someone like this? His morality has deep down nice core but he acts like a cultists about that and is endangering lives of other people just because of his morals despite he has strenght to end it very quickly instead of preaching.

Why making MC unhappy that he yes killed but saved a lot of people? You don't need to go from one extreme to another one. He would be a hero, he might feel a little bad but killing to save humanity and killing just because are two different things.

About what kind of faith you are talking about? Morals and faith are no problem it is the way how this show and MC is done. His faith and morals are in a way of saving the humanity.

This is a fantastical setting where murderer (Metropoliman) has supernatural abilities and power to easily escape justice of normal world. So yeah he should be put down.

And yes, MC unability to stop him is endangering a lot of people, because he could end it fast and save these people from Metropoliman but he has his stupid morals.

So yeah, if Metropoliman escapes again, every person dying because of him would also be MC fault because how this show is done.

And yeah I think horrible criminals deserve a death sentence.

If someone has ability to save someone he should do it, even if it would cost him his happiness, that is true heroism and true sacrifice.

Sigmar-Unberogen said:
@Nagadir-chan
Bruh... It's ridiculous how you jump to that conclusion when MC vs Metropoliman situation is exactly the same. MC isn't planning on befriending "Hitler". He wants to arrest him so he is later judged for his crimes. I'm not saying Hitler doesn't deserve death... There's a reason why they held Nuremberg trials instead of straight up executing Nazi leaders on the spot.
I've told you that it sounds stupid that MC is taking such a huge risk, but our opinions differ greatly on how we look at MC's in general it seems. I for once am not infuriated by MC's decision because it isn't alien or far-fetched in my opinion. I understand why he does things the way he does them. Some people seem to be personally offended by MC or something, even saying they'd rather see Metropoliman win, which is stupid!
Well that's the core of the problem here. You think that MC "might feel a little bad" and that's it; when in reality by becoming a murderer (no matter the honorable cause), MC will forever lose himself. In other words, he will die morally. I think people can't fathom how this is an issue and think it has to do something with cowardice or egoism.
No... Exactly because MC refuses to betray his morals, he would make a fine god! He isn't willing to make sacrifices and kill an enemy, even though millions in his place would've pulled the trigger already and constantly tell him to do the deed! You should try to understand MC's mindset more and why such resolve is admirable. The most extreme example would be Jesus. I mean, can you imagine Jesus committing sins out of convenience? Or smiting Romans and be like "F this, I ain't getting murdered by humans" and starts insta-killing his enemies because they gave them a reason. History knows plenty of people with conviction similar to Jesus or MC who stayed true to what they believe is true, despite the odds, despite people telling them to act differently, and still prevailed! Doesn't mean you have to like what he does or risks he's willing to take, but IMO hate is really undeserved here. I personally am nothing like MC, but can understand where he's coming from and respect his resolve. He is fanatical no doubt but are fanatics egoists? We can only judge MC at the end, I'd say. As you mentioned, this is an anime at the end of the day. If the god is almighty in this universe, he may well just reverse time or resurrect victims who died because of Metropoliman and others. End may yet justify the means. :)

Really though? Arguably there are plenty of dangerous, non superhuman villains out there that weren't executed on the spot (when arrested), but judged and kept in prisons. We don't live in stone age. We have laws. A criminal must be judged first, then executed if law demands. Metropoliman CAN be contained in the prison and executed later if deemed necessary.
MC is trying his best though. When it comes to Metropoliman, MC simply has to land a hit on him. When he has the option to hit him with a red arrow, there's no reason why he would choose white instead.
That's where we disagree as well. I don't think MC should be held accountable. It's not like he isn't trying. You are way too harsh on MC, one again demanding he grows a pair and pulls the trigger.
Won't argue much there, except we, the civilized world shouldn't stone criminals to death. They should be brought to justice and executed if deemed necessary later.
Well, MC believes he can and should stop the villain without killing him. He is ready to die trying to preserve this mindset. How is that less heroic? MC is risking his own life in order to save the life of an enemy! Of course he would like to avoid innocent people dying as well, but this is a hard task. It's not impossible but you should give MC some credit for doing his best to be this "Jesus figure". It's not like MC is faking this desire. It's a genuine desire to not kill anyone at all costs. It's SELFISH to demand MC should think otherwise.

Sigmar-Unberogen said:
@Nagadir-chan
Bruh... It's ridiculous how you jump to that conclusion when MC vs Metropoliman situation is exactly the same. MC isn't planning on befriending "Hitler". He wants to arrest him so he is later judged for his crimes. I'm not saying Hitler doesn't deserve death... There's a reason why they held Nuremberg trials instead of straight up executing Nazi leaders on the spot.
I've told you that it sounds stupid that MC is taking such a huge risk, but our opinions differ greatly on how we look at MC's in general it seems. I for once am not infuriated by MC's decision because it isn't alien or far-fetched in my opinion. I understand why he does things the way he does them. Some people seem to be personally offended by MC or something, even saying they'd rather see Metropoliman win, which is stupid!
Well that's the core of the problem here. You think that MC "might feel a little bad" and that's it; when in reality by becoming a murderer (no matter the honorable cause), MC will forever lose himself. In other words, he will die morally. I think people can't fathom how this is an issue and think it has to do something with cowardice or egoism.
No... Exactly because MC refuses to betray his morals, he would make a fine god! He isn't willing to make sacrifices and kill an enemy, even though millions in his place would've pulled the trigger already and constantly tell him to do the deed! You should try to understand MC's mindset more and why such resolve is admirable. The most extreme example would be Jesus. I mean, can you imagine Jesus committing sins out of convenience? Or smiting Romans and be like "F this, I ain't getting murdered by humans" and starts insta-killing his enemies because they gave them a reason. History knows plenty of people with conviction similar to Jesus or MC who stayed true to what they believe is true, despite the odds, despite people telling them to act differently, and still prevailed! Doesn't mean you have to like what he does or risks he's willing to take, but IMO hate is really undeserved here. I personally am nothing like MC, but can understand where he's coming from and respect his resolve. He is fanatical no doubt but are fanatics egoists? We can only judge MC at the end, I'd say. As you mentioned, this is an anime at the end of the day. If the god is almighty in this universe, he may well just reverse time or resurrect victims who died because of Metropoliman and others. End may yet justify the means. :)

Really though? Arguably there are plenty of dangerous, non superhuman villains out there that weren't executed on the spot (when arrested), but judged and kept in prisons. We don't live in stone age. We have laws. A criminal must be judged first, then executed if law demands. Metropoliman CAN be contained in the prison and executed later if deemed necessary.
MC is trying his best though. When it comes to Metropoliman, MC simply has to land a hit on him. When he has the option to hit him with a red arrow, there's no reason why he would choose white instead.
That's where we disagree as well. I don't think MC should be held accountable. It's not like he isn't trying. You are way too harsh on MC, one again demanding he grows a pair and pulls the trigger.
Won't argue much there, except we, the civilized world shouldn't stone criminals to death. They should be brought to justice and executed if deemed necessary later.
Well, MC believes he can and should stop the villain without killing him. He is ready to die trying to preserve this mindset. How is that less heroic? MC is risking his own life in order to save the life of an enemy! Of course he would like to avoid innocent people dying as well, but this is a hard task. It's not impossible but you should give MC some credit for doing his best to be this "Jesus figure". It's not like MC is faking this desire. It's a genuine desire to not kill anyone at all costs. It's SELFISH to demand MC should think otherwise.

What if your moral is to never kill a child and then terrorists would sent child bomber which can easily set the whole big building out? Hundreds of people dead because of your moral? What if there is no way then kill, because talking is not an option? What if it is a matter of seconds?

To other parts: Wishing that Hitler had his happiness won't change what happened. Same with Metropoliman, we are talking about what kind of person he is now, not what might have been. And now he is murdering psychopat.

I don't think sticking to your morals if they can endanger life is good.

MC's morals would be admirable if the show would not be making him so pathetic.

Mirai would not be a good God at all, because for his naive good morals, humanity would need to be without bad deeds and everyone would be happy.

MC is trying to stop Metropoliman pretty badly. But the main characters are acting hilariously bad without proper plans at all.

Who said something about stoning people to death? We have death sentences.

Sigmar-Unberogen said:
@Nagadir-chan
Well, the problem here is MC believes wholeheartedly that THERE IS A WAY to win in the situation without killing anyone. And, being honest - there is. Though, undoubtedly, it's way too hard and too risky to take that route.

About child-bombers.
Just as I said earlier, I don't have same conviction as MC and we are not alike, but I've known, and history has known such people, so that's precisely why I'm not agitated by his actions and actually admire his resolve, because I think it's actually a pretty strong trait. My problem with the viewers here is that they trash-talk MC. Why?

Monks and priests, for instance, devote their lives to faith and certain rules are sacred for them. They believe that murder of a human is an absolute taboo for instance. Even if a villain were to threaten them with annihilation unless they break their vows, it is still highly likely these people would choose annihilation 99 times out of 100.

If my family was threatened and I had a single bullet, I would likely try to kill the child-bomber. Someone, like MC, would risk aiming at the feet perhaps. MC here is "aiming at the feet" and people expect him to go for the head and call him egoistic and a pussy. I think that's wrong...

That is my biggest problem, MC is risking a lot just because of his morals, too much actually.
Who is he that he thinks risking so much is OK?

If he would be risking just his life OK, but he is not.

This is not just between him and Metropoliman, Metropoliman is not just trying to kill MC, but he doesnt care about innocent people and their lives. And that is why MC is pissing me off.

But because Metropoliman is taking innocent human lives into equtation I can't just shrugg it off, the risk is too high and MC has no right to decide that for millions of people.
It is usually people like this which believes they are doing good but in reality they do more damage then anyone.

Sigmar-Unberogen said:
@Nagadir-chan
Jesus man... He's a kid who "hasn't hurt a fly". MC is indeed risking a lot but why immediately assume he will fail. He certainly doesn't intend to fail! 0.5% success chance isn't 0% chance.

How is that MC's fault though??? It's the POS Metropoliman who makes things 1000 times worse. Also, there's no guarantee MC would win even if he tried to go for the kill anyways.
MC also doesn't want innocents to suffer, but killing someone is just out of the question here. That option doesn't exist, so he desperately seeks whatever else remains.

There goes the self-insert that's the big reason why people hate MC and this show in general. It's too little of "I feel this MC" and too much of "If I were MC, I would've done things differently" type of approach.
MC says he won't kill and that's an absolute rule. A man with such conviction is rare and very reliable. Men like MC wouldn't make exceptions when family members or rich/influential friends break rules for instance. He would judge everyone equally. Or are you saying you would prefer a god that tolerates evil as long as evil is necessary when saving more lives? A hypocrite god is better?
For instance, if MC becomes god, you can bet that he won't permit murders, no exceptions. He would instead punish criminals with other methods.
An average human would make exceptions out of convenience and I bet they would eventually turn into Yagami Light with own understanding of "justice". People with conviction such as MC, are less likely to be corrupted by power.
MC would greatly downgrade in my eyes if he breaks this rule because metropoliman is giving him a hard time. No is a No, not Maybe, unless or an IF.

FMmatron said:
Mukaido is safe going to die at the end of this battle. Hopefully he won't go out without getting shit done.

And lol, who else isn't irritated by Mirai?

Kayle_x_Morgana said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVxGmkk_3bw moist critikal was crying about it.

GhostCow said:
Didn't Mukaidou shoot Mirai with a red arrow? Then how come he isn't doing a single thing that Mukaidou is telling him to do? This show can't even follow it's own rules. Absolute trash.