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Sep 10, 2021 8:28 AM
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Apr 2016
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ChouEritto said:
JanPri said:

The same applies to 10. There is nothing that would be absolutely perfect.Of course, this is just my standart. 99% of the people here use the score system as they see fit (usually by their level of enjoyment), so there is really no "universal" standard for what makes a 1 or 10/10.
And yet you said quite clearly "no anime should be rated a 1 or 10" which is a definitive statement rather than a personal opinion, thus providing cognitive dissonance to your point. How people tend to ignore the guideline of what constitutes a certain score is not just irrelevant to the system itself when all it means are that many are using it incorrectly, but bringing it up to prove any sort of point despite you being very definitive in your initial point makes it doubly flawed. Either everyone has their own standard and the rating doesn't matter (as long as there's a clear consensus on what counts as good or bad) or there's a rigid standard to be used (of which there obviously isn't much to support as you even admit there's no universal standard).

The fact the lowest possible score here is 1/10 and not 0/10 really doesn't imply anything (let alone some minute level of competency), as it is the lowest possible score people can give and thus it can be argued that most, if not all, people here would just score 0/10 instead of 1/10 if it was possible.
Along with this being an assumption, it does nothing to support your point when all it speaks about is how someone would personally go about rating a work and would require genuine examples to be proven. Again, how one person interprets what a 1/10 represents may not be the same for another, making the idea that "nothing should be a 1/10" very silly.

The moment you have terrible story and character writing BUT amazing animation and art, the score should never fall lower than 5/10 (Something the people who didn't like Kimi no nawa don't seem to get, for example).
The reason being that the score is supposed to evaluate literally everything that encompasses the anime. It's supposed to be the average evaluation of all the aspects of the anime
Again, that's by your standard, not a universal one and certainly not MAL's with the very broad definition it gives, thereby making this point moot when speaking definitively as you are here.

even if the story is trash (which is subjective)
This is one thing that certainly isn't subjective. It's extremely easy to see if a story is poorly written by judging its internal consistency based on the rules and internal logic it applies and how well it sticks to them.
I know you're trying to sound very smart and all that, but why would you quote me again when I said "I think we can agree to disagree"?

Just a short reply. The very last one.
The same applies to 10. There is nothing that would be absolutely perfect.Of course, this is just my standart. 99% of the people here use the score system as they see fit (usually by their level of enjoyment), so there is really no "universal" standard for what makes a 1 or 10/10.
And yet you said quite clearly "no anime should be rated a 1 or 10" which is a definitive statement rather than a personal opinion, thus providing cognitive dissonance to your point.
I've just written what I thought and so I think it should be obvious it's my opinion. Or do I have to write "This is just my opinion and I have no credibility that would make my word an absolute objective truth" or something like that at the end of my every post???
Again, that's by your standard, not a universal one and certainly not MAL's with the very broad definition it gives, thereby making this point moot when speaking definitively as you are here.
If you would ever tried to write a review you'd might notice there are scores for every aspect of the anime and thus it's kinda logical (oh, I almost forgot, this is just my personal opinion and I have no credibility that would make my word an absolute objective truth) to think you are supposed to use the scoring system like that

This is one thing that certainly isn't subjective. It's extremely easy to see if a story is poorly written by judging its internal consistency based on the rules and internal logic it applies and how well it sticks to them.
If this is indeed the case then how would you explain the fact there are multiple literary critics and reviewers whose opinions very often (usually every time) widely divide when it comes to judging of a particular work?
JanPriSep 10, 2021 8:37 AM
Sep 10, 2021 9:44 AM
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Jun 2017
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JanPri said:
I know you're trying to sound very smart and all that, but why would you quote me again when I said "I think we can agree to disagree"?
When your reasoning is contradictive, it requires pointing out.

I've just written what I thought and so I think it should be obvious it's my opinion. Or do I have to write "This is just my opinion and I have no credibility that would make my word an absolute objective truth" or something like that at the end of my every post???
At best, one could only infer that your initial post was your opinion as you worded it in a very definitive manner. All that was required was saying "I believe" to clear that up, but the "muh opinion" shield still wouldn't shield it from any questionable aspects within your reasoning worth discussing.

If you would ever tried to write a review you'd might notice there are scores for every aspect of the anime and thus it's kinda logical (oh, I almost forgot, this is just my personal opinion and I have no credibility that would make my word an absolute objective truth) to think you are supposed to use the scoring system like that
Not only does the reviewing system's "overall" system only imply that it's a mean value, but the idea of basing a score on the mean value of the sum of its parts lies contradictory to how those in the creative circle view analysing their work in general. If there's one standard most people can agree is a universal one, it's that a work should be judged by how well it capture's the creator's vision, and you'll find in almost all such cases that the creator's go-to thoughts on the work will be on its story, characters or themes with very few writers or directors often putting similar emphasis on appraising or discussing the other elements during interviews unless specifically asked.
The divide in priorities between certain parts of a work are made even more obvious when, by design, anime/manga are a means of telling a story/exploring a concept through a visual means unless it's an obvious exception (eg. nobody's going to be unironically praising Inferno Cop's story). Visual aspects and sound would be necessary in conveying these elements, but view in or outside of its creation would argue they take precedence over the substantial aspects (plot, characters and maybe theme exploration).

Leaving all that aside though and just homing in on MAL's metric, there's some divide between the descriptions of its general rating compared to reviewing (eg. 4 is bad regularly, yet "decent" on the review page) and some very silly standards in the categories when it comes to giving them equal value (enjoyment should have no impact in rating a work based on its quality, let alone treating it equal to other elements), making using it as a solid standard still questionable at best when it seems even the site isn't too sure about what score definitively constitutes a certain aspect.

If this is indeed the case then how would you explain the fact there are multiple literary critics and reviewers whose opinions very often (usually every time) widely divide when it comes to judging of a particular work?
That's based more on their flawed perception of a work based on what is usually a lack of experience within the field (given the standard of what's needed to be an official "critic" nowadays is very slim) or willingly ignoring certain elements. For instance, most critics of modern films with undeniably poorly written plots (eg. The Last Jedi) ignore the plot holes within a work and focus on more vague aspects such as theme exploration (something entirely interpretive as opposed to something solidly quantified). In short, divisive analysises between critics/reviewers tend to be based either more on how they place value in sums of each part or being ignorant of certain aspects within the story, usually based on the limits of human memory.
A plot hole in an important story point makes the story undeniably bad, and it seems this not being obvious tends to be from people confusing plot holes with contrivances. A contrivance is lazy writing that is still plausible within the fictional universe, whereas a plot hole by definition is something that contradicts the established rules and stops a plot from functioning. The fact this even needs to be explained shows how little value is really placed into the understanding and appreciation of the craft of writing by many.

Moreover, people having differing interpretations doesn't invalidate objective standards existing, and this sort of idea shows how little people understand about objectivity. Objective reasoning only requires the removal of bias to create qualitative statements and not factoring in emotional or personal connections in the analysis, not that your interpretation has to be 100% fact. You can use objective reasoning and standards to answer a maths question and still get it incorrect, for instance.
ChouErittoOct 3, 2021 7:53 AM
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