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Attack on Titan
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Aug 12, 2021 3:07 PM
#1
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Nov 2020
176


“For, as I draw closer and closer to the end, I travel in the circle, nearer and nearer to the beginning”
-Charles Dickens, A Tale of Two Cities


AoT handles deaths in a somewhat unorthodox fashion to say the least. Most media and shows out there usually try to avoid killing central characters or at least give meaningful deaths to major characters. In shows like Naruto, for example, people die valiant deaths. They go down fighting, come to peace with their pasts, and meet their ends looking optimistically at the future.
AoT is kinda different in that regard.
Here, deaths are far from being honorable – they are pathetic and unheroic.
Let us observe some examples –

The 104 Cadet Corps Recruits and Survey Corps –

I legitimately thought guys like Mina, Thomas, Marco, Oluo, Petra and Mike were going to be main supporting characters. But guess what, not only do they die the cruelest deaths, their ends hardly matter if we consider the bigger picture. They do not get an epic heart touching monologue, they do not accept their fate with a smile. Everyone down in a state of shock and utmost horror, begging for their lives to beings as unfortunate and undignified as themselves. In Attack on Titan, sacrifices of the brave often end up changing nothing at all. But does that make their deaths meaningless? Absolutely not! Even if these deaths do not succeed in bringing the children out of the forest and creating up an ideal future, they will surely leave stories of martyrs on the pages of history, which would undoubtedly serve as beacons of light for the hopeless and inspiring accounts of valiance for those who want to fight and break free from their shackles.

Gross, the guy who killed Faye Yeager –

This was one of my favourite scenes in the show. Grisha, who’s about to be turned into a titan, confronts the man who killed his sister. What excuse, what justification does he give for this wretched murder of an innocent child?
He wants to steel himself against death, to purge the very fear of mortality from his soul. How does he want to achieve this? By killing Eldians and desensitizing himself from the terror of dying.
So how does he react when Kruger sends him tumbling down? How does he behave, knowing that he will be eaten alive by a monster of his creation, by someone whose life he ruined? Is he unwavering in his resolve to not fear death? Does he accept that his cruel fate is a consequence of his unfathomable sins?
Alas, no.
Just like every other human, the Marleyean dies screaming pathetically. The message is ironic. No matter how tough you try to act, or how “normal” you find Death, when it comes for you for real, you will be as terrified as the next guy.

Erwin Smith and Marlo Freudenberg–

These two are possibly the most intriguing of them all. Erwin Smith is perhaps one of if not the bravest of AoT characters. He is a hardened veteran who is unfazed by the deaths of his comrades. A cold and calculating tactician who gambles hundreds of lives for the slimmest of opportunities. A general brave enough to frighten the devil. Should not a man of that caliber face death with an arrogant smirk? To laugh at the very idea of being undone by something as simple as a flying rock?

His expression says differently. At the moment the rock strikes his stomach, we see a look of absolute unadulterated horror etched on his face. His bravado, intellect and resolve – all three are knocked out of him with just one fatal blow.
In his dying moments, he thinks not of the hundreds of souls he lead into a suicide charge, not of his duty as a commander. Rather, he dreams of his childhood, of the day he asked his father the question that would shape his life right up to the moment of his death.


Though much less memorable than the one previously described, the death of Marlo Freudenberg is by no means inferior when it comes to conveying the show’s idea of death. Marlo is a dedicated soldier with a one-track mind when it comes to his mission and the betterment of humanity. Things like love and intimacy are seemingly of no worth in his eyes; in fact the guy’s dense to the point that he seems to be completely oblivious to Hitch’s feelings towards him.
That is, until his very last moment.
True to his character, after Erwin is rendered incapable by Zeke’s barrage of rocks, its Marlo who takes charge and just like his commander, his reaction to certain death is, what some may call, “out of character.”
Faced with death, Marlo visualizes Hitch sleeping comfortably in a bed. He wishes he hadn’t gone, wishes that he had stayed by her side. It in this fit of wistfulness that he too meets the inevitable. To the superficial eye, this may seem contradictory and hence may be labelled as “bad/inconsistent writing”. “How did he suddenly start simping a girl he never paid any attention to?” is maybe something someone on the internet may end up saying. However it is this contradiction that makes AoT a realistic show, since in reality, people tend to be confused and conflicted and often take actions that are contradictory to their values. At the moment death becomes certain and the chances of survival become nil, one tends to see clearly the regrets and shortcomings of his life. Things that should’ve been said when there was still time, actions that could have been taken, and finally, the potential relationships that could’ve bloomed from buds into flowers if only there had been time. Hence one regretting and bemoaning about not being able to spend time with a girl he never paid attention to is not only consistent with the themes of the show, but also astoundingly heartbreaking and realistic since on the deathbed, every soul surely thinks about what it could never get hold of, regardless of how insignificant it may have seemed in day-to-day life.

This is something similar to a part of Chapter IX of Leo Tolstoy’s” The Death of Ivan Ilyich”, where we see a dying Court Official regretting his alienation from the blissful happiness of childhood, despite not sparing a minute to ponder on what he really wanted while in good health.
It basically goes like :
““What do you want? What do you want?” he repeated to himself.
“What do I want? To live and not to suffer,” he answered.
And again he listened with such concentrated attention that even his pain did not distract
him.
“To live? How?” asked his inner voice.
“Why, to live as I used to—well and pleasantly.”
“As you lived before, well and pleasantly?” the voice repeated.

And in imagination he began to recall the best moments of his pleasant life. But strange
to say none of those best moments of his pleasant life now seemed at all what they had then
seemed—none of them except the first recollections of childhood. There, in childhood, there had
been something really pleasant with which it would be possible to live if it could return. But the
child who had experienced that happiness existed no longer, it was like a reminiscence of
somebody else.”

Final thoughts –
I love how people in AoT die as flawed and weak individuals. If what we call “character” is a building made from bricks of experience and the cement of time, then it must tumble down when tested with the freak storm known as the Terror of Death; and when it does, surely the foundations will be left bare for all to see, including, of course, the dying man himself.

On a side note, I think all of the above are part of the reasons why I find the ending thematically consistent and satisfactory. But yeah, lets not spoil anime onlies here, this being an anime forum and all. Thank you for reading this long ass thesis, if you’ve made this far.










nhl2004Aug 12, 2021 3:11 PM
Aug 12, 2021 3:36 PM
#2
Offline
Mar 2021
97
Well it shows more of a reality aspect, not everyone will end up dying a hero and at the end of the day they are trying to survive, it gave me more of a realistic vibe than other shows which prefer making the audience happy by making everything peacefully done, it’s like “raw footage” letting us know not everything is alright and death can hit everyone anytime. Btw I liked the kind of analysis of your post need more people that can actually see bigger pictures!
Aug 12, 2021 3:42 PM
#3
Offline
Aug 2020
553
nhl2004 said:


“For, as I draw closer and closer to the end, I travel in the circle, nearer and nearer to the beginning”
-Charles Dickens, A Tale of Two Cities


AoT handles deaths in a somewhat unorthodox fashion to say the least. Most media and shows out there usually try to avoid killing central characters or at least give meaningful deaths to major characters. In shows like Naruto, for example, people die valiant deaths. They go down fighting, come to peace with their pasts, and meet their ends looking optimistically at the future.
AoT is kinda different in that regard.
Here, deaths are far from being honorable – they are pathetic and unheroic.
Let us observe some examples –

The 104 Cadet Corps Recruits and Survey Corps –

I legitimately thought guys like Mina, Thomas, Marco, Oluo, Petra and Mike were going to be main supporting characters. But guess what, not only do they die the cruelest deaths, their ends hardly matter if we consider the bigger picture. They do not get an epic heart touching monologue, they do not accept their fate with a smile. Everyone down in a state of shock and utmost horror, begging for their lives to beings as unfortunate and undignified as themselves. In Attack on Titan, sacrifices of the brave often end up changing nothing at all. But does that make their deaths meaningless? Absolutely not! Even if these deaths do not succeed in bringing the children out of the forest and creating up an ideal future, they will surely leave stories of martyrs on the pages of history, which would undoubtedly serve as beacons of light for the hopeless and inspiring accounts of valiance for those who want to fight and break free from their shackles.

Gross, the guy who killed Faye Yeager –

This was one of my favourite scenes in the show. Grisha, who’s about to be turned into a titan, confronts the man who killed his sister. What excuse, what justification does he give for this wretched murder of an innocent child?
He wants to steel himself against death, to purge the very fear of mortality from his soul. How does he want to achieve this? By killing Eldians and desensitizing himself from the terror of dying.
So how does he react when Kruger sends him tumbling down? How does he behave, knowing that he will be eaten alive by a monster of his creation, by someone whose life he ruined? Is he unwavering in his resolve to not fear death? Does he accept that his cruel fate is a consequence of his unfathomable sins?
Alas, no.
Just like every other human, the Marleyean dies screaming pathetically. The message is ironic. No matter how tough you try to act, or how “normal” you find Death, when it comes for you for real, you will be as terrified as the next guy.

Erwin Smith and Marlo Freudenberg–

These two are possibly the most intriguing of them all. Erwin Smith is perhaps one of if not the bravest of AoT characters. He is a hardened veteran who is unfazed by the deaths of his comrades. A cold and calculating tactician who gambles hundreds of lives for the slimmest of opportunities. A general brave enough to frighten the devil. Should not a man of that caliber face death with an arrogant smirk? To laugh at the very idea of being undone by something as simple as a flying rock?

His expression says differently. At the moment the rock strikes his stomach, we see a look of absolute unadulterated horror etched on his face. His bravado, intellect and resolve – all three are knocked out of him with just one fatal blow.
In his dying moments, he thinks not of the hundreds of souls he lead into a suicide charge, not of his duty as a commander. Rather, he dreams of his childhood, of the day he asked his father the question that would shape his life right up to the moment of his death.


Though much less memorable than the one previously described, the death of Marlo Freudenberg is by no means inferior when it comes to conveying the show’s idea of death. Marlo is a dedicated soldier with a one-track mind when it comes to his mission and the betterment of humanity. Things like love and intimacy are seemingly of no worth in his eyes; in fact the guy’s dense to the point that he seems to be completely oblivious to Hitch’s feelings towards him.
That is, until his very last moment.
True to his character, after Erwin is rendered incapable by Zeke’s barrage of rocks, its Marlo who takes charge and just like his commander, his reaction to certain death is, what some may call, “out of character.”
Faced with death, Marlo visualizes Hitch sleeping comfortably in a bed. He wishes he hadn’t gone, wishes that he had stayed by her side. It in this fit of wistfulness that he too meets the inevitable. To the superficial eye, this may seem contradictory and hence may be labelled as “bad/inconsistent writing”. “How did he suddenly start simping a girl he never paid any attention to?” is maybe something someone on the internet may end up saying. However it is this contradiction that makes AoT a realistic show, since in reality, people tend to be confused and conflicted and often take actions that are contradictory to their values. At the moment death becomes certain and the chances of survival become nil, one tends to see clearly the regrets and shortcomings of his life. Things that should’ve been said when there was still time, actions that could have been taken, and finally, the potential relationships that could’ve bloomed from buds into flowers if only there had been time. Hence one regretting and bemoaning about not being able to spend time with a girl he never paid attention to is not only consistent with the themes of the show, but also astoundingly heartbreaking and realistic since on the deathbed, every soul surely thinks about what it could never get hold of, regardless of how insignificant it may have seemed in day-to-day life.

This is something similar to a part of Chapter IX of Leo Tolstoy’s” The Death of Ivan Ilyich”, where we see a dying Court Official regretting his alienation from the blissful happiness of childhood, despite not sparing a minute to ponder on what he really wanted while in good health.
It basically goes like :
““What do you want? What do you want?” he repeated to himself.
“What do I want? To live and not to suffer,” he answered.
And again he listened with such concentrated attention that even his pain did not distract
him.
“To live? How?” asked his inner voice.
“Why, to live as I used to—well and pleasantly.”
“As you lived before, well and pleasantly?” the voice repeated.

And in imagination he began to recall the best moments of his pleasant life. But strange
to say none of those best moments of his pleasant life now seemed at all what they had then
seemed—none of them except the first recollections of childhood. There, in childhood, there had
been something really pleasant with which it would be possible to live if it could return. But the
child who had experienced that happiness existed no longer, it was like a reminiscence of
somebody else.”

Final thoughts –
I love how people in AoT die as flawed and weak individuals. If what we call “character” is a building made from bricks of experience and the cement of time, then it must tumble down when tested with the freak storm known as the Terror of Death; and when it does, surely the foundations will be left bare for all to see, including, of course, the dying man himself.

On a side note, I think all of the above are part of the reasons why I find the ending thematically consistent and satisfactory. But yeah, lets not spoil anime onlies here, this being an anime forum and all. Thank you for reading this long ass thesis, if you’ve made this far.











Although I definietly dislike the ending of Attack on titan your post acts as a pretty perfect reply to someone who says Eren's character was assassinated or at the very least helps to explain exactly what Isayama was thinking when he wrote that final chapter.
Aug 12, 2021 5:28 PM
#4

Offline
Aug 2019
1695
Very good post, and one of the few I enjoyed reading on here.

Like life itself, not everyone is given a heroic or touching send-off, and the realities of conflict and war can be unabashedly brutal and unforgiving.

It does deviate a lot from the typical shonen anime trope of giving characters elongated backstories in a cheap attempt to gain viewer sympathy before they die.

I mean how many people genuinely thought Petra was going to end up becoming a side-character that was going to at least last through until the end of the season?

I can remember vividly not really caring all that much about Sasha's death in S4P1 at the time, but over the course of the next few episodes, it was used as a tool to help formulate and then resolve conflict and unravel rooted ideologies between other characters like Gabi. I thought it was an interesting touch and retrospectively made Sasha's death that bit more meaningful.
Aug 12, 2021 5:54 PM
#5
Offline
Mar 2021
94
Aot was already my favorite story of all time. You just made me like it even more.
Aug 12, 2021 7:20 PM
#6

Offline
Jun 2020
260
Reminds me of Berserk.

While I find most deaths like Tomas and Mina were meant for shock value, I think there is some validity to your post.

A very well written post though!


Even If We Painstakingly Piece Together Something Lost, It Doesn't Mean Things Will Ever go Back To How They Were - Guts

Aug 12, 2021 7:41 PM
#7

Offline
Jun 2021
1207
Okㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤ
.
Aug 12, 2021 7:44 PM
#8

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May 2021
3513
wow so revolutionary killing characters which series do that often uhh games of something how was it called



Aug 12, 2021 9:16 PM
#9

Offline
May 2021
357
I really feel like people over-blow the amount of death in AOT. Everyone you mentioned above was just a side-character who had like 2 lines and were in the background of some scenes. I didn't even know who Thomas, Mina, and Mike were until I looked them up and I can't even remember if they had a single line. They were so obviously expendable Titan fodder written for the sole purpose of getting killed-off and its weird that people actually expected them to be main-players. What other main characters died besides Erwin, Sasha, and (MANGA SPOILER)? Its not like Game of Thrones which is a show that is so genuinely unafraid to kill a main character (final two seasons aside)
HakeemPAug 13, 2021 12:17 AM
Avatar: The Last Airbender is an anime
Aug 12, 2021 9:24 PM
Offline
Jul 2018
564612
nhl2004 said:


“For, as I draw closer and closer to the end, I travel in the circle, nearer and nearer to the beginning”
-Charles Dickens, A Tale of Two Cities


AoT handles deaths in a somewhat unorthodox fashion to say the least. Most media and shows out there usually try to avoid killing central characters or at least give meaningful deaths to major characters. In shows like Naruto, for example, people die valiant deaths. They go down fighting, come to peace with their pasts, and meet their ends looking optimistically at the future.
AoT is kinda different in that regard.
Here, deaths are far from being honorable – they are pathetic and unheroic.
Let us observe some examples –

The 104 Cadet Corps Recruits and Survey Corps –

I legitimately thought guys like Mina, Thomas, Marco, Oluo, Petra and Mike were going to be main supporting characters. But guess what, not only do they die the cruelest deaths, their ends hardly matter if we consider the bigger picture. They do not get an epic heart touching monologue, they do not accept their fate with a smile. Everyone down in a state of shock and utmost horror, begging for their lives to beings as unfortunate and undignified as themselves. In Attack on Titan, sacrifices of the brave often end up changing nothing at all. But does that make their deaths meaningless? Absolutely not! Even if these deaths do not succeed in bringing the children out of the forest and creating up an ideal future, they will surely leave stories of martyrs on the pages of history, which would undoubtedly serve as beacons of light for the hopeless and inspiring accounts of valiance for those who want to fight and break free from their shackles.

Gross, the guy who killed Faye Yeager –

This was one of my favourite scenes in the show. Grisha, who’s about to be turned into a titan, confronts the man who killed his sister. What excuse, what justification does he give for this wretched murder of an innocent child?
He wants to steel himself against death, to purge the very fear of mortality from his soul. How does he want to achieve this? By killing Eldians and desensitizing himself from the terror of dying.
So how does he react when Kruger sends him tumbling down? How does he behave, knowing that he will be eaten alive by a monster of his creation, by someone whose life he ruined? Is he unwavering in his resolve to not fear death? Does he accept that his cruel fate is a consequence of his unfathomable sins?
Alas, no.
Just like every other human, the Marleyean dies screaming pathetically. The message is ironic. No matter how tough you try to act, or how “normal” you find Death, when it comes for you for real, you will be as terrified as the next guy.

Erwin Smith and Marlo Freudenberg–

These two are possibly the most intriguing of them all. Erwin Smith is perhaps one of if not the bravest of AoT characters. He is a hardened veteran who is unfazed by the deaths of his comrades. A cold and calculating tactician who gambles hundreds of lives for the slimmest of opportunities. A general brave enough to frighten the devil. Should not a man of that caliber face death with an arrogant smirk? To laugh at the very idea of being undone by something as simple as a flying rock?

His expression says differently. At the moment the rock strikes his stomach, we see a look of absolute unadulterated horror etched on his face. His bravado, intellect and resolve – all three are knocked out of him with just one fatal blow.
In his dying moments, he thinks not of the hundreds of souls he lead into a suicide charge, not of his duty as a commander. Rather, he dreams of his childhood, of the day he asked his father the question that would shape his life right up to the moment of his death.


Though much less memorable than the one previously described, the death of Marlo Freudenberg is by no means inferior when it comes to conveying the show’s idea of death. Marlo is a dedicated soldier with a one-track mind when it comes to his mission and the betterment of humanity. Things like love and intimacy are seemingly of no worth in his eyes; in fact the guy’s dense to the point that he seems to be completely oblivious to Hitch’s feelings towards him.
That is, until his very last moment.
True to his character, after Erwin is rendered incapable by Zeke’s barrage of rocks, its Marlo who takes charge and just like his commander, his reaction to certain death is, what some may call, “out of character.”
Faced with death, Marlo visualizes Hitch sleeping comfortably in a bed. He wishes he hadn’t gone, wishes that he had stayed by her side. It in this fit of wistfulness that he too meets the inevitable. To the superficial eye, this may seem contradictory and hence may be labelled as “bad/inconsistent writing”. “How did he suddenly start simping a girl he never paid any attention to?” is maybe something someone on the internet may end up saying. However it is this contradiction that makes AoT a realistic show, since in reality, people tend to be confused and conflicted and often take actions that are contradictory to their values. At the moment death becomes certain and the chances of survival become nil, one tends to see clearly the regrets and shortcomings of his life. Things that should’ve been said when there was still time, actions that could have been taken, and finally, the potential relationships that could’ve bloomed from buds into flowers if only there had been time. Hence one regretting and bemoaning about not being able to spend time with a girl he never paid attention to is not only consistent with the themes of the show, but also astoundingly heartbreaking and realistic since on the deathbed, every soul surely thinks about what it could never get hold of, regardless of how insignificant it may have seemed in day-to-day life.

This is something similar to a part of Chapter IX of Leo Tolstoy’s” The Death of Ivan Ilyich”, where we see a dying Court Official regretting his alienation from the blissful happiness of childhood, despite not sparing a minute to ponder on what he really wanted while in good health.
It basically goes like :
““What do you want? What do you want?” he repeated to himself.
“What do I want? To live and not to suffer,” he answered.
And again he listened with such concentrated attention that even his pain did not distract
him.
“To live? How?” asked his inner voice.
“Why, to live as I used to—well and pleasantly.”
“As you lived before, well and pleasantly?” the voice repeated.

And in imagination he began to recall the best moments of his pleasant life. But strange
to say none of those best moments of his pleasant life now seemed at all what they had then
seemed—none of them except the first recollections of childhood. There, in childhood, there had
been something really pleasant with which it would be possible to live if it could return. But the
child who had experienced that happiness existed no longer, it was like a reminiscence of
somebody else.”

Final thoughts –
I love how people in AoT die as flawed and weak individuals. If what we call “character” is a building made from bricks of experience and the cement of time, then it must tumble down when tested with the freak storm known as the Terror of Death; and when it does, surely the foundations will be left bare for all to see, including, of course, the dying man himself.

On a side note, I think all of the above are part of the reasons why I find the ending thematically consistent and satisfactory. But yeah, lets not spoil anime onlies here, this being an anime forum and all. Thank you for reading this long ass thesis, if you’ve made this far.













All Deaths of Attack on Titan are Shock Values
Erwin's Death was the only good ones
Others just feel like Slasher films with no Character Development whatsover
Aug 12, 2021 10:58 PM
Offline
Sep 2020
270
AOT is one of those anime which is too realistic. The world itself is a cruel world, there is no morality, there is no difference between good and evil or right and wrong. There is no conception of salvation. The only choice in that world is to kill or to get killed, Thats how it works. If you still feel like it isn't appealing, then just think how many people die a meaningful death in real life or how many heros have died a meaningful death in history.

Every show doesn't need to be realistic or like AOT, Show like Naruto and FMAB are too shonen but still damn enjoyable. Don't get me wrong :)
AnimefandarshAug 12, 2021 11:02 PM
Aug 12, 2021 11:38 PM
Offline
Jun 2021
86
SPOILER ALERT Everyone dies in the anime in the first two episodes the most deaths accured in the start of the series it was just like they were normal titans not people controlling them.

In the second season there was sad deaths like Ymir (no not Ymir Fritz) Hannes and more season 3 episode 18 was really a very sad episode but someone died that was a very painful death but very happy guess who it is it's Bertolt the way Eren kills him is so satisfyingly and oh boy here we go...

The 4th Season this heartbreaks it shows how evil titans and human beings can be ANOTHER SPOILER ALERT Eren kills 80% of the world

Season 4 Part 2... Now this is one hell of a trainwreck Hange died... Pixis died... And Levi dosen't die but he gets hella injured overall it got more violent overtime and when the anime of season 4 Part 2 comes out I'm sure that your gonna have to prepare your eyes
A bad anime what do you do. Ignore It.

What do you do on MAL when you see a bad anime. Drop it Obviously
Aug 13, 2021 1:05 AM
Offline
Dec 2020
7
I really enjoyed reading your analysis and certainly agree that the portrayal of death in AOT is refreshingly more authentic. Personally, I would go as far to argue that the clearly defined and definitively presented "honourable death" trope shown in many shonen series (in which the hero calmly passes away in a very composed and dignified manner) rarely exists in real life, if ever. Erwin's death appears much more realistic when compared to real soldier reactions from stories I've heard from my partner's military superiors. Don't get me wrong - the more positive and feel good portrayal of meaningful deaths in media certainly has its place but its a shame that presentations of death like in AOT is considered unorthodox and rare. However, I suppose it's to be expected with advancing technology and its impact on death perspectives. As Philippe Aries (2004) noted in his analysis of the Western cultural view of death, it is now mostly denied, hidden, and seen as a medical science failure. Obviously AOT is not Western media but I would argue that East Asian countries also view death similarly but potentially to a lesser degree.
Aug 13, 2021 1:20 AM
Offline
Jun 2021
86
[quote=AnViewerOiuplasg message=64109503]SPOILER ALERT Everyone dies in the anime in the first two episodes the most deaths accured in the start of the series it was just like they were normal titans not people controlling them.

In the second season there was sad deaths like Ymir (no not Ymir Fritz) Hannes and more season 3 episode 18 was really a very sad episode but someone died that was a very painful death but very happy guess who it is it's Bertolt the way Eren kills him is so satisfyingly and oh boy here we go...

The 4th Season this heartbreaks it shows how evil titans and human beings can be ANOTHER SPOILER ALERT Eren kills 80% of the world

Season 4 Part 2... Now this is one hell of a trainwreck Hange died... Pixis died... And Levi dosen't die but he gets hella injured overall it got more violent overtime and when the anime of season 4 Part 2 comes out I'm sure that your gonna have to prepare your eyes
A bad anime what do you do. Ignore It.

What do you do on MAL when you see a bad anime. Drop it Obviously
Aug 13, 2021 1:31 AM
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Jun 2021
3
My anime No. 1 進撃の巨人
Aug 13, 2021 1:34 AM
Offline
Nov 2020
176
HakeemP said:
I really feel like people over-blow the amount of death in AOT. Everyone you mentioned above was just a side-character who had like 2 lines and were in the background of some scenes. I didn't even know who Thomas, Mina, and Mike were until I looked them up and I can't even remember if they had a single line. They were so obviously expendable Titan fodder written for the sole purpose of getting killed-off and its weird that people actually expected them to be main-players. What other main characters died besides Erwin, Sasha, and (MANGA SPOILER)? Its not like Game of Thrones which is a show that is so genuinely unafraid to kill a main character (final two seasons aside)






Thats hindsight. In the Trost Arc, Characters like Mina, Thomas, Marco, all had similar screentime to the likes of Ymir, Historia, Connie and so on. They could've well gone on to become part of the main cast. Same goes with Mike. he was introduced as the 2nd strongest soldier of humanity after only Levi. Definitely had potential to be a main character. So yeah, when I first watched, I definitely expected these guys to at least survive the first arc lol
Aug 13, 2021 9:17 AM

Offline
May 2021
357
nhl2004 said:
HakeemP said:
I really feel like people over-blow the amount of death in AOT. Everyone you mentioned above was just a side-character who had like 2 lines and were in the background of some scenes. I didn't even know who Thomas, Mina, and Mike were until I looked them up and I can't even remember if they had a single line. They were so obviously expendable Titan fodder written for the sole purpose of getting killed-off and its weird that people actually expected them to be main-players. What other main characters died besides Erwin, Sasha, and (MANGA SPOILER)? Its not like Game of Thrones which is a show that is so genuinely unafraid to kill a main character (final two seasons aside)






Thats hindsight. In the Trost Arc, Characters like Mina, Thomas, Marco, all had similar screentime to the likes of Ymir, Historia, Connie and so on. They could've well gone on to become part of the main cast. Same goes with Mike. he was introduced as the 2nd strongest soldier of humanity after only Levi. Definitely had potential to be a main character. So yeah, when I first watched, I definitely expected these guys to at least survive the first arc lol
did we watch the same show? None of those people even had a fraction of the screentime Ymir, Historia and Connie had
Avatar: The Last Airbender is an anime
Aug 13, 2021 9:20 AM
Offline
Nov 2020
176
HakeemP said:
nhl2004 said:






Thats hindsight. In the Trost Arc, Characters like Mina, Thomas, Marco, all had similar screentime to the likes of Ymir, Historia, Connie and so on. They could've well gone on to become part of the main cast. Same goes with Mike. he was introduced as the 2nd strongest soldier of humanity after only Levi. Definitely had potential to be a main character. So yeah, when I first watched, I definitely expected these guys to at least survive the first arc lol
did we watch the same show? None of those people even had a fraction of the screentime Ymir, Historia and Connie had


In the Trost arc before the titans breached through the walls, yes. None of them were focussed on specifically except the main trio and Jean. Historia, Connie and Ymir only got great amounts of time in the second arc and importantly, in s2 and s3
nhl2004Aug 13, 2021 9:30 AM
Aug 13, 2021 9:22 AM

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Jul 2019
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I agree that people usually die in aot. Idk it if goes that far tho.
Aug 13, 2021 9:38 AM

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Aerosmith224 said:
nhl2004 said:


“For, as I draw closer and closer to the end, I travel in the circle, nearer and nearer to the beginning”
-Charles Dickens, A Tale of Two Cities


AoT handles deaths in a somewhat unorthodox fashion to say the least. Most media and shows out there usually try to avoid killing central characters or at least give meaningful deaths to major characters. In shows like Naruto, for example, people die valiant deaths. They go down fighting, come to peace with their pasts, and meet their ends looking optimistically at the future.
AoT is kinda different in that regard.
Here, deaths are far from being honorable – they are pathetic and unheroic.
Let us observe some examples –

The 104 Cadet Corps Recruits and Survey Corps –

I legitimately thought guys like Mina, Thomas, Marco, Oluo, Petra and Mike were going to be main supporting characters. But guess what, not only do they die the cruelest deaths, their ends hardly matter if we consider the bigger picture. They do not get an epic heart touching monologue, they do not accept their fate with a smile. Everyone down in a state of shock and utmost horror, begging for their lives to beings as unfortunate and undignified as themselves. In Attack on Titan, sacrifices of the brave often end up changing nothing at all. But does that make their deaths meaningless? Absolutely not! Even if these deaths do not succeed in bringing the children out of the forest and creating up an ideal future, they will surely leave stories of martyrs on the pages of history, which would undoubtedly serve as beacons of light for the hopeless and inspiring accounts of valiance for those who want to fight and break free from their shackles.

Gross, the guy who killed Faye Yeager –

This was one of my favourite scenes in the show. Grisha, who’s about to be turned into a titan, confronts the man who killed his sister. What excuse, what justification does he give for this wretched murder of an innocent child?
He wants to steel himself against death, to purge the very fear of mortality from his soul. How does he want to achieve this? By killing Eldians and desensitizing himself from the terror of dying.
So how does he react when Kruger sends him tumbling down? How does he behave, knowing that he will be eaten alive by a monster of his creation, by someone whose life he ruined? Is he unwavering in his resolve to not fear death? Does he accept that his cruel fate is a consequence of his unfathomable sins?
Alas, no.
Just like every other human, the Marleyean dies screaming pathetically. The message is ironic. No matter how tough you try to act, or how “normal” you find Death, when it comes for you for real, you will be as terrified as the next guy.

Erwin Smith and Marlo Freudenberg–

These two are possibly the most intriguing of them all. Erwin Smith is perhaps one of if not the bravest of AoT characters. He is a hardened veteran who is unfazed by the deaths of his comrades. A cold and calculating tactician who gambles hundreds of lives for the slimmest of opportunities. A general brave enough to frighten the devil. Should not a man of that caliber face death with an arrogant smirk? To laugh at the very idea of being undone by something as simple as a flying rock?

His expression says differently. At the moment the rock strikes his stomach, we see a look of absolute unadulterated horror etched on his face. His bravado, intellect and resolve – all three are knocked out of him with just one fatal blow.
In his dying moments, he thinks not of the hundreds of souls he lead into a suicide charge, not of his duty as a commander. Rather, he dreams of his childhood, of the day he asked his father the question that would shape his life right up to the moment of his death.


Though much less memorable than the one previously described, the death of Marlo Freudenberg is by no means inferior when it comes to conveying the show’s idea of death. Marlo is a dedicated soldier with a one-track mind when it comes to his mission and the betterment of humanity. Things like love and intimacy are seemingly of no worth in his eyes; in fact the guy’s dense to the point that he seems to be completely oblivious to Hitch’s feelings towards him.
That is, until his very last moment.
True to his character, after Erwin is rendered incapable by Zeke’s barrage of rocks, its Marlo who takes charge and just like his commander, his reaction to certain death is, what some may call, “out of character.”
Faced with death, Marlo visualizes Hitch sleeping comfortably in a bed. He wishes he hadn’t gone, wishes that he had stayed by her side. It in this fit of wistfulness that he too meets the inevitable. To the superficial eye, this may seem contradictory and hence may be labelled as “bad/inconsistent writing”. “How did he suddenly start simping a girl he never paid any attention to?” is maybe something someone on the internet may end up saying. However it is this contradiction that makes AoT a realistic show, since in reality, people tend to be confused and conflicted and often take actions that are contradictory to their values. At the moment death becomes certain and the chances of survival become nil, one tends to see clearly the regrets and shortcomings of his life. Things that should’ve been said when there was still time, actions that could have been taken, and finally, the potential relationships that could’ve bloomed from buds into flowers if only there had been time. Hence one regretting and bemoaning about not being able to spend time with a girl he never paid attention to is not only consistent with the themes of the show, but also astoundingly heartbreaking and realistic since on the deathbed, every soul surely thinks about what it could never get hold of, regardless of how insignificant it may have seemed in day-to-day life.

This is something similar to a part of Chapter IX of Leo Tolstoy’s” The Death of Ivan Ilyich”, where we see a dying Court Official regretting his alienation from the blissful happiness of childhood, despite not sparing a minute to ponder on what he really wanted while in good health.
It basically goes like :
““What do you want? What do you want?” he repeated to himself.
“What do I want? To live and not to suffer,” he answered.
And again he listened with such concentrated attention that even his pain did not distract
him.
“To live? How?” asked his inner voice.
“Why, to live as I used to—well and pleasantly.”
“As you lived before, well and pleasantly?” the voice repeated.

And in imagination he began to recall the best moments of his pleasant life. But strange
to say none of those best moments of his pleasant life now seemed at all what they had then
seemed—none of them except the first recollections of childhood. There, in childhood, there had
been something really pleasant with which it would be possible to live if it could return. But the
child who had experienced that happiness existed no longer, it was like a reminiscence of
somebody else.”

Final thoughts –
I love how people in AoT die as flawed and weak individuals. If what we call “character” is a building made from bricks of experience and the cement of time, then it must tumble down when tested with the freak storm known as the Terror of Death; and when it does, surely the foundations will be left bare for all to see, including, of course, the dying man himself.

On a side note, I think all of the above are part of the reasons why I find the ending thematically consistent and satisfactory. But yeah, lets not spoil anime onlies here, this being an anime forum and all. Thank you for reading this long ass thesis, if you’ve made this far.













All Deaths of Attack on Titan are Shock Values
Erwin's Death was the only good ones
Others just feel like Slasher films with no Character Development whatsover
>Forced Elitism, no arguments to be found.
You're getting desperate with your baiting, mate. Could use some subtlety.
Aug 13, 2021 10:19 AM
Offline
Jul 2018
564612
[/quote]
All Deaths of Attack on Titan are Shock Values
Erwin's Death was the only good ones
Others just feel like Slasher films with no Character Development whatsover[/quote]>Forced Elitism, no arguments to be found.
You're getting desperate with your baiting, mate. Could use some subtlety.[/quote]

When all facts go over your head you can just call it forced Elitism
Lmao
Explain my invalid points
Aug 13, 2021 10:40 AM
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Nov 2020
176
Alvacka97 said:
Aerosmith224 said:



All Deaths of Attack on Titan are Shock Values
Erwin's Death was the only good ones
Others just feel like Slasher films with no Character Development whatsover
>Forced Elitism, no arguments to be found.
You're getting desperate with your baiting, mate. Could use some subtlety.


Let trolls be trolls. Their self worth hinges on successfully annoying other people
Aug 13, 2021 8:47 PM
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Mar 2021
228
This is what separates attack on Titan from generic shounen, and what defines it a masterpiece. The unpredictable story layered in mazes of plot twists are some of the biggest contributors to the show’s popularity and status. As you stated, in other generic shounen, such as Naruto, the story almost always goes “well”, or in a expectable way. Most named characters don’t die a meaningless death, and the protagonist and their “buddies” have insane plot armor. These are the reasons why I so strongly dislike shows like Naruto, giving them a 4 to maybe a 6, yet I easily give attack on Titan a 10/10.
Aug 14, 2021 6:35 AM
Demon of Hatred

Offline
Feb 2015
2228
AoT has only killed 3 important characters during the whole runtime, all the other deaths in the show have been purely for shock value. In the meanwhile, the shitty author refuses to do anything to the main trio as well as fans' personal darling Levi. Only if the author has guts to do something to them, I will find the deaths to be credible but alas, the author has 0 balls.

Stuff like Madoka, and even the shitty Akame ga Kill does a better job than AoT at killing "important" characters.
"Life is too bitter, so coffee, at least should be sweet..." - Hikigaya Hachiman (Yahari Ore no Seishun Love Come wa Machigatte Iru)
Aug 15, 2021 1:46 AM

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Nov 2020
1513
cchigu said:
AoT has only killed 3 important characters during the whole runtime, all the other deaths in the show have been purely for shock value. In the meanwhile, the shitty author refuses to do anything to the main trio as well as fans' personal darling Levi. Only if the author has guts to do something to them, I will find the deaths to be credible but alas, the author has 0 balls.

Stuff like Madoka, and even the shitty Akame ga Kill does a better job than AoT at killing "important" characters.
Wait how did the Writer 'refuses to do anything to the main trio'? Armin was fking burned and was only saved bc of Titan serum. Eren was on the brink of his death, got his leg and arm cut off when the abnormal titan ate him in Trost District Arc. And about Killing characters [Everything upto Anime covered as I am an anime only], these following characters have died-

1. Marco
2. Carla Yeager
3. Petra
4. Hannes
5. Dina Fritz
6. Grisha Yeager
7. Erwin Smith
8. Sasha
9. Kenny Ackermann
10. Eren Kruger
11. Ymir [Historia's partner]
12. Willy Tybur
13. Zachary

And all of these are important characters, so idk where's your 3 imp. character is coming from.

═════════════════════════════
You're going to be all right. You just stumbled over a stone in the road.
It means nothing. Your goal lies far beyond this. Doesn't it?
I'm sure you'll overcome this.
You'll walk again... soon.

═════════════════════════════
Aug 15, 2021 5:54 AM

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Feb 2020
1642
most people who died in Aot are bland supporting characters anyway.

this bland statist Marco for example. i never get the crying in the fandom back then.
yeah he had influenced Jean but that's all.

or second strongest soldier after Levi, this Mike guy.
meh.

and Sasha after she saved Kaya in season 2 (what was a really great scene) she was literally a bad potato joke in the fandom.

but Aot has also the message "for the greater good".


with execption of Erwin
no death in Aot had a special impact on me.
Aug 15, 2021 1:49 PM
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Nov 2020
176
animu007 said:
most people who died in Aot are bland supporting characters anyway.

this bland statist Marco for example. i never get the crying in the fandom back then.
yeah he had influenced Jean but that's all.

or second strongest soldier after Levi, this Mike guy.
meh.

and Sasha after she saved Kaya in season 2 (what was a really great scene) she was literally a bad potato joke in the fandom.

but Aot has also the message "for the greater good".


with execption of Erwin
no death in Aot had a special impact on me.


Well.... I wasnt talking about the writing or importance of the characters who died, but rather the philosophy behind these deaths and how they succeed at portraying war/death realistically. The bigger picture basically

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