| What the title said ^, curious why people think this way, Mushoku Tensei started as a Web Novel on November 2012(Correct me if I'm wrong), and there are some modern isekai that were written before Mushoku Tensei or even before the isekai craze started, and I'm not talking about old obscure titles. |
GilgameshuuJan 3, 2021 6:27 AM
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Gilgameshuu said: Popularity among the WN fan I guess. Back in 2013 I heard a lot about Mushoku Tensei among LN/WN fans but few talks about Re:Zero or KonoSuba. Also consider that most isekai WN are published in a website called Shousetsuka ni Narou which is kinda like the Japanese wattpad.What the title said ^, curious why people think this way, Mushoku Tensei started as a Web Novel on November 2012(Correct me if I'm wrong), and there are some modern isekai that were written before Mushoku Tensei or even before the isekai craze started, and I'm not talking about old obscure titles. |
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Desolated said: Gilgameshuu said: Popularity among the WN fan I guess. Back in 2013 I heard a lot about Mushoku Tensei among LN/WN fans but few talks about Re:Zero or KonoSuba.What the title said ^, curious why people think this way, Mushoku Tensei started as a Web Novel on November 2012(Correct me if I'm wrong), and there are some modern isekai that were written before Mushoku Tensei or even before the isekai craze started, and I'm not talking about old obscure titles. Yeah maybe. Re:Zero actually started much earlier compared to Mushoku Tensei, the Re:Zero Web Novel began on April 2012, 7 months before Mushoku Tensei started on November. |
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| I guess because people are stupid and it was their first novel or something. Hagure Yuusha no Aesthetica made fun of the meta years prior. |
| Well, I kinda remember people were talking about this webnovel even before rezero S1 get anime adaptation. This series was more popular in the LN/WN back then even before we even have a label category for "isekai" |
Fuwa_sanJan 3, 2021 3:41 PM
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| From my understanding Mushoku Tensei is the origin of the "hit by a truck" trope. its actually the origin/inspiration for pretty much all of the tropes for the modern isekai wave of shows we've had in recent years. its called "godfather of Isekai" or something similar as it was the forerunner for the modern Isekai fomula. It's why it sounds so generic, neet/deadbeat mc who is a pervert, every flavor of waifu, sword and magic world etc. I believe there were a few that were similar after SAO took off, but this is the webnovel that became immensely popular and basically helped spark the isekai craze and define the genre. |
AGlitchGnome said: From my understanding Mushoku Tensei is the origin of the "hit by a truck" trope. its actually the origin/inspiration for pretty much all of the tropes for the modern isekai wave of shows we've had in recent years. its called "godfather of Isekai" or something similar as it was the forerunner for the modern Isekai fomula. It's why it sounds so generic, neet/deadbeat mc who is a pervert, every flavor of waifu, sword and magic world etc. I believe there were a few that were similar after SAO took off, but this is the webnovel that became immensely popular and basically helped spark the isekai craze and define the genre. Hmm I see... but people really like to overexaggerate everything, I keep seeing online about people claiming that it's the progenitor of the isekai genre and that every modern isekai is just a failed copy of Mushoku Tensei or some bs. |
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Gilgameshuu said: Knight's and Magic used the'' otaku gets hit by oncomming traffic and gets reincarnated into a fantasy world where he's awesome'' trope back in 2010.AGlitchGnome said: From my understanding Mushoku Tensei is the origin of the "hit by a truck" trope. its actually the origin/inspiration for pretty much all of the tropes for the modern isekai wave of shows we've had in recent years. its called "godfather of Isekai" or something similar as it was the forerunner for the modern Isekai fomula. It's why it sounds so generic, neet/deadbeat mc who is a pervert, every flavor of waifu, sword and magic world etc. I believe there were a few that were similar after SAO took off, but this is the webnovel that became immensely popular and basically helped spark the isekai craze and define the genre. Hmm I see... but people really like to overexaggerate everything, I keep seeing online about people claiming that it's the progenitor of the isekai genre and that every modern isekai is just a failed copy of Mushoku Tensei or some bs. |
Roevhaal said: Gilgameshuu said: Knight's and Magic used the'' otaku gets hit by oncomming traffic and gets reincarnated into a fantasy world where he's awesome'' trope back in 2010.Hmm I see... but people really like to overexaggerate everything, I keep seeing online about people claiming that it's the progenitor of the isekai genre and that every modern isekai is just a failed copy of Mushoku Tensei or some bs. So Mushoku Tensei being the father of isekai is just self-proclaimed by the fans? It's less of a trope inventor and actually more of a trope combiner. It just takes all the tropes of earlier isekai and puts them into one. Becomes popular and somehow the fans believe it started it all. The way I see it is that it's the most generic isekai of all time, am I wrong? Although being generic doesn't mean it's bad, it all comes down to execution it's just that it's quite unoriginal. |
GilgameshuuJan 3, 2021 8:03 PM
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Gilgameshuu said: It can't be the most generic isekai of all time since Isekai Cheat Magician exists but yea it's just a part of the explosion of isekai novels. Isekai was already branching out all over the place by this time, some other titles that started in 2012-2013 are: Overlord, Youjo Senki, Re:Zero, TenSura, Isekai wa Smartphone, Death March, Bookworm, Konosuba, Hachinan tte, Arifureta, Tate no Yuusha and of course Isekai Cheat Magician.Roevhaal said: Knight's and Magic used the'' otaku gets hit by oncomming traffic and gets reincarnated into a fantasy world where he's awesome'' trope back in 2010. So Mushoku Tensei being the father of isekai is just self-proclaimed by the fans? It's less of a trope inventor and actually more of a trope combiner. It just takes all the tropes of earlier isekai and puts them into one. Becomes popular and somehow the fans believe it started it all. The way I see it is that it's the most generic isekai of all time, am I wrong? |
Roevhaal said: Gilgameshuu said: It can't be the most generic isekai of all time since Isekai Cheat Magician exists but yea it's just a part of the explosion of isekai novels. Isekai was already branching out all over the place by this time, some other titles that started in 2012-2013 are: Overlord, Youjo Senki, Re:Zero, TenSura, Isekai wa Smartphone, Death March, Bookworm, Konosuba, Hachinan tte, Arifureta, Tate no Yuusha and of course Isekai Cheat Magician.So Mushoku Tensei being the father of isekai is just self-proclaimed by the fans? It's less of a trope inventor and actually more of a trope combiner. It just takes all the tropes of earlier isekai and puts them into one. Becomes popular and somehow the fans believe it started it all. The way I see it is that it's the most generic isekai of all time, am I wrong? Some of those came out before the isekai explosion, Overlord iirc started on 2010, and Re:Zero started on April 2012, a few months before SAO aired and 7 months before Mushoku Tensei began and got popular. |
GilgameshuuJan 3, 2021 8:44 PM
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| I guess people like to say ignorant sh*t. |
| :v |
Gilgameshuu said: You're right, Overlord is from 2010. In April 2012 you also had No Game No Life debuting as a Light Novel, another title that clearly shows that isekai was already popular at the time. And as I already said the otaku dies, is reborn and gets super awesome and popular trope was already a thing aswell.Roevhaal said: It can't be the most generic isekai of all time since Isekai Cheat Magician exists but yea it's just a part of the explosion of isekai novels. Isekai was already branching out all over the place by this time, some other titles that started in 2012-2013 are: Overlord, Youjo Senki, Re:Zero, TenSura, Isekai wa Smartphone, Death March, Bookworm, Konosuba, Hachinan tte, Arifureta, Tate no Yuusha and of course Isekai Cheat Magician. Some of those came out before the isekai explosion, Overlord iirc started on 2010, and Re:Zero started on April 2012, a few months before SAO aired and 7 months before Mushoku Tensei began and got popular. |
Jlarz56 said: Mushoku Tensei has a story that is better than that, of most Isekai stories written today. Despite all the backlash and controversy at one point in time Mushoku Tensei was the most popular WN on the site it was published on, more so than Shield Hero or Re Zero. In regards to the story Mushoku Tensei executes the world building and character development like no other series out there. Aside from the main cast Mushoku Tensei does a great job at creating magnificent supporting characters that feel like they could each have their own spin-off unlike 1-D fodder side characters in most stories. I think this probably captures it. Mushoku tensei became the gold standard by which isekai were measured because of how good the world building and character development was. I usually like to refer to is as "godfather" in stead of "grandfather" but they essentially means the same thing. However I guess technically speaking you would be correct, the tropes had existed beforehand so it wasnt a completely new take. Every derivative isekai that came afterwards tried to replicate the formula for success from this series and usually more than likely failed. The vast majority of good isekai were either released before this series or around the same time and didn't try to copy it. |
| Honestly i think they say it because they want to protect the original material. As someone that does love it, i know it has a lot of problems especially at the beginning, so a lot of people say its the "Grandfather" to give a reason as to why those problems and cliches exist (when they shouldnt even if it was really the grandfather). |
VP2003boi said: Honestly i think they say it because they want to protect the original material. As someone that does love it, i know it has a lot of problems especially at the beginning, so a lot of people say its the "Grandfather" to give a reason as to why those problems and cliches exist (when they shouldnt even if it was really the grandfather). I could see that. Its a slow burn series and doesnt really start to shine until you are a pretty good way into it. It's always tough when a show like this gets so hype because then the expectation is set for it to be amazing right from the start and when it isn't it's just disappointing. The haruhi movie is an example I can think of. I think that movie is a masterpiece, but you have to wade through the haruhi series to get the full experience. Unfortunately I think the haruhi series is really just above average to very good at best and can completely understand if someone couldnt get through it. |
co111s said: A yes, I love being baited into watching series by overbearing fans.We all want our beloved series to get popular. I think that's natural. If none of the fans tried anything to help this series grow (calling it grandfather of modern isekai), this new 2021 show will probably be glossed over and seen as a "generic isekai that I shouldn't bother checking out". Although saying such things will inevitably cause people to raise their expectations too high, I think this is a better route than just leaving the show as it is. |
| The amount of detail put into each characters and world building , attrition to detail, and very entertaining story makes this a fascinating read as far as LN goes. The writing of this series is better than most of the isekai light novel out there too. Also do note this serie is like 2 decades old, which has ended and with so many volumes. So is not wrong to call it father of isekai trend because many of the later isekai just copies this formula in an inferior way later on. |
Ventus_S said: The amount of detail put into each characters and world building , attrition to detail, and very entertaining story makes this a fascinating read as far as LN goes. The writing of this series is better than most of the isekai light novel out there too. Also do note this serie is like 2 decades old, which has ended and with so many volumes. So is not wrong to call it father of isekai trend because many of the later isekai just copies this formula in an inferior way later on. 2 decades? As far as I know it started in November 2012, unless I'm wrong about that. |
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Ventus_S said: Also do note this serie is like 2 decades old, which has ended and with so many volumes. So is not wrong to call it father of isekai trend because many of the later isekai just copies this formula in an inferior way later on. As much as I love Mushoku Tensei, it's wrong to say that Mushoku Tensei affect an entire genre of Isekai. Isekai have existed since a long time back so making that argument would invite a lot of useless discussion about who first started isekai story. But It does indeed inspired a lot "modern narou style reincaranation isekai" isekai story that you see in recent years because MT become popular on a Syosetsu all time rank, earning its 1st position for a few years. |
Angry_onionJan 8, 2021 3:54 AM
Gilgameshuu said: Ventus_S said: The amount of detail put into each characters and world building , attrition to detail, and very entertaining story makes this a fascinating read as far as LN goes. The writing of this series is better than most of the isekai light novel out there too. Also do note this serie is like 2 decades old, which has ended and with so many volumes. So is not wrong to call it father of isekai trend because many of the later isekai just copies this formula in an inferior way later on. 2 decades? As far as I know it started in November 2012, unless I'm wrong about that. Yeah my mistake. So yeah only 8 years :3 Still pretty long running. |
coolxal said: Isekai has existed since series like Fushigi Yuugi, Escaflowne, Inuyasha, etc. This kinda reminds me of an argument gamers have about whether or not PUBG fathered battle royale genre. I mean, yes, you can indeed argue that Mushoku Tensei hasn't invented isekai. But it made this genre what is today. Whether you yourself like MT or not is secondary to its cultural impact. |
heitooJan 10, 2021 5:03 AM
| because it's popular, and the main character (like almost all isekai or fantasy mcs nowadays) is a massive nonce and pervert. |
| As much as I love mushoku tensei, it did not start the tropes. The reason why it’s call the ‘godfather’ is because it popularized it. It’s like how people say SAO started the isekai trend. It really didn’t however it definitely popularized it. Mushoku Tensei just became the series to copy off of because it was doing good. The light novel of it or more specifically the web novel (because that’s what I read) is IMO one of the best world building, characters, and stories, and it is my second favorite isekai after re zero. Mushoku tensei is like most isekai however done right. It takes the potential of the typical isekai trope and actually surpasses it. I’m half excited half worried about how it would do as an anime, but it looks like they are doing a good job so far. |
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ExcaliburAO said: It’s like how people say SAO started the isekai trend. I'd say SAO started progression fantasy trend rather than isekai trend. |
heitooJan 10, 2021 10:41 AM
What a coincidence, I just finished watching that an hour ago. |
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| Ofc there were isekai way before this was even a thing but it's probably because it popularized isekai as a genre. |
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| I don’t really get it either, the series only started in 2012 and isekai as we currently know it was already present back then. And no, just because it was more popular than its competitors doesn’t make it the “grandfather” if that’s why people are saying it. |
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Monochrosanity said: And no, just because it was more popular than its competitors doesn’t make it the “grandfather” if that’s why people are saying it. You're underestimate how often a certain popular series affect an entire genre or giving birth to new fad that people doesn't recognize before. Monochrosanity said: The series only started in 2012 and isekai as we currently know it was already present back then. Exactly, isekai as we know it today doesn't exist before at that moment because we call those story "Fantasy". MT is popular enough to secure the 1st place on syosetsu a site where many amateur writer submits their works for a long time from 2012-2015 or 2016. The popularity of MT made Syosetso popular among fiction writer and casual readers in Japan introduces this site to a broader people who later would write their own fiction, since MT is the most popular ones many amateur writer would use this and other popular works on that site as an inspiration to their new novel. |
anilandrot said: 12 kingdoms is the grandfather of isekai, and the only show that did it well. Bunch of zoomers that only started watching anime because of aot might think differently. Story of Urashima Tarō is grandfather of isekai in Japan. |
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| Because No The isekai are at least have 38 years old since Dunbine and there have been a lot of popularizing them. And the trope that all new LNs of the op prota with a harem in a generic fantasy world follow led to the peak popularity with Zero no Tsukaima and SAO's WN in the 2000s. AGlitchGnome said: From my understanding Mushoku Tensei is the origin of the "hit by a truck" trope. Dude, Astroboy die by a Truck in 1952 XDD |
ALOCFeb 4, 2021 3:15 PM
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| MT might be the only Isekai that follows the MC's life from birth to the end. I do not think any Isekai before MT have done that aspect. |
WindenMar 9, 2021 9:33 AM
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
| saving this so I can lol later (pt.2) |
| I started reading it in 2014 and I didn't even know the meaning of the Isekai term. That said, I am pretty sure the origination of this whole "Isekai hype" generated mostly from SAO. I still vividly remember how everybody went batshit crazy because of the first season of SAO, especially the Japanese audience. |
| "Life is too bitter, so coffee, at least should be sweet..." - Hikigaya Hachiman (Yahari Ore no Seishun Love Come wa Machigatte Iru) |
| Isn't that title supposed to be over SAO's head? |
Sore wa chigau yo! - Junko Enoshima, probably |
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