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#1
Feb 14, 1:50 AM

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I've seen this statement a lot from Type-Boomers how FGO is ruining the franchise because of all the retcons, rule and lore breaking it does. It's no secret that the early days of FGO were terrible and everyone already accepted that. However, I think it has definitely gotten better since Camelot. Aside from putting out 1-dimensional servants and genderbending historical figures for no reason from time to time, we all know they gotta sell those png files to keep the franchise alive, how exactly does FGO ruin Fate or Nasuverse in terms of lore? I think the boomers are just salty Type-Moon is all about FGO now.
 
#2
Feb 14, 2:12 AM

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I don't think 60 years old people watch or even play FGO.





do kpop idols get recycled when they died?
 
#3
Feb 14, 3:37 AM

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Screen capping this so I can prove you wrong in the future...


 
#4
Feb 14, 9:43 AM

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Posts: 475
"Retcon" is intended in a totally negative "they changed things!!!!" way nowadays, but the term doesn't mean only that and in fact FGO has some retcons but in the true sense of the term, not what detractors says.
And also no, it doesn't break lore and it doesn't ruin Fate or the Nasuverse as a whole.

Don't listen to those people, you literally can't reason with them. I knew some hardcore FGO-haters and they don't want to discuss: they are just right and you are just wrong and you should feel ashamed for playing and enjoying FGO.
It's only a toxic part of the community, ignore it.
 
#5
Feb 14, 11:11 AM

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There are basically two factions involved in this.

1. The other Type-Moon fans who don't like the fact that FGO or Fate in general is essentially the main focus now and everything else is taking a backseat. Can't blame them when Tsukihime literally got shafted for years and we get a bunch of Fate games, anime and other materials in between the recent announcement. I want Carnival Phantasm season 2 too but that would only be filled with Fate jokes :')

2. The FSN purists who can't accept the fact that Fate has become what it is now.
 
#6
Feb 14, 11:58 AM

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Anyway I always welcome discussions regarding Fate because it's fun and engaging to me so I'll throw in some from the top of my head...

1. The infamous "I can only be summoned as a Saber class" criticism which honestly doesn't make sense to me because all other classes of Artoria are meme/event servants that shouldn't be taken seriously. Only Goddess Rhongomyniad breaks this but at least it actually makes sense since Camelot/FGO is an alternate timeline to FSN.

2. I think they also changed Berserkers in a way. There are a lot of Berserkers in FGO that don't seem to have lost their sanity but instead are just some angry people holding grudges for eternity though you can pretty much reason that out to Madness Enhancement parameters. Otherwise, every Berserker would just be growling/roaring servants.

3. IIRC it was also mentioned in FSN that only the Hassans can be summoned as Assassins and yet here we are... Kojiro has been established as an exception by the way.

4. FGO is also very and I mean VERY vague, I mean this in nicest way possible even though I'm very frustrated with it lol, with how servants' memories work. There have been multiple instances where servants seem to remember things even though they already went back to the Throne of Heroes.

5. There's also the fact that Nasuverse works in a multiverse concept so inconsistencies are bound to arise like how Archer Emiya is soooo different from his FSN counterpart.

6. I think there's also the stuff about pseudo-servants where humans supposedly cannot withstand being possessed by gods and stuff and yet here we are...

Honestly, with how expansive Nasuverse is it was only a matter of time before they started retconning/changing stuff to fit in into FGO easier.

 
#7
Feb 14, 7:11 PM

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If someone dislikes FGO, let them be.

"type boomer" lmaoooooo
 
#8
Feb 14, 8:57 PM

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From what I see around, there are two things:

1. Nasu constantly recycles concepts he introduces in his non-professional works and gives it new meanings and contexts (like Land Steel) which causes a knee-jerk reaction of HE RETCONED IT. He simply didn't establish it in his professional works. He loves reusing names too (There's a mysterious benevolent figure called "Dr. Roman" in DDD too). Very similar to this, he often has some ideas he talks about in interviews he leaves incomplete or vague that the fandom develops some stern and strict "canon" from those statements without realizing he's just informally sharing some potential future ideas, nothing set on stone yet. That's why he's free to change those in the future. Also because he keeps things ambiguous for years, the fandom (english one in particular) has developed their own fanon they consider the only valid explanation usually held as gospel and when he introduces new info that contradicts the fanon they built, they would complain he retcon it. They also take many of his jokes seriously, or his attempts of humor as serious lore or what not. When Nasu loves parody and doesn't let it influence his main storylines. They exist as an extra spice which can be enjoyed if you're a fan.

2. Nasu sometimes retcons and changes things. That isn't just with FGO. FSN timeline changed in the past, afaik. Merlin had 3 VAs until Nasu thought the 'definite' version of him, for example. Berserker Class no longer works as it used to do, but that's since Apocrypha, not FGO. I'm not talking about the Berserkers who can talk only, but that monstrous and gaunt features consequence of Mad Enhancement is gone. Because the characters are more profitable if they look attractive.
Modified by Thess, Feb 14, 9:03 PM
 
#9
Feb 15, 10:03 AM

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Dull_Lull said:
Anyway I always welcome discussions regarding Fate because it's fun and engaging to me so I'll throw in some from the top of my head...

1. The infamous "I can only be summoned as a Saber class" criticism which honestly doesn't make sense to me because all other classes of Artoria are meme/event servants that shouldn't be taken seriously. Only Goddess Rhongomyniad breaks this but at least it actually makes sense since Camelot/FGO is an alternate timeline to FSN.

2. I think they also changed Berserkers in a way. There are a lot of Berserkers in FGO that don't seem to have lost their sanity but instead are just some angry people holding grudges for eternity though you can pretty much reason that out to Madness Enhancement parameters. Otherwise, every Berserker would just be growling/roaring servants.

3. IIRC it was also mentioned in FSN that only the Hassans can be summoned as Assassins and yet here we are... Kojiro has been established as an exception by the way.

4. FGO is also very and I mean VERY vague, I mean this in nicest way possible even though I'm very frustrated with it lol, with how servants' memories work. There have been multiple instances where servants seem to remember things even though they already went back to the Throne of Heroes.

5. There's also the fact that Nasuverse works in a multiverse concept so inconsistencies are bound to arise like how Archer Emiya is soooo different from his FSN counterpart.

6. I think there's also the stuff about pseudo-servants where humans supposedly cannot withstand being possessed by gods and stuff and yet here we are...

Honestly, with how expansive Nasuverse is it was only a matter of time before they started retconning/changing stuff to fit in into FGO easier.



1.That's just a LIVING Saber talking tho. So it doesnt mean anything. And yes basically only her Lancer versions are not joke material. Archer is just Scathach messing with her Saint Graph.

2. That's since Apocrypha.And Zero if we count Lancelot who was fine if Artoria wasnt around.


3.Apocrypha changed that long before FGO and the limitation was only on the ritual the 3 families created.


4.Only Servants summoned with the Fuyuki ritual cant have access to other memories. The Throne does keep a record of the new memories. EMIYA is a good example of middle ground.As a CG he makes new memories and the Throne obviously lets him keep them, that's including when he is summoned in Fuyuki.


5.Only reason FSN Archer is so moody is because he is summoned in his time and faced with his younger self. Plus, that EMIYA has access to his UBW development no matter how vague that is.


6.But mythology is full of human being possessed by gods. It makes no sense that being the case in Nasuverse. Maybe you mean full power of a god destroying a human, which makes sense and answers why pseudo servants are so much weaker.

 
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