| yeah I kinda get what you mean...I mean whether or not suicide is legal doesn't really matter that much, if a person wants to kill themselves they're just gonna do it :[ the only interesting thing left is Ai Magase and her weird superpower. I'm interested to see if Mc will kill her or vise versa |
| I feel like the discussion in anime isn't only about the law itself. It is about a great change in morality and way of thinking on the entire earth. Currently, in the Western cultures (and a few others) due to Christianity suicide and death are considered a taboo and something negative. Anime shows a story about the changes which will probably never happen in our reality. In my opinion it is pretty fascinating. |
ultramega_0k said: Mori-dono said: I feel like the discussion in anime isn't only about the law itself. It is about a great change in morality and way of thinking on the entire earth. Currently, in the Western cultures (and a few others) due to Christianity suicide and death are considered a taboo and something negative. Anime shows a story about the changes which will probably never happen in our reality. In my opinion it is pretty fascinating. I get what you're saying but a talk about the morality of suicide without considering the circumstances that sorround such event I think is irresponsible, maybe it's the lack of empaty of the show that buggs me The empathy is one of the main topics of the show. Magase Ai questions the existence of morality (to her killing isn't a bad thing) when MC provides more "normal" point of view (he cares about existence of other people and wants to protect world from Magase's madness). Babylon mentions very difficult topics. Why do we must live though on our path is only pain and suffering? Why death is such a bad thing? Gods and moral rules don't exist so why we shouldn't hurt others though it might bring us pleasure and profit? This show made me question all these things. |
ultramega_0k said: Mori-dono said: The empathy is one of the main topics of the show. Magase Ai questions the existence of morality (to her killing isn't a bad thing) when MC provides more "normal" point of view (he cares about existence of other people and wants to protect world from Magase's madness). Babylon mentions very difficult topics. Why do we must live though on our path is only pain and suffering? Why death is such a bad thing? Gods and moral rules don't exist so why we shouldn't hurt others though it might bring us pleasure and profit? This show made me question all these things. But is it really empathy a main topic of the show? Questions about the morality of death and suicide I think are divorced from empaty, in that sense the series takes a very academic approach to the subject. As of yet the focus has always been on how the MC reacts to the deaths sorrounding them, but never on why any of these death would happen. It doesn't help that suicide until now has been black magic in which a couple of words gets an instakill. I feel it's far removed from the real problem of suicide which it's ok for the fantasy murder mystery of the first arc but it's dissapointing for the second half. In that sense it feels like when anime tries to talk about rape and focuses in the act more than the afteshock and road to recovery, delicate subject and maybe not the best approach. Technically speaking you are right. This anime has many flaws and the whole magic / mind control thing is rather weird but I'm just trying to find out the essence of the show. Searching the message and meaning of this anime is the most important thing in my opinion. |
| It was matter of time, this is based on novels by Sekaisuru Kado's writer. |
 |
ultramega_0k said: Very good questions, I ran into those myself. I think the anime and/or it's translation are sloppy about differentiating between assisted and unassisted suicide, which causes all the trouble. In the anime, they talk about a drug easily available to aid suicide. This is how it usually is done in legislations with fully legal assisted suicide laws, you get a cocktails of chemicals including a sedative, a painkiller, and of course something lethal which isn't giving too horrible a death (e.g. not suffocating). From a medical professional.Why is the anime assuming that suicide is illegal in most countries? checking wikipedia shows that most countries have a neutral stance or is legal. Besides why the goverment would have a say in suicide? What's gonna do, arrest your corpse? Fine the failed attempts on suicide? And the (il)legality of suicide has mainly consequences for everybody helping or not preventing a suicide, not only for the person conducting it. In Germany, despite semi-legality, doctors helping would lose their approbation and normal people aiding suicide or not trying to prevent it will be charged with manslaughter or similar. They usually will not be sentenced, but it's still stigmatizing and may create a criminal record. TL;DR: Methinks when the anime says "legal suicide", they mean "legal assisted suicide", and more so, a readily available public infrastructure for that. |
 |
| @ultramega_0k Your reason for disliking this is wrong and also pretty dumb no offense. I Slightly dislike this anime too but for a different reason. -Babylon is NOT BASED ON OUR REAL WORLD. It uses the Names, and Locations, of places of real life. It literally says that in the beginning of each episode... So the facts that you are pulling from Wikipedia are dont apply and are moot. This whole thread is pretty embarrassing.  Whats sad is that nobody in this thread pointed this out yet... |
iLoveWaterJan 18, 2020 6:38 AM
 |
| @ultramega_0k Its fine it happens. My reason for slightly disliking this anime is that they focused too much on making a lot of its characters think suicide is bad and should be illegal. It really felt like most of the characters ignored the fact that there are very logical reasons as to why one might commit suicide. For instance Making Suicide Illegal, Ye see uhhh this is something that I can 100% see happening with governments in real life so as dumb as it sounds, I can't even get mad at the Anime for this because its very realistic and could and probably has happened. But we all know who didn't commit suicide. Jeffrey Epstein. |
|
| The show thinks that it is smarter than it really is. It started out as a nice psycho-thriller but it is continuously devolving in the second half. It seems to be the weakness of the author because Kado also started strong and ended as a mess. |
lll-blank-lll said: Water-sama said: @ultramega_0k Its fine it happens. My reason for slightly disliking this anime is that they focused too much on making a lot of its characters think suicide is bad and should be illegal. It really felt like most of the characters ignored the fact that there are very logical reasons as to why one might commit suicide. For instance Making Suicide Illegal, Ye see uhhh this is something that I can 100% see happening with governments in real life so as dumb as it sounds, I can't even get mad at the Anime for this because its very realistic and could and probably has happened. But we all know who didn't commit suicide. Jeffrey Epstein. But they aren't trying to make it illegal though Some of the people in the show disapprove of it. They really dont to allow suicide. |
|
ultramega_0k said: The main conflict of the second half (as it has been for the entire series) is the suicide law itself and defining what true justice is. I feel the story has progressed organically from where the first arc left off. You have to remember: the original intent of Shiniki was to be a testing ground for new laws. It didn't have to be suicide, it could have been anything. We're seeing now, here in the second arc, how said law would affect other nations, or rather how a law, regardless of how outlandish it may seem at face value, can evolve and truly become something world-changing.I need someone to explain to me the main conflict of this second arc because I honestly don't understand the main discussion on suicide that it's happening. Why is the anime assuming that suicide is illegal in most countries? checking wikipedia shows that most countries have a neutral stance or is legal. Besides why the goverment would have a say in suicide? What's gonna do, arrest your corpse? Fine the failed attempts on suicide? There's nuance to the enactment of a suicide law. By allowing suicide they're essentially encouraging people to die. Of course suicide isn't illegal, but it's an act that, in most cultures, is looked down upon. No country worth a damn would allow suicide (in my opinion), but the show does make interesting counterpoints to the contrary. |
More topics from this board
Poll: » Babylon Episode 11 Discussion ( 1 2 3 )Stark700 - Jan 20, 2020 |
118 |
by GreenTeaRabbit
»»
Apr 7, 1:25 AM |
|
Poll: » Babylon Episode 7 Discussion ( 1 2 3 4 5 ... Last Page )Stark700 - Nov 18, 2019 |
319 |
by GreenTeaRabbit
»»
Apr 6, 11:47 AM |
|
Poll: » Babylon Episode 12 Discussion ( 1 2 3 4 5 ... Last Page )Stark700 - Jan 27, 2020 |
442 |
by madstar345
»»
Mar 16, 2:02 PM |
|
Poll: » Babylon Episode 3 Discussion ( 1 2 3 4 )Stark700 - Oct 6, 2019 |
157 |
by madstar345
»»
Mar 16, 10:53 AM |
|
Poll: » Babylon Episode 9 Discussion ( 1 2 )Stark700 - Jan 6, 2020 |
98 |
by VanniePon
»»
Feb 16, 6:47 AM |