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Poll: Steins;Gate 0 Episode 23 Discussion


Oct 5, 2018 5:33 PM
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i think i know what okabe feel to choose one world between kurisu or mayuri,, where if you choose one and the other will die,, its very hurt to lose one who love and trying to save them but what ever youre doing the result is alwasys same one will die,, killed by world
 
Oct 6, 2018 6:27 AM
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in the end, they didn t explain the whole hospital scene...
 
Oct 6, 2018 11:30 AM

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Franck_Nicolas said:
in the end, they didn t explain the whole hospital scene...

The most powerful asset in a war of time machines is people who remember other world lines. There was an ongoing research by different parties and Leskinen was also involved in it.
 
Oct 6, 2018 2:49 PM

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Unexpectedly mediocre experience.


- The same old cycle of events, re-used ideas and plot devices. The big difference between the original and this one was the aspect of mystery and lack of information, which made the whole show a lot more interesting and/or exciting.

- Pacing is all over the place, going from a crawl to full-on sprint and to something in-between.

- Lack of S;G flair. Characters losing their identity. Loss of the S;G mood and tone.

- Excess indulgence in bad melodrama. The events can be sad and the characters are mentally broken, but there is no need for drawn out, overly dramatic scenes with little to no impact and value.

- Highly sub-par animation at times, especially the action scenes.

- Abuse of plot armor and common occurrence of highly improbable events.

- Generally absurd ideas.


Time to add one more title to the 'Never anticipate the sequel to be adequate' list.
Suddenly, someone slaps you with a brick wall.



 
Oct 6, 2018 7:58 PM
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All this people saying that kagari looking like kurisu is just a coincidence... Lmao. Kagari is the incarnation of Amadeus, in 2025 scientists, most like together with leskinen, create a human based on amadeus data. That is kagari, and thats why she looks like kurisu.
 
Oct 6, 2018 7:59 PM
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Franck_Nicolas said:
in the end, they didn t explain the whole hospital scene...


The hospital scene was caused by a change in world lines, cuz of Russia testing time machines.
 
Oct 6, 2018 9:16 PM

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Just watched every single episode in one day lol. Have to say, it was a blast. Huge thrill the entire time...absolutely loved it. Was great visiting with these characters again and seeing them succeed after such painful battles. Eyes watered when Kyouma "returned" a few episodes back. Really an awesome anime.

Biggest issue was really just the color-banding but that very likely wasn't teh studio's fault.
 
Oct 7, 2018 1:14 AM
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SheevPalpatine said:
AX3M said:

Steins Gate was reached the moment it was sent.


This sentence is false. The video D-Mail has no impact in the past without the Suzuha who knows about Operation Skuld (because it's encrypted... Okabe gets the message in the 1st episode of the original series, but he can't watch it and completely forgets about it... then the Suzuha who knows about the message, on 21st August, make him remember).

So Steins;Gate will be reached only in 2036, when Suzuha (the little Suzuha from the last episode in 2025) travels to the past.



That's true. Perfect explanation
 
Oct 7, 2018 5:03 AM
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realm087 said:
Franck_Nicolas said:
in the end, they didn t explain the whole hospital scene...


The hospital scene was caused by a change in world lines, cuz of Russia testing time machines.


Yeah but what about all the plot with Katsumi Nakase staying at the hospital with a weird device on her head?
 
Oct 7, 2018 1:52 PM
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was worried coming here that most would be wearing the SG fan goggles and not be willing to admit this season wasn't as good as season 1. Then again season 1 was a masterpiece and one of the best anime made so another series always had big boots to fill. That being said i really enjoyed 0 and i'm glad we got more of the Steins Gate universe in anime form. Really had to sit and think about what i watched through the whole season, the reddit thread was a big help! over all its a 8/10 for me. Very few anime nail a fantastic ending and this one did bravo!
I thought what I'd do was, I'd pretend I was one of those deaf-mutes

That way I wouldn't have to have any goddamn stupid useless conversations with anybody. If anybody wanted to tell me something they'd have to write it on a piece of paper and shove it over to me. They'd get bored as hell doing that after a while, and then I'd be through with having conversations for the rest of my life
 
Oct 7, 2018 7:08 PM
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Man, what a ride... I mean, I'm veeeery subjective here 'cause this kind of narrativeit truly gets me, but MAN, WHAT A RIDE. Flops aside, this was a moving, endearing story about human will and determination where the weaker can araise victorious against all odds with that and the power of love *80's intensifies*. I'm a laconic man, but can't reprise this need to say SO COOOL. SON OF A *EJEM* this is good, that's all.
 
Oct 7, 2018 8:00 PM

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Did not expect such an open ending to be honest! They now better make a sequel to this in either a season or a movie! But well the finish is almost there but just so far away! Why do they do this to us?

Still one absolutely amazing anime season, one that has been with my from te start and buy even that post-ending was magnificent.

Really do look forwards to see what will happen, it's just sad to not be sure when we will see a continuation on this!
 
Oct 7, 2018 11:47 PM
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RafaelDeJongh said:
Did not expect such an open ending to be honest!


What remained opened? (except the origination of the D-RINE message, but that can be find by logic)
 
Oct 8, 2018 1:46 PM

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Remember how the second half of the first Steins Gate was much better than the first, well this second season felt like the first half of s1 dragging for 23 eps. I get Okabe is kinda in mourning mode but he was wayyy too subdued for my liking, his Kyouma impressions towards the end felt really cringe. I like Maho but she was a far cry from Kurisu, just didn't make things interesting enough. Also no idea why we went full on first person shooter towards the end there, was not expecting it from this show. Barely 7.

Join the MSP Club for an in-depth look at score progressions and other stats of currently airing anime
 
Oct 9, 2018 10:06 PM

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time to milking milking baby...

7/10.
 
Oct 10, 2018 10:17 PM

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RafaelDeJongh said:
Did not expect such an open ending to be honest! They now better make a sequel to this in either a season or a movie! But well the finish is almost there but just so far away! Why do they do this to us?

Still one absolutely amazing anime season, one that has been with my from te start and buy even that post-ending was magnificent.

Really do look forwards to see what will happen, it's just sad to not be sure when we will see a continuation on this!


Everything was resolved, there's no open ending.

-Okabe tricks Suzaha into thinking he's dead in 2025 by time traveling instead of a natural death
-Okabe travels to the year 18,000 where no one exists and no one can interpret him as alive. Therefore he's dead, dead since 2025. (convenient that Mayuri and Suzaha traveled so far into the future by chance...)
-He sends Mayuri and Suzaha back to 2036, while he's staying in 18,000 to stay dead to the world. The 2 girls probably avoid the originals and live the rest of their life doing something else
-Suzaha (The original 2036 not the one above) travels back in time to get Okabe to save Kurisu in the Steins Gate timeline, where it's impossible for a war over a time machine to break out by her living.
Modified by LemonMAL, Oct 10, 2018 10:30 PM
 
Oct 11, 2018 3:30 PM

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I feel like there should be a episode 24.
This didn't feel concluding at all.

I'm gonna give it a 7/10 anyway.
Would have given it a 9 if more things happened and it ended with them finding steins;gate and had both Mayuri and Kurisu alive
 
Oct 11, 2018 3:52 PM
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Izekyu said:
I feel like there should be a episode 24.
This didn't feel concluding at all.

I'm gonna give it a 7/10 anyway.
Would have given it a 9 if more things happened and it ended with them finding steins;gate and had both Mayuri and Kurisu alive


Why would they show again the episode 24 of the original again?
 
Oct 11, 2018 8:08 PM
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Izekyu said:
I feel like there should be a episode 24.
This didn't feel concluding at all.

I'm gonna give it a 7/10 anyway.
Would have given it a 9 if more things happened and it ended with them finding steins;gate and had both Mayuri and Kurisu alive


But we already have that, episode 24 of Steins;Gate. Why would they show us this again?
 
Oct 12, 2018 10:49 AM
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This is one masterpiece anime that i ever seen,,
the characterlistic, is strong, there so many sad moment in this anime ,,
you know okabe trying so much time to change the fate,, save mayuri, kurisu and the future but he many time fail again and again but he kept trying, the fate can be beaten easly like there no way out,,
after countless time okabe change the world line, he feel fail to save both and fell bad and break his heart and and accept kurisu sacrifice to save the future and mayuri,,
a little bit, okabe become a normal people went to college and meet maho there the senior of makise kurisu,,
suddenly okabe meet the amadeus project and see kurisu there,, its fell hurt and happy at same times to see the people you love front of you.. but okabe relize that kurisu sacrifice is useless and keep search for steins gate

at episode 19 okabe deciding to use the machine to back and try to save mayuri and suzuha who try to going back to the past and seeing that both died by missile, okabe once again see their death,and after a times trying okabe figure that he awake at 2036 and see the death of rukako ,,

but the ending is awesome, okabe back to 2011 after over 3000 time using the machine, and the finale they commit to delete the all dataof amadeus system and say good bye to kurisu,,(you know its very hurt to watch thisepisode ),, then okabe manage to save suzuha and and mayuri and send them to he past to talk mayuri in the past and finally they out of machine rime energy energy trape at bc 18000,, and when i think they gonna died, they see a like light and see that okabe came from future to save them (this is the best scene of all series, i cring to see this).. end..

 
Oct 13, 2018 2:22 AM

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all these commotion only to slap Okabe. I thought this series would come to an end where he achieved Steins Gate. as far as I remember, this is the continuation where Okabe feel down because he can't save Kurisu right?

whatever, fuck it. I'm getting tired to follow up their timeline. but still enjoying it because I loved all about conspiracy shit. 8/10.
Modified by Abyhape, Oct 13, 2018 2:26 AM
 
Oct 15, 2018 6:39 PM

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So uhh....why was kagari there in 2025 as an adult when she isn't born until 2026?
 
Oct 15, 2018 6:43 PM
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duhu1148 said:
So uhh....why was kagari there in 2025 as an adult when she isn't born until 2026?


Because that's the present Kagari, the one from 2011, another Kagari will be born in 2026 so there's going to be 2 Kagari's in the future, a young one and an older one.
 
Oct 15, 2018 6:49 PM

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xZabuzax said:
duhu1148 said:
So uhh....why was kagari there in 2025 as an adult when she isn't born until 2026?


Because that's the present Kagari, the one from 2011, another Kagari will be born in 2026 so there's going to be 2 Kagari's in the future, a young one and an older one.
Oh that's right.

It's confusing that they don't age some of them. Faris doesn't look older either.

I'll muse on the score for a while before finalizing it but probably a 7/10. Decent overall with some hard hitting moments, but botches most action scenes and the plot is getting messy, among a few other nitpicks. Not anywhere close to the masterpiece of the original series, though I was expecting that. I hope the special turns out well. And the movie if they decide to do that.

The biggest thing is I just don't understand some of their decisions with story direction (and this applies to the VN as well) for this sequel. Kagari and Maho were not necessary characters for this to work. Kagari in particular was a huge waste of space. Amadeus wasn't necessary. Mayuri going back in time to tell herself to slap Okabe wasn't even necessary.

All this sequel needed was for Okabe to go through a long rough patch until they eventually reached WWIII from Nakabachi/kurisu's paper. Okabe witnesses the terror of WWIII for himself, they build a machine and send the dmail to the past. Would have been so much better and made for a neater plot, but they were intent on making more characters, fan service, and silly action scenes.
Modified by duhu1148, Oct 15, 2018 6:59 PM
 
Oct 15, 2018 7:31 PM
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duhu1148 said:
xZabuzax said:


Because that's the present Kagari, the one from 2011, another Kagari will be born in 2026 so there's going to be 2 Kagari's in the future, a young one and an older one.
Oh that's right.

It's confusing that they don't age some of them. Faris doesn't look older either.

I'll muse on the score for a while before finalizing it but probably a 7/10. Decent overall with some hard hitting moments, but botches most action scenes and the plot is getting messy, among a few other nitpicks. Not anywhere close to the masterpiece of the original series, though I was expecting that. I hope the special turns out well. And the movie if they decide to do that.

The biggest thing is I just don't understand some of their decisions with story direction (and this applies to the VN as well) for this sequel. Kagari and Maho were not necessary characters for this to work. Kagari in particular was a huge waste of space. Amadeus wasn't necessary. Mayuri going back in time to tell herself to slap Okabe wasn't even necessary.

All this sequel needed was for Okabe to go through a long rough patch until they eventually reached WWIII from Nakabachi/kurisu's paper. Okabe witnesses the terror of WWIII for himself, they build a machine and send the dmail to the past. Would have been so much better and made for a neater plot, but they were intent on making more characters, fan service, and silly action scenes.


True, in my opinion Steins;Gate 0 would have been a lot better by having Amadeus being helpful as a support character and not a minor filler character and having Okabe time leaping through different world lines and doing some test and experiments in each one to see if they are able to "trick" convergence and hence, having Okabe finally devising the plan to save Kurisu and avoiding WW3.

I also hated the fact that they hinted Fubuki having some sort of semi-Reading Steiner ability but that character wasn't used for anything, hell, the new characters wasn't used for anything here and they were just a bunch of useless, waste of space filler characters that didn't help the story at all. Fubuki needed to act as a second support character in helping Okabe find a way to "trick" convergence by using her ability.

So much wasted potential in this anime, they could have done wonders with the concept but it was wasted with cringy slice of life that fucking took forever, over-dramatic moments that also felt cringy, stupid shounen type of shit by having Kagari and Moeka dodging bullets and killing trained soldiers by themselves in the middle of the warzone while tanking bullets and slicing heads off barehanded... sigh... so much shit went wrong with this anime.
Modified by xZabuzax, Oct 15, 2018 7:40 PM
 
Oct 16, 2018 12:13 AM

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Just finished it, it was really great. Also some of you might have some questions, this redditor explained the ending well if u want to check it out.



MY

FAVORITE

【CHARACTERS💕】


 
Oct 16, 2018 2:45 AM
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Elanin said:
Just finished it, it was really great. Also some of you might have some questions, this redditor explained the ending well if u want to check it out.


That's the ending of the VN. The anime had some differences. Here is the explained ending of the anime:
https://www.reddit.com/r/steinsgate/comments/9j67w5/explanation_for_sg_0_ending/
 
Oct 16, 2018 2:55 AM

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SheevPalpatine said:
Elanin said:
Just finished it, it was really great. Also some of you might have some questions, this redditor explained the ending well if u want to check it out.


That's the ending of the VN. The anime had some differences. Here is the explained ending of the anime:
https://www.reddit.com/r/steinsgate/comments/9j67w5/explanation_for_sg_0_ending/


Aw great, thank you mate!


MY

FAVORITE

【CHARACTERS💕】


 
Oct 16, 2018 11:54 AM

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final episode done and im not satisfied
all the episodes in this series was great brought back the old steins gate feel except this one
this episode did not feel like a episode of steins gate at all, it threaded far away from it
i dont know wat to give considering most of the episodes in this show was good i'll give 8/10
now onto watching something better
 
Oct 16, 2018 7:10 PM

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Way too many questions left unanswered.

It was hinted that Katsumi Nakase may have had Reading Steiner. Guess we forgot about that.

7/10
 
Oct 18, 2018 7:21 PM

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so... steins gate I know actually starts in episode 21

but it's too late for that, zannen. Honto ni.

4/10
 
Oct 19, 2018 7:47 AM

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The final is not close well. It was seems that would be wonderful, but in the end there was a disappointment. Where is Makise Kurisu? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

The answers I see here don't conform me.

EDIT: However, don't kill me yet; I give it 10 points (ha ha).
EDIT 2: You're too f*** bad with the score.
Modified by Slain_slate, Oct 19, 2018 7:56 AM
Is there anybody out there?
 
Oct 20, 2018 9:29 AM

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Slain_slate said:
The final is not close well. It was seems that would be wonderful, but in the end there was a disappointment. Where is Makise Kurisu? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

The answers I see here don't conform me.

EDIT: However, don't kill me yet; I give it 10 points (ha ha).
EDIT 2: You're too f*** bad with the score.


After SG0 is over, you watch the final episode of the original series. This Okabe will never find happiness.
Suzuha and Mayuri are saved but Okabe will stay and die at the Event Horizon (13000 BC).
Persona 4 (Golden obviously) is better than Persona 5 imo
 
Oct 20, 2018 11:52 AM
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Mohammadalmannai said:
Slain_slate said:
The final is not close well. It was seems that would be wonderful, but in the end there was a disappointment. Where is Makise Kurisu? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

The answers I see here don't conform me.

EDIT: However, don't kill me yet; I give it 10 points (ha ha).
EDIT 2: You're too f*** bad with the score.


After SG0 is over, you watch the final episode of the original series. This Okabe will never find happiness.
Suzuha and Mayuri are saved but Okabe will stay and die at the Event Horizon (13000 BC).


Will Okabe die for sure?
 
Oct 20, 2018 11:54 AM
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Abyhape said:
all these commotion only to slap Okabe. I thought this series would come to an end where he achieved Steins Gate. as far as I remember, this is the continuation where Okabe feel down because he can't save Kurisu right?

whatever, fuck it. I'm getting tired to follow up their timeline. but still enjoying it because I loved all about conspiracy shit. 8/10.


But we already saw that in the original series. Why do they need to show us this again?
 
Oct 20, 2018 1:48 PM

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yMorgoth said:
Mohammadalmannai said:


After SG0 is over, you watch the final episode of the original series. This Okabe will never find happiness.
Suzuha and Mayuri are saved but Okabe will stay and die at the Event Horizon (13000 BC).


Will Okabe die for sure?

For SG0, Okabe dies shortly after this episode

In the original, he keeps on living.
Persona 4 (Golden obviously) is better than Persona 5 imo
 
Oct 20, 2018 3:38 PM
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Mohammadalmannai said:
yMorgoth said:


Will Okabe die for sure?

For SG0, Okabe dies shortly after this episode

In the original, he keeps on living.


I thought Zero Okabe would stay alive in another era
 
Oct 21, 2018 12:05 AM
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Mohammadalmannai said:
Suzuha and Mayuri are saved but Okabe will stay and die at the Event Horizon (13000 BC).

When was this confirmed? I'm asking because in Steins;Gate 0 (anime and visual novel) they never tell what will happen to Okabe after he saves Mayuri and Suzuha.
Modified by Phantom74, Oct 21, 2018 4:46 AM
 
Oct 21, 2018 7:17 AM

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yMorgoth said:
Abyhape said:
all these commotion only to slap Okabe. I thought this series would come to an end where he achieved Steins Gate. as far as I remember, this is the continuation where Okabe feel down because he can't save Kurisu right?

whatever, fuck it. I'm getting tired to follow up their timeline. but still enjoying it because I loved all about conspiracy shit. 8/10.


But we already saw that in the original series. Why do they need to show us this again?

all right, now I know what this is all about after rewatching episode 23 and 24 from original series.
 
Oct 30, 2018 7:53 AM

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I honestly thought this was definitely weaker than the original, like if these 23 episodes were put in with the original and it was a 47 episode season, it definitely would drag down the quality.

Lot of stuff felt redundant or not necessary but to fill in time, the litle blurb with him going to a timeline with an alive Makise and teasing Nakise having reading Steiner and then sidelining her the rest of the show. Then there's him getting randomly thrusted into the future and both of these could have been written better.

The professor being an antagonist was made so obvious here to the viewer and is quite lazy when you compare to finding out that Moeka and the bald land lord are with SERN. Then there's Alexis, who is also teased in several brief scenes as someone who probably is against Rintarou but ends up tossed to the way side as the show favors giving more air time to Kagari as Leshkinens puppet instead.

It wasn't bad, it was good although not near the level the original was, but for something that was supposed to flesh out the original ending more I still think it just opened up more questions than answers.
Modified by Venom900, Oct 30, 2018 7:58 AM


"To be yourself in a world that is constantly trying to make you something else is the greatest accomplishment"
 
Oct 31, 2018 12:45 AM

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Wow! Another great execution by White Fox! It was a great, thrilling ride while it lasted. My questions are answered and have nothing more to say about this anime. I would admit that most episodes fills me up with anxiety, but that's just the nature of this series I guess.

10/10! Superb enjoyment!
 
Nov 4, 2018 9:09 PM

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Following up on the original Steins;Gate was always going to be tough. That series hit all of the right notes for me in terms of story and characters - it felt like everything fit together into one well crafted whole. Steins;Gate 0 makes an admirable attempt at following up. It is an enjoyable series in its own right but does not match up to he quality of the original.

My issues with this sequel were that I did still have some questions that I felt were not addressed, or at least not addressed well (but that could just be due to time limitations of the adaptation). The pacing also suffered a bit in some of the middle episodes of the season. It felt like occasionally the series was just as lost and morose as Okabe was and that dragged down my enjoyment. And, while there were definitely some strong story moments and emotional scenes, S;G 0 just never quite hits the same highs as the original.

Those complaints aside, it was nice to spend more time with these characters and to see a darker take on the original concept. It is also still a better handled story than a lot of other sci-fi anime I have seen, even considering its weaknesses. Overall, I am still thinking about the exact score I would like to give it; but it would be somewhere in the 7-8 category.
 
Nov 7, 2018 9:10 AM

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Hououin Kyouma . . . The First Timelord.


There has been a lot of complaints about the whole "mad scientist gone sad scientist"... but that's just people being selfish and caring more about okabe's antics more than the actual story.

Overall, this was absolutely fantastic, and an incredible addition and expansion on the universe. There really was no better way to up the stakes and make everything more real and consequential.

Also, the idea that even a single time machine existing would be enough to shatter the world, is not something that's often enough addressed... Especially if there were competitors. Fortunately the future gadgets lab was the leader in time machine development, and nobody else had one . . . But, if anyone else had one... well, lets just say crafting a true time war, is not something that anybody but the best writers in the world could even hope to pull off, and it would be nigh incomprehensible anyways.

I've experimented with creating scenarios where time dilation is used as a weapon, and even that stretches outside of what's fathomable, a true time war that involves all thes complicated rewrite and world line nonsense, which makes existence a clusterfuck of infinities that all could cross over and interfere with one another at any point throughout all time, would be utterly inconceivable.

I found this series to be rather amazing, not what i expected, but a very worthy successor. Upon starting Steins;Gate 0, i watched all of Steins;Gate up to 23 β, and the continuity was impeccable. I'm sure if i analyzed every time skip leap and jump, i'd find plenty of holes and issues (including using "time paradox" as a plot gimmick, without justifying it), but there is so much that is valid, and frankly taking on concepts like these are obscene projects and really test your skills as a writer, the fact it was done this well is amazing, and flaws are completely excusable.

The point of Steins;Gate 0, is that Okabe didn't succeed yet. He made up his mind and gave up half way through, which is fatal to any true scientist He decided that upon saving Mayuri, that his accomplished his goal; this ofc is false. Kurisu is dead, and he's still in the middle of everything. For him to finish the fight, he had to first conquer himself, and this is what took up most of the series - Okabe's struggle with himself and despair. But ever since the beginning, there was only one right answer: you have a time machine, you can see through timelines, you have it first, you are the king of time as far as humans go... The only right answer is to gain the ideal reality he seeks. It will be hard and horrible and despairing, but ultimately, if you have the power, grasp it, and solve all of the problems that plague you. The only choice was to save everyone he wants to save, because he can.

In the end, bravo.

ps: i would have preferred keeping the first OP & ED, at least until point okarin does the time leap again and stuff starts getting intense and faster paced

Now that i finished this, time to go back to og Steins;Gate ep23
Modified by GenesisAria, Nov 7, 2018 10:17 AM
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Nov 7, 2018 11:20 AM
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GenesisAria said:
I'm sure if i analyzed every time skip leap and jump, i'd find plenty of holes and issues (including using "time paradox" as a plot gimmick, without justifying it)


No, you wouldn't find anyone. There are no paradoxes at all in Steins;Gate 0, it completely respects the rules which were established in the original Steins;Gate (unlike the movie...)
 
Nov 7, 2018 2:29 PM

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@SheevPalpatine
I didn't say paradoxes, i said holes and issues... The fact of using "time paradox" as an excuse to not do something or avoid an easier solution is in of itself, a plot issue, if that is not justified. There was never any evidence anywhere in the story that a "paradox" would cause anything, or that Okabe would be entirely unwilling to find out.
Anyways that's just the first thing that popped into my head. Perhaps you don't understand the level of depth i go to when i analyze things... if you don't know, perhaps looking at my thread about Kimi no Na wa (if you've seen it), i actually ripped it apart scene by scene, as i watched through it fully studying every aspect of it's literary design.

I sincerely doubt Steins;Gate is flawless, especially considering where the story comes from and the people that made it.
Modified by GenesisAria, Nov 7, 2018 4:55 PM
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Nov 7, 2018 4:03 PM
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GenesisAria said:
@SheevPalpatine
I didn't say paradoxes, i said holes and issues... The fact of using "time paradox" as an excuse to not do something or avoid an easier solution is in of itself, a plot issue, if that is not justified. There was never any evidence anywhere in the story that a "paradox" would cause anything, or that Okabe would be entirely unwilling to find out.

Anyways that's just the first thing that popped into my head. Perhaps you don't understand the level of depth i go to when i analyze things... if you don't know, perhaps looking at my thread about Kimi no Na wa (if you've seen it), i actually ripped it apart scene by scene, as i watched through it fully studying every aspect of it's literary design.

I sincerely doubt Steins;Gate is flawless, especially considering where the story comes from and the people that made it.


That's the point: there are no time paradoxes in Steins;Gate, because the Attractor Field modell won't allow you to make one. In the world of SG causality remains strong.

Time travel in SG is flawless, except one highly debated thing, but that was in the original (Suzuha's disappearance at the end)
 
Nov 7, 2018 5:00 PM

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@SheevPalpatine
I remember holes being discussed in og steins... but anyways, i don't have the energy to untangle this one. Also, there's no such thing as "won't allow you to make one"... There's no such thing as flawless time travel.

Another example of an issue with the story is how everyone just happens to know eachother, and all the enemies happen to be people close by etc... it's just highly improbable.

A plot hole in the time travel i can bring up right now, is why did Okabe's time leap go to the future suddenly? Or how some of them randomly remember stuff over world lines because why not, and they probably needed some kind of reason to motivate decisions? There's plenty of arbitrary cheats and convenient contrivances like that which time travel stories apply. It's way too easy to blame issues on quirks or ambiguity of the mechanics.

Another plot hole, is SERN was left and more or less forgotten, once the war topics came up... SERN was already doing time machine stuff long before Future Gadgets Lab, and could still potentially unlock a method, and cause the same chaos. There's also the couple times that Okabe felt the Reading Steiner activate when the source of the time travel effects were unknown... etc etc.
Modified by GenesisAria, Nov 7, 2018 6:16 PM
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Nov 7, 2018 10:36 PM
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GenesisAria said:

A plot hole in the time travel i can bring up right now, is why did Okabe's time leap go to the future suddenly?.


You mean episode 20? after Okabe tried to time leap it didn't worked for some reason so Okabe was living normally all those years till 2025, after his "Death" in 2025 (not really dead but was considered a vegetable by then) Daru and crew used the memory of Okabe from 2011 which was stored in Data from the failed attempt in time travel in 2011 to replace the 2025 vegetable Okabe with the 2011 Okabe. For us and Okabe it looked like it time leapt to the future but that was not the case because we only saw it from the perspective of Okabe's memory which was in data form from 2011. From the other's perspective that wasn't the case though and for them time kept running normally for years.

Because of the reasons above I don't consider this a plot hole, Steins;Gate 0 was full of other type of uninteresting shit that I hated though.
Modified by xZabuzax, Nov 8, 2018 1:18 AM
 
Nov 8, 2018 3:50 AM
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xZabuzax said:
GenesisAria said:

A plot hole in the time travel i can bring up right now, is why did Okabe's time leap go to the future suddenly?.


You mean episode 20? after Okabe tried to time leap it didn't worked for some reason so Okabe was living normally all those years till 2025, after his "Death" in 2025 (not really dead but was considered a vegetable by then) Daru and crew used the memory of Okabe from 2011 which was stored in Data from the failed attempt in time travel in 2011 to replace the 2025 vegetable Okabe with the 2011 Okabe. For us and Okabe it looked like it time leapt to the future but that was not the case because we only saw it from the perspective of Okabe's memory which was in data form from 2011. From the other's perspective that wasn't the case though and for them time kept running normally for years.

Exactly this. It was clearly explained in episode 20.

GenesisAria said:

Or how some of them randomly remember stuff over world lines because why not, and they probably needed some kind of reason to motivate decisions?

Because they are memories. And memories don't disappear, just go deep into their brain when the worldline shifts. In terms of worldline chronology, they are the memories of the "past" (here: past = previous worldlines)

GenesisAria said:

Another plot hole, is SERN was left and more or less forgotten, once the war topics came up... SERN was already doing time machine stuff long before Future Gadgets Lab

And all of that happened in Alpha Attractor Field. But the whole 0 takes place in Beta (except episode 8). In Beta, SERN never achieved anything significant in time travel.

GenesisAria said:

There's also the couple times that Okabe felt the Reading Steiner activate when the source of the time travel effects were unknown...

WWIII is about the "time machine war". Someone (possibly Russia with Nakabachi) experimented on time travel, and they modified the past successfully.
 
Nov 8, 2018 7:35 AM

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@xZabuzax
SheevPalpatine said:
xZabuzax said:
You mean episode 20? after Okabe tried to time leap it didn't worked for some reason so Okabe was living normally all those years till 2025, after his "Death" in 2025 (not really dead but was considered a vegetable by then) Daru and crew used the memory of Okabe from 2011 which was stored in Data from the failed attempt in time travel in 2011 to replace the 2025 vegetable Okabe with the 2011 Okabe. For us and Okabe it looked like it time leapt to the future but that was not the case because we only saw it from the perspective of Okabe's memory which was in data form from 2011. From the other's perspective that wasn't the case though and for them time kept running normally for years.
Exactly this. It was clearly explained in episode 20.
Then why is he in 2036? He woke because of the time leap overwriting his mind and waking him up. He didn't leap to 2025 as a recoil of the failure.
I watched through the whole episode, and that isn't a valid explanation for how it can go to the future at all, and the facts don't line up, and as usual, a highly convenient turn of events came about due to a "we don't know" excuse.


SheevPalpatine said:
GenesisAria said:

Or how some of them randomly remember stuff over world lines because why not, and they probably needed some kind of reason to motivate decisions?
Because they are memories. And memories don't disappear, just go deep into their brain when the worldline shifts. In terms of worldline chronology, they are the memories of the "past" (here: past = previous worldlines)
That's a pretty weak attempt to explain, but at least it was semi-consistent as a universal phenomenon that everyone experiences, and not just a magical select few type thing.

SheevPalpatine said:
GenesisAria said:

Another plot hole, is SERN was left and more or less forgotten, once the war topics came up... SERN was already doing time machine stuff long before Future Gadgets Lab
And all of that happened in Alpha Attractor Field. But the whole 0 takes place in Beta (except episode 8). In Beta, SERN never achieved anything significant in time travel.
The jelly man stuff was long before any of Okabe's time travel stuff had any relevance or impact.

SheevPalpatine said:
GenesisAria said:

There's also the couple times that Okabe felt the Reading Steiner activate when the source of the time travel effects were unknown...
WWIII is about the "time machine war". Someone (possibly Russia with Nakabachi) experimented on time travel, and they modified the past successfully.
Yes that was stated, but never again addressed or justified. It also means that others were able to develop time travel shit independently of the time machine and data everyone was fighting over that started the war etc. And if they succeeded back in 2011 i think it was, they would have been a leading power in time machine warfare, and had the head start on everyone else. Which of course would explain why they wanted to just scrap all the other time machine data and equipment to eliminate competitors... There's too much shit that could have come out of that, and the russians could have done far more to intercept other outcomes etc. It was a hole because it was almost completely unaddressed. The major flaw with the steins;gate universe is a conventional war being fought when time machine wars would be fought all across time, it'd be like trying to chase time lords - if you've watched much Doctor Who, you'd know what i mean when i say it's ultra convoluted.

See, stories like this can get away with a lot of shit due to using very arbitrary and ambiguous mystical models for their happenings, so they can disguise contrivances as "unexplored aspects of the mechanics". It's too easy to blame other things being different etc because of "changing world line", but without any valid causation for said differences along said timeline. If something is different, it'd be because some element changed it.


Keep in mind i haven't actually gone and analyzed every scene and mapped everything out (that's a lot of work, it takes an entire day just to do a single movie), so if i do make a genuine error, i'll own it, but i haven't seen much of that yet.
Modified by GenesisAria, Nov 8, 2018 7:44 AM
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