Shingeki no Kyojin Chapter 101 Discussion

Jan 8, 2018 8:28 PM

#101

Fake_Williams

Offline

Apr 2016

429

Who could have expected the ordinary looking maid to be the holder of the Warhammer Titan.

Jan 9, 2018 12:29 AM

#102

windeen-windy

Offline

Mar 2009

3709

Under a spoiler for space saving:

AzorAhai said:

windeen-windy said:

Then if you don't check- don't use gender specific terms if you don't bother checking profiles.
Some females (like me) take offense to that while others don't.
And it's the main reason I was so PO'ed.
I won't get into my dislike of the term "my bad" though or how insincere it comes across.

As for this: Why don't I have faith?
That question is a bit too personal.
I could go into all of the first-hand reasons why I don't. But I doubt anyone here cares, and don't want to seem like I'm sympathy grabbing.
I will just say that I've seen the worst that children can do to others, first-hand. And they do it quite happily, without care what harm they are doing to others.
And tjose types of children take great joy in the physical and emotional pain that they cause others.

I'm not saying that they should be killed if they are redeemable. But if they aren't (and I have met a number of people in reality who are not redeemable- because they continued doing the things they did, after attempts to stop them and make them understand before and after they reached adult-hood) then they should be eliminated in one way or another (locked away for life is one option, killing isn't the only way).

And I don't care what anyone thinks about that POV. Its one I've had since I was a child when I had to mentally grow up fast in order to survive dealing with the other children and what they were all putting me through (and there were a lot of them. It was NOT (in case you think to say that I'm jaded because of what a handful of people did to me and others) a handful).
I wouldn't have mentioned it at all, except you mentioned my lack of faith in others and my humanity.

I am aware that people are normally USUALLY redeemable. But, in the situation of THIS story, those people's minds are so fu@ked up that I don't think that the majority of them are.
The only way to deal with the lot of them is either lock them away and try to redeem them while they b!tch and moan about how horrible their other side is, or put them (because of their fear due to the brainwashing) out of their misery and other's as well.
The majority of the examples of characters I have seen in this side of the story are bat-sh!t crazy and afraid of the other side because of what they have been told by those above them.
The Japanese at least knew what Hiro Hito was doing was wrong, and they stopped when the US put their foot down. I mentioned Hitler because the mentality of the people he controlled was more in line with what I am seeing in this manga.... As far as I can tell from EVERYTHING I have read about ive.
Anyway.
Though I do admit- some of, if not most of, the Nazi youths were able to be redeemed and enter into society as "normal" productive (and like the former Pope- repentant people. I'm not intending to say that they all were not redeemable- if that's how it came across, I'm sorry).
As for my faith in other humans, I have none, as a general rule, unless I am given a reason to. While some people have given me reason to- I've seen far more reasons not to.
The latest reason being: the child of someone I know was just molested by another child on new year's eve. And she was told it would be at least a year before the boy could even be arrested. And that is the soonest that they could do anything.
Sorry if my opinions seem inhumane but I've got my reasons. Just like I'm sure you have your reasons to think the way you do.

I'll be honest I wasn't rally sorry for the "my bad i didn't check gender" thing and though it probably changes nothing I never though that the word "dude" would be considered offensive to someone because to me it's more a unisex word rather than masculine only, but i understand i was wrong and am sincerely sorry this time for sure.

Now, as far as i know even today Japanese don't blame hirohito for ww2. After all, his generals were the ones pulling the strings and hirohito was the one who eventually went against their will to continue fighting, saving japan from another nuke as a result. I cant agree that Japanese knew about atrocities Japanese soldier did everywhere, and even those few who did would never spread the word fearing they'd be labelled as traitors. Even majority of Germans were unaware that concentration camps existed. Why I'm saying this is that people back than, or in this manga world are similarly easy to deceive since there is no free information source available, such as internet for example.

Now the big one begins.
It seems you have been through a lot. I myself, for example, was a very shy and quiet boy, I have been bullied by kids older and younger than me, i have been manipulated and have done things against my will in order to be appreciated and to look "cool" in other people's eyes. Back than I was so weak-willed, pitiful and lost. Unlike you it took me up to age of 20 to actually come out of a shell of an insecure, helpless kid. Remembering the past there was more than one occasion when I could have become a completely different - to what I am now - person; those other paths would have lead me to either a prison or an early grave...or I would just lock myself and get drunk...but that's an early grave too I suppose. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to initiate "who suffered the most as a kid" contest. I'm certain many others, if not everybody had their share of hell as kids. Was it only luck that we didn't become somebody else? somebody worse? Why didn't I lose faith in others considering how there was not a single person there to support me? it will be a lie to say that even after "maturing mentally" (I think I did mature ;)...) I don't hate those people for what they made me to go through (after all, they involuntarily played a huge role in making me a better person. Please don't think I'm saying this because I'm in love with myself or something, though I definitely am not ashamed of myself either) , if I were to one day see them in danger (life-death situation) I'd still rush for help without ever considering "serves you right b!tch" or something in similar fashion. I don't' know, maybe my outlook on life is too different, but our existence itself is a mystery, it's magical, it's wonderful... why shouldn't we be amazed with such gift? Why shouldn't we all do our best to protect it? Lives, our own and of others... Since childhood I've been thinking about lots of different things - a lot; and when you think about it, won't you agree that no human is born good or evil? Who made us like this? Is it god that decides our fate? nature? luck determines it all? - perhaps. But, It is our parents, society and environment that shapes our personalities and influences our development as human beings the most.

Just for a moment everyone should put themselves in the boots of people they disagree/hate/fight against.. People like bullies, killers, thieves. Something must have happened in their lives that turned them into such people right? Unless one believes that a person can be rotten from age 0, we should understand that a chain of events led a person's transformation from a cute crying newborn baby, to a merciless serial killer, dictator...or an average bully. In different circumstances I'm sure any of us could have been either good or bad. Now you might ask "so what should we do with such people? accept them as "normal" members of society"? No, of course not! But we should fight against it with different weapons. When a crime is committed, there should always be punishment. But we should at least try to understand these people before judging them; understanding isn't the same as forgiving; and only through understanding, rather than simple hate or vengeance can we build a better world. If there is at least a glimpse of hope that a person can change we should encourage them to change instead of treating them as "human-waste" or "oxygen-thieves". Things are much more complicated when we talk about not a single individual, but a group of people and even an entire nation! When it comes to brainwashing masses, we, who realize their unfortunate state, should always consider giving these people chances after chances. Take North Korea for example, the entire nation is a pure example of BRAINWASHED. like Marleyans consider Paradisians to be threat to the world, our world considers N.Korea to be an equal threat the same way. Most of its soldiers will gladly sacrifice their lives for their god-leader. Why aren't we putting these people out of their miserable, filled with lies, oppression and famine, lives? If a war breaks out, should we be ok with eliminating 90% of their population without second thought? We shouldn't make fun of these people, we shouldn't hate them or provoke them, we should be trying to guide them towards salvation. Such people should be given a chance to change; they already suffer enough on their own. Now back to the topic, when Eren just bashed his way through the building he left these type of people without any chance to change; without them ever knowing the real world, the truth. Unless you gave up on people and think that it's fine if one or some of these people get accidentally squashed, one would think twice before acting so reckless. Now don't think by saying all this i'm bashing Eren or these series only, there were/are characters who think and act the same way. None of them shall receive any sympathy from me.
When I see brainwashed kids getting squashed, I can't feel anything but sorrow for them. No way can i be fine with them getting killed, even if they'd be glad to see other people getting annihilated, I still see them as "lost souls" who need guidance towards the right path. Let's take North Korea for example again; say war breaks out and we bomb them to oblivion, a lot of brainwashed kids - who are future brainwashed soldiers and generals - would inevitably die horrible deaths; knowing this, should we nuke them first and fast because there's no hope for them anyway, or should we help them with all we can give?

P.S I still don't get it why you're so certain that people shown in manga are mostly all irredeemable, saying their minds are too F-d up! I'd say this story doesn't even come close to how actual people were mind fk-d during ww2, vietnam, Korean war and/or others :) list can go on forever...

I might sound too naive or I might be hoping for the impossible, but no matter the person, I can't look lightly at their suffering or deaths because, me and you and anybody else, if we were to be born in their place in same environment we would most likely think and act the same way because for us that kind of life would be considered normal... I wouldn't want the world to give up on me; if i were to be some average kid in North Korea, i wouldn't want the world to look at me as "unavoidable casualty of a coming war against evil" or "cannon fodder" or "selfless, mindless zombie". I realize not many will agree with my POV. After all, there are people who are trigger-happy, some hesitate and some refuse to even touch a weapon for a reason. But if we could all value the lives of others equally priceless, we would not think about taking up arms at all. Now after reading you story about kids who were given chances to change but still refused to do so, i understand that not every single one of them can be "saved" myself; but understanding this shouldn't get in our way when we encounter another, similar problem.

Now after reading all this, one would wonder why I even read violence filled manga such as this one? Well that's the kind of person I am. Violence has always been part of this world and i, a temporary guest here, am not planning to cover my ears and eyes in order to live in a fantasy world where there's global peace and only good people around. Still, after reading or seeing stories such as this, why should we consider its dark contents as "that's how life works", instead of "that's how life SHOULDN'T work". If you accept that the world is a vile, brutal and merciless place, others will look at it the same way and the world will indeed become like that. Eventually we will be one brainwashed race that (with ever-growing population) loses faith in itself and human life becomes cheaper than livestock . Perhaps we are destined to face such sad end, i mean come on, movies like "Django unchained" or "inglorious bastards" is beloved by so many people... I don't even know what to expect...
...as lame as it sounds, i feel sorry for people like me - for still hoping that we can become better.

P.S.S disclaimer: just like you i don't want to seem like I'm sympathy grabbing. i'm writing about myself and my POV because i feel like doing so and i don't seek any "special treatment", compassion or fame or something like that by writing this...
Butttt, i do apologize beforehand if reading all that was written above was like going through a "huge pile of SH!T" for you! ;) I still failed to really express myself as i wanted to, and a rather small number of Engrish words in my vocabulary didn't help my cause as well - making me sound like a drunkard or a whiny kid or something. that's why I kept editing and editing and editing the same comment for the 100th time already ;)

I don't disagree with everything you say. And I likely don't come across as I intend to, either. I still have PTSD to this day, even though its been a little over 20 years since I was pulled out of the situation I was in

So, because of my PTSD I am not good at expressing myself either.
Added to that that I am also Dyslexic(the main reason for why I was treated the way I was-most if the kids in my place had some sort of learning disability).

I guess I came across as a cold-hearted b!tch- which... I don't deny I am, at times.
I have aggravated my bleeding-heart best friend to the point of her nearly not talking to me a few times, with how cold I can be.

But I guess she takes into account the fact of things I've been through and that I am not as cold as I come across as being (though if something happens that is in any way connected to the people who hurt me, I usually say good riddance or they deserved it and that usually sends her into ballistic mode for a time).

Anyway. As I said. I don't disagree with all of what you said. But, I also don't agree with all of it, either.
I don't want to argue about this any more, though.
So I will just leave it at that.
We both have our own opinions and our reasons for them.

And we both also seem to be completely invested in our opinions and reasons.
So, neither of us is likely to be changing the other's opinions, or agreeing completely with each other, either.
I will say that I do think you're views (some of them) are a bit naïve. Since you said that. I figured I should address that. Also, you expressed yourself just fine. I've seen others who are from native English speaking countries (not sure of the general English proficiency of the people from Georgia (for those from America here who see this, I'm talking about the country. Not the US State of Georgia... I should hope those from the state would have a grasp on English, and those I meet from it seem to communicate just fine- I'm not intending to insult people from the state or country by what I just said) I don't know if its mandatory to learn it or not there)... Who can't even properly (or even attempt to try) to form even one sentence. Your English is just fine. You don't sound insane, stupid or drunk. Just a bit naïve (IMO)....

Anyway, that's what I had to say. Also. Most females might not take issue to being referred to as "dude"... But I do. So, sorry I jumped all over you. But its always been a gender specific thing to me. Most guys wouldn't want to be called by a female specific term either (I do know one who is transitioning into a woman though, so he might be an exception, I suppose).
And thank you for the apology.
I think you really do mean it, this time.

Jan 9, 2018 12:42 AM

#103

Stark700

Online

Nov 2011

127893

The Warhammer Titan better gets its own badass theme someday when it airs on TV.

It might take some time for me to get used to the current Mikasa but she's still cool as ever.

Jan 9, 2018 1:45 AM

#104

Edylson

Offline

May 2017

338

AzorAhai said:

windeen-windy said:

Then if you don't check- don't use gender specific terms if you don't bother checking profiles.
Some females (like me) take offense to that while others don't.
And it's the main reason I was so PO'ed.
I won't get into my dislike of the term "my bad" though or how insincere it comes across.

As for this: Why don't I have faith?
That question is a bit too personal.
I could go into all of the first-hand reasons why I don't. But I doubt anyone here cares, and don't want to seem like I'm sympathy grabbing.
I will just say that I've seen the worst that children can do to others, first-hand. And they do it quite happily, without care what harm they are doing to others.
And tjose types of children take great joy in the physical and emotional pain that they cause others.

I'm not saying that they should be killed if they are redeemable. But if they aren't (and I have met a number of people in reality who are not redeemable- because they continued doing the things they did, after attempts to stop them and make them understand before and after they reached adult-hood) then they should be eliminated in one way or another (locked away for life is one option, killing isn't the only way).

And I don't care what anyone thinks about that POV. Its one I've had since I was a child when I had to mentally grow up fast in order to survive dealing with the other children and what they were all putting me through (and there were a lot of them. It was NOT (in case you think to say that I'm jaded because of what a handful of people did to me and others) a handful).
I wouldn't have mentioned it at all, except you mentioned my lack of faith in others and my humanity.

I am aware that people are normally USUALLY redeemable. But, in the situation of THIS story, those people's minds are so fu@ked up that I don't think that the majority of them are.
The only way to deal with the lot of them is either lock them away and try to redeem them while they b!tch and moan about how horrible their other side is, or put them (because of their fear due to the brainwashing) out of their misery and other's as well.
The majority of the examples of characters I have seen in this side of the story are bat-sh!t crazy and afraid of the other side because of what they have been told by those above them.
The Japanese at least knew what Hiro Hito was doing was wrong, and they stopped when the US put their foot down. I mentioned Hitler because the mentality of the people he controlled was more in line with what I am seeing in this manga.... As far as I can tell from EVERYTHING I have read about ive.
Anyway.
Though I do admit- some of, if not most of, the Nazi youths were able to be redeemed and enter into society as "normal" productive (and like the former Pope- repentant people. I'm not intending to say that they all were not redeemable- if that's how it came across, I'm sorry).
As for my faith in other humans, I have none, as a general rule, unless I am given a reason to. While some people have given me reason to- I've seen far more reasons not to.
The latest reason being: the child of someone I know was just molested by another child on new year's eve. And she was told it would be at least a year before the boy could even be arrested. And that is the soonest that they could do anything.
Sorry if my opinions seem inhumane but I've got my reasons. Just like I'm sure you have your reasons to think the way you do.

I'll be honest I wasn't rally sorry for the "my bad i didn't check gender" thing and though it probably changes nothing I never though that the word "dude" would be considered offensive to someone because to me it's more a unisex word rather than masculine only, but i understand i was wrong and am sincerely sorry this time for sure.

Now, as far as i know even today Japanese don't blame hirohito for ww2. After all, his generals were the ones pulling the strings and hirohito was the one who eventually went against their will to continue fighting, saving japan from another nuke as a result. I cant agree that Japanese knew about atrocities Japanese soldier did everywhere, and even those few who did would never spread the word fearing they'd be labelled as traitors. Even majority of Germans were unaware that concentration camps existed. Why I'm saying this is that people back than, or in this manga world are similarly easy to deceive since there is no free information source available, such as internet for example.

Now the big one begins.
It seems you have been through a lot. I myself, for example, was a very shy and quiet boy, I have been bullied by kids older and younger than me, i have been manipulated and have done things against my will in order to be appreciated and to look "cool" in other people's eyes. Back than I was so weak-willed, pitiful and lost. Unlike you it took me up to age of 20 to actually come out of a shell of an insecure, helpless kid. Remembering the past there was more than one occasion when I could have become a completely different - to what I am now - person; those other paths would have lead me to either a prison or an early grave...or I would just lock myself and get drunk...but that's an early grave too I suppose. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to initiate "who suffered the most as a kid" contest. I'm certain many others, if not everybody had their share of hell as kids. Was it only luck that we didn't become somebody else? somebody worse? Why didn't I lose faith in others considering how there was not a single person there to support me? it will be a lie to say that even after "maturing mentally" (I think I did mature ;)...) I don't hate those people for what they made me to go through (after all, they involuntarily played a huge role in making me a better person. Please don't think I'm saying this because I'm in love with myself or something, though I definitely am not ashamed of myself either) , if I were to one day see them in danger (life-death situation) I'd still rush for help without ever considering "serves you right b!tch" or something in similar fashion. I don't' know, maybe my outlook on life is too different, but our existence itself is a mystery, it's magical, it's wonderful... why shouldn't we be amazed with such gift? Why shouldn't we all do our best to protect it? Lives, our own and of others... Since childhood I've been thinking about lots of different things - a lot; and when you think about it, won't you agree that no human is born good or evil? Who made us like this? Is it god that decides our fate? nature? luck determines it all? - perhaps. But, It is our parents, society and environment that shapes our personalities and influences our development as human beings the most.

Just for a moment everyone should put themselves in the boots of people they disagree/hate/fight against.. People like bullies, killers, thieves. Something must have happened in their lives that turned them into such people right? Unless one believes that a person can be rotten from age 0, we should understand that a chain of events led a person's transformation from a cute crying newborn baby, to a merciless serial killer, dictator...or an average bully. In different circumstances I'm sure any of us could have been either good or bad. Now you might ask "so what should we do with such people? accept them as "normal" members of society"? No, of course not! But we should fight against it with different weapons. When a crime is committed, there should always be punishment. But we should at least try to understand these people before judging them; understanding isn't the same as forgiving; and only through understanding, rather than simple hate or vengeance can we build a better world. If there is at least a glimpse of hope that a person can change we should encourage them to change instead of treating them as "human-waste" or "oxygen-thieves". Things are much more complicated when we talk about not a single individual, but a group of people and even an entire nation! When it comes to brainwashing masses, we, who realize their unfortunate state, should always consider giving these people chances after chances. Take North Korea for example, the entire nation is a pure example of BRAINWASHED. like Marleyans consider Paradisians to be threat to the world, our world considers N.Korea to be an equal threat the same way. Most of its soldiers will gladly sacrifice their lives for their god-leader. Why aren't we putting these people out of their miserable, filled with lies, oppression and famine, lives? If a war breaks out, should we be ok with eliminating 90% of their population without second thought? We shouldn't make fun of these people, we shouldn't hate them or provoke them, we should be trying to guide them towards salvation. Such people should be given a chance to change; they already suffer enough on their own. Now back to the topic, when Eren just bashed his way through the building he left these type of people without any chance to change; without them ever knowing the real world, the truth. Unless you gave up on people and think that it's fine if one or some of these people get accidentally squashed, one would think twice before acting so reckless. Now don't think by saying all this i'm bashing Eren or these series only, there were/are characters who think and act the same way. None of them shall receive any sympathy from me.
When I see brainwashed kids getting squashed, I can't feel anything but sorrow for them. No way can i be fine with them getting killed, even if they'd be glad to see other people getting annihilated, I still see them as "lost souls" who need guidance towards the right path. Let's take North Korea for example again; say war breaks out and we bomb them to oblivion, a lot of brainwashed kids - who are future brainwashed soldiers and generals - would inevitably die horrible deaths; knowing this, should we nuke them first and fast because there's no hope for them anyway, or should we help them with all we can give?

P.S I still don't get it why you're so certain that people shown in manga are mostly all irredeemable, saying their minds are too F-d up! I'd say this story doesn't even come close to how actual people were mind fk-d during ww2, vietnam, Korean war and/or others :) list can go on forever...

I might sound too naive or I might be hoping for the impossible, but no matter the person, I can't look lightly at their suffering or deaths because, me and you and anybody else, if we were to be born in their place in same environment we would most likely think and act the same way because for us that kind of life would be considered normal... I wouldn't want the world to give up on me; if i were to be some average kid in North Korea, i wouldn't want the world to look at me as "unavoidable casualty of a coming war against evil" or "cannon fodder" or "selfless, mindless zombie". I realize not many will agree with my POV. After all, there are people who are trigger-happy, some hesitate and some refuse to even touch a weapon for a reason. But if we could all value the lives of others equally priceless, we would not think about taking up arms at all. Now after reading you story about kids who were given chances to change but still refused to do so, i understand that not every single one of them can be "saved" myself; but understanding this shouldn't get in our way when we encounter another, similar problem.

Now after reading all this, one would wonder why I even read violence filled manga such as this one? Well that's the kind of person I am. Violence has always been part of this world and i, a temporary guest here, am not planning to cover my ears and eyes in order to live in a fantasy world where there's global peace and only good people around. Still, after reading or seeing stories such as this, why should we consider its dark contents as "that's how life works", instead of "that's how life SHOULDN'T work". If you accept that the world is a vile, brutal and merciless place, others will look at it the same way and the world will indeed become like that. Eventually we will be one brainwashed race that (with ever-growing population) loses faith in itself and human life becomes cheaper than livestock . Perhaps we are destined to face such sad end, i mean come on, movies like "Django unchained" or "inglorious bastards" is beloved by so many people... I don't even know what to expect...
...as lame as it sounds, i feel sorry for people like me - for still hoping that we can become better.

P.S.S disclaimer: just like you i don't want to seem like I'm sympathy grabbing. i'm writing about myself and my POV because i feel like doing so and i don't seek any "special treatment", compassion or fame or something like that by writing this...
Butttt, i do apologize beforehand if reading all that was written above was like going through a "huge pile of SH!T" for you! ;) I still failed to really express myself as i wanted to, and a rather small number of Engrish words in my vocabulary didn't help my cause as well - making me sound like a drunkard or a whiny kid or something. that's why I kept editing and editing and editing the same comment for the 100th time already ;)

Well u know what they say, u dont need to like the main character for a series to be good *cough* Death *cough* Note *cough!*! But you'r taking this manga way too seriously, it is a dark fantasy after all
And i can understand eren's actions, even tough they may not be justified, even tough u may not like him, its an interesting turn!! Im smelling flashbacks in the next chapters since this is coming to an end according to Isayama!!

P.S. Can somebody plz explain to me why the f*** is this series tagged as shounen?!!

Jan 9, 2018 2:11 AM

#105

Salamander2170

Offline

Aug 2012

4703

Edylson said:

AzorAhai said:

windeen-windy said:

AzorAhai said:

First, I'm not a dude. Calling me one is the quickest way to tick me off and flip my b!tch switch.

huh my bad, i don't usually check people's profiles for their gender...

Second, that's not what I said at all.
3d it wasn't a friggen festival in the first place! It was a war rally and I didn't say a damn thing about the Japanese....

I know you didn't say it lol, i just made an example. After reading this:

"And as far as I'm concerned, most of those "innocent people" (children included) would gladly see anyone (combatants or not) from the island murdered and get popcorn for the viewing of the carnage... Most of them are so far into their brainwashed little worlds that it would likely be near impossible to reform them into any other mindset.
And by that way of thinking, they should be killed. "

i wrote Japan thing because during ww2 i'm sure a lot of Americans thought the same way about Japanese people... how they're fanatical and even kids are brainwashed to a level of no return. Not saying Japanese weren't brainwashed, but how come they changed? Despite the fact Japanese were brainwashed U.S troops didn't "give up" on their humanity and didn't accept "should be killed" "policy"... Do you maybe think Japanese people weren't as brainwashed as people in manga? The way you say "they should be killed it's too late for them" is pretty disappointing thing to hear from a human being... Why don't you have faith?

Then if you don't check- don't use gender specific terms if you don't bother checking profiles.
Some females (like me) take offense to that while others don't.
And it's the main reason I was so PO'ed.
I won't get into my dislike of the term "my bad" though or how insincere it comes across.

As for this: Why don't I have faith?
That question is a bit too personal.
I could go into all of the first-hand reasons why I don't. But I doubt anyone here cares, and don't want to seem like I'm sympathy grabbing.
I will just say that I've seen the worst that children can do to others, first-hand. And they do it quite happily, without care what harm they are doing to others.
And tjose types of children take great joy in the physical and emotional pain that they cause others.

I'm not saying that they should be killed if they are redeemable. But if they aren't (and I have met a number of people in reality who are not redeemable- because they continued doing the things they did, after attempts to stop them and make them understand before and after they reached adult-hood) then they should be eliminated in one way or another (locked away for life is one option, killing isn't the only way).

And I don't care what anyone thinks about that POV. Its one I've had since I was a child when I had to mentally grow up fast in order to survive dealing with the other children and what they were all putting me through (and there were a lot of them. It was NOT (in case you think to say that I'm jaded because of what a handful of people did to me and others) a handful).
I wouldn't have mentioned it at all, except you mentioned my lack of faith in others and my humanity.

I am aware that people are normally USUALLY redeemable. But, in the situation of THIS story, those people's minds are so fu@ked up that I don't think that the majority of them are.
The only way to deal with the lot of them is either lock them away and try to redeem them while they b!tch and moan about how horrible their other side is, or put them (because of their fear due to the brainwashing) out of their misery and other's as well.
The majority of the examples of characters I have seen in this side of the story are bat-sh!t crazy and afraid of the other side because of what they have been told by those above them.
The Japanese at least knew what Hiro Hito was doing was wrong, and they stopped when the US put their foot down. I mentioned Hitler because the mentality of the people he controlled was more in line with what I am seeing in this manga.... As far as I can tell from EVERYTHING I have read about ive.
Anyway.
Though I do admit- some of, if not most of, the Nazi youths were able to be redeemed and enter into society as "normal" productive (and like the former Pope- repentant people. I'm not intending to say that they all were not redeemable- if that's how it came across, I'm sorry).
As for my faith in other humans, I have none, as a general rule, unless I am given a reason to. While some people have given me reason to- I've seen far more reasons not to.
The latest reason being: the child of someone I know was just molested by another child on new year's eve. And she was told it would be at least a year before the boy could even be arrested. And that is the soonest that they could do anything.
Sorry if my opinions seem inhumane but I've got my reasons. Just like I'm sure you have your reasons to think the way you do.

I'll be honest I wasn't rally sorry for the "my bad i didn't check gender" thing and though it probably changes nothing I never though that the word "dude" would be considered offensive to someone because to me it's more a unisex word rather than masculine only, but i understand i was wrong and am sincerely sorry this time for sure.

Now, as far as i know even today Japanese don't blame hirohito for ww2. After all, his generals were the ones pulling the strings and hirohito was the one who eventually went against their will to continue fighting, saving japan from another nuke as a result. I cant agree that Japanese knew about atrocities Japanese soldier did everywhere, and even those few who did would never spread the word fearing they'd be labelled as traitors. Even majority of Germans were unaware that concentration camps existed. Why I'm saying this is that people back than, or in this manga world are similarly easy to deceive since there is no free information source available, such as internet for example.

Now the big one begins.
It seems you have been through a lot. I myself, for example, was a very shy and quiet boy, I have been bullied by kids older and younger than me, i have been manipulated and have done things against my will in order to be appreciated and to look "cool" in other people's eyes. Back than I was so weak-willed, pitiful and lost. Unlike you it took me up to age of 20 to actually come out of a shell of an insecure, helpless kid. Remembering the past there was more than one occasion when I could have become a completely different - to what I am now - person; those other paths would have lead me to either a prison or an early grave...or I would just lock myself and get drunk...but that's an early grave too I suppose. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to initiate "who suffered the most as a kid" contest. I'm certain many others, if not everybody had their share of hell as kids. Was it only luck that we didn't become somebody else? somebody worse? Why didn't I lose faith in others considering how there was not a single person there to support me? it will be a lie to say that even after "maturing mentally" (I think I did mature ;)...) I don't hate those people for what they made me to go through (after all, they involuntarily played a huge role in making me a better person. Please don't think I'm saying this because I'm in love with myself or something, though I definitely am not ashamed of myself either) , if I were to one day see them in danger (life-death situation) I'd still rush for help without ever considering "serves you right b!tch" or something in similar fashion. I don't' know, maybe my outlook on life is too different, but our existence itself is a mystery, it's magical, it's wonderful... why shouldn't we be amazed with such gift? Why shouldn't we all do our best to protect it? Lives, our own and of others... Since childhood I've been thinking about lots of different things - a lot; and when you think about it, won't you agree that no human is born good or evil? Who made us like this? Is it god that decides our fate? nature? luck determines it all? - perhaps. But, It is our parents, society and environment that shapes our personalities and influences our development as human beings the most.

Just for a moment everyone should put themselves in the boots of people they disagree/hate/fight against.. People like bullies, killers, thieves. Something must have happened in their lives that turned them into such people right? Unless one believes that a person can be rotten from age 0, we should understand that a chain of events led a person's transformation from a cute crying newborn baby, to a merciless serial killer, dictator...or an average bully. In different circumstances I'm sure any of us could have been either good or bad. Now you might ask "so what should we do with such people? accept them as "normal" members of society"? No, of course not! But we should fight against it with different weapons. When a crime is committed, there should always be punishment. But we should at least try to understand these people before judging them; understanding isn't the same as forgiving; and only through understanding, rather than simple hate or vengeance can we build a better world. If there is at least a glimpse of hope that a person can change we should encourage them to change instead of treating them as "human-waste" or "oxygen-thieves". Things are much more complicated when we talk about not a single individual, but a group of people and even an entire nation! When it comes to brainwashing masses, we, who realize their unfortunate state, should always consider giving these people chances after chances. Take North Korea for example, the entire nation is a pure example of BRAINWASHED. like Marleyans consider Paradisians to be threat to the world, our world considers N.Korea to be an equal threat the same way. Most of its soldiers will gladly sacrifice their lives for their god-leader. Why aren't we putting these people out of their miserable, filled with lies, oppression and famine, lives? If a war breaks out, should we be ok with eliminating 90% of their population without second thought? We shouldn't make fun of these people, we shouldn't hate them or provoke them, we should be trying to guide them towards salvation. Such people should be given a chance to change; they already suffer enough on their own. Now back to the topic, when Eren just bashed his way through the building he left these type of people without any chance to change; without them ever knowing the real world, the truth. Unless you gave up on people and think that it's fine if one or some of these people get accidentally squashed, one would think twice before acting so reckless. Now don't think by saying all this i'm bashing Eren or these series only, there were/are characters who think and act the same way. None of them shall receive any sympathy from me.
When I see brainwashed kids getting squashed, I can't feel anything but sorrow for them. No way can i be fine with them getting killed, even if they'd be glad to see other people getting annihilated, I still see them as "lost souls" who need guidance towards the right path. Let's take North Korea for example again; say war breaks out and we bomb them to oblivion, a lot of brainwashed kids - who are future brainwashed soldiers and generals - would inevitably die horrible deaths; knowing this, should we nuke them first and fast because there's no hope for them anyway, or should we help them with all we can give?

P.S I still don't get it why you're so certain that people shown in manga are mostly all irredeemable, saying their minds are too F-d up! I'd say this story doesn't even come close to how actual people were mind fk-d during ww2, vietnam, Korean war and/or others :) list can go on forever...

I might sound too naive or I might be hoping for the impossible, but no matter the person, I can't look lightly at their suffering or deaths because, me and you and anybody else, if we were to be born in their place in same environment we would most likely think and act the same way because for us that kind of life would be considered normal... I wouldn't want the world to give up on me; if i were to be some average kid in North Korea, i wouldn't want the world to look at me as "unavoidable casualty of a coming war against evil" or "cannon fodder" or "selfless, mindless zombie". I realize not many will agree with my POV. After all, there are people who are trigger-happy, some hesitate and some refuse to even touch a weapon for a reason. But if we could all value the lives of others equally priceless, we would not think about taking up arms at all. Now after reading you story about kids who were given chances to change but still refused to do so, i understand that not every single one of them can be "saved" myself; but understanding this shouldn't get in our way when we encounter another, similar problem.

Now after reading all this, one would wonder why I even read violence filled manga such as this one? Well that's the kind of person I am. Violence has always been part of this world and i, a temporary guest here, am not planning to cover my ears and eyes in order to live in a fantasy world where there's global peace and only good people around. Still, after reading or seeing stories such as this, why should we consider its dark contents as "that's how life works", instead of "that's how life SHOULDN'T work". If you accept that the world is a vile, brutal and merciless place, others will look at it the same way and the world will indeed become like that. Eventually we will be one brainwashed race that (with ever-growing population) loses faith in itself and human life becomes cheaper than livestock . Perhaps we are destined to face such sad end, i mean come on, movies like "Django unchained" or "inglorious bastards" is beloved by so many people... I don't even know what to expect...
...as lame as it sounds, i feel sorry for people like me - for still hoping that we can become better.

P.S.S disclaimer: just like you i don't want to seem like I'm sympathy grabbing. i'm writing about myself and my POV because i feel like doing so and i don't seek any "special treatment", compassion or fame or something like that by writing this...
Butttt, i do apologize beforehand if reading all that was written above was like going through a "huge pile of SH!T" for you! ;) I still failed to really express myself as i wanted to, and a rather small number of Engrish words in my vocabulary didn't help my cause as well - making me sound like a drunkard or a whiny kid or something. that's why I kept editing and editing and editing the same comment for the 100th time already ;)

Well u know what they say, u dont need to like the main character for a series to be good *cough* Death *cough* Note *cough!*! But you'r taking this manga way too seriously, it is a dark fantasy after all
And i can understand eren's actions, even tough they may not be justified, even tough u may not like him, its an interesting turn!! Im smelling flashbacks in the next chapters since this is coming to an end according to Isayama!!

P.S. Can somebody plz explain to me why the f*** is this series tagged as shounen?!!

It's published in Bessatsu "Shonen" Magazine

Jan 9, 2018 5:54 AM

#106

keragamming

Offline

Oct 2013

12258

Stark700 said:
The Warhammer Titan better gets its own badass theme someday when it airs on TV.

It might take some time for me to get used to the current Mikasa but she's still cool as ever.

A bit too skinny and straight imo, Isayama is not good in drawing sexy female characters body.

I'm not asking for fairy tail or one piece type of curve, but she could get a bit.

Jan 9, 2018 1:25 PM

#107

Aezeryel

Offline

Nov 2017

182

In2TheBlu said:
So, powerwise, where would you rank the Warhammer Titan? Do you think Eren could take her down in a fair 1v1?

Nah, we saw it in the chapter. He attacked first and got rekt anyway. Even with the power of hardening he couldn't withstand the blow from the hammer.

Jan 9, 2018 2:12 PM

#108

In2TheBlu

Offline

Jul 2015

121

AzorAhai said:

windeen-windy said:

Then if you don't check- don't use gender specific terms if you don't bother checking profiles.
Some females (like me) take offense to that while others don't.
And it's the main reason I was so PO'ed.
I won't get into my dislike of the term "my bad" though or how insincere it comes across.

As for this: Why don't I have faith?
That question is a bit too personal.
I could go into all of the first-hand reasons why I don't. But I doubt anyone here cares, and don't want to seem like I'm sympathy grabbing.
I will just say that I've seen the worst that children can do to others, first-hand. And they do it quite happily, without care what harm they are doing to others.
And tjose types of children take great joy in the physical and emotional pain that they cause others.

I'm not saying that they should be killed if they are redeemable. But if they aren't (and I have met a number of people in reality who are not redeemable- because they continued doing the things they did, after attempts to stop them and make them understand before and after they reached adult-hood) then they should be eliminated in one way or another (locked away for life is one option, killing isn't the only way).

And I don't care what anyone thinks about that POV. Its one I've had since I was a child when I had to mentally grow up fast in order to survive dealing with the other children and what they were all putting me through (and there were a lot of them. It was NOT (in case you think to say that I'm jaded because of what a handful of people did to me and others) a handful).
I wouldn't have mentioned it at all, except you mentioned my lack of faith in others and my humanity.

I am aware that people are normally USUALLY redeemable. But, in the situation of THIS story, those people's minds are so fu@ked up that I don't think that the majority of them are.
The only way to deal with the lot of them is either lock them away and try to redeem them while they b!tch and moan about how horrible their other side is, or put them (because of their fear due to the brainwashing) out of their misery and other's as well.
The majority of the examples of characters I have seen in this side of the story are bat-sh!t crazy and afraid of the other side because of what they have been told by those above them.
The Japanese at least knew what Hiro Hito was doing was wrong, and they stopped when the US put their foot down. I mentioned Hitler because the mentality of the people he controlled was more in line with what I am seeing in this manga.... As far as I can tell from EVERYTHING I have read about ive.
Anyway.
Though I do admit- some of, if not most of, the Nazi youths were able to be redeemed and enter into society as "normal" productive (and like the former Pope- repentant people. I'm not intending to say that they all were not redeemable- if that's how it came across, I'm sorry).
As for my faith in other humans, I have none, as a general rule, unless I am given a reason to. While some people have given me reason to- I've seen far more reasons not to.
The latest reason being: the child of someone I know was just molested by another child on new year's eve. And she was told it would be at least a year before the boy could even be arrested. And that is the soonest that they could do anything.
Sorry if my opinions seem inhumane but I've got my reasons. Just like I'm sure you have your reasons to think the way you do.

I'll be honest I wasn't rally sorry for the "my bad i didn't check gender" thing and though it probably changes nothing I never though that the word "dude" would be considered offensive to someone because to me it's more a unisex word rather than masculine only, but i understand i was wrong and am sincerely sorry this time for sure.

Now, as far as i know even today Japanese don't blame hirohito for ww2. After all, his generals were the ones pulling the strings and hirohito was the one who eventually went against their will to continue fighting, saving japan from another nuke as a result. I cant agree that Japanese knew about atrocities Japanese soldier did everywhere, and even those few who did would never spread the word fearing they'd be labelled as traitors. Even majority of Germans were unaware that concentration camps existed. Why I'm saying this is that people back than, or in this manga world are similarly easy to deceive since there is no free information source available, such as internet for example.

Now the big one begins.
It seems you have been through a lot. I myself, for example, was a very shy and quiet boy, I have been bullied by kids older and younger than me, i have been manipulated and have done things against my will in order to be appreciated and to look "cool" in other people's eyes. Back than I was so weak-willed, pitiful and lost. Unlike you it took me up to age of 20 to actually come out of a shell of an insecure, helpless kid. Remembering the past there was more than one occasion when I could have become a completely different - to what I am now - person; those other paths would have lead me to either a prison or an early grave...or I would just lock myself and get drunk...but that's an early grave too I suppose. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to initiate "who suffered the most as a kid" contest. I'm certain many others, if not everybody had their share of hell as kids. Was it only luck that we didn't become somebody else? somebody worse? Why didn't I lose faith in others considering how there was not a single person there to support me? it will be a lie to say that even after "maturing mentally" (I think I did mature ;)...) I don't hate those people for what they made me to go through (after all, they involuntarily played a huge role in making me a better person. Please don't think I'm saying this because I'm in love with myself or something, though I definitely am not ashamed of myself either) , if I were to one day see them in danger (life-death situation) I'd still rush for help without ever considering "serves you right b!tch" or something in similar fashion. I don't' know, maybe my outlook on life is too different, but our existence itself is a mystery, it's magical, it's wonderful... why shouldn't we be amazed with such gift? Why shouldn't we all do our best to protect it? Lives, our own and of others... Since childhood I've been thinking about lots of different things - a lot; and when you think about it, won't you agree that no human is born good or evil? Who made us like this? Is it god that decides our fate? nature? luck determines it all? - perhaps. But, It is our parents, society and environment that shapes our personalities and influences our development as human beings the most.

Just for a moment everyone should put themselves in the boots of people they disagree/hate/fight against.. People like bullies, killers, thieves. Something must have happened in their lives that turned them into such people right? Unless one believes that a person can be rotten from age 0, we should understand that a chain of events led a person's transformation from a cute crying newborn baby, to a merciless serial killer, dictator...or an average bully. In different circumstances I'm sure any of us could have been either good or bad. Now you might ask "so what should we do with such people? accept them as "normal" members of society"? No, of course not! But we should fight against it with different weapons. When a crime is committed, there should always be punishment. But we should at least try to understand these people before judging them; understanding isn't the same as forgiving; and only through understanding, rather than simple hate or vengeance can we build a better world. If there is at least a glimpse of hope that a person can change we should encourage them to change instead of treating them as "human-waste" or "oxygen-thieves". Things are much more complicated when we talk about not a single individual, but a group of people and even an entire nation! When it comes to brainwashing masses, we, who realize their unfortunate state, should always consider giving these people chances after chances. Take North Korea for example, the entire nation is a pure example of BRAINWASHED. like Marleyans consider Paradisians to be threat to the world, our world considers N.Korea to be an equal threat the same way. Most of its soldiers will gladly sacrifice their lives for their god-leader. Why aren't we putting these people out of their miserable, filled with lies, oppression and famine, lives? If a war breaks out, should we be ok with eliminating 90% of their population without second thought? We shouldn't make fun of these people, we shouldn't hate them or provoke them, we should be trying to guide them towards salvation. Such people should be given a chance to change; they already suffer enough on their own. Now back to the topic, when Eren just bashed his way through the building he left these type of people without any chance to change; without them ever knowing the real world, the truth. Unless you gave up on people and think that it's fine if one or some of these people get accidentally squashed, one would think twice before acting so reckless. Now don't think by saying all this i'm bashing Eren or these series only, there were/are characters who think and act the same way. None of them shall receive any sympathy from me.
When I see brainwashed kids getting squashed, I can't feel anything but sorrow for them. No way can i be fine with them getting killed, even if they'd be glad to see other people getting annihilated, I still see them as "lost souls" who need guidance towards the right path. Let's take North Korea for example again; say war breaks out and we bomb them to oblivion, a lot of brainwashed kids - who are future brainwashed soldiers and generals - would inevitably die horrible deaths; knowing this, should we nuke them first and fast because there's no hope for them anyway, or should we help them with all we can give?

P.S I still don't get it why you're so certain that people shown in manga are mostly all irredeemable, saying their minds are too F-d up! I'd say this story doesn't even come close to how actual people were mind fk-d during ww2, vietnam, Korean war and/or others :) list can go on forever...

I might sound too naive or I might be hoping for the impossible, but no matter the person, I can't look lightly at their suffering or deaths because, me and you and anybody else, if we were to be born in their place in same environment we would most likely think and act the same way because for us that kind of life would be considered normal... I wouldn't want the world to give up on me; if i were to be some average kid in North Korea, i wouldn't want the world to look at me as "unavoidable casualty of a coming war against evil" or "cannon fodder" or "selfless, mindless zombie". I realize not many will agree with my POV. After all, there are people who are trigger-happy, some hesitate and some refuse to even touch a weapon for a reason. But if we could all value the lives of others equally priceless, we would not think about taking up arms at all. Now after reading you story about kids who were given chances to change but still refused to do so, i understand that not every single one of them can be "saved" myself; but understanding this shouldn't get in our way when we encounter another, similar problem.

Now after reading all this, one would wonder why I even read violence filled manga such as this one? Well that's the kind of person I am. Violence has always been part of this world and i, a temporary guest here, am not planning to cover my ears and eyes in order to live in a fantasy world where there's global peace and only good people around. Still, after reading or seeing stories such as this, why should we consider its dark contents as "that's how life works", instead of "that's how life SHOULDN'T work". If you accept that the world is a vile, brutal and merciless place, others will look at it the same way and the world will indeed become like that. Eventually we will be one brainwashed race that (with ever-growing population) loses faith in itself and human life becomes cheaper than livestock . Perhaps we are destined to face such sad end, i mean come on, movies like "Django unchained" or "inglorious bastards" is beloved by so many people... I don't even know what to expect...
...as lame as it sounds, i feel sorry for people like me - for still hoping that we can become better.

P.S.S disclaimer: just like you i don't want to seem like I'm sympathy grabbing. i'm writing about myself and my POV because i feel like doing so and i don't seek any "special treatment", compassion or fame or something like that by writing this...
Butttt, i do apologize beforehand if reading all that was written above was like going through a "huge pile of SH!T" for you! ;) I still failed to really express myself as i wanted to, and a rather small number of Engrish words in my vocabulary didn't help my cause as well - making me sound like a drunkard or a whiny kid or something. that's why I kept editing and editing and editing the same comment for the 100th time already ;)

Essay-kun, I missed you!

Jan 9, 2018 7:41 PM

#109

Salamander2170

Offline

Aug 2012

4703

Hajime Isayama’s Monthly Q&A in Bessatsu Shonen Magazine February 2018 Issue

Q: Do Annie and Pieck get along well?
A: Because Annie kept a distance from everyone, I don’t think they were very close to each other.

No nickname for characters this month!

Translations by: suniuz.tumblr.com

Jan 9, 2018 8:15 PM

#110

Abhorrent

Offline

Mar 2017

742

not sure why you guys are arguing, this is extremely consistent with narrative so far. Eren now knowing the true enemy and true cause of his loss, decided to launch a counter attack. He even drew parallels to what reiner did because he knew it was the exact same. And in spite of this, in spite of knowing the cruelty and pain first hand, he pressed on. Marching down the devil's path. War is cruel, and there are no good guys. it's lit.

come, you sweet hour of death

Jan 9, 2018 11:46 PM

#111

windeen-windy

Offline

Mar 2009

3709

In2TheBlu said: