Supporting characters gets 90% screen time?

_Ako_ said:
I think we'll agree that the focus of the series would be the different characters; the different realms in the different world and the people that resides or goes in the restaurant.

I don't care about the main characters, or the supporting characters or you OP, I just care about the next EP that will bring another different cuisine and possibly different back story of a character.

MortalMelancholy said:

You talking about Shokugeki? Lel

_Ako_ said:



As far as I know, I'm talking about Isekai Shokudou.

MortalMelancholy said:

Ppl add isekai to too many things, as if said setting is an improvement to the plot =/

World_Creator said:
"MAIN CHARACTERS" Lol 10% overall screen time

MortalMelancholy said:

Ppl add isekai to too many things, as if said setting is an improvement to the plot =/

flannan said:

It is not a story of the restaurant, it is a story of its visitors.


1) Isekai might not improve the plot much, but it sure improves the characters. Cross-world travel is the only thing that makes black dragon waitresses possible.
2) Yes, fantasy worlds do improve the plot, because our world is a very unadventurous place.
Yes, main characters coming from another world does improve the plot, because they mean that the main character who is a fish out of water and has the setting explained to him/her is not a dumb country bumpkin. MC not being a dumb country bumpkin opens up a lot of possibilities.

Speaking of black dragon waitresses, I wonder - did the black dragon learn to suppress her death aura, or is the red dragon's blessing protecting everyone in the restaurant?

MortalMelancholy said:

1.) Isekai is different from Fantasy, in which a black dragon waitress would still possible.
2.) MC being a dumb Japanese gary stu who "ooh, has such a great understanding of a RPG-ripoff world" isn't any better than MC being a dumb country bumpkin, or even an intelligent country bumpkin. The thing is, isekai MCs tend to have an extremely "glossed over" character "just a generic Japanese XYZ," rather than a unique character, true to the world, built through growth and experiences. The biggest selling point of isekai isn't to make the character intelligent, but to make the character Japanese.
3.) RPG dynamic decreases focus from plot, for focus on RPG-like stats and elements.
4.) Point is, isekai in itself has little bearing on character or plot, but writers are usimg it use it to diminish said characters and plot.



Speaking of black dragon waitresses, what's that from? Gimme <.<

flannan said:

1) In fantasy, black dragons and waitresses are quite possible, but getting a black dragon to be a waitress is very much impossible.
Nekoya, "the restoraunt from another world", is the only place that needs waitresses and actually has something to offer to an epic black dragon in return. I am talking about Kuro, of course.

2) No part of "isekai" actually demands that the MC is dumb or gary stu.
"No Game No Life", one of the highest-rated isekai anime in recent times, has a brother-sister pair of gamers as the main characters. No idea how suetiful they are, but they sure aren't dumb.

2.1) Nor does it demand the MCs to be generic Japanese. Most isekai protagonists who actually make it to anime are pretty specific people. Chief, Lt. Itami, Kazuma...
It's annoying when people know that MCs from Konosuba and Isekai Smartphone are both isekai protagonists, yet they somehow treat them as interexchangable.

3) No part of "isekai" demands usage of RPG mechanics. The oldest isekai story I know, "The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe", predates RPGs. (And anime as we know it)
On the contrary, anime set in worlds that work on RPG mechanics are likely to not be isekai. Record of Lodoss War, Night Wizard and Chaos Dragon are based on tRPG playthroughs, and aren't isekai. Granblue Fantasy, Utawarerumono, Tears to Tiara, Escha & Logy no Atelier: Tasogare no Sora no Renkinjutsushi, Disgaea, Shining Hearts: Shiawase no Pan, Slap Up Party: Arad Senki, Tales series, Eiyuu Densetsu: Sora no Kiseki - all of these are based on computer RPGs, and aren't isekai. (and that's just the ones I've watched personally, so I can vouch for them not being isekai).
Stories which aren't actually RPGs, but insist their settings work on RPG mechanics, like Danmachi, often aren't isekai too (like Danmachi).
Sure, there is a number of isekai anime that work on RPG mechanics, like Overlord, Log Horizon and Konosuba. This is not a rule.

But overall, you should get ready - as more and more people grow up playing RPGs, more and more fantasy will be RPG-like. And unfortunately, when I mean "RPGs", I mean "computer descendants of D&D". (I want to see Tenra Bansho Zero anime!)

4) I've seen plenly of anime that draw themes from contact between different cultures based on travelling between worlds. Whether it's Overlord futilely trying to apply his salaryman skills to running his evil empire, or Outbreak Company attempting cultural conquest, or just soldiers sent beyond the Gate feeling bad from colliding with fantasy world's barbarism.

MortalMelancholy said:

Lol we clearly have different definitions of Isekai. To me, it's not literally "another world," which could be nearly anything, from Inuysha, to DBZ. It's the currently used stereotype, Japanese person --> fantasy world + RPG settings + contrived advantage over normal residents. And as I already said, isekai definition regardless, doesn't necessarily impact the completeness nor complexity of plot and characters in any way. Japanese writers, however, are using it to simplify said plot and characters, taking advantage of the decrease in significance of completeness and complexity.

flannan said:

Okay, can you give me a list of isekai anime as you described it?
Okay, Log Horizon, Overlord and Isekai Smartphone. I think Ixion Saga DT was like that too.
That makes four works. Unless you can make it 10 works, I am likely to think you're making a mountain out of a molehill.

MortalMelancholy said:

Lel it's a relatively new thing for anime adaptations; it takes time for the seasons to build up the count (just as with magic academy, you only have so many per season). I could give you like 200 light or web novels for it though. But yes, I can still come up with another 6 in addition to the ones you mentioned:
SAO (the firestarter)
Re:Zero
Knights & Magic
Tate Yuusha
Death March kara Hajimaru Isekai Kyousoukyoku
NGNL (not bad though)
Youjo Senki (though not deficient in the more typical qualities)

Notable mention:
Konosuba (parodies Isekai)

flannan said:

SAO isn't a fantasy world. It's a game in a near-future sci-fi world. That's pretty different, and SAO goes out of its way to explore and exploit the differences.
Tate Yuusha and Death March aren't anime (yet).
I have seen a few episodes of Knights and Magic, and I don't see any RPG settings there. Not much of a contrived advantage either - just one cute boy against medieval stasis.
NGNL is the opposite of RPG setting. Any setting where bandits challenge random passerbys to a game of cards instead of menacing them with swords is not an RPG setting.
I haven't seen enough of Youjo Senki, but their world doesn't look like it's fantasy or RPG either. The author was probably inspired by Strike Witches, but had a bad case of realism.

That leaves us with Re:Zero and KonoSuba, for a total of 6 works, and possibly two more.

Sure, you can give me like 200 web novels. I can probably give you 10 myself. But few of them get adapted to anime, because they tend to suck. People who are actually good at writing don't let RPG mechanics overshadow the fun.
Overall, I do not feel that your definition is actually useful. "RPG-mechanics verse" is a lot more useful descriptor if you ask me. As is "generic fantasy".

MortalMelancholy said:

Ah, you're right. Some of my examples were a bit haphazard, and I was overgeneralizing isekai a bit; the ones with RPG mechanics only represent the worst end of the spectrum (The rest still stand, however. And SAO is the quintessential baseline for shitty isekai. I can show you a picture that looks like a person, and tell you it's actually a heavily photoshopped pizza. In the end, it's still a picture of a person.). But the not yet aired ones are right on point, as I was noting that said generalized isekai are the advent of all those bad things. Back around the time of Infinite Stratos, we didn't have soo so many magic academy anime, but look at us now goddammit. I have seen the future (of incoming isekai), and it ain't pretty.

flannan said:

You people are always prophesying doom and gloom, but I will most likely enjoy both Tate Yuusha and Death March, just like I enjoyed SAO, and how I'm enjoying most magic academy anime.

MortalMelancholy said:

The end is nigh! SAO, the harbinger, has long since marked the entire industry for destruction!