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Jun 24, 2017 5:49 PM
#1

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I'm pretty sure there is no community out there without this problem , but I feel like the anime community has it the worst. People here always divide each other and always wage wars. Examples like: Dub vs Sub, Old vs New, Rem vs Emilia, Plot vs Flat etc. Now as i said, other communities have the same problem, like the gaming community with Xbox vs Playstation, Call of Duty vs Battlefield or comic book fans with DC vs Marvel, but with them I've seen people come to a mutual understanding and say "Why not both ?" while here it's always, you either choose one side or the other there is just no middle ground. Why can't people choose both instead of flaming each other for their preference ?
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Jun 24, 2017 5:55 PM
#2

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For 3/4 examples you listed, there are plenty of people who like both. The reason why everything seems divided is because those who choose the middle ground usually don't have extreme opinions on either thing and therefore do not make a fuss or spam threads with their opinion.


What's the difference?
Jun 24, 2017 6:02 PM
#3

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that's the inevitable cost of 'diversity'. too many different things in 1 place nobody can agree with each others.
CrossAnge

Hey guys check my profile for current airing season anime recommendation (guaranteed best taste)
Jun 24, 2017 6:06 PM
#4

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I think it's because of how big the anime community is and how different the fans are. The cartoon community is far less divided because it's smaller.
Jun 24, 2017 6:08 PM
#5

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I like dub anime if they are comedies, and sub if its serious.
Jun 24, 2017 6:13 PM
#6

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Gohdhand said:
For 3/4 examples you listed, there are plenty of people who like both. The reason why everything seems divided is because those who choose the middle ground usually don't have extreme opinions on either thing and therefore do not make a fuss or spam threads with their opinion.


I was going to say it but it was already done, this is the real answer. Thread over.
Jun 24, 2017 6:14 PM
#7

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Well someone has to take side. It's better than everyone agreeing on all the things... :/
Jun 24, 2017 6:17 PM
#8

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Because the moderate ones doth not giveth a f*ck, giving the illusion that there exist no middle ground. The truth is that they are usually mostly the same old fanatical users going at it again the same old way, every time.
You gave up your freedom of speech when you clicked Agree to the User Agreement
This is not a public platform.
Jun 24, 2017 6:18 PM
#9

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_Ako_ said:
Well someone has to take side. It's better than everyone agreeing on all the things... :/


People don't have to agree with everything, but it feels like sometimes they wage pointless wars over pointless things.
Jun 24, 2017 6:18 PM
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"Together we fall divided we stand". - True anime fans
Jun 24, 2017 6:21 PM

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LArachel said:
I like dub anime if they are comedies, and sub if its serious.


Me too! The only time I go to sub for a comedy is if the dub sucks or a dub doesn't exist. <3
The anime community in a nutshell.
Jun 24, 2017 6:23 PM

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DrGeroCreation said:
I think it's because of how big the anime community is and how different the fans are. The cartoon community is far less divided because it's smaller.


Now that you mention it, I don't think i have seen huge flame wars among cartoon fans.
Jun 24, 2017 6:25 PM

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haven't really seen a united community so

still life: pink roses
Jun 24, 2017 6:26 PM

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Some choices are meant to be far more difficult since their desire are pretty obvious.




"Think about that glowing dust
That destroys the night sky's dream of
Just being nothing"
----
Jun 24, 2017 6:27 PM

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Here is what I wrote in the old vs new thread but it pretty much talks about this trend in general:

Pullman said:
Idk, the anime community loves to randomly separate things into two opposing fractions where you can only pick one even if that's really bullshit. Quality or enjoyment? Polar opposites. Old or New? Choose your side, you can only like one. I don't think talking about old vs new in particular is any different from talking about why people and anime fans especially have this urge to see the world in black and white camps like that.

It's alway sabout belonging to some sub-group of the community that thinks of itself as superior (less cringy, knowing what's really good, not being blinded by 'nostalgia', whatever reason they can come up with) to all the rest. Because in general people are not proud of being anime fans. On the contrary, they don't want to be associated with anime because they themselves think it's cringy and whatnot, so they need to belong to special groups within that community to not feel bad about their hobby. They need to think of themselves not as 'another anime fan' but as part of some special group within that distances itself from all the 'cringe' and 'elitism' and 'shit taste'.

The old/new dichotomy is just one very easy way of finding identity in the community. Plus with some mental gymnastics you can easily convince yourself that everything evil in the community originates from old anime (like Zapredon does like an obsessed person in every single thread remotely related to this dichotomy). Old anime fans are not innocent when it comes to thinking of old and new stuff as completely separate entities but mostly this is coming from the newer fans who just don't even see old stuff as a legitimate option to watch. In their minds it's not even the same medium. Anime is after 2000, everything before that might as well not exist. If you make such strong distinctions of course groups will form around them, and whole mindsets until eventually almost nobody is left who sees age just as one more aspect of an anime among many, like art, animation, directing, soundtrack, writing, coloring etc...
Have that mindset for too long, and have too many others pat you on the head and agree with you on it, and you will end up thinking of anime only in those dichotomies and be unable to just see it as one medium. At some point you just aren't able to talk about old anime without establishing that modern anime is superior and the only reason to watch oldies is when you are somehow delusional because of nostalgie or other mind-altering effects.

The few people who just are neutral keep being forced to pick sides. It is impossible to enjoy old anime and talk about it without 20 people in this forum immediately jumping to the conclusion that you hate new stuff. These arbitrary distinctions that split all of anime into two opposing, if not straight out antagonistic camps, are stuck way too deep in the collective unconscious of the community.

How many people can you find who don't think that quality and enjoyment are opposing ways of watching and assessing anime but instead those two are aspects every single one of us judges in every show, just to varyying degrees. As soon as you call something deep, well-written or thought-provoking 90% of the community will think that cannot possibly be an enjoyable, fun watch.

It's the same with old vs new. How many people can you find who won't just blindly agree on blank statements like 'the art/story/animation/writing/characters/creativity/etc' of old (or new) anime is so much better/worse. Almost noone.

Because these categories exist and people constantly use them to seperate other people into 'friends or foe' people start believing those are factual distinctions, that it is logically impossible for quality and deepness to be aligned with having fun and caring about enjoyment. That it is logically for old and new to be treated as completely different mediums instead of realizing that it's just the same medium year for year and for just about any aspect there are many more important factors than age.

It's honestly very frustrating to deal with when you are the exception and don't feel attached to any of the rabid sub-communties that all define themselves by how much they shit on their 'enemies'. I always have to tiptoe around certain topics because if you use the wrong word or phrasing just once people will immediately categorize you as an enemy (of fun, of new anime, of anything that they care about). But even then I had people call me an elitist because I don't only care about the aesthetics but also about the story and writing. And of course I always see people jumping the shark when it comes to random people wanting to talk about how they enjoy old anime. Unless they have an extremely submissive attitude you will, without an exception, be categorized as an elitist who bases modern anime and feels superior for liking old anime. Even if your thread literally says you like modern anime and just feel desperate about oldies because you can't find anyone to talk about them.

That's how dependent the mind of the average anime fan is on these dichotomies. They will actually override reality just to make it confirm to their beliefs. In their mind you can't like oldies without being an elitist, high on nostalgia and hating on modern anime. Reality is just a tiny obstacle that won't hinder them from seeing the world like this. There is nothing like the comfy pleasantness of a very easy black and white worldview. That's what's so attractive about it. You never have to be unsure again. All you need is a little basic information and you can judge people before they even say a word about what they actually think.

So yeah, if you ask me it's just a general human need to categorize and judge things and make distinctions and jump to conclusions based on them. It is just particularly strongly developed in the anime community because it both attracts and generates a lot of insecurities in people which makes them rely even more on these group dynamics, and feeling good by focusing on what they think of the more pathetic parts of the community.

These black and white distinctions make people feel better about themselves because now they can just put anything they are ashamed of or don't like about anime in the 'other category' while putting everything they do like about it in their category. Dividing the world into two easily distinguishable, opposing camps like that takes away any doubts and gives people security about their taste/preferences and their hobby (anime) in general. That comfy sense of security is all they ever wanted so they're never letting go of it. Seriously, it is extremely hard to get these people to even listen to arguments, to facts because once they made their decision they just want to 'belong'. They don't want to hear arguments.

Old vs New is just one easy way of getting this sense of security and belonging in the community. Most people would never touch anything pre 2000 anyway so they are feeling like they are basically already in that camp so it's an easy commitment. You just need to start thinking of it being based on the objective supriority of modern anime instead of a preference or a lack of being used to different designs, and you're good to go. Et voilá, now you can blame every act of elitism you ever saw, every thread where some casual with 20 shows talked about anime dying, everyone who ever hated on something you love, on their oldie elitism nostalgia delusion. Who would want to let go of such a convenient tool that can be a scapegoat for everything you want it to be.


And THAT my friends is why people cling to these dichotomies. Why they treat them as factual distinctions, as polar opposites, as basically their own mediums. It makes being an anime fan so much easier, so much less requiring of your own thoughts and arguments. It solves almost all the issues people associate with being an anime fan for you. The perfect placebo for insecurities.
I probably regret this post by now.
Jun 24, 2017 6:31 PM

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Vlad4o said:
DrGeroCreation said:
I think it's because of how big the anime community is and how different the fans are. The cartoon community is far less divided because it's smaller.


Now that you mention it, I don't think i have seen huge flame wars among cartoon fans.
I haven't either, it's a pretty chill community.
Jun 24, 2017 6:32 PM

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Vlad4o said:
_Ako_ said:
Well someone has to take side. It's better than everyone agreeing on all the things... :/


People don't have to agree with everything, but it feels like sometimes they wage pointless wars over pointless things.


It's not like it affects you, or you get scars everything users flame or bitch at each other. They might have expressed their own differences in some ways; extreme at it is often.


At the end of the day, they've had fun producing salt and burying each other's grave. And that's all that matters.
Jun 24, 2017 6:34 PM

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Lol, anyone who has actual arguments over dub vs sub is stupid.

I never noticed such a big division like what you're talking about, its mostly just a lot of opinions about what is good and what is bad and it can be taken too far sometimes.
Jun 24, 2017 6:54 PM

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Gohdhand said:
For 3/4 examples you listed, there are plenty of people who like both. The reason why everything seems divided is because those who choose the middle ground usually don't have extreme opinions on either thing and therefore do not make a fuss or spam threads with their opinion.


le_halfhand_easy said:
Because the moderate ones doth not giveth a f*ck, giving the illusion that there exist no middle ground. The truth is that they are usually mostly the same old fanatical users going at it again the same old way, every time.


I guess you're both right about that. And It's not like i ever denied that people like that exist, but it seems that everyone is always forced to choose, either that or get bashed by one side or the other or both. Maybe that's why most people don't want to speak up or just don't care anymore, since no matter what they say there will always be arguments on which is better and their opinion won't matter that much.
Jun 24, 2017 7:48 PM
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I get why you would be... well, rather concerned about the anime community being divided, or at least questioning it. And tbh, as MUCH as I want the community to be together or at least agreeable to some degree, that doesn't happen a lot of times.

And well while it is true that it isn't an anime thing, it doesn't really face the fact that its a matter of getting used to. It's a pipe dream on my end (and probably for some people) to have people to agree or understand in terms of debating, but that's how it is, and that applies to every community. There's not really much harmony or much to do regarding on it.
Jun 24, 2017 8:13 PM

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Because Rem is the best girl ...
Sub are objectively superior to dub with no exception
Jun 24, 2017 8:20 PM

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Simply because 99% of humans aren't intelligent enough to grasp more than a fraction of the whole.
Be thankful for the wisdom granted to you.
Jun 24, 2017 8:25 PM

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Here's something to share then. Related a bit. It's about elitism and old anime and how they overlapped with each other.

Elitism has two particular definitions that are necessary in order to understand the label properly. An elite group of people would be a selected group that has power or influence, or are meant to represent the best of the best of a community.[1] Elitism represents not only a belief in an elite of a community, but also pride and privilege for those that are a part of that select group.[2] In this case, an elite group for the anime community would probably be those that have seen the largest amount of anime (in terms of show count or time spent watching) as well as having a wide variety of anime that they have tried, depending on the priorities of the fans considering the ranking. Despite the positivity that this kind of term would normally bring when bestowed on another person, the label in the anime community refers to an attitude of being superior to others in terms of anime preferences and taste that is not necessarily well founded. This includes snubbing popular shows only for their popularity and mass appeal, and the rejection of other fans’ ideas or critiques mainly based on their show preference rather than the quality of their arguments. There are some fans who wear the label of elitist ironically in order to make fun of those that carry a superiority complex, though many of them would fall under the unironic usage of the label despite their persistence to the contrary.

In order to accuse someone of being an elitist, they normally will be derogatory towards others and gravitate towards certain shows that they deem to be unique, deep, underrated, and/or thematically unique/having an aesthetic that makes them stand out from most of the anime library. This can include shows that are generally considered to be good in quality, like The Tatami Galaxy, Ping Pong The Animation, and Katanagatari, but it can also refer to shows that have left the community more divided in regards to the show’s merits, like Kara no Kyoukai, the Monogatari series, and Aku no Hana.

The stereotypical go-to show for an elitist to praise is that of Legend of the Galactic Heroes which is a long, multi-season space opera that was originally released during the late 80’s to the late 90’s. It oozes what appeals to the modern anime elitist stereotype: multiple interwoven plot-lines, complex characters, well written drama, its age, and a lot of these qualities making the show typically overlooked by the fan population at large. While this should not reflect poorly on a good show, it is always worth recognizing the kinds of people that an anime will attract. While an anime elitist will praise certain kinds of shows, however, it is typical for them to shit on shows that they dislike, either for their quality or depth in writing, popularity, fanbase, release date, and other qualities. To phrase it another way, elitists tend to be much more critical of shows in terms of their technical qualities, and will most likely go out of their way to both critique shows and post their ideas online. They may also find challenging shows in order to be able to put another feather in their cap in regards to “experience” for the sake of it rather than attempting to broaden their horizons.

What exactly breeds this kind of animosity, though? Why would people in what has traditionally been a niche hobby want to alienate others based on their taste? What can really be gained from it? Well “traditionally” is a decent indicator as to why this might be. While the first breed of anime fans grew up with the likes of Astro Boy and Neo Human Casshan, the difficulty in acquiring other anime that had been licensed by companies in the West, let alone translated into English, was slim to none. Anime would receive its first boom in the early 90’s with the likes of films like Akira becoming popular world wide in the late 80’s and Ghost in the Shell releasing in the mid 90’s, which left a heavy influence on much of Western pop culture, with Akira being primarily responsible for the cyberpunk genre that saturated much of anime at the time. While it’s arguable that the most vocal and common anime fans on the internet are those that grew up in the late 90’s/early 00’s with Toonami and Adult Swim, these spaced out groups of people can easily be attributed to this rise in feelings of superiority. Those that have been familiar with anime longer and have experienced more of the trends and changes that the media has gone through may feel distanced from the newer ones coming in on the backs of Attack on Titan or Sword Art Online, shows that someone who grew up with Voltron or Yu Yu Hakusho might consider beneath their own tastes for various reasons, be it style, writing, setting, or even how it’s animated.

With the rise of the internet came anime that was more easily accessible, and in the age of streaming and pirating, there’s little to wonder why the fanbase is so large. Being an outcast or special for enjoying anime is no longer really something that occurs, and older fans might be bitter about this since not too long ago admitting you liked anime to some people translated to you admitting to liking tentacle porn. Although that ignorant mindset still exists, it’s a lot more difficult to come by nowadays, and the amount of anime being released has also increased exponentially in order to take advantage of this boom in fan population. Older fans may feel ostracized by the anime coming out now not holding the same kinds of themes, styles, or influences that the ones they love the most did, it reflects poorly on them when they lash out at those that enjoy what is currently being released. Sure, not all that tote the elitist mindset love old anime necessarily, but they do have a similar mindset towards the newer fans that cosplay as Kirito or the Scouting Regimen soldiers at cons and seem to be noncritical about what they love. On the flip side, casual fans might criticize others on taking anime too seriously and not letting themselves enjoy anything without pointing out flaws and inconsistencies, or being just as narrow-minded as they accuse casuals of being while seeking out things they dislike just to have the ability to make fun of it.

The in-fighting in the community is inevitable, though it’s unfortunate that it misses the point of enjoying a hobby in the first place: people enjoying things in their own way. Their values in regards to that hobby is based on what they personally consider to be the most important aspects of that hobby, and their tastes and decisions will be molded by it. If someone enjoys escapism anime or shows that allow them to be immersed in a big world with lots of characters like One Piece, what’s the problem? If someone else enjoys watching poor quality shows every now and then in order to appreciate their favorites more highly, is there anything wrong with that? Someone loving Love Live! and Code Geass isn’t necessarily going to hate G Gundam or Tenchi Muyo! just because they’re older as long as they’re willing to be open-minded. An older fan’s love for traditional animation and the feeling of older anime shouldn’t be used as an excuse to shut themselves off and berate new-comers; it is an opportunity for them to show what they grew up with and, in time, be willing to watch new shows that they can find appealing for the same reasons the shows they loved growing up did. Anime fans have such a great wealth of shows to choose from and explore, as well as peers that they already have something in common with, that they’re only hurting themselves when they try to categorize some being better or worse than others.


https://lyonfacedblog.wordpress.com/2015/09/01/anime-buzzwords-part-6/

It's a good thing I'm more of a video game fans than anime fans. Yeah,I've never seen a community as divided as anime. Video game community are not obsessed with this old vs new(At least, not as much as anime community).

Rem vs Emilia is more of a Re Zero civil war.
ZapredonJun 24, 2017 11:30 PM
But it's important to remember that a movie review is subjective;it only gives you one person's opinion.

http://www.classzone.com/books/lnetwork_gr08/page_build.cfm?content=analyz_media&ch=30

It doesn't matter if you like LoGH,Monster etc.If you are a jobless or college/school dropout living in your mom basement, you are still an unintelligent loser. Taste in anime does not make you a better person.If elitist don't exist, casual pleb and shit taste also don't exist.
Jun 24, 2017 8:28 PM

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Vlad4o said:
Gohdhand said:
For 3/4 examples you listed, there are plenty of people who like both. The reason why everything seems divided is because those who choose the middle ground usually don't have extreme opinions on either thing and therefore do not make a fuss or spam threads with their opinion.


le_halfhand_easy said:
Because the moderate ones doth not giveth a f*ck, giving the illusion that there exist no middle ground. The truth is that they are usually mostly the same old fanatical users going at it again the same old way, every time.


I guess you're both right about that. And It's not like i ever denied that people like that exist, but it seems that everyone is always forced to choose, either that or get bashed by one side or the other or both. Maybe that's why most people don't want to speak up or just don't care anymore, since no matter what they say there will always be arguments on which is better and their opinion won't matter that much.


I think that is pretty true. I'm one of the few people who tends to enjoy both sides of pretty much all divisions among the anime community (dub/sub, enjoyment/quality, old/new etc... even if I have a preference I always also enjoy a ton of stuff from the 'other side', if not straight out find the division stupid) one way or the other so I get into arguments with whoever bashes either side too much or in really prejudiced and ignorant ways. And it is hard to not grouped with the 'opposing side' of whoever you are currently arguing with. And it can feel like you're the only one since most repliers will usually pick a side or interpret your post as picking a side too.

But in private I do regularly have people approach me who are similarly open-minded and they almost unanimously say they don't participate in the forums because they don't have the patience to deal with these things and feel like almost noone in the forums is similar-minded and everyone is just bashing each other and what they enjoy. The irony is that if all those people started to become active in the community it would become a better place with less of a divisive feel to it but that fact that the current state is so divisive makes them keep to themselves for the most part.
I probably regret this post by now.
Jun 25, 2017 1:11 AM

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You're just exposed to the scum of the internet who use anime as part of their silly irony culture, 'lol shitposting is god filthy frank is life STOP OFFENDING ME I'M SENSITIVE'. Go to an anime convention and you'll get some good discussions.
WEAPONS - My blog, for reviews of music, anime, books, and other things
Jun 25, 2017 1:13 AM

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I bet you never seen warhammer 40k community it's either For the Emperor or Blood for The blood Gods.
Jun 25, 2017 1:16 AM

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Swagernator said:
I bet you never seen warhammer 40k community it's either For the Emperor or Blood for The blood Gods.


FOR THE GREATER GOOD!! sorry i love the tau technology to much

Tau and Tyranids are my two favorite factions my third would be Chaos but only because they are fking nuts
GrimAtramentJun 25, 2017 1:26 AM
"among monsters and humans, there are only two types.
Those who undergo suffering and spread it to others. And those who undergo suffering and avoid giving it to others." -Alice
“Beauty is no quality in things themselves: It exists merely in the mind which contemplates them; and each mind perceives a different beauty.” David Hume
“Evil is created when someone gives up on someone else. It appears when everyone gives up on someone as a lost cause and removes their path to salvation. Once they are cut off from everyone else, they become evil.” -Othinus

Jun 25, 2017 1:19 AM

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hazerddex said:
Swagernator said:
I bet you never seen warhammer 40k community it's either For the Emperor or Blood for The blood Gods.


FOR THE GREATER GOOD!! sorry i love the tau technology to much

Tau and Tyranids are my two favorite factions my third would be chaos but only because they are fking nuts

For the Lion ! and the Emperor !

but yeah i also like Eldar.
Jun 25, 2017 1:23 AM

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It's just people wanting to feel better about themselves, by making everyone else look like bigger losers than them.
Jun 25, 2017 2:56 AM

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Because even when we all like anime, we also like different things about the medium, and not necessarily the same thing our neighbor like, and, in the most of cases, we tend to think the things we like are superior to the ones our neighbor loves.
You just have to see the Fate fanbase to realize what I am talking about.
IllyricusJun 25, 2017 6:43 AM
Jun 25, 2017 3:39 AM

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Pffft, try being part of the Sonic the Hedgehog community. Like I was until 2011 or so.

The great divide of the SEGA Forums was quite the experience to say the least.
Endless "Modern Sonic vs. Classic Sonic" or "2D games vs. 3D games" circle-jerks and flame wars.

Oh, Lord, the dark memories are returning! Y u do dis to me?!


MAL's AD isn't quite at that level. Not yet anyway. So take comfort in knowing, it could be worse.
Jun 25, 2017 6:42 AM

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There's no such thing as the anime "community"

It literally doesn't exist.

If there's an anime "community" then there's also a Doritos community.

You know...people who eat Doritos.

See how stupid it sounds!
Jun 25, 2017 6:45 AM
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1 Dub vs Sub not that much and i don't care
2 Old vs New very rare to happen since most of the peoples will say anime after 1999 are better than the ones before
3 Rem vs Emilia i was going threw one right now but still not that ig shit
4 Plot vs Flat only saw that in anime
Since Koe no Katachi has a very high rating her on MAL, rated by nearly 100k users currently should we try to upvote the movie on the worlds largest database related to films? This movie only has around 4,5k votes at the moment. Let's all vote and make the rating higher?

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt5323662/

if we make it more popular it will raise more money so it will support the anime industry and make anime more popular between all the peoples since IMDb is not an anime site
so more quality anime will be made
Jun 25, 2017 6:46 AM

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You keep saying "problem" but I don't see it. I hear no evil.
[left] (◕‿◕✿)
Jun 26, 2017 3:08 AM

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SIMPLY because its such a broad-ranged medium with so much to love and hate about.
Jun 26, 2017 3:39 AM

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Because people tend to be deceive by the bounds of limitations. And only who had escaped those gain the mindset of saying "why not both".
Jun 26, 2017 5:30 AM

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Because anime itself is very vast with a wide variety of series aimed at various demographics and ages. Difference are bound to exist. Besides some anime have a lot of passionate fans who can't deal with people having different opinions/tastes.

But at a more basic level, differences exist in fandoms of each series itself, specially when shipping is concerned and I'll blame that on the author/creators for playing around with the emotions of fans by showing multiple possibilities even though it's not a VN where the fans actually have a choice between the options.
Jun 26, 2017 5:34 AM

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Anime is scary like this because it's so good that it makes people like it so strongly that they can't come to terms on their opinions about it.
Jun 26, 2017 6:47 AM

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It's because we all have our own o p i n i o n, when people try to force their's or at the very least defend their opinion things like "x topic vs y topic" happens ;)

**subs ftw bby
Jun 26, 2017 7:01 AM

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Maou_heika said:
Because anime itself is very vast with a wide variety of series aimed at various demographics and ages. Difference are bound to exist. Besides some anime have a lot of passionate fans who can't deal with people having different opinions/tastes.

But at a more basic level, differences exist in fandoms of each series itself, specially when shipping is concerned and I'll blame that on the author/creators for playing around with the emotions of fans by showing multiple possibilities even though it's not a VN where the fans actually have a choice between the options.


This makes sense. Most fandoms aren't around media but around a scene - a set of ideas and artistic archetypes so you get the Metal scene and the Horror scene in cinema. Sometimes, though, there's a fandom of a medium but medium isn't enough to determine consensus because of the variety of content.

So you get ecchi fans and battle shounen fans under the same banner.
WEAPONS - My blog, for reviews of music, anime, books, and other things
Jun 26, 2017 9:12 AM

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It'll be considered a miracle if there's one community that is united.

"Maybe he's trying to take a shit, but the shit just won't come out."
Captain Levi, 2014
(/^-^)/☆♪♪☆\(^0^\)
Jun 26, 2017 10:56 AM

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But who doesn't like arguing and defending for their side though😂 Wars against people who know what their talking about are a lot of fun
Jun 26, 2017 11:05 AM

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828
well, anime fans are usually prone to being autistic and not understanding how a normal functioning human being works. they also have a hard time accepting other opinions and are often under the impression that their own opinion is the sole truth.
"I came here to sniff Madoka panties and kick witch ass and I am all out 'doka panties" - Homora Akemi
Jun 26, 2017 11:13 AM

Offline
Oct 2015
828
JustALEX said:
There's no such thing as the anime "community"

It literally doesn't exist.

If there's an anime "community" then there's also a Doritos community.

You know...people who eat Doritos.

See how stupid it sounds!


there is no mydoritoslist, but there is a myanimelist where people gather and have discussions, among other things. see how stupid you sound?
"I came here to sniff Madoka panties and kick witch ass and I am all out 'doka panties" - Homora Akemi
Jun 26, 2017 11:51 AM

Offline
Jun 2008
25958
Sjo said:
JustALEX said:
There's no such thing as the anime "community"

It literally doesn't exist.

If there's an anime "community" then there's also a Doritos community.

You know...people who eat Doritos.

See how stupid it sounds!


there is no mydoritoslist, but there is a myanimelist where people gather and have discussions, among other things. see how stupid you sound?

lol, you realize you're talking about two very different things, right?

MAL =/= EVERY single person that watches anime.

When people talk about the "Anime Community" they're talking about everyone who watches anime.

Then fucking call it the "MAL Community" or whatever.

There's no such thing as the "Anime community"
Jun 26, 2017 11:59 AM

Offline
Oct 2015
2099
I do not accept that there is an "anime community" as such, to me anime is too vast a field for that. That's like saying all people who listen to any kind of music, occcasionally or dedicated, for enjoyment or professionally, would form a "music listener community". Such "community" would not have any meaning.

And why this desire for hegemony in the first place ?
Why should of all huge-in-members-group the one consisting of people-interested-in-anime be the one to be all-agreeing over everything?

Would you really expect the "food-eaters-community" to agree on favourite fruit, beverage, dessert? Is it better to eat with chopsticks, knife/fork/spoon, or with your "clean" hand?

(damn. to agree on sth. with JustAlex, feels so wrong. :D )

Jonouchi-Katsuya said:
LArachel said:
I like dub anime if they are comedies, and sub if its serious.


Me too! The only time I go to sub for a comedy is if the dub sucks or a dub doesn't exist. <3

Ah, So.
no wonder you rated Azumanga Daioh inappropriately low. ;)

(I actually only know Japanese and German dub for AD, and the latter is detrimental to the show. much.)
BannoBunka_snorkJun 26, 2017 12:13 PM
*darn, using my right hand is off-limits for a while. Typing with my left hand only is ... eww.*
Jun 26, 2017 12:29 PM
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Aug 2011
569
Pullman said:
Here is what I wrote in the old vs new thread but it pretty much talks about this trend in general:

Pullman said:
Idk, the anime community loves to randomly separate things into two opposing fractions where you can only pick one even if that's really bullshit. Quality or enjoyment? Polar opposites. Old or New? Choose your side, you can only like one. I don't think talking about old vs new in particular is any different from talking about why people and anime fans especially have this urge to see the world in black and white camps like that.

It's alway sabout belonging to some sub-group of the community that thinks of itself as superior (less cringy, knowing what's really good, not being blinded by 'nostalgia', whatever reason they can come up with) to all the rest. Because in general people are not proud of being anime fans. On the contrary, they don't want to be associated with anime because they themselves think it's cringy and whatnot, so they need to belong to special groups within that community to not feel bad about their hobby. They need to think of themselves not as 'another anime fan' but as part of some special group within that distances itself from all the 'cringe' and 'elitism' and 'shit taste'.

The old/new dichotomy is just one very easy way of finding identity in the community. Plus with some mental gymnastics you can easily convince yourself that everything evil in the community originates from old anime (like Zapredon does like an obsessed person in every single thread remotely related to this dichotomy). Old anime fans are not innocent when it comes to thinking of old and new stuff as completely separate entities but mostly this is coming from the newer fans who just don't even see old stuff as a legitimate option to watch. In their minds it's not even the same medium. Anime is after 2000, everything before that might as well not exist. If you make such strong distinctions of course groups will form around them, and whole mindsets until eventually almost nobody is left who sees age just as one more aspect of an anime among many, like art, animation, directing, soundtrack, writing, coloring etc...
Have that mindset for too long, and have too many others pat you on the head and agree with you on it, and you will end up thinking of anime only in those dichotomies and be unable to just see it as one medium. At some point you just aren't able to talk about old anime without establishing that modern anime is superior and the only reason to watch oldies is when you are somehow delusional because of nostalgie or other mind-altering effects.

The few people who just are neutral keep being forced to pick sides. It is impossible to enjoy old anime and talk about it without 20 people in this forum immediately jumping to the conclusion that you hate new stuff. These arbitrary distinctions that split all of anime into two opposing, if not straight out antagonistic camps, are stuck way too deep in the collective unconscious of the community.

How many people can you find who don't think that quality and enjoyment are opposing ways of watching and assessing anime but instead those two are aspects every single one of us judges in every show, just to varyying degrees. As soon as you call something deep, well-written or thought-provoking 90% of the community will think that cannot possibly be an enjoyable, fun watch.

It's the same with old vs new. How many people can you find who won't just blindly agree on blank statements like 'the art/story/animation/writing/characters/creativity/etc' of old (or new) anime is so much better/worse. Almost noone.

Because these categories exist and people constantly use them to seperate other people into 'friends or foe' people start believing those are factual distinctions, that it is logically impossible for quality and deepness to be aligned with having fun and caring about enjoyment. That it is logically for old and new to be treated as completely different mediums instead of realizing that it's just the same medium year for year and for just about any aspect there are many more important factors than age.

It's honestly very frustrating to deal with when you are the exception and don't feel attached to any of the rabid sub-communties that all define themselves by how much they shit on their 'enemies'. I always have to tiptoe around certain topics because if you use the wrong word or phrasing just once people will immediately categorize you as an enemy (of fun, of new anime, of anything that they care about). But even then I had people call me an elitist because I don't only care about the aesthetics but also about the story and writing. And of course I always see people jumping the shark when it comes to random people wanting to talk about how they enjoy old anime. Unless they have an extremely submissive attitude you will, without an exception, be categorized as an elitist who bases modern anime and feels superior for liking old anime. Even if your thread literally says you like modern anime and just feel desperate about oldies because you can't find anyone to talk about them.

That's how dependent the mind of the average anime fan is on these dichotomies. They will actually override reality just to make it confirm to their beliefs. In their mind you can't like oldies without being an elitist, high on nostalgia and hating on modern anime. Reality is just a tiny obstacle that won't hinder them from seeing the world like this. There is nothing like the comfy pleasantness of a very easy black and white worldview. That's what's so attractive about it. You never have to be unsure again. All you need is a little basic information and you can judge people before they even say a word about what they actually think.

So yeah, if you ask me it's just a general human need to categorize and judge things and make distinctions and jump to conclusions based on them. It is just particularly strongly developed in the anime community because it both attracts and generates a lot of insecurities in people which makes them rely even more on these group dynamics, and feeling good by focusing on what they think of the more pathetic parts of the community.

These black and white distinctions make people feel better about themselves because now they can just put anything they are ashamed of or don't like about anime in the 'other category' while putting everything they do like about it in their category. Dividing the world into two easily distinguishable, opposing camps like that takes away any doubts and gives people security about their taste/preferences and their hobby (anime) in general. That comfy sense of security is all they ever wanted so they're never letting go of it. Seriously, it is extremely hard to get these people to even listen to arguments, to facts because once they made their decision they just want to 'belong'. They don't want to hear arguments.

Old vs New is just one easy way of getting this sense of security and belonging in the community. Most people would never touch anything pre 2000 anyway so they are feeling like they are basically already in that camp so it's an easy commitment. You just need to start thinking of it being based on the objective supriority of modern anime instead of a preference or a lack of being used to different designs, and you're good to go. Et voilá, now you can blame every act of elitism you ever saw, every thread where some casual with 20 shows talked about anime dying, everyone who ever hated on something you love, on their oldie elitism nostalgia delusion. Who would want to let go of such a convenient tool that can be a scapegoat for everything you want it to be.


And THAT my friends is why people cling to these dichotomies. Why they treat them as factual distinctions, as polar opposites, as basically their own mediums. It makes being an anime fan so much easier, so much less requiring of your own thoughts and arguments. It solves almost all the issues people associate with being an anime fan for you. The perfect placebo for insecurities.

This is very well said.

tragedydesu said:
Because Rem is the best girl ...
Sub are objectively superior to dub with no exception


While I think dub vs sub is very subjective, even for me, I can think of a few dubs that are absolutely superior to the original.

Yu Yu Hakusho, original sub wasn't bad this was just dub was better for this kind of show.

Ghost stories, the dub dialogue was the only saving grace of this show.

Samurai Pizza Cats, same as the above.

These are just a few I have a harder time thinking the sub was better for these anime.
Jun 26, 2017 12:32 PM
Arch-Degenerate

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Sep 2015
7676
JustALEX said:
There's no such thing as the anime "community"

It literally doesn't exist.

If there's an anime "community" then there's also a Doritos community.

You know...people who eat Doritos.

See how stupid it sounds!

i found a doritos community through google search if that counts for anything

Jun 26, 2017 12:41 PM

Offline
Oct 2015
828
JustALEX said:
Sjo said:


there is no mydoritoslist, but there is a myanimelist where people gather and have discussions, among other things. see how stupid you sound?

lol, you realize you're talking about two very different things, right?

MAL =/= EVERY single person that watches anime.

When people talk about the "Anime Community" they're talking about everyone who watches anime.

Then fucking call it the "MAL Community" or whatever.

There's no such thing as the "Anime community"


there is a giant ass chunk of the community on reddit, 4chan, youtube etc. so whatever uninformed point you're trying to make does not stand. but nice try
"I came here to sniff Madoka panties and kick witch ass and I am all out 'doka panties" - Homora Akemi
Jun 26, 2017 12:42 PM
#1 Hitagi Lover

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Apr 2014
2999
Because there are alot of things that factor into the anime medium, therefore we aren't always going to agree on everything.
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