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#1
Mar 12, 2:32 PM

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I have seen the movie "The Kingdom of Dreams and Madness" a documentary about the making of JPDisney's "The Wind Rises" where Hideaki Anno was used as a voice actor.
Theres a Scene where he drives home at night. He speaks with a co-worker about JPDisney mybe making another movie (he didn't). Hideaki Anno somehow seems to be looking forward to do his own last movie.

It came to me, this guy is 57! He will not allways be arround. And who will do NGE when he hits the bucket.
Who is for Hideaki Anno what J. J. Abrams is for George Lucas?
Please not Kazuya Tsurumaki. Then I would have to wait another 6 Years (KT is 6 Years less old) I HATE FLCL.

P.S. I would prefer Yoshiyuki Sadamoto (the guy who did the manga, character design) but hes just 2 Years less Hideaki Anno and he seems to be a pervert ;-)
Modified by Des_Pudels_Kern, Mar 12, 2:47 PM
 
#2
Mar 12, 2:44 PM

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Please no one. End my suffering and finish this series once and for all.
But i would miss Gendou...whatever, one character isnt enough to heal my scars.
 
#3
Mar 12, 2:46 PM

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I didn't think you liked NGE?

Anyway, the last Rebuild will be done in Anno's lifetime, or if it isn't it doesn't really matter. The Rebuilds are garbage. Anno's live-action films are much better than those.
 
#4
Mar 12, 2:54 PM

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codephat said:
I didn't think you liked NGE?

I don't like his NGE. He ruined it. But maybe someone else can fix it with a 3 Act.

codephat said:

Anyway, the last Rebuild will be done in Anno's lifetime, or if it isn't it doesn't really matter.

Acording to his quotes, NGE is his live, his live is not at end neither is NGE.
If I would be a terrible person I would be transform it to
"As long as Hideaki Anno lives NGE gets no proper ending"
Does this sound creepy?

codephat said:

The Rebuilds are garbage. Anno's live-action films are much better than those.

The Bebuilds are a cynical cash grab. But for what does he need all the money. He seems too be like George Lucas. These Guys are broken beyond repair.

Its sad that you have to wait till those people die out. Now I am sad. I feel the Weltschmerz.
 
#5
Mar 12, 3:25 PM

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@Des_Pudels_Kern You mean fix it with an act 3 in the final rebuild? Because NGE is done and has been for a long time...

And his NGE is NGE.

I agree with what you said about the new films being cash grabs.
 
#6
Mar 12, 3:32 PM

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codephat said:
And his NGE is NGE.

Whats about Star Wars. It was George Lucas's it is no longer.
Its a different question if this is better or worse.

codephat said:

I agree with what you said about the new films being cash grabs.

This guys are horrible people.
 
#7
Mar 12, 3:37 PM

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Des_Pudels_Kern said:

Whats about Star Wars. It was George Lucas's it is no longer.
Its a different question if this is better or worse.
SW has always been more about the world than the story. It's a large group of stories. NGE is just a personal story.
 
#8
Mar 12, 3:47 PM

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[quote=codephat message=49958778]
Des_Pudels_Kern said:
NGE is just a personal story.

Not acording to my plans.
I am getting sick when I think about who could get his dirty hands on it.
If you hate the Rebuilds, just imagine what would happen if the crators of "Monster Musume" get it in their hands.

Its exactly like Star Wars. Its get raped bejond recognitation. On the other side ...
 
#9
Mar 13, 12:24 PM

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Des_Pudels_Kern said:
codephat said:

Anyway, the last Rebuild will be done in Anno's lifetime, or if it isn't it doesn't really matter.

Acording to his quotes, NGE is his live, his live is not at end neither is NGE.
If I would be a terrible person I would be transform it to
"As long as Hideaki Anno lives NGE gets no proper ending"
Does this sound creepy?

codephat said:

The Rebuilds are garbage. Anno's live-action films are much better than those.

The Bebuilds are a cynical cash grab. But for what does he need all the money. He seems too be like George Lucas. These Guys are broken beyond repair.

Its sad that you have to wait till those people die out. Now I am sad. I feel the Weltschmerz.
Des_Pudels_Kern said:
codephat said:

I agree with what you said about the new films being cash grabs.

This guys are horrible people.
Anno is not a horrible person, you'd know that if you'd have done literally any research. He didn't really direct much of the rebuilds himself, it was mostly done by Kazuya Tsurumaki and Mahiro Maeda. Yes, he is letting them make them because NGE is still immensely popular and people will pay for it, but he's not doing that out of greed. he has been publicly concerned about the stagnation and oversaturation of the anime industry for years, and he believes the only thing to stop its total collapse is innovation. New ideas need to make it into the mainstream, and that's why he used all of the rebuild movie money to fund the Japan Animator Expo shorts. I don't blame him for the fact that that had to involve polluting a franchise that he never even cared about that much, and which has already been polluted plenty through other means.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ntZhZKOy1o

TL;DR Anno doesn't care about money, he doesn't care about NGE, he cares about Anime. Do you?
Modified by coenraed, Mar 13, 1:11 PM
 
Mar 13, 1:14 PM

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coenraed said:
He didn't really direct the rebuilds himself, it was mostly done by Kazuya Tsurumaki and Mahiro Maeda.

Are the Rebuilds NGEs Island Episodes? Prost Mahlzeit!!!

coenraed said:

Yes, he is letting them make them because NGE is still immensely popular and people will pay for it, but he's not doing that out of greed.

Sounds greedy to me. Its popular - It sells - I don't want to do it - let some hacks do it - who cares about quality (The Nadia Island Approach)

coenraed said:

New ideas need to make it into the mainstream, and that's why he used all of the rebuild movie money to fund the Japan Animator Expo shorts.

Last Time I checked those are just what a "Graphics Demo" is to a "Video Game". And the tech was never the problem. Story is.
Animes have horrible stuppid storylines. They never evolved out of their 80s saturday morning shows for kids.
I'm just wondering why a show like "South Park" can run 20 Years with just rotating bitmaps.
Mybe they realy using the most advanced tech https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UOZxobtLPCM

coenraed said:

I don't blame him for the fact that that had to involve polluting a franchise that he never even cared about that much, and which has already been polluted plenty through other means.

That sounds like a man with ideals.
 
Mar 13, 1:47 PM

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Des_Pudels_Kern said:

That sounds like a man with ideals.
You sound like you've decided you know exactly how art works and what makes it good or bad 5 years ago and you've been applying that same logic to absolutely everything.

You are reacting to my individual sentences, but not to the points they make together.

https://www.youtube.com/user/ThatAnimeSnob
I'm sure you'll be great friends.
 
Mar 13, 2:31 PM

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coenraed said:

You sound like you've decided you know exactly how art works and what makes it good or bad 5 years ago and you've been applying that same logic to absolutely everything.

I never talked about art. I sayed its stuppid trying to save animation while ruining an animation show on purpose. And Drawing/Animation-Technics seems not to be the problem in the first place.

coenraed said:

You are reacting to my individual sentences, but not to the points they make together.

Whats the overall point? Hideaki Anno is absolutly justified by doing an half-assed job, when he uses the money to blow it on some nonsenical eye-candy. Those stuff never sold well neather does it attract people to animation who do not watch it now. Actually it does more harm by making animes more weirder than they are allready.


I am not. This guy absolutly loves NGE + Hideaki Anno.
 
Mar 13, 3:13 PM

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Des_Pudels_Kern said:
I never talked about art. I sayed its stuppid trying to save animation while ruining an animation show on purpose. And Drawing/Animation-Technics seems not to be the problem in the first place.
Art is a word that encompasses all media, not just visuals. Allow me to rephrase: You sound like you've decided you know exactly how media works and what makes it good or bad 5 years ago and you've been applying that same logic to absolutely everything.
Des_Pudels_Kern said:
Whats the overall point? Hideaki Anno is absolutly justified by doing an half-assed job, when he uses the money to blow it on some nonsenical eye-candy. Those stuff never sold well neather does it attract people to animation who do not watch it now. Actually it does more harm by making animes more weirder than they are allready.
You seem to be equating his intention to the project's actual impact. He wanted to inject some new ideas into the industry, and to give talented people an opportunity to do meaningful work with a team, to express themselves, to give them directorial experience and to bring them a little closer to being able to produce anime of their own. They were not just 'nonsensical eyecandy', they all had interesting stories with lots of heart, and Me!Me!Me! went viral, so the argument that it doesn't attract people to animation is bullshit. They were not made with the hope that they would sell well.

Calling any media 'weird' is inherently narrow-minded and limiting to expression.

Look, I hate arguing like this, and I don't think I'm going to be able to change your mind when you're so angry over a couple of movies that you ignore the fact that Anno is a real person with a real, complicated life. Please, just have some introspection. And seriously, watch these two videos, with an open mind.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ntZhZKOy1o
Modified by coenraed, Mar 13, 3:17 PM
 
Mar 13, 4:03 PM

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coenraed said:

He wanted to inject some new ideas into the industry, and to give talented people an opportunity to do meaningful work with a team, to express themselves, to give them directorial experience and to bring them a little closer to being able to produce anime of their own.

Theres no lack of animators. As long as invotation just means, more fancy graphics then the point is missed. You don't get new customers by that. People which doesn't buy now will not buy even when graphics get even more flashy. Animes lack on substance not style.

coenraed said:

They were not just 'nonsensical eyecandy', they all had interesting stories with lots of heart

Yeah, they were all cheap emotion triggers. It's like shaking keys for a baby.

coenraed said:

, and Me!Me!Me! went viral, so the argument that it doesn't attract people to animation is bullshit.

It doesn't attract people who aren't allready attrakted to it. For anyone else it's just akward. And these products do not sell.
Speaking of Me!Me!Me! : It's quite cynical if animators talk about hikikomori/otaku.
Its like a heroin dealer talking about the pain of junkies.

coenraed said:

They were not made with the hope that they would sell well.

So they are useless, course money is one part of the problem. 1 "The Simpsons" Episode cost 1 Million to produce, and this show runs since 1989 and is still runing. A hole 13-Episode Anime Show costs 3 Millions, and dies after that. It takes years for the companies to get even this amount of money back. They are all dieing.

coenraed said:

Please, just have some introspection. And seriously, watch these two videos, with an open mind.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ntZhZKOy1o

And whats the point?
 
Mar 13, 4:21 PM

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Des_Pudels_Kern said:

And whats the point?
You're an elitist who knows jack shit about anime and its creators and won't listen to reason, that's the point. Goodbye.
Modified by coenraed, Mar 13, 4:37 PM
 
Mar 13, 4:43 PM

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It could always just end.
 
Mar 14, 11:35 AM

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coenraed said:
Des_Pudels_Kern said:

And whats the point?
You're an elitist who knows jack shit about anime and its creators and won't listen to reason, that's the point. Goodbye.

That sounds like "reason".
All you are saying is "Everything Hideaki Anno does is completly justified". Thats just black/white-thinking. He could have done good and does now bad.
 
Mar 30, 12:01 AM

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Since you are apparently his biggest fan ever, you will be interested in this TV program:


About the fact that Anno relies on Evangelion to make money, it's sad actually. And no matter how beneficial it is to innovation, it is also detrimental to it because people only see the Evangelion elephant among khara's zoo.


More on the future of Evangelion: Evangelion creator talks about the future of the franchise.
I have some doubts about the success of this vision because those new creators take on Eva will always suffer from the audience tendency to see only the old elephant hanging above.


PS: Sadamoto is not affiliated with khara (he merely reworked his designs for the movies and created Mari, he didn't even animate any part of the movies) and often expressed his boredom of being restrainedd to draw Evangelion figures.

PS2: if you want to learn a bit about Anno's idea of his industry when he was coming out of Nadia, I invite you to read the cross-interview with Tomino I listed on my blog page.


edit @Des_Pudel_Kern : URLs are allowed, but being on a handheld, switching between pages and copy/paste on limited RAM isn't sexy. I would have rather you clicking three time to get there than me reloading the same pages four times or more with rural internet.
Sadamoto started the manga to raise interest in the in-development series, of course he had nothing against it back then. But between 1995 and 201x (check the manga's end date), things changed (if I should guess: everybody seeing in him only "the guy who gave the Eva's characters their appearance" when he did a lot of other works).

No matter what one thinks about Eva (who is Anno's creation, with little bits coming of course from others, so I don't understand your point there: no Anno, no Eva), it never makes Sadamoto's designs (and art for the episodes he drew) less good.
He didn't "ruin the original show" (maybe the original end by making The End), he IS / was the original show. It's not like if you were talking about some producer/editor stiffing its nose in the creative process, he was the one coming up with it, a Gainax guy even stated that this kind of focus in the end was planned (despite the unplanned form it took, and even there the lack of means was profitable since it fuelled "creativity"). It's just that it doesn't conform with the concept you have for when someone will ask you to create another postapocalyptic scifi show with mechas and monsters.

It's well known that if you don't give limitations to someone's vision, it will never raise above a certain level. "Unlimited budget" (it's an expression, I know there is no such thing) can often get in the way of art/creation because it prevents some reflexion.
Modified by Rei366, Apr 2, 7:00 AM
 
Apr 2, 6:26 AM

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Rei366 said:

About the fact that Anno relies on Evangelion to make money, it's sad actually.

The only sad thing about it is that he rapes it another time, after ruining the original show. It's also sad that his poor work takes a dump on the hard work of others. Like Sadamoto.

Rei366 said:

And no matter how beneficial it is to innovation, it is also detrimental to it because people only see the Evangelion elephant among khara's zoo.

It's the only product he sold successfully in his life, except of Nadia (where he probably hasn't enough rights to milk it again).
But, in my way of thinking, it's just dishonest to do a half-assed job for the money. If he can't live of the stuff he realy loves to do, he should work in an assembly line an do animation in his spare time.

Rei366 said:

I have some doubts about the success of this vision because those new creators take on Eva will always suffer from the audience tendency to see only the old elephant hanging above.

Problem is, noone likes to raise another guys child. the same with Star Wars. Everyone gets a chance to have his way with it.
Gundam is not like NGE. Gundam was good in the first run. NGE is a clusterfuck. It can't get much worse. (Expect for let the "Kill la Kill"-Guy do it, of cource).

Rei366 said:

PS: Sadamoto is not affiliated with khara (he merely reworked his designs for the movies and created Mari, he didn't even animate any part of the movies) and often expressed his boredom of being restrainedd to draw Evangelion figures.

Then why draw a Manga? If you want get rid of working on a franchice - DONT DO IT!

Rei366 said:

PS2: if you want to learn a bit about Anno's idea of his industry when he was coming out of Nadia, I invite you to read the cross-interview with Tomino I listed on my blog page.

Links are not allowed?
 
Apr 2, 6:39 AM
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NGE is a clusterfuck. It can't get much worse.


It's a clusterfuck but that helped it as well as hindering it. The most creative and memorable stuff in the show emerged from the limitations and chaos of the production process.

The only nonsensical, messy writing is in the Adam/Lilith lore and the more out-there science fiction (which is functionally magic anyway)--and the show worked anyway because all that conspiratorial stuff is just there to ominously hang above the human drama.

It's a mess but it's a glorious mess and I'd hate to see it neutered anymore by bad fanfic-tier reboots full of lowest-common-denominator shipping bait and shitty CGI action.

NGE needs to be put to rest, but, there's weebshekels to be made...
Modified by dickteautwins, Apr 2, 6:48 AM
 
Apr 2, 7:04 AM

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dickteutwins said:

The most creative and memorable stuff in the show emerged from the limitations and chaos of the production process.

Example? The narrative died a horrible death in this "work". It could easyly run forever this way. So it was a good thing that someone pulled the plug on it. It had never a direction, so it run out fuel and crashlanded.

dickteutwins said:

The only nonsensical, messy writing is in the Adam/Lilith lore and the more out-there science fiction

Nothing is realy accomplished. Theres setup but no payoff. Many open Questions and no storyline resolution watsoever. Bad decisions all the way. For example: "The End of Episode 19. Big Mambojumbo about the awoken Robot" - "Start Episode 20 - Robot back in its Robot-Stable" - How?

dickteutwins said:

(which is functionally magic anyway)--and the show worked anyway because all that conspiratorial stuff is just there to ominously hang above the human drama.

Its just sloppy writing. The conspiratorial stuff is handled poor becouse noone took the effort of tinking it trough (writing Episode after Episode without a Overall-Plan is just stuppid in the first place. Thats why the human drama is also handled pooly. You can do much more with 26 Episodes if you know you have 26 Episodes to do. And you don't have to fuck up the ending.

dickteutwins said:

It's a mess but it's a glorious mess and I'd hate to see it neutered anymore by bad fanfic-tier reboots full of lowest-common-denominator shipping bait and shitty CGI action.

Well, it's done by the same people who did the original show. With their own studio. They have all the freedom they ever wanted, and they just spit in your face. Maybe they where never the good guys you think they where in the first place.

dickteutwins said:

NGE needs to be put to rest, but, there's weebshekels to be made...

As I said, WHO HAVE TO MADE WEEBSHEKELS. And what do you have to think about those people? They can allways work at an assembly line instead, if its just for making money.