Erg_Orgy said: That's what I would like to say, but unfortunately, you have to adapt to a certain Level to the Speech-Mannerisms of other People in order to be understood best. You wrote that it should "represent someone as a person to some degree", so that's a good Point, because it neither strikes for extreme Uniqueness nor for extreme Conformity. Having your own Style without it being only one of a Kind, is ideal imho as well.We should cherish and embrace our own linguistic mannerisms I think. Long Sentences aren't really a Problem, since that's kind of an Issue that many Writers of the German Language had and have, including Appositions, Relative-Clauses, Brackets and so on and so forth in their Writings. The longest Sentence I recalled having written was over 70 Words long for some Homework, lol. I should come/get to the Point more often. Yeah they probably were the stories mostly, and even if those books did include the legends they must've been tweaked a bit as to not scare children or anything. To be fair, the Brothers Grimm weren't Story Tellers, but Story Collectors. So some Parts could be butchered just from the Nature of having to have it collected and then to bring it together. Despite of this, it's still quite astonishing how from a later Point of View a harmless-seeming Story like Hansel and Gretel gets perceived more brutal once you look through the happy-sounding Children Song (this Version also contains the Poems from the original Text) and try to view it with realistic Eyes as if it were a real Report instead of idealized, stuck in the Mind of being in some Fairy-Tale ones.There might be some degree of chauvinism to this comment of mine but I couldn't agree more with him lol. That National-Pride is what made me a bit doubtful about whether a normal or lesser then normal skilled German-Speaker would be better than a Master-English-Speaker. But then again, there's also the objective or collectively subjective Side and this includes Expert-Statements as this and Experiences from People who can speak ideally all mentioned Languages.Which original German Terms are you using in informal Speech? We have a decent amount, not nearly as much as other old countries though. I only know a very tiny Percentage of my own, so the Amount isn't that important. You have Fairy Tales about historical Figures? Because I can only recall Folk Tales being there about some of them. The most well-known ones are probably the ones about Saint Ladislaus who is actually my favorite famous figure from our country. Ooooh I loved Andersen's tales as a kid, my favorite was the one about the brave Toy Soldier. Had re-read it, since it's been long and it's quite melancholic. I liked "The Ugly Duckling", "The Emperor's New Clothes" and "The Fir Tree" the best, because they have some easy to pick up Messages. I don't think it was, although there are probably some mutual stories shared by both books. Hmm, do you know who the original Author was? Like isn't it written somewhere in the Book? |
NoboruFeb 1, 2017 2:41 PM
| @Noboru Fair point, one needs to get to a certain level to be comprehensible but after that I think we should kinda let it flow, I know some people in real life who are really trying to grasp more descriptive and expressive vocabulary but it just doesn't work for them since the other parts of their idiolect don't match that extended vocabulary and the whole thing ends up being unbalanced. As one of my Hungarian teachers once said, "A person exhibits real maturity if they can express themselves in an understandable manner while keeping their sentences organized, however complex those may be.", so I think that letting our idiolects improve and expand evenly is the best course of action if we want to mae ourselves clear in a truly sophisticated manner. Yeah it's weird how so many children's stories are actually pretty brutal originally, like the one about Goldilocks and the bears, if memory serves, that was a pretty morbid story initially. I suppose it's only fair to make these comparisons when one has equally great insight on both languages in question, yeah. To the extent of my knowledge I still think an average Hungarian speaker might have a slight advantage over an expert English speaker when it comes to expressiveness, I think that's mostly because our standard dialect was heavily influenced by "country dialects" and old literature, both of which are rich in different terms and sayings which we apply in everyday speech a lot too.And we have really descriptive words if that makes any sense, lots of words - especially adjectives and the such - have separate Hungarian words as their roots in some way which really helps when you need to be descriptive and/or expressive, we can use exagerations not just for the sake of being complex, but because we can use such words for it that tell more and give you an idea based on the root/origin of the word. We are linguistically permitted to use some words which are taken from German as synonyms, such as "hót ziher" which means that something is definitely 100% sure. and if I'm not mistaken 'sicher' means sure in German and that's the word that was modified a bit to 'ziher' in the previously mentioned term, so they also mean the same thing basically. Yes we have some fairy tales too, but it seems Hungary is too buy with its history to emphasize that. I don't personally have the book but when I get the chance I'll check out the author if the book is still in my local library. |
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| The Miss Peregrine Trilogy: Really exciting dark fantasy series. Quo Vadis, Pillars of the Earth, Shogun, Taipan, Noble House: Really good historical fiction novels. Anna Karenina, Crime and Punishment: If you like classical Russian literature. Mistress of the Art of Death series, Give me Back my Mountains!, The Cattle Truck, Embers: Oher very enjoyable books. |
| @Erg_Orgy: Style is not only about using fancy Words or having a bigger Vocabulary, though. It's also about how you start your Sentences and how you connect different Ideas. Merely knowing more Words and Phrases to express yourself more accurately doesn't help - not only because of the missing Balance that you were pointing out, but also because solely having an unfamiliar Way of Expressing yourself by switching your style from short Sentences to long ones or vice verse is already a big Challenge. Style is not only about flavoring your Text with fancy Words, it's about avoiding Repetitions whenever it is possible without changing the Meaning. Wherever you have to me more precisely, you sometimes have to use the same Words twice, thrice and many other Times, as Synonyms are nothing but Words, which are only related in Meaning and thus can't always be applied in a given Context. As for Understandability, if you try to break down scientific Subjects in Laymen-Terms, you'll get a Corruption of the Meaning. The Challenge is to balance it out between what can be still expected from the average Reader or Listener, and what is needed to convey a given Topic closely to the Point enough. I'm not too familiar with Goldilock; have only watched a Cartoon about it if I'm not mistaken. However, I believe it's very Possible that Children Stories have been weakened with the Editions that followed after. There was even a little Uproar because of controversial "Political Correctness" - Changes being made to established Books for Children a few Years ago over here. That's the Feeling I'm getting as well, since I feel like the modern English Language is lacking Words from their own native Word-Stock to express more complicated Ideas like "Past", "Present" and "Future" however primitive the Words may sound if you take them literally like how "Present" used to be something like "andward" where the Word itself is describing a Direction you're walking onto right now that could be at least partially understood by modern Speakers. But then again, English is a pluricentric Language with multiple Standards and all Standards have multiple Substandards and Dialects. With that, you can have a much richer Vocabulary as well. Do those Synonyms fit the Meaning in all Situations precisely? Because "sicher" also means "secure" and "safe" in other Contexts. That's a Shame, because History and everything begins with Mythology. If you're not looking more closely to your own Folklore, you cannot investigate your own History extensively enough, since orally passed-down Sayings and Stories are Parts of the cultural Heritage. Having them collected can give you a better Picture to how People from an older Age have really thought. All right, then. |
NoboruFeb 2, 2017 1:04 PM
| Any of the historical fiction trilogies by Ken Follett are pretty good Song of Fire and Ice If you like informative with somewhat comedic undertones try Mary Roach's book's (Stiff, Bonk, and Spook were all really good) If you prefer something more mainstream Dan Brown line of books have been pretty good as well. |
| recently picked up the book called "Tools of Titans" pretty resourceful, has a place in my shelf of self-improvement books. |
Noboru said: @Erg_Orgy: Style is not only about using fancy Words or having a bigger Vocabulary, though. It's also about how you start your Sentences and how you connect different Ideas. Merely knowing more Words and Phrases to express yourself more accurately doesn't help - not only because of the missing Balance that you were pointing out, but also because solely having an unfamiliar Way of Expressing yourself by switching your style from short Sentences to long ones or vice verse is already a big Challenge. Style is not only about flavoring your Text with fancy Words, it's about avoiding Repetitions whenever it is possible without changing the Meaning. Wherever you have to me more precisely, you sometimes have to use the same Words twice, thrice and many other Times, as Synonyms are nothing but Words, which are only related in Meaning and thus can't always be applied in a given Context. As for Understandability, if you try to break down scientific Subjects in Laymen-Terms, you'll get a Corruption of the Meaning. The Challenge is to balance it out between what can be still expected from the average Reader or Listener, and what is needed to convey a given Topic closely to the Point enough. I'm not too familiar with Goldilock; have only watched a Cartoon about it if I'm not mistaken. However, I believe it's very Possible that Children Stories have been weakened with the Editions that followed after. There was even a little Uproar because of controversial "Political Correctness" - Changes being made to established Books for Children a few Years ago over here. That's the Feeling I'm getting as well, since I feel like the modern English Language is lacking Words from their own native Word-Stock to express more complicated Ideas like "Past", "Present" and "Future" however primitive the Words may sound if you take them literally like how "Present" used to be something like "andward" where the Word itself is describing a Direction you're walking onto right now that could be at least partially understood by modern Speakers. But then again, English is a pluricentric Language with multiple Standards and all Standards have multiple Substandards and Dialects. With that, you can have a much richer Vocabulary as well. Do those Synonyms fit the Meaning in all Situations precisely? Because "sicher" also means "secure" and "safe" in other Contexts. That's a Shame, because History and everything begins with Mythology. If you're not looking more closely to your own Folklore, you cannot investigate your own History extensively enough, since orally passed-down Sayings and Stories are Parts of the cultural Heritage. Having them collected can give you a better Picture to how People from an older Age have really thought. All right, then. You might have misinterpreted me there, I was more or less trying to say what you just said, idiolects - more specifically extensive ones - go way beyond vocabulary, they pretty much entail all communicational mannerisms a person has I think, which is why I think words are only really worth using if one knows how to string them together in a sophisticated manner. Yeah, I suppose that can mostly be chalked up to how English was spread out and it evolved differently in various areas and then different dialects are getting widespread out of the many which may or may not be as complex as older versions of English might have been. Well, we use the word 'ziherejsztű' which is a term for those needle-like things you have on the back of badges and whatnot, a synonym for it is 'biztosítótű' with 'biztos' meaning 'secure' in this context so while it's not in the same word as I've previously mentioned, ziher/sicher is used in that meaning as well kind of. Yeah, most Hungarians only know a few of the really popular ones and that's that, they're really bitter about large portions of our history which may be why they also don't want to delve into anything that's even remotely history-related. |
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| I am really becoming a fan of Agatha Christie after recently reading And then there were none and The Thirteen problems. |
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
| Here are some of my favorites. American Gods and Stardust by Neil Gaiman. Journey to the Center of the Earth by Jules Verne. Treasure Island by Robert Louis Stevenson. To Kill a Mocking Bird by Harper Lee. |
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animesannin said: Agathe Christie was also an Author I've always wanted to read but never came to it. I'd like to read the Novels and other Works, where she has put down her Experiences in the Orient Express just to know what the big Deal has been all about.I am really becoming a fan of Agatha Christie after recently reading And then there were none and The Thirteen problems. @Erg_Orgy: My Bad, then. They don't have to be sophisticated, they just have to be fitting for the Occasion. Language Complexity is a rather complicated Topic. Let's just say that Old and Middle English were more complicated in Grammar than Modern English. It's the "Safety" in "Safety Pin", then. Also, it's not like English has taken the same Word with all its Application either when they borrowed angst from us. Well, at least you can still have National Pride without being labeled a Nazi. |
| I love to read, i read more books than do anyhing else. i read for a couple hours a day, every day currently reading red seas under red skies by scott lynch, second book in the gentleman bastards series. a fantasy series about con artists, pretty cool so onto recs hyperion cantos by dan simmons. science fiction. awesome adventure story that is just like whoa, so big, so amazing, so fun. blindsight by peter watts. science fiction. kind of scary. thought-proking stuff 100 years of solitude by gabriel garcia marquez. classical book, although its not that old. follows one family through 7 generations of them. the stuff that happens in this novel is jus t bonkers, but its so fun to read and i actually cried at the end, which i rarely cry for books my name is red by orhan pamuk. historical fiction about four muslim miniature artists who are commissioned to work on a book for their sultan in the western style. but one of them is murdered because of perceived blasephemy. its a great book about art, religion and politics. and its so beautifully written. its on of my favourite books |
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| I've recently finished my first book called ''Fuck the World', and it's available for a pre-order if you're interested :D On here: https://www.andreabedford.com It's dark, psychological novel with horror, sci-fi and LGBT elements :D One of the characters is also an anime fan :D |
| Your request is a bit too wide. Maybe you can share what kind of books you enjoy? The ‘great book’ is quite subjective. But if I need to mention a good (but random) novel, I’d go with Banana Yoshiimoto’s Moonlight Shadow. |
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