Shuumatsu no Izetta Episode 7 Discussion

What did you think of this episode?

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Nov 14, 2016 1:13 AM

#51

Psykofreac

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Aug 2013

170

Red_Ranger_Wien said:
Man first Yaoi n Fire and now this. What is up with people getting all buttmad about yaoi/yuri bait? It's not like ZOMG the show gets any better or worse if the characters are actually gonna drill butts/scissor each other.

I don't mind the fanservice in itself but rather the fact that the writers constantly NEED to use it. It's quite obvious their purpose are to break between the dull expository dialogue but it's been shown time and again that it's the only way they know how to entertain the audience during these times.

PsykofreacNov 14, 2016 1:38 AM

Nov 14, 2016 1:45 AM

#52

Ahenshihael

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Jul 2007

23708

The problem comes from it never coming to fruition
if you don't want to commit to it, don't bait. Adding very clear hints and then backpedaling or never elaborating is just awful.

Using sexual orientation for fanservice and marketing is just exploitative and its very common practice nowadays and people are just tired of it. Why do you think Hibike Queerbaitphonium gets so much flak for it?

Not to mention that bait usually breaks narrative and affects the way the show is written. Look at Nanoha franchise and how silly and outright amateurish the "just friends" idea feels there.

We live in times when people are no longer satisfied with just being targets of baiting. People want LGBT pairings to exist. And not just be there when the show needs somebody to kill off. So when the show starts baiting it is only normal to start asking where it is going.

So yeah, depending on how Izetta and Fine are handled WILL affect the overall rating of the show.

AhenshihaelNov 14, 2016 1:51 AM

Nov 14, 2016 1:51 AM

#53

Red_Ranger_Wien

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Sep 2011

2145

Fai said:

The problem comes from it never coming to fruition
if you don't want to commit to it, don't bait. Adding very clear hints and then backpedaling or never elaborating is just awful.

Using sexual orientation for fanservice and marketing is just exploitative and its very common practice nowadays and people are just tired of it. Why do you think Hibike Queerbaitphonium gets so much flak for it?

We live in times when people are no longer satisfied with just being targets of baiting. People want LGBT pairings to exist. And not just be there when the show needs somebody to kill off.

Not to mention that bait usually breaks narrative and affects the way the show is written
So yeah, depending on how Izetta and Fine are handled WILL affect the overall rating of the show.

I mean is it really any worse than using cool action shots or pretty background music as fanservice?

And one more thing, it's really only bait if you go into it looking for that kind of thing.

Nov 14, 2016 2:43 AM

#54

1idd0kun

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Jul 2009

783

Red_Ranger_Wien said:

I mean is it really any worse than using cool action shots or pretty background music as fanservice?

That's not fanservice. That's good production values.

Nov 14, 2016 4:15 AM

#55

Mascera

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Jan 2015

3242

Genix said:

Mascera said:
Pretty awesome action by Izetta, especially with that Torpedos.

I'm pretty sure those were missiles. To be called a torpedo, it must go under water lol

But, but... The shape is "perfectly fit" to be called a torpedo, also Izetta use her "magic touch" to make it fly like a missile. Oh well, whatever it is at least it perfectly explode.

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Nov 14, 2016 5:55 AM

#56

ratul_109

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Jun 2016

Wtf!! Why he took the soldier life. He could have kept him in prison. Not fair man!!!

Nov 14, 2016 6:04 AM

#57

Ahenshihael

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Jul 2007

23708

Red_Ranger_Wien said:

I mean is it really any worse than using cool action shots or pretty background music as fanservice?

And one more thing, it's really only bait if you go into it looking for that kind of thing.

Yes. Exploiting and gaslighting minorities is FAR WORSE than having a good animation is.

Even the malegaze camera shot fanservice does not come close to that level of grossness.

Nov 14, 2016 9:51 AM

#58

Mizusi

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May 2013

621

That was exciting. It would be nice if the animation was good, but it was an entertaining episode.

Nov 14, 2016 10:28 AM

#59

gophercg

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Mar 2012

4027

Both yuri bed & aerial fight were well done.
Sacrificing a carrier just for witch weakness? that quite expensive. Since he already knows the basement could've sent a spy first.

Nov 14, 2016 11:45 AM

#60

MichaelJackson

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Aug 2016

3554

this anime is actually nice and its a good episode, but Im getting so f*cking upset of the "almost yuri" scenes, if they end kissing, I hope they do it next episode and not at the end so I can drop it on time... gosh

And Im waiting for more and more actions scenes. This and Drifters have the best this season.

Nov 14, 2016 12:45 PM

#61

zcv45

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Sep 2015

673

Great episode. Other than the tickling scene being typical. I got no complaints.
Actually I got another complaint. The "bilge" is not the lowest part of a ship. That is wrong. Bilge is the curved part of the hull's bottom. He was talking about the keel that snaps from an underwater explosion.

Also... Fai? Historically accurate? This isn't supposed to be. It just takes the background of WW2 and have its own story from there. It is like expecting strike witches to be accurate.
Shows like Zipang is where you would judge historical accuracy.
Also please explain what was a major inaccuracy that would derail one's entertainment?

zcv45Nov 14, 2016 12:54 PM

Nov 14, 2016 12:54 PM

#62

Red_Ranger_Wien

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Sep 2011

2145

Fai said:

Yes. Exploiting and gaslighting minorities is FAR WORSE than having a good animation is.

Even the malegaze camera shot fanservice does not come close to that level of grossness.

"Manipulating and gaslighting minorities" "Male Gaze Camera Shot"

Dem's some funny jokes there.

Nov 14, 2016 1:03 PM

#63

Nexu

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Jun 2016

10245

Introduction of a second witch... Interesting... Makes me think that the white witch will return.

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Nov 14, 2016 1:08 PM

#64

Psykofreac

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Aug 2013

170

So basically Izetta: The Last Witch refers to her being the last witch by the end of the story right?

Nov 14, 2016 2:55 PM

#65

DazeFire

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Apr 2014

1221

yeah that new guy that joined them just looks like he's up to no good just by looking at him and of course glasses guy would figure it out from just seeing weakness once and to make things even worst they're about to go to that castle and find out that map which is about to make things real rough for Izetta and the others

but other than this ep was nice also loved the Izetta x Finé moment

"one step at a time"

Nov 14, 2016 10:05 PM

#66

GenesisAria

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Dec 2009

2902

Izetta has been in a state of mental duality for some time now. She fights and kills, then turns around and exhibits an innocent mind when it comes to the normal life stuff. She even said that the fighting seems like a dream.

I'm not sure how many people have realized this, but a state like this cannot be maintained. She hasn't realized what death means, and it's going to hit her hard later on, when circumstances require her to be up close and personal with someone she kills. She will realize that she's massacred hundreds and thousands of people single-handedly, regardless of the reasoning.

The mental methodology of war has always been "kill a few to save many more in war," without realizing that by doing so they perpetuate a cycle that only piles up the death counts on both sides, and all for what? You don't like the ideology of the nation coming to take your lands. Otherwise you'd just let them take over, then try to preserve your way of life afterwords through discussion and dealing.

The truth is that the average person's life won't change all that much even if there's a change of leadership, unless the new leadership is flawed and permeates poverty, or excessive restrictions that make some peoples' jobs impossible. The occasional nation may have policies of mandatory service or conscription as well.

GenesisAriaNov 14, 2016 10:16 PM

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Nov 15, 2016 12:47 AM

#67

-Abyss_Walker-

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May 2016

448

GenesisAria said:

The truth is that the average person's life won't change all that much even if there's a change of leadership, unless the new leadership is flawed and permeates poverty, or excessive restrictions that make some peoples' jobs impossible. The occasional nation may have policies of mandatory service or conscription as well.

Since this is based on World War 2, if you hand over your nation to the AXIS, there is no way the civilian life will remain same... they will either get massacred or be treated as second class citizens.

Nov 15, 2016 1:05 AM

#68

GenesisAria

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Dec 2009

2902

-Abyss_Walker- said:

Uh, that's mainly in cases of those who've been put into camps, which is something that happens in wars of all kinds. The imperials did it to the natives, japanese did it to others around the east, russia did it, it's pretty much a staple of heated warfare. When the war ends, there's no need to waste assets on such things. Camps get dissolved etc.

People like to speculate what Nazi supremacy might have looked like, and it's usually biased. It was similar in a lot of ways to the roman empire, though a bit more retarded, and in an age where there's strong military arsenal everywhere... as opposed to the old days before fast communication when it was generally if you had the numbers and the organization, then you won. The face of war was changing since the advent of instant communications, and WW1/WW2 was when everyone realized it. Anyway, it wouldn't have been as bad as people like to think, they had a plan. They weren't being russia where they need a pack leader like dogs.

Nazi Germany pissed everyone off because they kept getting their fingers all over everything and invading (not unlike what the USA is doing today).

GenesisAriaNov 15, 2016 1:33 AM

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Nov 15, 2016 1:13 AM

#69

Jonesy974

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Aug 2013

2274

I feel bad for Izetta, Fine, and the Elystadt crew. They have the decked stacked against them so fucking hard it's not even fair.

- Izetta isn't this invincible beast. Her powers have the obvious major flaw of being dependent on ley lines.
- none of the allied countries are open to helping Elsytadt or fighting Germania. They "want" to help, but the government just aren't open to it. Fine is legit bending over backwards just to get the most minimal of outside support.
- Germania is OP as fuck. They're technologically superior in every way to the other countries.
- Izetta's biggest strength was her speed and agility, and now Germania magically invented a new plane that gives crazy pilot guy a fighting chance.
- Germania guy with the glasses is gary-stu as all fucking hell. He magically knew off the bat that she had a big weakness. He watched Izetta's battle from a cliff and just from one instance of watching her slow down and hit the water, he immediately knew exactly what her weakness was. There could be a million explanations for what he saw, but somehow immediately deduced the correct reason, just because.
- Germania is now man-made creating their own witch, and, knowing Germania, that witch will be broken and OP as fuck. Probably wont have to rely on ley lines to draw power and will somehow be way stronger than Izetta.

Nov 15, 2016 1:28 AM

#70

GenesisAria

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Dec 2009

2902

@Jonesy974 From episode 6...

GenesisAria said:
Germania is upgrading...

Jonesy974 said:
- Izetta's biggest strength was her speed and agility, and now Germania magically invented a new plane that gives crazy pilot guy a fighting chance.

It only mattered because she was trying to protect the torpedoes. With an arsenal of swords or what-have-you, it'd be no problem. The plane wasn't magically invented, the arsenal in the show is all accurate for the time, and that's right around when they'd be testing new models like that (i'm not sure which this is, it might be a custom modification).

Edit:

(reddit) said:

GenesisAriaNov 15, 2016 1:56 AM

❀桜舞う空〜 Cute is Power. 🔗CosmoGenesis Project

“You cannot know what you do not know.”
“Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.”
“A truth seeker has no patience for BS.”

I seek only to improve myself and others.

Nov 15, 2016 2:45 PM

#71

Vasilivros

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Jul 2016

105

Yuri is strong with this one. Definitely better than ep6.
Everything is very interesting, I'm waiting for the next episode :)

Nov 15, 2016 8:02 PM

#72

Hyperkinetic

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Aug 2016

Shuumatsu no Izetta Episode 7 “The Battle of Sognefjord”: 8/10

After painting an intricate picture of the war and its central characters back in Eylstadt, Shuumatsu no Izetta finally turns to the development of the promised offensive. This is, after all, an anime about World War II, and the show has been much more of a discussion about people and power than a depiction of mid 20th-century army-on-army action. While there’s certainly nothing wrong with the latter, Shuumatsu no Izetta’s approach is more convincing; my personal taste for character-driven narratives aside, the deeper the connection developed between the viewer and the warring parties, the more effective the driving punch of the story. Despite this initial character focus, the plot has turned to true, dedicated warfare, and our first glimpse of the struggle in earnest is the Eylstadtian bid for British help.

There’s a lot at play in this opening scene of the British war room, and the elements of this sequence come together pretty convincingly, for the most part. The quirky, personal depictions of representatives from different nations and how they symbolise their national spirit is more likely to be silly jabs than genuine commentary, but is just subtle enough to be well executed. The real meat of the scene, however, does a very good job of pulling us back into the center of the narrative. “Otto’s game” is an excellent way of portraying the nature of the German enemy: to the Allies, the battlecruiser is a key strategic element, whereas the eponymous Otto van Bismarck manipulates it like a pawn to be sacrificed. We even get a reminder of this disparity after the ship is destroyed, when our favorite Germanian villain announces the mission a success. While the destruction of the cruiser was an essential objective for the Britannians, the massive Germanian war machine is willing to trade it away for a little crucial information. This discussion of the closing trap is rather effective in reminding us of the desperation little Eylstadt and its potential Brittanian buddy face.

However, the most interesting element of the sequence comes with the diplomats’ dismissal of Izetta as a “real” witch rather than a media ploy. This is nothing new to our story: Germanians and Eylstadtians alike have dismissed Izetta, first on the basis that war is a matter of “iron,” not magic, second for the impossibility of witches in a “modern age.” This everpresent scorn, paired with Izetta’s ethereal entrance, paint the witch and the princess as entities that exist outside of war: the silvery witch and the commanding ruler, floating through the sky above the brutality of trench warfare to save a small, helpless country. In fact, this otherworldliness is part of what separates our two protagonists from the Germanian enemy; the weapons that give the Germanian army power are demonstrations of raw mechanical might and industrial prowess, while Eylstadt’s key weapon is a powerful girl entangled in morals and duty who can’t see herself as a weapon at all. Furthermore, Izetta’s disconnection from the brutal reality of war is part of her dual identity, in that the strategists of Eylstadt must create a weaponised persona to replace the far more complex and personal witch. Again and again, the writers tell a tale of the two worlds of war: one of personal, morally invested love and dedication, and one of mechanical, strategic destruction.

That isn’t to say this construct doesn’t have problems. In fact, the majority of the guilt for Izetta’s actions is sloughed onto the strategists. Instead of Izetta facing real moral qualms about the destruction of Germanian lives, her actions are quickly explained away by her dedication to the princess. This episode alone, we are reminded of Izetta’s powerful motivation twice: first, she swears her unwavering allegiance to the princess personally in a very intimate, but refreshingly fan-service-free segment; second, she describes how the protection of Eylstadt gives her the opportunity to use the “power everyone hated” for good. Is this enough to brush aside the moral weight of waging war? Instead, the blame of wartime destruction is transferred to the Eylstadtian ministers organising the war effort. Especially after the characterisation of Izetta as a deeply caring, morally thoughtful individual, the shallowness of her empathy for Germanian losses is a rather weak component of the narrative.

All this being said, the titular destruction of Sognefjord’s Germanian warship is the true central focus of this episode. The truly striking component of this scene is the animation, which toes the line between remarkable and stellar. The suggestive camera angles mysteriously highlighting the young witch’s bust are scrapped in favor of significantly more exhilarating, action-oriented perspectives; the dramatic, squinting eyeball zoom-ins come at the right times and are sparing enough so as to not disrupt the pacing of the battle; and Izetta’s choice to take risk and offer sacrifice inspires genuine excitement. That’s not to say the scene was perfect; while I hate to criticise a story on its plausibility, the plot armor is maybe slightly too powerful here, and the suspense of the scene would have been heightened had the Germanian pilots been able to aim. Demerits aside, the animation and pacing was enough to pull even this pretentious reviewer to the edge of their seat.

A few notes:

-While obvious, the end of this episode did give us some genuine character empathy with a Germanian character for the first time. True, going out and proving oneself is almost as overused as it gets, but some understanding of the human motivations of the previously mechanical Germanian technocrats is welcome.

-In Izetta’s conversation with the pilot, our witch’s dedication to the protection of Eylstadt takes on a whole new dimension. After years of isolation and others’ hatred of her magical abilities, Izetta is suddenly able to use her power in a way that people accept and commend - protecting Finé, the person who first accepted her for who she was. It’s paramount that Izeta’s unwavering commitment to the cause doesn’t become unbelievable, and this added layer of personal importance certainly helps in that regard.
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Nov 15, 2016 8:25 PM

#73

1idd0kun

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Jul 2009

783

Damn these characters are so bland and underdeveloped. Fine's still the perfect princess and Izetta still comes across more as Fine's pet than the hero she's supposed to be.

Yoshino's such a hack. One of the worst writers in the anime industry.

Nov 15, 2016 8:56 PM

#74

SakurasouBusters

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Jun 2013

6123

The animation was pretty poor in this episode, but it made up for it in action and entertainment!

Nov 16, 2016 6:19 PM

#75

skiayly

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May 2014

sarroush said:

WrongPriest said:

That's way too subtle for this show.

Actually they don't even have to bug out with a friends ending, they'll just kill off Fine.

Hahaha I'm more inclined to believe Izetta's going to die.
Why can't we have any happy endings? ;_;

same or both of them die

Nov 17, 2016 3:05 AM

#76

Bibimbapski

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Jun 2013

3513

I thought it was cool when Izetta used magic to get those missiles (?) to follow her.

I have a strong feeling that someone is going to backstab them soon. :(

Of course, I can't comment without mentioning that drool-worthy, yuri bedroom scene between Fine and Izetta. The pervert in me is too strong.

Magic battle next week.

臭い-

Nov 17, 2016 5:34 PM

#77

semerman

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Nov 2016

There are so many beautiful Izetta's illusts I have never seen at this website.
http://aniex.net/tag/shuumatsu-no-izetta/

Nov 18, 2016 9:08 PM

#78

Mormegil

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Mar 2009

8123

Fai said:

1idd0kun said:

That's not a fact. It can interpreted as Izetta being embarrassed because she feels unworthy of sharing a room/bed with the princess. That actually goes in line with her humble and self-deprecating attitude.

Yes friends totally lie in the same bed facing each other while in their underwear, holding hands an d looking longingly into each other's eyes. Suure.

#SubtleFriendship

Can we get more scenes like this, please? I'm going to be pissed if it's just more bait.

Nov 19, 2016 1:52 AM

#79

Ahenshihael

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Jul 2007

23708

Mormegil said:

Fai said:

Yes friends totally lie in the same bed facing each other while in their underwear, holding hands an d looking longingly into each other's eyes. Suure.

#SubtleFriendship

Can we get more scenes like this, please? I'm going to be pissed if it's just more bait.

Considering there has been exactly zero actual development or textual discussion on the subtext(is that even still subtext?), it is 99% surely bait that will most likely be "resolved" via one of them dying. The show is content with not progressing beyond "they care about each other, guys, ain't it sweet?!" state and is not even giving the characters the chance to explore who they are as people and reflect upon all that happened.

It seems that this season all the actual real gay stuff has condensed into Flip Flappers and Yuri on Ice while all the bait - into izetta and queerbaitphonium.

Nov 19, 2016 5:15 PM

#80

Top_Sergeant

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Mar 2015

772

I was very glad to see that nobody took any "stupid pills" this week. And hitting a carrier in the hangar is a very good method of taking it out of action. Well done!

The sword that takes life gives life

Nov 20, 2016 1:47 PM

#81

Gorzkiewski

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Apr 2015

Phlippy said:

Gorzkiewski said:
They are shooting tracer ammunition and as such it can emit a green glow (what isn't such a bad idea as it must make adjusting aim easier).

Ah, then I got no complaints :D Just never heard of that kind of ammo. Was it mentioned in the anime that they are using this or just your assumption?

It wasn't mentioned in the anime, no. I just know how does it look like.

Nov 23, 2016 9:03 AM

#82

TrashDax

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Jun 2015

8992

Izetta is really good at blowing shit up.
I hope the Nazis don't get that information as easily as they plan, that would be pretty lame.

Nov 24, 2016 6:35 AM

#83

WolfWood37

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Jul 2008

10493

Now that's how you use a torpedo.

Dec 8, 2016 10:50 PM

#84

matias067

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Oct 2008

13628

[Chyuu] is so slow!
Another successful mission by Izetta!
looks like Berckmann & Ricelt is slowly figuring-out the weakness of Izetta!
4/5.

Dec 10, 2016 6:56 PM

#85

BurntJelly

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Feb 2013

6196

Well, that didn't quite go as planned. It made the battle more suspenseful and enjoyable.

Dec 20, 2016 2:33 AM

#86

bittersweetlove

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Jul 2009

4805

Finé and Izetta bedtime moment was cute...I am shipping them!

Dec 26, 2016 3:34 AM

#87

ernst

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Nov 2011

508

any show show with an impressive action episode gets a good score from me.
By the way, I'm watching the dub while I wait for chihiro... Should I switch to sub?

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Jan 1, 2017 4:16 PM

#88

Wings

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Apr 2014

2448

Calm down everyone they're just childhood friends!!

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Jan 5, 2017 9:54 PM

#89

nickehhhhhh

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Mar 2015

6644

That battle was intense! Glad Izetta got out of it alright but it looks like they're closer to finding her weaknesses.. plus there's another witch in the works?

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Jan 28, 2017 4:45 AM

#90

Abyhape

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Jan 2014

2553

what with that tube? they're creating an artificial witch?

now even the Germanian heard the secret of the witch?
as far as I know, the only thing that know it's location is fine, izeta, bianca, elvira, and muller and never been told to anyone. did one of those reveal the secret?
how did they learn?
am I missing something here?

AbyhapeJan 28, 2017 4:48 AM

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Sep 21, 2020 10:31 AM

#91

HagePotPotato

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Oct 2019

4204

The trick to watching this show is to skip the awful girl love fan service stuff and just watch the war stuff.

Clever trap by the Nazis, but why would they assume the witch would attack that far from their country? EDIT: Oh right, there's another spy...

No way that Britannia plane would still be flying if it was shot up that badly

Sep 1, 2023 12:24 PM

#92

Stripes

otp haver 🤪

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Jul 2017

6386

These lesbians. Insufferable.

I think the entire action spectacle was pretty solid. However I think the enemies finding out her "weakness" and then having access to the basement where the secret is, feels a little convenient but I guess we gotta wrap this shit up in 5 more episodes so me must rush along.

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